Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 22:46, 31 July 2009

This is Jimbo Wales's talk page, where you can send them messages and comments.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed

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Archives

Index -index- As of January 16, 2003 September – December 2005 January 2006 January – February 2006 February 2006 February 2006, cont. March 2006 April 2006 - late May 2006 May 24 - July 2006 July 2006 - August 2006 August 2006 Most of September 2006 Late September 2006 - Early November 2006 Most of November 2006 Late November 2006 - December 8, 2006 December 9, 2006 - Mid January 2007 From December 22, 2006 blanking Mid January 2007 - Mid February 2007 Mid February 2007- Feb 25, 2007 From March 2, 2007 blanking March 2-5, 2007 March 5-11, 2007 March 11 - April 3, 2007 April 2 - May 2, 2007 May 3 - June 7, 2007 June 9 - July 4, 2007 July 13 - August 17, 2007 August 17 - September 11, 2007 September 14 - October 7, 2007 October 28 - December 1, 2007 December 2 - December 16, 2007 December 15 - January 4, 2008 January 4 - January 30, 2008 January 30 - February 28, 2008 February 28 - March 11, 2008 March 9 - April 18, 2008 April 18 - May 30, 2008 May 30 - July 27, 2008 July 26 - October 4, 2008 October 4 - November 12, 2008 November 10 - December 10, 2008 December 5 - December 25, 2008 December 25 - January 16, 2009 January 15 - January 27, 2009 January 26 - February 10, 2009 February 8 - March 18, 2009 March 18 - May 6, 2009 May 5 - June 9, 2009 June 10 - July 11, 2009 July 12 - August 29, 2009

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Incivility and comparisons to Usenet

I've seen many people (including you) make comparisons between Misplaced Pages and Usenet, typically as a justification for civility policies. I think such comparisons demonstrate a marked lack of understanding of how Usenet operated (no offense meant; an understanding of Usenet culture is hardly a sign of superiority.) Some members of the Usenet community eventually discovered killfiles, while others did not. For those that did not, Usenet seemed an anarchic and barbaric place. For those that learned to use technology to filter out the noise, Usenet was a quiet and serene place, full of lively discussion. In an environment that's essentially anonymous (and in which it is thus effectively impossible to truly "ban" anybody) it simply makes no sense to try to enforce behavioral guidelines. The only effective way to deal with unruly behavior in such situations is to ignore it. If the sheer volume of such behavior is an issue (as it was on Usenet and is arguably becoming so here) then it should be filtered out at the reader's discretion. Given that talk pages here often follow a model of threaded discussion anyway, it would seem that the best solution would be to simply modify the software so that they were genuine threaded discussions, which would make it trivial to apply filters. The alternative — empowering some individuals to act as overseers of the others — is fraught with peril and doomed to failure. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shdfbsjhc (talk • contribs) 01:05, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

I think the success of Misplaced Pages is the supreme example of the proof of the failure of the philosophy of Usenet as you have expressed it. As it turns out, communities can come together successfully and set standards of behavior (for example, including rules against admins cursing at and abusing non-admins, and similar). It turns out that it is possible, even in anonymous environments, to effectively raise the cost of abusive behavior in a variety of ways, in no small part as a service to readers who should not be required to do all the filtering themselves. --Jimbo Wales (talk) 03:33, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Success of the Nodrama

Hey Jimbo. WP:NODRAMA was a success and it was good to see your approval of it. I've just had an idea. We could have an official day in July each year where there is to be no drama for 24 hours. It could be an official event and could have a proper title such as "Nodrama Day." It could be that July 18 of every year is "Misplaced Pages Nodrama Day". Your thoughts?--_{Sky Attacker} 03:19, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Would it mandatory or would there be a signup sheet like before? Griffinofwales (talk) 03:41, 29 July 2009 (UTC) No reply will be given by me for 18 hours or more

