Talk:Abdurrahman Wahid: Difference between revisions

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	{{WikiProject Egypt \| ~~class~~=~~Start~~}}		{{WikiProject Egypt\|importance=Low}}
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			== Inaccuracies ==

			There is no reference to prove that he was of Arab descent
			--] (]) 05:18, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
			*And you removed the category. That's already enough. It's a common target for IPs. — ] (]) 05:55, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
			No, it's not enough as the paragraph (tagged {{Citation needed}}) still says the person is of chinese-arab origin, but with no reference nor inline citation (are you referring to the same article as said on the top?) --] (]) 07:36, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
			*The category is a common thing for IPs to add (I have no idea why; perhaps it is based on the Indonesia tendency to emphasize somebody's ethnic origin). We can (and should) simply remove this "inaccuracy" (actually, your complaint is more like "unverified content"), until we have a reference. I don't doubt that references exist: Wahid's ethnicity appears well-discussed in the literature, including the question of whether or not he had Chinese ancestry like was rumored when he was president. — ] (]) 08:14, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
			His chinese background might exist (though it's hard to verify the validity), but arab-ethnicity in Indonesia is easier to verify as there are institutions (such as ''al-Maktab al-Daimi'' office in Jakarta) that can verify and authenticate the lineage based on their lineage records kept for hundreds of years. As long there is no valid references to say so, the sentence mentioning he has Arab ethnic background is inaccurate and highly questionable. To simply remove the word is hard, as the ethnicity is intermingled in the next sentence. Also there is confusion in saying "Javanese ... with some native blood". Isn't Javanese is already a native? --] (]) 15:42, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

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			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20060818164956/http://www.kompas.com:80/kompas-cetak/0004/14/NASIONAL/dari07.htm to http://www.kompas.com/kompas-cetak/0004/14/NASIONAL/dari07.htm
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110921213010/http://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/12/news/12iht-a1_3.html to http://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/12/news/12iht-a1_3.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20041020230400/http://www.indomedia.com:80/bernas/012002/01/UTAMA/01uta4.htm to http://www.indomedia.com/bernas/012002/01/UTAMA/01uta4.htm

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			Cheers. —]<small><sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS">]:Online</sub></small> 01:18, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

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			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20041020230400/http://www.indomedia.com:80/bernas/012002/01/UTAMA/01uta4.htm to http://www.indomedia.com/bernas/012002/01/UTAMA/01uta4.htm

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			Cheers.—]<small><sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS">]:Online</sub></small> 05:32, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

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			Cheers.—]<small><sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS">]:Online</sub></small> 23:36, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

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	==Missing Precession/Sucession links==

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	Missing from this article, and none of the other Indonesion articles, is the Precced by, Suceeded by links.
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100121130700/http://www.thejakartapost.com:80/news/2000/10/20/palestinian-ambassador-should-be-replaced-alwi.html to http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2000/10/20/palestinian-ambassador-should-be-replaced-alwi.html
	] (]) 10:05, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110721042709/http://www.tempo.co.id/harian/wawancara/waw-nurcholis.html to http://www.tempo.co.id/harian/wawancara/waw-nurcholis.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100103110821/http://web.bisnis.com/umum/sosial/1id153530.html to http://web.bisnis.com/umum/sosial/1id153530.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110607140211/http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2009/12/30/former-ri-president-abdurrahman-wahid-passes-away.html to http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2009/12/30/former-ri-president-abdurrahman-wahid-passes-away.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080726235515/http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/Australia/indonesia.htm to http://www.gusdur.net/english/index.php

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	== Big cut 'n' paste of Presidency to ] ==

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	Please note that I've effected a large cut-n-paste from here to the Post-Suharto Era. The selection was probably overly large and detailed. Some of it might need to come back here. ] (]) 09:23, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 15:03, 2 October 2016 (UTC)
	==Health==
	We need to mention his (near) blindness, caused by an illness in mid-life (I think), and his two strokes (in 1998).

