Revision as of 05:29, 29 February 2024 editRenamed user 0e40c0e52322c484364940c7954c93d8 (talk | contribs)6,278 edits →RSP#WikiLeaks: ReplyTag: Reply← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 21:48, 25 October 2024 edit undoTom.Reding (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Page movers, Template editors3,891,546 editsm -{{BLP}}; +blp=yes (request); cleanupTag: AWB |
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{{Canvass warning|short=yes}} |
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{{Old AfD multi| date = January 12, 2007 |
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{{Old XfD multi| date = January 12, 2007 |
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| result = '''Speedy Keep''' |
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== Date quote reported == |
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== Daily Dot questionable? == |
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@] I partial reverted , why are the Daily Dot articles questionable? ] (]) 22:10, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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We don't need to include the time, or the time after death, that a quote from ] was reported by ''The New York Times''. If it's on the page it should be sourced and given accurately. But such a detail is not relevant to the article. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 12:36, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:Consensus has determined it ] for the reasons given at the time it was raised. It certainly ought not to be relied upon for contentious statements of fact. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 22:59, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::{{tq|Consensus has determined}} The RSP you cite says {{tq|There is no consensus}}. |
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::It does not say {{tq|It certainly ought not to be relied upon for contentious statements of fact.}} It says {{tq|there is community consensus that attribution should be used in topics where the source is known to be biased or when the source is used to support contentious claims of fact.}} Why do you think the statements are contentious? If it is we can attribute it like the RSP you cite says ] (]) 23:19, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::We could, but given that this appears to be the only source which makes certain claims, it's more appropriate not to give this slightly dubious source excessive weight in the article. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 23:23, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::I ask again. Why do you think the statements are contentious? |
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::::Why is it ]? it is not unlikely, particularly difficult to verify, ambiguous and open to interpretation, and no RS makes different claims |
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::::Why is it ] It is not widely acknowledged as extremist, promotional in nature, or rely heavily on rumors and personal opinions ] (]) 23:31, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::Similarly, the Daily Beast is not regarded as a high-quality and reliable source, particularly for statements of fact about living people. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 23:38, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::You did not answer. Please stop ignoring questions. |
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:::::About Daily Beast, you were ] with no consensus and nothing has changed |
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:::::And WikiLeaks is not a living person, BLP does not apply to the organisations Twitter account does it? ] (]) 23:44, 21 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::Some instances have other sources, so the use of low-quality sources is redundant. Others make claims not reported on by any other sources, not even by better sources (such as Wired) that focus on tech/cyber reporting and that closely reported on WikiLeaks. We ought not to give undue weight to 1 source lacking a strong rep for reliability. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 02:00, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::::Please stop ]. You have cited things and said they had consensus for things they did not. You mention other policies that do not seem supported and are not answering about it ] (]) 10:49, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::::It’s time to stop making false claims that I’m ignoring questions. What you mean is that I’m not answering them the way you want. That's not on me. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 13:16, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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We should be using mainstream ] with strong reputations, not shoestring sites with little or no evidence of editorial oversight and disagreement on reliability. Hence I replaced e.g. the DailyDot website with '']''. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 05:03, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:Sources like the one about the password and the quote use the word {{tq|reportedly}} to describe the quote. It uses that word twice and brings up the timeline |
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:{{tq|The password is a reference to a famous quote by former US President John F. Kennedy, '''reportedly''' given to a senior administration official one month before he was assassinated by Lee Harvey Oswald in 1963. According to the official, quoted in a New York Times report published three years after his death, Kennedy said he wanted “to splinter the CIA in a thousand pieces and scatter it to the winds”.}} |
