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Revision as of 03:03, 4 June 2021 editCorbieVreccan (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers28,682 edits Caution: Removal of content, blanking on St. Joseph's Indian School.Tag: Twinkle← Previous edit Latest revision as of 01:54, 25 December 2024 edit undoDarth Stabro (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, New page reviewers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers11,316 edits →Merry Christmas!: new sectionTag: New topic 
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== Welcome == ==A barnstar for you!==
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|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align:middle;" | {{#ifeq:{{{2}}}|alt|]|]}}
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|style="font-size:x-large; padding:0; vertical-align:middle; height:1.1em;" | '''The Death Barnstar'''
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! <div style="margin:0; background-color:white; font-family:sans-serif; font-size:120%; font-weight:normal; border:1px solid lightgrey; text-align:left; padding-left:0.4em; padding-top:0.2em; padding-bottom:0.2em;">Hello, Natemup! '''] to Misplaced Pages!''' Thank you for ]. You may benefit from following some of the links below, which will help you get the most out of Misplaced Pages. If you have any questions you can ask me on my talk page, or place '''<tt>{&#123;helpme&#125;}</tt>''' on your ] and ask your question there. Please remember to ] on talk pages by clicking ] or by typing four tildes "~&#126;~~"; this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you are already excited about Misplaced Pages, you might want to consider being "]" by a more experienced editor or joining a ] to collaborate with others in creating and improving articles of your interest. Click ] for a directory of all the WikiProjects. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the ] field when making edits to pages. Happy editing! &nbsp; &mdash; ]<span style="margin:0 7px;font-variant:small-caps;font-size:0.9em">&middot; ]]</span> 23:37, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
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== August 2018 ==
] Please do not add new statements immediately in front of citations that do not support the new statements. You did this in the article on ]:
:As of 2016 the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Moscovian Patriarchate has 12,334 officially registered churches, by far more than any other religion in Ukraine<font color="#CD0000">, though the Kievan Patriarchate has more members</font>.<ref name=RISU2016>RISU (Religion Information Service of Ukraine): .</ref>
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By putting the new statement (shown in red above) in front of the citation, you created the false illusion that the citation supported the new statement.

There are other problems.
#The section was about Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Moscovian Patriarchate.
#The new statement did not have a citation.
I have attempted to fix the problem:
:As of 2016 the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Moscovian Patriarchate has 12,334 officially registered churches, by far more than any other religion in Ukraine<font color="#CD0000">,</font><ref name=RISU2016>RISU (Religion Information Service of Ukraine): .</ref> <font color="#CD0000">(though the Kievan Patriarchate has more members){{fact}}</font>.
<references/>
If you do not come up with a citation for your new statement, it will be reverted sooner or later.--<span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">] ]</span> 17:21, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
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== Athens Academy ==

I wouldn't expect someone whose been here for 7 years would have so little knowledge of how we handle disputed new content. I didn't leave you a warning earlier per ]. If a new addition you boldly made is reverted, the proper procedure is to follow ] by starting a discussion on the article talk page. It is never ok to just put it back and insist it's the correct solution. The solution isn't far off. I'm very dubious of the reliability of the website that published this op-ed, so I'll likely continue to dispute your change just based on that (see ]. The fact it's an op-ed is also a problem. If the publication were reliable, all an op-ed can verify is its own opinion. We cannot state that as Misplaced Pages's opinion, which is what you are doing. With a source we can agree is reliable and an op-ed, we could state it "according to X, Athens was founded as a seg academy. ] (]) 20:27, 22 May 2020 (UTC)
:::Content is decided by consensus. Two separate editors have reverted your change. Feel free to push this to ANEW. ] (]) 20:53, 22 May 2020 (UTC)
:::: Consensus was reached long before my edits. There has been a talk section concerning this topic for years, and it was agreed that it should be mentioned in the article that it was a segregation academy. But, for whatever reason, the mention was not there. Probably removed by someone out of bias and not noticed by anyone else. So I added it. Hastily the first time, but this time with a good source. As such, it should remain. ] (]) 20:58, 22 May 2020 (UTC)

:Feel free to make your "according to X" edit, since you know that three reverts in a row spells trouble. The source is fine and I made nothing into Misplaced Pages's opinion. I merely noted that it shouldn't be controversial to call a spade a spade. It's like asking me to provide a front-page newspaper article to source the claim that MLK got assassinated. Peace. ] (]) 20:41, 22 May 2020 (UTC)
:::removed yet again. ] (]) 07:04, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

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== Just a note about ref names ==

Quotes are only need for reference names when there's more than one word in the name. Thus '''name=website''' does not need to be '''name="website"''', but '''name=church website''' must be '''name="church website"'''.

