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<!--PLEASE PLACE NEW REQUESTS BELOW THIS NOTICE -->


==PerspicazHistorian==
== Biophys ==
{{hat|{{u|PerspicazHistorian}} is blocked indefinitely from mainspace. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 03:34, 9 January 2025 (UTC) }}
{{Discussion top|1=Discussion now occurs at ]. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 20:00, 26 March 2010 (UTC)}}
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br />Requests may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>
===Request concerning Biophys===
; User requesting enforcement : --] <sup>]</sup> 19:18, 15 March 2010 (UTC)


===Request concerning PerspicazHistorian===
; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Biophys}}
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|NXcrypto}} 15:53, 19 December 2024 (UTC)


; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|PerspicazHistorian}}<p>{{ds/log|PerspicazHistorian}}</p>
;Sanction or remedy that this user violated :
: ]
: ]
: ]


<!--- Here and at the end, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it : Despite several prior sanctions and warnings, Biophys has in recent months massively conducted edit warring and POV-pushing. When he has a spare minute he now proxies for an indefinitely banned editor. In the most tenacious revert war, Biophys's only source, which he aggressively tries to enforce as the truth, is a known propaganda website of Islamist anti-Russian extremists, in spite of protests by several users.
'''Background'''


;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]
{{userlinks|Biophys}} is a persistent POV-pusher and edit-warrior who has been blocked several times and whose disruptive behaviour has been discussed in several reports on admin noticeboards:
<!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced --->
*At ]:
*At ]:
*At ]:
*At ]:


; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
Many of these reports resulted in Biophys being sanctioned and warned, yet Biophys has chosen to ignore all these warnings and has continued his heavy disruption. In addition, Biophys has already been sanctioned with a 1RR per the ] sanctions. . However, the 1RR sanction was later lifted for the technical reason that "no prior warning was given." According to a June 2009 finding by now arbitrator ], Biophys is a regular edit warrior. He is also listed as one of the warned editors at ]. Biophys has also been discovered as a member of the ], and participated in the cabal's campaign of disruption.. Further evidence of disruption caused by Biophys can be found at ]. Several members of the EEML were found by ArbCom to have proxied for banned users, so Biophys knows that proxying is not allowed. Biophys has been proxying for the community banned ] in several articles (see evidence below).
<!-- Supply diffs as evidence here, and explain why they require arbitration enforcement. Any allegation not supported by a diff is usually disregarded. You may also link to an archived version of long discussions instead of supplying very many diffs. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as ], or groundless or ] complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.-->
# - removed "discrimination" sidebar from the page of ] (fascist ideology) even though the sidebar was inserted inside a section, not even the lead.
# - tag bombed the highly vetted ] article without any discussion or reason
# - attributing castes to people withhout any sources
# - edit warring to impose the above edits after getting
# - just like above, but this time he also added unreliable sources
# - still edit warring and using edit summaries instead of talk page for conversation
# - filed an outrageous report on WP:ANI without notifying any editors. This report was closed by Bbb23 as "{{tq|This is nothing but a malplaced, frivolous personal attack by the OP.}}"


; Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any :
'''Edit warring'''
<!-- To the extent it may be relevant, link to previous sanctions such as blocks or topic bans.-->
'''Massive edit warring at ]'''
*Already 2 blocks in last 4 months for edit warring.
;If ] are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see ]):
; Additional comments by editor filing complaint :
<!-- Add any further comment here -->


I do not see any positive signs that this editor will ever improve. So far he has only regressed. ] <small><small>]</small></small> 15:53, 19 December 2024 (UTC)
Biophys has already been blocked twice for edit warring on this article.,


:While going through this report, PerspicazHistorian has made another highly problematic edit by edit warring and misrepresenting the sources to label the organisation as "terrorist". This primary source only provides a list of organisations termed by the Indian government as "terrorist" contrary to ]. ] <small><small>]</small></small> 03:12, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
Nevertheless, Biophys continues his persistent and massive edit warring.


*PerspicazHistorian is still using sources (see ]) and wishing to move ] to ] which is a blatant POV. ] <small><small>]</small></small> 04:39, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
Revert wars of Biophys in 2010:


; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested :
*,,, (3 reverts in 24 hours),,, (again 3 reverts in 24 hours),,,,,,,,,,,,,
<!-- Please notify the user against whom you request enforcement of the request (you may use {{subst:AE-notice|thread name}}), and then replace this comment with a diff of the notification. The request will normally not be processed otherwise. -->


<!--- In the line below, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
'''Edit warring at ]'''


===Discussion concerning PerspicazHistorian ===
Here Biophys is edit warring heavily to keep a known Islamist propaganda source (http://www.kavkazcenter.net) in the article.
<small>''Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.<br />Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.''</small>


====Statement by PerspicazHistorian ====
This is a terrorist website similar to the illegal Al-Qaeda websites the United States keeps closing down around the world. Their fact-checking is not just zero but they enjoy publishing politically-motivated false rumours like against Gordon Brown and the "European Union's elite pedophile commissioners in Brussels" or the story about Israel trying to harvest organs in Haiti. They continue the episode with their own lies and report about "the fact that "Israel" has brought some 25,000 Ukrainian children into the occupied entity over the past two years in order to harvest their organs."
*By far I am also concerned how my edits were forcefully reverted without a proper reason despite providing enough references. Please check how I am getting attacked by them on ] Page.
I didn't know about the three-revert-rule before ] told me about this: ].
Please grant me one more chance, I will make sure not to edit war.<br>
*In the below statement by LukeEmily, As a reply I just want to say that I was just making obvious edit on ] by adding a list of notable people with proper references. And according to ] it is clearly said: "Edits from a slanted point of view, general insertion or removal of material, or other good-faith changes are not considered vandalism." It was a good faith edit but others reverted it. I accept my mistake of not raising it on talk page as a part of ].<br>
*As a clarification to my edit on ], it can be clearly seen that I provided enough reference to prove its a terrorist organisation as seen in this . I don't know why is there a discussion to this obvious edit? Admins please correct me if I am wrong.
:@], Yes I read about 1RR and 0RR revert rules in ]. I now understand the importance of raising the topic on talk page whenever a consensus is needed. Thank You ! ] (]) 07:16, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
::Yes, I will commit to that. ] (]) 13:10, 20 December 2024 (UTC) <small>Moved comment to own section. Please comment, including replies, only in this section. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 13:19, 20 December 2024 (UTC) </small>
:At that time I was new to how AFD discussions worked. Later on when ] was marked for deletion, I respected the consensus by not interfering in it. The article was later deleted. ] (]) 11:54, 21 December 2024 (UTC)
*Hi @] , I just checked your user page. You have 16 years (I am 19) of experience on wiki, you must be right about me. I agree that my start on Misplaced Pages has been horrible, but I am learning a lot from you all. I promise that I will do better, get more neutral here and contribute to the platform to my best. Please don't block me.
::''<small>P.S.- I don't know If I will be blocked or what , according to this enforcement rules, I just want to personally wish good luck to you for your ongoing cancer treatments, You will surely win this battle of Life. Regards.</small>'' ] (]) 12:23, 21 December 2024 (UTC)<small>Moved comment to own section. Please comment, including replies, only in this section.] (]) 15:30, 24 December 2024 (UTC)</small>


*1) I just asked an user @] if the page move is possible. What's wrong with it? I still have not considered putting a move request on talk page of article.
Russians are always insulted as "invaders", "minions", "infidels" , "apostates", "the enemy", "hirelings", "puppets", especially in reports about bombings and other violence against them. Russian victims are purposefully dehumanized. The web site's original affiliation was with Shamil Basayev,
:2) Many of other sources are not raj era. Moreover I myself have deleted the content way before you pointing this out. Thank You ! ] (]) 06:29, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
who Washington too declared a terrorist and a threat to the United states.
::even @] is seen engaged in edit wars before on contentious Indian topics. ] (]) 06:37, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
:::as mentioned by @] before, <sub>Please discuss at talk, not here; we don't deal with content here</sub>. You can discuss content related topics on talk pages of articles rather than personally targeting a user here in enforcement. ] (]) 06:42, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
::::@] I once filed a to find it @] is a sock (out of a misunderstanding, as all were teamed up similarly on various pages). I think he felt it as a personal attack by me and filed this request for enforcement. Please interfere. ] (]) 06:47, 29 December 2024 (UTC) <small>moving to correct section ] (]) 13:24, 29 December 2024 (UTC)</small>


*Hi @] @], In my defense I just want to say that
All this is known by Biophys, who has backed the Kavkaz writer ] since the early days of his account, yet he keeps edit warring to keep this terrorist source in the article to push his POV. After users complained about it, he just accused them all falsely of sockpuppetry.
:1)Yes I usually edit on RSS related topics, but to ensure a democratic view is maintained as many socks try to disrupt such articles. Even on ] page, I just edited on request of talk page and added a graph. I don't think its a POV push.
:2) My main interest in editing is ] and ] topics.
:3)There have been certain cases in past where I was blocked but if studied carefully they were result of me edit warring with socks(although, through guidance of various experienced editors and admins I learnt a SPI should be filed first). I have learnt a lot in my journey and there have been nearly zero case of me of edit warring this month.
:Please do not block me. ] (]) 14:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
*@] I beg apologies for the inconvenience caused, thanks for correcting me. I will now reply in my own statement section. @] I am a quick learner and professionally competent to edit in this encyclopedic space. Please consider reviewing this enforcement if its an counter-attack on me as mentioned in my previous replies. You all are experienced editors and I have good faith in your decision-making capability.] (]) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
*@]@] I have edited content marked as "original research" and "mess" by you, I am ready to help removing any content that might be considered "poorly sourced" by the community. Please don't block me.] (]) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
*@] This enforcement started for edit-warring and now I feel its more concerned to my edited content(which I agree to cooperate and change wherever needed). After learning about edit wars, there has been no instance of me edit-warring, Please consider my request.--] (]) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
*:@] I am not a slow learner, I understand the concerns of all admins here. I will try my best to add only reliable sources, and discuss content in all talk pages, as I already mentioned ]. ] (]) 12:55, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
*::@]@] I think admins should focus more on encouraging editors when they do good and correct when mistaken. I have made many edits, added many citations and created much articles which use fine citations. The enforcement started out of retaliation by nxcrypto, now moving towards banning me anyways. I started editing out of passion, and doing it here on wiki unlike those who come here just for pov pushes and disrupt article space(talking about socks and vandalizers on contentious Indian topics).
*::The article ] doesn't only has issue on citations, but the whole article is copypasted from the citations I added. I just wanted to point that out. Remaining about ], I am currently pursuing Btech in cs from IIT delhi, idt I am a slow learner by any means. Still, happy new year to all ! ] (]) 14:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
*:::@] You mean to say, "<sub>The ''prasada'' is to be consumed by attendees as a holy offering. The offerings may include cooked food, ] and confectionery sweets. Vegetarian food is usually offered and later distributed to the devotees who are present in the ]. Sometimes this vegetarian offering will exclude prohibited items such as garlic, onion, mushroom, etc. "</sub> is not copy pasted by website? Is this also a wiki mirror website? How would you feel if I doubt your competence now? ] (]) 14:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
*::::@ ] I just asked others to share their opinion in the enforcement. With all due respect, I don't think its wrong in any sense. ] (]) 15:13, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
*:::::To all the admins involved here,
*:::::* I agree to keep learning and apologize if my previous edits/replies have annoyed the admins.
*:::::* I have not edit warred since a month and please see it as my willingness to keep learning and getting better.
*:::::*Please give me a chance, I understand concern of you all and respect your opinion in the matter. But please don't block me from editing from main article space. I promise that I will abide by all the rules and will learn from other editors.
*:::::] (]) 15:22, 8 January 2025 (UTC)


====Statement by LukeEmily====
*,,,,,,,,,,,, (3 reverts in 26 hours),
PerspicazHistorian also violated ] by engaging in an edit war with {{u|Ratnahastin}} who reverted his edits and restored an article to a stable version by admin. Also, I want to assume good faith but it is surprising that PerspicazHistorian claims that he did not know the three revert rule given that he has more than 800 edits.] (])


====Statement by Doug Weller====
''']'''
I'm involved so just commenting. I don't think this editor is competent. I had to give them a community sanction caste warning as they were making a mess of castes. See this earlier version of their talk page.]https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User_talk:PerspicazHistorian&oldid=1262289249] and ]'s comment that "It was very unwise of you to keep moving ] to article space when it has not passed review. As a direct result of your actions, a deletion discussion is taking place, and when this is complete and the article is deleted, you will be prevented from recreating it. ] (]) 14:44, 4 December 2024 (UTC)" There have also been copyright issues. I strongly support a topic ban. ] ] 11:00, 21 December 2024 (UTC)


:::I won't be involved in the decision. No more treatments for me, just coast until... ] ] 12:50, 21 December 2024 (UTC)
*,,,,,,


====Statement by Toddy1====
Again, this is not the first time Biophys has edit warred on this article (see ).
This is another editor who appears to have pro-] (RSS) and pro-] (BJP) views. I dislike those views, but find it rather alarming that Misplaced Pages should seek to censor those views, but not the views of the political opponents. Imagine the outrage if we sought to topic-ban anyone who expressed pro-] views, but allowed ] to say whatever they liked.


