| Revision as of 20:58, 8 October 2007 editAnythingyouwant (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Template editors91,258 edits →Involved parties: Spelling out acronym on first use.← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 00:05, 19 November 2024 edit undoMediaWiki message delivery (talk | contribs)Bots3,139,117 edits →ArbCom 2024 Elections voter message: new sectionTag: MassMessage delivery | ||
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| ==Archives== | |||
| : Beginning of Time to 14 March 2007 (plus one comment by Ferrylodge on 27 September 2007). | |||
| : | |||
| 14 March 2007 to 14 May 2007. | |||
| ⚖️ | |||
| : 14 May 2007 to 15 June 2007. | |||
| == Help with adding to Talk page == | |||
| : 15 June 2007 to 11 September 2007. | |||
| I would like to add a sentence to the Hunter Biden laptop controversy article. I see that you have made edits to the page. The page is protected, so I went to the Talk page | |||
| An archive of banishment proceedings against Ferrylodge is . | |||
| ] | |||
| == Freddie == | |||
| and clicked "Click here to start a new topic", then composed my suggestion. But when I click "Add topic", it just shows moving slanted lines for a second, and then gives up. I have tried this several times. What do I need to do to actually add the topic? ] (]) 03:20, 12 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| Thanks for the invite, but I believe you misunderstood what I had said. The wrong version refers to an essay on meta, found at ]. When there are sides in a debate, you are bound to protect the "wrong version" from one side's perspective. It's a lose, lose situation. No matter what, when a sysop protects a page during a content dispute, it is the "wrong version". My comment was thus referring to this idea, and I was not expressing my opinion that the version was in fact, wrong. But thanks again for bringing it up, and I might just chime in when I get some time.-] </sup>]] 04:09, 12 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::I reported the glitch at ]. I assume you’re not a registered user, but if you become one then it will likely work for you.] (]) 05:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| :::I have a login, Swan2024, which I created several hours ago in case that was the reason I couldn't add the topic. Is that sufficient for "registered user"? ] (]) 05:21, 12 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Should work without logging in, but almost certainly will work when you’re logged in, ]. Good luck. The likely cause of your difficulty is that you were trying to add a topic with just one or two words in the header, and/or one or two words in your comment. Misplaced Pages requires more words from users who aren’t logged in, so as to filter out spam.] (]) 05:56, 12 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| == Regarding ] == | |||
| == Photos == | |||
| First, thank you for restoring the text I mistakenly removed. I have restored directly from Carguychris' edit. If you believe your version is better, than just revert my last two edits. | |||
| I imagine it has something to do with ]. There is a bug where some images from commons are not showing, and the developers know about it and are working on it. Hopefully, it will be cleared up soon enough. Hope this helps.-] </sup>]] 17:50, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ], here is my perspective. You made a claim there are not reliable sources, which was refuted. You made a claim that it was the media that amplified the hoax, which has not been proven outside unreliable sources like Fox News. When you provide your list of sources, then we can see your perspective and discuss. Until then, it looks like the three of us don't agree with your perspective. Alternatively, if you want to suggest alternative wording, then go ahead and do so. I already made one such change when you didn't agree with the word 'they' and am willing to work together on wording. I just am opposed to the removal of details about what happened. --] (]) 04:39, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| :Just found out purging the image pages over on commons (]) gets them to show (at least on my computer). Not sure if it's necessary to do this though if another solution is already under works.-] </sup>]] 17:53, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :To explain why I didn't get your other ping and seemed to be ignoring your message, you put your signature on a newline. As noted at ], "he edit must be signed by adding <code><nowiki>~~~~</nowiki></code> to the end of the message." The system acted as if you had made two messages and ignored the ping to me in the first message. Hope that clears things up a bit. --] (]) 05:02, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| ==Pregnancy== | |||
| :], thanks for visiting my user talk. Regarding nazis, please see ], which says, “The first paragraph should define or identify the topic with a neutral point of view, but without being too specific.” You say above that you’re “opposed to the removal of details about what happened.” But I don’t object to putting nazi details in the article body, or even later in the lead if people feel strongly about it. Just not in the opening paragraph. As far as I know, nazis had no effect on what happened in Springfield, nor any effect on what GOP politicians did. What a horror show Misplaced Pages’s articles on political events would become if they all began with commentary from the nazis on the left, and the Marxists on the right.] (]) 05:12, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| Sorry, our revs got crossed. ... ] 18:37, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Sources say that neo-Nazi groups were spreading the message along with far-right groups. Given the prominence in reliable sources, we are following a ] by mentioning it in the lede. As for the order of stuff, the only thing I could see that has a shot would be splitting off everything after the first sentence of the first paragraph into a new second paragraph and moving all of the old second paragraph into the first paragraph following the first sentence. | |||
