Revision as of 00:37, 25 March 2016

Use this page to request clarification or amendment of a closed Arbitration Committee case or decision.

• Requests for clarification are used to ask for further guidance or clarification about an existing completed Arbitration Committee case or decision.
• Requests for amendment are used to ask for an amendment or extension of existing sanctions (for instance, because the sanctions are ineffective, contain a loophole, or no longer cover a sufficiently wide topic); or appeal for the removal of sanctions (including bans).

Submitting a request: (you must use this format!)

1. Choose one of the following options and open the page in a new tab or window:
   • Click here to file a request for clarification of an arbitration decision or procedure.
   • Click here to file a request for amendment of an arbitration decision or procedure (including an arbitration enforcement action issued by an administrator, such as a contentious topics restriction).
   • Click here to file a referral from AE requesting enforcement of a decision.
   • Click here to file a referral from AE appealing an arbitration enforcement action.
2. Save your request and check that it looks how you think it should and says what you intended.
3. If your request will affect or involve other users (including any users you have named as parties), you must notify these editors of your submission; you can use {{subst:Arbitration CA notice|SECTIONTITLE}} to do this.
4. Add the diffs of the talk page notifications under the applicable header of the request.

Please do not submit your request until it is ready for consideration; this is not a space for drafts, and incremental additions to a submission are disruptive.

Guidance on participation and word limits

Unlike many venues on Misplaced Pages, ArbCom imposes word limits. Please observe the below notes on complying with word limits.

• Motivation. Word limits are imposed to promote clarity and focus on the issues at hand and to ensure that arbitrators are able to fully take in submissions. Arbitrators must read a large volume of information across many matters in the course of their service on the Committee, so submissions that exceed word limits may be disregarded. For the sake of fairness and to discourage gamesmanship (i.e., to disincentivize "asking forgiveness rather than permission"), word limits are actively enforced.
• In general. Most submissions to the Arbitration Committee (including statements in arbitration case requests and ARCAs and evidence submissions in arbitration cases) are limited to 500 words, plus 50 diffs. During the evidence phase of an accepted case, named parties are granted an automatic extension to 1000 words plus 100 diffs.
• Sectioned discussion. To facilitate review by arbitrators, you should edit only in your own section. Address your submission to arbitrators, not to other participants. If you wish to rebut, clarify, or otherwise refer to another submission for the benefit of arbitrators, you may do so within your own section. (More information.)
• Requesting an extension. You may request a word limit extension in your submission itself (using the {{@ArbComClerks}} template) or by emailing clerks-llists.wikimedia.org. In your request, you should briefly (in 1–2 sentences) include (a) why you need additional words and (b) a broad outline of what you hope to discuss in your extended submission. The Committee endeavors to act upon extension requests promptly and aims to offer flexibility where warranted.
  • Members of the Committee may also grant extensions when they ask direct questions to facilitate answers to those questions.
• Refactoring statements. You should write carefully and concisely from the start. It is impermissible to rewrite a statement to shorten it after a significant amount of time has passed or after anyone has responded to it (see Misplaced Pages:Talk page guidelines § Editing own comments), so it is often advisable to submit a brief initial statement to leave room to respond to other users if the need arises.
• Sign submissions. In order for arbitrators and other participants to understand the order of submissions, sign your submission and each addition (using ~~~~).
• Word limit violations. Submissions that exceed the word limit will generally be "hatted" (collapsed), and arbitrators may opt not to consider them.
• Counting words. Words are counted on the rendered text (not wikitext) of the statement (i.e., the number of words that you would see by copy-pasting the page section containing your statement into a text editor or word count tool). This internal gadget may also be helpful.
• Sanctions. Please note that members and clerks of the Committee may impose appropriate sanctions when necessary to promote the effective functioning of the arbitration process.

General guidance

• Arbitrators and clerks may summarily remove or refactor discussion without comment.
• Requests from blocked or banned users should be made by e-mail directly to the Arbitration Committee.
• Only arbitrators and clerks may remove requests from this page. Do not remove a request or any statements or comments unless you are in either of these groups.
• Archived clarification and amendment requests are logged at Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Index/Clarification and Amendment requests. Numerous legacy and current shortcuts can be used to more quickly reach this page:

• WP:ARCA
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• Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and .../Amendment

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Currently, there are no requests for arbitration.

No cases have recently been closed (view all closed cases).