A lot of pro-RSS/BJP editors turn out to be sock-puppets, so please can we do a checkuser on this account. And to be even-handed, why not checkuser NXcrypto too.
''']'''


If we want to talk about ] when editors make mistakes, look at the diff given by NXcrypto for "Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested" - it is the wrong diff. He/she did notify PerspicazHistorian - but the correct diff is .
*,,,,,,,,,,


A topic ban from Indian topics would be unhelpful, unless given to both parties. Misplaced Pages is meant to be a mainstream encyclopaedia, and BJP and RSS are mainstream in India. Loading the dice against BJP and RSS editors will turn Misplaced Pages into a fringe encyclopaedia on Indian topics.
''']'''


I can see a good case for restricting PerspicazHistorian to draft articles and talk pages for a month, and suggesting that he/she seeks advice from more experienced editors. Another solution would be a one-revert rule to last six months.<span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">--] ]</span> 13:55, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
*,,,, (the last 4 reverts are a 3RR violation),


====Statement by Capitals00====
I find the comment from {{U|Toddy1}} to be entirely outrageous. What are you trying to tell by saying "{{tq|Misplaced Pages is meant to be a mainstream encyclopaedia, and BJP and RSS are mainstream in India}}"? If you want us to entertain those who are in power, then we could never have an article like ].


You cannot ask topic ban for both editors without having any evidence of misconduct. Same way, you cannot ask CU on either user ]. It is a high time that you should strike your comment, since you are falsely accusing others that they "{{tq|seek to censor}}" this editor due to his "{{tq| pro-Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) and pro-Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) views}}". You should strike your comment. If you cannot do that, then I am sure ] is coming for you. ] (]) 15:20, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
''']'''


====Statement by Vanamonde93====
*,,,,
{{U|Toddy1}}: I, too, am baffled by your comment. We don't ban editors based on their POV; but we do ban editors who fail to follow our PAGs, and we certainly don't make excuses for editors who fail to follow our guidelines based on their POV. You seem to be suggesting we cut PH some slack because of their political position, and I find that deeply inappropriate. Among other things, I don't believe they have publicly stated anywhere that they support the BJP or the RSS, and we cannot make assumptions about them.


That said, the fact that this was still open prompted me to spot-check PH's contributions, and I find a lot to be concerned about. is from 29 December, and appears to be entirely original research; I cannot access all of the sources, but snippet search does not bear out the content added, and the Raj era source for the first sentence certainly does not support the content it was used for. ], entirely authored by PH, is full of puffery ({{tq|"first to sacrifice his life for the cause of Swarajya"}}, and poor sources (like , and , whose blurb I leave you to judge), from which most of the article appears to be drawn. ], also entirely authored by PH, has original research in its very first sentence; the sources that I can access give passing mention to people whose names include the suffix "appa", and thus could perhaps be examples of usage, but the sources most certainly do not bear out the claim.
'''Proxying for banned editor HanzoHattori'''


I will note in fairness that I cannot access all the sources for the content I checked. But after spotchecking a dozen examples I have yet to find content PH wrote that was borne out by a reliable source, so I believe skepticism is justified. We are in territory where other editors may need to spend days cleaning up some of this writing. {{U|Bishonen}} If we're in CIR territory, just a normal indefinite block seems cleanest, surely? Or were you hoping that PH would help clean up their mess, perhaps by providing quotes from sources? That could be a pathway to contributing productively, but I'm not holding my breath. ] (]) 18:00, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
{{userlinks|HanzoHattori}} is an indefinitely banned POV-warrior and sockpuppeteer. His main interest was terrorism and warfare in the Caucasus.


:Thanks Bish: I agree, as my exchanges with PH today, in response to my first post here, have not inspired confidence. . ] (]) 20:22, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
List of HanzoHattori sockpuppets, based on ]:
*{{userlinks|RamboKadyrov}}
*{{userlinks|Putinjugend}}
*{{userlinks|Captain Obvious and his crime-fighting dog}}
*{{userlinks|84.234.60.154}}
*{{userlinks|94.246.154.130}}
*{{userlinks|Ostateczny Krach Systemu Korporacji}}
*{{userlinks|Mjr Edit}}


====Statement by UtherSRG====
Biophys had tried to help the sockpuppet RamboKadyrov by a warning how to avoid getting CheckUsered. Biophys was also already suspected of proxying for HanzoHattori half a year ago. He answered with a ], stressing that he checked the sources. Biophys said that he finds the banned HanzoHattori "the best WP editor" and "a fantastic expert": On the mailing list he revealed previous mail contact with HanzoHattori (20090624-0311) and, moreover, tried to protect a sockpuppet of HanzoHattori and prevent it from being detected:
I've mostly dealt with PH around ]. They do not seem to have the ability to read and understand our policies and processes. As such, a t-ban is too weak. The minimum I would support is a p-block as suggested below, though a full indef is also acceptable. They could then ask for the ] when they can demonstrate they no longer have ] issues. - ] ] 20:05, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
Biophys and his EEML friends then tried to organize a comeback for HanzoHattori:


:Based on , I'm more strongly leaning towards indef. - ] ] 12:27, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
In recent months, Biophys has visited several little known Caucasus-related articles previously edited by HanzoHattori and his socks, and performed massive edits on HanzoHattori's behalf.
::They now indicate they believe the article they edited was copied from one of the websites they used as a reference, when in reality the website is a mirror/scrape of the Misplaced Pages article. I believe we are firmly in ] territory here. - ] ] 14:25, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
::: is a mirror of the Misplaced Pages article. - ] ] 16:29, 31 December 2024 (UTC)


===Result concerning PerspicazHistorian ===
For example:
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.''


{{u|PerspicazHistorian}}, can you explain your understanding of ] and the ] rule? I'd like you to read thoroughly enough to also explain wny someone may be edit warring ''even if they aren't breaking 3RR''. ] (]) 21:58, 19 December 2024 (UTC)
*]
<!-- When closing this request use {{hat|Result}} / {{hab}}, inform the user on their talk page if they are being sanctioned (eg with {{AE sanction}} or {{uw-aeblock}} and note it in the discretionary sanctions log. -->
*This article was created in 2008 by HanzoHattori sock RamboKadyrov.
:@], that explanation of edit warring is a bit wanting. An edit war is when two or more editors revert content additions/removals repeatedly. Even a second reversion by the same editor can be considered edit warring. Best practice -- and what I highly recommend, especially for any inexperienced editor -- is ''the first time'' someone reverts an edit of yours, go to the talk page, open a section, ping the editor who reverted you, and discuss. Do you think you can commit to that?
*No other editor had made major edits on this article.
:<small>Re: your question on why your "obvious edit" was reverted: we don't deal with content issues here, only with behavior issues, but from a very quick look, the source is 50 years old, and using a list headed "TERRORIST ORGANISATIONS LISTED IN THE FIRST SCHEDULE OF THE UNLAWFUL ACTIVITIES (PREVENTION) ACT, 1967" that includes a certain organization as a source that the organization should be described as a terrorist organization is ]; in their ] NXcrypto provided an edit summary of "Not a reliable source for such a contentious label. See WP:LABEL." Please discuss at talk, not here; we don't deal with content here.</small> ] (]) 11:28, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
*Biophys then arrives to do a massive edit:
::I'm seeing this as a CIR issue. I'd like input from other admins, if possible. I'm a little concerned that setting a tban from IPA is just setting a trap. Maybe a p-block from article space would be a kinder way to allow them to gain some experience? ] (]) 13:28, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
:::@], have you seen how many times I or others have had to move your comments to your own section? This is an example of not having enough experience to edit productively. Please do not post in anyone else's section again. ] (]) 16:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
::::I do agree we're in CIR territory, and the concerns expressed are completely valid. I don't think this editor is ill-intentioned. They just don't seem very motivated to learn quickly. Well-intentioned-but-a-slow-learner is something that can only be fixed by actually practicing what you're bad at. I'd prefer an indef from article space which gives them one more chance to learn here before we send them off to mr.wiki or Simple English to try to learn. Not a hill I'm going to die on, though. ] (]) 11:36, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::@], like Uther I have major concerns about the edit you made yesterday, which included replacing a citation needed tag with these sources.<ref>{{Cite web |title=Significance of Different Type of Prasad in Hinduism For God |url=https://www.ganeshaspeaks.com/predictions/astrology/prasad-food-for-god/ |access-date=2024-12-30 |website=GaneshaSpeaks |language=en-GB}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |title=What Is Prashad |url=https://www.swaminarayan.faith/articles/what-is-prashad |access-date=2024-12-30 |website=Shree Swaminarayan Mandir Bhuj |language=en}}</ref> The first is a company that markets astrology services. The second is the site for a religious sect. Neither is a reliable source for explaining the concept of prasada in Wikivoice. You made this edit ''yesterday'', after you'd confirmed here and on my talk that you understood sourcing policy.
:::::The reason for an indef from article space is to allow you to learn this policy: You would go into article talk and suggest sources to fix citation needed tags. Another editor would have to agree with you that the sources are reliable before they'd add them. ] (]) 12:51, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
*A tban from IPA for PerspicazHistorian would be a relief to many editors trying to keep this difficult area in reasonable shape. However, Valereee makes a good point about 'setting a trap': it's doubtful that PH would be able to keep to a tban even if they tried in good faith. I would therefore support a p-block from article space. ] &#124; ] 16:48, 29 December 2024 (UTC).
*:{{u|Vanamonde93}}, no, I don't really think PH can usefully help clean up their mess; I was following Valereee, who has been going into this in some depth, in attempting to keep some way of editing Misplaced Pages open for PH. It's a bit of a counsel of desperation, though; there is very little daylight between an indef and a p-block from article space. Yes, we ''are'' in CIR territory; just look at PH's ] for NXcrypto being "engaged in edit wars before on contentious Indian topics": one diff of an opponent complaining on NXcrypto's page, and one diff of somebody reverting NXcrypto. What do those actually prove? That NXcrypto has opponents (big surprise). So, yes, as you suggest, I'll support an indef as well. ] &#124; ] 20:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC).
*Is there a length of time proposed for the p-ban or would it be indefinite? ] (]) 17:06, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
*:I would say indefinite; not infinite, but I'd be wary about letting them back into articlespace without some kind of preclearance. ] (] • she/her) 18:39, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
*It looks to me like there is a consensus for an indefinite partial block for PerspicazHistorian from article space. Unless any uninvolved admin objects within a day or so, I will close as such. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 06:31, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
*:Given PH's recent slew of requests on multiple admin talk pages, yes, please do. - ] ] 12:58, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
*<!--
-->


{{reflist talk}}
Between 7 March and 9 March, Biophys performed several edits on behalf on HanzoHattori. All these articles were previously edited by HanzoHattori and his socks. Biophys did not do any edits of his own during this period.
{{hab}}


==LaylaCares==
* ]
{{hat|There is consensus to remove LaylaCares's EC flag. ] (]) 17:55, 5 January 2025 (UTC)}}
* Previously heavily edited by HanzoHattori, who has the 80 edits on this article.
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br />Requests may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>
* Also edited by the socks Captain Obvious and his crime-fighting dog (13 edits) and Ostateczny Krach Systemu Korporacji (3).
* Other editors do not even come close to HanzoHattori and his socks (and now the proxy Biophys).


