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Nobel Prize was nominated as a good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (January 5, 2007). There are suggestions below for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated.

This article was reviewed by Nature on December 14, 2005. Comments: It was found to have 5 errors. For more information about external reviews of Misplaced Pages articles and about this review in particular, see this page.

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What?

is it handen out in Oslo or Stockholm or what?? '

Quote from the article:

With the exception of the peace prize, which is handed out in Oslo, they are all handed out in Stockholm at an annual ceremony on December 10, the anniversary of Alfred Nobel's death.

/ Mats Halldin (talk) 05:33, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

What are the prerequisites to be put on the different committees and how are they chosen to be on them?

Note on Mahatma Gandhi

If the Nobel Prizes are awarded by Sweden, what is the relevance of Norway not wanting to offend its World War II ally, the United Kingdom, to awarding Gandhi the Nobel Prize? Alfred Nobel liked drama and poetry as much as chemistry and physics.

Because of this:

The Nobel Peace Prize is awarded annually in Oslo, the capital of Norway, unlike the prizes in economics, physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, and literature, which are awarded in Stockholm, Sweden.

Fictional Nobel Prize Recipients

Would it be possible or encouraged for someone to start a list for Fictional Recipients of the Nobel Prize? (This would cover recipients of the Prize in Movies, Novels, Television and Comics). Orville Eastland 23:17, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Certainly not in this article. You're free to start a separate article, but it will be jumped on by a herd of new pages patrollers, so it's best to have relatively organized product before posting it. savidan 06:09, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Declined Prizes?

The opening section states that some prizes have been declined. A list of people that did so would be nice. Matt Deres 02:06, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

There's a list of people who declined the prize on the Nobel Prize controversies page. AndrewWTaylor 15:56, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

What about prizes that were received after initial rejection by the scientific community? Declined papers that won Nobel prizes May be appropriate for external link. Lakinekaki

Errors

I gave the article a once-over. The only major error that jumped out at me (I'm no expert on the Nobel Prizes, I should add), was a mention that Alfred Nobel was shocked by the use of dynamite for war. This is false; he spent many years working to develop military weapons involving explosives, there could have been no shock. It seems more a case to me that he developed weapons of war but was interested, on the whole, in peace (or at least wanted to settle his moral debts). See this article for more information about this aspect of his career. --Fastfission 19:46, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

I found this to be slightly inaccurate:

Each award can be given to a maximum of three people per year.

At least the peace prize is not necessarily awarded to people but often to organizations. So stating that only 3 people can be given the prize seems inaccurate and could maybe have been counted as an error by the reviewer? Shanes 04:49, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Well, corporations are "persons" under the law. Perhaps this is true for organizations as well? --Daev 16:01, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

And what about this:

It is customary (but not mandatory) for the recipients to donate the prize money to benefit scientific, cultural or humanitarian causes.

Is this really true? What are the percentage of winners who donate all the money? I have no idea myself, but "customary" looks too strong a word to me. Shanes 05:25, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Customary is definitely the wrong word, it implies that they're expected to do so, which is not true. Which necessitates the "but not mandatory" remark. I'll simply replace this with "It is common", a better word. --BluePlatypus 03:18, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Errors ID'd by Nature, to correct

The results of what exactly Nature suggested should be corrected is out... italicize each bullet point once you make the correction. -- user:zanimum

• “The prize is occasionally awarded to those who preserved through critical moments in a process despite the risk of failure.” Not sure what this is supposed to mean, but if it implies that the committees take this criteria into account when deciding upon who shall get a prize, there is no evidence for this. This is part of the mythology and relates to Nobel’s own romantic vision, but not to the actual working of the prizes.
• The reasoning for why no mathematics prize with respect to mathematics not considered a practical science is historically wrong. We do not know why Nobel chose not to include mathematics; evidence points to issues not mentioned in the entry, which repeats popular mythology and not work of those who studied the issue in detail.
• Final date for receiving proposals is 31 January not 1 February.
• Unclear/misleading: Those invited to nominate is unclear. Process of evaluating is unclear. The discussion of criticisms seems haphazardly slapped together; where useful information was found, it was included, but no clear thesis or vision for what should be included seems present. No perspective on why the prizes became significant; no perspective on general use of NP or other prizes for determining the alleged ‘Best’.
• Omission: The location of the ceremonies has changed over time.

Changing "commendation"?

The text states "widely regarded as the supreme commendation in the world today." However, the commendation article seems to have little relevance for this prize. Would not "award" or "honor" or something similar be better? Meritus 14:48, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Claims of Nomination

Periodically, a Misplaced Pages article claims that someone has been nominated for a prize -- generally within the 50-year secrecy period. I feel that such claims should either not be included or severely qualified. At least one other editor strongly disagrees. The instant case is R.J. Rummel, but I have placed a request for input on Misplaced Pages:Village pump (policy)#Nobel and Other Secret Prize Nominations. Robert A.West (Talk) 06:11, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Declining Nobel

I want to find a list of prize winners that have declined the award. Also with any reason(s) given by them. Is there any such page in Misplaced Pages?

I believe this is what you are looking for: Nobel Prize controversies. MiraLuka 20:42, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, reason(s) are summarized in the section "Nobel Prize controversies#Nominees and recipients who declined."--NYScholar 14:46, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Yasser Arafat

I modified the comment on Yasser Arafat. Originally it stated

Yasser Arafat for signing a peace agreement with Israel which he proceeded to ignore.

Now it states:

Also among the most infamous is the peace prize awarded to Yasser Arafat, Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Rabin.

Whether Yasser Arafat ignored the peace treaty or was unable to act or was forced to act due to Israels defiance of the peace treaty (after Rabin was assisinated) is hotly disputed and presenting it as a fact is not NPOV. The main controversies article is probably a better guide to a slightly more balanced assessment of Yasser Arafat and Peres relative merit to the peace prize. However it might be better to leave it as is, and let readers visit the main controveries page or the individual pages for the people in question to get a better assessement of whether there people deserved the peace prize or not. In any case, clearly presenting such a hotly disputed issue as fact is not NPOV. Nil Einne 21:58, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

List of unshared prizes?

Would it be worth the effort to make a list of unshared Nobel prizes? It would be rather short, at least in the sciences, since unshared prizes have become a rarity, because nowadays there are so many scientists and so many parallel research efforts, and most of the research is done by teams, not by outstanding individuals. That's why we have seen this recent inflation of Nobel Prize winners... Science History 16:12, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Controversial examples of controversies

There are examples of controversies on the page, which might be okay, but unfortunately the examples cited by Pproctor (talk · contribs) just happens by sheer coincidence to be the lack of recognition of a one Peter Proctor (which he whines about here). Such self-promotion is obviously to be frowned upon, but other Wikipedians' input on the matter are welcome, so if consensus is reached here that it should be included then it should. — Dunc|☺ 10:22, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

First, you removed references to both of the controversies surrounding exactly who discovered the transistor. Likewise, the fact that high conductivity in Charge transfer complexes was discovered nearly two decades before that in the polyacetylene organic semiconductors. Similarly, these days, the official histories clearly give John McGinness credit for the first organic solid state device. E.g.:

"An Overview of the First Half-Century of Molecular Electronics" by Noel S. Hush, Ann. N.Y. Acad. Sci. 1006: 1–20 (2003).

