| Revision as of 07:01, 6 September 2006 editThebee (talk | contribs)1,956 editsm →Question regarding revert← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 23:57, 4 October 2021 edit undoPrimeBOT (talk | contribs)Bots2,066,063 editsm →Waldorf education is covered by discretionary sanctions: Task 24: removal of a template following a TFDTag: AWB | ||
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| Archived ], 29 Oct 2006 | |||
| ==PLANS== | |||
| Archived ] 12 Jan 2007 | |||
| As a friendly suggestion: reduce your arguments to a cogent paragraph or two; this is more effective and leaves a better impression than sprawling pages. Even I, sympathetic to your point here, shudder at the format! Best wishes. ] 14:45, 22 July 2006 (UTC) | |||
| == Edit War == | |||
| Thanks for telling. I don't like long drawn out discussion back and forth about details. That's why I try to be as thorough as possible from the beginning in my argument. But the thoroughness does't seem to impress my main opponent. Or maybe I just read too much Steiner ... ;-) --] 18:08, 22 July 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ] Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an ]. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you get reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the article's ] to work toward making a version that represents ] among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See ] for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant ] or seek ]. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary ]. | |||
| == Invitation to join a Project == | |||
| Dear TheBee, I am starting a project to overhaul and balance the article on Waldorf ed. I would like to invite you to take part because of your ongoing contributions to the page. Please le me know at my Talk page if you would like to participate. ] 16:39, 25 August 2006 (UTC) | |||
| '''Being involved in an edit war can result in your being ]'''—especially if you violate the ], which states that an editor must not perform more than three ] on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—'''even if you don't violate the three-revert rule'''—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.<!-- Template:uw-3rr --> | |||
| Dear Wonderful Bee, | |||
| ::I'm just a little rusty in my editing, sorry, Will try to update myself on the rules and habits of editing. ] (]) 06:50, 22 March 2015 (UTC) | |||
| :::And by the way, I'm not editor HGilbert in any form, puppet or -otherwise. Any admin can check my IP-address and compare with his. Thanks. ] (]) 07:01, 22 March 2015 (UTC). | |||
| ==Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion== | |||
| I will send your friend an invitation to join the project and will be thrilled to list you as a participant. Unfortunately I broke a finger last week and have not been typing much - I will set up the project pages later today. | |||
| ] | |||
| Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at ] regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on ]. <!--Template:An3-notice--> Thank you.--] <sup>(]</sup> <sup>])</sup> 05:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC) | |||
| ... Thanks Pete. ] (]) 13:29, 21 March 2015 (UTC) | |||
| == Waldorf education is covered by discretionary sanctions == | |||
| I understand everyone's concern...and I also love Waldorf ed...but I also love Misplaced Pages and find that it is just necessary to intervene to make this a fair, unbiased page which is notthetopc of ongoing edit wars. Please understand that one of the ideas I plan to advance with this project is no outside links other than to scholarly articles. This step alone would end many of the ongoing problems. | |||
| {{Ivm|2=''This message contains important information about an administrative situation on Misplaced Pages. It does '''not''' imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date.'' | |||
| My own page and other homescholing pages have been removed from this page - as the homeschooling page offers resources which will help them find everything - and has gone through its own process of reducing huge numbers of links to just a few. | |||
| '''Please carefully read this information:''' | |||
| I hope you know that I respect your contributions to the page over time and will welcoe you asa member of the team to make this a more stable article. | |||
| The Arbitration Committee has authorised ] to be used for pages regarding ], a topic which you have edited. The Committee's decision is ]. | |||
| Best wishes, | |||
| Discretionary sanctions is a system of conduct regulation designed to minimize disruption to controversial topics. This means ] administrators can impose sanctions for edits relating to the topic that do not adhere to the ], our ], or relevant ]. Administrators may impose sanctions such as ], ], or ]. This message is to notify you sanctions are authorised for the topic you are editing. Before continuing to edit this topic, please familiarise yourself with the discretionary sanctions system. Don't hesitate to contact me or another editor if you have any questions. | |||
| Lucie ] 15:14, 28 August 2006 (UTC) | |||
| }}<!-- Derived from Template:Ds/alert --> The recent dispute came to my attention due to . Thank you, ] (]) 16:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC) | |||
| == ] == | |||
| == New Project Page == | |||
| {{Misplaced Pages:Arbitration Committee Elections December 2015/MassMessage}} ] (]) 16:07, 23 November 2015 (UTC) | |||