===Request concerning LaylaCares===
* ]
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|Vice regent}} 08:00, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
* Chief editor is the HanzoHattori sock Captain Obvious and his crime-fighting dog


; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|LaylaCares}}<p>{{ds/log|LaylaCares}}</p>
* ]
* Chief editor is HanzoHattori. Together with the socks ] and Ostateczny Krach Systemu Korporacji they have over 150 edits. No other editors come even close.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


<!--- Here and at the end, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
* ]
* HanzoHattori has 4 edits on this article.
* Biophys has never before been interested in Turkish history.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]
* ]
<!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced --->
* A little known article heavily edited by HanzoHattori socks RamboKadyrov and Captain obvious and his crime-fighting dog.
* Biophys has never shown much interest in World War II history of Germany and Poland.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
* ]
<!-- Supply diffs as evidence here, and explain why they require arbitration enforcement. Any allegation not supported by a diff is usually disregarded. You may also link to an archived version of long discussions instead of supplying very many diffs. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as ], or groundless or ] complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.-->
* Previously edited by HanzoHattori.
# EC gaming
* Biophys has never shown much interest in German history. His edit is a massive change which requires knowledge of the subject. It is highly unlikely this edit was written by Biophys himself.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


* ] ]
* Created by HanzoHattori sock Captain Obvious and his crime-fighting dog in 2008.
* No other editor has made major edits in this article.
* Biophys has never before displayed any interest in Japan or Japanese people - one of Hanzo's main interests
* Biophys never edited this article before.


;If ] are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see ]):
Please note, that Biophys edited all these articles '''sequentially'''. It is highly unlikely he would suddenly get interested in all these articles edited or created by HanzoHattori. It is unlikely that Biophys would suddenly (after performing sequential edits on several HanzoHattori articles), get interested in a little known Japanese person (whose article just happens to have been created by HanzoHattori.)


; Additional comments by editor filing complaint :
There is ''yet another'' sequential row of proxy edits by Biophys on the evening of 5 March.
Pretty obvious case of EC gaming. Account created on Nov 17, 2024, then about 500 mostly minor edits followed by the first substantial edit ever was the creation of on Dec 17 (subsequently moved to draftspace).''']''' <sub>(Please ] on reply)</sub> 08:00, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
* ]
* Heavily edited by HanzoHattori and his socks.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


* ] ; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested :
* HanzoHattori & socks are the main editors of this article.
* Biophys never edited this article before


<!--- In the line below, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
* ]
* Familiar story: HanzoHattori and socks are the main editors.
* HanzoHattori also created this article in 2007.


===Discussion concerning LaylaCares===
* ]
<small>''Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.<br />Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.''</small>
* HanzoHattori is the most active editor. The socks have also edited.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


====Statement by LaylaCares====
* ]
* This article was created on 5 March by Biophys.
* It is unlikely the text was written by Biophys himself. The English is almost perfect, while Biophys usually makes many mistakes.
* The structure is similar to what HanzoHattori used: just a single chapter. (Compare to this HanzoHattori-created article:
* Ref formatting is similar to what HanzoHattori used. Please compare this to or to any other HanzoHattori edits.


====Statement by Aquillion====
''Yet another'' row of proxy edits in the early hours of 7 March:
Question: Assuming it's determined that they gamed the extended-confirmed restriction, would the page they created be ]-able? I've asked the relevant question in more detail ], since it is likely to come up again as long as we have such a broad restriction on effect, but I figured it was worth mentioning the issue here as well. --] (]) 14:16, 4 January 2025 (UTC)


===Statement by Dan Murphy===
* ]
Please look at ], written by the account under discussion. It's a hit job, originally placed in mainspace by this account. Anyone who wrote that shouldn't be allowed with 1 million miles of the topic.] (]) 23:14, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
* A HanzoHattori socks has 100 edits on this article; next most active editor has only 6.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


====Statement by starship.paint====
* ]
I've edited Draft:Hamas–UNRWA relations, so Dan Murphy's link is inaccurate for the purposes of this discussion. For the version of Draft:Hamas–UNRWA relations with content only written by LaylaCares, . '''] (] / ])''' 10:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
* HanzoHattori has 111 edits and a sock as 25 edits. Next most active editor has only 33 edits.


====Statement by (username)====
* ]
* Also edited by HanzoHattori in the past.


<!-- Copy and paste this empty section below the most recent statement and replace "(username)" with your username. -->
*]
* HanzoHattori and socks have done nearly all edits on this article.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


===Result concerning LaylaCares===
*]
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.''
* A HanzoHattori sock has the most edits in this article.
<!-- When closing this request use {{hat|Result}} / {{hab}}, inform the user on their talk page if they are being sanctioned (eg with {{AE sanction}} or {{uw-aeblock}} and note it in the discretionary sanctions log. -->
*I agree that this looks like EC-gaming. Absent evidence that the edits themselves were problematic, I would either TBAN from ARBPIA or pull the EC flag until the user has made 500 edits that aren't rapidfire possibly LLM-assisted gnomish edits. ] (]) 17:02, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
*I agree on the gaming piece and would suggest mainspace edits+time for restoration of EC. I will throw out 3 months + 500 (substantive) main space edits. ] (]) 17:16, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
*I agree with Barkeep but I'd up it to 4 months. I don't believe that a TBAN is necessary at this point. ] (]/]) 04:45, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
*@]: I agree that the draft should be G5'd, but will wait for consensus to develop here. ] (]/]) 01:00, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:I don't think the wording of ] allows for deletion of a page that was created by an EC user. <small>(ECR also seems to forget that anything other than articles and talkpages exists, but I think the most reasonable reading of provision A still allows for G5ing drafts at admins' discretion if the criteria are met.)</small> That said, a consensus at AE can delete a page as a "reasonable measure that necessary and proportionate for the smooth running of the project". Deleting under that provision is not something to be done lightly, but I think for a case where a page's existence violates the spirit of an ArbCom restriction but not the letter, it'd be a fair time to do it. And/or this could make for a good ARCA question, probably after PIA5 wraps. <span style="font-family:courier"> -- ]</span><sup class="nowrap">&#91;]]</sup> <small>(])</small> 03:48, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*I would just pull EC and require the editor to apply via AE appeal for its restoration. They should be very clearly aware that receiving such restoration will require both substantial time and making ''real'', substantive edits outside the area, as well as an understanding of what is expected of editors working in a CTOP area. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 01:22, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*I see a clear consensus here to remove the EC flag. For clarity, when I proposed a TBAN above it was because removing this flag ''is'' an ARBPIA TBAN as long as the ECR remedy remains in place; it's simply a question of whether the editor get the other privileges of EC or not. I don't see a consensus on what to do with the draft, but given that other editors have now made substantive contributions to it, I don't believe it's a good use of AE time to discuss the hypothetical further. ] (]) 17:55, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
{{hab}}


==AstroGuy0==
Other evidence:
{{hat|{{u|AstroGuy0}} has been issued a warning for source misrepresentation by {{u|Voorts}}. No other reviewers have expressed any wish for further action. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 06:29, 7 January 2025 (UTC) }}
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br />Requests may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>


===Request concerning AstroGuy0===
* ]
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|Hemiauchenia}} 03:41, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
* Again heavily edited by HanzoHattori socks in the past.
* Biophys never edited this article before.


; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|AstroGuy0}}<p>{{ds/log|AstroGuy0}}</p>
* ]
* Heavily edited by many different HanzoHattori socks.


<!--- Here and at the end, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
* There are also many other articles where Biophys obviously proxied for HanzoHattori, but the evidence presented above should be more than enough.


;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]
;Enforcement action requested (], ] or ]) : The infamous ] case resulted in several highly disruptive users being topic banned from Eastern European articles by ArbCom. These topic bans have worked well and have helped to pacify the topic area. For some reason (perhaps due to his "retirement" tactic), Biophys managed to escape sanctions even though he was one of the chief disruptors of the EEML cabal. Massive edit warring and proxying for an infamous banned POV-warrior cannot be allowed to go on. Biophys has already received multiple sanctions and warnings, yet he has learned nothing, has only accelerated his disruptive behaviour after the closure of the EEML case.
<!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced --->
(Even though this isn't the usual R&I fare, I consider the intersection of "Race/ethnicity and sex offending", to come under "the intersection of '''race/ethnicity''' and human abilities '''and behaviour'''")


; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
A 1RR restriction is '''not enough'''. Biophys has already promised to follow 1RR: ("I will also try to stick to 1RR").] replied: "in particular, I expect Biophys to adhere to his promise to "try to stick to 1RR"." In September 2009, Biophys still had a userbox "this user follows 1RR" on his now-deleted userpage. The above diffs of edit warring show how well Biophys kept his "promise."
<!-- Supply diffs as evidence here, and explain why they require arbitration enforcement. Any allegation not supported by a diff is usually disregarded. You may also link to an archived version of long discussions instead of supplying very many diffs. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as ], or groundless or ] complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.-->
# Asserts that "A majority of the perpetrators were Pakistani men" despite the cited source (freely accessible at ) does not mention the word "Pakistani" or any variant once.
# Describes the sex offender ring as "Pakistani" in the opening sentence when the cited source in the body says that they were only "mainly Pakistani"


; Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any :
The necessity of topic banning Biophys from Eastern European articles in line with the other EEML sanctions should be self-evident. However, since Biophys has also proxied for HanzoHattori in other articles (such as ]), this topic ban is not enough. I request a one-year block followed by a EE topic ban for continued heavy disruption despite several sanctions and warnings.


;If ] are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see ]):
This is what admins had to say during the last AE report about Biophys:
*"The involved editors have been warned extensively. Let's try to make a decision here, or else we should go to arbitration." -- Jehochman
*"I generally support some sort of restriction on Biophys, as I have warned them previously, and they appear to be continuing with battleground behavior." -- Jehochman
*"I am beginning to warm to Shell's suggestion that if we continue to see reports and discussions like this (including some recently at ANI, I think), topic bans all around may be the best way to prevent continued conflict." -- Sandstein
*"...but I would not want to impose a full topic or specific article ban for issues that were more than a month old" -- Thatcher


: Made aware of contentious topics criterion:
; Additional comments by editor filing complaint : Having been "involved" in the ] case, I have been actively watching participants in the EEML for evidence of continued disruption, and all of the above is very recent evidence which seems to demonstrate that the user in question still does not get "it".
<!-- Add any further comment here -->


; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested : ; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested :
<!-- Please notify the user against whom you request enforcement of the request (you may use {{subst:AE-notice|thread name}}), and then replace this comment with a diff of the notification. The request will normally not be processed otherwise. -->


<!--- In the line below, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
===Discussion concerning Biophys===


Additional comments by editor filing complaint:
====Statement by Biophys====
This is largely a harassment campaign by a group of like-minded Russian users, most of whom participated in EEML case. This is also an attempt to re-litigate the EEML case since Russavia and others frequently quote this case and provide links to comments made much earlier. Here is the proof:
*This AE request was filed by ]. I did not comment about him almost for a year except asking ''to lift all his sanctions''. But he came back with vengeance, immediately after the end of his editing restrictions. The restrictions had nothing to do with me. He started some time ago from ] me (hence his first block by Moreschi) and he now continue the "battle".
*Recent personal attack by ]: "''Who are serving?''" (I have to provide link to my talk page because LokiiT distorted a lot of things in his comment below).
*Personal attacks by YMB29 ,, . He even tells to Altenmann: ''"I am trying to get the admins to finally do something about him... don't tell me that I should be cooperative with him and that we should work together"'' .
*Recent threat by ] (''"may be we can meet you in Moscow..."'') .
*] also came to personally attack me (see edit summary):
*''Two more people'' came through ''proxy'' servers to talk page of ] to blame me of being a "terrorist supporter" and ] Future Perfect - see this supervised record . According to this SPI request , all of them are different persons.
*Vandalism accusations by ] in response my quotes from a book by a notable philologist ] .
*Wikistalking by ] and ] who reverted whatever I did (see diffs in this link )
*Saiga12 copycats a previous threat by ] .This is bad because they know who I am in real life, and there are bad posts about me off-wiki.
*I received a mildly threatening email to my ''work'' rather than to wikipedia address during the EEML case signed by "Filatov". This is real life name declared by Ellol at his user page. I deleted this message as garbage. Eloll said it was his impostor and maybe it was .
*There are now at least four accounts, {{User|Vlad_fedorov}}, {{User|Saiga12}}, {{User|YMB29}}, and {{User|Ellol}} who do little beyond wikistalking my edits, reverts and other disruption. Please examine their edit history.


This new user seems intent on POVPUSHING regarding "Asian/Muslim grooming gangs" and making contentious claims that are not backed up by sources. ] (]) 03:44, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
Nevertheless, I in fact collaborated and negotiated with ] in "Bombings" article (see below) and I can continue doing the same with any of the users involved (see the "Proposed conflict resolution" section below).


