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Revision as of 00:24, 25 August 2011

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DYK for Tell Ezou

On 8 May 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tell Ezou, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the owner of the prehistoric Tell Ezou in Syria has expressed an interest to turn it into an olive plantation? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 00:02, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Lebanon and Eden

I'm not sure I've done it well enough, but I'm trying to clarify both that these authors are not suggesting that a real Eden was in Lebanaon, and the subtlety of what they are saying. In one case it even appears that the author is discussing Lebanon as being not necessarily a physical place. I'm happy to discuss my edits on the article talk page. Dougweller (talk) 18:41, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

• As long as Lebanon's finally on the suggested location list, I'm a happy man Doug. Your edits look okay to me. I'm just glad you didn't judge Ezekiel, the "son of man" as an unreliable, fringe source... i know how much you want to ;-) 20:25, 22 May 2011 (UTC)
• To go into more detail, you'll see that the Brown and Swarup go into details about how paradise, eden and lebanese forests are entwined in prophetic writings. Jeremiah also comes close to describing the same thing with a vision of trees, whilst about nine other prophets also discuss paradiso and eden in transitional terms which show the development and use of the word in this period. I've been having some interesting discussions with friends about the vulgate/douay rheims versions of that chapter. Some good modern sources that I hope we'll agree is a beneficial addition to the page. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 20:42, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

"The holy Tigris, the holy Euphrates / the holy sceptre of Enlil / establish Kharsag.

In your recent edits on the Barton Cylinder you've sourced this quote to Black, can't find it there. Dougweller (talk) 04:56, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

I put this in the Barton discussion and will make it clearer that the translation is Barton's. Hope you noticed I didn't call it Kharsag but Hursag for you there too. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 08:03, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Thanks. I've redirected Kharsag anyway after our discussion last night. By the way, I think you would be wise to stick to the archaeology rather than O'Brien's translations if I understood you correctly. I'm curious also - are you looking for a real Garden of Eden where there was a real Adam & Eve? Dougweller (talk) 08:10, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

No problem, I may make an appropriate stubby page later. Lately I've got quite into antinomianism though - does it really matter if we call it kharsag, hursag or the Babylonian Eden? The concept has adequate discussion outside fringe sources to show the world what it means. The Barton Cylinder and Debate between sheep and grain both show story parallels to Eden in Sumerian literature dated almost 2000 years before the Bible was written. Adam and Eve show links to Enlil and Ninkharsag and Cain and Abel taken from Lahar and Anshar. There's even adequate discussion about a primordial location where the events of the tales take place and several commentators noting that the stories were handed down from a much earlier date.

What I am looking for is what I have found already, an unexcavated PPNB megasite with remains of large neolithic structures (some converted to Roman temples) in and around Aaiha and Kfar Qouq near Mount Hermon. There is a central tell mound overlooking the Aaiha rock cut watercourse where I retrieved limestone plaster from what I suggest was a large house site on the top, tentitavely identified with Enlil's (or Adam's if you like) 'house of life' (or meeting place of heaven and earth). I am looking for archaeologists to radiocarbon date the remains, and hopefully arrive at settlement dates from c. 8200 to c. 6000 BC which could greatly revise views about the neolithic revolution.

The people who inhabited the site, I would suggest were the first to establish an irrigated settlement where they domesticated animals and grains and initially diffused this knowledge outward to the surrounding areas of the Jordan Valley, Syria and Turkey. The closest remains of an Adam and Eve that we'll find are probably represented by the painted skulls dug up at Tell Aswad by Danielle Stordeur. Who knows what is under the soil still however.

I agree that I should stick to the archaeology, and many trained in this field, like yourself will run a mile before looking seriously at any evidence tainted with religious suggestions about Eden. This seems a modern anomaly, and somewhat of a shame considering all the valuable discoveries of the last 2 centuries based on documentary evidence from the Bible, Armana tablets, etc.