| Dear Bee, I just want to again invite you to join the project - the project page has been moved to its proper Wiki place (I am here a year and still a newbie really),]. I really think you have a whole lot to offer this project amnd with the help of unbiased Wiki editors, I believe we can end the ongoing edit wars that have been the waste of so much time for so many really good people. Please do join us, we're currently talking about the introduction. ] 02:19, 1 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| <!-- Message sent by User:Mdann52@enwiki using the list at https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User:Mdann52/list&oldid=692039973 --> | |||
| ==Notice of Fringe Theories Noticeboard discussion== | |||
| ==Can you contact me?== | |||
| ] There is currently a discussion at ] regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. <!--Template:FTN-notice--> Thank you.--] <sup>(]</sup> <sup>])</sup> 18:16, 29 November 2018 (UTC) | |||
| I'd prefer to keep all wiki related discussion on-wiki if you don't mind. When conversation goes behind closed doors there's always somebody ready to shout ]!!! or similar. If your question relates to the ] article it's in the best interests of everybody to keep all discussions open and transparent. That said, how can I be of assistance? I'm also looking into the other points you raised now and will help out shortly if I'm able to. -- ] 00:32, 1 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ==Dispute resolution== | |||
| Misplaced Pages has several levels of dispute resolution detailed at ]. If there's editor behaviour that you are not happy with, feel free to provide me with the actual ] where you feel the editor concerned may be breaching Misplaced Pages policy. I will be happy to act accordingly if it is proven breaches of policy are occuring. Of course, you are welcome to initiate any dispute resolution procedure you deem necessary without my intervention. I trust this advice is the best course of action for now considering the size and length of the dispute, but if there's any other way I can be of some assistance please let me know. -- ] 07:51, 1 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
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| ==Waldorf debate== | |||
| Pete K was the one who mentioned this debate had been raging for decades. I never made any assumption as such but I'm aware this issue hasn't recently began here at Misplaced Pages. He's currently serving a from editing, imposed by myself for a violation of the ]. He is welcome to return once his block expires. Please be mindful of this policy so it doesn't catch you or anyone else out. I'm not interesting in taking any sides, but I will keep the article free of ] and personal attacks from both sides. Thanks for your assistance to date. I'm here to help further if any other issues arise. -- ] 01:39, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :"Decades" is an overstatement, maybe typical of Pete. Maybe 9 years in a more organized form initiated by "], starting its anti-Waldorf campaign by against a public Waldorf methods school, spreading and supporting allegations that anthroposophy is a satanic religion and that public Waldorf methods schools teach Wicca to the pupils. | |||
| :Some years later, the President and Secretary of ] then hired a Private Detective to "in secret" sneak in at a voluntary, private, off campus, outside school hours Advent celebration with K-grade 3 children of the coming Christmas with a video camera hidden under his coat, to prove to school districts that Waldorf methods schools are religious in a way that violates the U.S. Constitution. See the of the WC. | |||
| :Maybe you can call that debate. | |||
| :How do you - strictly as Admin at Misplaced Pages - view the repeated insertion of identical material in a short introductory page to a sub section of an , that belongs in the sub section, and is discussed there, by someone (PK) who refuses to discuss the issue in connection with its proper page? Or can't I ask you how you - purely as Admin - view Misplaced Pages guidelines and their application? | |||
| :To tell you honestly, this debate at Misplaced Pages is killing me. | |||
| :Thanks for your comment and support, | |||
| : --] 02:06, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| == Question regarding NPOV == | |||
| You asked on my talk page a ''Question regarding NPOV'' - my response: ] and . I agree with the issue you raised. This is not really a content dispute I want to get dragged into but I am happy to support the observation of Misplaced Pages policies, if necessary expalining them to users.--] <sup>]</sup> 09:28, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :Thanks! Will you do this in this case? Thanks, --] 10:26, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::I will provide my opinion on matters of policy, but I know all but nothing about Waldorf or PLANS. The way out of content issues to my mind is with citations of reliable sources and I think the Wkipedia policies and guidelines provide useful parameters to operate within.--] <sup>]</sup> 10:34, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :::Will you implement what you tell with a request at the page? Thanks, --] 10:38, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::::As per above, or are you looking for more?--] <sup>]</sup> 10:40, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :::::Would you suggest I delete the argumentative section, referring to violation of http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view#The_neutral_point_of_view or take some other action? --] 10:44, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::Allow 24 hours for a response to the tag and in the mean time think how to phrase more neutrally if possible rather than remove altogether. Replace with more neutral text after 24 hours (some will say 24 hours isn't long enough but on a volatile article I think it is) - perhaps having allowed discussion on proposed replacement text on talk page first. If you had placed what others deemed controversial text, how would you like it to be dealt with? - how would good faith be demonstrated? The end state needs to be neutral though, so its not only about being nice.--] <sup>]</sup> 10:50, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| Thanks! How about the long quote at the end from a general and Copyright perspective? | |||
