User talk:Gibson Flying V: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 20:26, 21 January 2014 editGibson Flying V (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers92,854 edits →Height in football players' infoboxes: reply← Previous edit		Revision as of 20:37, 21 January 2014 edit undoGiantSnowman (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Administrators601,149 edits →Height in football players' infoboxes: rspNext edit →
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	::::::No, you are deliberately choosing some sources over others, namely those that support your pro-cm agenda, when plenty of alternatives which display height in m exist - see the Davide Astori talk page for evidence. That is what my issue is here. ]] 20:03, 21 January 2014 (UTC)		::::::No, you are deliberately choosing some sources over others, namely those that support your pro-cm agenda, when plenty of alternatives which display height in m exist - see the Davide Astori talk page for evidence. That is what my issue is here. ]] 20:03, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
	:::::::Yes, I do discriminate when it comes to sources, and so should all Wikipedians. You're supposed to be an administrator. You must know that not all sources are created equal. This is why I do prefer, for example, ] when it comes to biographies of soccer players over, say, fan-generated databases.--] (]) 20:26, 21 January 2014 (UTC)		:::::::Yes, I do discriminate when it comes to sources, and so should all Wikipedians. You're supposed to be an administrator. You must know that not all sources are created equal. This is why I do prefer, for example, ] when it comes to biographies of soccer players over, say, fan-generated databases.--] (]) 20:26, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
			::::::::I've found you a FIFA link on the Davide Astori talk page which uses m - and Sky Sports is not a "fan-generated database" - in fact many of them in wide use are professional companies. You don't know what you're talking about. ]] 20:37, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

	== What does SOURCE have to do with any of the changes you reverted? ==		== What does SOURCE have to do with any of the changes you reverted? ==

Revision as of 20:37, 21 January 2014

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State Of Origin 2013

John Sutton was in fact the 18th man for NSW. Josh Reynolds was player number 16 on the bench although he didn't get a start? why should he be reverted to 18th man when he wasn't? Sutton reverted to 18th man when Reynolds was selected on the bench over John Sutton. Check here: http://www.nrl.com/DrawResults/StateofOrigin/Teams/tabid/11363/Default.aspx

And why not? 17th and 18th man should be as equal as the rest of the squad. They did get selected didn't they?

114.76.237.11 (talk) 09:59, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

You're right about Josh Reynolds (and I'll gladly fix that). Definitely wrong about players who don't even play in a game being equal to those that did.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 10:05, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Fair enough on the 18th man's importance, it looks better though and flow better if the team lists looks the same, although 18th man should be before the coach. May the best State win, finally NSW can compete with QLD. #uptheblues 114.76.237.11 (talk) 10:11, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) I am of course so deeply devastated by the outcome of game I 2013 to the extend that, erm, I carried on with life as if hadn't happened, despite being deeply devastated. The only bright spot for me apart from Darbs' try was... well, it wouldn't be Origin without a bit of the biff, would it?--Shirt58 (talk) 10:29, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Headings

Stop edit warring, you know as well as I do about BRD. You were bold and made a change, it was reverted now discuss it on talk pages to reach a conclusion. Mattlore (talk) 09:56, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Interesting. Anyone can see you're the one edit-warring, but nice try. I have no idea what "BRD" is. It's clear why I'm making the improvements. You have some explaining to do.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 10:02, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

WP:BRD; Bold-Revert-Discussion. I'll start a discussion at wp:rl and give you the link. Mattlore (talk) 10:04, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Rugby_league#Headings_in_player_biographies Mattlore (talk) 10:24, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

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Dave Parkinson (rugby league

If you want to delete an article such as Dave Parkinson use the formal process instead of just overwriting it.--Racklever (talk) 05:43, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

1998 GF

At some point you will actually go off and find out what the highest score in GF is, and thereby learn a valuable lesson.

By no means do I take it for granted that you'll actually read the content you're deleting and the unambiguously worded source material given for it. Gosh, users masquerading as anonymous IPs are such fun!.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 03:47, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

So I take it that's a no on the highest score research?

