Misplaced Pages

I recognize that this user page belongs to the Misplaced Pages project and not to me personally. As such, I recognize that I am expected to respectfully abide by community standards as to the presentation and content of this page, and that if I do not like these guidelines, I am welcome either to engage in reasonable discussion about it, to publish my material elsewhere, or to leave the project.

Here about accountability? see my accountability page.
Note: The apparent listification of the category does not change my commitment to my recallability in any way

My real name is Larry Pieniazek and I like LEGO(r) Brand building elements. Feel free to mail me with comments or concerns. I will archive this page if/when there is a need but will not delete comments. I reserve the right to refactor by moving comments under headings, adding headings, and so forth but will never change comment order in a way that changes meaning.

Note: I archive off RfA thank yous separately, I think they're neat!

Archives

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXI (November 2007)

The November 2007 issue of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.
This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot 03:09, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

an acknowledgement

hey. I still think you made a good-faith misjudgement re COI (perceived) in that infamous now-closed Rfc ("clerking"). But I read your rationale for voting spumoni, and I was very impressed with your thoughtful fairness. Whatever my criticisms of you in that forum, they in no way impugn your actual integrity. I just wanted to say that. sNkrSnee | ¿qué? 02:50, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. ++Lar: t/c 03:00, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Oh how sad :(

I'm so sorry for your loss. Thank you for sharing her with us. What a beautiful creature! Maralia 17:54, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. She was very brave and she fought very hard. The folk at the MSU Large Animal Hospital are among the very best in the world, but it was to no avail. She will be sorely missed. ++Lar: t/c 18:15, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Successful admin coaching

Much congratulations to you on your coachee recently becoming an admin. It makes me happy to know people are active in the project and that good things do come of it. :) --Fang Aili 01:15, 5 December 2007 (UTC)'

Thanks. After a few busts (mutual discontinuations etc) it's nice to have two successes in a row (after Akradecki)... GrooveDog seems to have went less active so maybe John and I can take on another one? But not till after the Steward election is over... ++Lar: t/c 05:26, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Good luck with your new coachees if you take on any. Tbo (talk) 20:47, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Hope to see YOU in there coaching in a few months/half a year or so... BTW I think I sent you mail. ++Lar: t/c 21:05, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Did you? I just checked through my mail but nothing from you. Thanks. Tbo (talk) 22:34, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

It was a few days ago. I tried again. If still nothing, maybe mail me? thanks. ++Lar: t/c 23:28, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Ye, Ive got it now and sent a reply :) Thanks. Tbo (talk) 23:36, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Congrats on being support # 157 !!! Classic! ... when I saw that I died laughing. (I guess I'm glad you're not Tbo_357 ) ++Lar: t/c 13:06, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

I didn't notice it until you pointed it out :). Tbo (talk) 21:23, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Here I thought I figured out what you were waiting for :) ++Lar: t/c 21:28, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Your German user page

Hi Lar, because of your comment on my German talk page I came across your German user page. I hope it is ok to give a comment regarding your German text on that page. In particular, the English text For best results, leave messages on my talk page has been translated to Für beste Resultate Urlaubanzeigen auf meiner Gespräch Seite. This looks like a Babelfish translation to me (which is, in my experience, far worse from English to German than in the opposite direction). Babelfish (or whoever translated this) interpreted leave message as a noun, i.e. as message about leaving. As this is typically a message of people leaving for a short time, e.g. for holidays, it was translated to something meaning vacation notice. If I may, I suggest following translation:

Hallo, ich bin Larry Pieniazek, Benutzer Lar auf der englischsprachigen Misplaced Pages. Siehe meine dortige Seite (User:Lar), um mehr über mich zu erfahren, und siehe meine WikiMatrix auf meta zu Informationen über meine weiteren Zugänge. Um mich bestmöglichst zu erreichen, hinterlasse bitte Nachrichten auf meiner Diskussionsseite (User talk:Lar) auf der englischsprachigen Misplaced Pages, da ich sie hier übersehen könnte. Danke!

