Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 23:31, 13 January 2012

Warning: active arbitration remedies The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to the Arab–Israeli conflict, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article: You must be logged-in and extended-confirmed to edit or discuss this topic on any page (except for making edit requests, provided they are not disruptive) You may not make more than 1 revert within 24 hours on any edits related to this topic Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Misplaced Pages, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. Further information The exceptions to the extended confirmed restriction are: Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive. Non-extended-confirmed editors may not create new articles, but administrators may exercise discretion when deciding how to enforce this remedy on article creations. Deletion of new articles created by non-extended-confirmed editors is permitted but not required. With respect to the WP:1RR restriction: Clear vandalism of whatever origin may be reverted without restriction. Also, reverts made solely to enforce the extended confirmed restriction are not considered edit warring. Editors who violate this restriction may be blocked by any uninvolved administrator, even on a first offence. After being warned, contentious topics procedure can be used against any editor who repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Misplaced Pages, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process. Contentious topic sanctions can include blocks, topic-bans, or other restrictions. Editors may report violations of these restrictions to the Arbitration enforcement noticeboard. If you are unsure if your edit is appropriate, discuss it here on this talk page first. When in doubt, don't revert!

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Arab Spring article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Article policies Neutral point of view No original research Verifiability

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14Auto-archiving period: 2 months

This article is a current featured article candidate. A featured article should exemplify Misplaced Pages's best work, and is therefore expected to meet the criteria. Please feel free to initiate the nomination. Also edit here and add {{Misplaced Pages:Featured article candidates/Arab Spring/archive1}} to the top of the list. After one of the FAC coordinators promotes the article or archives the nomination, a bot will update the nomination page and article talk page. Do not manually update the {{Article history}} template when the FAC closes.

This article has not yet been rated on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Arab world High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Arab world, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the Arab world on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Arab worldWikipedia:WikiProject Arab worldTemplate:WikiProject Arab worldArab world High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Africa Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Africa, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Africa on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.AfricaWikipedia:WikiProject AfricaTemplate:WikiProject AfricaAfrica Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Western Asia High‑importance This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Western Asia, which collaborates on articles related to Western Asia. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the project page for more details.Western AsiaWikipedia:WikiProject Western AsiaTemplate:WikiProject Western AsiaWestern Asia High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Politics Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Sociology: Social Movements Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Sociology, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of sociology on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SociologyWikipedia:WikiProject SociologyTemplate:WikiProject Sociologysociology Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. This article is supported by the social movements task force. Military history: African / Middle East This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status: Referencing and citation: criterion met Coverage and accuracy: criterion not met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met Associated task forces: /  African military history task force Middle Eastern military history task force

This page is not a forum for general discussion about Arab Spring. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about Arab Spring at the Reference desk.

The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information.

Template:Pbneutral

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

A news item involving Arab Spring was featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the In the news section on Error: Invalid time..

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Arab Spring article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Article policies Neutral point of view No original research Verifiability

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14Auto-archiving period: 2 months

Template:Rtne

Bahrain

The text of the Bahrain section does not concur with the sources used to justify it. At the end of the first paragraph of the Bahrain section states: "On 14 March, at the request of the Crown Prince, GCC Saudi Arabian troops entered the country, and opened fire on the protesters, several of whom were killed." In the next paragraph, it states: "On 16 March 2011, the protesters' camp in the Pearl Roundabout was evacuated, bulldozed, and set on fire by the Bahraini Defense Force, riot police, and the Peninsula Shield Force, the military arm of the Gulf Cooperation Council, which intervened reportedly at King Hamad's behest." The articles cited do not support either sentence. They make no claims that Saudi troops were definitely part of the group that opened fire on protestors nor that they were involved in bulldozing the Pearl Monument. Additionally, none of the articles support the (probably true, but still unsourced) claim that the Crown Prince of Bahrain requested the Saudi troops. Finally, there is no evidence in these citations that supports the statement that King Hamad requested either the Saudi intervention in general (though that claim makes sense) nor their participation in razing the protestors' camps. If no one objects, I will change the first sentence to read:

"On 14 March, presumably at the request of the Bahraini government, over 1,000 Saudi Arabian troops entered the country. Operating under the aegis of the Gulf Cooperation Council's Peninsula Shield Force (PSF) the Saudi troops moved to protect Bahraini government facilities. There is no evidence that the Saudi troops fired on protestors, although there were rumors of a PSF operation against the protestors. The United Arab Emirates sent 500 police officers to assist Bahraini efforts.."

I will change the second to read: "On 16 March, the Bahraini Defense Force evacuated, bulldozed, and set fire to the protestors' camp at the Pearl Roundabout, killing at least three."

If anyone can provide sources that support any of the original claims, I'll gladly support leaving them intact.

Israel?

The Arab Spring (Arabic: الربيع العربي‎; also known as the Arabic Rebellions or the Arab Revolutions) ... major protests in Israel, Algeria, Iraq, ...

I knew it! Sooner or later, the Arabs say: Welcome Israel!

But .... Israel is an Arab country? Ayeff (talk) 11:49, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Why does Israel mentioned in here? It's not an arab state and the conflict or the mentioned 2-day event held on may in the syrian border is not related to the Arad Spring what so ever. You can't really put in the same page what's going on Egypt, Syria or Libya and the conflict in Israel (which is not related to the arab spring). This is Huge Bias to put it here. 217.132.187.49 (talk) 21:23, 21 October 2011 (UTC).

