Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 20:16, 16 November 2007

In order to remain listed at Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment/User conduct, at least two people need to show that they tried to resolve a dispute with this user and have failed. This must involve the same dispute with a single user, not different disputes or multiple users. The persons complaining must provide evidence of their efforts, and each of them must certify it by signing this page with ~~~~. If this does not happen within 48 hours of the creation of this dispute page (which was: 05:54, 16 November 2007 (UTC)), the page will be deleted. The current date and time is: 17:37, 9 January 2025 (UTC).

• MONGO (talk · contribs · logs)

Users should only edit one summary or view, other than to endorse.

Statement of the dispute

This is a summary written by users who are concerned by this user's conduct. Users signing other sections ("Response" or "Outside views") should not edit the "Statement of the dispute" section.

Desired outcome

MONGO has a persistent pattern of disruptive editing and personal attacks regarding the "Attack Sites" issue. I would like to see an end to this behavior.

Description

When discussing Attack-Site-related issues, Mongo has "habitually overreacted" and "freely characterizes opponents in a derogatory manner". He regularly "comments on the contributor, not on the content", often attempting to "use someone's affiliations as a means of dismissing or discrediting their views". He has disruptively edited policy pages by repeatedly inserting various texts without first proposing the texts on the talk page and generating a strong consensus for their inclusion.

Evidence of disputed behavior

December Arbcom Case

• Mongo has a long history of disruptive behavior. A December 2006 Arbcom case was filed against MONGO, with much evidence presented accusing Mongo of incivility and personal attacks.

• Arbcom held that Mongo has a "habitual over-reaction" in dealing with the subject of Attack Sites: "In many instances he has reacted inappropriately to such harassment and events, freely characterizing opponents in a derogatory manner". (Emphasis mine)

• Mongo has a long past history of personal attacks. To quote a few of the the most relevant instances from his 2006 case, just to establish that a longstanding pattern:--

• Calls Miltopia a "moronic troll".
• Says Gentgee is an "admin that supports harassment"
• Says Luna Santin is an "admin that supports harassment.

• As a result of that Arbcom case, Mongo was desysopped.

Continued personal attacks

While we might have hoped that the December Arbcom case would have led him to change his ways, regrettably MONGO has chosen to continue this same problematic behavior.

• A month ago, MONGO was warned by an admin and then briefly blocked for engaging in personal attacks made at WT:NPA.

• Today, Mongo accused DanT of 'participating in a website that stalks people'. I feel this is a textbook example of a Personal Attack-- "Using someone's affiliations as a means of dismissing or discrediting their views -- regardless of whether said affiliations are mainstream or extreme." More seriously, MONGO's comment, although not explicitly stating this, strongly implies that DanT has been involved in criminal stalking-- an EXTREMELY serious charge.

• Today, MONGO accused me (Alecmconroy) of being an advocate for the recreation of a WP article Encyclopedia Dramatica-- another instance of MONGO's habit of "commenting on the contributor, not on the content". It's also particularly frustrating, since although MONGO was correct that I was involved the discussion, he neglected to mention that I had actually sided AGAINST the recreation.

• His edit summaries at NPA have frequently "commented on the contributor, rather than the content".

• "rv another ED contributor..."
• "revert, known ED contributor"
• "the only dispute is by those who contribute to WR."
• "not much to dispute, unless your an ED or WR partisan"

• Mongo attacked admin GTBacchus, saying "GTBaccus is also an ED contributor and always comes to the defense of his fellows. You folks really should get busy writing an encyclopedia instead of being angry that this policy was protected on the "wrong version"...seriously, 2 million articles await you." (emphasis mine)

• Mongo, discussing this RFC, says: ".I won't be party to your Rfc...I see it as blatant harassment and won't tolerate it." (emphasis mine)

Continued disruptive editing

• Three weeks ago, Mongo was again reported to ANI for disruptive edit warring-- making ten reverts over the span of a few days-- potentially "gaming 3RR".

• In the ANI discussion that followed, Mongo promised to abide by a 1RR on WP:NPA.

• Mongo has AGAIN come to NPA and repeatedly reinserted text against consensus. AGAIN the page has been protected and disrupted. In doing so, MONGO has either outright broken or at least gamed his earlier pledge to abide by 1RR.