And yes, I'm also guilty of using Babelfish to generate user pages but I admitted it ;) Regards, AFBorchert (talk) 17:47, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestions. Yes, that page was generated using babelfish, but not directly. I use babelfish, read what is written and then sometimes try different phrasings (I can read better than I can write). That nuance slipped past me, because I am only de-1. I learnt what German I know mostly from my mother and father, they spoke German when they wanted to keep secrets from their child. (She was from the DDR and he was from Poland, they came to the US after the war). I'll make a note that it is sourced that way. Appreciate the assistance. ++Lar: t/c 20:24, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

SS Christopher Columbus

Hi Lar, I just read SS Christopher Columbus. What a nice article! Have you, perchance, heard of the book The Devil in the White City? It's a fascinating historical account of the people behind the Columbian Exposition and a serial killer on the loose at the fair. I'm not generally a big fan of historical non-fiction, but I found Devil in the White City hard to stop reading. Doesn't mention the ship, as I recall, but so much about that fair was truly amazing. Anyways, I just read the article and thought I'd share. I do think you should work it up for FAC when you have the time! Cheers! --JayHenry (talk) 04:04, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

I came to the article via Whalebacks rather than via the fair. I've heard of the book but have not yet read it. Historical fiction and non fiction is more up my wife's alley but I may well give it a go, thanks for the tip. And thanks for the kind words. I do want to push this article to FAC but first I have to make all the changes maralia suggested! I'm behind on that... :) ++Lar: t/c 12:59, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Notability

Lar, I remember reading your note about not being notable on your talk page before and checking out the google link. Back then I agreed, but now, looking at the google link again, I would say you are becoming more notable. Perhaps not fully notable yet, but you are reaching that status. So you may want to consider updating your page. Congratulations on becoming notable! --Merond e 08:24, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Probably more notorious than notable :) Also, a lot of those things are notable for the event, not the person. ++Lar: t/c 13:01, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Help with Picture

Lar, there is a picture on a site that I want to use for an article that I am helping a friend with. The picture appears to be in the public domain, but I sent a message to the website owner just to make sure. Unfortunately, the address is no longer valid. What should I do? Thanks Lar! --Merond e 11:50, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Two basic approaches. One: Finesse the question of whether it's PD or not, upload it here and use a very rigorous Fair Use justification (it needs to be a very needful picture though). Two: Raise the issue on Commons Talk:Licensing and ask the Commons community for help. If the site is in English, give me a link and I'll take a look. That may not be the fastest way though, I'm pretty busy. If it's in (for instance) Arabic, asking on Commons may be a good approach, there are admins there that speak arabic, farsi, etc... ++Lar: t/c 12:21, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Actually, it's in German. But I'll try the Commons first. Thanks, Lar! --Merond e 06:27, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Lar, I'm posting at the Commons, but I found a non-German version of the page if you want to check it out too: . --Merond e 06:40, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

I still am not clear which picture it is. I however see nothing on that site that would indicate to me that either of the pictures on that page are in the public domain. Can you give me the German link too? Also, a link to where on Commons you raised this? I didn't spot it at first glance. ++Lar: t/c 12:27, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Email

You have email, WjBscribe 17:49, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

replied. ++Lar: t/c 18:22, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Coding

Hi Lar. I now you're probably busy but would you be willing to help in fixing some coding problems we are having on a different non foundation wiki. The wiki uses mediawiki software. If you can then I will give you the necessary details. Thanks. Tbo (talk) 22:15, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

If I say yes and then don't do it I'll feel guilty and you'll be mad. If I say no, you might still be mad but I won't be guilty. Can I suggest asking on the ref desk? Or alternatively on IRC on the developers channel? That latter is usually what I do when I get stuck. If you want to tell me what the problem is anyway knowing I might just say "I dunno" then go ahead. :) What kind of problem is it? Template coding? If it's extensions I am way out of my area of expertise though. I promise to at least look at it. Hope that helps. ++Lar: t/c 23:39, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Actually I probably should have mentioned the problem. Its nothing Ill get mad about so no need to worry there. It seems to be a simple problem but if you can't help then no worries, honestly :). The problem is described here in enough detail and the problem can be seen here. Sorry for directing you to these pages but its hard to explain simply enough. If you don't know then let me know and Ill ask on the ref desk. Thanks very much. Tbo (talk) 17:41, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Well on the plus side I found an interesting new wiki, but I think the interaction of spans and divs is a bit beyond me. I'll read more closely. It seems that wiki isn't using the interwiki map? When I went to set up my crosslink to my m:user:lar/WikiMatrix on meta the meta: prefix didn't work, I had to do a plainlinks span. ++Lar: t/c 17:55, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks anyway. Ill ask on the reference desk. You may also be interested in . Thanks. Tbo (talk) 19:10, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Wow, just noticed the amount of wikis youre on :). How do you fit in so much editing time? Tbo (talk) 19:18, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