| :That talk page history is awfully long for today - Ferrylodge, do you have a dif or preferably several of Photo modifying and/or deleting posts? That's completely unacceptable. Thanks - leave here, I have your page on watch, or leave on my talk page. ]<sup>]</sup> 18:53, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::{{Blockquote|text = Starting in September 2024, baseless claims and rumors spread online that Haitian immigrants were stealing pets in Springfield, Ohio, and eating them. Springfield and county law enforcement said that no credible reports or evidence support the claims, and the city's mayor, the city manager, and Ohio Governor Mike DeWine have all denounced them. The claims were widely described as racist. Fact-checking website Snopes called the claims unfounded, while others characterized them as a hoax or a lie.<br />The claims began with a local Facebook group post sharing a neighbor's story that her daughter's friend's cat had been butchered, then spread quickly among far-right and neo-Nazi groups. These claims were amplified by prominent figures in the American right, most notably Republican vice-presidential nominee JD Vance whose constituency includes Springfield, then by his running mate Donald Trump, along with allies such as Laura Loomer, and X owner Elon Musk. The person whose Facebook story started the controversy later admitted she never spoke to the cat owner and admitted the story lacked credibility.<br />The pet-eating claims spread amid existing racial tensions in Springfield, where recent legal Haitian immigration reversed population decline, but strained some public resources. There had been previous incidents of hostility towards the local Haitian community and unfounded local rumors of Haitians stealing waterfowl and food. After the claims spread, dozens of bomb threats prompted Springfield officials to close public buildings, including the city hall and elementary schools, and DeWine deployed state police to conduct daily sweeps of the facilities.}} | |||
| ::He . After I put it back, he .] 18:55, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::I don't know if it could be considered an improvement or not as it waits until the second paragraph to explain what is debunked, though it does put more emphasis that the claims are false. Other than that, I don't have much of a suggestion outside of this other one: | |||
| :::Well, renaming the section is acceptable, if not being done in an insulting, disruptive manner - for brevity or clarity or easier navigation. But deleting someone else's posts (except on one's own talk page) is a complete no-no in almost all cases. Your edit was not a blatant personal attack nor was it silly vandalism, which are the usual exceptions. I've left a warning on Photo's talk page. Thanks much for the diff, that history was daunting to look at and I had no idea where to start. ]<sup>]</sup> 19:35, 15 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::{{Blockquote|text = Starting in September 2024, baseless claims and rumors spread online that Haitian immigrants were stealing pets in Springfield, Ohio, and eating them. The claims began with a local Facebook group post sharing a neighbor's story that her daughter's friend's cat had been butchered and rose to national prominence by Republican vice-presidential nominee JD Vance whose constituency includes Springfield, followed then by his running mate Donald Trump, along with allies such as Laura Loomer, and X owner Elon Musk. The person whose Facebook story started the controversy later admitted she never spoke to the cat owner and admitted the story lacked credibility.<br />Springfield and county law enforcement said that no credible reports or evidence support the claims, and the city's mayor, the city manager, and Ohio Governor Mike DeWine have all denounced them. The claims were widely described as racist and having been spread quickly among far-right and neo-Nazi groups in the area. Fact-checking website Snopes called the claims unfounded, while others characterized them as a hoax or a lie.<br />The pet-eating claims spread amid existing racial tensions in Springfield, where recent legal Haitian immigration reversed population decline, but strained some public resources. There had been previous incidents of hostility towards the local Haitian community and unfounded local rumors of Haitians stealing waterfowl and food. After the claims spread, dozens of bomb threats prompted Springfield officials to close public buildings, including the city hall and elementary schools, and DeWine deployed state police to conduct daily sweeps of the facilities.}} | |||
| ::If either of the two work for you, then go ahead and try it. --] (]) 07:58, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| ::Oh and I am ]d to this discussion, so feel free to ping or not as I will know either way. --] (]) 08:00, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| :::I always prefer being chronological where possible, which helps people to comprehend what happened, one step at a time. That’s why I generally like the opening paragraph as it stands now: it summarizes the major developments one step at a time, in a clear manner. Except that I just think the nazi detail needs to be moved lower in the lead or removed from the lead. As I explained here at my talk page, I am not aware that any nazis affected what happened in Springfield, or affected how GOP politicians reacted to the whole thing. When nazis spread rumors, they typically do so on nazi websites and other places where nazis hang out, but AFAIK they’re not able to spread rumors into the mainstream, and the latter might be significant if it happened, but I’m not aware that it did happen.] (]) 10:37, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Understood. I did reply on the talk page about what they did in Springfield. As for lowering it in the lead, try it and see if it works. --] (]) 20:48, 18 September 2024 (UTC) | |||
| == Invitation to participate in a research == | |||
| == Article in the Washington Post == | |||
| Hello, | |||
| It was interesting to read about you in the Washington Post this morning. It sounds much like the person I now know to be Ferrylodge. However, you might like to ask them to clarify if you're a man or a woman. As in, the statement currently reads, "and another editor who goes only by Ferrylodge, a Republican and a Thompson supporter. (''He'' recently gave the former Tennessee senator a $100 donation.)... She is, though she's not yet sure who she will support." . Keep up the good work. ] 18:48, 17 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| The Wikimedia Foundation is conducting a survey of Wikipedians to better understand what draws administrators to contribute to Misplaced Pages, and what affects administrator retention. We will use this research to improve experiences for Wikipedians, and address common problems and needs. We have identified you as a good candidate for this research, and would greatly appreciate your participation in this ''''''. | |||
| == Why don't we talk about the "health" effects of abortion on the fetus??? == | |||
| You do not have to be an Administrator to participate. | |||
| ???] 20:45, 17 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| The survey should take around 10-15 minutes to complete. You may read more about the study on its ] and view its ] . | |||
| == Wikistalking == | |||
| Please find our contact on the project Meta page if you have any questions or concerns. | |||