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== Please stop ==

Hi. Please stop adding "African-American Catholics" categories to articles unless it is reliably sourced somewhere in the article as per ], thanks. <b>]]]</b> 09:41, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
:Hi again Natemup. Given you've ignored my message above, I'm still going to give you the benefit of the doubt by writing this instead of ] you with another unsourced warning, though I should note, certainly warrants one. Firstly, please always ] and don't accuse fellow editors of vandalism. It's not conducive to building a better encyclopedia and neither is ignoring concerns regarding your edits brought to your talk page by fellow editors. When we discuss issues, we resolve problems. I, as a volunteer, only have the best interest of the project and its articles in mind and so should you when editing. <s>This means doing so with a ] and without any bias on your part which, on closer inspection of these edits and given your user page, is not the case. It seems that adding person X was an African-American catholic and only that, is more important to you than the ] of the reported info from your sources, such as . It says that he was raised catholic but joined the baptist church later in life. Would it not be more prudent to add all of that to the "Personal life" sections you created? Why just the bit about the catholic church? It gives the strong impression that, given your user page admission, you have an agenda to push.</s> I'm happy to add those that are ] but please keep the quality of these articles in mind when doing so. That brings me to my next point: ] and ] are not reliable sources for ] articles unfortunately and other sources for these should be found. Thank you. <b>]]]</b> 16:05, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
:: On your part, you reverted a series of edits, claiming that they were not sourced. This was true in several cases, and you'll notice I did not dispute them. I accused you of vandalism in the cases where you rolled back an edit on a page wherein it *was* clearly stated that the person is Catholic. And I spared you even on a few of those. As such, we could both be accused of having agendas.
:::Yes, I mass reverted the mass addition as, after checking several of them, I assumed they were all unsourced. I should have checked all of them, agreed. My agenda is making sure all edits pass ].
::Do I focus many of my edits on Black Catholics? Yes. It is my specialty. And on Barker's page, I added that he was both Baptist and Catholic. I added only one category as I was not aware of a Black Baptist category, since that is not my area of expertise.
:::Here I must apologize, so you did and I glanced over your edit too quickly.
::Feel free to remove the religion of these individuals as you see fit, but don't pretend it isn't commonly included on pages of otherwise non-religious articles (not to mention the fact that several of these articles have *no* sources at all). In my understanding, inadequate sourcing is best served with a ref template or talk page edit rather than reverts. ] (]) 16:19, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
:::BLP articles require reliable sources and ] says that the lack thereof should rightfully be challenged. While finding a source for someone else's edits is preferable, reversion is acceptable. If I see the same unsourced cat on any page I do remove it but you were making mass unsourced additions which grabbed my attention and I'm sure there are many articles with many unsourced cats. Thanks for taking the time to reply and attempting to source your edits, though some still need more reliable references as I mentioned earlier. <b>]]]</b> 16:42, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

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== December 2020 ==

] Please stop your ]. If you continue to add ] content, as you did at ], you may be ]. <!-- Template:uw-unsourced3 --> ] (]) 19:55, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
:I added made one major addition, which was sourced from Dr. Ochs book. The other stuff was corrections of erroneous restatements of the existing sources. I could give examples, but you can go see for yourself. Also, the capitalization was per Misplaced Pages policy. I was mistaken to not leave an edit summary, though. ] (]) 22:36, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
::{{u|Natemup}}, you have the policy backwards! ] ] (]) 22:40, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
:::Yes, you're right. I now realize I read a greened quote a few weeks as if it were the Misplaced Pages policy. I had been operating on that reading ever since. My apologies. My other edits will be redone, however, with explanation.