I don't know about bias, but there's nothing really Arab Spring-related going on in Israel, even if it had some of its Arab citizens protesting about the Gilad Shalit deal in some way. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 23 Tishrei 5772 21:58, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Hahaha! If I'm a very bias towards the Jews I believe they say Israel is their homeland for Jews. This is a very general fact that Israel is NOT AN Arab country. It was majority Jewish. This goes same thing to Iran and Afghanistan whereby because they are Muslims or placed under Middle East, it does not mean is an Arab country. 60.49.62.246 (talk) 10:34, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Israel is under Impact of the Arab Spring 60.49.62.246 (talk) 03:42, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

It's not Israel that's included, it's its border. The Palestinian protests for independence. EkoGraf (talk) 03:16, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Israel is under impact? so is north korea, why don't we just put it in there?Philoleb (talk) 21:45, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Lebanon Casualities

I think we should point out the fact the lebanese casualities came from clashes between various segment of the population and were not governement relatedPhiloleb (talk) 19:00, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

No need to post this three times. Do you have a specific article or quote to support that? Jeancey (talk) 20:24, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Well the articles that are cited #63 and 64 claim that the casualities come from sunni alaouite clashes, thatarest warrants have bee issued, and that the lebanese army was sent to restore order... Philoleb (talk) 02:31, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

and where was this posted three times?? Philoleb (talk) 02:26, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

I deleted the other two of them. Jeancey (talk) 03:18, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

"Strategy of tension"

After initially trying to copyedit it into grammatical English, I've now completely removed a sentence referring to the Arab Spring as a form of the strategy of tension. This is massively POV, with the suggestion that it is some kind of Western plot, and completely unsupported by the cite given after the sentence below. If people are going to add stuff like this, it needs be cited as an opinion, fully attributed to who is saying it, and to come with cite to reliable sources that confirm this. -- The Anome (talk) 00:48, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

I notice that the massively POV-pushing "strategy of tension" stuff has been re-added by User:188.29.93.221, which seems to be a one-off use of the IP just for this purpose, by someone who is already familiar with Misplaced Pages's editing tools. However, since my previous removal of it was less that 24 hours ago, the 1RR rule applying to this article prevents me from removing it again. -- The Anome (talk) 23:42, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Interesting. Taking a look at the history of the "strategy of tension" article, there seems to be one particular editor that likes to edit both (and only) this article and the strategy of tension article, from a variety of IP addresses all in the same range. I haven't yet been able to dig out all the occasions when this phrase has been added to this article, but I'm beginning to suspect this may be one single editor at work. -- The Anome (talk) 02:14, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

And they're back, this time as user:188.29.143.137. This is clearly a single-issue editor, working from a variety of IPs, pushing a highly offensive POV, completely unsupported by any citation. Since they are editing in a hit-and-run fashion from ever-changing IP addresses, there's no way to discuss this with them, and I suspect that they will keep on re-adding this stuff forever, unless something happens to prevent it. -- The Anome (talk) 12:51, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

Here are some of the recent appearances of edits from this IP range that have also edited strategy of tension:

• User:188.29.143.137 (15 November) -- also edited the Arab Spring article
• User:188.29.93.221 (14 November) -- also edited the Arab Spring article
• User:188.28.27.6 (10 November)
• User:188.29.13.10 (8 November) -- also edited the Arab Spring article
• User:188.28.190.152 (7 November)
• User:188.28.174.151 (7 November)
• User:188.28.37.134 (7 November)

-- The Anome (talk) 13:23, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

I have left a message on the talk page of one of the IPs involved, just on the off-chance that it is a misguided beginner that is behind all this. If the behaviour of edit-warring and complete lack of communication continues, then it is clearly disruptive, and it would be time to take it to WP:AN/I to get some sanctions put in place against this editor. --Saddhiyama (talk) 13:35, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

They are already back at it again. --Saddhiyama (talk) 13:49, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

I note that they are editing from an IP address range assigned to Hutchison 3G UK Ltd, who run the "3" network in the UK; this means they are likely to be doing this via a 3G mobile internet dongle. -- The Anome (talk) 13:55, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

They are doing it again. This time from User:188.29.52.67 and User:188.28.250.208. Jeancey (talk) 21:49, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

Maybe we should keep the Strategy of tension stuff as an opinion, this source clearly mentions it as a technique used in the Arab spring. P.S: I've requested semi-protection for the page. --Tachfin (talk) 22:00, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps. But this particular source mentions it in passing in relation to something else, not weighty enough to include in the lead. With some better sourcing (and of course worded to reflect it is an opinion) it could be included in the main text somewhere. --Saddhiyama (talk) 22:06, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

I think the main problem is that they keep simply adding it, and they won't ever discuss to come to consensus about it. Jeancey (talk) 22:07, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

I agree, definitely not in the lead. I've done some research and the site mentioned above is pretty much the only one that makes that claim; the odd thing is that "strategy of tension" in this case would've been used by the regimes and not the protesters. Though, on the larger scale, one can theorize that world powers used it to persuade public opinion. But that is only OR or fringe theories, the lack of sources on this is the main issue. Tachfin (talk) 22:20, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

The material clearly does not belong here -- it fails both WP:FRINGE and WP:OR.However, the main issue here is no longer the material, it's the editor's unwillingness to participate in Misplaced Pages's conflict resolution procedures. If the editor in qusetion continues to refuse to heed requests for discussion on this, I suggest either that this page be semiprotected to prevent further editing from IPs, thus forcing them to register an account. or that a rangeblock be requested for the two /16s they've been editing from, or, if that's too draconian, further editing of this page be blocked from that range of bare IPs using the edit filter. - - The Anome (talk) 21:24, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

The page has been protected now, I believe. Jeancey (talk) 21:35, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

So it has! -- The Anome (talk) 21:56, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

The Anome, I agree with you regarding this IP-editor. But unfortunately my ANI report on the user was archived with no admin attention whatsoever. I will still patrol this and the other article, but the lack of attention from admins regarding this case is not exactly encouraging. --Saddhiyama (talk) 23:13, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Change form Israel to occupied palestine

WE are in the context of the arab spring, it is thus more reasonable to refer to the the palestine/ israel region as occupid palestine.Philoleb (talk) 05:54, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

No, we're not doing that. Massive WP:POV issue there. -Kudzu1 (talk) 05:57, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

How is not POV to put Israel when we are talking about Palestinians? If my knowledge is correct, it is palestinians that are protesting at the borders of what they call occupied palestine/territories.Philoleb (talk) 06:05, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