===Discussion concerning AstroGuy0===
The reverts. Many diffs by Russavia are not reverts to older version, but changes to a compromise version, or simply significant changes during a single edit. Yes, there are many reverts, but they are usually done in the framework of one or at most two reverts per day (or less frequently). The exception was vandalism fight in one article. I had problems mostly with Ellol and YMB29 who followed my edits and aggressively reverted whatever I did (see diffs in this link ).
<small>''Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.<br />Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.''</small>


====Statement by AstroGuy0====
The alleged proxy editing. I had an email exchange with another person who suggested to make specific changes in a number of articles. Since I was well familiar with the subjects, I agreed to look at the matter (I previously edited many articles in this area ). I looked at the suggested changes, agreed with some of them, rejected others, and modified whatever was necessary. But I did not act as "meatpuppet". ''"Meatpuppetry is the recruitment of editors as proxies to sway consensus"'' according to ]. But I made only such changes I would like to make myself. I did not even touch some articles because I disagreed with ''all'' changes he suggested. I also checked the sources.


====Statement by Iskandar323====
Everyone is welcome to examine each my single edit (see evidence by Russavia above) to see that they improve the content. I honestly believe these my actions were fully consistent with ] and other policies, such as WP:RS and WP:NPOV. And I am ready to answer any specific questions about these my edits:
This rather dated "Asian/Muslim grooming gangs" malarkey from the UK has recently been pushed on social media by a certain US tech billionaire and is now recirculating in right-wing social media and the blogosphere, partly in connection with UK politics, so this trend could flare before it dims. ] (]) 03:50, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
. None of the edits was in support of any terrorist organizations. For example, they complained about using Kavkaz Center as a source. Fine, I remove cat "News agency" but keep cat "Propaganda organizations" in the article: . And all other edits considered by Russavia as incriminating evidence are essentially like that and very much noncontroversial.


====Statement by (username)====
I just saw (I did not read it before). Well, I am "able to confirm that the changes are verifiable" and that I "have independent reasons for making them". The reason is obviously improvement of the content.
<!-- Copy and paste this empty section below the most recent statement and replace "(username)" with your username. -->


===Result concerning AstroGuy0===
]. Here, I had extensive discussions with ], and it was me who started a number of topics that needed discussion (please take a look): ,
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.''
,,
<!-- When closing this request use {{hat|Result}} / {{hab}}, inform the user on their talk page if they are being sanctioned (eg with {{AE sanction}} or {{uw-aeblock}} and note it in the discretionary sanctions log. -->
,
*<!--
.
-->
I was also looking for the 3rd opinion from ], who is not "on my side": , , but unfortunately he was not there. Yes, I believe the mediation by someone like him is the way to go. If you look at my edits, I mostly tried to develop a compromise version. I hardly made even a couple of "blind reverts" in this article.
:The second diff was before AG0 received a CTOP alert. I've alerted AG0 to other CTOPs that they've edited in, and I am going to warn them for their conduct in diff #1 without prejudice to other admins determining that further action is warranted. ] (]/]) 04:33, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
:I also looked at the source, and it indeed does not in any way support the claim made; it does not mention "Pakistani" even once. This is a fairly new editor, but I think we need to make it very clear to them that misrepresentation of sources is not something we will tolerate. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 04:59, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
::Given that AstroGuy0 has already been issued a warning, I don't think anything further is necessary, and will close as such unless any uninvolved admin shortly objects. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 18:23, 6 January 2025 (UTC)
{{hab}}


==Lemabeta==
]. That was mostly a struggle with a vandal who did such edits: ,,. Vandal or not, but I fully explained everything to him at article talk page: . Yes, "Russian invaders" are insulted at the Islamist web site, kavkaz.org, exactly as Russavia tells. However, they are ''not'' insulted in the wikipedia article. The article is written in full compliance with our NPOV policy, as one can see from the diff . Kavkaz.org was only used to source the statements by Chechen fighters, exactly as in hundreds published books . Saying that, I am very open to the idea of removing any references to kavkaz.org (and other sources that refer to kavkaz.org) if they contradict more reliable sources, as I did yesterday .
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br />Requests may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>


===Request concerning Lemabeta===
]. Everything was explained several times at talk page
; User who is submitting this request for enforcement : {{userlinks|EF5}} 20:18, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
. I agree with last version by ]: , who modified my version as follows: .


; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Lemabeta}}<p>{{ds/log|Lemabeta}}</p>
] We had some heated debates, but finally came to consensus, including the new title (I did not even edit there for a long time).


<!--- Here and at the end, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->
]. Here is the discussion.
. ] does OR by claiming that something is "geographically impossible", although tons of publications claim that very much possible.


;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]
]. I discussed and tried to find some compromise here, but ] repeatedly removed a lot of text sourced to books , and the discussion went confrontational . I asked an advice from ]: , and he was really helpful, but we did not resolve our differences with YMB29. I finally stopped editing this article a couple of weeks ago. You may look at the contributions of {{User|YMB29}}. If you think he can do the job better than me, I have no problem leaving this article to him.
<!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced --->

*Altenmann. That was an extremely offensive comment. I do not have anti-Russian, anti-Chechen, anti-Polish or other "anti-national" attitudes. That is why I had good relations with Ukrainian, Polish ''and Russian'' (like Colchicum or Muscovite99) users. It's only natural if a modern-day German does not like ] and ]. And it is just as natural if a modern-day Russian (like me) does not like the Soviet system and the ].

*LokiiT: I do not have any current content disagreements with you. You made a big story from two my edits in one article by coming at my talk page and claiming me to be a "terrorist supporter" . You did the same previously with regard to another user . The entire conversation can be found at my talk page: . See also links given by FPS. I did not stalk you at all, but simply went through a large number of Chechnya-related pages (see the examples by Russavia), and certainly could not miss the article about their current separatist leader.

*To Skäpperöd:No, I am not familiar with any policies that prohibit ''productive collaboration'' by email. The problem in EEML case was the alleged cooperation against other users and inappropriate canvassing. There was nothing of that kind here. No one asked me to vote or revert anyone. Besides, for how long can you haunt me with EEML case? You collected a number of diffs that show my frustration during this case (some of them are taken from old versions I deleted). I made no official promises to stop editing in EE area. Neither I was officially asked to stop editing. Yes, I had ''an intention'' to abandon my current account and edit only science. And I indeed marked my current account as "Retired" and opened an alternative account, ]. However, after making several edits , I realized that doing so is deception, no matter what my reasons might be. So, I marked this new account as my second account , fixed some of the old edits like this: and ''left a notice about this to Arbcom'' . ''Why I am not editing science from my current account?'' One of the reasons: I feel uncomfortable editing anything related to my work because of the ] and ] accusations by Russavia on-wiki and similar accusations off-wiki.

*Re to Vlad fedorov. Most of your claims are very old. As about new issues, that is what I said:. Please do not blame me of something I never did without supporting diffs. No, I did not write much about Putin, but what I wrote was fully sourced and consistent with our policies.

*Re to YMB29. At the talk page of ] I said that "I do not care if '''you''' are doing this yourself or someone asked you" . I did not mean myself. I have no idea who was user you are talking about. I did not ask him about anything. Please do not quote my words on a totally different subject.

====Proposed conflict resolution====
*Offer to Russavia. Russavia, I voted to lift all your sanctions. But you ask sanctions for me. I think the problem is article ], the only one where we have serious disagreements. You just reverted it to , immediately after coming from your editing restriction. I suggest the following. 1. We start from last stable version. 2. We create a list of our disagreements if any. 3. We ask Alex, Ezhiki or any other administrator ''of your choosing'' (or any established member of Mediation Committee) to be our ''judge'' rather than mediator. 4. He/she looks at the list and decides each disagreement one way or another. I agree in advance with any his/her decisions. Would that be working for you? Would you agree to withdraw this AE request? ] (]) 13:01, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*Offer to ]. Same as to Russavia. Would you agree?] (]) 13:01, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*Offer to ]. The only thing you did was reverting my edits in ], ] and ]. I will never edit these articles again. You can ] them. But you do not follow my edits in other articles. Agree? ] (]) 13:01, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*<s>Offer to ]. We keep last most complete version but indicate strength and losses as follows: ... per Russian side and ... per Chechen side. And let's discuss any other specific issues.</s> Seems to be resolved, thanks to ]. ] (]) 13:01, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*I do not have any other disputes with other editors.] (]) 13:07, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*None of the users involved responded positively to this offer so far, although I left them a notice five days ago. So, who does not want the collaboration? Russavia, do not you want some help even from the most friendly administrators like Alex or Ezhiki (if they agree of course)? ] (]) 13:42, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

==== Comments by others about the request concerning Biophys ====

===== user:Altenmann : disclaimer =====
I amware of severe anti-Russian attitude of Biophys. I have no problem with this: everyone is entitled to their position. I see no problem it promoting this anti-Russia attitude into wikipedia articles as long as it is clear who is the bearer of this attitude (and this bearer is notable enough for their opinion to be reported) and it iss not presented as ''truth'' about Russia.

At the same time I disagree with usage of my name by Biophys as any kind of validation of his actions. For example, his phrase "I agree with version by User:Altenmann" does not mean that this version was somehow endorsed by me: it just randomly happened that I was the last one to edit this page.

I do remember finding a number of Boiphys's editing habits as problematic, but I have bad memory and don't really care about modern East-European political issues to waste my time on editing/personal conflicts. - Altenmann ] 23:34, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

===== user:Celasson : just thoughts =====

We are not a debating society. We are Misplaced Pages which is based upon WP:FIVE; one of those being WP:NPOV. And the title is NOT NPOV. --Russavia Dialogue 01:15, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

People,we can not tolerate phrases such as '''We are not a debating society''' it is horrible that somebody dare he? I think lot of guys here have to learn that various points of view can be integrated in a particular Wiki article.And you can say it about Biophys and about his opponents.But '''We are not a debating society''' is unacceptable.] (]) 00:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

===== user:DonaldDuck : objection =====
I object to use of my name and our limited recent interaction by Biophys as any kind of justification for his actions. After my indefinite block (which was result of coordinated efforts by EEML cabal to remove me from Misplaced Pages, and Biophys was member of the EEML group), I avoid articles on controversial topics such as terrorism/Chechnya, so we just edit in different topic areas with Biophys.] (]) 05:01, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Comment by Fut.Perf. =====
I'll just point out that Biophys and two of his opponents, {{user|LokiiT}} and {{user|Ellol}}, were recently on my talkpage bitterly complaining about each other, about issues related to the ones raised here. The threads are at ] and ]. I also observed him edit-warring persistently against {{user|HistoricWarrior007}} on ], in a situation where my impression was that both editors were behaving in a heavily tendentious way. For various reasons I couldn't muster the energy to judge the situation and take action at the time, and so I think it will be better if I abstain from such action now too; however, it appears to me that the time may be ripe for at least a revert limitation, possibly not just on him but also some of the editors on the other side. ] ] 07:35, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Comment by # Grey Fox-9589 =====
I'm pretty amazed Biophys is actually still editing since hes endured some of the worst stalking and herassment himself. If I recall correctly, he got outed and threatened even outside wikipedia. Users who are after him are always extremely nationalistically orientated users who would get a fine pay as lawyers of ]. With users who aren't as nationalistaclly orientated he never really had problems. Biophys doesn't edit "anti-russian" (a wrong term considering that he's Russian himself), in contrary he sometimes protects articles from those who are trying to turn wikipedia in the new ]. He was never alone in this, but because of the EEML case many of those are temporarely topic banned at the moment and probably aren't allowed to voice their support right now. Note that Biophys himself survived EEML even though some users posted large lists of supposed "evidence". EEML wasn't long ago. This file for arbitration is an obvious attempt to get him sanctioned at a time when he would get outvoted.
:As for the edits by Hanzohattori. This users was actually a good editor, he created a lot of new articles, collected a lot of new sources and updated them regularely. Eventually he got banned for insulting an administrator and went on to become a sockpuppeteer. This of course doesn't mean that all the articles he created in the past are wrong. I became an editor too at the articles he created, after he got banned (but now I've become inactive too). Why would Biophys not be allowed to edit the articles? I've got to know both users a little and they both had the same interests. Biophys isn't even editing the articles so much, they're mostly small edits or votes.
:As a conclusion I would like to ask whatever administrator judging this request to look through the history of the complainers. Most of them will have an extremely obvious pro-Putin bias and a lot of them have a lot of disruption as well (some of them almost having been permabanned). ] (]) 13:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Concerning the further comments that Russavia has made below. It's another attempt at trying to demonise Biophys as someone promoting extremism, a pretex under which many journalists are banned from working in Russia. The source was already discussed at wp:rs several times. I explained the use of such sources here and there's no bad intention whatsoever. Several users have gone after biophys labeling him a 'terrorist lover' or other ridiculous accusations which together with calling him 'anti-russian' means they view him as ]. Ironically articles like ] are brought up. It's indeed quite so that articles like ] are often the setting of edit wars because the pro-Putin editors mostly target such articles. It's sad really, journalists and human rights activists reporting on crimes by the current Russian government are assassinated in Russia every few months. Afterwards their wikipedia pages are targeted by groups of Putin lobbyists attempting to discredit these activists. Anyone who tries to prevent this gets labeled "anti-Russian". ] (]) 20:16, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Further comments by Russavia=====
that his use of a terrorist website to source articles is not a problem and is always done from a NPOV stance. This is false, as can be attested by his persistent reinsertion of an external link (albeit from January 2009) to a terrorist website showing what the terrorist claim are the bodies of killed Russian soldiers, whom are described as "Russian invaders" right there on the page., . This is not NPOV; far from it. Biophys also claims that his other edits are always NPOV, however, this again is false. After I was topic banned last year, Biophys took the opportunity to - one which many editors had struggled to edit due to extreme ownership issues which Biophys seems to have with such articles. He mentions my recent edits to the article above, but what he fails to mention is what I have mentioned at ] - that is, Biophys continually reverts to his favoured version, whilst at the same time ignoring issues raised by other editors, and which '''always''' involves the removal of sourced information of the article by Biophys; ostensibly because it does not fit in with Biophys' own POV. Such things have been experienced in the past on other articles, such as ], where Biophys' edits allowed conspiracy theories to have "centre stage", whilst pushing information from aviation experts out of sight. The same thing was experience at ], where accusations by ] were allowed to appear in the article, but criticism of those claims were not ,, etc. As one can see, Biophys clearly has a history of edit warring over information which does not fit his own POV on the ways of the world, and it is being continued as per the reported articles above. --] <sup>]</sup> 17:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comments/Evidence by YMB29=====
I was also going to post a similar complaint about Biophys. I reported him before at the edit warring noticeboard , but the request was declined as not being posted in the right place.