As long as you don't have to actually constructively edit or reference anything, and continue limiting yourself to undiscussed removal of well-referenced content while hiding behind an IP address, right?--Gibson Flying V (talk) 04:41, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

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national]] representative half back of the 1970s and 80s, he played his club football with the [[Manly-Warringah Sea Eagles. Gibbs spent 2012 as a presenter on ''NRL Daily'' and is also the host

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Talk:Football in Australia

I think you may have fundamentally misunderstood everything being discussed on Talk:Football in Australia. There is no consensus to change anything from soccer to football. There is consensus that there is no need to disambiguate the article because the information provided is much more useful than a disambiguation would be in terms of explaining the complex picture of football (ALL CODES) in Australia. The consensus exists. The sources that support this position abound. If you take a second to read the points being made by the side that consensus exists for you, you would realize that you need to argue from a source based position that relies primarily on etymological sources regarding the history of the terms. You can say anything else you want, but until you provide those sources, there will be zero ways to reach consensus. Do the research to enhance your position. Or better yet, spend a few weeks improving Soccer in Australia, Australian rules football, Rugby league in Australia, Rugby union in Australia, American football in Australia, Futsal in Australia. Get them all up to GA levels. Learn the sources. Then having a good grasp of the sources and the history and the etymology and the regional playing patterns and all the other information presented in the Football in Australia article. After that, make your case. (Doing this for all other football codes in Australia will also make it harder for people to argue you are a soccer partisan of the worst kind.) Anyway, I await your sources. Sources. Sources. Sources. --LauraHale (talk) 09:25, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

I think you've just been arguing with these soccer guys far too long. You can't possibly be as foolish as you're making yourself look. Not trying to be funny, but did you actually read anything I'd typed? And if so, what is the "case" you think I'm making? I see you're big on apologies for personal attacks. I wonder if you'll practice what you preach.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 09:47, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

Please stop

Please stop and explain the edits you are making to Football in Australia.--LauraHale (talk) 06:42, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

I suggest you go and read all I've written on the talk page. The article should be restricted to content relating to more than one code of football, or, if about one code of football, should be for firsts or records for any code of football (not any sport). But I'm repeating myself. Go read about it on the talk page where you spectacularly failed to address it.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 06:46, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

anti-consensus editing

There is no consensus to go back to a disambiguation. Please stop removing all "code" specific information because it is too sepcific. This looks like an attempt to purge all information about football as a whole in Australia in order to justify a disambiguation against consensus.--LauraHale (talk) 06:47, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

You let me know when I create a disambiguation page. Until then you've not the ghost of a point.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 06:49, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

anti-consensus editing

Then look closer, restricting the artcle to "information about football as a whole in Australia" is precisely what I'm doing. And I'm rather helpfully doing it one sentence at a time, so that you can attempt to argue against each edit if you're willing/able. I know I can.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 06:52, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

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October 2013

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You're wasting your own and my time. Look more closely at your edit. You removed more than just images. I am replacing the textual information you carelessly removed. I don't care about the images. Please pay closer attention to what you're doing.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:53, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Do not re-add those files, or I will take this to ANI and request your blocking for repeated violations of WP:NFCC. One cannot just remove the files and leave the text. Gallery tags dont work like that, Feel free to re-add the text but do not re-add the files. Werieth (talk) 22:56, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

You make it extremely difficult to construe your edits as anything but nonconstructive when you willfully remove content and flat out refuse to re-add it. Report away. All you'll do is display your own carelessness and bad faith.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:59, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

See what I mean? the text without the files doesnt display. It should be re-worked into the article. but thats not a simple process Werieth (talk) 22:59, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

See what I mean? No need to throw the baby out with the bathwater.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 23:02, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Given that the article still looks horrible and re-working the formatting is going to be a fairly complex process which will probably involve wikitable markup (something I dont know how to write) I felt that removing the files and leaving it for those familiar with the article to re-integrate the information in a logical and functional manner would be best. Your actions to blindly violate NFC is what led to your warning, it wasnt a matter of bad faith, rather it was an attempt to ensure that NFCC was enforced. Werieth (talk) 23:07, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