It doesn't matter what they call it. The name of the country is Israel. It's a member state of the United Nations. -Kudzu1 (talk) 06:11, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

It doesnt matter what the UN calls it what matters is that we are in the context of the arab spring, with palestinian demonstrators. If there was unrest in the West Bank what would we have written? Its not a recognised country at the UN... What about western sahara? To my knowledge this is in Morroco according to the UN... if you want we can take out the flag like we did for western saharaPhiloleb (talk) 06:16, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

So, you undid the change, I don't understand why?Philoleb (talk) 21:18, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Actually, I undid the change. There is a discussion going on. You shouldn't change the topic of the discussion in the middle of the discussion. Wait for consensus to emerge before you change it. If there is no consensus, they you don't change it. Jeancey (talk) 21:21, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I explained my reasoning: It doesnt matter what the UN calls it what matters is that we are in the context of the arab spring, with palestinian demonstrators. If there was unrest in the West Bank what would we have written? Its not a recognised country at the UN... What about western sahara? To my knowledge this is in Morroco according to the UN... if you want we can take out the flag like we did for western sahara. I think thats valid to enough to call it occupied territories...Philoleb (talk) 21:27, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

The difference is, the Palestinian-Israeli conflict is a significantly charged issue. Calling it Occupied Palestinian Territories make its non NPOV because it puts us on the OTHER side of the issue. Using Israel Borders IS NPOV because we are using the designation of a neutral party, in this case the UN, in order to describe it. It doesn't matter about the context of the arab spring. We don't call the US the east in china related articles simply because it is in the "context of china". Jeancey (talk) 21:32, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

You do not refer to the us as the west because the west encompasses much more than just the us. Then if this is our reasonning, there should be no western sahara column. I think it is more NPOV to put borders of occupied palestinian territories, the arab league refers to it that way, and the arab league is neutral and more knowledgable about middle-eastern affairs.Philoleb (talk) 21:39, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Actually the arab league is extremely Non NPOV in this case, as they side entirely with the palestinian side of the argument. Using the Arab League declaration wouldn't be neutral in any way. Jeancey (talk) 21:43, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

But the UN is?? what about the partition plan (resolution 181) that's not very neutral... what about America's enormous influence in the UN and the securtiy concil... its not a very NPOV... why dont we put borders of israel/occupied palestine? Philoleb (talk) 21:48, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

The Security council is NOT the entirety of the UN. Honestly I think if it was put to a general assembly vote, Palestine would be recognized. Until that happens, the UN recognizes that area as being part of Israel. The US and the UN have been trying to work out a deal between Israel and Palestine for years, with little success mainly due to Israel. I'm not trying to take sides on this, I'm trying to point out the most neutral wording, which is using the UN recognized state, and the specific part of that state. We aren't going to reach consensus with just the two of us, so I suggest we just hold off and wait for more people to come and comment and add more points of view. Jeancey (talk) 21:53, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Actually putting the Israeli flag for stuff that happened in the Golan heights seems POV. I previously thought that Israel's entry was about the protests that occurred in Tel Aviv, but since it's about the Golan heights (which is recognized as an occupied territory by the U.N or if you hate the term "Occupy", is at least disputed) there should be no flag there. Or it should be included in Syria's entry since the protests happened from the Syrian side to which the Israeli army responded with fire. Nothing inside Israel proper happened a part from the Tel Aviv demonstrations last summer, which it seems, are not considered part of the Arab spring. Tachfin (talk) 21:58, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Ok, so let us not put israel, but occupied golan height or delete israel and include that protest in syria section like Tachfin suggested Philoleb (talk) 22:01, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Removing the flag seems to be an acceptable compromise. If we remove the flag and leave it as Israeli border clashes. Jeancey (talk) 22:02, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

I think saying Golan height border is better, saying israel border, ignores the fact that the protesters came from syria, but saying syria borders ignores the fact that the soldiers came from the occupied territories... Golan Height is the best compromisePhiloleb (talk) 22:05, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Are the protests in the Israel border regions located ONLY in the Golan Heights region? If this is the case, then Golan Heights clashes might be best. Avoid the word Occupied though. Jeancey (talk) 22:09, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Essentially, and i think Occupied Golan Height is correct according to the United nation: United Nations Security Council Resolution 242 declared the Golan Heights an Israeli occupied territoryPhiloleb (talk) 22:13, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

UNSCR242 was in 1967... according to the article on the topic, Israel withdrew from the area in the 1990s even to the point of the Israeli President at the time saying that Golan Heights belonged to Syria. This might not be the current status of the area, but 242 is definitely NOT current enough to base anything off of. Jeancey (talk) 22:17, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

The wikipedia article about israeli occupied territories says the golan is occupied... and the article on the golan height says that the resolution 242 still applies...Philoleb (talk) 22:21, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

I think that in this case, Golan Height Clashes is the MOST neutral. Adding in Occupied seems to me to be pushing a point of view. There were clashes, and they happened in the Golan Heights. Calling this Occupied implies that israel is in the wrong to even be there, and while it might be the case, it doesn't really effect whether or not there clashes. It is likely that if it was solely controlled by Syria there would STILL be clashes in the area. Jeancey (talk) 22:27, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Sure so lets change Border of israel to Golan Height?Philoleb (talk) 22:28, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Golan Heights Clashes? With no flag whatsoever? Just Golan Heights in the table though. But in the subsection on it, clashes. Jeancey (talk) 22:30, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

PerfectPhiloleb (talk) 22:34, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

I'm new to wikipedia, sorry i screwed up the tablePhiloleb (talk) 22:42, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

No worries, I fixed it. Jeancey (talk) 22:45, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Is the Countries collapsible in the Golan Heights row intentional (or necessary)? It overlays part of the cell text on lower resolutions (1024 width and possibly 1280 as well, observed on IE8). Is it relevant to the table or should it be put somewhere else? If the former, can it be fixed in some way to not cause overlaid text? TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 01:04, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

I wasn't sure if that was part of it either, so i left it alone. If it's not, it can probably be removed. Jeancey (talk) 01:34, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