I can confirm that Biophys has continued edit warring and also tag teaming after the EEML case. He just pretended to retire and kept quite during the case and for some time after it.

Since the end of January Biophys has resumed edit warring in the ] article, trying to reinsert his edits from September without any discussion. Even attempts by admin ] to get a discussion going on the issues were eventually ignored by Biophys, as he failed to respond.

But more importantly he continues tag teaming like in the EEML days. He got a user who never edited the article before to revert for him. <br>
He basically admitted it when I asked him about it:
:-''Someone asked me? You mean like you asked User:Defender of torch to revert me in the human rights article?''
:-''I said "I do not care". Yes, that's my personal opinion: we should encourage communication in this project, no matter how people do it (over the phone, by email or using body language). No one should be punished for "canvassing".''

In the ] article he tried to insert his POVed jokes , even after all the users told him that they are inappropriate.
Then he simply goes over to the ] article to insert those same jokes there, because he knew that not nearly as much people edit that article. He does not give evidence of the jokes' notability and continues to edit war. It is like he is on a mission to sneak in his POVed edits anyway he can and does not care what others have to say...

Obviously he was lucky to escape a ban in the EEML case, but his behavior shows that he learned nothing.

-] (]) 01:55, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

'''Response to "offers" by Biophys'''

First of all, I don't need to "own" any articles...

As mentioned already, Biophys has made promises before but they were kept only temporarily, until things cooled down.

Also, edit warring is one thing but coordinating it offline and proxying for a banned user, even after the EEML case, is too much. -] (]) 02:23, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

'''Response to personal attack accusations'''

Don't know how my comments that Biophys brought up are personal attacks. One of the comments was not even made to him. He also quotes out of context (note again that this is common for him when making accusations) to make it seem like I refused to cooperate with him, when in fact I explained: ''I have tried to resolve this through discussion countless times with him, but he is not interested. He sometimes only pretends to discuss a little but then fails to continue and just reverts.''

Biophys tries to present the statements and evidence here as a mass attack against him (don't know if he still thinks FSB agents are involved) due to his political views, but one just has to look at his history on Misplaced Pages to see that the complaints against him are valid and many users are just tired of his behavior. -] (]) 22:46, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comments/Evidence by LokiiT=====
Biophys seems to have gone back to all his old disruptive ways again following a short calm after the EEML case. Just in the past couple of weeks he's engaged in stalking, edit warring and sock fishing, all issues that I had brought up in my EEML evidence page, and that I hoped would have come to an end after that.

It started (with me) in late February when he stalked me to the ] article. This was an article he had never edited in before, and his first edit was a revert of my edit (something he has a long history of doing). (I'm beginning to think he's somehow connected to the POV pushing IP who I had reverted there in the first place). He then continued to edit war in that article without discussing things in talk until after, and ignoring everything I was saying, which forced me to take it off my watched list out of frustration. (Also note in that last revert, he used a provocation "trick" I described in my EEML evidence where he does a giant revert-edit while saying something minor/irrelevant in the edit summary.)

I made a somewhat hot-headed response to those provocations of his (given our history, I do believe they were provocations), and he proceeded to report me at an admin's talk page. In his report, he made a bold faced lie about my real life identity, claiming that I had actually said myself that I was "related to" (ie. a sock of) the inactive user , a name I had all but forgotten about since 2008 when he first accused me and ] of being this person's sock along with working for the Russian government (this government accusation was made on a subpage that he deleted, but was confirmed by ]).

So then, after FPaS had understandably given up on our dispute, Biophys proceeded to report me for sockpuppeting. I made it clear on the page that I believed this was simply a personal attack/revenge tactic and that he was just fishing to see if I had any active socks, since the similarities between myself and the other accused parties are nonexistent; not even so much as back to back reverts or identical edits, and only two or three similar articles. The result of that investigation, involving five users and four IPs, was that they were unrelated. This gives more evidence that he was just fishing and wasting everyone's time on top of it. (Again, puppet fishing was yet another issue I had brought up in my EEML evidence page. The tally of wrongful accusations he's made against me has to be exceeding 10-15 if you include IPs.)

Basically I feel that he's blatantly harassing me, and has been since I first created this account . If stalking me isn't enough, surely the continuous baseless accusations and lies/prying about my real life identity which have nothing to do with wikipedia content are. ] (]) 03:06, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

====Comment by Skäpperöd====
===== Re: Biophys' proxying for banned users =====
It is disturbing to see Biophys continuing the EEML habit of proxying for blocked users (compare the compelling evidence by Russavia above to ). Already in December, that this is not OK, and has included proxying for blocked users in the respective user-specific EEML-FoFs as evidence for disruption. ] (]) 18:06, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Re: Don't ban me, I will withdraw from the area of conflict =====

Biophys should not even have edited the articles where the proxying took place. He promised to edit science only, and retired, to avoid sanctions in the EEML arbcom:

The arbcom case had just started when Biophys announced "". When the case was in its final stage (2 months ago), Biophys again stated "," and the "last word"

Biophys also 'retired' (obviously, not) to avoid sanctions during the EEML arbcom: "" This response was made by an editor on 15 October 2009 (!): "."

=====Re: Biophys' response to the above=====

Re : Biophys, your involvement with the EEML and the resulting arbcom is where we met. In contrast to the other EEMListees, you apologized for your wrongdoings and promised to not do that again. Believe it or not, that meant something to me. From your reactions, I had the impression that in contrast to other listmembers you seriously reconsidered where you want to go here. And now I see you proxying big time, and understand that all your promises and talk is just strategy to avoid sanctions. ] (]) 22:32, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

====Comment by Vlad fedorov====

=====Insulting other editros as paid Pro-Putin editors or FSB agents. Incivilty.=====

I am actually quite disappointed with adminstrator's discriminative approach to Biophys and Co behaviour. In ] it was forbidden to name EEML members "Anti-Russian" or "cabal members". At the same time guys like Biophys, Grey Fox, etc. here at these pages and anywhere in WP are allowed to insult anyone as "paid Pro-Putin editors", "paid FSB editors".

I very surprised that criticizing ] POV article on absence of the text related to humanitarian corridors equals to being paid Pro-Putin editor, or to being an agent of FSB. See more . And how this at all relates to being Pro-Putin editor.

I am also surprised that any attempt to fix Biophys extreme POV, as acknowledged already by many editors since Stomakhin arbcase, leads to you being called FSB internet paid editor of fascist "Nashi" group.

I expect that administrators at least here would take measures to enforce arbitration FoF of Piotrus 2 case ], especially finding on "Involvement by security organs"

6.1) There is no convincing evidence that any of the security organs of the Russian state are involved in Misplaced Pages editing, directly or indirectly; nor that any editors involved in this matter are acting as agents of or receiving instruction from said organs.

Passed 9 to 0 at 23:59, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
6.2) Several editors have claimed that they are agents of certain Russian security organs. Such claims are disruptive and potentially intimidating to other editors, even when made in jest.

Passed 9 to 0 at 23:59, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

I am surprised that some WP users are allowed to call the names and to insult other users without any consequences. I believe that doesn't promote any collaborative work of the editors and doesn't contribute to already heated atmosphere of Eastern European articles.

Sorry for "I-centric" passage.

=====Using arbitration as a tool to kick opponents off WP=====

Just look into arbitration case which was initiated by Biophys after his unsuccessful edit warring in ] -
]. He got a warning and 3RR block on this article. In sum Biophys has followed Commodore Sloat edits, discovered some unrelated to his matter uncivil comments, summed with his personal accusations and tried to kick Commodore Sloat from WP to OWN Operation Sarindar article.

Now look into arbitration case ], the same picture. He collected all my uncivil comments that I've erroneously made before and made a case against me just to kick me off WP as an editor whose contibutions he was so fiercely opposing. Finally this case from content dispute turned into vlad fedorov civilty case. As a result extremist Boris Stomakhin who was an editor of terrorist web-site KavkazCenter was named as dissident in WP.

Biophys also provokes other users by using various WP procedures. For example, he initiated sockpuppet investigation on users Saiga12 which lead to negative answer and Lokiit just to win content dispute over Chechen articles. And when he gets a response reaction from these authors he insults them by naming paid Pro-Putin editors and claims that it is harrassment campaign against him.

He has also initiated in EEML case campaign against user Ellol whom he accused of issuing coded death threats for him. Now in his response claims that he cooperates with user Ellol. What a drastic change! Perhaps we would ask Ellol himself if he finds Biophys to be cooperative?

=====Biophys political agenda in WP=====

Biophys right from his start in Misplaced Pages unambiguously by his actions was demonstrating why he is here.

his WP program:

"Western security and intelligence services should '''start harassing FSB and SVR personnel wherever possible'''. It '''should be routine to boot these officers from foreign postings'''. '''We should disrupt their lives and the lives of their families''' whenever and wherever possible. American and European internal-security and foreign-intelligence services should track the finances of former and active-duty FSB and SVR officers. I'''f it is possible to cause them pain--for example, by regularly blocking the accounts of officers even tangentially connected to anti-dissident or criminal activity in Europe or Russia--we should do so'''."

At the end of this, Biophys uncunnily asks "Is that a good idea?". Do I need to point finger at the people who Biophys considers as FSB personnel in WP?

I leave the question of whether Australian guy like Russavia, US guy Commodore Sloat, or Belarusian lawyer like me are paid Pro-Putin agents. In fact this was repeated so many times, that actually all of us are tired of this and even accustomed to these incivilties.

But any objective observer who would analyze Biophys activities (contribs) in WP, will see:

* Extreme POV pushing based on opinionated sources. Just one recent example "Putin began the general bombing" from ]
* Sterilization of the articles from any POV contradicting that of Biophys
* Creation of offensive articles (FSB internet troll squad)
* Chronic violation of ] This surfaced several times in various arbcases but was never dealt with by the arbitrators.
* Attempts to kick rival editors through arbitration cases and wikilawyering
* Chronic violation of ]
* Harassment of other editors
* Treating Misplaced Pages as battleground where forces of light (EEML cabal and their folks) fight the forces of evil (paid Pro-Putin editors)
* Disinformation of other WP users just like by telling them that he (Biophys) cannot speak freely in Misplaced Pages. Ok guys, that Biophys who has created attack article ], who is calling other editors "paid Pro-Putin editors", says he is not free to speak here? Am I missing something there?

His previous activities:

could be seen only by the administrators. Here Biophys threats with creation of the new artciles which are supposed to be Anti-Russian.

by Biophys.