| Ferrylodge, your accusation is way out of line, and unacceptable. You don't ] ] or any other article, nor do you have the market cornered on interest in the subject. Perhaps ''you'' should read the section on Wikistalking that you pointed me to - and then tell me just how I had harassed you or disrupted anything by making one comment on the talk page in support of what I believe to be another editor's correct criticism of a section of the article. And please don't tell me how long that wording has been in the article - that doesn't mean it is right. I think you owe me an apology - but if you think you're right, I suggest you make your accusation in a more formal way, because innuendo is not going to cut it. <strong>] </strong>|<small>]</small> 05:58, 19 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| Kind Regards, | |||
| :I am not making accusations. Some users are unaware that it is bad form to follow other users around. If you are following me around (from ] to ] to ]), then I would kindly ask you to please stop. However, if it is merely a bizarre coincidence, then we can leave it at that. If you want to continue this discussion, please do it at the article talk pages. Thanks.] 13:50, 19 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ] | |||
| ::It's only bad form if one is doing it to harass. It's perfectly OK, for instance, to check a vandal's contribs and go around correcting them. Or similar cases where one suspects that a particular user's edits are suspect and need another eye. And one way one might get that suspicion is by tangling with them on one page. So long as the edits one makes after following them around are valid, it's not wikistalking. -- ] 16:05, 19 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| <bdi lang="en" dir="ltr">] (]) 19:27, 23 October 2024 (UTC) </bdi> | |||
| :::Thank you, Zsero - that is correct. And Ferrylodge, I think you know that I am a very experienced editor with over 7500 edits, and I know Misplaced Pages policy, so don't be disingenuous. I'm continuing this conversation here because it isn't germane to the article talk page. Pointing someone to a policy page and suggesting they read it is certainly implying an accusation. I'll continue to edit whatever pages I please, and having seen what I and several other editors have identified as appearing to be POV-pushing, it's possible that you'll see me editing other pages that you also edit, and commenting on their talk pages, to try to rein it in. There's been no disruption or harassment on my part - disagreeing with someone's POV is not harassment. There's policy on that too - you might look at it. <strong>] </strong>|<small>]</small> 18:01, 19 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
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| == ArbCom 2024 Elections voter message == | |||
| ::::As might you.] 12:58, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| <div class="ivmbox " style="margin-bottom: 1em; border: 1px solid #a2a9b1; background-color: #fdf2d5; padding: 0.5em; display: flex; align-items: center; "> | |||
| :::::Again - where exactly have I harassed you or disrupted anything? And where have I accused you of anything? You play rather loose with facts, Ferrylodge, as I've mentioned before. <strong>] </strong>|<small>]</small> 23:04, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
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| Hello! Voting in the ''']''' is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on {{#time:l, j F Y|{{Arbitration Committee candidate/data|2024|end}}-1 day}}. All ''']''' are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once. | |||
| The ] is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the ]. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose ], ], editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The ] describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. | |||
| ::::::I have said several times that I am not accusing you of anything, Tvoz. You, however, have been following me from one article to the next, accusing me of being disingenuous, accusing me of playing loose with facts, accusing me of acting like I own an article, and accusing me of POV-pushing, et cetera. Following other editors around without a good cause is not acceptable, Tvoz — in fact, it's very clearly defined as disruptive behavior and disallowed by ]. I am far from convinced that you have good cause. In any event, please post no more at this talk page. Thanks.] 19:05, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
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| == Blocked == | |||
| </div> | |||
| <div style="padding:5px; border:1px solid #c0c090; background-color:#FEC;" class="user-block"> ] You have been ''']''' from editing for 48 hours in accordance with ] for violating the ] {{{{{subst|}}}#if:stillbirth|at ]}}. Please be more careful to discuss controversial changes or seek ] rather than engaging in an ]. If you believe this block is unjustified, you may ] by adding the text <!-- Copy the text as it appears on your page, not as it appears in this edit area. Do not include the "nowiki" tags. --><nowiki>{{</nowiki>unblock|''your reason here''<nowiki>}}</nowiki><!-- Do not include the "nowiki" tags. --> below. {{{{{subst|}}}#if:''']''' <sup>]</sup> 16:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC)|''']''' <sup>]</sup> 16:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC)}}</div><!-- Template:uw-3block --> | |||
| </div> | |||
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| Reverts: , , , . ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 16:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| {{unblock reviewed|1=The last two reverts are very different from the first two. The last two edited the lede to INCLUDE the word "uterus" in the lede. The first two edits edited the lede to EXCLUDE the word "uterus" from the lede. That is what the controversy was all about: whether the lede should include the word "uterus". The lede has included the word "womb" for years.|decline=Please reread ]. The reverts do '''not''' have to involve the same material each time. Your four edits serve to reintroduce "womb" each time in any case. — ] 17:10, 20 September 2007 (UTC)}} | |||
| I would also like to add that KillerChihuahua has been attacking me personally and harassing me all day today. At the ] article today, she that my words are "bullshit". At the ] article today, she that I am "naive and disingenuous." At the ] article today, she that I was trying to insert a "vulgar" word into the article. It astounds me that an admin can get away with such incivility, and I find it very difficult to respond in a constructive way to her personal attacks. | |||
| More recently, at the Stillbirth article, she that I am a "spammer". Actually, the "spam" to which she referred was a list of definitions of the word "womb" from reliable sources, and I had not previously listed those definitions (or '''''any''''' of them) anywhere else, prior to listing them in the Stillbirth article. | |||
| Instead of responding intelligently and civilly to those definitions, she ignored them, disparaged them as "spamming", continued her edit-war against the word "womb" in all pregnancy-related articles. | |||