You guys can say in details something like "Golan heights boarders which have been occupied by Israel since.." ignoring the fact that this area have been occupied by Israel might give a wrong idea about why these people were demonstrating there. I believe ignoring this fact is a POV. Bahraini Activist (talk) 05:25, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I noticed it already says that in details. Bahraini Activist (talk) 05:29, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Actually, from what I have read, that ISN'T the reason why they are protesting, atleast not directly. They are protesting for the same reason as everyone else, the people in charge aren't doing the will of the people, they are just helping themselves. It's unlikely that any of the people in the area who could be in charge would have the same result. It's not just because it is israel. Jeancey (talk) 05:34, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I removed the Golan Height and the Western Sahara from the Summary of Protests by Country section because they were not countries. They are territories. 60.49.56.153 (talk) 02:38, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

I've restored them and note that there is a 1RR restriction in place on this article. Golan Heights and the Israeli border disputes have been listed without a specific country being mentioned because both areas are heavily disputed and the most neutral approach Misplaced Pages can take is to not get involved in placing POV labels on territorial disputes. The information is nonetheless appropriate for the table despite this minor technicality. TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 23:55, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

I disagree of what you said. If so, then why wasn't the Palestinian territories are also part of what you said? It's also a dispute territory between Israelis and the Palestinians, although currently controlled by Israel. And wrong, the information is illegitimate to put Western Sahara and Golan Heights (Israeli border area whatever you like to call) as a country since there are disputes between two countries. If there's no fix ownership then I have to remove it. Besides, if you wanna check Israeli border, one can check the Israeli border through this place and also the Western Sahara in this place too Arab_Spring#Others. 60.49.56.180 (talk) 02:00, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

The Palestinian territories aren't listed in the table. You can see the process and discussion that was used to gain consensus on this issue in this very section. I understand that you disagree, but there are more people than you that support these places being listed in this way at the moment and that is what we use for determining whether we do something or not. If you want this changed, you need to change consensus by convincing people that the change is a good one. At the moment that's not the case. TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 22:25, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

However, this is not about the Palestinian territories. The Nabkah day suicides took place not only in the Golan Heights, but the Lebanon/Galilee border, which is only considered "Occupied Palestine" if you don't accept the existence of Israel or the Jews at all.Ericl (talk) 14:43, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

Syrian situation deteriorating and "civil war" term is used

Editors are welcome to discuss it here.Greyshark09 (talk) 22:47, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

News Update

Hey, guys. I just heard something about the Sudanese opposition is trying to form a coalition to topple Omar al-Bashir. On the other hand, protesters just stormed Kuwait parliament. Somebody should keep an eye for these infamous Arab revolt countries. Thank you. 60.49.57.195 (talk) 14:38, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Cleanup blog refs

After a quick glance at the refs I see some blogs used in citations (e.g. Global voices), don't know how much there is of them so I'm gonna be removing those and other self-published material per WP:BLOGS. (P.S: This does not apply to blogs of respectable media e.g. Guardian, Aljazeera etc)--Tachfin (talk) 18:14, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Libyan flag

Hello, people! Who are the vandal's news that hasn't updated such that the Libyan flag has already been changed? Why is the flag reverted to the old Libyan Arab Jamahiriya flag? Change that flag back now! The UN membership already confirms the Kingdom of Libya flag as the legitimate flag already! Do not use the green flag as the current one. Thank you.

60.48.195.249 (talk) 04:54, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

•  Done. Yeah it was vandalism... no idea how that got by. good catch! Jeancey (talk) 05:02, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks. Actually I was looking at the Summary of protests by country country section. My thoughts were that if this is all about country, then why is both Golan Heights and the Western Sahara are considered countries? Golan Heights (Israeli border whatever) is actually a territory, not countries. The same as the Western Sahara. 60.48.195.249 (talk) 05:23, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

 Not done That was not vandalism, see lengthy discussion above. The war started and happened in the old libya, not the current one. Putting the new flag for events that happened in February is an anachronism. Tachfin (talk) 06:21, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Makes sense. I compare it the same way as World War II belligerent flags as well as the Six-Days War. Thanks for reminding that. 118.100.70.240 (talk) 11:13, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Egypt again a site of major protests and clashes

Any changes needed to the map? The bigger question is is this a summary map (as it is now) or ongoing events map (most countries quiet, with current violence in Syria, Yemen and Egypt and minor protests in Jordan, Kuwait?Greyshark09 (talk) 12:14, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

33 dead 1750 wounded! anyway, is it correct to qualify egypt as a revolution already, after all Mubarak handed over power to his budy of 20 years... and if the protesters manage to overthrow the miliatry council: is this a revolution^2 ;). should we revert it to uprising... I read a bbc article saying the revolution was not over, im not sure if revolution is when the governement is finally overthrown or the process...Philoleb (talk) 05:44, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

The colors represent the status of the pre-AS governments. Egypt/Libya/Tunisia are all colored in darkest blue because almost everyone agrees that their pre-AS govt's were overthrown; what happens after that has no bearing on the map. 48Lugur (talk) 06:24, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

We may need to revisit the color scheme if the Egyptian SCAF is forced to leave power, as that will arguably be two separate revolutions. Until then, I don't think any changes are necessary. -Kudzu1 (talk) 06:57, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

I've created this map splitting Egypt between the Mubarak gov't ("Government Overthrown") and the SCAF gov't ("Protests and governmental changes"). What do you guys think? 48Lugur (talk) 07:07, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

I don't like it, personally. It's too confusing. At first, somebody might think, "Wait, so the government was only overthrown in western Egypt?" We've experimented with stripes in the past, but the consensus back then was that they were just too busy in the visual sense. -Kudzu1 (talk) 07:38, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

No, I disagree of what you mention about revisit the color scheme. Let me ask you a question, so if the Tunisian Prime Minister Ghannouchi resigns, will you do the same thing? I guess not. The same when Saif al-Islam were captured in Libya. A dictator overthrown is consider a final one. Do not revise it again. The Government Overthrown is the last one. Arab Spring is either all about total change or just demand for governmental changes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 118.100.70.11 (talk) 08:31, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

PS: Some people have refer to The Economist Arab Spring map, but here in this CNN International, its also a good map showing the coverage in the Arab World:
http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2011/arab.unrest/ 118.100.70.11 (talk) 08:45, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Appropriate Colors for the Arab Spring Map

On the map, I think it's appropriate to have reasons for why a color for a type of situation is chosen. It appears that blue symbolizes freedom. The countries with the darker blue were able to gain to more freedom and change. Red/Orange on the other hand should symbolize blood. The more red a country, the more violence is occurring in that nation.