• "Also in 1974 came the first experimental demonstration of an operating molecular electronic device (emphasis-added) that functions along the lines of the biopolymer conduction ideas of Szent-Gyorgi. This advance was made by McGinness,(and coworkers) who examined conduction through artificial and biological melanin oligomers. They observed semiconductor properties of the organic material and demonstrated strong negative differential resistance, a hallmark of modern advances in molecular electronics.58 Like many early advances, the significance of the results obtained was not fully appreciated until decades later...(p 14)"

206.180.133.30 02:32, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Copyright violations in use of the Nobel medal throughout Misplaced Pages articles and Misplaced Pages Commons

See Nobel image talk page. The various image files (.jpg and .png ) used in the Nobel prize articles are not within fair use. The Nobel medal is clearly protected by both trademark and copyright, and it cannot be used without written permission obtained in advance from the Nobel Foundation. --NYScholar 20:58, 1 September 2006 (UTC); updated --NYScholar 08:22, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

These images are "fair use". Note that "fair use" is an exception to copyright and trademark laws that works regardless of the claims or policies of the copyright or trademark holder.

These images, on the other hand, should not be on commons. David.Monniaux 11:47, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

This use is disputed. The logo and images of the Nobel Medal and all Nobel Medals explicitly require written permission being "granted" by the Nobel Foundation for their use in any such articles. See the talk page of the image. The assertion that these images are within "fair use" is disputed, since the copyright registered to the Nobel Foundation requires written permission to be "granted" for their use and for their use "only" in articles about Alfred Nobel, the Nobel Prize, and Nobel Prize laureates prior to their use and that the registered copyright notice to the Nobel Foundation be affixed on their use IF such permission is granted in writing by the Nobel Foundation. See the talk page of the image. --NYScholar 20:43, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

I've suggested several times to this user to e-mail the Foundation's legal team about the issue. He has, to my best knowledge, always declined to do so. David.Monniaux 17:37, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

This user has never suggested that I e-mail the Nobel Foundation's "legal team about the issue." See the Nobel Image talk page and particularly my section called The possible violations of copyright have been brought to the attention of the Nobel Foundation.

There I explained days ago now that the Nobel Foundation ("the Foundation") had already been contacted re: this matter. Early Monday morning, September 4, 2006 (Labor Day in the United States, a national holiday), I received a reply from the copyright contact person in public relations for the Nobel Foundation (from the contact address listed in the copyright notice on the official website for the Nobel Prize), saying that she had referred this matter to the legal department of the Foundation. Responsibility for resolving these potential copyright violations resides with Misplaced Pages and the Nobel Foundation.

Please also see my current talk page, and follow its link to my Archive 1, for more information, including DM's comment "suggesting" that I contact Misplaced Pages's "legal use" people (not the Nobel Foundation's "legal team").]

Clearly, as it is his photograph and others' photographs and images relating to and from the Nobel Foundation's website of the trademark and copyrighted design of the Nobel Medal that are uploaded in Misplaced Pages and posted in this article, it is he and they who need to contact the Nobel Foundation for guidance (and to ask for permission). To avoid potential trademark and copyright infringement, they (not I) need to seek guidance from its legal department re: his and others' claims of "fair use" and various and sundry misstatements about the provenance of the Nobel Medals and the Nobel Foundation's copyright. (The licenses are still erroneously presented throughout Misplaced Pages; some of the same images have been deleted from Misplaced Pages Commons, though they are still being featured, in a featured article yet, in some other language versions of Misplaced Pages, e.g., Czech, with erroneous descriptions and statements.)

Please go to my talk page, archive 1, for the context of what DM actually wrote in my talk page re: e-mail and for my reply there: This is what he wrote:

I believe this image falls under the "fair use" clause of US copyright law for use on articles directly related to the Nobel prize. If you disagree with it, write to legal AT wikimedia DOT org, where your email will be dutifully ignored by our legal staff, which has more serious stuff to do than deal with ridiculous quarrels on copyright. David.Monniaux 11:35, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Despite my reply there and elsewhere (repeatedly) that I do not use the e-mail feature in Misplaced Pages or engage in e-mail with Misplaced Pages because of my own (understandable) concerns about privacy, DM later posted his misleading comment (out of context) above in this article talk page and not on his own image page, where I have already explained that I don't use e-mail in Misplaced Pages and that I do not wish to do so.

Faulty statements about the policies of the Nobel Foundation regarding its logo, design of the Nobel Medal, images, and photographs of its Nobel Medal are now posted and re-posted throughout Misplaced Pages and other online sites now displaying Creative Commons and GNU licenses for this article or earlier versions of it. The Nobel Medal images and photographs and Nobel Medal trademark logo and Nobel Medal designs are not licensed freely for "any use" as claimed; that claim (in some of these featured Misplaced Pages uploaded images) totally distorts the very trademark and copyright policies stated in the copyright notices posted on the website of the Nobel Foundation (as already linked multiple times and quoted in these various talk pages).

As I explain in my archived talk page, I have neither the time nor the inclination to deal with these issues about his and others' uploading of trademark and copyright-protected images of the Nobel Medals any further. My earlier comments in this talk page, my comments in the Misplaced Pages talk pages of the various uploaded images, and my comments in my own archived talk page should suffice. Please read them in the context of the entire dispute about copyright and Fair use pertaining to Misplaced Pages's featuring images of Nobel Medals in this and other articles in English and in other languages (See also the second tag at the top of this page for an example of such problems).

Fortunately, at least in this "Nobel Prize" article someone has finally added the registered copyright identifying the Nobel Foundation as the owner of the trademarked Nobel Medal design and copyright ("Original design ®© The Nobel Foundation"). But, unfortunately, permission has not yet been requested or received for featuring the notices (my last information from the Nobel Foundation). But the featuring of the just-quoted credit (throughout this article on the "Nobel Prize") appears to me to suggest that such permission was already granted. That suggestion is misleading, because various claims of "fair use" (of the Nobel Medal images) are still (in my own view) in some doubt. The image pages uploaded by various Wikipedians, however, do not clearly state the current situation.