Start with his personal page which was emptied during EEML arbitration. If you would look at his misc links dating back to 2007 you will see that he has contained there as one of the main links a link to '''methods of propaganda and disinformation''', which contained very detailed description of how to disinform and how to advance propaganda.

Now just let us remember articles created by Biophys: ], ] now in light of that please appreciate his "work":

* - Biophys deletes sourced content by historian ].
* - Biophys deletes sourced content by Mayer without providing any reason again, asking to "discuss" on talk page. He does not justify this on Talk page himself.
* Biophys twice reinserts inaccurate information which is dismissed at talk as not connected to the content of the article{{ndash}}without even bothering to look at the ]. When ] reverts asking him to see talk, Biophys tries to at ]. Administrator ] Biophys to stop antics like that, as he did not even bother to consult the talk page.
* - Biophys removes sourced material about the politics of controversial Russian opposition leader ], claiming "undue weight for biography of a world chess champion."
* - Biophys is warned by ] to stop inserting nonsense into the ] article while ignoring the changes that take place on the ] page.

=====Forecast=====

If you won't educate Biophys, perhaps like me in Boris Stomakhin arbcase, these repeated Biophys-centric dramas on Incident admin board, Arb case, and Arb enforcement pages would never stop. Biophys is not showing even an inch of remorse, he still believes that FSB agents are hiding under his bed when he is editing on WP and they try to cut off his electricity supply to prevent him from editing WP.

=====Re:Biophys claims=====
Biophys claims:
"I looked at the suggested changes, agreed with some of them, rejected others, and modified whatever was necessary. But I did not act as "meatpuppet". Being "proxy" or "meatpuppet" means doing something ''exactly'' as someone else asked you. I did not do that. I made only such changes (with my corrections) I would like to make myself. In a number cases I did not even touch an article because I disagreed with ''all'' changes he suggested. I also checked the sources"

You know we had this situation already, but this could be only established by looking into emails or ICQ logs, which could be easily forged by the people who have it.

I even could imagine such "disagreement" between folks:

Hanzo: Please write: "Putin eats children".
Biophys: Hanzo, I disagree with you, Putin not only eats, but also fries children.

Anyway, if this could happen, then what sense bans have here in WP? The reason behind this meatpuppetry is that edits are initiated not by current user, but by banned user. Little "diagreements" between these two are not that important. What is important is the result - in the end article is effectively contributed by banned user, and it's not even important to which extent (smaller or bigger). ] (]) 08:54, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

====Statement by user Ellol====
A month ago Biophys came to my talk page and claimed that he had received a email signed by my name with "concerns about his health". Allegedly it was sent during the EEML case (last September — December), he "thought it might be me", but only now that "I indicated my name", he could link it to me. In reality my name has been on my user page non-stop for the past four years with these or those extra bio details. After I asked for more information about that alleged mail repeatedly, Biophys answered "Nothing more to tell at the moment. Thank you." and "Let's drop it" and then diverted from the topic.

At my talk page he stated, entirely on his free will, that "So, that was your impostor who knew your name", while now he speaks differently: "Eloll said it was his impostor, and maybe it was indeed his impostor. I do not know."

Regarding the alleged e-mail, in his recent post he claims to have "immediately deleted it as garbage", what is contradictory with his alleged state of concern with such a mail that now turns to be "a mildly threatening" per his comment.

I think that it must be clear that a story like that can't be treated as an accusation against any Misplaced Pages user, me in this case. Moreover, internal contradictions inside Biophys'es story indicate that it could be intentionally thought-up as an attempt to disseminate fear-mongering aka "Russians go" what is a very, very bad taste.

] (]) 12:22, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

===Result concerning Biophys===
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''

This request has now been open for ten days without input by uninvolved admins (and indeed apparently without input by users not involved in Eastern Europe editing disputes). My best guess is this is because
*the request is not so obviously either well founded or without merit that it could be disposed of quickly but needs close examiniation by several uninvolved people,
*it involves very many and serious allegations of longterm misconduct on the part of an established editor, and
*many administrators may not want to go anywhere near something that appears to be related to the hugely conflictual ] case and/or its parties.
For these reasons, I believe that this request is ill-suited to be dealt with under arbitration enforcement procedures. I propose that we - the admins working at AE - refer it to the Arbitration Committee so that they may decide whether to take it as a full case, dismiss it or otherwise dispose of it. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 16:32, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

: I concur with Sandstein on all counts - with cases of these nature you're looking at things which have been bubbling up for months or years and an uninvolved admin is practically unable to make a judgement call because of a lack of comprehension of that history - there seems to be bad blood on both sides and it's unclear whether it's all just a misunderstanding, or whether one side's targetting the other, or reacting to the other. ArbCom should be asked in this case for assistance. ] 06:31, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

::OK, I'll ask the Committee to take a look and am closing the thread here. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 06:42, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

:::I am familiar with the history here, and have reviewed the evidence. Uncollapsing the thread now because reading tiny type was giving me a headache. ] <sup>]</sup> 11:11, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

::::OK, but I am putting it into an archive box so as to prevent this case from being discussed in several places at once. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 20:00, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}

== Abd ==

''Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.''
===Request concerning Abd===
; User requesting enforcement : ] (]) 08:33, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Abd}}

;Sanction or remedy that this user violated : ]

; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it : :
# Removes from Ghost the lead paragraph that has been heavily disputed, and claims himself the arbiter of how much consensus is needed to place it on the lead.
# Removes the pseudoscience arbitration case notice from ]. (unlogged edit) He wasn't an originating party from either the "does Ghost belong to pseudoscience category" dispute, or the "should we place the pseudoscience arbitration notice here" dispute
## Removes it again, saying that the argument should count even if it was made by an IP.
# Comments out of the RfC section, in a topic that was not covered by the RfC
# Removes the NSF commentary from the pseudoscience case notice in ] (directly relevant to the Ghost dispute)
# Uses the whitelist page to comment on a lot of requests where he is not an originating party. Notice that the meaning of "originating party" was further clarified two weeks ago and this is a clear violation.
; Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required): # Warning by {{user|Enric Naval}}
;Enforcement action requested (], ] or ]) : One week block, as the restriction says.

; Additional comments by editor filing complaint : Ghost-related violations: Abd is not an originating party of the already-existing dispute that was going on ]. He has commented on the dispute outside of the context of the RfC, and he has extended the already-existing dispute about the NSF source into the Pseudoscience talk page.

:Whitelist-related violations: Abd held a discussion ] about improving the whitelist, but he has implemented it in a way that allows him to comment in any already-existing dispute that involves a whitelisting request, independently of whether he was an originating party or not. In , he advises an editor about COI, and this sort of advice is what caused the problems with LirazSiri, with those problems leading to his last AE block.

:He made two additional diffs that are not so clear-cut, so I sent those to requests for clarification. The diffs listed above are the clear-cut ones, and they are by themselves a clear violation. --] (]) 08:35, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested :

===Discussion concerning Abd===

====Statement by Abd====
See also ] filed by Enric Naval. When Enric first complained about my Ghost edits, I placed a request on my Talk page noting that I would respect any clarification by a neutral administrator covering this new interpretation, pending resolution. Absent such, since Enric Naval was highly involved in the subject RfAr and has consistently presented himself as an adverse party, with a number of complaints that were not sustained, I do not consider his interpretation binding. This request, however, reaches even beyond that. I respond in detail in collapse, if anyone needs detail. The collapse summaries should be adequate as non-evidenced response.
{{collapse top|1. Single edit to ], not a participation in discussion of a dispute}}
The existing dispute was over the use of an NSF report in an attempt to establish a scientific consensus that belief in ghosts was a pseudoscientific belief. The edit did not weigh in on this, but rather on a different issue, whether or not the NSF comment was sufficiently notable and required by balance ''in the lede.'' One does not make oneself the "sole arbiter" of some text by asserting a single edit. Nor did this edit "discuss" an extant controversy, which was over an RS issue, not lede characteristics as such. The comment about consensus was my understanding of our guidelines.
{{collapse top|about the lede and why this was inappropriate, not relevant to ban interpretation issue}}
Ledes should enjoy the highest level of consensus, more difficult issues should be covered in the text. That lede text is considered to require references is a sign that it may not reflect high consensus; generally everything in the lede should be established in the article, so references are redundant, and the lede should be a summary of the most notable and clear aspects of a topic. If Misplaced Pages had a Summary of Knowledge publication, consisting only of ledes from articles, would this text be in it? I didn't think so, hence I removed it. That removal did not take a position on the raging debate over the National Science Foundation reference, and I did not touch the later section in the article where it was used (the section on the situation in the United States); that usage, in fact, shows the narrowness of the NSF issue and why it doesn't belong in the lede. "Ghosts" are a global concept, and the situation in one nation is a small part of the topic.
{{collapse bottom}}
{{collapse bottom}}
{{collapse top|2. Pseudoscience arbitration case notice: not a participation in discussion of a dispute}}
At the time, ] was not in the pseudoscience category. It is now, but only as a result of protection of the "wrong version" in the middle of an edit war over it. Further, that notice was being used to insert an unsigned personal opinion, under color of an ArbComm finding. The simplest way to deal with it was to remove it. Ordinarily, I'd have made a single edit, as I initially did, and then left final disposition to the community. But autologout had struck, so it was IP. And then an editor removed it as if it had been vandalism, not appearing to read the edit summary. So I restored it logged-in, and noted that edits by IP editors should receive the same respect as edits by logged-in editors, generally. The edit was again reverted and I did not continue. There is serious disruption going on at ] and in the pseudoscience area, with edit warring at ], ], and ], such that the two articles have been full protected. I am not the cause of this disruption, not even close. I have only asserted, simply, normal editorial positions, without discussion (except for the inadvertent post mentioned outside collapse and allowed RfC comment). This kind of activity is not what the sanction was designed to address.

I was not aware of a "should we place the arbitration notice here" dispute. Perhaps Enric Naval could point out where it was. It became a dispute later, may still be in dispute, I don't know. If it started with the original placement and my removal, am I then an "originating party"? It doesn't matter, in fact, because I don't intend to discuss it. I took an action, a permitted one, not "discussion" but ordinary editing (with the minimal encouraged "discussion" of edit summary explaining the edit).

The edit was a completely independent judgment and not relevant to the original dispute, on the face. That my edit appeared to support one side of a dispute does not mean that it was a comment on the dispute. I was asserting a Talk page content issue, and that assertion did not address the standing dispute, which was not over the Talk page notice itself, even though those arguing might preferentially have one position or another. My work is not defined by several editors arguing, and was not a "comment" on their dispute. It was my action, as a member of the community who attempts to anticipate consensus, acting to express it. In the end, whether I'm correct or not will be up to the community, and these brief and quickly reversible actions, easily ignored if they are improper and find no support, are not disruptive. The raging debate, with three RfCs and counting, edit warring and repetition and multiplication of arguments, is. If I express my specific opinion about this, as to the factions, I'd be violating my ban, though it might leak through sometimes.
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{{collapse top|3. Discussion in ], inadvertent ban violation, now struck}}. I struck , as soon as I realized, it being pointed out by SamJohnston, in the RfAr/Clarification, that this was discussion, not a comment in an RfC, and related to a dispute in which I was not an originating party. I'd have deleted it if it had been immediately pointed out. The edit was unsigned and probably inadvertent. I put great effort into complying with the ban, while remaining engaged in permitted activity. I occasionally write a response, then dump it as it becomes clear to me that it would push the edge of the ban. I am attempting to interpret the ban very strictly, as I agreed to do. Had I been blocked for this edit, I'd have had no response but "Oops! Sorry!" At this point, I really don't understand why I'd even write the thing, all I can imagine is that I became confused as to where I was, given that I was also commenting, around the same time, in two different RfCs over the basic issue. So, at this point, I'd request one thing relevant to enforcement. If not for the ban, would that edit have been harmful? It is expressing what will probably be community consensus when the smoke clears, and, if not, at least it was a reasonable expression of what will become part of the consensus. I consider that edit crossed into doubtful territory, at least, so it is not a toe in the door, and I request that I not be blocked as a result of it. Repetition of such edits would appropriately see response with a block, even if inadvertent. I would also not object to a short block or a block log annotation, so that there is a ready record of violation history. However, this does not apply to the rest of what Enric Naval has alleged. --] (]) 17:09, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
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{{collapse top|4. Alleged removal of NSF commentary: Not a removal and not discussion.}}
Since the removal of the notice, an RfAr ruling on pseudoscience placed on a Talk page for an article not in the pseudoscience category, the topic not being covered in the definition of pseudoscience in the ruling itself, was reverted, I then so that it was clear that it was separate, addressing the most serious problem. I did not, as claimed by Enric Naval, remove it. I think he didn't read the whole diff. This is all normal editorial process whereby some compromise is made that preserves the critical values of all sides. I was disputing the Talk page notice and how it was presented, and working this out quickly and efficiently without tendentious discussion. That, it seems, is what ArbComm wanted me to do. I was not intervening in someone else's dispute, even though my actions might have an effect on that dispute.

