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Revision as of 16:35, 27 March 2015

This user page was nominated for deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination: Delete, 20 December 2014, see discussion. Delete, 2 February 2012, see discussion.

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Two Deletion Reviews:

• Misplaced Pages:Deletion_review/Log/2015_March_11
• Misplaced Pages:Deletion_review/Log/2014_October_1

Contested deletion

This page should not be speedily deleted because... It just went through a Deletion Review. It was stated that recreation was allowed. --CrazyAces489 (talk) 18:43, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Yes but the article is still begging for an AfD. The previous AfDs and both DRv call into question the quality and number of references and the repost was again a mess - one would think some attempt to address the underlying issues discussed would have been carried out.Peter Rehse (talk) 20:11, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Well, with a group of people deleting important citations, it will be a stub and subsequently deleted. CrazyAces489 (talk) 21:11, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Sorry - who deleted citations from the article.Peter Rehse (talk) 21:47, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Some one did a major clean-up of the problem references and with a little further copy editing on my part - the article is in much better (clearer) shape than it was at the re-post. Thank you Niteshift36. There are still some reference issues (primarily deadlinks, see below) which should be looked at but a far clearer case for keeping now exists.Peter Rehse (talk) 12:26, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

• Yes, I deleted a number of sources that won't come close to passing RS. I ran out of time, but some more are likely to go as well. Additionally, there are some primary sources that should probably be reviewed in terms of what they contribute and a few sources that are debatable in terms of passing RS. I may seek some opinions at RSN. Niteshift36 (talk) 14:20, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

possible further references

http://www.ma-mags.com/srchmag.php?SrchFor=ron+duncan&SrchHow=all - An index of magazines proving what?

http://duncanmartialarts.com/history/- self-published source, shouldn't be used

http://www.bohans-family.com/sensei-speaks/duncan-ron/rd.htm
Not a RS

http://kogaryuninjutsuint.blogspot.com/2009/05/grand-master-ronald-duncan.html
- Not a RS

http://jkashtonsjournal.blogspot.com/2012/11/rip-ronald-duncan.html Not a RS

http://www.martialforce.com/SIFU%20ALAN%20GOLDBERG%20MARTIALFORCE%20INTERVIEW.htm Questionable source

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfcYiKlc5tg- A video showing what?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KdPGOFLydY- Not a RS

allegations and issues with black belt magazine http://books.google.com/books?id=pM4DAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA58&ots=N2VRLlEapv&dq=ron%20duncan%20ninja&pg=PA58#v=onepage&q=ron%20duncan%20ninja&f=false -RS that shows nothing of value

http://www.kapmma.com/3/my_tweets.htm Not a RS

http://coboinvestigations.com/Combat-Training.php - Not a RS

— Preceding unsigned comment added by CrazyAces489 (talk • contribs) 06:18, 20 March 2014 (UTC) CrazyAces489 (talk) 02:23, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

• Great job! You restored 12 sources, 7 of which are not reliable, one that's a SPS, one questionable one, 2 that have questionable value. Stellar work. Niteshift36 (talk) 02:33, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

• I've removed a link within http://oninotsume3.wordpress.com, which appears to be a full pdf of a copyright magazine. It seems incredibly unlikely that blog has permission from the publisher to distribute the copyrighted material, so it would fail WP:LINKVIO "if you know or reasonably suspect that an external Web site is carrying a work in violation of the creator's copyright, do not link to that copy of the work." --86.2.216.5 (talk) 07:01, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

References with issues

• http://www.cnfsa.com/content/history_sa.html%7Ctitle=NINJUTSU%7Cpublisher= Processing error (HTTP Error: 404)
• http://www.usadojo.com/eulogies/mary-cates.htm Processing error (Fetching error)
• http://www.quietstormmartialarts.com/Specials.html Processing error (HTTP Error: 404)
• http://lostlegacysystems.com/programs/%7Ctitle=Programs%7Cpublisher= Processing error (HTTP Error: 404)
• http://www.ashidakim.com/HowKimMetHayes.html%7Ctitle=HowKimMetHayes%7Cwork=ashidakim.com Processing error (HTTP Error: 404

• None of those are reliable sources. Niteshift36 (talk) 20:12, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

And I think none of them are still in the article. By the by - nice job on the article. I like the way the references were cleaned out without the gist of the article getting gutted.Peter Rehse (talk) 20:14, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

• The comment was more for the benefit of the author.....who has been conspicuously absent in the editing process. So much work would have been saved if he had at least a functioning understanding of the RS criteria. Niteshift36 (talk) 20:17, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

I create so others can work. Niteshift36 PRehse It is a group volunteer effort. CrazyAces489 (talk) 04:25, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

First rule of volunteerism is not to pile on work for others to do.Peter Rehse (talk) 08:39, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