I still consider these early creation myths as something that still needs a vast amount of work to improve our understanding and am quite cheered by the work on Sheep and grain, especially Black removing the deification of Lahar and Anshar. It shows that whilst O'Brien may have shot off on his own tangent, discovering what he discovered, modern scholars are catching up and improving on his suggestions in different ways and coming to similar, down to earth, agrarian interpretations without the gods, demons and evil spirits of the early translators.

Hopefully in depth coverage (as a pose to impossible to find translations in obscure Japanese journals like Acta Sumeriologica) on Misplaced Pages will encourage scholars to expand studies in this regard, so I still see it as valuable contribution along with the archaeology. Hope you agree. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 14:31, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Incidentally, if you can find another copy of the Bendt and Westenholz translation, I would be really grateful. Your old link to the PDF seems to have dissappeared with the creation of ORACC. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 14:44, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Ok. We know, or at least many scholars say, that the biblical myths in Genesis have earlier Sumerian sources, so finding new ones is not a terrible surprise. Dougweller (talk) 15:37, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Not a terrible surprise, but a rebalancing. The Sumerian creation myth, Epic of Gilgamesh and Atrahasis all cover similarities to the flood very well, and promote Velikovsky theories nicely in their own way. The Debate between sheep and grain, Barton Cylinder and any others I can make pages about from the Nippur library are the ones that specifically deal with Eden and earlier Genesis stories, which (in my view) are more important than the flood. Science is way behind conclusive evidence on catastrophism, but as Sarah Parcak is showing on BBC 1 on Monday night at 8.30pm, archaeology is not far off infra-red satellite photography detection of the remains of a massive neolithic ruins and underground streams in a basin just north of Mount Hermon. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 22:55, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Tell Halula

On 25 May 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tell Halula, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the first settlers of Tell Halula brought fully domesticated forms of wheat, barley and flax from somewhere else, circa 7750 BC? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 16:04, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

The Sumerian "debate literature"-"Short-Story"

This is a "Hello" ! ! message from the author of the Debate between bird and fish.
(i feel like a proud papa)-First, the top of my skull blew off when i found the "Debate between (mighty) copper and silver" in Kramer's book. (I retired from two decades of a Job-because of it). but, it surprised me that I had never heard of these short story debates, and that though I had turned pages, and read parts of Kramer's book probably 15-20 times, I had never hit upon the literature discussion of the debate with silver/copper.
Anyhow, my feelings are: Congrats, on carrying forward..... And my thoughts, philosophical, and moral are these: "Human expression" is where it is at.. all of the Customs, and Societal Norms are based on the "Position in Society" of the individual, group, family, etc.... My thoughts on the 'debates' are that: ... As in Ancient Egypt, the "Weighing of the Soul", balancing the Heart (hieroglyph), on one scale against the vertical "Feather of Truth", (Maat's Shu-Feather-(of Truth)). ---leads me to where I have been at philosophically, and personally, for some 2 decades or so.------
4000 years of religios 'crap', discussion, 'social-contract-norms', "god(s) created", 'dancings', chants, invocations, or 'public/private prayer-(s)', -- -- -- -- none of that 4000-years worth can out-balance 1 of these 7 Sumerian Disputations-(a created discussion of "human-relations-to-the-world"-(similar to Akhenaten's Great Hymn to the Aten). The fact that some guys (or girls) created these short storyies is a testament to our humanity.-(I don't "play" religion; wikipedia has Irreligion and Nonreligious, added to Atheism and Agnosticism-(i do Not define capital G, God, and the small 'gods' are all human creations (some in their likeness)...I don't play the religion/"god" game)
(I actually think Mark Zuckerburg, --Facebook, --creating, --dreams, --passions, -- -- -- that all of that is a testament to our humanity. Misplaced Pages, your follow-on articles, "Paul Bedson",... all a testament. (Of note, the Time Magazine article on Zuckerburg, explains how he at age 13 created a Network in his house for his Mom, Dad, Sister, etc. ....Wow, another, top of the skull blown off by what I read!))..
So, thanx, ...Welcome to Misplaced Pages, ... I hope to give a Star, or Cookie, (I have never given one)... you already, deserve 1 or 2, in my book.) Cheers... --(from the the HotSonoran Desert, Arizona,USA--Mmcannis (talk) 12:14, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

My thanks indeed for giving me the idea and template. Such kind and inspired praise gives me a lot of encouragement. I've been thinking to move van Dijk's discussion into the dispute sections of each one. I'll look into doing some other improvements and the Debate between copper and silver, but kinda had my eyes on the Debate between hoe and plough next in that series.

