Talk:Claudette Colbert: Difference between revisions

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			== External links modified ==
	While not widely talked about, Claudette Colbert was a known bisexual to her intimates. Her affair with Marlene Dietrich is mentioned on that page and she had a long standing relationship with Verna Hull who had an adjacent house to hers in Barbados. So far only anonymous users have removed these items. It would be appreciated that before removing them again the person would identify themselves and state their reasons. I knew the persons involved. ] 16:42, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	Who is Verna Hull? Woman of fictitious?--] 01:14, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			I have just modified {{plural:3\|one external link\|3 external links}} on ]. Please take a moment to review . If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
	:Hi Doc. It wasn't me that removed them, however I am in favour of removing them. I appreciate that you knew the people involved and I've read of Colbert described as bisexual, so I'm not disbelieving it. The issue is ]. Obviously nobody is going to dispute the other things in the article about her movies and what-not, but her bisexuality is another story - if a published source could be cited that would greatly improve the situation. I'm sure you appreciate that a lot of gossip and innuendo has attached itself to various Hollywood celebrities past and present - without verification there is nothing to distinguish this from various other lies and half-truths that are scattered throughout numerous biographical articles. ] 13:31, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130114130743/http://www.quigleypublishing.com/MPalmanac/Top10/Top10_lists.html to http://www.quigleypublishing.com/MPalmanac/Top10/Top10_lists.html
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://walkoffame.com/claudette-colbert
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081107112613/http://www.sarahsiddonssociety.org:80/html/Awardees.html to http://www.sarahsiddonssociety.org/html/Awardees.html

			When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the ''checked'' parameter below to '''true''' or '''failed''' to let others know (documentation at {{tlx\|Sourcecheck}}).
	In short, you want to say that Colbert was a bisexual. ] said ''I've read of Colbert described as bisexual, so I'm not disbelieving it. The issue is Misplaced Pages:Verifiability.'' Is it so? Sexual perversion, leave here.--] 13:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			{{sourcecheck\|checked=false}}
	:If that comment is directed at me : no I do not want to say in Colbert's article that Colbert was a bisexual. Do you realize that you are replying to comments that were made more than a year ago? ] is not part of this discussion, so he is not likely to reply. Neither is ] who you have replied to below. You keep bringing my name into things, do you realize that I agree with you that it should not be added? You say it should be left here - it is left here. You are the one that can't leave the subject alone. As you are the only one still making comments about this old discussion, would you like me to archive this section so that it no longer appears on this page? It is obviously bothering you. We can't delete it, but we can move it so that it is no longer visible. Would that help? ] 13:34, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 01:41, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
	Vivien Leigh's fan, leave here.--] 13:47, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			== External links modified ==
	:I'll take that as a "no". ] 14:56, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	Many people testify about ] having been a bisexual. He suggested a thing like it with his autobiography. Who testified that Colbert was a bisexual? her husbands? her friends? Please lead a conclusion from a cause. Please do not give top priority to a conclusion.--] 01:43, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			I have just modified 2 external links on ]. Please take a moment to review . If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
	::Wish that I knew of a source other than first hand knowledge. I knew Verna Hull rather well and worked with her. I met Claudette a time or two with Verna and many intimates knew of their relationship and adjacent houses in Barbados. Neither made a show of it, but in the 1960s it was an accepted fact among their good friends. ] 20:57, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110511172837/http://www.digitaldeliftp.com/DigitalDeliToo/dd2jb-Screen-Guild.html to http://www.digitaldeliftp.com/DigitalDeliToo/dd2jb-Screen-Guild.html
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.sarahsiddonssociety.org/html/Awardees.html

