| Revision as of 13:45, 8 August 2024 editIpigott (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, New page reviewers, Pending changes reviewers271,683 edits B class← Previous edit |
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== Requested move 14 April 2024 == |
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<!-- ] 14:19, 7 May 2024 (UTC) -->{{User:ClueBot III/DoNotArchiveUntil|1715091592}} |
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<div class="boilerplate mw-archivedtalk" style="background-color: #efe; margin: 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px dotted #aaa;"><!-- Template:RM top --> |
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:''The following is a closed discussion of a ]. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a ] after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.'' |
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The result of the move request was: '''Moved''' to ] as stronger consensus lies with the use of the word against in the event. Also no support was found for removing the year from the title and other alternative titles couldn't generate consensus.<small>(])</small> <span style="font-family:Monospace;color:black">>>> ].]</span> 09:21, 22 May 2024 (UTC) |
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---- |
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] → ? – The previous discussion was on moving 'Strikes' to 'strike' version, and it was speedy closed by me as there is a speedy consensus on that matter. However, what had been raised in that discussion is which proposition to be used in the article title. |
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Opening this discussion as a continuation of the ]. Further discussion on whether to have the year removed from the title per ] to be carried out in a separate subsection below. ] (]) 01:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Comment:''' It is worth noting that many of the strikes were against targets in the occupied territories, which are ''not'' Israel, so any title that implies the strikes were confined to Israel will invariably be a gross violation of NPOV. ] (]) 11:48, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::'''Reply:''' Disagree. Iran leaders stated that the purpose of the attack is to damage military facilities inside Israel and targeted Israel itself as an entity The fact that these missiles missed their target and hit the West Bank/ Jordan / Iraq and etc doesn't mean that the attack wasn't targeted onto Israel. ] (]) 13:40, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::At the bare minimum, there were targets struck in the Golan Heights, which is occupied territory, not Israeli territory. So no need to blur the details. ] (]) 14:07, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::This sort of logic doesn't make sense to me. Israel certainly has military assets present in the Golan Heights and will readily admit so, as it does as well in the West Bank. The fact that Iranian strikes were targeting Israeli assets in territory not internationally recognized as Israeli doesn't mean that they weren't targeting territory or assets de facto controlled by the Israeli state. ] (]) 19:07, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::Also not calling the strikes in Golan Heights strikes against Israel would mean they're on/against Syria, which just doesn't make sense. GH is de facto Israeli territory. ~50% of the population of the Golan are Israeli Jewish settlers. Any strike on the Golan is targeting Israeli infrastructure and thus is a strike on israel. Same thing for West Bank. It's targetting Israeli infrastructure even if the territory is not recognised as Israeli territory. Also strikes hitting Iraq/Jordan as ] pointed out were strays and were still targetted onto Israel. For example, during the Russo-Ukrainian war missiles reached Poland. That doesn't mean Russia launched missiles against Poland ] (]) 18:58, 18 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::The only missiles that landed landed at the Nevatim airbase in the Negev desert... This is undisputed Israeli territory.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/04/15/israel-ballistic-missiles-iran-military-bases-nevatim-negev/ ] (]) 20:33, 18 April 2024 (UTC) |
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: The previous discussion was moving "Strikes" to "strikes", rather than to "strike", I believe? I mention this because there may be further strikes by Iran on Israel later in the year, and it's not clear whether this article would include those, or if they would get their own articles. I think clearest would be to include the full date, so this article is specifically about the missile and drone attack on the one day, which I think would be 14 April 2024 (starting in the early morning hours local time). ] (]) 05:23, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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=== Preposition: 'in' vs 'on' vs 'against' === |
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Between the article creation and the previous requested move discussion, the following occurred: a discussion of whether to move the article from 'on' to 'in', and also while the discussion was ongoing (for 3-4 hours or so), it was also moved to 'against' (and ] two separate RM/TR requests to revert), therefore there are three possible titles here: |
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# {{no redirect|2024 Iranian strikes in Israel}} |
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# {{no redirect|2024 Iranian strikes on Israel}} |