I have to take a break and do Enlil and Ninlil which is from the Miscellaneous Babylonian Inscriptions Nippur collection next. It's in a different series grouping as much as it's setting is noted as the same "Nippur before creation" as in the Debate between sheep and grain and Debate between Summer and Winter. I also have to go do something about Assad Seif, the head of archaeology at the Directorate General of Antiquities, who a friend in the Ministry of Culture (Lebanon) has just offered to be put in contact with. I somehow have to convince him that the setting for all these myths is the Anti-Lebanon, precisely a foothill (hursag), 8km north of Mount Hermon (kurgal) with a tell mound on top that could very well be the remains of Enlil's house-of-life (e-namtilla or e-kur) surrounded by a giant PPNB megasite with canal, a reservoir for winter water, etc. If that can get noted, a lot more people will quickly reach a similar mindset and outlook as you regarding "religion". Hopefully then we can answer questions like that posed in the section above about where the settlers of Tell Halula came from with their fully domesticated the forms of barley, wheat and flax at 7750 BC. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 13:17, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Debate between sheep and grain

On 31 May 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Debate between sheep and grain, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that Edward Chiera considered the setting of the Debate between sheep and grain (example of sheep pictured) to be the Babylonian Garden of Eden? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 08:05, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you, Paul Bedson, for your kind comments about my efforts writing and creating the new article The Kid (musical). Much appreciated. ;) There is a free-use image used in the article already, if you want to use that along with the hook, that is fine by me. I just thought there were probably more interesting free-use images to choose from with other articles' hooks, nature, wildlife, scenery, etc. -- Cirt (talk) 14:28, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Nuska

This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of Nuska, and it appears to include material copied directly from http://www.onuska.com.

It is possible that the bot is confused and found similarity where none actually exists. If that is the case, you can remove the tag from the article. The article will be reviewed to determine if there are any copyright issues.

If substantial content is duplicated and it is not public domain or available under a compatible license, it will be deleted. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material. You may use such publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. See our copyright policy for further details. (If you own the copyright to the previously published content and wish to donate it, see Misplaced Pages:Donating copyrighted materials for the procedure.) CorenSearchBot (talk) 12:22, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

• ROFL!!! The website you mention is entitled Matt and Cindy's Website, which I certainly didn't source when writing about the Sumerian scribe of the original Decad. Cute though, they look like a happy Enlil and Ninlil, but all relevance lost after that and certainly not a copyright issue. Gotta love bots though, they can cheer you up and make you laugh sometimes. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 12:25, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
  • Hahaha! This also made me laugh when I was working at WP:SCV. Theleftorium 14:22, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Debate between Winter and Summer DYK

Sorry to see how this one got stalled. I've started a more formal review of it, and everything looks good to me save one quotation which I'm having trouble finding in the source. See details at T:DYK. Excellent article! Khazar (talk) 14:06, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for that. I've corrected a page number issue on that reference that should have it sorted. Regards, Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 14:31, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Hymn to Enlil and Decad (Sumerian texts)

Hello! Your submission of Hymn to Enlil, Decad (Sumerian texts) at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! —David Eppstein (talk) 23:34, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Enlil and Ninlil

On 10 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Enlil and Ninlil, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the setting of Nippur in the Sumerian creation myth of Enlil and Ninlil has been noted as "civitas dei", existing before the "axis mundi" and the creation of man? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 00:02, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Debate between Winter and Summer