Using that logic, then Yemen, Syria, and Bahrain should have a reddish color on the map, because those countries are currently having the relatively high rates of sustained violence.--Futuretrillionaire (talk) 02:32, 22 November 2011 (UTC)Futuretrillionaire

Yemeni Uprising or Revolution?

Saleh signed the deal agreeing to transfer of powers today, so does that mean Yemen qualifies for a "revolution"? If so, then the article needs to be renamed and the map given the appropriate colours.--ERAGON (talk) 17:22, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

"Uprising" still seems to be WP:COMMON. Wouldn't be shocking if that changes after Saleh actually leaves power (assuming he plays by the rules) on 23 December. I say we keep it at "uprising" for now. -Kudzu1 (talk) 17:24, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Agreed, stick to uprising for now. --ERAGON (talk) 18:58, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Can we change the color of Yemen to dark blue (revolution) on the map ? --Xijky (talk) 22:18, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps we could have Yemen with dark blue and normal blue stripes, because Saleh has officially signed a third-party agreement to step down, but has not officially announced his resignation. 48Lugur (talk) 23:50, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Well, I edited the map to mark Yemen as "Government overthrown". Is that OK for now? 48Lugur (talk) 02:49, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Does it counts as overthrown if Saleh wilfuly departs from power?Philoleb (talk) 04:15, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

He's complaining about the protests being a "coup", so I don't know if I'd call it willful. But he hasn't left power, so I don't think these changes are appropriate. -Kudzu1 (talk) 04:22, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Kudzu is right. Why is Yemen already black? Because he signs the power transfer deal does not mean its the end of his 33 year rule. He stills has 30 days left to step down.

OK, I changed the map and table back. I've still got the map with a black Yemen if it needs to be changed. 48Lugur (talk) 05:38, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

60.49.60.182 (talk) 04:44, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

The map changed back to Uprising, but why the Summary of Protests by Country still black? I saw many of the media sources says that "Saleh agrees to step down", which he actually did not step down at all. Who knows at the last minute Saleh will still back away once again? We need to hear his official annoucement (or at least his Vice-President or other important figures) of his hereby resignation. So please do not place it as "Government Overthrown". 118.100.70.11 (talk) 08:07, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

About Yemen

Guys from Misplaced Pages I have a Question: So Saleh sign the deal which means officially he will transfer all his powers to his Vicepresident so he can work to create a Transitional goverment with the opposition, that will be like in December 23.So when that date comes, we can talk about a Revolution??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.29.154.113 (talk) 17:44, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

The Yemen Post publisher and editor-in-chief Hakim Almasmari once quoted "Tactics are now being gathered by President Saleh to ensure that the power transfer signing only results in more ink on useless paper." To be honest, the GCC deal doesn't really deals anything. Even if Saleh signs it, Saleh still can break his promise by retaining his power. This is not bias but people in the past has usually done that. I'm quite doubful that after these 30 days he will be automatically step down. So even with that, we cannot verify a revolution (or Government Overthrown), unless the Yemeni ruling leaders announce his resignation just like Tunisia's Ben Ali (Prime Minister announces Ben Ali's flees to Saudi Arabia) and Egypt's Mubarak (His vice-president announces Mubarak resignation). Until then, Uprising is still the most common to be used for Yemen. 60.48.196.16 (talk) 03:27, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Bahrain

Bahrain should be "Sustained civil disorder and governmental changes" (like in the summary) or "Protests and governmental changes" (like in the map)? At least, the CNN considers Bahrain a situation similar to Yemen and Syria.--81.84.110.142 (talk) 03:37, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

It's definitely Sustained civil disorder and governmental changes. After the Bahrain Independent Commission of Inquiry released it's report yesterday which accused the government of wide spread violence and systematic torture there might be some root changes here in Bahrain. At the same day few hours before the report, a man got killed and clashed occurred in the town where he died (see Aljazeera report). The CNN explanation for the categorization can be seen here. It's clear enough to me that Bahrain fits as "Sustained civil disorder and governmental changes". The map needs to be changed. Bahraini Activist (talk) 19:04, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Trend worth mentioning

How/where to add it? I've seen several op/eds (e.g. this) about how 1.) the Arab Spring has opened the door for Islamists in formerly secular Arab strongman states and 2.) the West needs to accept this as the will of the people. The latter point is a bit POV, but the former is certainly empirical and should be assessed in this article briefly (per summary style) and in more detail elsewhere. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 21:52, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Kuwait's status?

The country has witnessed its largest political protests ever, there's been violence between demonstrators and security forces, and now the government has resigned: I think it's time to give the 2011 Kuwaiti protests their own page. -Kudzu1 (talk) 17:24, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

• Support - clearly notable.Greyshark09 (talk) 18:59, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
• Support - Shouldn't be upgraded? --Smart (talk) 05:46, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

Done. Article probably needs some work, but I'm slammed in RL and I'd appreciate someone else stepping in. Might help to know Arabic. -Kudzu1 (talk) 06:23, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

• Strong support — Kuwait is experiencing major protests relating to government corruption. It should absolutely have its own page. Master&Expert (Talk) 10:42, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Page reform?

Their are various sources including BBC and CNN claiming that Syria maybe inching closer to civil war. Maybe we should change the syrai to red for civil war.

Maybe we should define civil war as any country with a rebel army and government fighting the mainstream army and government.

What about a new map with a more fluid color...

