| Revision as of 13:07, 12 July 2007 editMichaelW (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users746 edits →I am stopping now my useless comments← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 12:30, 29 August 2024 edit undoLowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,299,654 editsm Archiving 1 discussion(s) to Talk:Fidel Castro/Archive 18) (bot |
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|itndate=26 November 2016 |
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Continuation of why are we refusing to call Castro a Dictator? |
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I am continuing in response to MichaelW comment if anyone is interested in following the discussion then go to the archives to see prior comments |
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The way I look at the definition of coup d'etat is a quick grab for power from an existing government and I agree that Castro did manage to do that. Otherwise he will not be in power today. He try without success to get to power by democratic means but he could not by whatever reasons. |
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Obviously Cubans wanted a change when he grabbed power and many probably though they had something good for a little while with the revolution as long as they were not affected by all the private property confiscations in the name of the people by the revolution (Castro) but we soon learn once he had control of the press that we were going in the path of an authoritarian regime commanded by our commander in chief Castro. |
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As for your comments on Chavez not being a dictator. You must be blind. He seem to have being elected by the people of Venezuela but was he? Do you think his best friend Castro did not lecture him about how to manipulate Venezuela's poor buying their vote? Something he(Chavez) is actually trying to do in the US by offering discounted fuel for heating to poor people? DO you think Chavez does this things because he cares about them? No he does not he cares about that he cares about the influence he can get from those people that he is helping here. |
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{{WikiProject Socialism|importance=top}} |
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Yes Chavez is a dictator also. Have we not seen in the news in radio and tv how he arbitrarily stop the license of an independent TV station because it was critical of his government. |
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What would you have done if Richard Nixon had order using executive power of his government to close the Washington-Post newspaper after that paper showed everyone about the Watergate scandal? I know many of you can not even imagine things like this happening in this country. |
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Just think for a second how democratic is Chavez that now he had to dissolve the equivalent to the Senate and the representative they all happen to vote in favor of giving him full power to rule on his own without the checks and balance of a congress. Do you think those are not the signs of a dictator? Soon Venezuelan will have one ballot were only Chavez appear on it and unfortuanatelly I believe is too late for them |
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to vote him out. I am betting the only way he will relinquish power is when he die just like Castro. Do you think is right that just one person should have so much power? If you answer yes to that last question then I am wasting my time here. Is like going back to the times of Kings and Queens even them were not as powerful as today's modern dictators with access to information at their finger tips with advance computers and technology of all kind to control their own people. |
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{{WikiProject Cuba|importance=Top}} |
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Please read Animal Farm if you have not and also 1984. I read those books for the first time when I was in my 30s here in the US. |
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{{WikiProject Military history|class=GA|Biography=y|North-American=y|Cold-War=y}} |
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Do you know why? Because Castro does not let those books be published in Cuba. Those books were portraying the life I and millions of other Cubans had to endure under Castro's rule. Slogans like "Patria o Muerte venceremos" finding and enemy to blame for everything (the US) and the list goes on everything there is a portrait of the Cuba I knew well and that foreigners visiting Cuba hardly experience when they get the government guided tour of the goodness of socialism staying at 5 stars hotels only for foreigners. WHat would you say if all of the sudden all the hotels in this country could be use only by rich Europeans visiting here? (that is what happen in Cuba where any foreigner is above any national) |
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I was so impress with those little books. Since the guy that wrote them is long gone and he wrote them even before the Cuban revolution existed. I was surprise to see that totalitarian regimes be leftist or rightist create similar systems were they had to repress people and information. Were "we the people" end up loosing against the monopoly of the state over our life. Where the state decide about how many pants and what type and color you can have during the year and even with who you meet. If you like a system like that you probably should vote for some one like Klinton and then let us say we let her do as she pleases! We will soon loose every freedom we have and you will be looking over your shoulder and being very careful what you say and to whom you talk. Being afraid of "Big Brother" spying on you! |
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Many people do like that kind of system and thrive in it specially is good for the none talented, the snitches the ones that like to live without working hard all they need to do is agree with everything the maximum leader says. that's all. |
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I and many other people think we should have the right to each of us have their own opinion. |
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Is not very far fetch that very soon governments will have the power thru technology to be able to watch over each of us like Big Brother. Everything you do or say will be recorded. Do you think governments any government should have that kind of control over individuals? I think is best a system in which you are able to voice your |
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opinion your POV without fear of getting kill. Without the fear of retribution against your family. Without the fear of losing your job or not getting a job just because you do not happen to agree with what the government think or do. I am a bit sad that many of you have not experience a system like that and think is a good thing. |
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I believe the individual should have the right to choose no the government bureaucrats. I believe we should all have a voice and not necessarily the same voice singing in unison. |
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==Net worth== |
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] 03:42, 12 July 2007 (UTC). |
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I see that in 2006, Forbes ranked Castro as #7 on a list richest heads of state. May we mention this? I do not wish to bother if it has already been edited out. |
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== Random Sentence == |
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:Dear Silent Voice, even by your own definition the Cuban Revolution wasn't a coup d'etat. It was no quick grab for power, it took a couple of years guerilla war and a popular uprising, and Castro's concentration of power was no quick grab either, but the result of a long process. And Chavez didn't "arbitrarily stop the license of an independent TV station because it was critical of his government." Its licence was up for renewal and the renewal was legitimately refused - not because of criticism but because of its involvement in the failed coup. Realistic political opinions need to start from what is - not from what you think it should be. |