Note that the entire ruling was again later as misleading or confusing. That may or may not stand. I do not necessarily support the removal, in fact, because I do not support arguing over trivialities, and especially not revert warring over them. I am not taking a side in the dispute between editors, on-wiki. (Off-wiki, I certainly have my opinions.) If one faction wants it in, and it is on a Talk page and does not do serious harm, why not leave it for a while? I simply took action, based on project welfare, and the sanction only covers certain kinds of discussion. I was personally content with separating out the most contentious part so that it was attributed, and possibly, if it were still considered disruptive (as argued in the latest removal) might have added some more qualifying text that would avoid misinterpretation. But I'm probably done with that issue, and I'm discussing it here only because of this AE request. In general, enforcement efforts over the sanction have caused far more waste of time than any disruption resulting from my alleged violations, most of which have not been sustained where examined.
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{{collapse top|5. Whitelist activity: Not a dispute and not discussion of a dispute}}
I'm flabbergasted by this one. Whitelist requests have been sitting for as long as two months with no response, or there is a single comment that is ambiguous and makes no decision. I've been in extensive discussion with Beetstra over this for a very long time, up to a year, and the case RfAr/Abd and JzG was originally about an improper blacklisting by an involved admin, and ArbComm confirmed there that blacklisting should not be based on admins making content decisions. However, content issues are not completely irrelevant, either, for if it is true that there is no possible legitimate usage, or that such usage would be the exception rather than the rule, this can be a factor in deciding how serious spam should be before blacklisting and then requiring whitelisting of individual pages. Big problem, though, is a lack of volunteer support at the whitelist page, and there are very few administrators working on blacklisting issues. So, after , I offered to help at the whitelist page, trying to pioneer a way for non-administrators to help, and my intention would be to solicit other editors to do the same, and to develop clearer guidelines for whitelisting requests. To do that, I need experience making whitelist judgments. So I've started doing that. These are simply expressed opinions on a whitelisting request. They are completely independent, though I do consider any comments that exist already. None of these would be at the level of dispute as contemplated in the sanction, though it's possible that someone will dispute my comments. There is no assertion that any comment is improper. There is no dispute at all until there is a decision, though if I come across a request where there is serious dispute, I might consider that and recuse because of the ban. Someone else can look at them, and I'll try to facilitate that happening.

I'm trying to make it quick and efficient to get a page whitelisted if there is an adequate ''possibility'' of legitimacy, and in doing this, there is a lot of flexibility. I can recommend "no action," but suggest to the requestor that they obtain support from other editors at an article Talk page, for example, or perhaps at a WikiProject. And if they do, then I can change my recommendation. Blacklist admins very obviously don't have time for this, and that is not their fault at all.

My work there also will be of no effect, a waste of time, if no blacklist admin respects it. I have no coercive power, nor would I want it. But this is an opportunity for blacklist admins to stop making content decisions when they deny a request (or, for that matter, grant it, though a whitelisting does ''not'' make a decision that a link is to be used). As I see it, admins would never deny a request, they would let the community do that, and the community can make content decisions. Then, if an admin participates in a whitelist discussion, it's only as a member of the community. A close as "whitelist," however, requires an admin, because it's an edit to a protected page. I'm proceeding with sensitivity and cooperation, I hope.

Enric Naval clearly considers the project a battleground, so that any discussion of a proposal becomes a "dispute." I don't think so. I have no intention of becoming embroiled in other people's disputes, either on the whitelist page or elsewhere. I'm just trying to help clear up the backlog, and to help make the ArbComm ruling on blacklisting a reality, while fully respecting the needs of the administrators working on antispam process. I may be uniquely placed to accomplish this, given a great deal of time spent studying blacklist issues, and quite a bit of successful work with blacklist admins. (Don't mistake the occasional flare-ups for a lack of cooperation, blacklist admins are faced with a flood of spam and it is very hard to distinguish that, sometimes, from legitimate content additions, and they get faced with charges of "censorship!" all the time. They need help and support that, at the same time, respects the goal: a functional editorial community which also needs assistance and support, necessary for the project.)
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{{collapse top|Enric Naval's warning: not about the only actual violation (number 3)}}
Enric Naval warned me only about the first item in his list. I responded adequately there, soliciting clarification from any neutral admin, should any agree with him. None did. The only violation here is his item 3, which was inadvertent, I was slow to recognize it when SamJohnston pointed it out, because of the noise about "violations" that weren't. You can see in my edits to RfAr/Clarification that at first I thought he was pointing to RfC text, I was astonished to find that he was right, so sure was I that I'd confined discussion to comment in RfC. Perfect and error-free, I am not.
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*'''@Verbal''' Please do not bring an open content dispute here, there is an RfC on the very position you are asserting, and your position is not the majority one, so far. That may change. It's moot for AE, because my sanction does not prohibit me from making errors about content. As to length of comment, my essential response is all visible outside of collapse, each collapse having a descriptive title that says it. There is no obligation to read the "details." Is there harm in them being made available? --] (]) 19:10, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
*'''@TS''' ''Continually injecting these thousand-word essays into discussions on Misplaced Pages.'' '''Have I done this anywhere recently, even once, let alone "continually"?''' I assume I'm allowed freedom on my own Talk page, and to present evidence and argument as needed when I'm hauled before ArbComm or AE. If I'm being "continually" hauled before ArbComm or AE, maybe some attention should be paid to that, and to who is doing it. You do realize it's the same people, don't you? --] (]) 19:34, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
*'''@Hans Adler.''' While I appreciate your support, the question here is my right to make the edits, not whether they were "correct" or not. While your view, if accepted, might be an ameliorating factor in ban enforcement, that's about it. Thanks. --] (]) 19:41, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
{{collapse top|@JzG and One Night in Hackney: I disputed an unopposed extreme claim by an editor on the blacklist page, thus originating a "dispute" as allowed.}}
*'''@JzG and One Night in Hackney.''' These editors raise as a new problem. Whether songfacts.com is RS or not is not the issue in itself, the issue for blacklisting is spamming, and thus there may be some dispute between an alleged spammer and someone demanding the spam stop. However, that isn't a dispute, per se, usually, on the blacklist page. (there is no practice of notifying "spammers" of blacklist discussions, and they normally don't see these and comment). It may be relevant, however, that discussion exists, because if there is a possibility of cooperative behavior from the "spammer," blacklisting is not to be used, by policy. Because I'd been discussing songfacts.com, off-wiki, with an administrator, and had investigated the site and found that it does appear to be, even, reliable source, in spite of the legal disclaimer ONIH found, it was important to note that possibility, since otherwise had been claimed. In other words, I was not intervening in the dispute between the spammer and the other editor (from which I explicitly have refrained, precisely because of my ban, even though I think I could be useful there, as I've been in the past with such offenders, they listen to sympathetic advice much better than "go away, dirty spammer!" which is, too often, the text or subtext, even if unintended), but '''I was disputing a claim by an editor on the blacklist page. Before that, there was no dispute on that page.''' So, for this "dispute," if we want to call it that, I'm an '''originating party,''' sorry to have to wikilawyer to that extent. My ban does not prohibit me from originating disputes. That someone somewhere else might be involved in some similar or related dispute doesn't make my independent comment an intervention in that other dispute. It stands apart from it, and does not resolve it or attempt to resolve it, though a resulting community consensus might have an effect.

Whether or not songfacts.com is RS or not is not the issue here, and it wastes all our time for irrelevant issues to be brought here. I am not under a sanction to never make an error in an argument, even if I did that. These AE requests have, however, often been an occasion for editors to scour my contributions looking for anything they disagree with, which they toss in the hopper, making it look like I'm being massively disruptive, challenging the edges, etc. I have extensive experience with blacklisting issues, having brought an RfAr over blacklist abuse by JzG, confirmed as such by ArbComm, but I did far more work with the blacklist than was about JzG, with quite a bit of success, and with successful cooperation with blacklist admins. And now this is being threatened, not because I'm disruptive at the blacklist/whitelist, -- that's preposterous if you look at the pages -- but because a long-term agenda to ban me from the site (I've documented this before, it's been openly expressed) sees opportunities. If this is not noticed and stopped, it will continue until I'm banned again, or spike my password, and when I'm gone, the same editors will continue to do this with others, as they did before I ever became involved, while I was site-banned, and in matters that involve me not at all.

I made an additional comment on the blacklist talk page in response to comment from Beetstra, which could be seen as a closer approach to the ban edge, because Beetstra had referred to the IP editor's behavior, though I was still trying to avoid comment on the dispute (on the IP editor Talk page), as can be seen, so, since nobody has replied to that edit, I have , even though it has not been mentioned here. --] (]) 18:05, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
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*'''@Enric Naval:''' The is very specific as to this '''3.3) Abd is indefinitely prohibited from discussing any dispute in which he is not an originating party. This includes . He may, however, vote or comment at polls.''' I am prohibited from discussing the disputes of others on Misplaced Pages pages. I am not prohibited from non-discussion action, such as editing an article. I may not enter an existing dispute ''discussion.'' While I could start a new section and discuss my own independent issue, I'm not aware of taking advantage of this anywhere that an existing dispute is involved, and usually it is not needed. I may watch and comment in RfCs that appear, though, and I am under no 0RR restriction or the like. Thus the original intention of the ban, probably about "tomes" considered offensive, is not violated by ordinary article space edits, which are not "discussion," unless I made them so, nor by other edits which do not ''discuss'' a standing dispute, and especially if the length is restrained. --] (]) 19:11, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
*'''@SamJohnston''' beats dead horse. Response to charge (3) above discusses that edit and acknowledges ban violation and discusses response. Generally, Misplaced Pages does not punish, but acts to prevent damage. I made an edit, inadvertent or not, and it's up to enforcing administrators as to what is best for the wiki, and I only ask that such be neutral, as policy requires. --] (]) 19:25, 18 March 2010 (UTC) <small>Providing evidence to prove a violation already acknowledged by me, with link, is indeed "beating a dead horse," that's what it means, belaboring the obvious and already accepted. --] (]) 04:23, 19 March 2010 (UTC)</small>
{{collapse top|General comment on enforcement.}} In reviewing this, if block response (and there was one violating edit) is found appropriate, I ask that the block record be considered. Please notice that the two blocks began with one week (excessive for first ban block), were placed by a single admin, already in dispute with me over a serious issue (recusal failure re prior threat to block another, made on my Talk page), and were not based on any of the AE reports or RfAr/Clarifications, with respect to actions that were not covered by the ban as understood at that time. To avoid disruption, I accepted a much tighter definition of the ban, and then, second incident in particular, was blocked for something that I never dreamed would be covered, that already existed during the tightening clarification, and that hadn't been considered to be a violation previously, and without warning, other than uselessly general ones. --] (]) 19:37, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
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*'''@Stifle.''' I agree that there was a technical violation, number 3 in the list above, and I acknowledged that immediately as soon as it was pointed out. If you believe that any other edit violated the sanction, it would be useful to note it, or to note the absence of such, so that this whole thing isn't a waste. Thanks. --] (]) 14:54, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

====Comments by others about the request concerning Abd ====
=====Comment by Verbal=====
Two quick points, having not read all of Abd's wall-o-text. 1, is there/shouldn't there be a limit on the length of Abd's response? Collapsing bits isn't a substitute. 2, Ghost '''is''' in the pseudoscience category, via the paranormal category, so his reasoning on that whole point is faulty (this doesn't preclude other instances of his reasoning being faulty). <span style="font-family:Papyrus">] <small>]</small></span> 18:52, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
: Could we impose a community remedy requiring Abd to communicate normally? Five or six brief sentences should be enough for anybody. Continually injecting these thousand-word essays into discussions on Misplaced Pages is perhaps the most destructive of Abd's activities. --] 19:18, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
::I believe this was a restriction or similar (recommendation?) placed on him at the close of a previous arbcom case. <span style="font-family:Papyrus">] <small>]</small></span> 19:57, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
'''@Abd''' I haven't brought a dispute here, that Ghost is in the PS category (whether that category is on the page or not) is an easily verifiable fact, and a fact that no one has disputed - or can without being shown to be wrong. And yes, there is a harm especially when they contain incorrect statements that at first blush appear true - such as saying Ghost isn't in the PS cat, or that this is disputed. The level of it's inclusion has been a topic of minor dispute, but it's still there (Cat Ghosts -> cat paranormal -> cat pseudoscience). Also, there is a simple way of ending Abd's attachment to AE and ArbCom, which would be a net positive for the project. <span style="font-family:Papyrus">] <small>]</small></span> 19:53, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

