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Revision as of 18:30, 17 April 2007 view sourceTony Fox (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers20,644 edits →London Times: - reply to anon← Previous edit Revision as of 18:45, 17 April 2007 view source Jimbo Wales (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Founder14,538 edits →Massive pedophile crackdownNext edit →
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:Congratulation to the Misplaced Pages for actioning to protect wide society from the dangerous individuals] 14:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC) :Congratulation to the Misplaced Pages for actioning to protect wide society from the dangerous individuals] 14:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
::Congratulation to Wen Hsing for making an extremely POV edit, not to mention one that is highly erroneous. — ]] 14:39, 17 April 2007 (UTC) ::Congratulation to Wen Hsing for making an extremely POV edit, not to mention one that is highly erroneous. — ]] 14:39, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

::I am unaware of any general crackdown. We always block people who are trolling and being disruptive. I see nothing wrong with any of the blocks.--] 18:45, 17 April 2007 (UTC)


== ] == == ] ==

Revision as of 18:45, 17 April 2007


This is Jimbo Wales's talk page, where you can send them messages and comments.
Archives: Index, Index, A, B, C, D, E, F, G, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120, 121, 122, 123, 124, 125, 126, 127, 128, 129, 130, 131, 132, 133, 134, 135, 136, 137, 138, 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144, 145, 146, 147, 148, 149, 150, 151, 152, 153, 154, 155, 156, 157, 158, 159, 160, 161, 162, 163, 164, 165, 166, 167, 168, 169, 170, 171, 172, 173, 174, 175, 176, 177, 178, 179, 180, 181, 182, 183, 184, 185, 186, 187, 188, 189, 190, 191, 192, 193, 194, 195, 196, 197, 198, 199, 200, 201, 202, 203, 204, 205, 206, 207, 208, 209, 210, 211, 212, 213, 214, 215, 216, 217, 218, 219, 220, 221, 222, 223, 224, 225, 226, 227, 228, 229, 230, 231, 232, 233, 234, 235, 236, 237, 238, 239, 240, 241, 242, 243, 244, 245, 246, 247, 248, 249, 250, 251, 252Auto-archiving period: 7 days 
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Archives
Index -index-
  1. September – December 2005
  2. January 2006
  3. January – February 2006
  4. February 2006
  5. February 2006, cont.
  6. March 2006
  7. April 2006 - late May 2006
  8. May 24 - July 2006
  9. July 2006 - August 2006
  10. August 2006
  11. Most of September 2006
  12. Late September 2006 - Early November 2006
  13. Most of November 2006
  14. Late November 2006 - December 8, 2006
  15. December 9, 2006 - Mid January 2007
  16. From December 22, 2006 blanking
  17. Mid January 2007 - Mid February 2007
  18. Mid February 2007- Feb 25, 2007
  19. From March 2, 2007 blanking
  20. March 2-5, 2007
  21. March 5-11, 2007
  22. March 11 - April 3, 2007
  23. April 2 - May 2, 2007
  24. May 3 - June 7, 2007
  25. June 9 - July 4, 2007
  26. July 13 - August 17, 2007
  27. August 17 - September 11, 2007
  28. September 14 - October 7, 2007
  29. October 28 - December 1, 2007
  30. December 2 - December 16, 2007
  31. December 15 - January 4, 2008
  32. January 4 - January 30, 2008
  33. January 30 - February 28, 2008
  34. February 28 - March 11, 2008
  35. March 9 - April 18, 2008
  36. April 18 - May 30, 2008
  37. May 30 - July 27, 2008
  38. July 26 - October 4, 2008
  39. October 4 - November 12, 2008
  40. November 10 - December 10, 2008
  41. December 5 - December 25, 2008
  42. December 25 - January 16, 2009
  43. January 15 - January 27, 2009
  44. January 26 - February 10, 2009
  45. February 8 - March 18, 2009
  46. March 18 - May 6, 2009
  47. May 5 - June 9, 2009
  48. June 10 - July 11, 2009
  49. July 12 - August 29, 2009

This page has archives. Sections older than 7 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III.
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Revision of history

Six years ago I said this was an interesting experiment, two or three years ago I pointed out fundamental problems causing Misplaced Pages to distort and conceal facts from the public. You ignored my suggestions then, perhaps you think we Xanadu people are too old for you and don't have any good ideas - I don't know why you've allowed this to devolve into a social club for self-righteous and those with a vested agenda.

Smile!

IsuzuAxiom1007 (talk • contribs) has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

ASIJ

Hi, Mr Wales, I met you recently, you came to my school ASIJ. Thought I'd mention that. Why do alot of Admins delete accurate information on wikipedia, insult me, then inform me that the information is inaccurate?

Yours Sincerely, Alexander Turner aturner@turnerzworld.com

Thank You!

Smokizzy has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Help with Wiki-rules.

Hi Jim,

My compliments, you look and seem like a great guy. I'm a newbie to Misplaced Pages and thus I'm trying to understand its structure. I posted a link - that I've come to learn that Misplaced Pages rules discourage posting your own like, but don't prohibit it. However, I did and an individual ( Ruhrfisch) reverted the link, failing to follow Misplaced Pages rules and had no justifiable reasons for doing so. When I questioned his actions he became highly defensive and attacked me...a course of events that Misplaced Pages rules state will happen when someone like Ruhrfisch does what he did.