| I did not violate 3RR here. The third and fourth cited edits were reverting to a lede that included KillerChihuahua's preferred term "uterus". The first and second edits reverted to a version of the article that did not include KillerChihuahua's preferred term "uterus."] 17:01, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ==Apologies== | |||
| My apologies. I thought 3RR meant reverting three times to a previous version, which of course I did not do. | |||
| However, I do not offer any apologies to KC. She is an uncivil edit warrior who has repeatedly and personally attacked me today.] 17:31, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :Looks the other way around to me; like you're attacking her. If you're really the aggrieved party here and not interested in scoring hits against KillerChihuahua you'd be following ] instead of violating it I think. And I see that you were blocked for 24 hours in May for Clearly you've got a grudge against KillerChihuahua, I suggest steering clear of her and ceasing the personal attacks. If not you're simply making yourself look worse and digging your hole deeper. ] 21:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::I have no grudge against KC. I do not like having to address the "harassment " charge over and over again, but since you have brought it up I will briefly address it again. Unlike the present 3RR charge (which I have apologized for above), the harassment charge was bogus, in my view. Killerchihuahua never asked me to leave her talk page. Bishonen asked me to leave KC's talk page, but Killerchihuahua did not. I did leave after denying the harassment charge, and I was blocked for denying the charge. How many other people at Misplaced Pages are blocked for harassing someone who never asked to be left alone? And then when I brought an RfC against Bishonen, Bishonen , who proceeded to make a mockery of the RfC by , and the like. It was a disgraceful episode.] 22:58, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::So it's all KillerChihuahua's, Bishonen's and "all her friends" fault. I see. Sorry, I'm not buying it. ] 23:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::I don't really care if you buy it or not.] 23:49, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Your repeated incivility towards KillerChihuahua is tempting me to extend your block. A sincere apology would be a VERY good idea. ] ] ] 22:15, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::You have it backwards, Swatjester. If you would look at the previous section above, you would see that the incivility has been toward me. Calling my words "'''''bullshit'''''", suggesting that I am "'''''naive and disingenuous'''''", falsely accusing me of "'''''spamming'''''", saying that my words are "'''''vulgar'''''" --- this is the kind of incivility that has been directed towards '''''me'''''. | |||
| :::Want more examples? KC says that my words are "'''''inane'''''." she suggests that my words indicate I am "'''''congenitally dense'''''". | |||
| :::I will not apologize to KC, so block me for as long as you please.] 22:38, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| OK. A forced apology is not going to solve anything anyway. Ferrylodge and KillerChihuahua obviously don't get along. There's been incivility on both sides, as is common when 2 editors don't get along. The best approach at this juncture is probably just for everyone to simmer down, sit out the 3RR block, and try disengagement or ] when you come back. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 22:49, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :I agree with MastCell. Swatjester, when a user is blocked, it's natural that he feels aggrieved, and the kindest and fairest approach is to ignore comments that you find problematic, unless they cross a certain threshold. For example, if someone is blocked for vandalism, or severe BLP problems, and, during his block, he fills his talk page with " has sex with little boys", then I wouldn't hesitate to extend the block to indefinite. But to call someone an uncivil edit warrior is hardly the kind of thing we block people for, even though I completely disagree that KillerChihuahua is anything of the kind. If we did extend blocks for that, then you'd have to start handing out an awful lot of blocks to people who have been in dispute with Ferrylodge. I'm quite sure KC is able to put up with a blocked user writing such things during a block. It's part of being an admin. She's had worse things said about her; I've had worse things said about me; I'm quite sure you've had worse things said about you. Ferrylodge is blocked for 48 hours. He hasn't told people to fuck off or called them assholes. Some people do that with impunity on Misplaced Pages. Why on earth would we extend his block for expressing his frustration inappropriately but not aggressively? It would completely send the wrong message. | |||
| :And Ferrylodge, KillerChihuahua has already pointed out that "vulgar" has more than one meaning. Nor did she imply that you were "congenitally dense". She said that your behaviour served no purpose, "unless your purpose to convice others you are congenitally dense." That's quite different. ] ] 22:55, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Ferrylodge has shown no contrition. That's the difference between some users who get the point of a short block (or even a warning before a block is implemented) and those that don't. So, I slightly disagree with ElinorD and MastCell. Moreover, and what hasn't been discussed herein, Ferrylodge has a long history around here in a POV-warrior mode of editing. History matters here. ] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 23:06, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::He did show contrition for violating 3RR, which is what he was blocked for. He wasn't blocked for incivility or anything else; I'm really hesitant to block established contributors for that sort of thing. Yes, I think it would be nice if he offered an olive branch instead of entrenching his position with regard to KillerChihuahua, but to be clear, the block had nothing to do with the feud between him and KillerChihuahua. As far as his history, I did take into account his prior 3RR block, hence this block was 48 hours rather than 24 (which is what I usually use for first-time 3RR violations). ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 23:43, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::I think I was referring to the community ban request. Oh well, this may be irrelevant. ] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 23:55, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::I apologize to Misplaced Pages and to MastCell and to Yamla for violating 3RR due to my misunderstanding of the rule. But I will not apologize to KC. I'll give KC a pass on the word "vulgar" because it is (rarely) used to refer (condescendingly) to the "ordinary people in society." But no pass on the rest of her incivility. And I would urge admins to visit the ] article and look at the way she blithely reverts without engaging in any discussion, rudely dismissing detailed references to reliable sources as "spam." It's highly offensive to me, and I do not understand how an administrator can just run roughshod like that.] 23:10, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::None of which addresses your standing personal attacks above and chronic harrassment of Killerchihuahua. That's the topic here. There's a limit of how much of this the community needs to suffer. ] 23:50, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::None of this matters. Someone has taken it to a request for community ban on Ferrylodge. It's about time. ] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 23:55, 20 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::Excellent timing! What better moment for KC to pounce than when I am unable to defend myself. Bravo! That lady earns her screen name. See .] 00:27, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::::A great comment to be used in determining your community ban. Very civil.] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 00:53, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::::That comment has apparently prompted efforts to allow me to respond, and high time too. ] 00:57, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::::::Rudeness prompted nothing. Fairness did. If you cannot understand the difference between the two, then this is going to be very difficult. ] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 01:14, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::::::::If I were you, Orangemarlin, I wouldn't be levelling accusations of rudeness, after rudely complaining right here at this talk page about the "immature rantings" of another editor.] 01:35, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::::::::Good attempt at transference. ] <small><sup>] ]</sup></small> 01:51, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| It will take more than 48 hours for this to be decided, in all probability. If you wish to make a statement, you can do so here on your talk page and I will link to it, if you wish. Or you can request unblocking for the purpose of posting there. ]<sup>]</sup> 00:41, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :I request unblocking for the purpose of posting there.] 00:45, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Hang on, let me contact the blocking admin. ]<sup>]</sup> 00:50, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Done. ]<sup>]</sup> 01:02, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::I am still not able to edit at the Community sanction noticeboard.] 01:05, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Ah, I meant "done" as in, I have contacted the blocking admin, sorry for any confusion. ]<sup>]</sup> 01:06, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| (undent) I'm still not able to edit at the Community sanction noticeboard. FYI, I will be travelling tomorrow until Monday, and therefore will not be able to respond on Friday, Saturday, or Sunday.] 01:53, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :I apologize for the delay in responding; I was away from the computer. I've unblocked you so you can participate in the ] discussion. In terms of article editing, I would prefer if you waited a bit, but blocks aren't intended to be punitive, so if you're okay with abiding by ] you can go ahead and edit as you feel is appropriate. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 03:07, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Thanks.] 03:37, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::I still get an error message when trying to edit: "You are unable to edit Misplaced Pages because someone using the same internet address (an 'IP address') or shared proxy server as you was blocked. Your ability to edit Misplaced Pages has been automatically suspended as a result. Note that you have not been blocked from editing directly."] 03:52, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::I can't edit from the computers at work, but can at home.] 10:00, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::That was due to a lingering ] on your work IP from the 3RR block. I tried to find and remove the autoblock, but the autoblock-finding tool wasn't showing any. As it turns out, . I apologize for that - I tried to undo the autoblock, but was stymied by technical problems which I am only now becoming aware of. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 20:48, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::: Well, it's kind of moot now, since he's a) been banned and b) away over the weekend. This whole thing is a travesty. -- ] 21:19, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::::I agree. I got back at midnight on Sunday, and was already banned. Anyone can look at the discussion at ] that prompted this ban, and see what happened there.] 19:16, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| == Banned == | |||
| In light of the evidence of your misdeeds and the overwhelming support for banning you at ], you have been blocked indefinitely from editing Misplaced Pages. ] 18:24, 21 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :This comment is premature, since the discussion is ongoing. ] 10:52, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Correction: He is indeed indef blocked. What he may not be is banned; that discussion is indeed ongoing, as I have reverted the archiving which was put in place. However, indef blocked, with or without a community ban, is still indef blocked. ]<sup>]</sup> 11:02, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::But an indefinite block is not a community ban. The tags prejudiced the discussion. ] 11:26, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Actually, it can be, and often is. The definition of a community ban is that an editor is blocked indefinitely, and no administrator unblocks. That is ban by default, always has been. Discussion by the community at large is optional - BAN states it "may have discussed" which clearly indicates it may '''not''' have been discussed anywhere at all. CSN is quite new, comparatively. Until and unless someone unblocks, this is ''ipso facto'' a ban. From WP:BAN: "There have been situations where ... he or she has been blocked long term (usually indefinitely)... and no one is willing to unblock them. ...Users blocked under these circumstances are considered to have been "banned by the Misplaced Pages community."" In fact, the majority of community banned users never even saw CSN. Some have a brief appearance on ANI for review, but that is not always the case. Some are indef'd and only appear on ANI when they appeal the block - which more often than not results in support, which turns the indef into a community approved ban. Sometimes they are given a second chance. ]<sup>]</sup> 11:44, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| For the record, I am of the opinion that a consensus was not achieved in Ferrylodge's case, that the discussion was closed prematurely, and that it was directed in such a way that other options could not be explored. It unsatisfactory that he was blocked only for a few brief periods before this attempt at a permanent block. It may have been possible to set conditions on his continued editing, such as: | |||