• Wrong answer! You don't do bad work and hope other clean it up. An article like this could go either way. I personally think Duncan is notable, but someone could make a good argument to delete again. With an attitude like that one, I will probably be less inclined to improve an article and just side with delete Niteshift36 (talk) 16:38, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

Niteshift, do what you want. I don't control you. I will continue making articles so others can improve on them. 80 this year so far. CrazyAces489 (talk) 17:41, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

• Creating articles isn't a contest. I've looked at some of your creations.....and the number deleted. Pretty soon, your refusal to even try to follow RS will catch up to you at ANI. Niteshift36 (talk) 18:39, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

I don't see the point in putting a lot of work into new articles anymore. Nor engaging in a lot of debate. I looked at what is qualified to be notable for some people. Things such as playing in the major leagues or WP:NCOLLATH. I put in enough information so that it won't be deleted via CSD. I simply can't fight over sources nor how an article should look. I leave it to others to improve it. So long as I don't violate WP:CIVIL or WP:COPYVIO I won't have any issues. I am choosing to no longer engaging a group of individuals at pages and wasting my time fighting long difficult fights. Too much energy wasted to me. I will just make articles that I feel are notable via wikipedia standards. If they get deleted, so be it. CrazyAces489 (talk) 21:19, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

• Willfully disregarding RS is uncivil and considered disruptive editing, especially when it becomes a pattern. You have a responsibility to make a good faith effort to follow the policies. It can catch up to you. Just trying to avoid COPYVIO and CIVIL violations doesn't protect you from the other policies. Niteshift36 (talk) 23:17, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

I haven't willfully disrupted anything. I may not be a veteran like you in being able to identify RS sources, but this does not mean that I can't be a good contributor. I am putting up good articles of notable individuals. If you want to challenge my articles, feel free to put them up for AFD. CrazyAces489 (talk) 02:22, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

I think the problem runs deeper than "I may not be a veteran like you in being able to identify RS sources", above you are asked to have a "at least a functioning understanding of the RS criteria", and your response is not an acknowledgement or commitment for improvement but more shrug and comment to the effect "that's someone else's problem, I'll continue the way I am and let you sort it out", hardly a collegial attitude. You've been pointed in various places by me, and I would assume others that stuff like blogs are not going to be WP:RS yet you continue to add them to articles or lists of sources like the above, that's not veteran level that's merely reading and understanding what's being said to you. Likewise in a recent AFD I noticed you saying that a bio on IMDB was a strong source in your opinion, yet right there in WP:RS it talks about such content as not generally being appropriate "This includes any website whose content is largely user-generated, including the Internet Movie Database (IMDB)...", again that's not veteran level, that's just the basics. At the moment people are talking to you about stuff like this, if you aren't willing to help sort it out at a level of self improvement I guess someone may be inclined to take this to a further level of dispute resolution --86.2.216.5 (talk) 07:13, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

How many times have you seen me use IMDB after someone said that it was RS? Go through my edits and tell me. If someone tells me and shows me some sort of proof, I don't blatantly put those things up. If you want to take it up a further level, knock yourself out. I am not engaging any more battles with users who have made it clear that they do not like my work here. The less major edits I do, the less they can complain about. CrazyAces489 (talk) 12:21, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

• Anyone who has created 80 articles in 3 months isn't allowed to claim the "I'm not a veteran" card. If it were one or two articles, that'd be one thing, but you have an inherent responsibility to know what you're doing. There's a reason they give you a written test before you get a drivers license. They want to know you know the basic rules of the road. (No, I'm not suggesting that we need a test to edit on Misplaced Pages) Being a responsible wikipedian means trying to do it right. When experienced editors are telling you there is a consistent hole in your editing, why not try to fix the issue instead of not just ignoring them, but telling them to do it themselves. Niteshift36 (talk) 15:49, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

You don't have to like my edits. I don't always like yours or 86's opinion on my edits. You have given your opinion about me in the AN/I so has 86 in another I have found a small niche for myself. Creating articles and I will stick to it. Maybe in a few months, I will start uploading photos and that will be my new niche. If most of you were nicer in general to me, I would be more open to conversation. If you don't like the articles I create feel free to bring them up for AFD. I will probably give my reason for a keep, and that will probably be the end of it. CrazyAces489 (talk) 16:01, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

• It's not about "liking" them. It's about your refusal to even try, a refusal that amounts to intentional ignorance. It's not about being nice or not nice. It's about following the community norms. The norm is to follow the policies. And I didn't give my opinion of you at ANI. I gave my opinion of your actions. Sadly, the thread didn't attract the attention it should have from admins. Don't feel vindicated, feel fortunate. Niteshift36 (talk) 16:35, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

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