| Revision as of 05:37, 18 December 2022 editBeccaynr (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users29,602 edits →Lead sentence definition: ReplyTag: Reply← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 17:34, 9 November 2024 edit undoLowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,301,937 editsm Archiving 2 discussion(s) to Talk:Gender/Archive 11) (bot |
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== C-class downgrade == |
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], can you please elaborate on ] to class C? You gave as the reason, ''downgrade to C-Class due to lack of citations, see also: ]'' [linked discussion now in ]].) This article has 205 citations, which at a size of 147 kb works out to 1 citation per 717 bytes. I checked another article in the gender space, ], which has 257 citations in 177 kb, or 1 per 690 bytes, so roughly the same as this one. Yet, FGM is a featured article, so it would seem that this number of citations could be appropriate for a FA for other articles as well. So, at a minimum, I don't see that as a valid argument for a downgrade below FA, and since this one started out at 'B', I think it should be restored to 'B'. ] (]) 08:24, 21 October 2022 (UTC) |
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:] I agree with your reasoning. I should've been more through with my assessment. ] (]) 12:51, 21 October 2022 (UTC) |
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:: Thanks for the assessment review, and for your comments. (Needless to say, it could be subject to reassessment based on other factors, and as assessing editor shouldn't shy from that if applicable.) Cheers, ] (]) 15:30, 21 October 2022 (UTC) |
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== Lead sentence definition == |
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I propose changing the lead sentence to something like: |
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*{{tq|Gender is "the behavioral, cultural, or psychological traits typically associated with" the male or female sex in humans}}. ''Merriam-Webster'' |
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This is consistent with the current source (Palan, K. (2001)): "ender is the cultural definition of behavior defined as appropriate to the sexes in a given society at a given time." ] (]) 01:06, 17 December 2022 (UTC) |
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: Oppose. If you check , you'll see that they don't have one. (But note that they do have .) So, I think they are adding the definition of ''gender role'' to ''gender'', because they don't have another place for it. In fact, the definition you quoted, is pretty close to what I think of as a definition of ''gender role'', and I don't think your proposed definition should be used here. Notice that it is only the 2b definition; why pick that one and not, say, the 2a definition, which it equates to the ''sex'' 1a definition? (Rhetorical question; definitely don't do that!) The point here being, a (good) dictionary lists *all* meanings of a term (not only the primary one) including less frequent usages. Here, they are listing *all* the ways that the word ''gender'' can be used, and it's true that it sometimes it is used to mean "sex" (as in 2a), and sometimes it is used to mean "gender role" (as in 2b). But in no way is 2b the primary definition of it, and we shouldn't cherrypick that version and imply that it is. ] (]) 09:50, 17 December 2022 (UTC) |
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::Is the subject of this article not the 2b meaning? If not, which dictionary definition of gender are we discussing here? ] (]) 10:40, 17 December 2022 (UTC) |
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::{{u|Mathglot}}? ] (]) 00:12, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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::: Thanks for the ping. As to the questions, I think I'll bow out, and let more major contributors jump in. Not that I'm avoiding things—I may pop in later—but I'm a bit gendered out at WP articles for the moment, and need to lurk or play a more minor role here for a bit. But I will subscribe, and watch with interest, and rejoin, perhaps, at a later time. Thanks again! ] (]) 00:43, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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A better definition may include gender roles: |
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*{{tq|Gender is "the socially constructed roles, behaviours, activities, and attributes that a given society considers appropriate for" humans of a particular sex}}. |
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The article ] may need to be merged here, or this article should be shortened to encompass just an overview of all of the concepts of gender. ] (]) 02:13, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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Or |
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*{{tq|Gender is the roles and behavioral, social, cultural, and psychological characteristics that a society typically associates with humans of a particular sex}}. |
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"Socially constructed" is implied by "a given society typically associates with". I'm trying to simplify this to something like what {{u| Clicriffhard}} and {{u|Tewdar}} had discussed at Draft:Female (gender).] (]) 05:29, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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:The source cited for the above suggestion also states {{tq|In biosocial terms, gender is not the same as sex.}} There is the artice ], as well as the sources and the developing lead in ] that seem relevant to consider - there does not appear to be support for a definition of gender that is as strictly tied to "a particular sex". I think precision in terminology will be helpful, given the occasional overlap in informal uses of the words. ] (]) 05:37, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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The picture of a naked man abd a naked woman illustrate human sexes. It does not illustrate their genders (which as drawings they can't have). A depiction of human genders would need to involve some element of how two people behave as society provides for them to act according to their sexes. For instance, the male might be holding a hunting weapon appropriate for big game, and the female might be weaving a basket. ] (]) 16:44, 24 June 2024 (UTC) |
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== ] and ] == |
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fyi, this draft includes sources in the article and on the Talk page that may be helpful for expanding this article, including the lead. There is a related discussion at ] with sources that may also be of interest to editors. ] (]) 02:32, 18 December 2022 (UTC) |
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:By the time the ] bearing that image launched, 1) The terms ''gender'' and ''sex'' had started to be used more interchangeably, and 2) most human societies had evolved far beyond the hunter/gatherer stage. ] (]) 19:48, 24 June 2024 (UTC) |
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::This article has changed a lot since I first started working on it. Back then "gender" was the most common way to refer to whether any organism, human or otherwise, was male or female. And by "most common," I mean "in the English language overall," not "in the social sciences as written in English." If you said "sex," it'd be like that time on ''The Simpsons'', when Lisa said "These dolls are sexist" and the other girls laughed and said "Lisa said a dirty word!" As Haig writes, in and around 2003, the words were functionally interchangeable. I like that the article shows that the FDA changed its in-house definition of the term more than once. We could use a few examples from outside the U.S. ] (]) 20:45, 11 August 2024 (UTC) |
The rise of criticism against the WID approach led to the emergence of a new theory, that of Women and Development (WAD). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dhum.group2 (talk • contribs) 17 May 2019 (UTC)
In contemporary times, most literature and institutions that are concerned with women's role in development incorporate a GAD perspective, with the United Nations taking the lead of mainstreaming the GAD approach through its system and development policies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dhum.group2 (talk • contribs) 17 May 2019 (UTC)
The picture of a naked man abd a naked woman illustrate human sexes. It does not illustrate their genders (which as drawings they can't have). A depiction of human genders would need to involve some element of how two people behave as society provides for them to act according to their sexes. For instance, the male might be holding a hunting weapon appropriate for big game, and the female might be weaving a basket. P0M (talk) 16:44, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
level-3 vital article is rated B-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
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