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Japan Unassessed

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Perhaps some of the content can be moved to History of Okinawa and Ryukyu Kingdom. --Tongpoo 00:50, 2003 Dec 5 (UTC)

I think Commodore Perry wrote the name as "Lew Chew"; is that worth noting? --165.121.147.225 00:35, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I believe Lūchū is the Okinawan name for Ryūkyū. - Gilgamesh 00:55, 2004 June 14 (UTC)

...no, no it is not. "luchu"/"lew chew"/"loo choo" is an English-language name. The Okinawan name is "ruuchuu", a word borrowed from Chinese, or "uruma", a native word. --Node ue 11:10, 10 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I've been told the islands are notable for the exceptionally high longevity of their inhabitants. Is anyone in a position to expand this section? I think at least a brief mention (with some links to explanatory references) would be of interest to many readers. --Breakpoint 1755PST31JUL2005

I've added some very basic info on Okinawan longevity and a link to the Okinawa Centenarian Program. Will ask someone from the team to provide more specifics when she's less busy. Or else I'll try to get Dr. Willcox to write something. :) Oenomel 10:17, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Forgot to mention: The Ryukyu flag is possibly incorrect. The yellow and blue colors need to be switched. As supporting evidence, here's a Japanese book about the flag and a link to the book cover image. Also, according to a comment on Flags of the World: "The flag has three Tomoes of red, yellow and blue from top clockwise in white field. Oue image on FOTW Japan which supposedly was taken from The Flag Book of the United States by Whitney Smith is wrong and yellow and blue should be switched." Now, I'm no flag expert, but I'm leaning heavily toward the Japanese book. After all, the Japanese author is more likely to have access to more accurate historical Japanese/Ryukyuan sources, right? Oenomel 10:43, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Or it may simply indicate that at the time the flag was used the relative position of the three colors was considered unimportant to those who flew it. It wasn't until the 20th century that the position of the stars in the blue canton of the United States flag became set in stone and some Revolutionary War U.S. flags had 7 white and 6 red stripes instead of the more common and now offical arrangement of 7 red and 6 white stripes. Caerwine 17:06, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

Satsumu?

Ran across Satsuma Islands (a 1911 britannica stub) by random page, and can't quite tell how it fits into this page. Should it be redirected here? — Catherine\ 11:40, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

It seems like "Satsuma Islands" may be an archaic term. Maybe it refers to what is also known as Satsunan Islands. I could find only 23 Google search results for the term. Or maybe it could be voted for deletion.—Tokek 16:16, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Update: I looked into the matter further and found out that "Satsuma Islands" is likely an archaic name for Koshikijima Islands. The Britannica-derived Misplaced Pages version of the article said it belongs to Ryukyu Islands, but that was incorrect speculation. Further explanation given at Talk:Satsuma Islands.—Tokek 10:15, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Flag

The flag looks rather unprofessional to me; does anybody have a more appropriate image?

Rdr0 20:52, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

Supposed conflicts with Japan

Recently I've seen in this article claims of:

1. A series of massacres against the Okinawans perpetrated by the Japanese army that killed off major portions of the Ryukyuan population
2. "big voices for independence and autonomy in some islands"

Also, it's hard to grasp the size of said independence movement, and what percentage of the Ryukyuan population sympathises with this. Does anyone have sources? I am actually not aware of No. 1. I know the Japanese army assasinated opposing polititians in the early years of the Japanese takeover, but I have not heard of major portions of the Ryukyuan population being massacred by Japan in order to clear "the Ryukyans' strong Chinese roots, anti-Japan emotions". In recent years, the deadliest periods that I am aware of was during WWII when the Okinawans were caught in the crossfires, and pre-WWI when Okinawa suffered a famine during a horrible economy. —Tokek 11:22, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

• "ryukyu massacre" - 0 hits
• "ryukyu kingdom massacre" - 0 hits
• "Okinawa massacre" - 1 hit (about a play)