Has anyone thought about posting death rates in the maps.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-15769804 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-15149133 http://www.newsfeedcentre.co.uk/sky/world-news/un-syria-in-civil-war-as-deaths-exceed-4000/ http://news.yahoo.com/un-syria-state-civil-war-163757327.html http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/01/us-syria-un-rights-idUSTRE7B01M720111201

Here are some base images that are free to use:

Danalm000 (talk) 02:49, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

I agree with defining Syria as a country in civil war, however there is really no need to list death rates of any sort.

Scruce (talk) 20:16, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

I have no very good paint skills and have never done formating in my occasional edits or i'd do it myself but i agree syria is in civil war... or is extremely close... in the last 2 weeks there have been multiple attacks on loyalist forces by the FSA, many casualties.96.50.10.234 (talk) 08:42, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

• The term "civil war" is not yet ubiquitous among major media outlets when they are reporting on the situation in Syria. Once it is widely used, then we can update this image. Master&Expert (Talk) 10:39, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Old or new flag?

I just want to make it clear about this. I'm wrong about changing the flag, especially when it comes to Libya. The Summary of Protests by Country country section depicts about the historic country which starts the uprising, not the current one. The thing about flag displayed on Libya is different from this article bcuz this one belongs to an article which talks about history while that Libya talks about the current one (although separate with its history section). Therefore it's true that the war started with the old Libyan flag, not the new one. So don't change the Libyan flag.

In the future, any country's uprising which results in the new flag, like if Syria revolution will win soon, given that the opposition uses their pre-1963 flag, do not attempt to change it in this article. Leave it be the same. If you do not believe what I said then I guess we should hook up all the war articles, like World War I and World War II. Those articles, how did they end up with those old flags?

60.49.56.180 (talk) 03:18, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Dohuk Riots

Over the weekend there was an Islamic inspired riots all over northern Iraqi province of Dohuk. There is already a wikipedia page on it, and I'm wondering if it should also be mentioned here as it is a recent islamic inspired movement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.112.63.195 (talk) 07:40, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

We would need sources associating it with the Arab Spring movement. I haven't looked but if the sources you've seen do that already, please do feel free to add it. TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 23:36, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

I don't think it fits. Maybe sources say otherwise, I haven't checked...but my feeling is that these were riots by Islamists bent on destroying private property, not demonstrations for political reform or civil liberties. -Kudzu1 (talk) 23:43, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Timeline of Arab Spring

Hi, I need help from you to update this template. At this point in time, it isn't added into any articles. One of the concerns is that this timeline might get overloaded with text. If that's the case, key events are sufficient. Thanks in advance! Hytar (talk) 02:36, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

Re: Redirect from Dayof Rage

(noted here since Day of Rage is not monitored.) Any objection to removing the redirect and instead making a reference link to Arab Spring from the Day of Rage page? Rationale: Other movements have sprung from that event that don't have a Middle East focus. --DeknMike (talk) 15:41, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Syria - Armed Uprising?

I don't think Syria should be changed to civil war until the FSA holds a large amount of territory, but I think it should be treated like Libya was before it was called a civil war. It was called an "armed uprising", which I think is quite a fair way to describe the situation in Syria. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.21.62.65 (talk) 23:31, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Syria should be changed to a civil war. The reason is that ANY armed uprising is a civil warEricl (talk) 14:31, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

Syria certainly should not be changed to 'civil war' until we have multiple reliable sources calling it such. We don't decide on things based on our interpretation of the definition of the term (and 'civil war' hardly has a universal definition in any case). When our sources start calling it a civil war, then we can assess changing it. TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 23:31, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

File:Homs Syria Protests 2011 - 03.jpg Nominated for Deletion

An image used in this article, File:Homs Syria Protests 2011 - 03.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests December 2011 What should I do? Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so. If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Misplaced Pages (Commons does not allow fair use) If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used. This notification is provided by a Bot --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 08:19, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Subdued vs. Ended

A lot of the "current state of protests" sections in the table claim that the protests have been subdued. However, this implies that the government arrested/killed or something along those lines and ended the protests, usually by force. Ended would mean the protests simply died down. The page seems to claim that certain protests were subdued when really the protests just ended. This should be fixed. I'm not an expert on which nations actually did have their protests subdued, so someone else should do it. I also fixed Tunisia, which claimed subdued instead of ended, a few weeks ago as an IP. Dayshade (talk) 01:44, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Updates

There are several things that need to be updated:

1. The sentence regarding about Ali Abdullah Saleh in the third paragraph of Overview needs to be changed.

2. The map color of Bahrain should change to dark blue.

3. The sentence "As of November 2011" In the same Overview section should change to December.

60.49.63.145 (talk) 13:38, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

So do it yourself. No one's stopping you....Ericl (talk) 14:28, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

I can't because I'm not an autoconfirm user. So I request somebody with that user to do it. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 05:51, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

mohammed bouazizi

why is mohammed bouazizi not mentioned

75.68.82.58 (talk) 02:13, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

He's mentioned 4 times in the article. Did you read it? TechnoSymbiosis (talk) 21:37, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

Saleh has stepped down, please update the article

It appears that Saleh is mentioned to still be in power while he had signed the GCC initiative and started the transfer of power. Please update the article. I find that the Yemen section is up-to-date but the Overview is not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wsaqaf (talk • contribs) 11:59, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Saleh has not yet stepped down. --Smart (talk) 03:41, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Please view this before making such hasty and pre-mature statements:

Talk:Arab_Spring#Yemeni Uprising or Revolution?.