Now, I'm having the most difficult time trying to find anyone in authority at Misplaced Pages who will make a ruling based on Misplaced Pages rules and not on opinion. Everyone seems to say that no one will do this, which begs the question - Why have rules if no one is going to uphold them?

Please direct me to someone who can assist me in taking this issue through the proper channels so that it can be resolved civilly, based on Wiki-rules. Thank you! DaVoice 22:55, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Can you give us a link to the post? --KZ 04:57, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
On closer look at the RFC, it seems to me that Ruhrfisch acted properly when removing that link. As the RFC stated, the link failed the guidelines of WP:EL. And also, may I remind you that consensus by many editors usually reflects the policies and guidelines of Misplaced Pages, not personal opinion. --KZ 05:18, 6 April 2007 (UTC)


This is my point exactly...Ruhrfisch did not act according to Misplaced Pages rules as I've indicated numerous times stating Wiki-Rules throughout that discussion. He only states opinions and yes in his opinion it fails. However, Wiki-Rules clearly state that a link that supports, gives credence to, items stated in the article are allowed. How is it that a link to photographs and articles about Newton Falls, Ohio and to the events listed in the article do not give credence to the article or fail to meet Wiki-Rules? Is it this clique? The very clique that Jim Wales speaks against having at Misplaced Pages? For Jim's sake...you allow a link to photos of a tornado, how less then is a link to photos about the Car Show, Bike Show, Cake Walk, Carnival, 44444 Event, Fishing Derby - or articles about the winners? Anyone can make a statement based on opinion, this is why Misplaced Pages has rules - or is it? Are you suggesting that I go around as a "watchdog" reverting links similar or worse than, such as the Youngstown Vindicator - Baltimore Sun? If a link to the | Newton Falls Leader is inappropriate, then based on Ruhrfisch's opinion a link to these newspapers should be reverted! DaVoice 16:06, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi Jim - Can only imagine how busy you are...but I'd like to get this issue settled. I realize that in the realm of things, this is minute, but this is also about Wikipedians like Rührfisch and his distructive behavior here at Misplaced Pages. A 1,000 pages on his watchdog list leaves a huge venue for abuse, and as a founder, I would hope that you are concerned about people like him destroying what you've created. DaVoice 14:30, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Implement plan semi-willy-nilly

I just wanted to say that becoming a sysop is *not a big deal*.

I think perhaps I'll go through semi-willy-nilly and make a bunch of people who have been around for awhile sysops. I want to dispel the aura of "authority" around the position. It's merely a technical matter that the powers given to sysops are not given out to everyone.

I don't like that there's the apparent feeling here that being granted sysop status is a really special thing.

--Jimmy Wales Tue Feb 11 11:55:00 UTC 2003

I think the time has come to actually do this. Most people agree RFA is broken, you're one of the few in the position to do something about it —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Random832 (talk • contribs) 01:10, 8 April 2007 (UTC).

I would just like to say, as a very recently promoted/appointed sysop, that I was both proud and humbled to receive the trust of the wiki community in my RfA. And I do not agree that RfA is broken - I failed one last year, which in hindsight I agree with. This year's decision, I hope, I will demonstrate was correct. But surely, the important thing is to have admins who are simultaneously competent and trustworthy. No?--Anthony.bradbury 01:21, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
The problem is arbitrary requirements like ten million edits in every namespace and a perfect record, that turns adminship into a big deal. --Random832 01:25, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Nobody asks for that. And "adminship is no big deal" does not mean that it is trivial.--Anthony.bradbury 01:27, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

It was hyperbole. But there's really no good reason for requiring large numbers of edits in each space - even in article space. I think part of the problem is it's so hard to take it away, so there's an irrational fear of not "getting it right the first time" and so people who should get the bit don't.--Random832 01:28, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
I think there are good reasons to require some experience and some personal attachment to the project from an admin of a top-ten website. Besides I simply do not understand how a person can be present on Wiki for half a year and do not have 3K+ mainspace and 0.5K+ wikispace contributions (or what is the highest requirement). Why would he want to be an admin? Alex Bakharev 04:10, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
If you actually make your own edits rather than leaving them to a glorified bot like VP or AWB, 3K+ mainspace per six months is a very high requirement. If each edit takes an average of five minutes (not unreasonable, if you're actually looking for things to edit and thinking about what to put, rather than trolling recent changes for vandalism to revert), that's 60 hours a week. You're basically saying that for someone who actually does stuff (rather than just running scripts) to be an admin, the wiki has to be a full-time job. --Random832 12:57, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
This is twenty edits per day or less than 2 hours a day according to your own estimates. I do not see it is an extremely excessive. Admins are suppose to be accountable that among other things mean that they present onwiki for a few hours everyday. Obviously not every edit can be done in five minute time. Some may require hours. On the other hand vandal reversion, tagging for cleanup, simple formatting according to MOS, categorizing, etc require significantly less than five minutes. I guess people writing FAs using an external editor might have problems with an edit count, but I never heard that somebody with a number of FAs was denied adminship based on the edit count Alex Bakharev 10:40, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