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	Her husband was still alive in 1960's. Did not her friend have to live in the neighbor with her? Are you a delusion maniac? --] 03:39, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			{{sourcecheck\|checked=false\|needhelp=}}
	:You might try "The Sewing Circle" by Axel Madsen but I don't know if she's in it. Though Rossrs states, "Without verification there is nothing to distinguish this from various other lies and half-truths that are scattered throughout numerous biographical articles", as far as Misplaced Pages is concerned, trash between the covers of a book is all that's needed. Madsen's piece of junk should do just fine, focusing as it does on Mercedes de Acosta, Garbo, Dietrich et al. As someone once said of de Acosta's book, "Here Lies the Heart," - "and lies and lies and lies." Forget the typos, the misspellings, the inaccuracies - this is what Misplaced Pages calls a great reference and should suit your purposes. As far as an affair with Garbo, I worked on the Garbo bio by Barry Paris and don't recall any such thing being the case. Paris is extremely thorough, with fastidious source notes, and is highly regarded as one of the best biographers ever. You probably don't see him quoted much on Misplaced Pages.] 01:14, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 02:22, 9 August 2017 (UTC)
	Documents the double life of "The Sewing Circle," a group of lesbians and bisexuals that included Marlene Dietrich, Greta Garbo, Tallulah Bankhead, Joan Crawford, Myrna Loy and Agnes Moorehead.--] 10:18, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			== External links modified ==
	It is a thing heard of for the first time that Colbert has met Greta Garbo. Are not they your ideas at all? Were not the celebrities only combined by force?--] 01:14, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	In response, Colbert's friend Helen O'Hagan told the New York Daily News that the actress barely knew Dietrich or Garbo, and that Colbert was "a man's lady".--] 06:43, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			I have just modified one external link on ]. Please take a moment to review ]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
	::: Boze Hadleigh also wrote about Colbert -- I think his work is unfairly disparaged. I've lived in Hollywood for 24 years and have met many people who confirm Hadleigh's facts from first or second-hand knowledge -- which is a lot better than most accepted history. A few people seem to require a higher standard -- almost impossible to meet -- for the bisexual/homosexual information, and they seem to be on a mission to cleanse all of it from Misplaced Pages.{{unsigned2\| 18:50, 9 August 2006\| 70.7.11.178}}
			*Added archive https://archive.is/20061020015435/http://www.dramadesk.com/1984_1985dd.htm to http://www.dramadesk.com/1984_1985dd.htm

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	Boze Hadleigh, a journalist, interviewer and writer primarily of gossip about ]s of Hollywood.--] 03:57, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

			{{sourcecheck\|checked=false\|needhelp=}}
	::::When writing about people's private lives, a higher standard is required than just hearsay or interviews where there are no tapes or that have been published after a person's death when they can't deny them and can't sue. If you're going to write that some people at Misplaced Pages don't want to put unfounded statements in an article, you should sign your message.] 09:19, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 03:01, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
	She was a noble lady. Leave here if you want to do obscene stories.--] 13:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			I am confused as to how the fact that she drove a Lincoln Continental and a Ford Thunderbird, could be relevant in an article about a person in the acting arts.
	:::How does this work, a direct quote from Chapter 11 of ''The First Lady'' (a re-release of "]'s Odyssey" by ] by Duncan Fallowell (London: Jonathan Cape, 1982, ISBN 0-224-01849-3): "And I visited Verna Hull who often came to AD8 when she was in London. She lived next door to Claudette Colbert with whom she'd shared a house for many years. But they'd fallen out and despite living only feet apart they didn't speak at all." Also, in an article about Colbert that was published in the Spanish newspaper ] in 2006 is the following information: "mantuvo una larga relación con una mujer llamada Verna Hull, su vecina en la isla caribeña de Barbados". ] 22:04, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
			A significant portion of the article reads like your average Hollywood gossip magazine.