On 11 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Debate between Winter and Summer, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that Samuel Noah Kramer noted the Debate between Winter and Summer "is the closest extant Sumerian parallel to the Biblical Cain and Abel story"? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 06:04, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Lament for Ur, Ekur

Hello! Your submission of Lament for Ur, Ekur at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Thelmadatter (talk) 20:59, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

Please see new note on DYK talk page. Yoninah (talk) 22:41, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Song of the hoe

Hello! Your submission of Song of the hoe at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! --Elonka 17:36, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

FYI, awaiting your reply at the DYK entry regarding the hook. --Elonka 14:48, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Kesh temple hymn

On 14 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Kesh temple hymn, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Sumerian Kesh temple hymn (similar temple pictured) is one of the oldest texts? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 00:02, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Hymn to Enlil

On 14 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Hymn to Enlil, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Hymn to Enlil is part of a sequence of Sumerian scribal training scripts called the Decad? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:03, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Decad (Sumerian texts)

On 14 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Decad (Sumerian texts), which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Hymn to Enlil is part of a sequence of Sumerian scribal training scripts called the Decad? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:03, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Hubur

On 16 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Hubur, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Sumerian "river of paradise", the Hubur (pictured), derived partly from real geography before becoming a demonic fantasy? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:02, 16 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Lament for Ur

On 18 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Lament for Ur, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Lament for Ur which describes the fall of Ekur, c. 2000 BC, is similar in style to the Book of Lamentations which bewails the destruction of Jerusalem in the 6th century BC? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:02, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Ekur

On 18 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Ekur, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Lament for Ur which describes the fall of Ekur, c. 2000 BC, is similar in style to the Book of Lamentations which bewails the destruction of Jerusalem in the 6th century BC? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:03, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Garden of the gods (Sumerian paradise)

Hello! Your submission of Garden of the gods (Sumerian paradise) at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Drmies (talk) 15:27, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Song of the hoe

On 22 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Song of the hoe, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Song of the Hoe, a Sumerian creation myth, describes the construction projects of the Sumerian gods at the beginning of the universe? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 00:04, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Garden of the gods (Sumerian paradise)

On 27 June 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Garden of the gods (Sumerian paradise), which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that in the Epic of Gilgamesh, the hero travelled through the cedars near Mount Hermon in Lebanon (pictured) to find the Garden of the gods? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Calmer Waters 18:02, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Reply, (to editting)

I will try to be succinct, (not necessarily short):

1. --I love editting. I only fix a typo, or an edit if I want an article on my watch list. 98 percent are still on my watch list.
2. --at work once a compatriot had a hard copy, about 7 paragraphs of a hugely technical computer/ sound-(acoustic)/ software-trailer-mounted system for "scoring" a sound-produced event. (think weapons). The first paragraph was one sentence about 10 technical ideas strung together, about 5 sentences worth. I made 2 minor edits for the following 6 paragraphs, but I looked at my buddy, and said-(for para 1)... I get this with these edits to the mid paragraph point.... but from there i am lost. He said, yeah, i know.... I never looked at the final copy, but the Trailer appeared some years later.
3. --Edits to me, are like the BIG S, in Greek the Sigma-(i.e. Smmation: minor ones added to Major ones): I start at the first sentence, or words, and just continue...(or at midpoint, then go back to Start Point) and continue to the end. For the Song of the hoe, I didn't press SAVE, until between iteration 10 to 20, maybe about the 15th point, I added the last comma, or whatever.
4. --A quick look at the Gudea cylinders appears to confirm that: Graham Hancock... (his books, follow-on ideas) about the 'star alignments, with buildings is proof from the cylinders that the Great Pyramids,.. are (obviously, (by Deductive Observation, (reasoning), etc)), the three stars of Orion's Belt. (I will never read his books, though I turned pages in them. As with wikipedia, I seldom read EVERY article I edit.) (time)... (I assume Hancock wasn't the FIRST-person)
5. --I consider ALL of WIKIPEDIA, personal RESEARCH. all of the REF's are irrelevant (to me). Planet Earth-H. Sapies-humanitarium, is still coming out of the Dark Ages (of Religion, and fool-hardy interpretaions of our smarts)
6. --Paul, please explain the title on my talk page: (if you care to): == Fit like min (what like man) ==. I'm smart, (but not clairvoyant-smart)(I have only one guess what it means)
7. --I used to order the book at the Bookstore (B. & Noble), and have a shelf (1/4th filled with books on Egypt-(at the store), ...that I had at home). (the favorite was the (book), with the (now famous, color) Dashur-necklace encircling the 5 Hieroglyph-based small, miniature "pendants" where 1 of 5 was upside down. To view, the book had to be rotated 180 deg.).. (it's the Hotep "tablet", with hieroglyphs sitting on it instead).. (these are all beautifil, colorful, stone-inlaid pendants)
8. Charles R. Pellegrino's book from some years ago, Return to Sodom and Gomorah-(I read most of it once-(or twice): uses the term riverworlds referring to the Nile Egypt, and the Tigris-Euphrates-World... It explains why the cultures began at the same starting points.. (water), it also explains why they are so dramatically different in their typology, cosmology, etc. (Not Pellegrino's explanation: but using the term, easily defines the history from about 5500 BC to the Greek-Roman World time)