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# {{no redirect|2024 Iranian strikes against Israel}} |
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Please input your comments on which proposition to use below. ] (]) 01:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''3''' - The title was fine before as 2024 Iranian strikes against Israel and I don't think it needs to be changed to anything else. ] (]) 01:56, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "against", accept "on"''', oppose "in". ] (]) 02:33, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''3''' because this is part of the ]. ] (]) 03:49, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''"on" or "against"'''. Option 1 causes unnecessary confusion with "in", but I don't have that strong of an opinion between option 2 or 3. ] (]) 03:00, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "against" or "on"'''. Oppose "in". ] (]) 03:02, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::@], @], @], @], just noting that ] and ] follow the same pattern, using the preposition "in". ] (]) 03:35, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::My problem w/using “in” is that some of the projectiles were shot down before they reached Israel. I don’t believe the other strikes you mentioned had projectiles that were shot down in other countries. ] (]) 08:33, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "against" or "on"'''. Oppose "in". Thanks! ] (]) 07:12, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::in the contrary to 2024 Iranian missile strikes in Iraq and Syria and 2024 Iranian missile strikes in Pakistan where the strikes took place only in pakistan or only in sytia,iraq here a major part of the strike took place outside of israeli borders so "against" or "on" seems to my to by more accurate then "in" ] (]) 08:32, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*I would prefer a different title entirely, '''2024 Iranian attack on Israel'''. This seems shorter and more to the point than "'''strikes'''". This was a direct attack by Iran on Israel. I would prefer keeping the year since past incidents of the ] like the ] can also be considered Iranian attacks on Israel. ] (]) 09:18, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "on"'''; oppose "against" and "in". As for "attack" vs "strikes"; this was clearly a major attack and is described as such by RS but I oppose changing "strikes" for now until the dust settles. ] (]) 10:33, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Suppprt "against"'''. Oppose in / on as it is not clear. ] (]) 10:52, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support 3: "against"'''; oppose "on" or "in", which imply that the strikes were geographically confined to Israel, when a large part occurred against Israeli forces in the occupied territories – the latter are still "against" Israel as an entity, without being on Israel or in Israel. ] (]) 11:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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* '''Support 3''', but also '''WP NO YEAR'''. --] (]) 17:27, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support 3: "against"'''. <span style="font-family: Papyrus; font-size: 14px;">] ]</span> <span style="font-family: Papyrus; font-size: 11px;"></span> 19:29, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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* '''Support 3: "against"''' per above. ] (]) 19:36, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Strong support 2 (on), support 3 (against)'''. In English, "Strikes in" has a meaning that is inconsistent with what occurred. "Strikes in" is never or almost never used to describe attacks by one entity against or on another entity, no matter the location of some of all portions of the attack. "On" reads better to a native English-speaker. ] (]) 20:05, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support 2 or 3'''. Many missiles and drones were destroyed outside the Israel territory. ] (]) 01:55, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "in"''' for consistency with previous attacks by Iran this year. See ] and ]. ] (]) 05:34, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "against" or "on"''', oppose "in", regardless of where the strikes landed they were against the ''entity'' of Israel and the geographic 'in' is probably unsuitable. ] (]) 09:19, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Strong Support "on"''' as per the tranche above. This is geopolitical, no matter how many attempted strikes. Intent matters. ] (]) 10:42, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support for "against" or "on"'''. Whether the Golan is occupied territory or part of Israel is a matter of disagreement. Claims that it is simply occupied territory rather than disputed territory is itself a non-neutral position. But the article should not implicitly endorse either way what the status of the Golan is. Against and on both avoid this issue. Note that the fact that some systems missed and hit outside what everyone agrees with as Israel is not a relevant consideration arguing for "against" since the intent was clear. ] (]) 18:20, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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* '''Support "against" or "on"''', though I do prefer "against" more, but "on" is ok too. Using "in" sounds like the Iranian strikes were launched in Israel. ''']''' <sup>water?</sup>(] | ]) 23:10, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*:When I read this article's name for the first time, I was confused on why the preposition 'on' was used. 'On' or 'against' are better prepositions ''']''' <sup>water?