== Speedy deletion nomination of Preslaysa Williams ==

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== January 2021 ==

] You may be '''] without further warning''' the next time you make disruptive edits to Misplaced Pages contrary to the ], as you did at ]. ''We've been here before about ], final warning.''<!-- Template:uw-mos4 --> ] (]) 03:28, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
:It's really not cool to make personal comments on editors to impugn our ] to the project. I suggest that you edit your recent talk page comment and redact that which is not directly oriented toward improvement of the article. ] (]) 03:50, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

::It's directly oriented toward improvement of that and various other articles. ] (]) 04:06, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

== Notice of edit warring noticeboard discussion ==
]
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at ] regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on ]. <!--Template:An3-notice--> Thank you. ] (]) 04:19, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
:Please consider the ANEW report a warning; you need to discuss this dispute on the article talk page instead of reverting each other. Further edit warring will result in being blocked. ] (]) 09:26, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
::{{ping|331dot}} Natemup is continuing his edit warring at ] page. – ] (]) 15:20, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

:::This is a totally different page (Elizium23 was also disputing the ethnicity of Klay's brother Trayce), and you yourself are the one who has broken the 3RR rule here, despite my explanations. ] (]) 15:28, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
::::I have not broke ], because I did not make 4 reverts (I am currently at 3 reverts). Please double-check before making accusations. – ] (]) 15:36, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

== Klay Thompson ==

] You currently appear to be engaged in an ]&#32; according to the reverts you have made on ]; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. Users are expected to ] with others, to avoid editing ], and to ], rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

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:Since you are ignoring everyone, I am issuing this warning notice to you. – ] (]) 15:21, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

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Rather than edit war with you, I have started a discussion at ] regarding your edit. ] (]) 19:25, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
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== ] moved to draftspace ==

An article you recently created, ], is not suitable as written to remain published. It needs more citations from ], ]. <small>(])</small> Information that can't be referenced should be removed (] is of ] on Misplaced Pages). I've moved your draft to ] (with a prefix of "<code>Draft:</code>" before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Misplaced Pages's ] and thus is ready for mainspace, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page. ] <sup>(])</sup>/<sub>(])</sub> 23:59, 5 April 2021 (UTC)

== ] ==

The parent of ] is ]. Bishops are notable for, and therefore categorised by, their diocese, if they have one. Not by their original nationality. Duhart appears to have moved to Thailand and stayed there until he died. There is nothing in the article about his nationality. He was an American missionary, not an American bishop. ] (]) 14:51, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
: The former category itself specifically says "This category includes bishops of the Roman Catholic Church who were American by nationality". The bishop was born and raised in Louisiana. My edits should be reinstated. ] (]) 17:22, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

== May 2021 ==

] You currently appear to be engaged in an ]&#32; according to the reverts you have made on ]. This means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be although other editors disagree. Users are expected to ] with others, to avoid editing ], and to ], rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

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=== STOP! ===

Natemup, ]y edits like are completely unacceptable, and if I see you make such an edit again I will request that you be topic-banned from articles on Japanese history. The fact that ''buke'' status (like, indeed, all occupations in pre-modern Japan) was hereditary is not "unsourced, controversial, idiosyncratic" or "contradictory" but is rather attested on a practically universal level, and ''it doesn't even contradict your claim'' that during the Sengoku and Azuchi-Momoyama periods non-''buke'' could be granted "samurai" status that would subsequently be passed to their descendants.

Anyway, if you want a public domain source that you can check for free online, the eighth paragraph of Lafcadio Hearn's "Feudal Integration" should suffice (I'm using the Delphi collection, which facilitates ''moji-kensaku''ing the entire Yakumo oeuvre, but you'd have to pay money for the page number to be useful). An old but still reputable and authoritative source is page 557 of Sansom's ''A History of Japan, 1615–1867''. a modern scholarly source (sorry, most of my good Japanese history books are ... well, not something I want to read a chapter of just in the hopes that it will make an explicit statement of something that, within the field of Japanese studies, is a given, just to demonstrate said given to someone on Misplaced Pages who seems not to want to accept it).

] (<small>]]</small>) 07:42, 9 May 2021 (UTC)
:Why did you make ? Are you trying to get TBANned? You can consider this a final warning. ] (<small>]]</small>) 02:04, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

::Noted and ignored. ] (]) 02:11, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

== RfC ==

Hi natemup, I can help with the creation of an RfC. There are some steps to follow laid out at ]. If you would like me to do them, the very least I'd need from you is a "brief, neutral statement" about the issue that needs outside comments. ] (]) 12:36, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