So materially reducing the informativeness of the article is preferable to having it "still look horrible"? Yeah OK. Very good.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 23:10, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Football in Australia Terminology

I just wanted to know why you undid my edit here? I thought the section needed rewording as the current backtracks, and is unnecessarily lengthy.--2nyte (talk) 00:30, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

I was viewing that edit (giving soccer of all things pride of place at the top of the Etymology section) through the paradigm of your stated goal to have the Football in Australia article changed over time into Soccer in Australia.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:05, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Firstly, my intention (as stated above) was to reword the section as it backtracks and is too lengthy; I only 'reorganised' the content in alphabetical order (now I realise American football came before association football - honest mistake). Secondly, my "goal" was to have the Football in Australia article replaced with a disambiguation page, and separately have the Soccer in Australia article moved to Association football in Australia. Now, with that out of the way can we revert to this edit though in the correct alphabetical order.--2nyte (talk) 00:40, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

You really think I'm that stupid? You'll do better not to insult my intelligence like that. Of course it wasn't an accident. And from "Association football in Australia" (which I'd have no problem with if it would only end there) you'll then use the fact that it has the words "Football in Australia" to move it there instead.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 00:50, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Why must you be so cynical and why must you villainise me? It was an honest mistake. And I have no intention, none at all, for the Football in Australia article to be only about soccer. Don't second guess me, don't anticipate my next move because I don't have one. There is no elaborate plan or scheme so please stop accusing me of any such thing.--2nyte (talk) 01:12, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Football in Australia "Sportsperson"

Ok, I can now see how 'footballer' is applicable, as described in the opening of Football player, so we'll leave it as that. Though, couldn't you have just explained your own reasoning in the edit summary rather than just insulting me. Don't assume I know what you know, because I simply don't.--2nyte (talk) 01:35, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Your edits are in perfect alignment with what you'd expect from someone who believes that soccer in Australia should be called football and no one but soccer players have the right to be called footballers. (The world is full of these people by the way, they're called British people) If it's all just a remarkable coincidence of innocent mistakes I'll gladly eat my words. But it just doesn't look very likely that that's the case now does it? I'm far more disappointed than you are. There are enough users here that can't be taken seriously without you adding yourself to the pile. The sooner childish tactics like vote-stacking and trying to smuggle POV-pushing through customs under the guise of innocent error are grown out of, the easier all this will get for you.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 04:57, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I wasn't using sportsperson because I think football/footballer should only be used for soccer/soccer player (which I don't), I was using sportsperson because Karmichael Hunt played 3 different sports and I though it sounded ambiguous. Similarly, if he played rugby league, rugby union and soccer or soccer and cricket I wouldn't use footballer or cricketer, I would use sportsperson. On the other hand all people who play a code of football are considered footballers, so that's why I said it's fine.--2nyte (talk) 05:40, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Yes, very good. Until your next innocent error then. (Don't go making too much of a habit out of it) --Gibson Flying V (talk) 07:33, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I wouldn't consider it an error on my part, I was just misinformed. You could have very easily explained your edit before you undid mine. And to be fair in the first edit you showed I cut and pasted HiLo post to quote him and didn't realise at the time, and the second I clicked save page instead of show preview and I undid the edit straight away before LauraHale commented.--2nyte (talk) 08:00, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Football in Australia talk page

Also, why did you add the content I archived back onto the talk page on Talk:Football in Australia? It has been quiet for over a month and also if we are going to continue we should probably start fresh seeing as how ugly it got.--2nyte (talk) 08:09, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Of course. You're innocent and not trying to cover your tracks. I forgot. Allow me to explain: Talk pages discussions should be archived when they get too numerous and the page becomes too long, not when they get too old. The most recent ones should remain no matter how old they are. Otherwise people come to the talk page thinking an issue's never been discussed before when it actually has, and they should simply read/add to the existing one rather than starting afresh (thanks for making me type that out. I had nothing better to do).--Gibson Flying V (talk) 09:11, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I'm certainly not trying to cover my tracks. I archived the content, I didn't delete and I added a search bar. Also the page was 184 KB which took very long to load and didn't save properly. Anyway Archive 1 had the main discussion, which you didn't add back, and like I said it was quiet for over a month.--2nyte (talk) 09:41, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Ask yourself if you really need me to type things this obvious: if the talk page seems to long, archive the oldest discussions, not all of them.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 20:37, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