</sup>(] | ]) 00:20, 11 May 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "on"''' as most usual English. -- ] (]) 10:35, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*:Support for "against" or "on." ] (]) 14:31, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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* '''Support “on”''', and oppose “in” or “against”. “In” does not make sense in this situation, and “against” is a bias tone and therefore is not neutral. ] (]) 13:29, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support for "against" or "on"'''. ] (]) 14:30, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "on" or "against"''', oppose "in" as I think it makes things very unclear as to whether attacks took place in or outside of Israeli territory. ] (]) 19:11, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''3''', The current title makes the most sense, however a different title using that from #1 could be used as “2024 Iranian Drone Attacks in Israel” would make more sense ] (]) 03:19, 17 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support "in"''', opposed "on"/"against". Precisely the strike was against three discrete military bases that were directly engaged in the bombing of the Damascus consulate. "2024 Iranian strike on Israeli military bases" is a bit much though, and this title "in" makes it clear that it was in Israeli-controlled territory, including occupied Golon Heights. Would also support "2024 Iranian retalition for Israeli consulate-strike" or something similar because of added precision. "On" or "against" seems to vaugely imply to me a greater attack on Israel as a whole, rather than a targetted operation. ] (]) 06:23, 18 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Support for "on"'''. "On" is better than "against" or "in" in my opinion. ] ] ] 16:57, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Oppose "in"''' as it might sound like ] are performing a ] for peace or government intervention. |
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*'''Support "on" or "against"'''. The word "in" is misleading - only some of the missiles went into Israeli airspace, and it suggests that the attacks were launched from within Israel. – ] <sup>(])</sup> 09:29, 19 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support "against" or "on",''' as in does not take height for the fact that some of the strikes were in the occupied Palestinian/Syrian territory, not just Israel. ] (]) 10:43, 19 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support "on"''' More accurate and ] with ]. <span style="font:'Pristina'">]</span><span style="font:'Pristina'"><sup>]</sup></span> 13:04, 19 April 2024 (UTC) |
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=== WP:NOYEAR === |
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Since the Israel against Iran page got NOYEAR'ed, this one should too. (I was not in favor of NOYEARing the other one, but nonetheless it should still be done for consistency...) ] (]) 02:04, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' I don't see an instance where someone could mistake it for any other israel-iran conflict and thus the year serves no purpose. Although I guess the question now is whether it's Iranian strikes ''on'' or ''against'' Israel. ] (]) 02:09, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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: Comment: Putting this as a subsection of the requested move discussion above. ] (]) 02:18, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' As per above, I can't think of any other Iranian strikes that would require year specification, so NOYEAR applies here. ] (]) 02:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' I prefer keeping the year since past incidents of the ] like the ] can also be considered Iranian attacks on Israel. The year also allows readers to find the article more easily. ] (]) 09:30, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:Is there consensus at this point on NOYEAR? ] (]) 07:53, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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: '''Oppose''', ] calls for the year of the event in the majority of cases, with NOYEAR applying only to historically unique events (i.e. ]). The year is a useful indicator for the reader and keeps it ] with other articles in this set. ] (]) 09:32, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose'''; year helps keep things in perspective. ] (]) 10:34, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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: '''Support''', this is the only one. --] (]) 17:24, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose'''; ] states, "Some articles do not need a year for disambiguation when, ''in historic perspective'', the event is easily described without it" (emphasis added). We do not have historic perspective. And for the reasons ] articulated. <span style="font-family: Papyrus; font-size: 14px;">] ]</span> <span style="font-family: Papyrus; font-size: 11px;"></span> 19:33, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:<small>Note: ], ], ], ], ], ], ], ], ], ], and ] have been notified of this discussion. ] (]) 19:34, 14 April 2024 (UTC)</small> |