These are just 'notes to self', and as I started editting some of your articles, I knew you'd be examining my edits.... For what it is worth, on Misplaced Pages Commons I created, first: Category:Hieroglyphs on meda, then Category:Cuneiform on media. The Gudea cylinders photos have been there at least 2-3 years-(Category:Hieroglyphs on clay cylinders-(or whatever the cat name is).... And I had to go to commons to make the Cat: Category:Hieroglyphs of Egypt (check the Category:Meteor hieroglyph, and look at the stele in the Louvre).. that categorizing of Photos was needed before I worked on the Category:Egyptian hieroglyphs-Gardiner listed. Till later... (floating along in my own 'Edin')
And...thanks for giving me "grist for the mill", and how many more topics are on the clay tablets (it is pretty much endless, part of my quote: "you can't teach, what you don't know")...

DYK for Gudea cylinders

On 5 July 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Gudea cylinders, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the Gudea cylinders (pictured) are the longest literary composition ever found in the Sumerian language? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Calmer Waters 00:02, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Iraq ed-Dubb

Hello! Your submission of Iraq ed-Dubb at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Zoeperkoe (talk) 20:02, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

PS, Paul, I know about your "crusade" but sometimes you should try to remain a little bit more objective and precise in their interpretation, if I may say so (and please don't take offense, I think that in general you are doing a good job). Also, I get the impression that you paraphrase sources quite closely; you might want to work on that a little bit since sometimes it might border on plagiarism.--Zoeperkoe (talk) 20:02, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the good advice. Will try to be a bit more wordsmithy for you. Thinking objectively, this has given me several ideas to get better evidence for the levantine corridor primacy argument. I like the idea of a "crusade", thanks for giving me some guidance on better areas for the offensive. lol. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 20:28, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

You have new mail in your DYK submission. As far as "this has given me several ideas to get better evidence for the levantine corridor primacy argument", that's exactly the whole point. It's not up to you to find better evidence for one argument at the expense of another (at least not here on WP); it's up to you to say what others say about it, and to do that in such a way as to comply with wp:due. Please don't get carried away too much by your own enthusiasm! --Zoeperkoe (talk) 20:57, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

I am not trying to find better evidence, just updated, modern evidence. Much of which is not well documented on WP. I will try to remain balanced and reflect consensus though. You do well to remind me.Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 21:30, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Good comments. I'll also add that I think at times you are relying on Google snippets, which is rarely a good thing as you haven't seen the context, and that you need to keep closer to what the sources actually say. And Misplaced Pages is not a venue for presenting new information to the world - something I think you know you are trying to do. Dougweller (talk) 06:29, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