My two pence: I fully agree with the views of Jimmy: "I'll go through semi-willy-nilly and make a bunch of people who have been around for awhile sysops. I want to dispel the aura of "authority" around the position." While I do have full confidence in the process of RFA, sometimes the process gives highly distorted results in the name of consensus as happened in the case of Ambuj: Ambuj’s RfA. In case, you decide to make a bunch of people sysops, please remember Ambuj and many editors like him who should be endowed with the administrative tools to function more effectively. --Bhadani (talk) 06:53, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Rather than call upon Jimbo to implement a suggestion he mentioned four years ago when Misplaced Pages was a much smaller project, I suggest heading over to Misplaced Pages:Admin coaching/Requests where 48 people are awaiting coaches. I've been coaching several people and it's pretty easy and fun. Durova 07:15, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Durova, thank you for your inputs. I will surely try to help as far as possible. Frankly speaking, after noting my comments, I discovered that the views expressed by Jimbo were the old ones. Wikis do not allow deletion (everything happily or sadly resides in the historical archives and after-thoughts are not useful) so I just left my two pence to accumulate some interest here despite having discovered that Jimbo's comments were the old ones and the wikipedia community has traversed a long way since then :) --Bhadani (talk) 07:24, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

While I agree that it shouldn't be a big deal, deadminship should be less of a big deal too. Then people would be more willing to give adminship out, and it'd cause less possible damage with having bad admins, you know. (And even then, it shouldnt be a big deal for them to get it back if they reform...) --Phroziac ♥♥♥♥ 21:39, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

In theory I agree. In practice that has two drawbacks: it would draw a lot of energies away from editing and administrative chores into desysopping and resysopping and the people who would take the greatest interest in that process would be the ones who got blocked by that particular administrator. We already have a voluntary process at Category:Administrators open to recall. Durova 16:56, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
I think I am verry smart and educated and techincally savvy, so I should be made an Admin by Jimmy Wales very soon. Or allowed to be one otherwise I'd say within a month perhaps? Gatorphat 03:06, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
  • RfA is not broken. It is functioning quite well. A few people dislike some other people's reasons for supporting or opposing candidates. They need to get over it and realize that those other users are entitled to make up their minds based on what ever criteria they would like to select. Johntex\ 04:24, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Please help

I have recently came across Misplaced Pages in Bosnian.To my astonishment it is hugely biased, any atempt to talk or edit is being dismissed with no explanation. This particular Misplaced Pages grossly destroys what Misplaced Pages is all about. Personally I started doubting accuracy and reliability of information found on Misplaced Pages. For example it does not have a single tag for neutrality even in most ambiguuous or controversial articles. The language in its form only exist for several years and speakers of the language have very turbulent recent history,and the country where the language one of the three official languages, constitutes of three nations.However administrators and registered users come from only one of these nations and are hugely unfair towards the other two. I have tried to point out some geografical factual mistakes,tried discussing -no reply,tried editing all changes are reverted with no explanations, finally blocked with no warning nor discussion. I hape I came to the right address to point this out, if not my apologies, pointing out to whom I shall write would be hugely appreciated.A.P. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 87.175.241.217 (talk) 09:58, 10 April 2007 (UTC).

You could go to Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment and solicit outside opinions on that article. Durova 16:08, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Request to an Administrator...

Please review the "Gary Lavergne" page and consider reverting the last set of changes. The assertions have no basis in fact and is accusatory. Thank you. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 146.6.110.149 (talk) 11:28, 10 April 2007 (UTC).

Onorem pruned the accusations down somewhat - good enough? --AnonEMouse 14:32, 10 April 2007 (UTC)


Thank you. The article is of an living person. The last paragraph is argumentative because there is no standard definition of mass murder. Some define it as the successive murders of individuals who were individually targeted--like Whitman, the San Ysidro McDonalds, or the Luby's Cafeteria tragedies. The Kehoe incident does not fall into that category--it was a bomb that killed indiscriminately and simultaneously. Please understand that the person writing that comment has been permanently banned (a.k.a. SubwayJack)on more than one occasion and has a long history of vandalizing articles connected to the Whitman Murders (Charles Whitman, Ramiro Martinez, Houston McCoy, and now Gary Lavergne). Check with Jimbo--he knows about this and what I am talking about. That is why I ask for reverting to the April 8th version, and the assignment of an administrator to monitor the entries. Again. Thank you. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 146.6.110.149 (talk) 16:07, 10 April 2007 (UTC).

A Greeting lost?

Jimbo,

I have been here for 11 days editing and nobody has given me a welcome. I would be great I think if you were the first to personally give me my "welcome to wikipedia" message that everyone else gets. That would be awesome! Thanks, Gatorphat 03:47, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Speaking at VCU

I am very much looking forward to seeing you speak tomorrow at VCU. It will be very interesting to finally meet you. I'll see you tomorrow. All the best, ^demon 06:21, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

It was nice to meet you today. Unfortunate that you had to leave really quickly and get to the airport, but a nice experience nonetheless. I think the audience was very receptive to your speech and ideologies. All the best, ^demon 21:49, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, great presentation. It was great to meet you and talk to you, even if only for a minute. :) --Coredesat 23:25, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. Keep up the good work. --StevenL 03:32, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

FYI: per Misplaced Pages:Conflict_of_interest/Noticeboard#Department_of_Art_Education_-_Virginia_Commonwealth_University__.28history.7CWatchlist_this_article.7Cunwatch.29_.5Bwatchlist.3F.5D I've full protected the Virginia Commonwealth University article for one month. Durova 08:02, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

After receiving some polite communication from the faculty I've unprotected the article and launched Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Classroom coordination as a venue where professional educators can get guidance with experienced Wikipedians about incorporating Misplaced Pages writing into classroom assignments. The idea had been at proposal stage for nearly a month and generated some interest so it was easy to implement it now. I'd like to get get the word out about the new WikiProject, perhaps a few lines in the Chronicle of Higher Education, and am interfacing with people from the Foundation toward that end. Durova 03:53, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Wikia Search

Hi,
Just some questions about wikia search. I'm Sorry for contacting you on this page, but I think that you may react faster to this one.