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:'''Oppose '''If not for the recency of this event, if I heard the title of this article, I wouldn't know what year or specific event it referred to—and while I'm not an expert, I've casually followed events of this sort, especially in the realm of military history, for many decades. I also think that the "lack of historic perspective" argument applies. ] (]) 20:11, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' No historic perspective and not enough context in the title without it. ] (] · ]) 01:14, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose'''. Far too generic. -- ] (]) 10:35, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''', this is a conflict that has been ongoing since the Iranian Revolution and includes numerous attacks and conflicts (people rightfully bring up the 2006 Hezbollah raid as an example). If there was some positive identifier of "direct" strikes, rather than proxy strikes, maybe this would work but I don't like that title either for other reasons. ] (]) 19:14, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' This is a unique event. If another one happens, it might be right to change.] (]) 05:29, 17 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' I just find it vague. Having it there causes no harm anyways. Not to mention that removing it would break the ] with ]. <span style="font:'Pristina'">]</span><span style="font:'Pristina'"><sup>]</sup></span> 13:02, 19 April 2024 (UTC) |
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=== Other titles === |
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==== ] ==== |
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I think the name ] is better. This is an attack like never before. In addition, this is an attack with different types of weapons (assuming we will find out later that there was also a cyber dimension and the like). ] (]) 21:09, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:{{small|'''Note:''' This was originally a separate slightly earlier section (see ] that grew organically. Shifting here because it makes no sense to have separate primary discussions on name changes. ] (]) 01:34, 15 April 2024 (UTC)}} |
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:'''Support''' but this should probably be a move discussion ] (]) 21:09, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::No. Because someone just forwarded the article without waiting for further opinions.] (]) 21:11, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' There have been previous strikes on Israel by Iran, so for now let's leave it with the current name. ] (]) 21:15, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::This is not true. Iran didn't strike Israel from its own terrority before. |
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:: ] (]) 08:24, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' as in not calling it anything like Iran-Israel war. Calling it that when all of this could be over a week from now makes no sense to me. ] (]) 21:15, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' The "assuming" is pure ] and doesn't have its place here. ] (] · ]) 21:18, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::WP:CRYSTAL isn't relevant. This is not speculation, rumors or any kind of violations stated in the guideline. ] (]) 08:37, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::{{tq|(assuming we will find out later that there was also a cyber dimension and the like)}} is absolutely speculation. ] (] · ]) 12:42, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:Hmm. What was this "attack" a response to? |
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:Don't bomb embassies. ] (]) 21:20, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Comment''' The appropriate title was ], the page has been repeatedly moved without discussion. ] (]) 21:23, 13 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' This was a retaliation to the ], so the appropriate term would be "strikes." "Attack" also seems a biased term towards this situation and would be inappropriate per ]. ] (]) 05:19, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' |
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:As it is an historic event and the first time ever Iran attacked Israel from its own terroity. ] (]) 08:25, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' for reasons already stated. ] (]) 08:42, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' the intent of Iran sending missile's into Israel was not to disstory anything, it is for a show of force, and to deter Israel from future boming of Iran's embassys. |
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: We also did not call the Israel air strike on Iran's embassy a attack, we called that a boming, and that was done with intention of as some would say to neutralize the embassy and the people inside |
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:] ] (]) 11:49, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::I object to this comment as it is misleading. The purpose of tje Iranian attack was to destroy military bases inside Israel and kill soldiers as a revenge against the killing of their commander. Both attacks had an intention to destroy, kill and neutralize army men. ] (]) 13:29, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' : Hello, I created this page yesterday using the terms '2024 Iranian drone attack on Israel'. If I used the term "attack", it's because I'm not completely fluent in English, and in French, the term is broader. However, it wasn't a POV, as within the same framework, I didn't attribute the strikes to Iran and used the conditional for this attribution until other contributors deemed it appropriate to update, which I, of course, followed. Regarding the date 2024, which seems to be the issue, I preferred to specify the timeframe for the page to be more precise, and mainly because I was unaware if such confrontations between these two countries had occurred before. Since it appears from this discussion that it's the case, as the messages above state, it's clearer to keep the term '2024' for now. As for the question of 'bombings', 'strikes', etc., I don't have a clear position.] (]) 12:03, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::I must state that the name we kept for many of the pages where I worked used the yearly date, even if they were the first, for example : ] or ] ] (]) 12:07, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:This would be vague and factually incorrect. An attack can take many forms, such as a cyber attack, or a verbal attack. |