:"Due to the existence of one secondary definition of samurai describing them as hereditary, certain editors have reduced the intro of the "Samurai" wiki page to reflect only this description, despite the existence of more primary definitions describing them merely as retainers of a daimyo. A prominent nexus of this controversy seems to be Yasuke, an ancient African man who himself became a retainer of a Daimyo. An entire media universe has cropped around this character and the idea of an "African samurai", but despite this (and the ubiquitous historical and non-historical sources describing Yasuke as such), the aforementioned editors have also modified the Yasuke wiki page to remove mention of Yasuke being a samurai in any sense—which is the entire warp and woof of his significance justifying a Misplaced Pages article. One of these editors has been recently arguing in both talk pages that none of the countless sources referring to Yasuke as a samurai (including those presently abounding in the Yasuke article) meet the qualifications of being a reliable source because they are allegedly not written by scholars with sufficient credentials. He has also cited the hereditary reference in the intro of the Samurai wiki page as evidence—though he himself had a hand in that reference being added and retained. I am requesting comment on this situation so as to establish a consensus on how the Yasuke page (intro and body), and Samurai page (intro and Yasuke section) should read, according to the extant claims from reliable sources."
:Feel free to edit! ] (]) 13:26, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
::I think that length is technically acceptable, although our guidelines strongly recommend keeping the statement quite short, maybe 1-3 sentences. It doesn't seem particularly neutral, though, and it's helpful to frame the question in a way that allows RfC participants to provide up-front vote summaries (they're not really votes but whatever). How about: {{bq|Should Yasuke be described as a samurai in the ] and ] articles?}} You could then use much of your proposed language in your not-vote. {{pb}}I would recommend wrapping up the convo with {{yo|Hijiri88}} on whether the posting at ] is sufficient to get outside comment without needing an RfC. ] (]) 15:58, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

:::Understood. His RSN post seems to deal primarily with the Samurai page, whereas the issue affects the Yasuke page most pertinently and probably others he and his friends have edited as well. ] (]) 16:12, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
::::I don't think that RFC question is appropriate. Currently there are a lot of news sources floating around that are confusing the purely fictional character created by Netflix and LeSean Thomas with the historical figure (about whom very little is known, including his social class). If we just ask a random selection of editors whether he "should be described as a samurai" without clarifying the sourcing issue, it seems likely to cloud the issue rather than clarify it. RSN is the correct venue to ask whether the sources that have been provided thus far (which, again, have not been named: is not valid since virtually none of the sources currently cited in the article are by professional historians of Japan) are sufficient to verify the content in question. (] is an excellent example of what happens when an RFC is used when RSN would have been the appropriate solution -- an issue that should have been resolved within a week was dragged out for '''over a year''', and eventually an admin closed the RFC with what amounted to "roughly half of the !votes need to be thrown out as they are ignoring the sourcing problems or seem to have been made by editors who are ignorant of our sourcing policies". I can see that question resulting in exactly such a scenario.) ] (<small>]]</small>) 22:53, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

:::::I don't care what you think. Glad to go over your head. 😘 ] (]) 01:32, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
::::::Hi natemup, whatever you decide to do, I wish you luck. I think my best response here is to take a step back from helping you, as it's hard to view what I'm doing as neutral technical support, given how much editor conflict is involved. The link at the top of this section is pretty clear cut, so I don't imagine you'll have much difficulty setting up the RfC on your own if that's what you choose to do. ] (]) 01:55, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
:::::::Fine then, how about this: I've stated numerous times that I'm not opposed to "describing Yasuke as a samurai in articles"; in order to get a consensus for or against what Natemup has advocated and I have opposed, the question would need to be {{bq|Should Yasuke be described as a "samurai" in the opening sentence of the ] article without qualification of what a "samurai" is?}} What about that question? ] (<small>]]</small>) 02:08, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

:::::::::Since you are adamant about one secondary definition of samurai, no. There will be no need to qualify, since the word will be linked to the samurai page (which, ideally, will also be corrected to reflect the status quo antebellum).

:::::::::<blockquote>Should Yasuke be described as a samurai in the Yasuke and Samurai articles? Should 'hereditary' be in the lead of the latter, unqualified?</blockquote> ] (]) 11:59, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
::::::::::{{tq|you are adamant about one secondary definition of samurai}} You don't know me. You don't know how I feel about any of these matters beyond what I have chosen to disclose. The definition that you claim I am "adamant" about is one that (as I ''have'' disclosed to you) I am personally not a big fan of, but it is the primary definition given in most English dictionaries (]), as well as the lead sentence of our article currently titled "]". I wish it were a "secondary" definition as you are now claiming, but in English, it is not, and doesn't seem to have ever been.
::::::::::{{tq|the samurai page (which, ideally, will also be corrected to reflect the status quo antebellum)}} Are you still on this "you and a few other editors are the reason that the Samurai article refers to them as hereditary" thing?
::::::::::] (<small>]]</small>) 13:37, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