	== ~~Overtures~~ ==		== External links modified ==

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	I added several references to the flap about Ambassador Awad that nearly resulted in his being declared persona non grata. However, I could not find any reference to Wahid having studied in Israel during his youth. Can someone add that, either to Early Life or to Overseas Education? ] (]) 02:06, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

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	== Gus Dur nickname ==
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.surya.co.id/2009/12/31/dari-abdurrahman-addakhil-menjadi-gus-dur.html
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2000/10/20/palestinian-ambassador-should-be-replaced-alwi.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070929081458/http://www.gusdur.net/english/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=746&Itemid=1 to http://www.gusdur.net/english/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=746&Itemid=1
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.tempointeraktif.com/hg/politik/2009/12/26/brk%2C20091226-215718%2Cid.html
			*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.tempointeraktif.com/hg/nusa/2009/12/30/brk%2C20091230-216543%2Cid.html
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150702160646/http://www.mediaindonesia.com/mipagi/read/9041/Gus-Dur-Hidup-lewat-Novel/2015/03/08 to http://www.mediaindonesia.com/mipagi/read/9041/Gus-Dur-Hidup-lewat-Novel/2015/03/08

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	I thought the article used to explain where his nickname "Gus Dur" came from, but at any rate, it doesn't explain it now, and it should. --] ] 00:57, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

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	== Education ==

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 06:53, 25 June 2017 (UTC)
	The recent edit of his inability to get his Arabic fluency recognized in Egypt seems to have condensed too much of the earlier text. We are now left with an "out of the blue" comment about inability to get fluency certified, which sidesteps the whole issue of being obviously (?) fluent and yet not certified. The original text says something about bureaucracy and is useful info (assuming it's true).

			== External links modified ==
	Also, I read somewhere that Gus Dur studied in Israel for a time, which was a factor in his refusal to take a hard-line against that country. Can someone find a source for this info? ] (]) 01:48, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	== Article page protected for 3 days, per request ==

			I have just modified one external link on ]. Please take a moment to review ]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
	Per the request at ] and following review of the editing history I have protected the article for 3 days. If a consensus arises that semi-protection should be substituted, or protection fully lifted, please contact an administrator. If protection remains, contact an admin to enact any consensually agreed edits, as discussed on this page. ] (]) 13:08, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091231170523/http://thejakartaglobe.com/home/former-president-abdurrahman-wahid-dies/350091 to http://thejakartaglobe.com/home/former-president-abdurrahman-wahid-dies/350091
	:This may be a stupid question, but why was it fully-protected when it was only being vandalised by IP users? Would semi-protect be okay? Anyway, a source hasn't yet been added for his death, and one really needs to be added. It takes about five seconds to find it on Google, but I'm not an admin and can't edit the page... ]] ] 13:17, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	::There is a source there - Indonesian language "Kompas". When I added it, it was the only reputable newspaper with the story. Now it's in a number of English language sources too. I also don't understand the need for full protect. --] (]) 13:21, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	:::Is there? Sorry, I never saw that. I'm not fluent in Indonesian (P.S. - There's a dab link to ] I need to fix!), ]] ] 13:23, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	::::The (English language) Sydney Morning Herald is now reporting it - I'd add it but..... --] (]) 13:24, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	:::::Ah, I see it now. Shouldn't it be in the death section? I heard (from ]) that stuff referenced in the main article doesn't need to be referenced in the lead section. I'm being to picky with details, aren't I? Meh, ]] ] 13:27, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	::::::Yes, possibly a tad on the picky side - i could have done that but was fumbling through versions, trying to find a source, ward off boogaloo jokers and stumbling around trying to find a place to get an admin - then it got locked. Next time I will use my second set of hands. ;-) --] (]) 13:30, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

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	== Edit request ==

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			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 18:04, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
	Can an admin please add ] to the category structure.

			== External links modified ==
	And can the following also be added to the death section...