Requests for clarification and amendment

Amendment request: Carl Hewitt

Initiated by Prof. Carl Hewitt at 03:06, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Case or decision affected

Carl Hewitt arbitration case (t) (ev / t) (w / t) (pd / t)

Clauses to which an amendment is requested

2. Link to the principle, finding, remedy, section, etc for which you are requesting amendment

List of any users involved or directly affected, and confirmation that all are aware of the request

• Prof. Carl Hewitt (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (initiator)
• CarlHewitt (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
• CBM (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Confirmation that all parties are aware of the request

• CBM

Information about amendment request

• Link to the principle, finding, remedy, section, etc for which you are requesting amendment

• State the desired modification

Statement by Prof. Carl Hewitt

Edit talk pages of articles to make suggestions for improvement and participate in discussions or dispute resolution pages specifically concerning articles for which I have contributed to talk pages.Carl (talk) 00:06, 25 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by CBM

I would like to encourage Arbcom to discuss amendments to the original arbitration remedy that make article improvement and maintenance more straightforward. The persistent editing of particular articles and talk pages by numerous logged-out IP addresses, together with an inability of Dr. Hewitt to edit under a logged-in account because of an indefinite block , make article maintenance challenging. In particular, editors cannot assume that the IP edits are by Dr. Hewitt, nor can they assume that the edits are not by Dr. Hewitt, which makes communication challenging. If Dr. Hewitt were permitted to edit from a logged-in account verified by Arbcom to be controlled by him, it might facilitate article improvement by making it clear who is proposing particular edits. Unfortunately, the continued presence of tendentious IP edits even on the recent Village Pump thread suggests that longer-term semiprotection may still be necessary on the affected articles . I think Arbcom may be able to strike a balance that, at least, allows us to clearly separate edits by Dr. Hewitt from edits by IP addresses. (I will be traveling from March 21 to March 25, and my responses my be delayed.) — Carl (CBM · talk) 00:06, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Only in Death

@Callanecc, CarlHewitt was blocked for abusively using socks - primarily to get around his Arbcom-mandated topic ban on autobigraphical editing. That would generally be seen as an arbcom-enforcement action even if it is not directly listed as such, rather than a normal admin action. Are you saying that because it was a block for socking, its not an Arb-enforcement? The cause was his socking to get round his arbcom-restrictions. If those restrictions didnt exist, he wouldnt have socked. Only in death does duty end (talk) 10:39, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by {other-editor}

Other editors are free to make relevant comments on this request as necessary. Comments here should address why or why not the Committee should accept the amendment request or provide additional information.

Carl Hewitt: Clerk notes

This area is used for notes by the clerks (including clerk recusals).

• Fixed notification diff for CBM. Amortias (T)(C) 15:34, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
• Cleaned/formatted request. @Prof. Carl Hewitt: Please edit Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment#Information about amendment request and Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment#Statement by Prof. Carl Hewitt with information about your request or it may be summarily rejected by the Committee. Kharkiv07 (T) 16:25, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Carl Hewitt: Arbitrator views and discussion

• It looks to me that User:CarlHewitt is blocked from editing for sockpuppetry not as an arbitration enforcement action or by the Committee but normal administrative enforcement. If that's the case then the block needs to appealed on User talk:Carl Hewitt, or if access to that account has been lost, on User talk:Prof. Carl Hewitt - see WP:Guide to appealing blocks. I am not willing to consider amending the case until Professor Hewitt has returned to active editing using an account. Given that the block is not under the control of ArbCom (it wasn't arbitration enforcement or a Committee decision) I'd rather let the community handle this first. Callanecc (talk • contribs • logs) 09:04, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
• I'm willing to treat this as effectively an AE appeal, assuming my colleagues agree. To me the key question, regardless of paperwork matters, is whether others in the topic area agree that this is the best path forward to minimize disruption, so I would like to see further feedback about that. If so, I'd suggest restrictions along the lines of: 1) restricted to a single account only (I don't much care which one); 2) absolutely no editing logged out; 3) restricted to editing only article talk pages, user talk pages, his own userspace, and project discussions or dispute resolution pages specifically concerning him. Opabinia regalis (talk) 18:48, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Amendment request: Infoboxes

Initiated by Gerda Arendt at 14:32, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Case or decision affected

Infoboxes arbitration case (t) (ev / t) (w / t) (pd / t)

Clauses to which an amendment is requested

1. Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Infoboxes/Review#Remedies

List of any users involved or directly affected, and confirmation that all are aware of the request

• Gerda Arendt (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (initiator)
• Pigsonthewing (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Confirmation that all parties are aware of the request

• diff of notification of Pigsonthewing

Information about amendment request

• Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Infoboxes/Review#Remedies

• Suspend all remedies concerning Andy (Pigsonthewing), original and after review, as no longer needed to prevent "disruption".

Statement by Gerda Arendt

Today is Bach's birthday. Three years ago I suggested an infobox for Johann Sebastian Bach, as some may still remember. I believe that the personal restrictions and remedies for Andy (Pigsonthewing) don't serve a purpose. He has not commented in any recent infobox discussion (and there have not been many). The suspension could happen immediately or on parole.