I love trains. I use planes a lot (to travel for work) and think they're nifty but probably will never be a planespotter. I'm not really a trainspotter (in the UK/anorak sense) either. More of just a US style railfan. I think you'll have more success asking on IRC in the #mediawiki channel than on the ref desk. ++Lar: t/c 19:43, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Im not really a trainspotter myself. Its just something I occassionally read about and write about on wikipedia. But like you Ive liked railways from a young age. Tbo (talk) 20:37, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

You...

you need to give others people's ideas some time before trouncing them entirely into the ground. If people don't like it (and I expect that they won't) they'll tell us. If you replace everything by political correctness, we'll never know. >Radiant< 00:30, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

That proposed policy has merit if the kinks can be worked out. But the justification reads like a polemic, in my view, and that's not an effective approach to gaining acceptance in my view and experience. I removed the polemicism and left the policy/process itself exactly as you formulated it. I think it's much more likely to gain acceptance now than before. YMMV. In short I'm not sure I'd characterise my attempts at improvement as "trouncing". If you're talking about something else I apologise but you didn't specify. ++Lar: t/c 00:37, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

But it's not a proposed policy. If it were, everybody would have to agree to it, and that's not the point. The intent is to find volunteers with like-minded attitudes. >Radiant< 00:41, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Semantics. That "idea" has merit if the kinks can be worked out. Better? The big kink is that unofficial things (things that aren't policy) won't be enforced by stewards. It will take some clever thinking to determine how to overcome that and I'm willing to work with you to try to come up with it. Unless this policy is actually a stalking horse? I doubt that. It's not your style I don't think, and it isn't mine either. I'm assuming you think the idea has merit enough to explore and see if it can be made to work. ++Lar: t/c 03:56, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Your recall page?

I was reading your Recall conditions page earlier and I seem to have lost the link. Can you point me to its location again? Sorry. From what I recall it seems to be worded very well. Cirt (talk) 04:08, 14 December 2007 (UTC).

User:Lar/Accountability. There is a link to it at the very top of this page. Hope that helps. ++Lar: t/c 04:10, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. There are so many different pages with ongoing discussions about this topic, it is very very hard to follow. Not sure where to comment about it, but for now I think I'll just take a gander at your page. Cirt (talk) 04:15, 14 December 2007 (UTC).

• After reading it over again, I think your page says it perfectly and should be discussed as a potential model for others. Where is the best place that this is being discussed? Cirt (talk) 04:17, 14 December 2007 (UTC).
  • WT:RFA has the hottest discussion currently but that page is very ephemeral. The talk page for CAT:AOTR is where stuff gets documented long term but there isn't much being discussed there now. Heck, I don't know. Where to discuss things often has me scratching my head. Sorry that's not more help. ++Lar: t/c 04:30, 14 December 2007 (UTC)
    • No worries. I think I'll sit tight for now and just read the ongoing stuff. Thanks for pointing me to your subpage, which again, I think is well worded/thought out. Cirt (talk) 04:32, 14 December 2007 (UTC).
      • "No worries" back. (one of my fave phrases), and thanks. I'm actually thinking of a little tweak but I have to figure out the wording right. It's a promise that if I change the criteria that people have some time before the change goes in effect (no fair changing things to make it harder just about the time you get into serious trouble)... Not sure how to word it cleanly. ++Lar: t/c 04:47, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Email

Please check your email.