The wikia-Search project seems to be not active at the moment, because there are no comments on the mailinglist or in the forum. So I'm wondering how the project shall make further process.

For the moment it seems that we have rare ideas how we could make a fully new way of doing such a search - the most advanced may be mine while the others are more into distributed search and nothing radically new.

So, if you are really interested in this project you might have to invest more effort into. I think it will be needed to ask some AI-and-search experts from various universities if they can help. I therefore think on peoples linke Michael Strube who invented the WikiRelate! algorithm or Shaul Markovitch who invented an even better way, because they are already combining AI and Misplaced Pages for doing classification and search.

What r u thinking about?

MovGP0 00:22, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

German De Misplaced Pages Unscheinbar aka Carol Christiansen is back

If there should be a Holy Lord I beg that German Misplaced Pages is not going to be poisened again from this man.

Bliming heck when will they understand that this kind of people behave only like German former Blockwarts. Please have a talk to the responsible people at Wikipedi in Germany Thank you. Kind regards--80.144.244.229 09:36, 12 April 2007 (UTC)


Gift for you

Dress Sword of Misplaced Pages
In appreciation for being the genius behind Misplaced Pages, I present you with this dress sword. Feel free to wear it at any black tie event or other ceremonial affair. SU Linguist 19:09, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

You might be interested/concerned

I've just left the following at WP:AN/I, touching on an issue that's concerned me for a while (not the specific question but the general one):

I've somehow got entangled in a large set of articles — one for each episode of a couple of Disney situation comedies (for children): That's So Raven and Cory in the House (neither of which I'd heard of before, and both of which I wish I never had). See, for example Ain't Miss Bahavian, on which I've just done a lot of work, reduced from this (not the worst by a long way).
The articles were typically long and sprawling, often with immensely long and poorly written plot "summaries", trivia sections, poor formatting, etc. I did my best to tidy them, and met determined opposition from a few editors, one in particular – Kid1412 (talk · contribs) – getting very emotional and abusive, though calming down after the intervention of a couple of other editors, and being cooperative for now. He or she has now admitted, though, to writing the plot summaries (or some of them, at least) while watching the series. There are no online or other sources so far as I can tell.
Now, it's not important in one sense; as with more than half the articles here, the subjects are trivial, and who cares whether the summaries are accurate, well-written, properly formatted, etc.? (The same goes for the pop-music articles that I try to clean up and defend.) From the Misplaced Pages point of view, though, it presumably does matter. Or does it? Is our position that the guidelines and policies are only really for proper articles, and the fanzine side of things can be safely ignored, and allowed to go its own way? There are countless articles documenting the entire outputs of minor pop singers and bands, every episode and character in minor children's television series, discographies going into obsessive detail, all breaking many if not most of the formatting guidelines in the MoS and the relevant WikoProjects, including the fair use of images.
My specific question is: what should I do about the case that I mentioned at the beginning? In theory the plot summaries should all be removed (in theory, I think, all the articles should go as being insignificant and making no claim to significance).
My general question is: are we going to pay attention to the vast mass of the Misplaced Pages iceberg which most editors and admins prefer to ignore — the fancruft below Misplaced Pages's plimsoll line? If so, then I'll just remove all the articles from my Watchlist and breathe a sigh of relief. If not, then I'll need a lot more help...

I thought that you might be interested (and share my concern). --Mel Etitis (Talk) 10:18, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

My take is that as long as it is in principle attributable to some stored version that has beenpublished on the air or over cable and can be expected to soon be on DVDs that it should not be deleted on grounds of WP:ATT. WAS 4.250 10:45, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

There have been a number of responses at WP:AN/I, many of them sharing my concern. The opinion has been offered, and seems to be popular, that Misplaced Pages is just doomed to have a significant number of SIG areas that go against Misplaced Pages guidelines and policies, and we should more or less rope them off and let editors there do what they want. It would make my life a lot easier, but I can't agree. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 22:17, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
"If you aren't having fun editing Misplaced Pages, then you are doing it wrong" is what I always tell people. WAS 4.250 14:16, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Forgive me if I say that that's not only simplistic but straightforwardly false. Hell is (at least very often) other people. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 17:37, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

See this, SqueakBox 17:42, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Wikitravel

Wikitravel uses the MediaWiki software, which is also used by Misplaced Pages. However, Wikitravel is not a Wikimedia project; it was begun independently. Unlike Misplaced Pages, it uses the Creative Commons Attribution ShareAlike license rather than the GNU Free Documentation License. What I wish to ask is that can I also start up with any such project like wikipedia or wikitravels with the help of mediaWiki software and that to free of cost. Thanks Sushant gupta 10:31, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Yeah sure, the MediaWiki software is free to download and use for whatever you want. Go to http://www.mediawiki.org/ for details and downloads. --Sherool (talk) 14:35, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Not all Wikimedia projects are GFDL licensed; a notable exception is Wikinews, which is CC-by-sa. hbdragon88 21:55, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

A minor correction: Wikinews uses CC-by, not CC-by-sa. --Dapeteばか 21:50, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Concern regarding zealous admin

Writing a biography for recently deceased Education Administrator Cliff Turney, I found the article scheduled for deletion.