We remember with thanks Viva-Verdi, who added infoboxes to all operas by Giuseppe Verdi - one of the areas of conflict in the 2013 infoboxes case -, before he died a year ago. Long live his memory. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:41, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Discussion style: I met Andy in the discussion about Samuel Barber. I was on the other side back in 2012, but liked his style, with a grain of humour ("Unless, of course, someone wishes to argue that Barber was not a person...". --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:56, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Pigsonthewing

@GorillaWarfare: Since you ask: it would beggar belief for anyone to suggest I would want, or would ever have wanted, otherwise. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:38, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by JzG

Andy can be maddeningly persistent on the tiniest of things, but this restriction has outlived its usefulness. His work as Misplaced Pages-In-Residence makes tiptoeing round the infobox issue an obvious problem. I'd support replacement with some kind of restriction that allows him to add and edit infoboxes, but not to argue about them. Guy (Help!) 10:42, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

• Collect's point I think addresses the core problem here, pace Rschen. Jbhunley also nails it. Andy has boundless energy, a remarkable commitment to the project, and exhibits good humour and good faith. He is, in short, a thoroughly decent bloke as well as being a prolific editor and ambassador for the project. However, he gets bees in his bonnet, as I think he would probably acknowledge. That's the source of all the problems. Most of what he does is uncontroversial and good, the problems occur only when something he sees as obvious - almost always in metadata curation, not content - is disputed or questioned by others. A restriction on argument will solve the problem, a restriction on any addition or discussion of infoboxen is more than is required given that in most cases proposals for or addition of infoboxes are simply not controversial. Most people actually don't care overmuch one way or the other. Obviously a targeted rampage of infobox additions would be a problem, but if Andy is editing an article - an eventuality that is always, IMO, a good thing for the project, given his attention to sources - I really don't see why adding an infobox would be an intolerable act. And if it's reverted then fine, he needs to walk away, and we can watch and help make sure he does that. Obviously if any of his long-term adversaries were to stalk him reverting additions then we'd pick that up as well. He has friends who will give him counsel, I really do think we should reduce the restrictions For Great Justice. Guy (Help!) 17:14, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Olive

Sanctions should have an expiry date. I haven't seen anything that indicates Andy cannot operate without sanctions. Lifting the sanctions then, is a next logical step. As well, we cannot conflate an editing/discussion style with sanctionable behavior. One is a emotional response to something we don't like; while a sanction is specifically a perceived transgression of our policies and guidelines. They are very different and should be dealt with as such. If we started sanctioning editors because we don't like their discussion style, we could become very short of editors in a hurry. (Littleolive oil (talk) 14:40, 23 March 2016 (UTC))

• If possible could arbs outline why they decline the case. We should be aiding editors to become fully operational again. Unless they are given feed back on their behavior they can't know how they are perceived or how to improve.(Littleolive oil (talk) 14:47, 23 March 2016 (UTC))

Statement by Montanabw

Time for these restrictions to go; they should expire, and the reality is that we have an editor who has extensive experience and knowledge being subjected to a set of rules suitable for 5 year olds. I favor the proposal. Montanabw 19:20, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Rschen7754

Given this discussion on Wikidata, where Pigsonthewing had his property creation rights revoked a few days ago, I do not see a good reason why the sanctions should be lifted, specifically the one about disrupting discussions. --Rschen7754 00:45, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Ritchie333

If I had to pick a specific problem with Andy Mabbett, it would be that he doesn't do a great job of explaining himself, particularly when he thinks he's right. But that's hardly crime of the century, is it? Drop his restriction back to parole, infoboxes are not the product of Satan's rear end and do serve a legitimate purpose in the right context. Then again, I find WikiData as exciting as watching grass grow, so don't take my view as gospel or anything. Ritchie333 13:29, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Jbhunley

Based on their need to respond to nearly every comment which is counter to their view in this VPP discussion about the religion= infobox parameter I can see how they could rapidly become disruptive in an infobox discussion. Because of that remedy 4.3.2 should stay in place. Remedy 4.3.1, the wholesale inability to add infoboxes, should be relaxed or removed but 4.3.2 is needed to rapidly curtail disruption which may occur as a result. Jbh 14:49, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Collect

The terse statement from Andy seems more than sufficient to accept that he would like restrictions in this area lifted. I have no idea what could be more "substantive" than his clear statement, alas. I suggest he is cognizant of the desirability of avoiding confrontations regarding actual existence of infoboxen (Wagnerian declension of the word), but all ArbCom needs do is by motion state "the restrictions are lifted, but all involved shall be cognizant and edit regarding infoboxes in accord with such cognizance." Collect (talk) 16:04, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Infoboxes: Clerk notes

This area is used for notes by the clerks (including clerk recusals).