For comparison, one may wish to consult the featuring of images of the medals in the article on "Nobel Prize" in the Online Encyclopedia Britannica. It's not entirely clear to me whether permission was requested and granted for these (degraded resolution) images (or whether, as in, say, DM's case, there are simply assumptions of "fair use" being made w/o such written requests/permission granted in writing), but the Encyclopedia Britannica articles display a credit to "The Nobel Foundation," suggesting that it was.

The general statement about "copyright" and "trademarks" in "legal notices" of that online encyclopedia ("Photographs and illustrations are copyrighted by their respective owners, as noted in the credits") suggests that such permission from copyright owners is sought and attained if and as deemed necessary; see also the section on "trademarks" there.

The images of Nobel Medals in this Misplaced Pages article at least now feature the proper symbols re: the "design" of the Nobel Medal in a more consistently elegant and accurate (in my view) manner, following precisely the format that the Nobel Foundation asks when it does grant permission. So maybe the Nobel Foundation will okay these if the images' description/license pages are revised also to represent the NF's trademark/copyright more accurately and more consistently throughout Misplaced Pages, in all its language versions. --NYScholar 09:00, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Mathematics prize

In the section on lack of a mathematics prize, we say: "Like the science Nobels, the Crafoord Prize in mathematics is awarded by the Swedish Royal Academy. It is generally considered the mathematics equivalent of the Nobel prize in the sciences." My feeling is that in mathematics the Fields Medal is considered the equivalent of the Nobel Prize. --Jordan

This 2001 press release issued by the Swedish Royal Academy about Alain Connes (who won both the Crafoord Prize and the Fields Medal ) agrees that the Fields Medal is the most prestigious award in Mathematics. See its similar phrasing: "He received the Fields Medal in 1983 (the most highly regarded mathematical prize in the world)"; cf. Misplaced Pages article: "The Fields Medal is widely viewed to be the top honor a mathematician can receive." Maybe the passage could add (for e.g.) the qualification: ". . .; however, the Fields Medal is generally considered the mathematics equivalent of the Nobel Prize in the sciences." --NYScholar 14:43, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

The Fields Medal can impossibly be considered the top honor mathematics award since there is an age limit on the winner. A prize excluding the majority (age 40+) of the research community can not be considered a serious equivalent of the Nobel Prize. (These days you need a lot of knowledge to do quality research, so it's not even the case that young researchers are "better" - i.e. performing research with higher quality - than old ones. Rather the contrary.) // Jens Persson (130.242.128.85 18:25, 18 September 2006 (UTC))

I thought that mathematicians generally felt they do their best work when young. -- Beardo 17:13, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

The Field prize is the highest regarded math award, second if is the Wolf prize (with no age limit) and everything else comes after that, possibly with the Clay Millenium problems as third. 195.70.48.242 09:23, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Other prizes

That section really doesn't belong here in such details. Much better to have a separate article on say "International prizes" ? -- Beardo 19:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

The section is intended to show similar awards related to the Nobel Prize, it's not a list of international prizes. Since Misplaced Pages has the list of prizes, medals, and awards, a separate article is completely unnecessary. —Coat of Arms (talk) 22:08, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Jews Overrepresented

Perhaps it should be mentioned in this article that, despite their very small number in proportion to the general World population, Jews are highly overrepresented when it comes to Nobel Prizes received. So, this leads me to ask: is it a prerequisite that a person must be Jewish to win a Nobel Prize? --64.12.116.130 03:09, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Or is it just that Jews are cleverer than the rest of us ? -- Beardo 17:13, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

This is impossible because it would mean the nazi race theory is true, that is some colours of people are genetically superior to the rest! The truth is jews, who lived mainly in Europe and North Africa during the entire Medieval Age and Early Modern Age, were banned by christian kings from owning land or doing agriculture. So they had to find occupation with manufacture, trade or fiscals to sustain themselves and that requires more intellectual skills. So they developed a culture that praised learning, especially the practically useful subjects. Even in the late 19th century, central european jewish youth were most likely to attend medical or natural sciences university, while young "christian" nobleman and bourgeois were more interested about degrees from law or state bureaucracy faculties. There was a period of 15 years near 1900 when the Budapest, Hungary jewish communty produced half a dozen top scientists (Nobel laurates and other big heads like John von Neumann). 195.70.48.242 09:10, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

I would like to see some figures on this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ] (] • ])

The previous comment is unsigned. As it suggests, the previous anonymous user posted this section with nothing to back it up. Such a comment has no place in this article, in my view. The concept of "overrepresentation" leans away from WP:NPOV and appears to be an inappropriate (potentially pejorative) judgment masquerading as fact. No facts have been presented by the anonymous user; the user's observation requires citation of a reliable source: see WP:Reliable sources. A possible attempt to raise controversy by an anonymous poster is not the same as a citation of a reliable source contributing to development of NPOV in writing an article. As many Nobel Laureates are still living people, WP:BLP applies in relation to this article too. Comments on their religious identification (not part of the criteria for their choice as Nobel Laureates)potentially violates BLP policy. According to the selections committees for the various Nobel prizes, such prizes are awarded on the basis of "merit" in their recipients' fields. Their religious identification (if even known) has nothing to do with their choice as recipients. The idea of a "prerequisite" appears to be facetious and is not to be taken seriously. It appears to be a ruse to start a controversy. I say ignore the post (which is objectionable) and this subject. --NYScholar 20:09, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

<<Their religious identification (if even known) has nothing to do with their choice as recipients.>>

Sorrowfully this is not true. One of the undeniable inventors of MRI was controversially excluded from the Nobel award, obviously based on his publicly visible seven-day creationist beliefs. Although creationism is fundamentalist junk that is clearly not up to scratch when compared to darwinism, one's personal beliefs about the supernatural and His revelations must never ban anybody from recognition for good sci-tech he/she did. 195.70.48.242

See what happens when we let Jews in to universities? We get things like atomic bombs, feminism, and American Studies. Jews are grossly over-represented when it comes to winning them - they have won about 18% of Nobel Prizes I believe, despite making up less than 0.25% of the World's population. --172.164.89.46 22:53, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

By the way: 27% of American Nobelists are Jewish, despite being only 2% of the US population. --172.164.89.46 23:05, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

For some historical contexts for potentially-veiled implications in comments by the anonymous posters above, see the Misplaced Pages article on Anti-Semitism and W:Guidelines and policies pertaining to offensive speech acts in articles and talk pages. Anonymous users who may be (or not be) trolls tend not to read or follow these policies and guidelines. -NYScholar 03:51, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

American servitude?