== Abortion topic sanctions – two reverts ==

You were warned a year and a half ago about abortion topic sanctions. Despite this, you edit warred your viewpoint into ], making two reverts in one day. You might remind yourself that one revert per day is the limit for sanctioned topics. ] (]) 20:06, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
: It's not a viewpoint. A consensus was reached before my entry, and the added wikilink is clearly the intended meaning. That fact hasn't been addressed in the slightest. ] (]) 20:23, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
:{{tps|alc}} {{yo|Binksternet}} my understanding is that topics covered under DS only have the one-revert-rule if an uninvolved admin place such a page restriction. I do see that there used to a broad 1RR application that was ] last September. It would be helpful to me to know if my understanding is wrong. Thanks, ] (]) 20:53, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

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== Bob Dylan's children ==

Hi Natemup, I reverted your edit and I gave the following explanation: Revert, Carolyn Dennis does not claim in Sounes's book that Dylan has "eight or nine" children. Nor does the BBC story make this claim. Sounes's book states Dylan has 6 children (p. 372)

You've re-posted this info: "Dennis has also claimed that Dylan has "eight or nine" children.<ref>"Follow That Dream international" December 1992, a Bruce Springsteen fanzine</ref> ''Follow That Dream international'', a Bruce Springsteen fanzine, is not a ]. {fwiw I've been reading about Dylan and Springsteen for past 50 years and I've never heard of ''Follow That Dream international''. Have you seen a copy of it?) Sounes's biography and Michael Gray's ''Bob Dylan Encyclopedia'' are ] and both state that BD has six children. ] (]) 18:20, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

:The intention was not to establish some new fact about the number of children Dylan has, but to simply reference the fact that Dennis has made that claim—Misplaced Pages being a repository of well-sourced claims moreso than a fact factory. Even so, you may be right that the fanzine is not a reliable source, but it's been included on Dennis' own Misplaced Pages page for some time now. ] (]) 18:50, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

== June 2021 ==

] Hello, I'm ]. I noticed that you recently removed content from ]&nbsp;without adequately explaining why. In the future, it would be helpful to others if you described your changes to Misplaced Pages with an accurate ]. If this was a mistake, don't worry; the removed content has been restored. If you would like to experiment, please use your ]. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on ]. Thanks.<!-- Template:uw-delete1 --> - ] <sup>]</sup> ] 01:50, 4 June 2021 (UTC)


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] Please do not remove content or templates from pages on Misplaced Pages, as you did to ], without giving a valid reason for the removal in the ]. Your content removal does not appear to be constructive and has been ]. If you only meant to make a test edit, please use your ] for that. ''The content is sourced, the plaintiffs allege the abuse happened when they were students at the school, by employees of the school. Your blanking may be considered vandalism.''<!-- Template:uw-delete2 --> - ] <sup>]</sup> ] 03:03, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
|} ~{{Smallcaps|]}}<sup>]{{nbsp}}•{{nbsp}}]</sup> 01:54, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 01:54, 25 December 2024

A barnstar for you!

The Death Barnstar
For being the first to the party. — Kodiak Blackjack (talk) • (contribs) 06:46, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Susan Wojcicki

On 10 August 2024, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Susan Wojcicki, which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. —Bagumba (talk) 14:40, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

CS1 error on Shahan Natalie

Hello, I'm Qwerfjkl (bot). I have automatically detected that this edit performed by you, on the page Shahan Natalie, may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:

  • A bare URL error. References show this error when one of the URL-containing parameters cannot be paired with an associated title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. (Fix | Ask for help)

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, Qwerfjkl (bot) (talk) 07:00, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Invitation to participate in a research

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BGerdemann (WMF) (talk) 19:28, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

ArbCom 2024 Elections voter message

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Merry Christmas!

Merry Christmas and a Prosperous 2025!

Hello Natemup, may you be surrounded by peace, success and happiness on this seasonal occasion. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Sending you heartfelt and warm greetings for Christmas and New Year 2025.
Happy editing,
~Darth Stabro 01:54, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

Spread the love by adding {{subst:Seasonal Greetings}} to other user talk pages.

~Darth Stabro 01:54, 25 December 2024 (UTC)