I understand the process involved, and believe that articles should face ruthless editing.

My concern is that the reasons given for the deletion are illegitimate. The article details a person notable under every single category listed for Academic.

The work is unfinished, and if it is to be deleted out of hand, I don't feel like doing more .. of anything.

It gets more concerning for me, as the person who listed it for deletion has done so for other articles I have proposed, in the past. When I go to the talk page to write in support, I'm faced with a Greek chorus who don't seem to be acquainted with the notability guidelines, but they just make the ambit claim it doesn't match. Some comments, like "non-notable academic who probably, like the great mass of men, lived a life of quiet desperation." I similarly recall such a comment on a previous, unrelated article. DDB 13:47, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Instead of appealing to Jimbo (who almost never intervenes in matters like this), why not try voicing your concerns directly to the editor who nominated the article? This encyclopedia is a collaborative project, after all. And if your statement above is in reference to the very brief conversation that you had at Talk:Cliff Turney, then you've mis-characterized it completely. A Train 14:32, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
Also be aware that deletion discussions usually remain open for several days. You can continue improving the article and very possibly get it retained, if you really can document through independent sources that the person satisfies notibility standards. Durova 15:48, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

This is whacked

Larry Sanger has gone from "co-founder" to "founder" http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/technology/s/1004/1004213_take_wikipedia_with_pinch_of_salt.html SakotGrimshine 15:51, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Several newspapers are doing this: Hut 8.5 16:57, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
And the Guardian: Odd that they'd all do the "founder" thing in their articles - I wonder if Larry Sanger's reaction came in a press release or something that provided all of them a basis to work from. (addendum: the Guardian story does later in the piece identify Sanger as "one of the founders" - but originally IDs him as the founder.) Tony Fox (arf!) 19:03, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
What I find funny is that that journalist from the MEN (Manchester Evening News, that's what we call it here in Manchester) made a mistake. He said "the Irish town of Mayo". Uh, no, that's Swinford in County Mayo. So he really has no right to go on about reported inaccuracies. --Deskana (fry that thing!) 21:58, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Canadian Heritage Alliance

I think we need a great deal of clarification on this article. One of the administrators continues to strip the article down to it's bare bones and there's a disagreement about what is considered to be legitimate sources. For example, this administrator has said that documents form the Canadian Human Rights Tribunal can not be used as sources unless there are sources from the mass media to back them up. The administrator is also stating (I might be putting words in thei person's mouth and if I'm wrong I apologize for that) sources from interested parties such as Matthew Lauder are unreliable (I include a sample of articles):

I think we would all appreciate some clarification on what is and is not a proper source. Thank you. AnnieHall 19:01, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

The best place to go for that is an article content request for comments. Durova 03:17, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

I hereby request permission to alter Wikimedia Logos for my own public, non-profit use.

I know that those logos are copyrighted, so I am asking for permission before altering them in any way, or posting these alterations publicly. I have created a Google Co-op Wikimedia search engine for my own use, and I would like to combine - meaning place side by side in one image - several project logos in order to create a title image to use in place of the default text supplied by Google: "Wikimedia Search". The Search Engine is located here: http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=002002171166015021901%3Aiz3pyuxcryc Alex460 04:47, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

You can also try asking m:User:Anthere, currently the chair of the board of the foundation. She might be faster to respond, since Jimbo is a bit occupied in general. --TheDJ (talk • contribs • WikiProject Television) 12:04, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

A couple of suggestions

You are probabaly aware of this, already, but I think it would be good to have a Wiki toolbar to gain easier access to search on Wiki. Other features could be added along, such as today's DYK, seperate search on Wikisource, etc. Apart from the toolbar, the search feature on Wiki could also be improved. One often needs to type in the correct text they are searching for, but if they're not certain of the correct spelling, they may get the wrong results, or no results at all. I also don't understand why the search engine makes a distinguishment between lower cases and capital cases. --Thus Spake Anittas 16:51, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

You'd probably have better luck discussing this at Misplaced Pages:Village pump (technical). —Remember the dot 02:17, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Disclosing my real life name and my real IP by checkuser Dmcdevit

Hi Jimbo. I am worried about this situation and I made a report at . Please look at it. Thanks.--MariusM 12:28, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

You have been impersonated on IRC

Hello Sir. I am just leaving a polite message to warn you that last night (14th April) / early hours of Sunday morning (April 15th), a user on IRC calling himself WoW8 (it is suspected he is a Willy on Wheels clone), changed his nickname to JimboWales7, and was attempting impersonate you on the #wikipedia-en, and #wikiversity-en channels on Freenode. After changing his nickname to JimboWales7, the user was asked to identify himself with your cloak, which He refused to do. Following a request to Freenode IRCops, one of the operators, Christel, placed a K_line against his IP (which is static) as a full network ban. I will be keeping a lookout on IRC in case he pops up again under a different IP. Thank you for your attention., Sir. Thor Malmjursson 15:20, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Did he claim to be Jimbo Wales or did he just choose that nickname? --Thus Spake Anittas 15:37, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
From memory, used nick and also claimed to be Jimbo despite objections and obvious evidence to the contrary. ShakespeareFan00 15:42, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
Another impersonator appeared recently on #wikipedia and #wikipedia-en today under the nickname Jimbo_Wales2. // PTO 18:45, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!