Is there a political agenda behind this year's full-american awarding of the medals? Does Dubya control the swedish academy? I'm afraid the prestiege of Nobel medals will drop sharply if the selection is indeed proven biased. Considering how little hard sci education is going on in America nowadays compared to India, Japan or even China plus the seven-day sectarian scandals, these full-american awards could be seen as a cover-up. So Bush can hide America's new Sputnik problem. 195.70.48.242 09:15, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

American Excellence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ] (] • ])

October 12, 2006: The Nobel Prize in Literature for 2006 has been awarded to Orhan Pamuk, who is Turkish, not an American. On October 13, 2005, last year's Nobel Prize in Literature was awarded to Harold Pinter, who is English, and Pamuk was widely thought to be a candidate for it prior to that. Some of the remarks in this section and earlier ones making irrelevant statements about nationality and religious affiliations of Nobel Laureates seem inappropriate; they do not follow WP:NPOV. --NYScholar 03:42, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Neither literature of those (literature and peace award) are sciences. One is art and the other is politics, which are not objective and thus those are insignificant. The fact is, Nobel Committe is part of a cover-up trying to hide America's growing education quality problem by awarding all science medals this year to people in the USA. If the public woke up and made note of this scandal, USA would actually benefit. In 25 years American science and industry will depend on China and India for even the simplest things, as the Bushite posse forces kids to learn seventh day jesus horse dinosaurs and how condoms are bad. Flat Earth curriculum is not far away in USA and the Nobel Committe is soliciting help for that crime. 195.70.48.242 08:02, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Where is the evidence for this bizarre claim? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.172.17.219 (talk) 16:32, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

For some historical contexts for potentially-veiled implications in some of the above comments by the anonymous posters, see the Misplaced Pages article on Anti-Semitism and W:Guidelines and policies pertaining to offensive speech acts in articles and talk pages. Anonymous users who may be (or not be) trolls tend not to read or follow these policies and guidelines. -NYScholar 03:58, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Anonymous users

Before commenting in Misplaced Pages article talk pages regarding articles like those on Nobel Prizes presented to currently living persons, which must follow WP:BLP, please scroll up to Template:Talkheaderlong As directed above, please respect Misplaced Pages:Policies and guidelines; e.g., WP:TPG. Thank you. --NYScholar 03:58, 13 October 2006 (UTC)\

"Winner" vs "Laureate"

Nobel prizes cannot be won, they are awarded by the respective institutions to recipients, called laureates. "Nobel prize winner" implies a competition where none is intended, neither by Nobel himself, nor by the awarding institutions --- and only in very few cases by the recipients. The article should be edited to reflect this, hmm?

Jussi Karlgren 17:32, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

The Nobel Prize website refers several times to the Laureates ans Winners. I think this would be the definite reference for this type of thing; if they are going to call the Laureates winners, then I think that is what they should be callet --Oshin 13:18, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Ga on hold

Wow sorry i missed this one, generally i tend to nominees waiting along time asap.

• Medal images need fair use rationale
• Prize categories should be moved down to similar prizes
• he Templeton Prize is the largest financial annual prize award given to a single person for intellectual merit, worth 795,000 pounds sterling or 1.4 million US dollars in 2006. Reference please
• Notable Laureates is just a list, try turn it into paragraphs
• Lag in the timing of Nobel Prize recognition for achievements, has three paragraphs that are too short.
• There are a lot of short/one sentence paragraphs, remove, merge or expand
• Process of nomination and selection, instead of listing try write it out
• When you quote him in the box you will need a reference
• Award ceremonies has no references, if a reference is added to each paragraph it will improve its chances on becoming an FA greatly, and a few are required for GA. Also try to incorperate history of the medals into this section as the lead should be a quick summary of the whole article.

All references are properly formatted (A first for me) Basically a few more references need to be added and the above issues dealt with. I will give you seven days and i suggest you get a peer-review in that time, goodluck M3tal H3ad 02:32, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Failed. M3tal H3ad 01:20, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

The article says that eight fathers and sons have received Nobel Prizes. However, in that list Manne Siegbahn and Kai Siegbahn are not present. That should make it ten. They both received the physics prize.

"Black" and "Hispanics" in science?

Has there been any black (and Hispanic) recipient of the Nobel Prize, excluding the intentionally made political-correct Peace Prize and Literature Prize??

Merge The Nobel Banquet

I would like to merge The Nobel Banquet to this article. Any objections? --Selket 19:40, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I agree Superhelix 11:47 1st March

No Economics Nobel Prize

With due respect to the study of Economics, I do not see any reason why it should continue to claim a Nobel Prize.

Out of respect for the Will of Nobel the Swedish Central Bank should cease spending the Swedish taxpayers' money on what amounts to the commercial offence of 'passing off', that is, pretending Nobel left money for a prize in economics when he did not.

After all. what would people think if a Prize for Astrology in memory of Alfred Nobel was set up ? To be awarded each year by a panel of astrologers with a gold medal and using the funds provided by yet another unfortunate set of taxpayers?

Finally I suggest that wikipedia consider deleting the economics references from the Nobel Prize article. Misplaced Pages should not encourage the offence of passing off.

Seantmchugh 10:58, 22 May 2007 (UTC)seantmchugh@yahoo.co.uk 22.05.07

Well, unfortunately with Misplaced Pages we have to write an encyclopedia about the world we have and not the world we wish we had. We're not going to pretend the economics prize doesn't exist because some people don't like it. We will, however, cover the controversy -- there's a section on the controversy at Nobel Prize in Economics. --JayHenry 13:29, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, but the problem is that it is a factual error to claim that the economic prize is a noble prize. Thus it shouldn't be named as such. it is better that it should stand something like :

"The Nobel Prizes (Swedish: Nobelpriset) are awards in Physics, Chemistry, Literature, Peace, Physiology or Medicine. The prize in economy isn't a nobelprize, but a prize that ..." 87.96.132.194 16:17, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

I change the factual error on the economic prize, now it clearly state that this is not a nobel prize but something else. But I think that the change made the text a bit weird, so it would be nice if someone checked the flow and the grammar of the change. 87.96.132.194 16:28, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Weird it still reads wrong. Technically, it is not a Nobel prize in the same way that the 4 in the will are. It is really important that this is made clear. Really, really important. There were (and are) political motives in the making of the Memorial Prize for Economics. No mention of this made either. Enough to make you paranoid.58.107.79.77 12:30, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

NNpov

Perhaps the most infamous case of this was in 1994 when Yassir Arafat shared the Peace Prize with Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Rabin for signing the Oslo Accords, despite Arafat's continued support for terrorist attacks against Israel. Arafat later reneged on his commitments under the Oslo Accords. Another example is Rigoberta Menchú, the Guatemalan author who won the Nobel Peace Prize for I, Rigoberta Menchu, which was purported to be an autobiography. As later research found, however, Menchu changed significant amounts of her life story to serve the propaganda needs of the Marxist guerillas then fighting to overthrow the Guatemalan government.