Infoboxes: Arbitrator views and discussion

• I would generally encourage these kinds of requests be filed by the person affected by the remedy, but in lieu of that, I'll at least wait to opine until Pigsonthewing leaves a statement here indicating he would actually like these remedies lifted. GorillaWarfare (talk) 05:00, 22 March 2016 (UTC)
• Decline --In actu (Guerillero) | My Talk 14:39, 22 March 2016 (UTC)
• Decline absent a substantive statement from the editor in question. Personally, I won't take any step involving the bizarrely apoplectic infobox wars without being extremely thorough. While I am impressed by the statements of support by numerous other editors, I think a statement from the editor himself is required before we can consider any modification, however minor or appropriate it may or may not be. Strike my vote if a statement is posted. Gamaliel (talk) 15:07, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

• I'm puzzled that in only a few hours I've already received two objections to the idea that someone seeking having their sanctions removed should make a substantive statement about why they should be lifted and what they would do following their removal. This is standard procedure. Requests and appeals accompanied without such statements are routinely rejected by the community and the Committee. Gamaliel (talk) 17:33, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

• I expect I'll be in the minority on this one, but I'd be willing to revise these. We do, however, need some further input from Pigsonthewing; what would be useful is a clear statement of how, specifically, he would like to see the restrictions modified - the answer may be "I want them removed entirely", but let's try to find something that might actually get consensus in favor. From the comments above it sounds like we could consider modifying remedy 1.1 to allow adding an infobox but restrict reverting if it is removed, or to allow adding an infobox when it arises specifically in the course of WiR/outreach activities. Opabinia regalis (talk) 19:05, 24 March 2016 (UTC)
• Tentatively support The simplest thing would just be a trial, making it clear that the sanction will be reimposed in problems resume. I would have been willing to consider this whether or not the individual sanctioned had asked for it; there are imaginable situations where a person might not want their sanctions changed or even brought up again for discussion, but the actual request here does not seem to fall in that category. DGG ( talk ) 00:37, 25 March 2016 (UTC)

Clarification request: Palestine-Israel articles 3

Initiated by Howicus at 18:51, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Case or decision affected

Palestine-Israel articles 3 arbitration case (t) (ev / t) (w / t) (pd / t)

List of any users involved or directly affected, and confirmation that all are aware of the request:

• Howicus (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (initiator)

Confirmation that all parties are aware of the request

Statement by Howicus

So, I came across a new user who ran afoul of the editing restrictions related to the Israel-Palestine conflict. I do not want to give them incorrect advice, especially in an area like this where a violation can lead to a block. The restriction states "All IP editors, accounts with fewer than 500 edits, and accounts with less than 30 days tenure are prohibited from editing any page that could be reasonably construed as being related to the Arab-Israeli conflict." Does this also prohibit those users from posting on article talk pages of articles related to the conflict? I looked around on related talk pages, and I saw IPs and new accounts who posted without getting blocked, warned, or reverted, but I would like to know for certain. Howicus (Did I mess up?) 18:51, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Thank you very much, kelapstick. Howicus (Did I mess up?) 00:10, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by Sir Joseph

I think there is a big difference between a talk page and an article page. It is not that often you will find a vandal participating in the talk pages of an area. There are people who instinctively revert any IP address edit in the ARBPIA area and I think that is stupid, whether it's in an article or talk page. We should be encouraging talk page edits, they are contributing ideas and while they can't edit the actual article, they may be helping someone else come to a better edit. Of course, if they are disruptive, then you have free revert. As to the letter of the law, which is your question, yes, they are not allowed to edit in the talk page or the article and someone could bring them to AE and have them blocked. Sir Joseph 13:50, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Statement by {other-editor}

Other editors are free to make relevant comments on this request as necessary. Comments here should opine whether and how the Committee should clarify or amend the decision or provide additional information.

Palestine-Israel articles 3: Clerk notes

This area is used for notes by the clerks (including clerk recusals).

Palestine-Israel articles 3: Arbitrator views and discussion

• Howicus, this came up in January. The 30/500 restriction explicitly applies to talk pages. However (my opinion) best practice is to not blanket revert and throw blocks around willy nilly when non-disruptive Good Faith™ requests come from editors who are not permitted based on the restriction. If you are looking to advise a new user, I would advise them to not edit the talk page until they meet the criteria, as they may or may not find themselves blocked if they do. --kelapstick 21:24, 22 March 2016 (UTC)
• What Kelapstick said. Callanecc (talk • contribs • logs) 08:53, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
• See Kelapstick 2016a --In actu (Guerillero) | My Talk 13:02, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
• Agree, seems good advice. Doug Weller talk 15:28, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
• Excellent advice. Gamaliel (talk) 00:07, 24 March 2016 (UTC)
• Pile-on "per Kelapstick". Opabinia regalis (talk) 18:50, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

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