Personally, I'd prefer a signup sheet like before. I'm just wondering what you thought of the idea. I mean, I don't know how many "official" days Misplaced Pages has but July 18 for a "Misplaced Pages Nodrama Day" sounds good, at least in my opinion. I understand that something like this may require more than founder approval, but I thought that taking this idea to the man himself would be the most sensible place to start.--_{Sky Attacker} 03:46, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Would this be in addition to or instead of the 5 day (possibly to be expanded to 7 days) No Drama Days festival planned for 2010? ChildofMidnight (talk) 22:46, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Maybe we could have a "Nodrama Week"!! At the moment it's just basically throwing some ideas around, but I think an annual Nodrama period would be a fine tradition for Misplaced Pages. And I really do think that July would be a great month for it.--_{Sky Attacker} 05:29, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Wait CoM!!! There's already plan for another one next year??????--_{Sky Attacker} 05:32, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

You're on FPC!

Good luck. ceranthor 12:24, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Just wanted to notify you, sir. ceranthor 14:54, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

They think you look like Kevin Costner. Don't see where they get that notion. By the way, you gave a great performance in Bull Durham. Durova 15:59, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes, well, with Susan Sarandon as my co-star... :-p You're silly. :)--Jimbo Wales (talk) 00:12, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Personally, I thought you did your best work in JFK ... IMHO ;) — Ched :  ?  04:19, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

5 out of 10 doctors use Misplaced Pages.

...according to an article I just saw on Digg, from New Scientist.

Do you agree that it is "disconcerting" for doctors to use Misplaced Pages as a resource for information? ☯  Zenwhat (talk) 21:13, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

I would assume that most doctors are intelligent enough to use Misplaced Pages appropriately.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 22:19, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

It makes me wonder why doctors are so interested in Stephen Colbert and South Park episodes. Aren't they supposed to be seeing patients? ChildofMidnight (talk) 22:44, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

I am sure many patients use it too, and extremely useful it is While there are areas such as politics where[REDACTED] is inevitably weak as people hold strong conflicting opinions outside such controversials subjects as alternative medicine versus conventional medicine[REDACTED] is generally excellent on the medical front, as it is in science generally. Thanks, SqueakBox talk 04:22, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

I dunno. The recent uploading of all those flat out wrong biology articles (like 900+) suggests that Misplaced Pages is a pretty poor primary resource science-wise. Crafty (talk) 10:08, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

If Doctors are checking Misplaced Pages articles and they understand the fact that anyone can edit, then they would very likely be the people to notice (and perhaps fix) errors. It would only really be of any concern if some Doctors actually mistook Misplaced Pages for an authoritative medical source, or didn't understand that just anyone can have edited any article; which can happen, but I would expect competent doctors check and corroborate their information before acting on it. --Mysidia (talk) 03:31, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Hey, I don't know about you guys, but I don't have health insurance, so I go to the clinic where anyone can practice. It's not so bad. *cough* Lara 17:21, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Be ware of the Spanish Misplaced Pages

The Spanish Misplaced Pages is run by Drini, Drini the King, please review his actions. Can he reset passwords? How much power a steward really needs? The Spanish Misplaced Pages is dark place where discussions are censor and any attempt to question an administrator will result in block. The Spanish Misplaced Pages is running wild, please put some control, ask Drini, he knows.

I believed in this project, but then realized this has been hick jacked by teens in a role-playing game, but dont believe me ask the foundation to run a survey and get the input of the few Spanish WIkipedians that still edits the project. Ask for example, why so few Puerto RIcans edit in that project, ask how users feels about the fair treatment of administrators. Please look into the Spanish project before is too late. My user name is jmundo but Drini reset my password and I dont have a way to get into my account. --71.68.208.166 (talk) 06:15, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

No one suspects the Spanish Inquisition.--Scott Mac (Doc) 08:43, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