This passage seems highly NNpov and unbalanced to me: besides a clearly non encyclopedic language (the most infamous case, serve the propaganda...), it presents an unbalanced interpretation on disputed facts: many blame Israel politics for the failure of Oslo Accords, something like ... despite Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Rabin continuous violations of human rights in Gaza Strip and West Bank... would have the same right to stay here as the presently expressed point of view (namely, none); the passage on Rigoberta Menchú completely lacks references and indirectly gives a judgment on historical facts which by no means can be said unanimous.

If the aim is to report a discussion around some Nobel Prizes, an encyclopedia should report where this discussions has arisen, which arguments are involved and who supports them, not an argument as a matter of fact itself. I strongly advise to change the whole passage into a more balanced one. --216.16.237.110 13:57, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

You may be misunderstanding the section - it's supposed to be a brief summary of a separate article - Nobel Prize controversies:

• If you think there are no (newsworthy) controversies related to the Nobel prizes, then you should propose deletion of that separate article (not here, but following normal deletion processes).

• If you believe that the section isn't a good summary of the separate article, you should edit it so that it more closely matches the separate article.

• If the section is in fact a reasonable summary of that separate article, then you need to review that separate article for NPOV violations, lack of sources, etc., and if you find problems, make changes or raise questions on the talk page there. If/when that article changes, then the summary here should also change. -- John Broughton (♫♫) 14:55, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

I gave a glimpse to the separate article and it doesn't seem so unbalanced as the summary, so I guess the second point is the one that fits my remark. However, my mother tongue is not English, so I don't feel as making my own contribution; I just replaced the passage with an excerpt of the separate article, perhaps someone can improve it. --216.16.237.110 16:49, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

List of atheist Nobel laureates

I have created the List of atheist Nobel laureates. In the Misplaced Pages, there are lists like ‘List of Jewish Nobel laureates’, ‘List of Hindu Nobel laureates’, etc. It is very important to acknowledge that there are several atheists who have received the Nobel Prize. RS

RFC: Country data in Nobel lists

There is currently a Request for Comments about the country data in the Nobel lists at Talk:Nobel Prize in Chemistry#RFC: Country data in Nobel lists. Your comments would be appreciated. The results of the RFC may affect all of the Nobel Prize articles. panda 17:12, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Economics

Britannica article talks about six Nobel Prizes: "any of the prizes (five in number until 1969, when a sixth was added)..." Encarta also talks about six prizes when it defines them as "annual monetary awards granted to individuals or institutions for outstanding contributions in the fields of physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature, international peace, and economic sciences." Anon edit to which I referred to was this. -- Vision Thing -- 12:26, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

If you read further down the page, the Encyclopedia Britannica article states:

"These prizes as established by his will are: the Nobel Prize for Physics (Nobelpriset i Fysik); the Nobel Prize for Chemistry (Nobelpriset i Kemi); the Nobel Prize for Physiology or Medicine (Nobelpriset i Fysiologi eller Medicin); the Nobel Prize for Literature (Nobelpriset i Litteratur); and the Nobel Prize for Peace (Nobels Fredspris). The first distribution of the prizes took place on December 10, 1901, the fifth anniversary of Nobel's death. An additional award, the Prize for Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel (Priset i Ekonomisk Vetenskap till Alfred Nobels Minne), was established in 1968 by the Bank of Sweden and was first awarded in 1969."

which is a direct contradiction of the first sentence that you referred to. We also all know that the econ prize is not a Nobel prize, as stated by the Nobel Foundation, which is obviously the more reliable source. So please stop reverting. –panda 14:55, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

I don't see how the passage you have quoted contradicts the first sentence. Nobel Foundation lists prize in economics as one of the Nobel Prizes. -- Vision Thing -- 21:36, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Actually, The Nobel Foundation does not call it a Nobel Prize anywhere on their site. They only list it as the "Prize in Economics" or "Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel". If you find a reference where they call it a Nobel Prize, please post it. BTW, this is what the entire controversy is about. The text that you removed also included a more reliable source (The Nobel Foundation) than the Encyclopedia Britannica article. So what exactly was the reason for your reverting it? –panda 22:35, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

They have put it in the Nobel Prizes category. Also, article about Nobel Prizes in UK's Encarta , which is reviewed by Nobel Foundation, defines Nobel Prizes as "awards granted annually to people or institutions for outstanding contributions during the previous year in the fields of physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature, international peace, and economic sciences." -- Vision Thing -- 23:22, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Simply putting something into the Noble Prize category doesn't make it a Nobel Prize. If you look at the names for each prize, you'll see that the other's do include the word "Nobel" while the econ prize does not. The UK Encarta article may have been reviewed by the Nobel Foundation, but that doesn't mean they wrote it or even endorsed it. I'll remind you that you removed a reference to the Nobel Foundation and replaced it with a reference to Encyclopedia Britannica Encarta. Are you trying to say that other sites are more authoritative than the Nobel Foundation's site about this matter? –panda 00:29, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

Nobel Foundation site puts prize for economics in Nobel Prize category. For me that is enough to consider it a Nobel Prize. However, since they don't simply say whether this is or isn't a Nobel Prize we need to check other sources. And the Encarta article, which Nobel Foundation reviewed, says it is a Nobel Prize. So matter is clear. -- Vision Thing -- 11:23, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

Allow me to explain the fault in your reasoning. I have reviewed your changes to this article. You may now state in the article reviewed by panda. However, I do not endorse your changes, in fact I oppose them. You, OTOH, are not required to change them. This still makes the article reviewed by panda even though I do not endorse the text. –panda 11:58, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

That assumes bad faith in Encarta, since it is implying that they have put Nobel Foundation name under the article with which Nobel Foundation doesn't agree with. -- Vision Thing -- 12:14, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I'm assuming that the Nobel Foundation doesn't have time to check every single web site that has text about the Nobel Prize. Also, I don't know if you've noticed or not but encarta.msn.edu does not include the text "Reviewed by: Nobel Foundation", which is copyrighted by the exact same Microsoft Corporation and probably updated more frequently as there is more text in the encarta.msn.edu version. –panda 12:33, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

Here is a quote from the Nobel Foundation:

Every year since 1901 the Nobel Prize has been awarded for achievements in physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature and for peace. The Nobel Prize is an international award administered by the Nobel Foundation in Stockholm, Sweden. In 1968, Sveriges Riksbank established The Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel, founder of the Nobel Prize. Each prize consists of a medal, personal diploma, and a cash award.

The definition of a Nobel Prize is one of the awards administered by the Nobel Foundation. The econ prize is not administered by the Nobel Foundation. Thus, it is not a Nobel Prize. I believe the Nobel Foundation would be the most reliable reference about this. BTW, the 2nd reference is the one you removed from the article when you reverted my edit. –panda 22:55, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Another Swedish website, written by the Swedish government, which is more reliable than MSN/Encarta:

The Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel: Sveriges Riksbank (The Central Bank of Sweden) instituted a prize in economic sciences in memory of Alfred Nobel at its 300th anniversary in 1968. The Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences selects a prize winner and the Nobel Foundation has accepted that this prize is awarded in the same manner as a Nobel Prize. The prize amount is also equal to the other Nobel Prizes. 58 men have received the prize so far.