Saleh never steps down. What really happens on November 23 is that Saleh just signed the deal, and agrees to step down only, that means he's not really stepping down yet. Besides, if you check most of the reliable sources and news media they will keep mentioning "...outgoing President Ali Abdullah Saleh..." which is another evidence that he hasn't step down yet. About the power transfer thing, you have already mentioned "started the transfer of power", so he may have transferred 10% of his power, but still there are 90% of the cabinet which he keep to himself. How's that suppose to mean he has step down already? What if he started to break his promise again? Please read this: Talk:Arab_Spring#About Yemen

60.49.63.145 (talk) 05:29, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Even if Saleh steps down, he appointed Abd al-Rab Mansur al-Hadi as his successor. Al-Hadi was vice president since 1994 (over 17 years), so it's not really a revolution or even overthrowing of the government. Also, unlike interim leaders in Tunisia or Egypt (Mebazaa and Tantawi), al-Hadi will probably stay in power for a full term after next elections. HeadlessMaster (talk) 14:05, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

I move that Yemen be changed to light blue on the map (Governmental changes) since Saleh has officially stepped down and the vice president is now in power. This should not be considered a revolution. User: Heresbubba53190

I absolutely disagree with Heresbubba53190's statement. Ben Ali left his prime minister in charge, Mubarak left the armed forces in charge. We still call those revolutions. The 1905 revolution in Russia left the Tsar still in power and we still call the Hungarian Revolution a revolution. Why then, is Yemen not a revolution? User: Dweedman —Preceding undated comment added 23:18, 23 December 2011 (UTC).

Agree with User: Dweedman here. If Saleh has stepped down, then it was obviously due to the popular uprising against him, and meets the criteria for a government overthrown designation. And if we're going to call Hungary 1956 a revolution, then Yemen 2011 certainly should qualify.74.131.99.14 (talk) 03:22, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

For HeadlessMaster, it really doesn't matter if Hadi has ruled Yemen as a VP for 14 to 99 years (just exaggerating saying) but the policy of the Yemeni protesters is to bring down the regime of Ali Abdullah Saleh, which means starting his ouster. If Saleh steps down, then it's consider a government overthrown. Likewise when it comes to Tunisia, when Ben Ali steps down, then although the Prime Minister Ghannouchi who has ruled Tunisia since 1999 has take over, we still call it a Government Overthrown. Saying Hadi takes over Yemen is not consider a Government Overthrown is actually consider a POV (point-of-view). Misplaced Pages is based on reliable media and sources only.

For Heresbubba53190 and Dweedman, yes the Yemenis are calling it a revolution. They are already asking the overthrow of the regime. Even until now the protesters keep claiming that they want to "continue their revolution", so its irrevelant to call it Governmental Changes. Besides, isn't Yemen has already implementing governmental changes long time ago? That's the reason why we labelled as "Sustained civil disorder and governmental changes".

But nobody has make any official statements such that Saleh has step down, so we cannot call it Government Overthrown for now. We cannot assume that because the GCC deal has expired in December 23 then we can say "Saleh has steps down already". Like I said earlier in this topic. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 03:58, 24 December 2011 (UTC)#

Saleh is gone, as it says in this article, "Since Saleh handed over the reins to his deputy under the Gulf peace accord, a new government headed by an opposition leader has been formed. A presidential election is scheduled for February." Goltak (talk) 20:34, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Nope, dude. Saleh is not gone. According to that source you show it, you forgot the word "outgoing President Ali Abdullah Saleh" which means he is still the "king" (just mockingly saying) of Yemen. Let me ask you a question, do you remember June 3 when Saleh got attacked in his presidential palace? Before he was sent to Saudi Arabia for medical treatment, he transfer most of his power to his buddy VP Hadi, but did he really step down? No, I don't think so. All transferred power were return back when he came back to Yemen at September. So the one thing the people should realize is that: "Transferring power ≠ Stepping down". Because Saleh forms a new government and he may lose his power it does not mean he was overthrown. Also remember in Egypt February 10? Mubarak once also transfer power to his VP Suleiman but he hasn't gone yet and claims wants to held office until the next election, but only later to formally decided to step down at next day. Besides, most mainstream media and reliable sources, when talks about how many were overthrown, until now they keep saying "Tunisia, Egypt, Libya" this 3 countries, but hasn't mention Yemen yet. I think you know why is that already. Saleh needs to formally step down on February, then we can call it Government Overthrown in this article and the Yemeni article as Yemeni Revolution whatever you all want to call it, depending what the reliable sources says if Saleh is really overthrown or not.60.49.63.145 (talk) 04:50, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Can't wait for Feburary. Goltak (talk) 18:27, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Sorry to be cruel with you for a while but we don't CARE if you can't wait at February. Thats your own problem. I hate to say that but most people just always seems to rush, rush, rush like Sonic the Hedgehog and eventually, what happens? Splash all the "paint" through the wall and run like a madman because they say "MOM, DAD, I CAN'T WAIT"? I want to make it clear for you. This article is not a NEWS article, this is a HISTORY article, articles depicts historic events with historic people and places. Also, Misplaced Pages is always about WP:RS. Repeat, Reliable Sources. You say you can't wait, but the protesters, news and the world can wait, even me and other users can too. Why must the article be changed just because there are some people here cannot wait? Come on, don't you have other important things to do other than just editing Misplaced Pages all the time? I know there are important things in our lifes that we "can't wait" rather than can't wait for February!

Quite so, as of this date where I'm gonna sign this signature soon, has the article talks about "ousted President A.A. Saleh", or "former President..." or "Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Yemen"? All I see until now is just outgoing President Saleh. Besides, the protesters and the officials, through their point-of-view already starts to worry that Saleh is going to take back the power again!! Here, take a look: http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle-east/suspicions-rising-that-yemens-president-seeks-to-scuttle-deal-meant-to-end-his-rule/2012/01/05/gIQAL7cxcP_story.html 60.49.63.145 (talk) 07:40, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

• FACEPALM**FACEPALM*FACEPALM*. No genius, I did not mean I could LITERALLY not wait for Feburary so I'm going to change NOW, NO!!!! I MENT that I'm LOOKING FOWARD to when that muderer steps down.... I'm sorry if this EXPRESSION is not commonly used from your native country... Geesh calm down a little please. Try not to take it so literally, of course I can wait until Feburary to update the article, ALL I was saying was that I was looking foward to it. Although I hope Saleh doesn't try to seize power yet again. I'm sorry if you've never heard this expression before I was just simply innocently making a statement.(talk) 14:39, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Okay. If you say so. Sorry for that. Well you could at least tell us that you aren't mean literally about "can't wait for February". After all, we don't know if you simply meant it directly or indirectly.