	Duncan Fallowell's book, the biography of a trans-sexual, ''April Ashley's Odyssey'' (1982).--] 06:00, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

	::::After Colbert's death, her purported bisexuality was explored most deeply in a well-reviewed book about gays, lesbians, and bisexuals in Hollywood, which was written by William J. Mann. I have added it to the article, though carefully using qualifiers re her sexuality, which remains unknown, or at the very least, unproven. But since the book was well-reviewed and considered by most critics I've found on LexisNexis and ProQuest as well researched, it merits inclusion in the article.] 22:06, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

	], an iconoclastic-openly gay author and film historian. His book ''Behind the Scenes: How Gays and Lesbians Shaped 1910-1969''--] 01:23, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

	There is no source in the above-mentioned though a lot of sentences were being written. All are the comments on anonymity. Nevertheless, other party's real name comes out. Then, what on earth was her marriage? Were her marriages all lies? There is not explanation about it at all as above. Please put out the source if she has met even once with Garbo. I can think only with the third-rate gossip that people liking a so erotic story finished. If such a thing was written in the Misplaced Pages, the 💕, Who testified? Or, who saw? Please write such evidence. It can be thought an extremely unfair way.--] 06:34, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

	==Vanity Fair==
	Vanity Fair did a article on Colbert a few years back and researched the bisexual/lesbian rumor and came up with nothing proving it or no one who knew her who would confirm it so it's apparently not true. ] 03:25, 2 March 2006
	:Not correct, don't know who Vanity Fair talked with, but not the ones in the know if that was their conclusion. Do you know the date? I'd like to read the article. As stated above I met her and knew her longest standing lover Verna Hull who was very open about their relationship in the 1970s. ] 18:47, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

	This comment is a little confusing; what bisexual? what lesbian? Please supply references etc for inclusion in the article.--] 01:23, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

	Please write not the rumor going around town but the source. Please write not your guess but evidence. How did the person who knew her during the lifetime make a remark for her? Or please write the fact that the third person watched her.--] 08:27, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

	==Trivia section==
	As per Misplaced Pages's general attitude towards trivia (]) I am going to attempt to remove the section by either absorbing relevant information into the article, and removing anything that is either irrelevant to a general appreciate of Colbert's life and career, or contravenes ]. I am recording my views for each point here, as I expect disagreement. I would welcome ''discussion'' here if anyone disagrees with edits related to this section.

			] (]) 20:10, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
	<s>*Relations between her mother and grandmother were poor. Colbert was closest to her grandmother. ''needs citing, but maybe somewhat relevant and could easily be added into the article''</s>
	::has been added to article. ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*She worked as a stenographer, a salesclerk in womens' clothing, and a tutor, in order to pay her expenses at the ]. ''could easily be added into the article''</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*''For the Love of Mike'' (1927) is a lost film; the print no longer exists. ''relevant as her film debut and could easily be added into article''</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*Colbert made ten films at ] in Queens, New York. ''maybe relevant, could be added if the right place in the article is determined.''</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*She co-starred three times respectively with ] and ]. ''irrelevant''
	<s>*Ellie Andrews of '']'' (1934) was a part refused by all other actresses in Hollywood. ''really? every single one? so if ] had wanted to do it, they would have let her?'' Even Colbert accepted only on condition that the salary be doubled and that the picture would take only four weeks to make. ''significant film, interesting comment, could be added, needs source though''.</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*She did not attend ] at first in 1935, because she thought that ] would win the Oscar. However, she was taken to the hall by the academy staff afterwards. ''of minor relevance''
	*Her first marriage was originally kept secret; she and ] did not even live together. ''this point is covered in the article slightly. the comment as it stands here is irrelevant as it does not attempt to answer the most important question - why did they do this?''
	*] also was an actress who did not allow to take the photograph only from the left side as well as Claudette Colbert. ''irrelevant''
	*She got sick during production of '']'' (1937). Therefore shooting of the film was prolonged. ''irrelevant. she also injured her back and missed playing in ''All About Eve'' - much more significant''
	*Production of '']'' (1939) cost a large amount of expense. ''almost every film "cost a large amount", what's so special about this one? irrelevant.
	Production of Drums Along the Mohawk (1939) cost more to produce than her other movies.--] 22:00, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*Scenes showing Colbert's face from the right show she was equally lovely from that side, but such shots are hard to find. ''then wait until one is found and then quote someone of repute declaring her to be lovely. Misplaced Pages should not be presenting this opinion, just the facts.''
	*Colbert had talent of business. ''this comment means nothing without further explanation. ''
	Colbert moved about well on the business side in the Hollywood age.--] 21:54, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*There was no romance between Colbert and men other than her husband. ''this is outrageous. how would anybody but Colbert know this?''
	There was no rumor that she had the romance with men other than her husband.--] 22:00, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*She had used the house in Palm Springs as a second home when she was living in Los Angeles. ''irrelevant''
	*She worried about becoming overweight and was careful about not overeating. ''most actresses had the same fear if they wanted to keep working. irrelevant. ''
	She was worrying about her health.--] 22:00, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*Claudette did not work overtime. ''irrelevant without further context/explanation. how is it significant?''--] 21:54, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*The idea of a villa in Barbados came to her following a visit to ]'s house in ]. ''could be mentioned in the article, though it's not particularly important it would be part of an exisiting paragraph''.</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*In 1963 she appeared in television commercials for ] coffee. ''should be put into the article''</s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	<s>*Although in 1969, Colbert said that she intended to write a book entitled "How to Run a House" for her friend's ]'s ] Press, this was not to be. She never even published an autobiography. ''should be put in article - but needs a source'' </s>
	::has been added to article ] 20:37, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
	*She kept two dogs in the active times and kept a cat in later years. ''irrelevant'' ] 13:41, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