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he previously played in ] for English clubs, ] and ], with whom he won the ]. Leuluai was also a member of the [[2008

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Laird

I removed your addition of Graham Laird as there is no Wiki page nor significant references. See wp:listpeople and wp:wtaf. Cheers Jim1138 (talk) 11:12, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

No worries. I've re-instated it though as national rugby league representatives are without a shadow of a doubt notable. See WP:REDDEAL. Cheers.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 11:14, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Bulldogs salary cap breach

Hi,

I've noticed that you've moved the page "Canterbury-Bankstown Bulldogs salary cap breach" to the club's 2002 season page. I was wondering what prompted you to merge the separate page to the season page, given it was a major salary cap breach since the NRL was formed in 1998.

I don't want to argue but I do believe the Bulldogs' 2002 salary cap breach was big, second only to the Storm's 2010 breach. In fact, both breaches came under the leadership of David Gallop, who has now defected to the FFA. The Storm's breaches has its own separate page, but it is more detailed (stripped of two premiership, three minor premierships, all competition points in 2010, etc.), whereas the Bulldogs' breaches in 2002 only resulted in the loss of 37 competition points, demotion to the bottom of the ladder but with no recent premiership to strip them of (at the time, their most recent premiership was in 1995).

Maybe that's one reason why you've decided to merge the Bulldogs' breach page to their 2002 season page. MasterMind5991 (talk) 07:15, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Agree 100% about the arguing. All the content you went to the trouble of creating/referencing (which I commend you for) and all the links to it are still 100% intact. The 2002 Bulldogs season article was crying out to be created. The breach's article? Less so in my opinion.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 11:08, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

"Expressing human height in metres is the same as expressing it in yards..."

Not necessarily Jeff, the last time I saw a doctor (albeit in England) is was height in metres and weight in kilograms (Though I'm old enough to prefer; feet & inches, and stones & pounds), and the Leeds Rhinos concur. Best Regards. The 2-yard tall DynamoDegsy (talk) 14:31, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I'm aware that it does happen, and it concerns me how much wikipedia may be responsible for that given its current status within the information "ecology" of which it is a part. In Australasia and Asia, where the metric system is not an oddity, centimetres have always been used. That is because expressing human height in metres truly is analagous with expressing it in yards (kind of like expressing aircraft altitude in feet: something I've personally never understood!).--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:21, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Height in football players' infoboxes

Hi, please do not change the height in football players' infoboxes to the unit cm, as it is usually shown in m (or ft and in) as you can see at Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Football/Players. --Jaellee (talk) 18:02, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

That shortcoming will be fixed soon and your reversions will be corrected. WP:SOURCEs carry more weight than WikiProject norms.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:00, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

Please read WP:CALC. --Jaellee (talk) 21:24, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

Indeed. It seems to agree with what I've just said. Please see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football#Height_templates.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:26, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

If you claim WP:SOURCE as reason for this revert then you say that 172 cm is supported by the source but 1.72 m is not. According to WP:CALC and 172 cm are equally supported 1.72 m by the source, so you should provide a better reason for the revert.

About Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football#Height_templates – I was under the impression that Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Football/Players is something that shows the consensus at WP:FOOTY, but if it's only a vague recommendation, okay, I'm glad to hear that. --Jaellee (talk) 21:41, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

The quality of sources plus what is the norm locally is always taken into consideration. Please see Template_talk:Height#Human_height_is_more_commonly_expressed_in_centimetres_than_metres.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:50, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

If you continue to push a pro-cm bias like you have done here then I will have to report you. Please stop until consensus is reached. Giant Snowman 13:02, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

You honestly think there's something to report? Go for it.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:13, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Final warning, if you continue to push your agenda like you have done here then I will take this matter to ANI. Just because the discussion at {{Height}} is not going your way, no need to edit disruptively. Giant Snowman 12:09, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