Also, links from The Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences (the organization that selects and awards the prize): , , and . Notice that they do not call it a Nobel Prize and are careful to keep it separated from the Nobel Prizes.

–panda 23:10, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

And another reference from Sveriges Riksbank (the Bank of Sweden) to show that the money for the econ prize comes from Sveriges Riksbank, not the Nobel Foundation:

The prize amount is the same as for the Nobel Prizes, 10 million, and is paid by the Riksbank.

Thus the Nobel Foundation does not administer the econ prize.

If there's no objections, I'll be replacing the text you removed. I'll give you some time to reply. –panda 23:20, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Swedish government website says: Nobel Foundation has accepted that this prize is awarded in the same manner as a Nobel Prize. The prize amount is also equal to the other Nobel Prizes. That means that they consider prize in economics a Nobel Prize (you accepted that meaning of other here).

As for other links, you can't use them as a source for claim that prize in economics is not a Nobel Prize, because they don't say that. You are relaying on your personal interpretation, and that is not acceptable, especially because we have a reliable source which straightforwardly says that prize in economics is a Nobel Prize. -- Vision Thing -- 16:57, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Read what you just posted: "in the same manner as a Nobel Prize." If somebody say, "Vision_Thing sings mellifluously, just as the angels do", this clearly implies that Vision_Thing is not among the angels. If the Swedes thought it was a Nobel Prize, they wouldn't say "same... as a Nobel Prize". Encarta is a Microsoft product, and as susceptible to bugs as any other. You seem intent upon denying all the most reliable cites, clinging stubbornly to common misperceptions. Please re-read this warning about "owning" articles. --Orange Mike 17:31, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

There are no reliable sources which say this is not a Nobel Prize. We just have reliable sources which say that it is (btw, Encarta article was reviewed by Nobel Foundation, so if it did contain some "bugs" they have corrected them). -- Vision Thing -- 17:53, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

According to the Nobel Foundation's FAQ:

"The prizes, as designated in the Will of Alfred Nobel, are in physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature and peace. Only once during these years has a prize been added – a Memorial Prize – the Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel, donated by the Bank of Sweden to celebrate its tercentenary in 1968. The Board of Directors later decided to keep the original five prizes intact and not to permit new additions."

Still not convinced? –panda 20:29, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Um ... you're nitpicking on wording -- they're Swedish, not perfect English speakers. Claiming that the references I listed can't be used means you're blatantly ignoring the definition of a Nobel Prize from more reliable sources. Anyway, I've asked a few others to come and look at this issue so maybe we can get some consensus about this. –panda 17:34, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

According to this paper, all six prizes are administered by the Nobel Foundation. -- Vision Thing -- 18:14, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, I'm here at the invitation of panda. As far as I'm concerned, the question of whether the Prize in Economics is a Nobel Prize passes the duck test. It is awarded at the same time as the other prizes, the same basic process is used to determine the winners, popular press often refer to the winners as Nobel Prize winners, the monetary amount of the prize is the same. That the Nobel foundation and others might want to make a distinction is perhaps understandable, but that horse has left the barn long ago. In popular culture, the Prize in Economics is equivalent in every meaningful sense to the other Nobel Prizes. older ≠ wiser 18:21, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Also here at panda's invitation. While I can frequently be found arguing (e.g., at Talk:Nobel Prize in Economics) that we must follow ordinary English usage in naming our articles, the same emphatically does not apply to the content of our articles. There we should strive to accurately reflect the true state of affairs. On that note, perhaps this quotation from the Swedish Misplaced Pages page on the Nobel Prize may be of interest:

Samtidigt som prisen enligt Nobels testamente delas ut, utdelas också Sveriges Riksbanks pris i ekonomisk vetenskap till Alfred Nobels minne, som instiftades 1969 i samband med Riksbankens 300-årsjubileum. 1969 beslutade man också att det inte skulle få vara ytterligare ämnen vid framtida utdelningar. Det ekonomiska priset förvaltas av Nobelstiftelsen, pristagare utses av Vetenskapsakademien och priset överlämnas av Konungen vid samma tillfälle som de fyra ("svenska") andra. Det ekonomiska priset har därför ofta kallats för ett Nobelpris, ibland "det alternativa Nobelpriset". Nobels släktingar har inte velat acceptera det ekonomiska priset som ett nobelpris.

Translation:

At the same time the prizes specified in Nobel's will are given, the Bank of Sweden Prize in Economic Science in memory of Alfred Nobel is given. This prize was instituted in 1969 in connection with the 300th anniversary of the Bank of Sweden. In 1969 it was also decided that no additional prizes would be awarded in the future. The prize in economics is managed by the Nobel Foundation; the winners are chosen by the Swedish Academy of Science and the prize is given by the King of Sweden on the same occasion as the other four (Swedish) prizes. For these reasons, the prize in economics has often been referred to as a Nobel Prize, and sometimes as "the alternative Nobel Prize." The Nobel family has been unwilling to accept the prize in economics as a Nobel Prize.

I also find rather persuasive that the Nobel Foundation does, indeed, refer to the other five prizes as, e.g., "Nobel Prize in Physics," but to the economics prize simply as the "Prize in Economics" (e.g., here; see the row of prize names toward the top). Also, this FAQ page rather ostentatiously avoids referring to the economics prize as a "Nobel Prize," calling it a "Memorial Prize," and says that "The Board of Directors later decided to keep the original five prizes intact and not to permit new additions" (emphasis mine).

My conclusion is that it ain't a real Nobel Prize, based on the Nobel Foundation's Web site. --Tkynerd 23:36, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages does not allow original research. If something is not clearly stated, we can't derive our own conclusions, epecially when there are reliable sources which say the opposite. -- Vision Thing -- 17:47, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Trying to make sense out of a source is not WP:OR, and neither is trying to make sense out of conflicting sources. If it were, we'd never be able to use any outside sources at all without violating copyright by reproducing them outright. --Tkynerd 20:12, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm surprised to hear, Tkynerd, that you are basing your decision on "the Nobel Foundation's Web site," because earlier you had quite different grounds: "it annoys me that this prize is known as a Nobel Prize when it isn't one; to me it's just a cheap-jack right-wing attempt to provide cachet for a prize in the pseudoscience of economics. (I mean, Milton Friedman? Please.)" When some editors on one side of a debate have an ill-concealed political agenda, it makes it a bit hard to assume good faith.--Anthon.Eff 16:56, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm surprised to hear, Anthon.Eff, that you are basing your "criticism" on what I wrote elsewhere rather than dealing with the arguments I've presented here. When an editor is unable or unwilling to distinguish between an explicitly stated POV and arguments that do not rely on that POV, it makes it a bit hard to assume good faith. --Tkynerd 20:12, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