	:I was going to get rid of most of the trivia, but since you're already on the job, more power to you. I agree with nearly all of your comments (I don't think an unwritten book merits inclusion though). ] 05:52, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

	==Mrs. Pressman==
	The first sentence called her "Mrs. Pressman". I removed that, since it's rather odd and doesn't exist in any other articles in Misplaced Pages. It was re-added and my edit called vandalism. It was a good faith edit, not vandalism. I'd appreciate input from others on this topic. ] 22:47, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

	] is repeatedly calling my edit vandalism and is now issuing threats to me on my Talk page. ] 23:03, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
	::Calling her Mrs. Pressman is very unusual and not in keeping with the style of Misplaced Pages, there's probably a guideline in the ] somewhere. You can remove that message from your talk page as it appears to be issued in ]. ] <small>]</small> 23:39, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
	:::Thank you. Another editor has removed it. ] 23:41, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

	Colbert had two husbands. She divorced the first husband immediately. She lost the second husband. Therefore, she was a widow.
	Spouse(s), Norman Foster (1928-1935),
	Dr. Joel Pressman (1935 – his death in 1968),
	She was interred beside her second husband.

	Because it erased a public fact for a personal thought, is not it destruction?--] 00:49, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

	Enough of this Mrs Pressman silliness! She was Claudette Colbert. There is ample reference made to her marriage to Dr Pressman in the section "Marriages". If there is a place for this reference, that is where it belongs, not in the first sentence of the article. ] 12:13, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

			== External links ==
	:Exactly. This is nothing but silliness. "Claudette Colbert" is the name she made famous. And this, from ] states it plainly and clearly :

			:I removed three entries from the "External links" that contribute to ]:
	:''"But in '''all''' cases, a woman should be called by the name she is most widely known under. ], even though she was married eight times, would not be referred to under those other surnames."'' (my emphasis. I don't think I can state strongly enough that this applies to '''all''' cases.) ] 12:44, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
			* {{Tcmdb name}}
			* <nowiki>{{Amg name\|14003}}</nowiki>
			* at Virtual History
			:Please feel free to incorporate any possible into the article or join a discussion if wishing to add any back. ] (]) 22:56, 13 August 2019 (UTC)