| * Ferrylodge abide by any clear consensus, as suggested by Gatoclass | |||
| * Ferrylodge agree to avoid editing pages relating to pregnancy and abortion | |||
| It is obvious that Freeylodge has annoyed many folk and a considerable change in his approach to Misplaced Pages is needed. ] 23:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :Why are you posting that here? Banno, if you want to discuss the closing with someone, I suggest you talk to Ryulong, who closed the darn thing (twice and most recently), although you might prefer to talk to FeloniousMonk, who only closed it (before Ryulong reclosed it, last closure) because you chastised him for '''not''' closing it. ]<sup>]</sup> 23:39, 22 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Ryulong did not close the CSN discussion, but archived the inappropriate vote section, then re-archived after it had been wrongly un-archived and FM had closed the discussion. I posted this here because I wished to flag my concerns, but not to aggravate the situation by re-opening the CSN discussion or unblocking FL. I'm happy to leave the next step to FL and admins who have not so far been involved. ] 00:32, 23 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :My view of the series of events does not align precisely with that interpretation, but as I've already gone through my I won't repeat it here. <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 09:59, 23 September 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> | |||
| ::Odd, it doesn't match my view of the events either. No doubt this could be a case of selective interpretation of the events in order to defend an erroneous posistion based on a questionable conclusion that may been based on a superficial scanning of the actual facts. The other option would reply on the ascription of motive, and I'd rather not go there. ] 15:43, 23 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Jim62sch's opinion sounds right to me. ] ] ] 18:41, 23 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::KC and Jim are right. A review of the evidence shows that FM was clearly enforcing a ban, not a block, and someone was trying to spin it as the latter. ] 19:14, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| Anyone interested in reading more about this travesty can see .] 19:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| *I think you probably have a good chance of being heard by the arbitration committee on this. You'll have to email one of the clerks or arbitrators though, so that you can be unblocked to make a case. Or they may allow you to make a case via email. I missed the whole shebang, but it seems like it was closed a bit quickly. Anyway, if it was me, that's what I would do. - ] 19:48, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Thanks Crockspot, for your comment. Due to time pressure, I was not able to contact any other editors, and was only barely able to . This ban request was initiated while I was blocked, and removal of that block was delayed. The ban was expedited, and was complete by the time I got back Sunday night.] 19:56, 24 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| == List of banned users == | |||
| Ferrylodge has been listed at ], as per the ]. Someone who is more comfortable with this ban might like to provide the rationale. ] 21:11, 26 September 2007 (UTC) | |||
| == ArbCom == | |||
| {{unblock reviewed|1=This unblock request is for appealing an indefinite ban to the Arbitration Committee. I plan to appeal later this week. The unblock request is limited to this purpose. The ban is for “attempted harassment.” Previous discussion of the ban can be found at my talk page, and at the Community Sanction Noticeboard.|decline=No need to unblock you. You conduct the appeal through email and you do not need to be unblocked for that purpose. — ] 15:37, 7 October 2007 (UTC)}} | |||
| :I will unblock you for this purpose only, on the condition that you understand that anyone will reblock you if you edit anything other than the ArbCom pages. Do you understand and agree? -- <b>] ]</b> 15:53, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :To Yamla, he's entitled as anyone to have a public forum for the review of his block, which was more than a little controversial. What possible reason is there to not afford him this opportunity? And if he edits one thing, it's back to indef-land. -- <b>] ]</b> 15:56, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::Yes, I agree. This unblock request is for appealing an indefinite ban to the ]. I plan to appeal later this week. The unblock request is limited to this purpose. The ban is for “.” Previous discussion of the ban can be found , and at the .] 15:57, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::There's no reason to unblock him. Appeal to ARBCOM requires that you email them. If the unblock request is to be discussed, ARBCOM can unblock this account under the conditions outlined. He has the opportunity to have his block reviewed by ARBCOM but this does not require that he be unblocked. It would be inappropriate for him to edit the ARBCOM pages in order to get his block reviewed (at least, at this time). --] 16:02, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Well, when it is decided how I should proceed, I will proceed. Please note that, .] 16:07, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| :::::"they should contact a member of the committee or an Arbitration clerk by email and ask that a request be filed on their behalf. Generally speaking, the banned user will make the request on his or her talk page, which will be copied to Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration by a clerk. In some cases, a banned user may be unblocked for the purpose of filing an appeal." You contact an arbitration clerk by email. If that clerk believes your request has merit, they may unblock you. There's no reason for us to unblock you at this time as you have not contacted an arbitration clerk yet. And if you had, they may unblock you, there'd still be no reason for an administrator who is not an arbitration clerk to lift the block. --] 16:17, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::: I don't see any good rationale for refusing this unblock. If he edits outside the parameters of ARBCOM, he can easily be blocked again. Since there was a great deal of disagreement whether or not there was consensus for the block in the first place, his request should be honored. - ] 23:28, 7 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| I think Yamla is correct on the letter of the law, as these things are usually handled via email as he spelled out. However, in this case I don't see any harm in unblocking Ferrylodge for the limited purpose of appealing his ban to ArbCom. The point of requiring banned users to use email is to prevent them from damaging Misplaced Pages further. I don't think Ferrylodge is going to go on a spree if he's unblocked; and if he does misuse the unblock to edit outside of an ArbCom request or attack other users inappropriately, then he can always be reblocked. I'm inclined to agree with ]; though the letter of the law certainly specifies email, I don't see the harm in an unblock for the specific purpose of an appeal to ArbCom. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 00:34, 8 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| {{tick|18}} '''Done'''. I have unblocked you in accordance with your request and per the above discussion. Please remember that edits to any page other than ArbCom pages and relevant user talk pages will result in an immediate re-blocking. -- <b>] ]</b> 20:32, 8 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| == Draft Request for Arbitration == | |||
| I'm creating this section to put together a draft request for arbitration, regarding my banishment from Misplaced Pages. This comment is a work in progress, and will be edited by me. '''''I would appreciate if other users would please not edit or insert any comments into this section of my talk page, although further sections can be created.''''' Once this draft is done, then I'll make the request to ArbCom, as described by . It may take me a few days to do this, because I'm tired of dealing with this whole thing. But, given my view that the ban was unjustified, I feel that ArbCom should be given an opportunity to review it. | |||
| Misplaced Pages guidelines say that, So, that's what I'll do. | |||
| Directions say to fill in the names of the involved parties, and provide links to any prior attempts to resolve the dispute (such as formal or informal mediation or talk page discussion). | |||
| State the request in 500 words or fewer, citing supporting diffs where necessary. Show the Arbitrators that there is a dispute requiring their intervention; do not try to prove the case at this time. If the case is accepted for Arbitration, an evidence page will be created that can be used to provide more detail. | |||
| === Ferrylodge v. FeloniousMonk === | |||
| : '''Initiated by ''' ] '''at''' 19:07, 8 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
| ==== Involved parties ==== | |||
| *{{userlinks|Ferrylodge}} | |||
| *{{admin|FeloniousMonk}} | |||
| *{{admin|KillerChihuahua}} | |||
| <!-- The editor filing the case should be included as a party for purposes of notifications. If desired, wording such as "(initiating party)" may be added. Substitute "admin" for "userlinks" if a party is an administrator. --> | |||
| ; Confirmation that all parties are aware of the request | |||
| <!-- All parties must be notified that the request has been filed, immediately after it is posted, and confirmation posted here. --> | |||
| ; Confirmation that other steps in ] have been tried | |||
| <!-- Identify prior attempts at dispute resolution here, with links/diffs. If prior dispute resolution has not been attempted, the reasons for this should be explained in the request for arbitation --> | |||
| KillerChihuahua proposed a community ban of Ferrylodge on 20 September 2007 at the Community Sanction Noticeboard (CSN), while Ferrylodge was blocked for violating the Three Revert Rule (3RR). The community ban was implemented the next day by FeloniousMonk for what FeloniousMonk called "attempting to harass other users". Ferrylodge was unblocked on 8 October 2007 for the limited purpose of pursuing an appeal. | |||
| Different methods of dispute resolution instead of an immediate ban were proposed, such as simmering down or a Request for Comments (RfC). However, those other dispute resolution methods were bypassed. KillerChihuahua explained her reason for not attempting other methods of dispute resolution, as follows: "I doubt that an Rfc would be of any help, because in the few previous instances I have seen of community input, Ferrylodge showed himself resistant to the concept that he could possibly have erred at all." Actually, Ferrylodge has often admitted mistakes and apologized, including 22 minutes before KillerChihuahua's statement to the contrary, and the day prior to KillerChihuahua's statement to the contrary. | |||
| ==== Statement by Ferrylodge ==== | |||
| ==== Statement by FeloniousMonk ==== | |||
| ==== Clerk notes ==== | |||
| : (This area is used for notes by non-recused Clerks.) | |||
| ==== Arbitrators' opinion on hearing this matter (0/0/0/0) ==== | |||
| * | |||
| ---- | |||
| ] 19:07, 8 October 2007 (UTC) | |||
Latest revision as of 00:05, 19 November 2024
⚖️
Help with adding to Talk page
I would like to add a sentence to the Hunter Biden laptop controversy article. I see that you have made edits to the page. The page is protected, so I went to the Talk page
Talk:Hunter Biden laptop controversy
and clicked "Click here to start a new topic", then composed my suggestion. But when I click "Add topic", it just shows moving slanted lines for a second, and then gives up. I have tried this several times. What do I need to do to actually add the topic? Swan2024 (talk) 03:20, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
- I reported the glitch at Misplaced Pages:Village_pump_(technical)#IP_editor(s)_cannot_edit_talk_pages. I assume you’re not a registered user, but if you become one then it will likely work for you. Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
- I have a login, Swan2024, which I created several hours ago in case that was the reason I couldn't add the topic. Is that sufficient for "registered user"? Swan2024 (talk) 05:21, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
- Should work without logging in, but almost certainly will work when you’re logged in, User:Swan2024. Good luck. The likely cause of your difficulty is that you were trying to add a topic with just one or two words in the header, and/or one or two words in your comment. Misplaced Pages requires more words from users who aren’t logged in, so as to filter out spam. Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:56, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
- I have a login, Swan2024, which I created several hours ago in case that was the reason I couldn't add the topic. Is that sufficient for "registered user"? Swan2024 (talk) 05:21, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
- I reported the glitch at Misplaced Pages:Village_pump_(technical)#IP_editor(s)_cannot_edit_talk_pages. I assume you’re not a registered user, but if you become one then it will likely work for you. Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
Regarding Springfield, Ohio, cat-eating hoax
First, thank you for restoring the text I mistakenly removed. I have restored directly from Carguychris' edit. If you believe your version is better, than just revert my last two edits.