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What is this sentence, |
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:It would be possible to take your opinions more seriously if you got your basic facts right, and had a basic understanding of what makes the political world tick. It matters very little what any of us think if it is not directly connected to action. We can make all the "I think.... we/they should..." statements we want but unless we have some means of influencing the political decisions we are looking at then we are just mouthing off like any powerless barroom ranter. |
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"The publication "Forbes" valued the inheritance left by the former Cuban leader, Fidel Castro, at approximately 900 million dollars." |
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doing at the end of the youth section? It doesn't relate at all with the sentence before and feels extremely disconnected. ] (]) 06:35, 21 November 2023 (UTC) |
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: The 900 million dollar estimate is mentioned three times in the article. Someone must think it is important. ] (]) 11:05, 21 November 2023 (UTC) |
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== "dictator, marxist" in opening sentence? == |
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:This is not the place for you to try and persuade those of us sympathetic to the Cuban Revolution that we are wrong. We are concerned here to maintain an encyclopedia entry of a live and active subject. This means ensuring the entry contains all the major ways of seeing the subject. Your title to this discussion displays your mistake -"...why are we refusing to call Castro a Dictator?" Answer: we aren't refusing - to repeat what I said before - we are refusing to ONLY call him a dictator. That 'we' is collective and contains your and my perspectives - your 'we' is a "...coz I say so" 'we'. If you work out a way to make that real, let us know - we can then have an endless discussion on Silent Voice the Dictator, good or bad? |
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I ask {{u|YMVD}} to discuss their desired changes to the opening sentence here rather than edit warring. ], {{tq|The responsibility for achieving consensus for inclusion is on those seeking to include disputed content.}} ] (]) 03:55, 28 November 2023 (UTC) |
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:Personally I think we need blogs attached to contraversial subjects so there is a three level entry system. Us idealogues do battle on the blog, and the talk page is the antechamber where useful statements are sorted from the carnage, rather than the home of semi-suppressed arguments that it currently is. If you want to continue this - start a blog and invite us to participate. ] 07:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC) |
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== Semi-protected edit request on 12 August 2024 == |
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== I am stopping now my useless comments == |
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It is useless to tell a blind person what colors are. Because they can't see them. You guys will never be able to understand why freedom is important. I think is useless for me to continue here. I hope people reading this article realize it is slanted in favor of Castro. Pretty much everything in this article is POV. As to having arguments between two groups or Points of Views is totally useless too. You have your point of view and I have mine. Mine is base in living in the system that Castro created. While yours is base in the fantasy and propaganda that the system creates to attract foreigners like you. That is a big difference in how we can see the system and our level of experience. Workers of the world you will have more to lose than your chains in a communist totalitarian society. Wake up from the snake charmers talk about equality etc. There is none in a communist system. |
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] 11:33, 12 July 2007 (UTC). |
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{{edit semi-protected|Fidel Castro|answered=yes}} |
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:Dear Silent Voice, |
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in the introduction it says that Castro's Government "Advanced Economic and Social Justice" |
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:My comments are based on having spent some time in Cuba living and working with ordinary Cubans. I met people who felt like you did, who were blind to the positives of Cuban society because their main desires were not on offer. If you took Cuba out of its historical and political context, then their criticisms would have been valid, but in the face of unrelenting US hostility, their main complaints could only be answered positively by Cuba giving up its independence. |
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this does not make sense and just sounds kind of wrong, would suggest changing it his government made "Economic and Social Justice Advancements" ] (]) 18:45, 12 August 2024 (UTC) |
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] '''Not done:'''<!-- Template:ESp --> I think the current text is clearer than the suggested replacement. ] (]) 19:42, 12 August 2024 (UTC) |
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:I assure you that I do know the importance of freedom, but I also understand the difference between freedom to and freedom from, and I understand that freedoms claimed by one person are often based on the denial of freedoms to someone else. |
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== ERIKA CUBOVA COBOVA == |
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:Your thought that the article is slanted in favour of Castro speaks more to your misunderstanding of Misplaced Pages than it does of the actual article. Many many editors covering the wide range of opinion about Castro and Cuba, have argued over the content and achieved a result which none of us are entirely happy with. Which is as should be on such a contraversial issue. It suggests a balance which is the next best thing to a neutral POV. |
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POZDRAVLJENI VKLOPILI SO MI ADROID IN IN DELA VELIKO STVARI MAM GOR LP 031286008 ] (]) 14:07, 28 August 2024 (UTC) |
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:Your comments are useless - not because we are blind but because they are a simple repetition of claims we have read many times before, in forms far better argued than you. All you have to say is "this is the way I see it and you MUST agree with me". Sorry mate - it ain't that easy. ] 13:07, 12 July 2007 (UTC) |
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I see that in 2006, Forbes ranked Castro as #7 on a list richest heads of state. May we mention this? I do not wish to bother if it has already been edited out.
What is this sentence,
"The publication "Forbes" valued the inheritance left by the former Cuban leader, Fidel Castro, at approximately 900 million dollars."
doing at the end of the youth section? It doesn't relate at all with the sentence before and feels extremely disconnected. Cheesesprite (talk) 06:35, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
in the introduction it says that Castro's Government "Advanced Economic and Social Justice"
this does not make sense and just sounds kind of wrong, would suggest changing it his government made "Economic and Social Justice Advancements" Redjarvis (talk) 18:45, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
level-4 vital article is rated GA-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
Not done: I think the current text is clearer than the suggested replacement. PianoDan (talk) 19:42, 12 August 2024 (UTC)