| :I don't see it as a copyvio, it is properly attributed and clearly a quote if we are both talking about the speech extract within the section ]. I think a cite is needed about the consequence of the speech. I don't know enough as to whether the whole thing is sufficiently notable to be included. Would naything be lost if it wasn't. Could it be referred to more briefly, ie paraphrase to give something like: | |||
| ::Waldorf teachers have noted that Dan Dugan, noted critic of the Waldorf system was not the cause of the problem but rather shed light on to issues with the Waldorf education system (and give cite to speech already referenced) | |||
| :Just my two cents. What is there doesn't breach any policy or guideline but is perhaps unnecessarily verbose for the purpose.--] <sup>]</sup> 11:09, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::I have described how the speech is used by ] at its site in at the Waldorf:Talks page. It is also described . Can that be described at the ] page as addition to the quote? --] 11:28, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| On "If you had placed what others deemed controversial text, how would you like it to be dealt with?": | |||
| :Well, I try to avoid violating Misplaced Pages guidelines, not argue in articles, describe facts using neutral language and stick to statements that I can provide references/citations for. --] 10:53, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::Then I hope all goes well with your editing :-) I know it isn't always that easy but it helps if your editing has met all the guidelines.--] <sup>]</sup> 11:09, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::: | |||
| :::Well, that's sort of not quite my experience from discussions at the Waldorf:Talks page. --] 11:28, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ==Question regarding possible personal attack== | |||
| At the PLANS:Talks page one user writes to me: "You have replied to a request for documentation, with a bunch of sleaze." Does that fall within the category of personal attack? Thanks, --] 11:07, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :Yes, probably - are you sure you want to escalate though or just ignore - it reflects badly on the writer not you doesn't it?--] <sup>]</sup> 11:09, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::There is a limit to accepted number of personal attacks at Misplaced Pages. If they do not start to be pointed out at some time, how do you know when the limit has been reached? --] 11:13, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :::You can record instances via using diffs - all instances contribute. The user who made the comment above has been warned by me --] <sup>]</sup> 11:25, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Thanks, these personal attacks are killing me. --] 11:37, 3 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :::::For a description by User DW herself 3 September of how she relates to the expected reasoned discussion culture here at Misplaced Pages, and the warning she received against making personal attacks in the discussion here, see . For some comments on the issue she writes that she would bring into the discussion, if she did not get her will through, see and --] 10:38, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| *Hmmm - I didn't understand the latter two refs - I am not into the content! She noted that she was chastised, hopefully she will behave here in future (ever the optimist). The page you need by the way is ] to report instances of personal attacks and/or lack of civility. Please note the rules at the top of the page.--] <sup>]</sup> 10:44, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :Thanks for the ref! The main bait used by the WC's since some years, to get people hooked up and enraged in their anti-Waldorf campaign, after the first allegations that Waldorf schools teach the pupils witchcrft, is to cultivate a myth that Steiner was an anti-Semite. The two links analyze some of used by the WC's to achieve this, and describe and how it is related to in Waldorf education. The first mentioned link and at Waldorf Answers try to document the baselessnes of and dismantle the myth, and other demagoguery by the WC's. | |||
| :On "hopefully she will behave here in future (ever the optimist)": Her own description of her habitual way of "arguing" can seem to speak against your hope. But optimism is what keeps the world up and running ;-)/ How do you suggest arguing against self described "rants and raving, and rants and ravings" every second hour by people here, using it seemingly to try to "prove" that the WC-group is not a hate-type of group ...?-/ --] 11:23, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ::Stay unenraged (is that a word? perhaps stay calm is better) and reference your assertions with reliable sources. Be reasonable. Edit elsewhere too - there is a tonne to do :-)--] <sup>]</sup> 11:40, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| ==Question regarding revert== | |||