Its true. While you have that feeling, I guess me too. Because through my analysis the international media does not cover the Yemeni uprising more than the Syrian uprising (which I believe there was an alleged political bias among these medias) so I tend to focus more on Yemen. Tho so I don't have much time to really pay attention to Misplaced Pages as I have other things to do. Like you, I also want the fall of Ali Abdullah Saleh, and knowing by timeline and analyze you can notice Saleh has better tactics and tricks to stay in power than the defiant late Libyan leader Gaddafi. I may cross the line, so again, sorry for that. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 15:47, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Arab Awakening?

Can somebody provide a scholarly citation for calling this "the Arab Awakening"? I have been studying the Middle East for years, and the Arab Spring since its beginning, and I have yet to actually come across somebody seriously coining the events as "Arab Awakening." The Arab Awakening usually refers to this, an Arabist movement that began in the 19th century. I won't remove the label and simply ask for discussion for now, but I will edit the Arab Awakening page from redirect to a disambiguation page. -- Crushti (talk) 21:44, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

Sudan

Sudan has recently just suffer another small wave of protests because of the dam proposal by the government to build it. Now some are asking for the overthrow of Bashir. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 17:10, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Covered on 2011 Sudanese protests. I'm a bit unsure whether they should be put into a new article or lumped together with the earlier protests. If they continue into the new year, my preference will probably be for splitting them off. I haven't seen them directly linked to the Arab Spring yet. -Kudzu1 (talk) 19:57, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Good idea. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 05:31, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Sudanese activist arrested days after heckling ruling party official.

http://www.sudantribune.com/Sudanese-activist-arrested-days,41152

60.49.63.145 (talk) 09:10, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Parties to the civil conflict and Lead figures

Hello. Why is the Parties to the civil conflict and Lead figures are placed in the Arab Spring box? This is not a united Arab conflict, rather this is a separate Arab country conflicts. You can't put something like "Riad al-Asaad are allies of Sadiq al-Ahmar" just because they were both opposition leaders. Where is the evidence that Sadiq or Riad are helping each other sides? Likewise who says the King Hamad is the good friend of Muammar Gaddafi and Bashar al-Assad? He blasted both of them and declare as their enemies. Try not to do prejudice where all leaders will unite together and all opposition leaders too. In reality, there are leaders hates another leaders. If you wish to do so then do it at the separate articles but not on this general article. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 05:18, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

Map Color Changes For Improved Viewing Quality?

Why are the colors for the Arab countries on the map all so very strange and unorthodox? Shouldn't primary and some secondary colors be used? (e.g. this cartogram- http://en.wikipedia.org/File:EU_net_budget_2007-2013_per_capita_cartogram.png) That'd make the map a bit clearer and less eye-weary, as well as conform to normal map standards. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm no cartographer. As a side note- Mauritania is the only Arab country without its own protest page. Should one be made? Or is nothing of relative importance happening there? Thanks— Mike44456 (talk) 01:27, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

I don't see any strange and unorthodox colour here, my friend. Its fine for me actually. We start our colour from the bright colour which shows their country has no protests before, then by going darker and darker the country is said to have experience a major protests and then uprising and then regime overthrown. This map and that map you show it all the same MAP (as long as users can identify better). The same thing I checked on the CNN Unrest On The Arab World. They all have the same strange and unorthodox map just like us.

As for the Mauritania its goes the same way as Palestinian Territory too. Both has protests before, but because very little amount (if coveraged by media) of protests happen in those country, so its no point we make such huge article, instead we go by a simple and small text under this section Arab_Spring#Others, which to me this is enough for countries like Mauritania already. If, by hypothetically speaking Mauritania has turned into the Kuwaiti pathway then maybe we would consider making an independent article, but until now no such page is needed. 60.49.63.145 (talk) 02:57, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

News Update

Seems like many people tend to focus more on popular uprisings and revolutions in Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Yemen, Syria and Bahrain, this is my discovery of those infamous Arab countries which suffer smaller protests. Any edits are welcome, if wish to.

Algeria:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5ic2rj6WFjN-Y4BuxjoEoECmPaBRg?docId=CNG.4e49b326c0b56a603281add8e86b2b2d.631
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/12/us-algeria-housing-protests-idUSTRE80B12A20120112

Jordan:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/12/us-algeria-housing-protests-idUSTRE80B12A20120112 60.49.63.145 (talk) 14:56, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

1. "Saudi sends troops, Bahrain Shi'ites call it "war"". Reuters. 14 March 2011.
2. Bahrain troops open fire on protestors; 2 killed – Rediff.com India News
3. "'Business-Friendly Bahrain' Disappears; Ex-Pats Exit". CNBC.
4. {{cite news|title=UAE says sent 500 police officers into Bahrain|url=http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/14/us-g8-bahrain-uae-idUSTRE72D6DE20110314%7Cdate=14 March 2011|accessdate=29 September 2011|agency=Reuters
5. "'Business-Friendly Bahrain' Disappears; Ex-Pats Exit". CNBC.
6. Three killed as troops open fire in Bahrain | The Australian

• Misplaced Pages featured article candidates
• All unassessed articles
• C-Class Arab world articles
• High-importance Arab world articles
• WikiProject Arab world articles
• C-Class Africa articles
• Mid-importance Africa articles
• WikiProject Africa articles
• C-Class Western Asia articles
• High-importance Western Asia articles
• WikiProject Western Asia articles
• C-Class politics articles
• Mid-importance politics articles
• WikiProject Politics articles
• C-Class sociology articles
• Mid-importance sociology articles
• C-Class social movements task force articles
• Social movements task force articles
• C-Class military history articles
• C-Class African military history articles
• African military history task force articles
• C-Class Middle Eastern military history articles
• Middle Eastern military history task force articles
• Misplaced Pages controversial topics
• Misplaced Pages In the news articles