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:I agree it should be sourced and given accurately, and an inflammatory quote should have context. Saying who published and that it was years after the person died is normal ] (]) 12:42, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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::That source usefully points out the provenance of the password in the quote. More reliable sources, including ''The New York Times'' and the academic work cited, simply give this as a quote. The claim of three years is factually incorrect. There's no indication that it's "{{tq|inflammatory}}". What do you think is the relevance of the date it was published to this article about Wikileaks? <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 12:52, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:::{{tq|There's no indication that it's "inflammatory"}} A President allegedly saying the CIA should be {{tq|shattered}} is not ]? Am I understanding a word wrong again? ] (]) 12:58, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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::::It's a quote from the US president about a proposed internal policy decision. What do you think is the relevance of the date it was published in a US newspaper of record to this article about Wikileaks? <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 13:04, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::Any quote first published years after someone died is questionable because they can't respond to it or deny it. If its inflammatory and we attribute it we should say when it was published or link to a wiki article that has context ] (]) 13:10, 12 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:{{tq|with little or no evidence of editorial oversight and disagreement on reliability.}} You described WikiLeaks |
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== Move or rename Inadequate curation and violations of personal privacy == |
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:{{tq|Hence I replaced e.g. the DailyDot website with The Atlantic}} You replaced one source with The Atlantic and removed the others without replacing them, or even adding a {{citation needed}} first like I did |
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:And you still havent explained why it is dubious or contentious ] (]) 10:51, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::Read the first and last sentences of your own comment. Your posts are becoming absurd. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 14:05, 22 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::My input is probably not warranted here, but I would like to point out that you are not answering. You call the source "dubious" despite the fact that there is no concensus behind it. Leaving unanswered the question of why you think the statements from the source are questionable. ] (]) 18:51, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::You may wish to {{tq|point out}} what you claim, but given it's not true, it's not "pointing out" something but merely making a false claim about the above comments. I agree that such input is not warranted, nor is it productive. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 20:38, 15 April 2024 (UTC) |
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== Donations via cryptocurrency: oddly missing from the article == |
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] should be changed to Curation or moved to ]. Editorial policy has a response section. For NPOV it should have information about claims that WikiLeaks publications never hurt anyone added |
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The article prose mentions "donation" or "donations" 30 times, and extensively covers bank and credit card donations, and the ectensive efforts of various state and financial entities to stop or halt such payment channels to WikiLeaks. Yet it makes no mention at all of WikiLeaks accepting donations in ]. |
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] and ] ] (]) 12:43, 26 October 2023 (UTC) |
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Odd that. The official website of WikiLeaks, linked as the first item in the "External links" section of the article, clearly indicates that WikiLeaks is set up to receive donations in at least a half dozen digital assets, that do not pass through banks or credit card processing centers. ] (]) 16:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC) |
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== Page size and changes == |
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== Semi-protected edit request on 26 June 2024 == |
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Two points: |
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* Page size has now reached 114 kB. Policy says pages of > 100 kB should "Almost certainly should be divided or trimmed". |
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* It is easier to follow changes when they are made in small increments. |
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] (]) 06:33, 1 November 2023 (UTC) |
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{{edit semi-protected|WikiLeaks|answered=yes}} |
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:I replaced a lot of the reception with a summary because of ] |
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'''MINOR GRAMMAR EDIT:''' |
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:Size is now 96 kB ] (]) 22:16, 5 November 2023 (UTC) |
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Line says "times '''were'''" - source article uses grammar that I think is correct "instances '''where'''" - if not protected I'd have changed it to "times where". |
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== Typo. == |
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Hello, i wanted to warn users with edit perm that in 2011–2015 section, the word "malware" is written as "mawlare". ] (]) 11:33, 13 February 2024 (UTC) |
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:{{ping|Rei Da Tecnologia}} I've fixed it. ]] 13:55, 13 February 2024 (UTC) |
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''In response to a question in 2010 about whether WikiLeaks would release information that he knew might get someone killed, Assange said that he had instituted a "harm-minimization policy." This meant that people named in some documents might be contacted before publication, '''but that there were also times were members''' of WikiLeaks might have "blood on our hands." One member of WikiLeaks told The New Yorker they were initially uncomfortable with Assange's editorial policy but changed her mind because she thought no one had been unjustly harmed.'' ] (]) 15:24, 26 June 2024 (UTC) |
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== Minor typo == |