JodyB _talk 21:40, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

replied. I should put a banner up saying "I check my mail a lot, you don't have to ping me. :) " :) ++Lar: t/c 21:49, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Mercury's faux "recall"

Please revisit Mercury's out-of-process "recall" RfC. He has "closed" it early, removed himself from the admins open to recall, and claimed that the RfC has demonstrated the community still "trusts" him, even though the support recall comments had piled up to 11 just before his close. Also, at his talk, when someone questioned the validity of the process he was putting the community through, he responded with "It's my recall" and nothing more. I note you supported his keeping the tools (which I don't understand at all, given his history, but I respect), but I've never noticed you losing your head in a discussion. As such, I'd like you to revisit the scene, and see if you don't see a drama-inducing admin who has no need for--and, in fact, has demonstrated a clear misuse of--the tools and buttons of adminship. Mr Which??? 23:37, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

I will take a look but it may not be right away, about to board an airplane. ++Lar: t/c 23:45, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Events overcame me, he has resigned and has stipulated it's "under a cloud"... I don't think that's something that can be taken back so that's that, I'd say. I am not sure whether commenting there now is useful or not. I would posit that, despite what many would characterise as some considerable changing things around during the process, it worked. Community pressure had the effect that it usually does, it made insupportable positions untenable and he has in the end done the honorable thing. ++Lar: t/c 02:42, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

I agree with that last bit, and my respect for him increased when he did so. However, I don't think the process really worked in this case, since it was haphazard, manipulated, and could have simply been ignored if Mercury were so inclined. Fortunately, Mercury did the right thing, but there was nothing in the process that constrained him to do so, in view at least. Mr Which??? 06:20, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Well there is some truth to that. I've massively overhauled my own page to more concretely specify in advance much of what caused controversy in Mercury's case. I plan, after some time to reflect on it and find holes, to campaign that other members of CAT:AOTR should do a similar exercise. (not necessarily adopt what I did per se, but go to a similar level of detail in advance and pledge to stick to it as I did) I feel that this lack of preplanning is one of the larger causes of issues with the process itself. All that aside, do you think there's still a particular action I should now be taking in the Mercury matter, as you did before? ++Lar: t/c 12:22, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Not necessarily. Perhaps you could talk to an administrator like AuburnPilot about being prick-ish to those of us who supported the recall, and thought Mercury was not a good admin? On his talkpage, before Mercury officially resigned to tools under controversy, he informed me that I could basically "move on" or "start an arbcom case that would be rejected" if I didn't like Mercury's withdrawal of his recall. AP also chose to out the account I used to edit under (my real name) at AN/I, even though I expressed that I had some serious RL concerns involved in vanishing. Anyways, you're a great admin, cool, level-headed--everything an admin (and an Arbcom member, perhaps one day?) should be. Keep up the great work, and I may be contacting you for assistance in vanishing again before too long. Regards, Mr Which??? 20:32, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

(<-) I'll go look at what transpired there if you want... do you have a diff for me to look at? I agree there's no need to be vindictive or abrupt. Thanks for your compliments! But as for ArbCom, not for me. I think I would much rather be a Steward. And I agree with those that say that perhaps it might be better not to try to do both at the same time. Stewards don't resolve disputes, they carry out consensus. Much less stressful (and very important). The election's almost over to be sure, so we'll see what happens. If you do need assistance in future let me know and I will see what I can do. ++Lar: t/c 20:41, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

That's okay, thanks. The one discussion (about Mercury) is still on his talkpage, and the case where he dug through my old contribs to find one of the old versions of my userpage that had an "approved sock of" tag on it that the oversighters missed in order to prove his point is still on the main page of AN/I, but further discussion on that issue now would be unproductive, I think. As I said, I may be contacting you for help in vanishing, though. I have RL concerns that caused the first "vanishing", and Jeffpw and Auburnpilot have brought those back to the surface in the current AN/I. Mr Which??? 20:54, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Thank You

Thank you for helping to resolve the block on my account and that of Kafka Liz. I believe I have made our off-wiki relationship more visible on my userpage. Aramgar (talk) 20:03, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

It took a fair bit of work to spot it... but yes hopefully. All the best. ++Lar: t/c 21:04, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Hi Lar - I wanted to write and thank you too. Your support and advice was much appreciated. Have a good holiday, and thanks again, Kafka Liz (talk) 19:03, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

No problem, my pleasure. And if you think I mishandled it, there is still time for *one* of you (grin) to go oppose my stewardship. :) ++Lar: t/c 20:00, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

I believe you are in the running for a stew pot?