I want to thank Jimbo for making Misplaced Pages. Now I can research (almost) everything whenever I want to! Right here on the 'Net. Misplaced Pages truly is an innovation of teh Internets. Thank you.

I am from Uncyclopedia, though. I largely ignore their Anti-Misplaced Pages stuff. Even though I am much more largely associated with them than here.

But thanks for Misplaced Pages.

-- An IP —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.73.111.231 (talk) 21:19, 15 April 2007 (UTC).

ED

I think it's time for the people of Misplaced Pages to stand against the ArbCom and add back in links to ED. Many of us also edit at ED, and would like links to edit it back in. What is wrong with ED? They are very informative about LiveJournal evemts! Hopefully you approve, or we poor workers will overthrow ArbCom and you! August 2 2005rps 01:17, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

What's "ED"? -- Hoary 01:22, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
No, it's not going to happen. ED is Encyclopedia Dramatica, a site that is well known for its attack pages on Wikipedians. // PTO 01:25, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
I would add its attempts at disruption of Misplaced Pages process as well. For example, this attempt at an AFD by the above user. Mr.Z-mantalk¢ 01:40, 16 April 2007 (UTC)


I notice how people from ED with 1 or 2 edits go around nominating articles for deletion because ED got deleted (including the original poster of this thread). The site basically goes around bashing everyone who works to help any wiki that's not ED -- they even impersonated an administrator here and claimed she had a miscariage for her pregnancy and spread all these horrible rumors. ED is always spreading false rumors and should be banned forever. SakotGrimshine 15:45, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

They also have the Misplaced Pages logo on their page about us, a clear copyright violation. Mr.Z-mantalk¢ 20:04, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Regaining Identity! User:Jeffrey Newman

I spent a little time with Misplaced Pages in 2005 and have returned occasionally to read stuff but could never log-in. My impatience level is high so I did not hang around. These past couple of days, I have realised that, since I want to do some serious work, it is worth persisting. But I am told that since when I originally created my account, I did not supply an e-mail address, it is impossible. Nothing is impossible - so I've come here to ask for help, hoping that you will not personally have to be involved but that someone else may pick up this request. As far as my queries re CIA, perhaps I watch too much West Wing (I received the whole set as a "65th" present from my family - I'm in the UK) but they would be stupid NOT to be ensuring Wiki survives - and though 'intelligence' might not be a characteristic, that level of stupidity is unimaginable. Experiences logging in to Misplaced Pages in Moscow were also interesting! But, since I have nothing to hide, I might as well join in. More than anything else, however - many congratulations on getting this whole enterprise up and running. It is 'awesome' (which is not an everyday word from an elderly Brit! Thank you. 85.210.255.81 01:52, 16 April 2007 (UTC) P.S. Why does "User Name:Jeffrey Newman" come out in red, not blue? - Jimbo: I really do NOT expect you, personally, to have to answer this!

The email reqirement is I believe for those who lose their password and want a new one emailed to them. If "nothing is impossible" them remember your old password. Otherwise, some things are impossible and you perhaps should create a new account. WAS 4.250 02:14, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
I presume you mean User:Jeffrey Newman, and that is your real name. The procedure to recover your account would be as follows: Find an administrator (or other well-respected Wikipedian) who lives close to you and prove your identity to them. They should then contact a developer, who will set the email address on your account to the address you choose, and you can then use the normal password recovery system.
Developer time is a precious resource, and they probably would prefer not to get such requests, so as an alternative, consider getting a new account, perhaps User:Jeffrey X Newman where X is your middle initial, or User:JeffreyNewman without the space, or User:Jeff Newman if you don't mind the contraction of your name, and then move the old user and talk pages to the new name. This is the easiest way to go.-gadfium 03:47, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. NZ is almost as far from UK as it is possible to be (though we shall be there in December!) How do I find out if there is an Administrator in London, to whom I could pay a visit, or send a copy of my passport, or something? 85.210.255.81 04:59, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Look at Category:Wikipedians in London, and pick a name you recognise from 2005, or look for an intersection with Category:English Misplaced Pages administrators, neither of which will be comprehensive lists. You could also ask at the talk page of the Misplaced Pages:English Wikipedians' notice board. Before you go to any trouble, wait to get some responses to my idea, as the developers might not be willing to do such a thing, or it might not be possible for technical reasons (if the email address is encrypted in the database, for example).-gadfium 05:09, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
I don't see any intersection of those categories, so the notice board is probably your best bet.-gadfium 05:17, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

It is generally quite rare for an account to be usurped, especially if the account does not have any permissions beyond "user" (though even then it's rare) and especially if no e-mail address was specified for the account. Nonetheless, proving your identity should not be all that difficult. I'm going to assume that you have an e-mail address with pipex.net. If this is the case, please contact privacy@pipex.net and ask them to e-mail me (or another admin) with confirmation that the e-mail address belongs to Jeffrey Newman, and then send me (or the same admin) an e-mail from that account verifying that it was you who made this request. Per the terms of their privacy policy this should be acceptable, and it should serve as adequate proof of your identity. The request can then be passed on to the devs, though it will likely take a very long time to complete. AmiDaniel (talk) 07:33, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Or, an interesting thing I just ran across, you might register with Trufina.com. Never used it before, but it looks like a fairly reliable way to prove one's identity. AmiDaniel (talk) 07:48, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Only for Americans, as far as I can see. It is geared around doing record searches based on a social security number. Metamagician3000 08:47, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