| Does the three revert rule refer to three reverts in three different articles, three reverts of different edits in one article, or three reverts of the same edit in the same article? Thanks, --] 15:35, 5 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| *] - refers to three reverts concerning the same content in one article. 4th revert and you will be blocked if reported. Please read the policy - there are a few exceptions (egregious vandalism for example).--] <sup>]</sup> 19:36, 5 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| :Thanks! --] 07:01, 6 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| = Waldorf Project Update = | |||
| Hey Bee, so sorry to read of the problems. I know you haven't formally signed up for the project, but since you expressed interest on my Talk page, I wanted to give you an update as I am doing with all project members. You are so welcome to join in at ] | |||
| == Consultation Stage == | |||
| We are currently in a stage of consulting with unbiased Wiki administrators about project management and plan to proceed with our next steps in 2 or3 days. | |||
| At that point we will also surely have final project pages set up outside of my user. Wonderactivist 04:48, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| Here is a copy of my note to admin and input has already begun. ] 05:06, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
| Dear Longhair and Cormaggio, Thank you immeasurably for your help with the Waldorf project so far. As you will note below, I am planning shortly to move the project pages to within alt ed - just want to clarify structure first. It is currently at User:Wonderactivist/Waldorf Project Team Page | |||
| With your admin experience, and the amount of back-n-forth this article has undergone - actually speeding up since the proposed project - I would like your opinion on strategies to manage the project if you should have time. | |||
| I see two major issues: | |||
| 1 there are "sides" within the group instead of a single focus on creating a good article. While this is somewhat to be expected, I also expected a greater level of professionalism. Is there a known strategy to begin to turn this around? | |||
| 2 Unbelievably, I think,we have actually reached almost a consensus on the Introduction. I would like to focus on this positive and if possible have it become a springboard for examining just one section at a time. 3 On the current project page, a format for the article has been proposed, while the person actually rewrote the whole article, I propose taking just the OUTLINE - the section names 0- and beginnning with agreeing upon the sections. | |||
| Other than the administrative questions, my project strategy will be to set up two pages within the alt ed project: | |||
| 1 to lay out a structure - outline only - for the page 2 to finalize with formal agreement, the introduction. 3 ONLY begin work on the next section when we have agreed upon the above two, then moving just one section at a time. | |||
| My hope is that it will disarm the ongoing wars over fine points and pet projects. | |||
| What is your opinion? | |||
| And thank you from the bottom of my transplanted Texas heart! Wonderactivist 04:14, 4 September 2006 (UTC) | |||
Latest revision as of 23:57, 4 October 2021
Archived Talks page, 29 Oct 2006 Archived Talks page 12 Jan 2007
Edit War
Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you get reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the article's talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.
Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.
- I'm just a little rusty in my editing, sorry, Will try to update myself on the rules and habits of editing. Thebee (talk) 06:50, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
- And by the way, I'm not editor HGilbert in any form, puppet or -otherwise. Any admin can check my IP-address and compare with his. Thanks. Thebee (talk) 07:01, 22 March 2015 (UTC).
- I'm just a little rusty in my editing, sorry, Will try to update myself on the rules and habits of editing. Thebee (talk) 06:50, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on edit warring. Thank you.--Shibbolethink 05:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
... Thanks Pete. Thebee (talk) 13:29, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Waldorf education is covered by discretionary sanctions
This message contains important information about an administrative situation on Misplaced Pages. It does not imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date.
Please carefully read this information:
The Arbitration Committee has authorised discretionary sanctions to be used for pages regarding Waldorf education, a topic which you have edited. The Committee's decision is here.
Discretionary sanctions is a system of conduct regulation designed to minimize disruption to controversial topics. This means uninvolved administrators can impose sanctions for edits relating to the topic that do not adhere to the purpose of Misplaced Pages, our standards of behavior, or relevant policies. Administrators may impose sanctions such as editing restrictions, bans, or blocks. This message is to notify you sanctions are authorised for the topic you are editing. Before continuing to edit this topic, please familiarise yourself with the discretionary sanctions system. Don't hesitate to contact me or another editor if you have any questions.The recent dispute came to my attention due to a 3RR complaint. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 16:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
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