			== Sentence in the The early films, 1928-1934 section makes no sense. ==
	Because you want to say that she was a lesbian, you do not like ''Mrs. Pressman''?--] 13:37, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			The next to last sentence in this section makes no sense. The sentence reads "Her character to "hold man" (Chevalier again) might surpassed co-star Miriam Hopkins, according to an analyst." There is a footnote reference for this sentence, but I can not help thinking that the sentence is not quoted correctly from that source. Can anyone help? ] (]) 00:47, 6 April 2024 (UTC)
	:No. Read my earlier comments ''carefully'' - I do not want to say Colbert was bisexual or lesbian or heterosexual. I don't want to say she was anything but an actress. I said earlier that I thought the comments should be removed. How could you misunderstand that? All articles must follow Misplaced Pages's guidelines. It was decided long ago that a person should be referred to by the name they are best known for. There are thousands of articles on Misplaced Pages about actresses - the '''only''' one I have ever seen where the name was followed by "Mrs .....", is this one. Not ], not ], not any other married actress, just Claudette Colbert. We are not going to make a special rule for Claudette Colbert just because you are bothered by it. You are making a huge leap if you think it somehow means I want to suggest that Claudette Colbert was bisexual. I do not know or care about her sexuality. OK? Click on this link and read it please :]. Read it through a few times so that before you comment again, you know exactly what you are talking about.

			== Pronounciation ==
	:The bit you need to read is this "''"But in all cases, a woman should be called by the name she is most widely known under. ], even though she was married eight times, would not be referred to under those other surnames."'' ] 13:47, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			The IPA pronounciation given, /koʊlˈbɛər/, is different from the American "kohl-BAIR" without any indication of why this is so. ] (]) 10:24, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

			== Another sentence that makes no sense ==
	The person who doubts that she was a bisexual even once must leave here.--] 13:57, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

			"During the filming of Tovarich (1937), director Anatole Litvak favored co-starring Charles Boyer over her in the camera angles, so she got very frustrated the boorish arrogance and be perem ptory." - what does the part after the last comma mean? ] (]) 23:22, 18 August 2024 (UTC)
	:Well that would be you, as you've made it clear that you doubt she was bisexual. You obviously haven't bothered taking my suggestion, so I'm not going to try to help you any more. But as you're leaving, I guess it doesn't matter. ] 14:03, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

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I am confused as to how the fact that she drove a Lincoln Continental and a Ford Thunderbird, could be relevant in an article about a person in the acting arts. A significant portion of the article reads like your average Hollywood gossip magazine.

109.67.73.116 (talk) 20:10, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

External links

I removed three entries from the "External links" that contribute to link farming:

{{TCMDb name}} template missing ID and not present in Wikidata.
{{Amg name|14003}}
Claudette Colbert at Virtual History

Please feel free to incorporate any possible into the article or join a discussion if wishing to add any back. Otr500 (talk) 22:56, 13 August 2019 (UTC)

Sentence in the The early films, 1928-1934 section makes no sense.

The next to last sentence in this section makes no sense. The sentence reads "Her character to "hold man" (Chevalier again) might surpassed co-star Miriam Hopkins, according to an analyst." There is a footnote reference for this sentence, but I can not help thinking that the sentence is not quoted correctly from that source. Can anyone help? 204.122.26.61 (talk) 00:47, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Pronounciation

The IPA pronounciation given, /koʊlˈbɛər/, is different from the American "kohl-BAIR" without any indication of why this is so. 2A02:AA1:1648:1F73:B50A:857C:6E7F:8B79 (talk) 10:24, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Another sentence that makes no sense

"During the filming of Tovarich (1937), director Anatole Litvak favored co-starring Charles Boyer over her in the camera angles, so she got very frustrated the boorish arrogance and be perem ptory." - what does the part after the last comma mean? 195.213.70.0 (talk) 23:22, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

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