London Times

You may be interested in this letter which was pulished in this morning's edition of the London Times . Perhaps it is about time Misplaced Pages had an official spokesman/person to counter these negative claims in the British press. Giano 08:23, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I nominate that fine user, Giano. Trouble is, there's an element - only an element - of truth in these claims. People who falsely claim that obscure Australian TV journalists have rock-star siblings don't help, for example. Neither does all the fannish cruft. That said, the writer of this letter sounds like someone with an axe to grind, and lots of people will surely see him this way. Metamagician3000 08:55, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
There are several points here. First, that correspondent does indeed seem to have an axe to grind. Secondly, as ongoing events continue to show, there is indeed more than a kernel of truth to what he claims. Thirdly, there are positives and negatives in the British press (excepting the gutter press, which is unlikely to take an interest in this particular area anyway) just as there are everywhere. If you don't like the letter or the article, then send your own counter-argument to The Times. It might get published, it might not, but I think cranking up the Misplaced Pages propaganda machine is unlikely to help and may in fact be ultimately counter-productive. Badgerpatrol 09:30, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
The (London) time is well known for printing seemingly controversial letters on various topics, However, it is also known for allowing people to respond to letters it prints. These need not be from offical bodies. Personally, I think the letter writer is wrong on some points. The other argument being if he thinks edits are being removed by cabals why doesn't he raise this with the community here? Presumably he tried to.
Why didn't he try? Because people who do that get banned repeatedly by admins working for cabals for the must spurious of reasons. It happens so frequently that its not even funny. So what happens? Someone writes a letter to a newspaper and your immediate response is to ban the person (or who you think the person is) for a spurious reason without proof (sockpuppetry). But the real reason you do it is because behind the facade of commitment to open development and freedom of speech, Misplaced Pages is an authoritarian, paranoid beast which lashes out wildly to any criticism no matter how well founded. The only reason the user was banned was that he spoke a truth that you don't want to hear. Now ban this IP address - you know you want to --194.151.240.201 16:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
er, actually, if the writer *is* the former WP editor as mentioned below, he was blocked way back last year sometime; the blocks had nothing to do with the letter being published. Sorry to burst that bit of your bubble. TINC. Tony Fox (arf!) 18:30, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
Misplaced Pages, has endless triva that is accepted, however there IS a lot of well sourced infromation in Misplaced Pages that would not be in other encyclopaedias with 'closed' edit models. A case in point being biographical details on obscure opposition leaders in questionable regimes. In addition, Misplaced Pages is not censored, hence in respect of articles on religion what might appear to be biased, when is in fact valid comment, just not palatable comment.;-)

ShakespeareFan00 13:43, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

  • Thanks Metamagician, but no I don't talk to the press in any way shape or form, and the unseemly spectacle of various editors airing their differences publicly in the Times would be enough to put people off their breakfast and wikipedia for good. A Minister of Education endorsing Misplaced Pages is to be encouraged here, not allowed to be undermined by the likes of Larry Sanger and other disgruntled editors so Misplaced Pages needs to respond officially to all such public comments as this. Millions of people find our work here helpful and useful - we should be proud of that and not allow it to be demeaned. We the editors put in the work - it is up to "senior management" to defend us and our efforts. Giano 13:55, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
I doubt if The Times is going to offer itself up for editors to have a pop at each other over trivialities. However, it may print a reasoned response outlining in s substantive form a counterargument. Generally, the use of Misplaced Pages should be encouraged, obviously- it's a fun way to learn new things which one can then check and independently verify. It's my experience that schoolchildren (and indeed often even university undergraduates) may lack the skills needed to differentiate between different sources and weigh up their usefulness. If the education secretary is suggesting that Misplaced Pages is a usable source for school essays and the like, then he is frankly wrong. It's possible that he doesn't actually understand what Misplaced Pages is and how it works. In any case, it's silly to get involved in Wiki-propaganda or tit-for-tat press releases and so forth, that's not the Wiki way. The success of Misplaced Pages (for what it is) is manifestly obvious to all. Badgerpatrol 14:28, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

In my opinion, a random English language Misplaced Pages article is more reliable than a random mass media article. WAS 4.250 16:57, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. And double hmm. Tony Fox (arf!) 17:11, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
  • Hmmm indeed! If we were certain it was him, then I would write a fully referenced section in his biography reporting his hobby of writing letters rubbishing wikipedia to national newspapers (see the talk page ) - but there could be two people of that name both domiciled in Matlock - so we have to give benefeit of doubt. If on the other hand Misplaced Pages felt that the co-incidence was too great to be in doubt, then the foundation could inform the Times their correspondent was in fact permanently banned from editing the project. Hence even The Times is not exempt from publishing dodgy information. Giano 17:20, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