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:{{done}}. '''〜''' <span style="font-family:Big Caslon;border-radius:9em;padding:0 7px;background:#437a4b">]</span> ] 15:53, 26 June 2024 (UTC) |
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== About the ] announcement on the top == |
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"In 2013, the organisation assisted Edward Snowden leave Hong Kong" |
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I think it's very necessary to add the announcement about "WikiLeaks is not part of, also have no relations with us Misplaced Pages" at the top of the page. But I can't find a proper way to add it. So I want to ask others' opinions about this suggestion. ] (]) 14:41, 4 July 2024 (UTC) |
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It should be |
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:Is there any evidence anyone is confused?--] (]) 01:36, 6 July 2024 (UTC) |
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::There was a problem many years back with people who clearly ''were'' confused posting hostile comments on this talk page: see e.g. this discussion. I'd be surprised if it is still happening now with enough regularity to be an issue though. ] (]) 01:50, 6 July 2024 (UTC) |
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== Typo == |
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"In 2013, the organisation assisted Edward Snowden in leaving Hong Kong" ] (]) 02:46, 20 February 2024 (UTC) |
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The word "raided" is mistakenly repeated in the sentence "In March 2009, German police raided raided the offices of Wikileaks Germany and the homes of Theodor Reppe, who owned the registration for WikiLeaks' German domain while searching for evidence of 'distribution of pornographic material'." ] (]) 05:40, 20 July 2024 (UTC) |
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== RSP#WikiLeaks == |
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:Fixed. ]] 15:23, 20 July 2024 (UTC) |
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== Trump–Russia relations == |
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{{tq|Citing your own easy is cute}} essay went through ] and ]. Content copied from WP policy pages. I cited ] first. Ignoring RSP {{tq|is cute but}} against policy. Ignoring consensus required {{tq|is cute but}} against policy. |
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Is this really relevant ? ] (]) 09:24, 31 July 2024 (UTC) |
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{{tq| but it’s common practice across the site to cite the subject’s own website for information about what it says it’s done}} Not when the site doesn't meet RSP. {{tq| It may be appropriate to cite a document from WikiLeaks as a primary source, '''but only if it is discussed by a reliable source'''.}} |
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I didnt remove '''any''' content and I left citations to WikiLeaks about what they said. It should be easy to find sources that meet RSP. ] (]) 14:25, 25 February 2024 (UTC) |
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:thats how templates work ] (]) 04:42, 2 August 2024 (UTC) |
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:Considerations of reliability for information outside of the article subject are not at issue here. No-one is disputing the 2021 RfC. Like numerous other news and media organisations (and other institutions and individuals – see ]) we can cite the Wikileaks website for information about the views or outlook or what is presented as content on the Wikileaks website. <span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#4682B4 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#4682B4 -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]— ]</span> 15:18, 25 February 2024 (UTC) |
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::] {{tq|Self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources of information about themselves, usually in articles about themselves or their activities, without the self-published source requirement that they are established experts in the field, so long as:}} |
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::{{tq|1. the material is neither unduly self-serving nor an exceptional claim;}} |
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::{{tq|2. it does not involve claims about third parties;}} |
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::They are self serving and ] and they involve third parties |
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::And @] said {{tq|Yes, ABOUTSELF allows linking to the main index page and About page, but WikiLeaks hosts lots of illegally obtained content, and I believe we are not allowed to link to such URLs. This list links to many such pages.}} ] |
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::Valjean started ] you said {{tq|Pinging @Diannaa as the resident expert to see whether such links represent a copyright issue.}} and no answer ] (]) 05:29, 29 February 2024 (UTC) |
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The article prose mentions "donation" or "donations" 30 times, and extensively covers bank and credit card donations, and the ectensive efforts of various state and financial entities to stop or halt such payment channels to WikiLeaks. Yet it makes no mention at all of WikiLeaks accepting donations in cryptocurrency.
Odd that. The official website of WikiLeaks, linked as the first item in the "External links" section of the article, clearly indicates that WikiLeaks is set up to receive donations in at least a half dozen digital assets, that do not pass through banks or credit card processing centers. N2e (talk) 16:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
I think it's very necessary to add the announcement about "WikiLeaks is not part of, also have no relations with us Misplaced Pages" at the top of the page. But I can't find a proper way to add it. So I want to ask others' opinions about this suggestion. Awdqmb (talk) 14:41, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
The word "raided" is mistakenly repeated in the sentence "In March 2009, German police raided raided the offices of Wikileaks Germany and the homes of Theodor Reppe, who owned the registration for WikiLeaks' German domain while searching for evidence of 'distribution of pornographic material'." 2001:16B8:DEF:E100:507E:A9D5:6C00:932C (talk) 05:40, 20 July 2024 (UTC)