According to your block log, you were blocked for this message on Drini's talkpage. Now, my Spanish is a bit rusty and Babelfish doesn't do too well with your writing style, but unless I'm missing something big, I can't say I'm at all surprised you were blocked. --Carnildo (talk) 08:51, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Translating Carnildo's diff: "because you have time on your hands, product of old money, who knows how many painkillers you shove into yourself each day, you know that this is not going to take you anywhere, no whore will sleep with a Misplaced Pages volunteer. But you pretend to be the strong boy because you can play bureaucrat, tell me how you smoke weed in Mexico, those eyes of yours have a lot of history, here you don't build anything but a forum that only a few handle, and the symbol of the wiki as the symbol of human trash, you don't get tired, look, go outside and hire a whore, be happy and stop working with those idiots, you have a future, I know, you have something but you're stuck" (run-ons in the original) I think that says everything we need to know about your block appeal. Titoxd 10:49, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Drini didn't change your password. He locked your account to prevent you from logging in. SUL (talk) 10:25, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

What JMundo said is actually worse than the above translation, the comment about paja is extremely offensive, anybody would have blocked him for this comment; is it just one person who comes here complaining about Drini. Thanks, SqueakBox talk 14:21, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

• • Im not appealing the block from es.wiki, but where is the evidence to block me from the English wiki. Just check my edits (Jmundo) here and in Commons. where is the evidence? Are we going to let sysops from another wiki control the English wiki?

But hey, I dont care if you don't unblock me, I was in not coming back wikibreak anyway. Wales, I respect a man of great ideas, too bad this place was run over by role playing boys and girls with no respect to due process. --74.249.3.58 (talk) 14:26, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

If you're not appealing the block then why keep spamming Jimbo's page (for the fifth time by my count) and complaining about Drini. Darrenhusted (talk) 14:38, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

You were blocked for two hours, from 01:57 until 03:56, today. You were unblocked over two hours before your first post here. The problem, like you admitted yourself, is that you forgot your password, not that you are blocked here, since you aren't. Fram (talk) 14:42, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

• • • Im blocked globally 1, I cant log in any project just because I piss off a steaward. Check my edits in this Wiki, do you find a pattern of disruptive editing? The lesson learned here is not to mess with an angry steward. --74.249.3.58 (talk) 14:49, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

@Darrenhusted, this isn't the same user. The other person was complaining about Drini's blocks on the Spanish Wikiquote. SUL (talk) 14:53, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Well Drini must be doing something right then. Darrenhusted (talk) 15:23, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

I dont know why Misplaced Pages dont require an IQ test, if you are stupid, dont edit! if you dont have anything meaningful to contribute to the conversation shut the fuck up. Darrenhusted, what a terrific post, so deep and philosophical! Oh Jimbo, the wiki software was great, but the humans!!! Misplaced Pages, and everybody knows this, is a terrific and easy forum no more different than posting in a newspaper article comment section. Im leaving, Im sick and tire of the boys and girls swimming in the shallow water with disguise personalities like softfrog, or killerdog or softyshit, what good can come out from anonymous editing!!!

Dear reader, that wathchlisted this page, get a life. The economy depends on you to go out a produce something, unless[REDACTED] is new age manifesto for not working and breaking the world wide system, go anarchy from the comfortable living room and the jetta, imagine thousands of jetta and organic coffee drinkers starting a revolution, what a joke! I given my knowledge to Misplaced Pages, and I'm done working with assholes for that a can keep working wiht coworkers. Good job Jimmy controlling the masses, dont give them too much power they run you over... No constitutional monarchy, just plain monarchy, long live the king. --74.236.128.117 (talk) 16:17, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Know Im free to start over, no more Wiki, Im feel real again, and Im out of this hypereality of edit contributions, Free, I'm free at last......

Sigh, ok. Again. this user has been trouble for months. He's got an obsession about blue shade on puerto rico flag. And when things don't go his way, he launches offensive remarks. He's been blocked before and by a mere bureaucratic thing he got off. He got on a wikibreak and suddenly out of nowhere without me having crossed a word on him, spews his insults.

Now, if it were just me, it wouldn't have been no big deal. But he's been harassing other users crosswiki (like durero, netito777, etc). So I locked globally his account. Someone posted a translation above about what's he's sending users (again, without having talked to him in months and without a provocation). So I gblocked his account. However, let it be noted for the record, those are not the only instances, he's been doing more and more attakcs hiding as IP again targetting other users.