<unindent> Speaking about The Times publishing dodgy information, the story that inspired the letter starts "The founder of the Misplaced Pages online encyclopaedia criticised the Education Secretary yesterday for suggesting that the website could be a good educational tool for children." Who dat? More importantly, the feedback on that page is generally pretty good, and the kudos from the UK Education Secretary sound interesting........dave souza, talk 23:16, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I liked the comment from the last guy on the "Have your say" to the original April 11 article.
  • Misplaced Pages is actually a better educational tool because pupils know that it can be edited by anyone. It forces pupils to check sources, and to determine which details are worth tracking down and which can be accepted without real risk. There's nothing like a crtiical attitude to one's textbook. --Malcolm McLean, Bradford, UK
Yes, and my response would be: you can find all kinds of interesting things down at the city dump. But its still a city dump and children shouldn't be playing there, no matter how well informed they are about the dangers of dumps. --194.151.240.201 16:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
Is Malcom McLean of Bradford, UK one of us? --Rednblu 02:54, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
I don't know whether I am in the wrong, but even if I am, I am happy to accept whatever gets thrown at me, including blocks, bans, or an indef. I don't care. I have just emailed The Times with a direct reply to Mr. Steadman's criticisms of Misplaced Pages, from the point of view of myself as an editor. I will be making the text of this email available on my Talk page, which gives you all the opportunity to view what I wrote and to comment upon it. Administrators, you are welcome too. Please don;t hold back, say what you think, but think what you say! Thor Malmjursson 04:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
  • Why are you holding a gun; threatening to shoot people?

Certainly not a timely, or seemly idea of what a spokesperson for Misplaced Pages should look like, in my opinion.

Smile

Djmckee1 has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

You are the best Wikipedian in the world and one of my greatest heros.Djmckee1 14:08, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Hello - Question

Hello Jimbo. I'm having a bit of a problem with one of wiki's users. His user name is Kronecker. The problem is that i have been adopted on Wiki and am doing lessons with my adopter. Ive edited some articles and write dome also. I have made some mistakes as you do (we all start somewhere, like you did when you co-foundered wiki) and he is picking up every mistake i do and posting it on my wiki page. I would not mind that bud he is doing it in a unnice way and calling me an idiot. This is what he said (hes done it twice):

Are you an idiot? That plot synopsis wasn't encyclopædic at all. You shouldn't capitalize titles either - use italics. --Kronecker 07:12, 15 April 2007 (UTC)


so i said privatly: I would appreciate it if you do not call me an idiot on my user page. I have been adopted on wikipedia and am learning how to write articles properly, so i don't need you to tell me im an idiot because: Alec1990 15:04, 16 April 2007 (UTC) Quote > Are you an idiot? That plot synopsis wasn't encyclopædic at all. You shouldn't capitalize titles either - use italics. --Kronecker 07:12, 15 April 2007 (UTC) <Quote

This is immature of you and i would appreciate it if you would not do it.

Thanks Alec

Then he said: Why have you labbelled all your contributions minor edits. You are an idiot. --Kronecker 00:15, 16 April 2007 (UTC)


Ive asked him privately to stop and via his talk page and he has done it again. Ive had a look at the user dispute page and i just don't get it. its complicated for a newbie.

He has done this in the past and has been blocked before.

I would really appreciate if you could help. Thanks Alec

I've issued an NPA reminder to the editor in question, and will leave a note on User:Alec1990's page as well. Tony Fox (arf!) 15:33, 16 April 2007 (UTC)


Hive

Daniel Brandt's notorious Hive Mind page which gave info on various editors and admins who work here including yourself and myself has been taken down. I thought you would be interested to know, SqueakBox 17:31, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if that was my doing. I have recently sent wikipedia-watch emails demanding that I'm removed from the page on the grounds that my username is no longer Dbiv and I am no longer an administrator, contrary to what my entry used to say. I would like to claim all due credit, naturally. Fys. &#147;Ta fys aym&#148;. 18:55, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
I strongly suspect not as if that were the case he could easily have removed you. There is an internet page where DB explains his motives but I wont be able to link to it as editors have been blocked for linking to said site. Nice to see you still here, David, SqueakBox 20:34, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
It's another veiled legal threat by Brandt () . Careful, he's trying to build a good argument, and he's probably setting us up for his proverbial "home run". Nothing pleases Brandt more than taking down a huge sum of information to preserve his own "privacy". // Sean William (PTO) 20:47, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Massive pedophile crackdown

About a month ago, there appeared to be a big crackdown on self-identified pedophilies. From what I can gather, the ones that I knew that had put up messages saying they were a pedophile (User:Zanthalon, User:Silent War, User:Clayboy) seemed to be indefinitely blocked and had their pages deleted and protected. I've found something here: Can you explain and is there any more information on this? Christopher Connor 21:55, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

The banning of three self-professed pedophiles hardly seems like a "massive crackdown". If there are issues with individual bans please email individual ArbCom members directly. -Will Beback · † · 23:06, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Congratulation to the Misplaced Pages for actioning to protect wide society from the dangerous individualsWen Hsing 14:05, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
Congratulation to Wen Hsing for making an extremely POV edit, not to mention one that is highly erroneous. —  $PЯINGrαgђ  14:39, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
I am unaware of any general crackdown. We always block people who are trolling and being disruptive. I see nothing wrong with any of the blocks.--Jimbo Wales 18:45, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

User:Yamla

Dear Wales, see Tito Ortiz, Brock Lesnar, Bobby Lashley, The Undertaker, Dave Batista and Mark Henry. These are just the articles I have found that have been protected for a long time and repeadetely extended, each for the same reason, which none has sufficent indication that fully protection is a must. None of those articles can be classified as in need for fully protection and there has not been any edit on those articles that can be indentified as vandalism. There has not been any discussions and no other admin (except Yamla) has been involved in these protections. Can you please fix this? Those topic´s have nothing related to that admin, and it is rather a taking advantage of the admin tools situation beacuse of a beef with an user.