So yeah, there you go. No. 1 looks very fishy, and also sounds like it was written by someone who had just a tad too much of Chinese brainwashing. No. 2 might be negligible for this Encyclopedia, since pretty much anyone anywhere on Earth can desire one's region to gain nationhood. The question is, so what? —Tokek 12:23, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I've posted a request for factual backup in this talk page, in the contributor's talk page (User_talk:72.136.191.136), and Misplaced Pages talk:Japan-related topics notice board. No references brought up. Because the alleged "fact" is very vaguely written and quite possibly false, I will be removing the last edit by 72.136.191.136 from the article. If it later turns out to be true, it can be re-added to the article by someone with better writing skills. —Tokek 12:30, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Update: Oops, I forgot to check the anonymous IP's talk page before I wrote the above. I thought that it would be unlikely s/he would have come back to post a reply, as the last contribution from that IP was in January. S/he says his/her source is a document in Chinese by an anonymous author, which is not online. S/he doesn't know where it is and will have to look for it, then upload it before others can see it. Unfortunately the reply raises more questions than it answers. —Tokek 12:45, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Article renamed

I've renamed this article from Ryukyu Islands to Ryūkyū Islands in accordance with the guidelines in the Manual of Style for Japanese articles. Bobo12345 11:55, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

English place names are generally preferred over local place names where one exists for article titles on English Misplaced Pages (WP:NC(GN)). For example, Venice, Italy, Japan, Bonin Islands, Iwo Jima, Ryukyu Islands are preferred as article titles over Venezia, Italia, Nippon, Ogasawara Shotō, Iōtō, Nansei Shotō. In this article's case, the English place name is not spelled with marcrons (if English place names ever did), hence Ryūkyū Islands should be moved back to Ryukyu Islands.

Originally there was misunderstanding that Ryukyu Islands was the Japanese place name and that Ryukyu Islands = Ryūkyū Shotō. However, the article actually deliberately avoids equating the two, and it is explained in the article that the definition of Ryūkyū Shotō only covers a subset of Ryukyu Islands, a.k.a. Nansei Shotō. —Tokek 23:52, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Well, that's nice. But as we've already discussed this issue to death at WP:MOS-JA, please follow the consensus policy. I have not spent hours and hours changing links to read "Ryūkyū" just for my health. "Ryukyu" (りゅきゅ) is not a word, and conveys no meaning, while Ryūkyū (琉球), just like piñata and Curaçao, is a word. It's just like the common English spelling, but not dumbed down for the masses, with little marks that indicate the proper pronunciation. LordAmeth 08:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Of course I am aware of WP:MOS-JP. To reiterate myself again, Ryukyu Islands is the English term. Nansei Shotō is the Japanese term romanised according to WP:MOS-JP. Ryūkyū Islands is nothing. Nobody uses it and no Misplaced Pages Policy recommends it. Again, *if* Ryukyu Islands were a Japanese term, then Ryūkyū Islands would have been valid according to policy, but that was only a misunderstanding. —Tokek 12:23, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Since there is confusion here, could you explain the meaning of each of the terms for us? Do I understand the following correctly?

• Nansei Shotō = all of the islands stretching between Kyūshū and Taiwan
• Ryūkyū Shotō = a subset of the Nansei Shotō including the Okinawa Islands, Kerama Islands, Daitō Islands, Sakishima Islands, Miyako Islands, Yaeyama Islands and the Senkaku Islands

Is that right? Bobo12345 12:56, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Basically, yes. Ryūkyū Shotō consists of Okinawa Islands and Sakishima Islands. Furthermore, Okinawa Islands consists of Kerama Islands and Daitō Islands, while Sakishima Islands consists of the other islands that you've mentioned.—Tokek 14:22, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

In that case, shouldn't this article actually be renamed "Nansei Islands", and "Ryūkyū Islands" can have its own separate article? What do you think LordAmeth? Bobo12345 22:58, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Sure. That would be fine with me. Of course, since "Nansei" simply means "South-west", it's not really the 'name' of the island chain, it's really just describing it. Whatever you want to do. LordAmeth 09:54, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Since Ryūkyū Shotō is a subset of the collective term Nansei Shotō I will move this article to "Nansei Islands" and create a new page for "Ryūkyū Islands". I'll correct the pages linking to these pages too, including the Regions of Japan template. It looks like I will require Administrator assistance to do this though. Care to help, LordAmeth? :) Bobo12345 13:04, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Requested move

Ryūkyū Islands → Ryukyu — Restore common English name, revert User:LordAmeth's continual edit warring over this. Gene Nygaard 16:19, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

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