MfD nomination of User:Paul Bedson/Sandbox

User:Paul Bedson/Sandbox, a page you substantially contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Misplaced Pages:Miscellany for deletion/User:Paul Bedson/Sandbox and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of User:Paul Bedson/Sandbox during the discussion but should not remove the miscellany for deletion template from the top of the page; such a removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. Dougweller (talk) 06:41, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

But you can't delete my sandbox... It's my mind... It's what I am thinking... I'm not speaking it live on Misplaced Pages. You can't take my thoughts from me! *Runs to the window and shakes fist* Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 17:44, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

Your sandbox and some general advice

Hi Paul, you asked about my opinion on your sandbox. I only skimmed through it, but from what I saw I get the impression that you are pretty far out there if you want to connect Sumerian myths from the 3rd millennium BC with Lebanese sites from the 10th millennium BC and there is definitely no scientist who will support this. And that is not because there is some cover-up going on or because they are "bumbling" or "frightened" (which I actually consider quite an offense toward Near Eastern archaeologists; you have apparently no idea to what lengths they sometimes go to try and do their work in war-torn countries like Iraq and Lebanon in the past), but simply because it is not supported by the facts. To give another example, if you want to know the source of the Jordan River, don't go with some 19th century travel writer that happens to fit your ideas, but look up a modern hydrology report. Furthermore, if your aim is to save this "Aaiha site" from destruction, writing articles on WP isn't the way to go because it won't help a bit. Connecting it with Sumerian myths isn't either. I'm sorry, but Near Eastern rescue archaeology simply doesn't work that way. The WP article on Ur or Babylon hasn't saved them from getting destroyed after the Iraq war, and yours isn't going to save sites in Lebanon. That shouldn;t stop you from contributing to WP though, but you just have to be realistic about it.

In the meantime, I suggest you move ZAD 2 to Zahrat adh-Dhraʻ 2, because that's how the site is named. In your enthusiasm to generate as much information as possible, you make simple mistakes like these that can be avoided. Again, don't take offense, but I suggest that you take some more time to do more research before you start writing articles (or ask someone for advice before you start; you are not the only one who works on Near Eastern archaeology). Your output is so incredibly high that people like me or Doug simply can't keep up checking it. For example, you are involved in a merge discussion on Wall of Jericho, and I would actually like to suggest a merge for the Tower of Jericho as well (especially since both articles contain some factual errors and the astronomy thing simply doesn't make sense; there is not even an explanation as to why that shadow should be important in the first place and why it can't be simple coincidence which is very likely in a mountainous area like that), and you are already working on new ones. Instead, you might want to look at some of the articles you already wrote, and maybe re-edit them and check them for factual mistakes that might have arisen from you going through sources too quickly, or using Google Books snippets that do not provide the whole context of a quote? Again, I think it is great that you are so excited about Near Eastern prehistory, and in general your work is good, but it's these little things that could be better. Given the quantity you've already produced, shouldn't it be time that you start to work on quality and factuality a little bit more?

Again, please don't take offense at my comments. You are of course free to do what you want (and again, I think it's really great that you want to invest so much time in improving coverage of the ancient Near East on WP), but since you asked for my opinion; this is it. Happy editing! --Zoeperkoe (talk) 05:11, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

• Thanks for your opinion. I am quite impressed that you bothered and will go and remove the bumbling comment right away. It has raised the issue of transmission of history using language, which we have different perspectives about and I clearly don't consider so "far out there". The site at Aaiha could have existed until around 6000 to 5500 BC before a hiatus in time when the Sumerians arrived at Eridu. I can see how it is viewed as radical as there is no evidence that we would have passed down our history via language and will look for sources that have explored this suggestion. I will take your comments under consideration on the mythology matter. Regarding the astronomy, they positioned it that way in my opinion for ceremonial purposes. You have to imagine their ceremonies to understand the purpose. I guess that's not very scientific though. Check out the video in the Jerusalem Post article, it explains all with computer graphics and media hype. I don't think you can merge the tower as it qualifies as the world's tallest structure between 8000 to 2650 BC. The wall is still under discussion but I should hope my latest expansion should qualify it for it's own page. I'll concede you're right about Zahrat adh-Dhraʻ 2 and will go move that. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 05:47, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