• Compromise solution. What do you think about following text:

The Nobel Prizes (Swedish: Nobelpriset), as designated in the Alfred Nobel's will in 1895, are awarded for physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature and peace. Prize in economics was instituted by Sweden's central bank in 1968. The first five prizes were first awarded in 1901, while the first prize in economics was awarded in 1969. All six prizes are administered by the Nobel Foundation and are widely regarded as the supreme commendations in their subject areas. -- Vision Thing -- 17:56, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Sounds good to me. I believe the plural of Nobelpriset is Nobelpriserna. Check with panda to be sure, since he is apparently an expert in Swedish orthography and grammar. --Anthon.Eff 19:47, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

I like this compromise text as well. My only change would be that the second sentence should begin with "A prize in economics in memory of Nobel..." rather than just "Prize in economics..." (Whether or not that alternative wording is accepted, the sentence needs to begin with an article.) Also, the first sentence should read "...as designated in Alfred Nobel's will..." rather than "...as designated in the Alfred Nobel's will..." And yes, Nobelpriserna is the correct definite plural form in Swedish. --Tkynerd 20:12, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

• I would recommend reorganizing the text into chronological order as well as including a few more details. I removed that the Nobel Foundation administrates all 6 prizes because it's not 100% true for the econ prize -- there is joint administration for the econ prize. So, this is my suggestion, incorporating the general ideas from above:

"The Nobel Prizes (Swedish: Nobelpriserna), as designated by the Swedish scientist Alfred Nobel through his will in 1895, are awarded for Physics, Chemistry, Literature, Peace, and Physiology or Medicine. They were first awarded in 1901. A prize in economics, The Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel, was instituted by Sveriges Riksbank (Bank of Sweden) in 1968 and first awarded in 1969. All six prizes are widely regarded as the supreme commendations in their subject areas. With the exception of the peace prize, which is handed out in Oslo, Norway, they are all handed out by the King of Sweden in Stockholm at an annual ceremony on December 10, the anniversary of Nobel's death." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Panda (talk • contribs) 00:18, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• I know you feel you have repeated yourself ad nauseam, panda, but to save the rest of us from trying to piece together from your previous comments what exactly you mean, would you mind detailing the ways in which the prize is jointly administered? Thanks. --Anthon.Eff 11:50, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• The references are cited above. If you still have questions after reading them, please let me know. (If everyone did their homework first, then no one would have to be repetitive.) –panda 12:34, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• Now panda, no need for a snide comment. I asked politely for what you meant when you said "there is joint administration." My browser cannot find a prior occurrence of the word "joint" on this page. I patiently await a response.--Anthon.Eff 12:47, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• Have you read the text or are you only searching for text? –panda 13:42, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• I also didn't find a source talking about joint administration for the prize in economics. -- Vision Thing -- 18:39, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• What does "administrating" the prize mean and what does it involve? –panda 18:43, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• Maybe we can focus on the selection process for the awards, at least as a start. The committees are picked by the bodies making the awards (Nobel foundation statutes). Medicine is awarded by the Karolinska Institute; chemistry, physics, and economics by the Swedish Academy of Sciences; literature by the Swedish Academy; and peace by a group of five people appointed by the Norwegian storting (all of this is in the current article). The Nobel Foundation manages the assets of all of the awards except for economics . What else should we consider? --Anthon.Eff 14:03, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

• There is no question who awards the prizes. (The info about the institution that awards the econ prize is one of the items that Vision Thing removed from the text, even though it was citied. ) I see the info about which institutions make the decisions for which award isn't already in the text. So you may want to add it to the "Nomination and selection" section or the introduction. You can also find the exact name of each committee per awarding institution on each institution's website. (They are not all called the "Nobel Committee".) –panda 15:00, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

• I think you are right, the selection process should be presented in more detail. The article discusses also how the committee turns over a report to a larger assembly within the institution, where some kind of vote is taken, and gives the example of the Karolinska Institute (the article gives no reference, but this arrangement is in the KI statutes). For the economics prize, there are statutes that state that the committee's "report and proposal" shall be submitted to the Academy, that the "Ninth Class" shall examine these and make it's recommendation to the Academy, and that the Academy as a whole shall make its decision. All of these meetings in the Kungliga Vetenskapsakademien are secret. Special statutes governing the other three prizes are linked to this page: (below the index at the top).--Anthon.Eff 21:25, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

• You may find easier to read prose about each institution's nomination/selection process on their websites. (Click on the UK flag for the English version.) I believe there is a link to them via the Noble Foundations' website. Otherwise just do a Google search. –panda 00:10, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

• I followed your suggestion panda, and checked the sites--they seem to all be at the press-release, public relations level, and don't really provide much information about the nomination and selection process. From what I've seen, the statutes on the Nobel Foundation site seem to be the best source. If this article were to go through external review again (Nature did one in 2005), it would be important to use the best sources. The statutes would of course also be the best source for determining in what ways the economics prize differs from the others. So far all I can come up with is that the economics prize was not specified in Alfred Nobel's will and that the Nobel Foundation does not manage its assets. Otherwise, it seems to be handled in the same way as the other prizes, and is clearly considered by the Nobel Foundation and the Kungliga Vetenskapsakademien to be a prize of the same stature as the chemistry and physics prizes.--Anthon.Eff 23:03, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

• Yes, it is a prize of the same stature, but that doesn't make it a Nobel Prize. What name did you find for the awarding committee for the econ prize in comparison with the chemistry and physics prizes? –panda 03:55, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

• To me it seems silly to focus on something as superficial as a name. Alfred Nobel didn't include economics in his will. Riksbanken put forth funds so that the Nobel Foundation could award a prize in economics. There was nothing sneaky about this, and the prize was given an honest name: "Sveriges Riksbanks" is in the name to show who put up the funds; "in Alfred Nobel's memory" is in the name to show that--like the other prizes--it is in Alfred Nobel's memory. The procedure by which the prize is awarded is like all of the other prizes, because it is the intention of the Nobel Foundation that it be a Nobel prize like all of the others. It is called a "Nobel Prize" by the press, by the public, and even in a few places on the Nobel Foundation website (for example this comment about the 1996 prize in economics). The Kungliga Vetenskapsakademien awards prizes that have nothing to do with the Nobel Foundation: the Crafoord Prize; the Rolf Schock Prize; the Gregori Aminoff Prize. These prizes are treated quite differently in the KV website, and--unlike the economics prize--you will not find links from the pages of these prizes to the Nobel Foundation or to the Nobel prizes. Your effort to separate the economics prize from the other prizes seems to be based solely on its name. As Shakespeare said, "a rose by any other name would smell as sweet." panda, this article needs work, and there is a lot you could do here that other editors would not oppose. Why not try to find that common ground? --Anthon.Eff 16:16, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