As I said I would I checked over your candidature in the final hour and, using the combined digits of every member of the family (including cats) and a very sharp knife, assessed that you had more than 30 votes and over 80% of them were supports. I am very pleased, for you, that I had no need to renege upon my declaration of principle. LessHeard vanU (talk) 00:34, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

No worries mate. ++Lar: t/c 01:22, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

question

Hi Lar:

I sent you a question about to rename my account. sorry but I didn't understand your response. If you can guide me to know how to cross links my accounts? thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by HernanFernandez (talk • contribs) 00:48, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Basically in each place you want to connect, make a post that you have an account in the other place saying what it is. You can put it on your user page, or talk page. Then at the request on Commons, give a diff to the relevant ones and you're all set. ++Lar: t/c 01:22, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Could you check. . .

Sorry to bother you, but I am posting in response to this thread over on Giano's talk page. Could you assure me that the cross-linking I've done between accounts is adequate (with regard to the elections)? Thanks, R. Baley (talk) 19:05, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

I am confused, sorry. which crosslinking that you've done were you referring to? Perhaps a link to it? I think it's adequately linked already based on my adding the en diff( of his link to the meta page where he says he has an en account) to the meta page... But I'm biased, since he is a supporter of mine so of course I'd want his vote to be valid, you may want to ask someone else to validate it :) ++Lar: t/c 19:09, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Oh crap, now I realize how confusing that was. . .I was talking about my user page. R. Baley (talk) 19:17, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Ah. OK well I think your last(?) edit to your user page removed the outbound links to meta and commons when you removed the VO comment, but before that edit you were OK. ++Lar: t/c 19:23, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

I did that because earlier I had added links to the top right hand corner of the page (the VO comments were referring to those), but if it's not clear I will put it back in. . . R. Baley (talk) 19:33, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Ah. Nope, I see now. I think the KEY thing is on your META page, make sure you make it clear how the crosslink is valid. That may mean giving the diff on en where you added it, or explaining where to look on the user page or whatever. Whoever is validating your vote needs to know about how to tell and sometimes those volunteers don't have a lot of time. But I think you're probably fine. ++Lar: t/c 19:37, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. By the way do you have OTRS access at commons? I could use some help, because I am worried about a situation that might be brewing. . .R. Baley (talk) 19:57, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

I have OTRS access (this access is not specific to a wiki, per se), yes, and I have access to the permissions-commons queue (this queue is for commons related permissions). What is the situation, can you give a pointer? Is there an associated ticket number or numbers (use the {{OTRS ticket}} template to refer to them, it makes reading the tickets very easy) ++Lar: t/c 20:13, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

In the interest of protecting editor(s) privacy, I have sent an email with the relevant information. R. Baley (talk) 20:47, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Do I have steward suffrage?

I have an old account that some consider an "open secret" because of a secret checkuser run on my for supposed "disruption" during the Durova Affair. Though it may actually be an open secret, I'd prefer to keep it at that level, per some RL concerns, so I'd prefer not to vote as my old account. As such, does my Mr Which account have suffrage? I have a Meta account under the same name, that I will use to vote for you if it has suffrage. Mr Which??? 19:16, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Steward elections have ended :-( R. Baley (talk) 19:18, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

The requirements are that you have an account on another wiki that you've had for 3 months, and that the two accounts (the other wiki and Meta) be crosslinked openly. It can't be "secret eligibility". I would think just vote with your old account by setting up your old account on meta would be the way to go. It's a moot point as the election is over though. I do appreciate your offer of support. Hope that helps. ++Lar: t/c 19:23, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

That's what I get for paying attention to a frivolous AN/I thread Deeceevoice started about me. Oh well, I guess it's the thought that counts, I guess.... :( Mr Which??? 19:27, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

It was a nice thought and I thank you for it. I think I should be OK even without your support, I hope. ++Lar: t/c 19:30, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Hotcop2