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:“Iranian strikes” is a better term to describe what happened, as this phrase conveys a conventional military strike. ] (]) 17:30, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''', This is perfect, no need to change. ] (]) 17:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''', based on ]'s argument. ] (]) 21:12, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose''' ]'s argument seems sufficient to me. ] (]) 23:49, 14 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Support''' This was a direct attack by Iran on Israel, something which happened for the first time in history. It will likely be remembered as such for many years. I disagree with Christophervincent01's argument that this was a retaliation, and therefore not an attack. Most western officials consent that this was a disproportionate response by attack for the bombing of its embassy. Israel did not directly attack Iran, but Iran did directly attack Israel. ] (]) 21:50, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::{{tq|Most western officials}} are diplomatically allied with Israel and hostile to Iran, so it's not surprising that they would blame Iran here. Whether Israel bombing the embassy constituted a direct attack or not is disputed, and a position shouldn't be taken in the title in one way or another. ] (] · ]) 09:47, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::It's certainly a step up the escalatory ladder, but that's not what we're here to discuss. Did Iran attack Israel? Yes. ] (]) 09:50, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::I was literally replying to the arguments you made, so I am confused about why you say {{tq|that's not what we're here to discuss}}. ] (] · ]) 09:54, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:'''Oppose'''<nowiki> The title is descriptive. If we are to elaborate in the title based on our opinion; then it may just as well be called: Iranian retaliatory response against Israel. Or Iranian defence against Israeli aggression. Let's not do that. ~~~~</nowiki> ] (]) 10:15, 16 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:* '''Oppose''' I don't think this one is the best. The three proposed titles with different prepositions are better. I like "on" or "against", although "against" is slightly better. |
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:''']''' <sup>water?</sup>(] | ]) 00:18, 11 May 2024 (UTC) |
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==== ] ==== |
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{{no redirect|Operation True Promise}} was added into the list of the possible titles by @] at ] for consideration. ] (]) 01:40, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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<div style="padding-left: 1.6em; font-style: italic; border-top: 1px solid #a2a9b1; margin: 0.5em 0; padding-top: 0.5em">The discussion above is closed. <b style="color: #FF0000;">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.</div><!-- from ] --> |
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</div><div style="clear:both;" class=></div> |
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== The article doesn't say 84% of munitions were intercepted == |
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== The article doesn't say 84% of munitions were intercepted == |
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it says 84% of the ballistic missiles were intercepted and all but one drone and no cruise missiles hit their target, please change it |
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it says 84% of the ballistic missiles were intercepted and all but one drone and no cruise missiles hit their target, please change it |
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== Edit request 21 April 2024 == |
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== Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 October 2024 == |
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{{Edit extended-protected|answered=yes}} |
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{{edit extended-protected|April 2024 Iranian strikes against Israel|answered=yes}} |
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'''Description of suggested change:''' Remove the "{{tq|1 C-130 transport aircraft damaged}}" from the infobox |
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fix hyperlink in outcome section |
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in "84% intercepted per Maariv", Maariv should link to https://en.wikipedia.org/Maariv_(newspaper) instead of https://en.wikipedia.org/Maariv ] (]) 19:00, 1 October 2024 (UTC) |
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:{{done}}<!-- Template:EEp --> ] <sub>]</sub><span style="color:#6B8E23">\</span><sup>]</sup> 20:07, 1 October 2024 (UTC) |
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== Maariv == |
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'''Diff:''' |
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{{TextDiff|1=* 1 ] transport aircraft damaged <nowiki>‹›ref name="ABC-2024a" /‹› </nowiki> |