If it were a Nobel Prize, why isn't it called "Nobel Prize in Economics?" Because in the strict meaning, it IS NOT a Nobel Prize, it's a prize awarded in the memory of Nobel, or whatever it's called. Doesn't the name of the prize say just about everything? -- Mackan 12:22, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

• Anthon.Eff: Could you please answer the question? What name did you find for the awarding committee for the econ prize in comparison with the chemistry and physics prizes? –panda 05:17, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• panda, can it really be that you've forgotten the name? We've been talking about it over the talk pages of two articles for nearly a week. If you've forgotten the name, then almost certainly you have forgotten the other points that we've discussed. If that's the case, then continuing this conversation is pointless. We tried to engage you, but it just didn't work. So back to business: I propose that we accept Tkynerd's modification of Vision Thing's compromise text, as follows:

"The Nobel Prizes (Swedish: Nobelpriserna), as designated in Alfred Nobel's will in 1895, are awarded for physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine, literature and peace. A prize in economics in memory of Nobel was instituted by Sweden's central bank in 1968. The first five prizes were first awarded in 1901, while the first prize in economics was awarded in 1969. All six prizes are administered by the Nobel Foundation and are widely regarded as the supreme commendations in their subject areas." --Anthon.Eff 15:57, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Just stumbled upon this page, and the very first sentence jumps out with a huge factual error, casting the entire article in doubt. The prize in economics is not a Nobel Prize, no way no how. There are only five Nobel prizes, the ones Alfred Nobel himself made in his will. The prize in economics is given in Alfred Nobel's memory, and is financed not by Nobel's willed money, but by the Swedish tax payers. I cannot believe that the reference from Encarta is somehow viewed as more "valid" than the Nobel Foundation itself. Although human error and/or space constraints on a couple of occations have indirectly put the Prize in Economic in the "Nobel Prize categorgy" on the webpage (see Anthon.Effs link above) that does not mean you can blatantly diregard that the Nobel Foundation itself time and time again say it is not a Nobel Prize; on the webpage, in the Museum (which I have personally visited on several occations), in all press releases, during the prize ceremony (which I have attended) and during the banquet afterwards (which I have also attended). Be as it may that popular view say it is a Nobel prize, in my opinion popular view should not overrule facts; The prize in economics is a very prestigous award that is treated like a Nobel Prize, but it really isnt one. When the Nobel Foundation itself in no uncertain terms has said that it is not a Nobel Prize, it does not help to use conjecture based on the wrong use of a word here and there to "prove" that it is.--Lensor 12:07, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• Anthon.Eff: You seem to be avoiding the question -- please answer the question. What name did you find for the awarding committee for the econ prize in comparison with the chemistry and physics prizes? Are you also ignoring Lensor's and Mackan's comments as well as my changes to the suggested text just to push your POV? –panda 16:30, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• panda is contesting the fact that the Nobel Foundation "administers" the six prizes. Does anyone else have trouble with the phrase all six prizes are administered by the Nobel Foundation? If you have trouble with it, please specify who actually administers the prizes. Support for the Nobel Foundation role in administering the economics prize can be found in § 4 of the special statutes for the economics prize:

The funds placed at the disposal of the Nobel Foundation by Sveriges Riksbank for defrayment of its expenses shall, after deduction of the administrative expenses incurred by the Nobel Foundation in conjunction with the donation and other general expenses, be used for defrayment of the expenses incurred for the presentation of the Prize. The amount not used to cover the year's expenditure shall be reserved for future expenditure. (emphasis added)

--Anthon.Eff 19:22, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• What I am contesting is already stated above. It's not 100% true that the Nobel Foundation administrates the econ prize and stating so is misleading. I will remind you that you haven't replied to my earlier question. –panda 19:49, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

panda, I opened a new topic, to address an actual edit of the article. The topic is at the bottom of the page so that everyone can easily find it. Please do not move this section elsewhere on the page. The intention is to commence editing the article, and to terminate a pointless conversation. But now that I have your attention--who, according to your sources, are the other parties that administer the econ prize? --Anthon.Eff 20:24, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• Your comment is an extension of #Economics as the original text that we're discussing is in this topic. I'm sorry that you see this topic as pointless but you were the one who chose to stop replying to my questions, which I'll remind you remain unanswered. To reply to your question, look at what the Nobel Foundation does, according to their web page, and compare that with what that they do for the econ prize. What's the difference? Then check what the definition of "administrate"/"administer" is. –panda 22:08, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Infobox

Something that's a little bizarre with the infobox is that there is a picture of the Nobel Prize medal but the econ prize is also mentioned. The econ prize has a different medal. So should a picture of the econ medal also be included in the infobox, since it's mentioned? Or should the econ prize be removed from the infobox, since it's not a Nobel Prize? –panda 20:37, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

I changed the caption under the picture. -- Vision Thing -- 21:40, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Rationale? It's still not a Nobel Prize and doesn't address the question above. –panda 22:36, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

I found a page with pictures of all the Nobel Prize medals. Which brings me to another question, what about the Peace Prize? It has a different picture than the ones handed out in Sweden. Shouldn't it also be represented in the infobox? Could we apply the same fair use rationale that is currently used for the image in the infobox to images of the medals from the Nobel Foundation? –panda 22:54, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Jocelyn Bell / Pulsar discovery

Jocelyn Bell / Pulsar discovery 58.168.59.103 02:39, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Jocelyn Bell discovered the first pulsar. Her senior scientist Anthony Hewish won the Physics Nobel prize for this same discovery. Jocelyn Bell co-wrote the paper on pulsars. her name came second on the paper after Anthony Hewish's (as it should have). However, Hewish won the prize and Bell didn't. Up to three people may win any given prize, and in this instance only two were named.

Jocelyn Bell made the physical discovery and participated heavily on the theory and mechanism behind this. Many other scientists, (including Hewish himself and Fred Hoyle) believed Bell warrented the Nobel Prize for this discovery.

If made today, Bell would have been a recipient. This was simply an error, albeit a massive error and injustice made by the Nobel committee.

This should be mentioned amongst the grievous errors made on behalf of the committee

This is covered in Nobel Prize controversies. –panda 05:38, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Peace prize awarder

The article states that the King of Sweden hands out all the prizes expect the Peace Prize. Who awards this? Ygoloxelfer 17:30, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

• Former good article nominees
• Externally peer reviewed articles
• Externally peer reviewed articles by Nature
• B-Class Sweden articles
• High-importance Sweden articles
• All WikiProject Sweden pages