Regarding the neo-Nazi debate, here is my perspective. You made a claim there are not reliable sources, which was refuted. You made a claim that it was the media that amplified the hoax, which has not been proven outside unreliable sources like Fox News. When you provide your list of sources, then we can see your perspective and discuss. Until then, it looks like the three of us don't agree with your perspective. Alternatively, if you want to suggest alternative wording, then go ahead and do so. I already made one such change when you didn't agree with the word 'they' and am willing to work together on wording. I just am opposed to the removal of details about what happened. --Super Goku V (talk) 04:39, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- To explain why I didn't get your other ping and seemed to be ignoring your message, you put your signature on a newline. As noted at Template:Reply to, "he edit must be signed by adding
~~~~to the end of the message." The system acted as if you had made two messages and ignored the ping to me in the first message. Hope that clears things up a bit. --Super Goku V (talk) 05:02, 18 September 2024 (UTC) - User:Super Goku V, thanks for visiting my user talk. Regarding nazis, please see WP:OPEN, which says, “The first paragraph should define or identify the topic with a neutral point of view, but without being too specific.” You say above that you’re “opposed to the removal of details about what happened.” But I don’t object to putting nazi details in the article body, or even later in the lead if people feel strongly about it. Just not in the opening paragraph. As far as I know, nazis had no effect on what happened in Springfield, nor any effect on what GOP politicians did. What a horror show Misplaced Pages’s articles on political events would become if they all began with commentary from the nazis on the left, and the Marxists on the right. Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:12, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- Sources say that neo-Nazi groups were spreading the message along with far-right groups. Given the prominence in reliable sources, we are following a Neutral point of view by mentioning it in the lede. As for the order of stuff, the only thing I could see that has a shot would be splitting off everything after the first sentence of the first paragraph into a new second paragraph and moving all of the old second paragraph into the first paragraph following the first sentence.
Starting in September 2024, baseless claims and rumors spread online that Haitian immigrants were stealing pets in Springfield, Ohio, and eating them. Springfield and county law enforcement said that no credible reports or evidence support the claims, and the city's mayor, the city manager, and Ohio Governor Mike DeWine have all denounced them. The claims were widely described as racist. Fact-checking website Snopes called the claims unfounded, while others characterized them as a hoax or a lie.
The claims began with a local Facebook group post sharing a neighbor's story that her daughter's friend's cat had been butchered, then spread quickly among far-right and neo-Nazi groups. These claims were amplified by prominent figures in the American right, most notably Republican vice-presidential nominee JD Vance whose constituency includes Springfield, then by his running mate Donald Trump, along with allies such as Laura Loomer, and X owner Elon Musk. The person whose Facebook story started the controversy later admitted she never spoke to the cat owner and admitted the story lacked credibility.
The pet-eating claims spread amid existing racial tensions in Springfield, where recent legal Haitian immigration reversed population decline, but strained some public resources. There had been previous incidents of hostility towards the local Haitian community and unfounded local rumors of Haitians stealing waterfowl and food. After the claims spread, dozens of bomb threats prompted Springfield officials to close public buildings, including the city hall and elementary schools, and DeWine deployed state police to conduct daily sweeps of the facilities.- I don't know if it could be considered an improvement or not as it waits until the second paragraph to explain what is debunked, though it does put more emphasis that the claims are false. Other than that, I don't have much of a suggestion outside of this other one:
Starting in September 2024, baseless claims and rumors spread online that Haitian immigrants were stealing pets in Springfield, Ohio, and eating them. The claims began with a local Facebook group post sharing a neighbor's story that her daughter's friend's cat had been butchered and rose to national prominence by Republican vice-presidential nominee JD Vance whose constituency includes Springfield, followed then by his running mate Donald Trump, along with allies such as Laura Loomer, and X owner Elon Musk. The person whose Facebook story started the controversy later admitted she never spoke to the cat owner and admitted the story lacked credibility.
Springfield and county law enforcement said that no credible reports or evidence support the claims, and the city's mayor, the city manager, and Ohio Governor Mike DeWine have all denounced them. The claims were widely described as racist and having been spread quickly among far-right and neo-Nazi groups in the area. Fact-checking website Snopes called the claims unfounded, while others characterized them as a hoax or a lie.
The pet-eating claims spread amid existing racial tensions in Springfield, where recent legal Haitian immigration reversed population decline, but strained some public resources. There had been previous incidents of hostility towards the local Haitian community and unfounded local rumors of Haitians stealing waterfowl and food. After the claims spread, dozens of bomb threats prompted Springfield officials to close public buildings, including the city hall and elementary schools, and DeWine deployed state police to conduct daily sweeps of the facilities.- If either of the two work for you, then go ahead and try it. --Super Goku V (talk) 07:58, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- Oh and I am Subscribed to this discussion, so feel free to ping or not as I will know either way. --Super Goku V (talk) 08:00, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- I always prefer being chronological where possible, which helps people to comprehend what happened, one step at a time. That’s why I generally like the opening paragraph as it stands now: it summarizes the major developments one step at a time, in a clear manner. Except that I just think the nazi detail needs to be moved lower in the lead or removed from the lead. As I explained here at my talk page, I am not aware that any nazis affected what happened in Springfield, or affected how GOP politicians reacted to the whole thing. When nazis spread rumors, they typically do so on nazi websites and other places where nazis hang out, but AFAIK they’re not able to spread rumors into the mainstream, and the latter might be significant if it happened, but I’m not aware that it did happen. Anythingyouwant (talk) 10:37, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- Understood. I did reply on the talk page about what they did in Springfield. As for lowering it in the lead, try it and see if it works. --Super Goku V (talk) 20:48, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
- I always prefer being chronological where possible, which helps people to comprehend what happened, one step at a time. That’s why I generally like the opening paragraph as it stands now: it summarizes the major developments one step at a time, in a clear manner. Except that I just think the nazi detail needs to be moved lower in the lead or removed from the lead. As I explained here at my talk page, I am not aware that any nazis affected what happened in Springfield, or affected how GOP politicians reacted to the whole thing. When nazis spread rumors, they typically do so on nazi websites and other places where nazis hang out, but AFAIK they’re not able to spread rumors into the mainstream, and the latter might be significant if it happened, but I’m not aware that it did happen. Anythingyouwant (talk) 10:37, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
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