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|2=}} |
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The cited source has been refuted . ] (]) 23:21, 21 April 2024 (UTC) |
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: {{Done}} ] ] 22:00, 21 May 2024 (UTC) |
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"84% intercepted per ]"? Are you serious? I don't know which of you is responsible for the articles concerning the ongoing war (which I have plenty to say about, and about you one-sided and very anti-Israeli view), but can't you at least check the links you put? The correct link is of course to ]. But you are to afraid of anybody writing the truth in your articles, so you won't let anybody make this very simple edit. Please put the correct link, this is just ridiculous... And really, you need to start considering how you write things in here, because as an Israeli, it is sometimes disgusting to read your articles here (not to mention your talk pages). ]! ] (]) 19:53, 1 October 2024 (UTC) |
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== Insufficient evidence for the preemptive closing of airspaces == |
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:The article has already been corrected. Articles like this are oftentimes (and unfortunately) made in a hurry, so mistakes like these are not unheard of. ] 16:19, 2 October 2024 (UTC) |
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This article currently claims twice that multiple countries (Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, Kuwait, and Israel) closed their airspace before the attack and notably in anticipation of the attack. I'm not convinced this is actually the case. |
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== Move discussion in progress == |
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First off, it is widely claimed that the attack happened at 20:00 GMT on the 13th<ref>https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/14/iran-attacks-israel-with-over-300-drones-missiles-what-you-need-to-know</ref> although Misplaced Pages itself only claims "around midnight". The source for Lebanon<ref>https://www.mtv.com.lb/en/news/local/1438394/lebanon-closes-its-airspace-to-all-aircraft</ref> however was posted at 00:15 GMT on the 14th and claims that the airspace would be closed from 01:00 GMT to 07:00 GMT on the 14th. This seems like a fairly clear case of Lebanon closing their airspace after the attacks already began rather than as a preemptive measure. |
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There is a move discussion in progress on ] which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. <!-- Talk:September 2024 Lebanon strikes#Requested move 1 October 2024 crosspost --> —] 19:55, 1 October 2024 (UTC) |
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There are also articles around the time of the attack that claim countries like Iraq<ref>https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/iraq-says-it-is-closing-its-airspace-as-iran-launches-attack-on-israel/</ref> closed their airspace in response to the attacks rather than preemptively. |
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I couldn't find any reliable sources<ref>https://aviationsourcenews.com/incident/jordan-to-temporarily-close-airspace-to-all-flights/</ref> for it in this specific case but GPS jamming prior to the attack would explain the borderline cases and it has been used as a tactic in this conflict zone.<ref>https://www.npr.org/2024/04/22/1245847903/israel-gps-spoofing</ref> Specifically this also covers the far stronger references to air force high alert from Egypt and Syria as reactive rather than preemptive. |
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==Possible source== |
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So with that said I'd propose removing references to preemptive language in the two places it currently exists: "To prepare for the attack" and "Several countries in the Middle East closed their airspace a few hours before Iran launched a standoff attack against Israel around midnight on 13 April." |
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<references /> |
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] (]) 03:00, 3 August 2024 (UTC) |
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Apparently the US attempted at least one air to air gun kill (it failed): |
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== Redirect == |
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https://www.twz.com/air/f-15e-pilot-recounts-having-to-switch-to-guns-after-missiles-ran-dry-during-iranian-drone-barrage |
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I suggest redirecting the article to the ], considering that another Iranian strike against Israel is imminent. ] (]) 22:48, 4 August 2024 (UTC) |
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] (]) 03:27, 16 November 2024 (UTC) |
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:If another set of strikes do actually happen, the title of this article will quickly be changed, but right now any title change just from a "presumed" strike is purely ]. ] (]) 22:50, 4 August 2024 (UTC) |
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:When the missiles move, the title moves. ] (] · ]) 23:06, 4 August 2024 (UTC) |
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it says 84% of the ballistic missiles were intercepted and all but one drone and no cruise missiles hit their target, please change it
Referencing and citation: criterion not met
Coverage and accuracy: criterion met
Done ZLEA T\ 20:07, 1 October 2024 (UTC)