Lar, I am informed that you have been looking into Hotcop2 (talk · contribs). I just blocked the account for 48 hours as a sock of Sixstring 1965. If you think this is wrong, feel free to reverse. The evidence is editing pattern, and the fact that the user page was edited by both Mister ricochet and Sixstring1965. In any case, this account has been posting images with apparently improper copyright declarations, and has been adding details to biographies without proper sourcing. This has been added to Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Mister ricochet- Jehochman 00:28, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Update: Shortly after posting the above message I took a second look and decided that there was enough doubt to unblock the user. I will wait for checkuser results and meanwhile try to help the user with their apparent editing difficulties. - Jehochman 01:09, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

I investigated and from a CU perspective I think it's inconclusive. But if you blocked on behaviour or edit patterns that isn't necessarily wrong per se, I suppose. However I like your other approach (that of trying to help the user) better. ++Lar: t/c 01:33, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

USRD Newsletter - Volume 1, Issue 17

Hello, Lar. A new issue of the newsletter is available to read here. --O bot (t • c) 04:27, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm user fro ms wiki

He come again to vandal us. Help me.Putera Luqman Tunku Andre —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.51.69.28 (talk) 22:43, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

DYK script

Hi Lar, I've added Nishkid64's DYK script to my monobook. For some reason, it's not working though (see the discussion on my talk page). Nishkid said you could probably help me with this. Would you mind checking what I did wrong?--Carabinieri (talk) 22:54, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

I answered on your talk to keep things threaded since several others are replying there. ++Lar: t/c 23:18, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Bravo!

Alice 01:00, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. ++Lar: t/c 02:54, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Recall message

Thanks for that. I think it is a good idea and I was thinking along similar lines myself. I will let you know what I do. Best wishes to you. --John (talk) 06:38, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

I just saw the message on John's talk page since some how both yours and John's user talk pages ended up being on my watchlist. I hope you don't mind. I was thinking of creating a page for my recall policy which I specified in my RfA and I probably will. I think your policy is a great example to follow however. Thanks. P.S. If you plan on delivering the message to all admins in the category, Ill be happy to help. Tbo (talk) 17:46, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. A very kind offer. It's probably best if it comes from one person though. I have a bot account User:Larbot, which is authorized to use AWB, that I can do it with if I need to, so no worries on that score. Worst comes to worst, I'll change some of my javascript functs to do it... :) And you're not the only person who noticed that message from having John's talk page on watch :) .++Lar: t/c 17:49, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

I guess watchlisting each others pages is useful :) Tbo (talk) 17:53, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Absolutely! It also can be considered a bit "stalky" if it's someone you're in a dispute with so do be cognizant of that but that's minor. ++Lar: t/c 17:56, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

One comment; perhaps using a different heading than "Important message about recall" would be advisable. I thought momentarily that the process was being activated against me. Luckily, I have no skeletons in the closet nor do I have any guilty secrets; it would have been far more worrying to me if I did! I've tweaked my accountability page to make it clear that I endorse your ideas of how the process should proceed. For me, having too much "small print" on such a commitment may devalue it in some people's eyes; it may be that the details of the process (and the ones you have come up with seem very good) should best be recorded centrally somewhere if consensus can be attained to do so, rather than having them repeated (with possible local variations) on every admin's version of the page. Thanks for your good work on this. --John (talk) 18:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

How about "You're about to be recalled! Do you know where your process is?" for the heading??? :) I'm not sure I support requiring everyone to use the same process, and by having it central, even if not required, there is the fear that someone might change it in a way you weren't on board with and then you're stuck with it... but ya. Merits further thought++Lar: t/c 19:04, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Autoblock of User:MRN

It looks like an autoblock has caught up User:MRN: . However, this is a checkuser block, so I am bringing this here. As another note, this user has been caught up in autoblocks before: . The Evil Spartan (talk) 06:55, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. I've commented there. The user appears to have gotten around the issue. ++Lar: t/c 14:30, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