• Despite widespread opposition and lack of any consensus, MONGO has reinserted Attack-Site-related text into WP:NPA a total of nineteen times:

Applicable policies and guidelines

• Misplaced Pages:No Personal Attacks, Misplaced Pages:Civility
• Misplaced Pages:Disruptive editing, Misplaced Pages:Three-revert Rule

Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute

• ANI discussion of 17 October
• ANI Discussion of 25 October
• Arbcom Case of December 2006
• Extensive discussion at WT:NPA

Users certifying the basis for this dispute

{Users who tried and failed to resolve the dispute}

1. Alecmconroy 07:39, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
2. Viridae 09:43, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
3. *Dan T.* 12:25, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
4. spryde | talk 12:38, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Other users who endorse this summary

1. His disruptive editing has led to the protection of WP:NPA mutiple times in recent months. His persistent personal attacks on other participants need to end, or he needs to be shown the exit door. GRBerry 13:32, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
2. Consensus Can Change, but while the current situation re:BADSITES, is the consensus of Misplaced Pages, MONGO should reasonably be expected to abide by it. SirFozzie 16:31, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
3. MONGO needs, as we all do, to abide by core principles like consensus and civility. If unable to do so, he may need to be reminded that the door Miltopia was shown is also available for him. I truly hope this won't be necessary, as I do see the good intentions and the good contributions, but the disruption and drama caused by this user currently outweigh the good he is doing. I say this with all regret. ---- John (talk) 17:14, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Response

This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete. Users signing other sections ("Statement of the dispute" and "Outside Views") should not edit the "Response" section.

{Add summary here, but you must use the endorsement section below to sign. Users who edit or endorse this summary should not edit the other summaries.}

Users who endorse this summary:

Outside view

MILTOPIA was a moronic troll who is now banned for exactly that. Distant past is distant past. Alecmconroy is an advocate for having an article on ED, per discussion on WikiEN-l. MONGO was viciously attacked by ED, if you try to push ED to MONGO then you are harassing him, by definition. This much is blindingly obvious to any outside observer, so, Alec, don't do that because it does not help.

This RfC amounts to "we disagree with MONGO and he won't shut up". It is pointless and vindictive, especially since MONGO seems to have proposed a very good form of words that is gaining some support on the talk page.

Users who endorse this summary:

1. Guy (Help!) 10:25, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
2. SqueakBox 10:28, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
3. RfC appears to have been filed to gain leverage in the WP:NPA dispute. Addhoc 13:15, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
4. Guy couldn't have put it better. ^demon 13:16, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
5. Agree with Guy. MONGO is MONGO. There is no doubt in my mind that his overall contribution to Misplaced Pages has been enormous. I see him as actively trying to improve his reactive behavior. Specific blocks when appropriate are fine. But I do not see the point of this general RFC. Mattisse 13:59, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
6. I wouldn't say "moronic" exactly, but I have to agree with the notions laid out here by Guy. Further, we shouldn't forget that consensus is found through editing, not through endless discussing in circles — esp. closed circles that appear to assume less than good faith with one very prolific long-term contributor. Not saying that MONGO has never displayed any problematic character traits - but precisely because of that WP:AGF and WP:BOLD are all the more applicable here, and an RfC seems unconstructive and uncooperative and in fact even deliberately so. |dorf|trottel| |mess|age| 14:00, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
7. Although I'm not exactly happy with the use of language in Guy's "Outside View" (not saying that it's foul, just a bit crude), I agree with Dorftrottel's take on this. I dunno why, but this RfC has a certain "Created in Bad Faith" feel to it. Avec nat...Le Wikipédia Prends Des Forces. 15:12, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
8. Classic use of dispute resolution to harass a user! 15:16, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
9. Crockspot 15:35, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
10. I am too diplomatic to use the word "moronic", but the rest is correct. - Jehochman 16:02, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
11. Bastique 17:58, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
12. I'm very sorry to see that attempts to bait Mongo continue. SlimVirgin 19:25, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
13. It should be noted that many of the "evidence" links in this RFC are reverts of Miltopia. szyslak 20:00, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
14. Indeed. -- Acalamari (talk) 20:10, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
15. This is an attempt by those who support harassment and attacks by linking to attack sites, to harass an editor who has been viciously attacked in the past, and bravely stands in their way. -- Crum375 (talk) 20:13, 16 November 2007 (UTC)