• P.S. A modern hydrology report would show fissures through the karst limestone topography from the Hasbani leaking the mountain water into the Litani and off into the Mediterranean sea, just as it leaks from Aaiha into the Hasbani. No-one's in a rush to fix that of course as Lebanon might as well take the water away from the Israelis before it gets to the Jordan as they will only use their west bank aquifier to take it away from the Palestinians if it got there. This greedy world somehow stole my pictures and video of the site and left me with nothing more than a rock and my words and information on here to alert the academic community with. I understand your skepticism about the effectiveness of my efforts but thank you again for all the assistance tidying up after me and helping me try.Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 06:07, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Iraq ed-Dubb

On 11 July 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Iraq ed-Dubb, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the earliest evidence for domesticated wheat and barley comes from Iraq ed-Dubb in Jordan and dates to the mid-10th millennium BC? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Thanks for helping the Did You Know project Victuallers (talk) 08:02, 11 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Hatula

On 20 July 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Hatula, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that evidence for domesticated dogs between 10,150 and 9320 BC has been found at Hatula in modern-day Israel? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 16:04, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Barnstar of Diligence
	For providing a great coverage of ancient moments and sites from Lebanon to Cornwall. Keep it up! ♦ Dr. Blofeld 19:57, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Tower of Jericho

On 21 July 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tower of Jericho, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the shadow of nearby mountains first hit the Tower of Jericho on the sunset of the summer solstice and then spread across the entire proto-city in c. 8000 BCE? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 00:04, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Re: A kitten for you

Why thank you! :) Looks like you do alot of awesome work as well. --User:Woohookitty 01:19, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

Heavy Neolithic

Because DYK has a new system for nominating articles (as detailed in the yellow edit notice that appears when you edit T:TDYK), your nomination for Heavy Neolithic was not submitted properly. I have fixed it for you, but in the future please be careful to review the new instructions. Basically all there is to it is

1. Create the nomination on its own subpage
2. Add the nomination subpage to T:TDYK

If you've ever nominated articles at WP:AFD, you'll find this process very similar. rʨanaɢ (talk) 02:07, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

• Thanks for this. I saw it had changed, but didn't read up on how and was in a rush to meet the deadline on it so just did it the old way. I'll be sure to nominate according to procedure in future. Thanks for fixing that and filling me in on the info. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 02:47, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Heavy Neolithic

On 1 August 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Heavy Neolithic, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that Gigantolithic tools may predate agriculture? You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Panyd 16:33, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

License tagging for File:Heavyneolithicsteepscraper.jpg

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License tagging for File:Heavyneolithicscraper.jpg

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Possibly unfree File:Orangeslice.jpg

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Upload your free media to Commons, please!

It is better if your free images can be uploaded to Wikimedia Commons as opposed to Misplaced Pages. Freely licensed or public domain media are more accessible to other Wikimedia projects if placed on Commons. Thank you: Jay8g (talk) 22:23, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Ourrouar

Please refrain from introducing inappropriate pages, such as Ourrouar, to Misplaced Pages. Doing so is not in accordance with our policies. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, contest the deletion by clicking on the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion". Doing so will take you to the talk page where you will find a pre-formatted place for you to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. You can also visit the the page's talk page directly to give your reasons, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines. Calabe1992 (talk) 15:07, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

• Please don't delete Ourrouar, it was a tool factory site for Aaiha, the capital of the Qaraoun culture during the early holocene and hence very important educational material for the billions of jewish, christian and muslim kids out there who currently believe that God built the Garden of Eden. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 00:19, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

What is this?

Just wondering, what is this? — Kudu  20:09, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

• This is me figuring out a way to teach everyone about where the Garden of Eden is via the Aaiha Hypothesis whilst evading the corporate constraints of not being able to log in on a PC for fifty hours every week. Paul Bedson ❉talk❉ 00:24, 25 August 2011 (UTC)