User talk:TheEssexMan

Lar, could you please review my actions at the above user talk page. Please give consideration to the possibility of using your checkuser rights to examine whether these users are in fact the same user as I strongly suspect; I'd say that the evidence of their contributions is highly compelling but not all of them were identified at the time that Misplaced Pages:Suspected sock puppets/Guitarlegs was concluded and I do not feel easy handing out indefinite blocks like this without involving another admin. Best wishes to you, --John (talk) 17:20, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Working on it. Do you want to file a formal RFCU and have me report there, give you findings here, or comment on the various user pages under the block requests or ?? ... If I don't hear from you back I'll report here, I have some findings already. ++Lar: t/c 17:58, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Reporting here will be fine, if you are ok with that. --John (talk) 18:11, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Works for me. I also have some IDs I would ask you to look harder at which I, for privacy reasons if they are innocent, prefer not to mention here, why sully reputations needlessly, I will mail you about those. ++Lar: t/c 18:13, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

OK... Checkuser results as follows:

•  Confirmed - TheEssexMan==Chilechicken==Bond0023==Guitarlegs
•  Confirmed - Guitarlegs==AgentOranges
•  Inconclusive - MrTwentyThree to any of the others. However a block on behaviour is sound.

I concur with your tagging and blocking of named accounts. I'm not going to comment on IP addresses unless necessary. (for the record, I did not investigate every IP listed on the suspected page, my focus was on named accounts) Please advise of any other questions or concerns. I have sent you additional information about accounts I would like you to look into further privately. I believe none of those accounts are related, so I am not making their names public, but I ask you to corroborate my exoneration. ++Lar: t/c 18:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your speedy response, that was very helpful. I haven't received any email from you recently; if you have already emailed me, you might care to resend? --John (talk) 18:42, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Cancel that, it just came through. Thanks again. --John (talk) 19:08, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Congratulations on becoming a steward

Well deserved! NoSeptember 19:32, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

• Concur with the both the congratulations and the judgment that it is well-deserved! Mr Which??? 19:34, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

'Grats. You're an exemplary Wikipedian, and I've no doubt you'll be a boon to the project in your new role. - Revolving Bugbear 19:58, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Heh, no one told ME! The first I learnt of it was when I started getting congratulations here and on meta. (How'd you guys find out?? :)) I much appreciate all your kindness and your support as well. What I suspect my biggest regret will be that the time I devote to article writing will go down even more. ++Lar: t/c 20:15, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

How could anyone tell a steward something - super human power doubtless arrives later.... --Herby 20:17, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

I have a link to the meta log on my personal portal, so I can keep my Desysop page up to date. NoSeptember 20:22, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to congratulate you too! I didn't vote -- missed the deadline -- but am very happy for your success. Cheers! Kafka Liz (talk) 21:27, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Congratulations. Now, how many flags do you have now??? One loses count... :) I (talk) 18:23, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Good question. Let's see... (ABCS are obviously Admin/'crat/CU/stew and R is root)

• WMF: meta - ABCS; commons - ABC; en:wp - AC; en:ws - A
• nonWMF: GLW - ABR; BrickWiki - A; WordForge - AB

So that would be 16, I guess? :) ++Lar: t/c 18:33, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

10 WMF flags. That must be some sort of record. Congratulations! :) I (talk) 18:41, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Whoot! :) Congrats! SQL 20:15, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Would you mind taking a look at this?

Hate to bother you Lar, but I'd like it if you could take a look at my interactions at this talkpage, and let me know what you think. I'm trying my best to be a solid participant in the project, but I feel that these types of interactions discourage folks like me from participating instead of encouraging them. This started when A.B. left a patronizing message on my talk page asking me to be more "kind." Mr Which??? 02:30, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

I looked. I see a lot of back and forth, but I haven't grasped what is really going on there. Perhaps let's talk via email or IRC? ++Lar: t/c 18:34, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

It was with regards to the back-and-forth discussion about whether legistorm.com's informative links regarding congressional salaries should be blacklisted. There is a current RfC on the subject at the talkpage for the MediaWiki Blacklist talkpage. I disagreed strongly with blacklisting a site that was clearly useful, and had been blacklisted only because it had been added en masse to the 535 members of congress' articles. There was vigorous discussion, but then A.B. dropped a "be more kind" note at my page. I asked what she was talking about, and the fray began. Hu12 dropped in to accuse me of TE and being disruptive, and it went on from there. It started at WP:ANI, and then proceeded to the blacklist talkpage here. If you think you would be better able to be more candid over e-mail, that would be fine with me. I'll check my work account more frequently today. Mr Which??? 18:49, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

