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Revision as of 21:51, 9 October 2008

	Systems: Systems theory Template‑class
This template is within the scope of WikiProject Systems, which collaborates on articles related to systems and systems science.SystemsWikipedia:WikiProject SystemsTemplate:WikiProject SystemsSystems Template This template does not require a rating on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. This template is within the field of Systems theory.

The first draft

The first draft of this template is made on 29 april 2007 as part of the WikiProjectSystems. And the following questions have been rased afterwards. - Mdd 22:29, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

The design of a Template:Systems

The design of the Template:Systems is a finishing touch for the new WikiProject Systems. This template can give major directions in the Misplaced Pages field of systems articles... It gives a global view of the field of systems in theory and practice. The first version is made 23:35, 29 April 2007 by Mdd. A first update is made the day after.

Now I made this point an item on it's own, because I would like to have some feed back and further discussion about how to proceed? - Mdd 22:16, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

There are lot's of examples to compare this template with. For example the Template:Cybernetics and the Template:Sociology. What can we learn from these two examples? - Mdd 11:43, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Fixed

Fixed the "Systems" link, where it linked to some German whatnot.

Thanks very much - Mdd 11:24, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Removals

Multi-agent system

This was a redirect to Agent based model - Mdd 11 July 2007, 14:38 (UTC)

Second-order cybernetics

This article is just a beginning, maybe improtant for cybernetics by hardly a key concept in systems, systems science and systems theory. - Mdd 11:43, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Alexander Bogdanov

This name has already been pushed in the systems theory, which is questionable because there are many fields of systems theory and even more succesors in these fields. Now the growth of systems theory started since the 1950s and Alexander Bogdanov played no part in that as far as I know.

I did however placed the article in the category:systems scientists and listed him in the List of systems scientists. But presenting him in the Systems template as a key figure in teh systems movement is unacceptable. - Mdd 11:43, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Anthony Stafford Beer

Stafford Beerd made significant contributions to the field of cybernetics so I moved him to the Template:Cybernetics - Mdd 15 August 2007, 17:53 (UTC)

Catastrophe theory

The relation between Catastrophe theory and systems science is far from clear to me. It looks like it, that this theory is not that crucial in the field of systems science. - Mdd 18 August 2007, 23:02 (UTC)

Industrial Ecology

In the field of ecology allready one field is mentioned: the Systems ecology. A second field could be Ecosystem ecology... Industrial ecology seems to be an spinoff here... and not that crusial to systems thinking. - Mdd 17:51, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Warren McCulloch

This is more a cybernetic expert - Mdd 21:23, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Multi-agent systems for the second time

The field of Multi-agent systems can hardly be called a main theoretical field of systems science. I think the article itselve should first be improved. In July last year this article was even made a redirect to the Agent based model article. I personly recreated the article again. But since then nobody really improved that article yet.

So if Multi-agent systems should be named in this template, please first severly improve that article itselve. -- Mdd (talk) 20:05, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

The article had been improved. I reentered this item but in the list of systems and not in the list of studies. The article explains this kind of system but doesn't show that this is a complete field of study. -- Mdd (talk) 23:55, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

The systems listed

I dunno much about the subject, but I have the impression that the systems are too different to be listed in one template. Andries (talk) 21:57, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

The Misplaced Pages offers thousands of articles about systems, see for example the Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Systems/List of systems list. The about 20 systems mentioned in the template here are only a selection, a set of the most representative articles. The general idea of this list is also to give an impression of the differences in the systems which are defined in science. Off cause there are large differences. But there also a structure of category, which brings all these systems together. -- Mdd (talk) 22:43, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Additions

What are the criteria for considering adding individuals to the template? I would like to propose adding Béla H. Bánáthy. -- btphelps (talk) 16:59, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Done. The template is for all subjects, that are central in the systems sciences and the persons, who played te most important role in the initiation of the different fields of systems science. I think Béla H. Bánáthy played a central role in the further developement of systems science, but I am not so sure he initiated a field of it own. I think we can keep in the template for a while. -- Marcel Douwe Dekker (talk) 19:46, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Over 2500 articles about systems in Misplaced Pages

I removed three new systems listed in the template. There are over 2500 artciels about systems in Misplaced Pages, see

• Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Systems/List of systems

And those can't be listed all in this template. That is why choices have to be made here. -- Marcel Douwe Dekker (talk) 01:59, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Mdd (Marcel Douwe Dekker) bias edits

So what is your excuses for removing the following

• Content Management Systems
• KnowledgeBase Systems
• Learning Management Systems

you bias on Computing Science topics? Each of the systems itself is not just a software, they have a set define of concepts developed by the Open Source community such as length of lifecycle (ALM / PLM), approach method (agile, Raid application developement, UML model), orientation programming (aspect, object-orientated, event-driven), Toools implanmentations, licensing (foundations, types of consortium specification is best fit to prevent "viral" legal propietary issues...etc.

Just because you are the creator of the template, doesn't mean you can choose not follow consensu. I don't get in the beginning what you remove Industrial Ecology, they are system science, it includes the following cycle. All of these cycle are system science

• Carbon cycle
• Nitrogen cycle
• Phosphorus cycle
• Oxygen cycle

--Ramu50 (talk) 21:37, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

• Template-Class Systems pages
• NA-importance Systems pages
• Systems articles in systems theory
• WikiProject Systems articles