You want to report me for introducing first-rate sources to biographies of living persons and formatting content to match them? I'm kinda curious to see how that goes. I suppose you know fully well that an assumption of bad faith is inherent in any such report and that's why you're not doing it. No one is impressed with your bizarre claims about metres being the norm and this being a personal crusade of mine, and I think your adminship needs to be looked at.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 19:43, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

Haha, yes, why don't you suggest that someplace? Almost as funny as your bizarre love for the cm. Giant Snowman 19:49, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

In the absence of anything in the MOS demanding that Misplaced Pages expresses human height in centimetres, we should follow reliable sources, especially in biographies of living persons. If quality, published sources express a subject's height in centimetres, then a very good reason is needed for us to go against that. You seem to think this is a personal preference of mine, but as you've already seen, it is the preference of sources. You don't know how many BLPs' heights and weights were incorrect before I came along and corrected them, and you don't know how many thanks I got from other editors for doing so.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 20:01, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

No, you are deliberately choosing some sources over others, namely those that support your pro-cm agenda, when plenty of alternatives which display height in m exist - see the Davide Astori talk page for evidence. That is what my issue is here. Giant Snowman 20:03, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I do discriminate when it comes to sources, and so should all Wikipedians. You're supposed to be an administrator. You must know that not all sources are created equal. This is why I do prefer, for example, FIFA when it comes to biographies of soccer players over, say, fan-generated databases.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 20:26, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

I've found you a FIFA link on the Davide Astori talk page which uses m - and Sky Sports is not a "fan-generated database" - in fact many of them in wide use are professional companies. You don't know what you're talking about. Giant Snowman 20:37, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

What does SOURCE have to do with any of the changes you reverted?

I simply took the exact material and used the correct template for them. I will be restoring those if you don't explain your change. In short, the information is exactly the same. My {{height|m=1.80}} returns 1.80 m (5 ft 11 in) and your {{convert|180|cm|ftin|abbr=on}} returns 180 cm (5 ft 11 in). The difference is that 180 cm is 1.8 m. That's a simple metric conversion and permitted per WP:CALC. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:25, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

I see you're edit warring with other editors above. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:26, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Then I needn't repeat myself here. The fact is, the metre as a unit for measuring human height is an oddity, and WP:Sources prove that.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:27, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

That's one revert for me, two for you. Who's edit warring again?--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:28, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

No it's not. Any time you change anything, it's a revert. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:30, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Fascinating. Yes, how dare I introduce reliable sources and change content to match it? Scandalous!--Gibson Flying V (talk) 22:31, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Fascinating. You don't understand the issues at all.

I understand that height isn't usually reported in meters but is usually reported in centimeters: I do live in a metric country after all. However, there is a general agreement to use that template. The correct fix is at that template, not on an article-by-article basis. So I'm partially on your side, but not in the way you think.

You also don't understand what it means to revert an edit.

Reverting means undoing the effects of one or more edits, which normally results in the page being restored to a version that existed sometime previously. More broadly, reverting may also refer to any action that reverses the actions of other editors, in whole or in part.

Your change to add the source also reverted material. I changed the template from convert to height. That too was a revert. Then we each undid the edit of the other. We're each at two reverts. Walter Görlitz (talk) 23:09, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

The power of "general agreement" on Misplaced Pages is quite remarkable then, isn't it? When users (in quite surprising numbers) start thinking it trumps WP:Verfiability (possibly the single most important core policy) and, not only that, but what they already know to be right.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 23:16, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

WP:V isn't being trumped as 100cm = 1m = 0.001km. The information is not unverified because it's a different unit, it is only displayed differently. I could even say 39.37 inches and not be going against WP:V as it's permitted per the guideline you're ignoring. The actual argument is whether height should be displayed in m or cm and I'll focus on that battle for now. BTW: Thanks for the thank. Walter Görlitz (talk) 08:25, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

If high-quality reliable sources present WP:BLPs with height in centimetres, then a very good reason is needed for Misplaced Pages to go against it. It's an absurdly small and simple thing when you think about it. Amazing that it's getting any resistance at all.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 08:33, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

ANI notification

There is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Giant Snowman 19:54, 21 January 2014 (UTC)