That helps a lot. I don't know that I will get to look at this in depth today, many demands on my time here... so don't sit on your email wondering why I'm not mailing you :) ++Lar: t/c 18:53, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

No problem. I appreciate your taking the time. I'll check a couple of times today, but I totally understand the demands on your time. Thanks again! Mr Which??? 18:55, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Category:Wikipedians against censorship

Per your very recent comment at that drv, you may wish to read for yourself a discussion related to the points we both make at Misplaced Pages:User categories for discussion#Category:Wikipedians against censorship where I make another very similar point. Here, a category containing over a thousand users is being debated for deletion or renaming by a pool representing approx 1% of those members. What constitutes consensus? Hiding T 18:31, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Seasonal wishes

Thanks! ++Lar: t/c 18:28, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Recall criteria

Just a thought, but it seems that people like the way you laid out your criteria. That said, the only variation I see is in criteria of those requesting recall (# of edits, amount of time as a Wikipedian, how many edits in which particular spaces, whether they are admins, etc.) Perhaps there would be a way to reword it so to make it that set of criteria to be "customisable", but to yet say "Like Lar's except, here's my criteria for those requesting:" or something similar to that. As I said, just a thought, based on all the reading I've been doing lately. - jc37 05:21, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

That's an idea. Maybe I'll make it templatizable. The issue I have is that I do change my criteria from time to time and I really do not think it fair that everyone else be forced to change theirs to match, dragged along willy nilly as it were... what if they don't like my latest change? Bears thinking about, thanks for the suggestion. ++Lar: t/c 05:28, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

My apologies, Lar

I'll back off. I'm sarcastic by nature, and blatantly ignoring the lengthy discussion right above the thread where he informed Giano of the block pissed me off. This whole effin' deal pisses me off. The folks who have it out for Giano haven't contributed to the project half as much combined as Giano has. If they manage to get him lengthy-blocked in the Arbcom, I'll take my little editor-self and leave for good. Mr Which??? 05:55, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm not pleased either but it's not one sided, and it is important to remember there are useful things done by those that mop rather than write. I think it's best to try to keep a calm and civil tongue in these matters if you can. Also, remember that this is the froth, not the liquid. There is a vast and deep current of good work being done that runs below the surface, oblivious to all this Sturm und Drang... we did not get 2M articles by infighting. When you get too mad, go write something, it's very relaxing, I find. ++Lar: t/c 13:16, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I had one thing I wanted to ask you about. You say in your Arbcom statement that Tony "apologized." He has not dones so, at least not in any traditional sense of the word. He hasn't even admitted he wrote those things. He's offered the classic "non-apology", but nothing else. Mr Which??? 18:14, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I view his statement as an apology. It's not perhaps in the form that might be desirable, but it is an apology. You may not agree, of course. I'd prefer it were more explicit. I again urge everyone, including you, to read, internalize, and embrace meatball:ForgiveAndForget. To forgive those we do not necessarily agree with, that we do not even like, is the height of civilization. ++Lar: t/c 18:17, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure how you can classify that as an apology worthy of forgiving and forgetting, when he doesn't even admit he said it, and is now accusing people of forging logs. While admire your trust, Lar, I'll trust my cynicism. Mr Which??? 18:21, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I have the Sep 2006 log, where is Tony saying the log is forged? I apparently need to reply to that. ++Lar: t/c 18:33, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

• He's made the claim that they're "faked" here. Mr Which??? 18:36, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I don't think Lar has the faked log, he is talking of the genuine ones. The faked (more an insertion) into a genuine log (nothing has been proven either way yet) have only just forwarded to the Arbcom by me. They were sent to me anonymously by an anonymous #admin member, I was immediately suspicious because they show Tony calling a female editor a "fucking cunt" while Newyorkbrad says nothing, Brad, I think and hope, would have responded to that if they were genuine. Giano (talk) 18:49, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

UCFD

They're operating a cabal down there and I really don't have the time or interest to keep them honest. Good luck to them, if they think that's how Misplaced Pages works. I'm very disappointed but I just feel like, whatever. It'll come to a head eventually, it always does. Hiding T 11:52, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

• I would support drv's of the two closes in question though. Hiding T 14:05, 26 December 2007 (UTC)