This is not about me. This is about stopping him to harass other users and stop his obsession with a single topic: blue shade of puerto rico flag that it's causing this problems. Thank you very much. -- m:drini 16:10, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

This is not about the blue shade, you asshole, read the english article, everybody discuss about this, but in the Spanish Wiki discussion is not foster, ask people around, the Spanish Misplaced Pages is a bad latinamerican country has much to learn about democracy.--74.236.128.117 (talk) 16:23, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

• sigh* -- m:drini 16:46, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Drini, kudos for your good work. Darrenhusted (talk) 17:30, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Sure, although I got wristslapped and he's unblocked and free to edit again. Kudos. -- m:drini 17:48, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Guidance on what is WP

As one of the historical proponents of Misplaced Pages, probably the "Father of Misplaced Pages", your guidance on what Misplaced Pages is supposed to be is requested.

The background of this is a minor politician who got fired because the city found out his wife is a pornographic actress, leading to a Misplaced Pages article read in Finland, United States, and probably many other countries. Whether or not this article is deleted is not the question. I can see what both sides are saying.

What is WP?

The real question is "What is Misplaced Pages". Here, I quote what I wrote to another editor...

What I want to ask you is what do we want WP for? On one extreme, it would cover very trivial items, news, video games, etc. On the other extreme, only the most scholarly topics like Australia, Charles de Gaulle, Lung cancer, World War II would be covered. Without quoting our rules, what should WP be?

1. Misplaced Pages should be any topic that anyone would conceivably look up.

2. Misplaced Pages should be most topics but nothing that would make people laugh at Misplaced Pages, so serious subjects only.

3. Misplaced Pages should be most topics but no nudity or anything that the ___ religion prohibits doing or looking at.

4. Misplaced Pages should be only what Encyclopedia Britannica has.

5. Misplaced Pages should be #4 plus a little more.

6. Misplaced Pages should only be biographies of people who will be known 100 years later, major geographic locations, and major wars.

Once we know what WP should be, we can work towards that WP and maybe even fine tune the rules. Should it be 1, 2, or 5? I don't expect a definitive answer only some thoughts that come to mind, Mr. Wales.

One thought that came to mind would be #1 except WP must be seen as honorable so no nasty attacks against mainly people but also topics. This would support the BLP rules but, again, I would like to focus on the product and purpose, not try to think of what description fits our current rules.

Note to others reading this: This communication is mainly to get Mr. Wales' opinion and not everyone else's although you may comment as you see fit. User F203 (talk) 15:00, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages should be an encyclopedia. Prodego 15:57, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

I think Misplaced Pages should be as comprehensive as we can be, given the need for and importance of reliable sources and verifiability, and given the need for proper maintenance in the long run. Biographies of living persons provide the most obvious and compelling reason to be cautious. But there are many ways that we might be hoaxed if we reach too far into obscurities. I don't like any of your 6 options, but if I were forced to pick one, it would be option (1) - but with the caveat that we have to be able to do a responsible job of it.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 16:43, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your response. Again, I was not looking for legal mumbo-jumbo, but just general ideas. Paraphrasing your ideas, it seems that Misplaced Pages should be about topics that people look up, responsibly written, and not too obscure. It also seems that it is hard to define because you reluctantly chose a numbered choice rather than write up your own choice. If I had to add to "what Misplaced Pages is", it would be that the editors should/must also be responsible people so bad behavior would be very un-Wikipedian, or at least not the ideal Wikipedian. Thank you for your comments, Mr. Wales. User F203 (talk) 17:43, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Council/Proposals/TRANSWIKI

I've proposed a new project dedicated to starting and translating missing articles from other wikipedias. It is intended to be partly missing encyclopedia articles project and partly translation project. Both the previous projects fizzled out but the main objective here is to draw up a full directory of missing articles from each[REDACTED] by language. If anybody is interested please comment or if anybody is learning a language and thinks it would help them practice by translating an article, join it!! Dr. Blofeld 18:33, 31 July 2009 (UTC)