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	Wahid died on Wednesday, 30 December 2009 at Cipto Mangunkusumo Hospital in ]. According to Maman Imanulhaq from the ], Wahid died after undergoing dental surgery at the hospital.<ref>{{cite news\|url=http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2009/12/30/former-ri-president-abdurrahman-wahid-passes-away.html\|title=Former RI president Abdurrahman Wahid passes away\|date=30 December 2009\|publisher=]\|accessdate=30 December 2009}}</ref>

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	Thanks, --] <sup>]</sup> 13:52, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120118094357/http://www.rfi.fr/anglais/actu/articles/120/article_6354.asp to http://www.rfi.fr/anglais/actu/articles/120/article_6354.asp

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	:Why not just semi-protect the article? --] (]) 13:54, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	::Hmm...probably the best idea...is this consensus? ]] ] 13:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	:::I was going to start a section on consensus, but you guys beat me to it. I believe that we do have some form of consensus that semi-protection would be better? --] <sup>]</sup> 14:01, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	*Semi protection it is. ] (]) 14:22, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

			{{sourcecheck\|checked=false\|needhelp=}}
	== Source dump ==
	May be useful for later. ] (]) 17:06, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 19:04, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
	=== ''Jakarta Globe'' ===
	*
	*
	*

	=== ~~''Kompas''~~ ===		== Wikilink to successor ==
	*

			Newbie here, what's the reason for not having another wikilink to his successor, Megawati Sukarnoputri, in the infobox? While it's redundant, it's a bit annoying to have to search for the wikilink. Thanks a lot. ] (]) 20:19, 22 February 2024 (UTC)
	== Neutrality ==

			:Just so you know, I've reviewed which mentions that repeat links can be used as long as they are helpful. Also, in my experience, most infoboxes which list successors have a wikilink. ] (]) 20:36, 22 February 2024 (UTC)
	I notice that this article sways a bit in favour of Wahid, without addressing the real reasons he was removed from office, for instance. This should be addressed. This article makes him out to be a victim of insurrection, and while that's partly true, there was a reason he was removed. --]] 23:12, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
	:If you can provide information from ]'s and present them in the article in a ] way, then it would be a great assistance. cheers --] (]) 23:36, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

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Inaccuracies

There is no reference to prove that he was of Arab descent --Buhadram (talk) 05:18, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

And you removed the category. That's already enough. It's a common target for IPs. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:55, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

No, it's not enough as the paragraph (tagged ) still says the person is of chinese-arab origin, but with no reference nor inline citation (are you referring to the same article as said on the top?) --Buhadram (talk) 07:36, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

The category is a common thing for IPs to add (I have no idea why; perhaps it is based on the Indonesia tendency to emphasize somebody's ethnic origin). We can (and should) simply remove this "inaccuracy" (actually, your complaint is more like "unverified content"), until we have a reference. I don't doubt that references exist: Wahid's ethnicity appears well-discussed in the literature, including the question of whether or not he had Chinese ancestry like was rumored when he was president. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:14, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

His chinese background might exist (though it's hard to verify the validity), but arab-ethnicity in Indonesia is easier to verify as there are institutions (such as al-Maktab al-Daimi office in Jakarta) that can verify and authenticate the lineage based on their lineage records kept for hundreds of years. As long there is no valid references to say so, the sentence mentioning he has Arab ethnic background is inaccurate and highly questionable. To simply remove the word is hard, as the ethnicity is intermingled in the next sentence. Also there is confusion in saying "Javanese ... with some native blood". Isn't Javanese is already a native? --Buhadram (talk) 15:42, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

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Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091231170523/http://thejakartaglobe.com/home/former-president-abdurrahman-wahid-dies/350091 to http://thejakartaglobe.com/home/former-president-abdurrahman-wahid-dies/350091

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External links modified

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Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120118094357/http://www.rfi.fr/anglais/actu/articles/120/article_6354.asp to http://www.rfi.fr/anglais/actu/articles/120/article_6354.asp

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Wikilink to successor

Newbie here, what's the reason for not having another wikilink to his successor, Megawati Sukarnoputri, in the infobox? While it's redundant, it's a bit annoying to have to search for the wikilink. Thanks a lot. Nanotik (talk) 20:19, 22 February 2024 (UTC)

Just so you know, I've reviewed MOS:REPEATLINK which mentions that repeat links can be used as long as they are helpful. Also, in my experience, most infoboxes which list successors have a wikilink. Nanotik (talk) 20:36, 22 February 2024 (UTC)

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