'''Hans''' On ghost I feel it is justified, on witches I'm not really interested, and I don't know of any other article where this has been pushed, and it's not relevant either. As for Ghost, I honestly disagree with you there. Please calm down - I'm not part of any gang (not even one of abd's famous cabals). <span style="font-family:Papyrus">] <small>]</small></span> 19:57, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

*Existing dispute: Abd has made it clear that what attracted him to the Ghost dispute was the presence of "cabal" editors, with whom he is already in a dispute with, making this indeed a clear violation of his restriction and a case of hounding - which it was clearly anyway, as are most of his "interventions". <span style="font-family:Papyrus">] <small>]</small></span> 22:19, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comment by Hans Adler=====
Concerning Enric's diffs and :

Abd removed two passages based on crass misrepresentations of an NSF paper. Every editor with a bit of experience with scientific or scholarly work (such as having written and refereed scientific publications) can see immediately that these paragraphs were quote-mined and quoted out of context. #1 was worse than #4 in that it appeared in article space. The passage would have been somewhat defensible (although still problematic) if it had appeared in the body of the article. But putting it in the lead is simply not reasonable and makes it a misquotation. #4 was worse than #1 in that it contained a ''lie''. A lie that was put at the head of the article talk page in order to intimidate other editors and make them believe ] is without any doubt a pseudoscience topic, because: "The ], as expressed by the ], has identified belief in ten subjects to be pseudoscientific beliefs. They are: ]s, ]es, ], ." Yes, that's what it claimed, with reference to a section "Belief in Pseudoscience" of Chapter 7 ("Public Attitudes and Understanding") of the 2006 edition (only) of a biannual NSF publication on "Science and Engineering Indicators".

The front matter of the paper is broken (404 error), so we don't even know who wrote that section. It certainly doesn't speak about "scientific consensus", that's all BullRangifer's original research. It doesn't claim to "identify" any beliefs in any way. It just looks at Americans' belief in pseudoscience by considering a Gallup study that examines belief in paranormal. In this context, the paper is written under the tacit assumption that paranormal implies pseudoscience to the extent necessary for the discussion, but never says so explicitly. What makes this really fishy is that the paragraph that ''suggests'' that belief in ghosts and (via a footnote) witchcraft is (sometimes? usually? always?) belief in pseudoscience is preceded by a paragraph with a correct definition of pseudoscience ("claims presented so that they appear scientific even though "), but nothing is said about the obvious contradiction.

To me, Abd does not seem to be a big problem at the moment. BullRangifer and Verbal are currently creating disruption over more and more articles and policy pages with their attempts to apply the "pseudoscience" label to everything and the kitchen sink, making liberal use of unethical methods in the process. Please take that into account. ] ] 19:32, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

:<small>@Abd: The ameliorating factor is precisely what I am driving at. There is a danger that some people make up their minds too quickly about the ] situation, allow that to influence their opinion about this request, and are reluctant to revise their position when ] comes up later elsewhere, because they have already acted on their original position. ] ] 10:15, 18 March 2010 (UTC)</small>

=====Comment by JzG=====
The edit to Ghost and involvement in the dispute there is an unambiguous violation of the restriction on becoming involved in disputes in which Abd is not an originating party. Claiming that it was not related to pseudoscience because the category was not in the article at the time is both false and blatant Wikilawyering since the entire dispute is about the categorisation of this subject as pseudoscience.

Hans is arguing that the content of the edits was right. This is irrelevant. It was a dispute and Abd piled in to make a controversial edit taking one side of an existing dispute. Sure, Hans likes the result, Hans is one of those on the side of removing all references to the NST's categorisation of belief in ghosts as pseudoscience, but that is not the point at issue, the point at issue is: did Abd violate his ban on becoming involved in pre-existing disputes? It is unarguably true that this is precisely what he did.

The spam blacklist discussions are also violations of the restriction on becoming involved in disputes in which Abd is not an originating party. Asserting that there is no problem because people can ignore him is blatant Wikilawyering against the clear intent of the restriction, the context of which includes Abd's involvement in spam blacklist / whitelist discussions. Songfacts is a dispute involving an IP editor who has been spamming the site, that is not Abd's battle.

The comments by Abd above are unambiguous violations of the requirement not to continually rake over the coals of past disputes - in effect "whatever you say, I was still right".

Enforcement, please. <b>]</b> <small>(])</small> 10:16, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comment by One Night In Hackney=====
Following on from what JzG says, the songfacts intervention is decidedly unhelpful. When he states "It appears that this is not a site with pure user-generated content. Users may submit content but it is reviewed and fact-checked before being published" this has no basis in reality. songfacts.com/legal.php (no direct link to avoid cocking up the blacklisting) says "Songfacts, LLC does not guarantee the accuracy of the information posted, as it may contain technical and factual errors", so there is no reputation for fact checking and accuracy. Abd is simply attempting to crusade against the use of the blacklist in cases he doesn't think it appropriate, regardless of the actual facts of the situation. I would agree wholeheartedly with enforcement, the constant pushing of the limits of his editing restriction need to be dealt with firmly. <font face="Celtic">]<sub>'']''</sub></font> 14:25, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Additional comment by Enric Naval =====
Abd keeps making edits related to the pseudoscience dispute, in which he is not an originating party. He has removed the pseudoscience category from another article he had never edited before. --] (]) 10:41, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Additional comment by SamJohnston =====
As I in the clarification, if you break it down this appears to be fairly straightforward:
* Was there an existing dispute?
* Did Abd discuss the dispute? (unsigned)
* Was Abd an originating party? No.
I don't believe that confining commentary to edit summaries and/or new threads evades the restriction because it ''includes, '''but is not limited to''''' talk pages et al. That said, the editing restriction is intended to avoid inflaming disputes, not prevent Abd from editing altogether (we have blocks for that). With this interpretation Abd would be able to edit provided he avoided hotspots and raised his own new issues as required.

While Abd claims above that this edit was "unsigned and probably inadvertent", it is still a clear violation and should result in a block - even a short one - particularly in light of subsequent editing relating to the same controversial topic. Future violations should be similarly punished, ideally with minimal time-wasting, navel-gazing discussion. If I were Abd I'd be focusing on uncontroversial edits with a view to having my restriction reviewed. -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 15:09, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

: How is pointing out a of your ] ""? While we're at it, how does a 350 word interjection into an existing debate "inadvertently" appear, without a signature no less? Is this too? You broke the restriction so you should be blocked and if you break it again you should be blocked again - sounds fair enough to me. If you don't want to be blocked then don't constantly test the limits. -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 21:18, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

:: It occurs me that Abd's motivation for being an editor could well be sparring with other editors rather than actual, uncontroversial editing. He being more concerned about the "welfare of the project" than "personal editing rights" while saying "bye, folks, if nothing changes" because he's "so restricted that can't edit Misplaced Pages, in substance". How hard is it to follow and "find a quiet area to work in" rather than jumping head first into existing disputes? If this is indeed the case then routine enforcement of the editing restriction should prove an effective remedy. -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 05:34, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

::: @GoRight: Abd '''is''' ] from "posing arguments in content disputes" (as he has done ) because it is '''not''' a poll and he is '''not''' an originating party: "''Abd is indefinitely prohibited from discussing any dispute in which he is not an originating party, article talk pages''". If you still can't ] that then I refer you to ], as upheld by the arbitrators: "''The rule is simple: never comment about any conflict between two or more people who are not you.''" -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 05:58, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

: Again boiling it down to basics, Abd ], contributed to existing content disputes and (so much for a single "inadvertent" violation), removed controversial content actively being discussed from the article and talk page and and the article was for ] the very next day. He then made a similar to the ] article, where the same topic was also an . To Hans Adler: "''He tried to help, but he wasn't helpful''".

: The loopholes used to justify participation in the existing conflicts were a) article edits, b) edit summaries and c) polls. These should be closed by clarification (even if just by requiring Abd to avoid active areas). -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 17:40, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comment by uninvolved Ncmvocalist=====
I'm not convinced that the current sanctions are sufficient to address the core issues, like overwhelming discussion with excessive posting - I've made a ] that I think does a better job of addressing that. ] (]) 05:55, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

===== Comment by GoRight =====
Wow, Enric is not leaving any ] unturned. Simply put, Enric is a long time antagonist of Abd and this request should be viewed as vexatious. Enric should be barred from discussing Abd anywhere on-wiki to put an end to this continuing disruption. Abd is not barred from editing articles, enforcing wikipedia policy, and posing arguments in content disputes. This is all he did despite Enric's framing of the facts to suit his own purposes. --] (]) 03:39, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

: @SJ : ''"Abd is barred from "posing arguments in content disputes" ... "'' - You seem to be confused on a couple of points. First, the sanction that you point to is no longer the controlling language. The language of the sanction was modified by a motion of Arbcom and can now be . Second, you seem to feel that the current language somehow restricts Abd from ''editing articles'' or ''being involved in content disputes'' over those articles. They do not. He is free to edit articles and comment on the content in question which is precisely what he did. Nothing more. Nothing less. His choice of articles, on the other hand, leaves something to be desired but it is not a violation of his restrictions. --] (]) 03:05, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

: General Comment : ''"The rule is simple: '''never comment about''' any conflict between two or more people who are not you."'' - Words have meanings. This statement does not restrict Abd from participating in ''content disputes'' which involve other people or for ''making arguments about that content''. This is evident from any plain reading of that text. If people are confused about what these particular words mean or if they believe that Arbcom actually intended something different than what they said, then the correct course of action is to ask Arbcom for clarification. --] (]) 06:35, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

: '''A request for an uninvolved admin''' : I take note of and and the note at the top of that section which reads ''"This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above."'' and would ask that this editor's comment be moved out of the section reserved for administrators. I would have done so myself but given the current attitude this editor seems to be expressing towards me I felt it would be not well received. Thanks. --] (]) 20:29, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

=====Comment by Ludwigs2=====
Well, just looking at the diffs objectively, I don't really see any problematic behavior. A few short on-point, comments, the removal of specious material that was being edit-warred into the document. I can't judge whether or not Abd's actions violated the ''letter'' of the Arbitration ruling (I leave that up to others), but I'm pretty convinced that his edits did not violate the ''spirit'' of the rulings - nothing in any of these edits speaks to someone intentionally trying to push boundaries or break rules. This whole thing seems a bit... hasty.

What this decision is going to come down to is a cool-head/hot-head disagreement: a cool-headed view on this can only conclude that there's not a whole lot going on here, despite the protestations of the hot-heads. Hopefully the cool-heads will carry the day. --] 05:36, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

===Result concerning Abd===
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''
<!-- Use {{discussion top}} / {{discussion bottom}} to mark this request as closed.-->
<!-- Use {{hat|result is ... }} / {{hab}} to mark this request as closed if collapsing desired.-->
*My first inclination is that there has been a technical violation of the restriction. However, it's stale at this stage and enforcement would be punitive. I am minded therefore to close this report with no further action, but am open to other suggestions. ] (]) 12:54, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
:* A warning to stop testing the limits would be good. <b>]</b> <small>(])</small> 14:52, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
::* Given the direction the is going, I'd tend to agree. It's not my intention to stop Abd from editing, just to stop him from editing ''disruptively''. -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small><sub><font color="maroon">]</font></sub><sup><font color="green">]</font></sup></small></u> 15:06, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

== Tasbian ==

{{hat|1=Blocked 55 hours by {{user|Tim Song}}}}
''Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.''
===Request concerning Tasbian===
; User requesting enforcement : -- ''']''' (]) 01:47, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Tasbian}}

;Sanction or remedy that this user violated : ]

; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
# Unsourced, POV edits, at article, ]
# Removal of word, "controversial", at article, ]
# Again, removal of word, "controversial", at article, ]
# Removal of word, "controversial", at article, ], and replaced it with wholly ''unsourced material''.
# Unsourced, POV changes, at article ]
; Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required):
# = Warning by {{user|UberCryxic}}, regarding ] use of word "controversial" in unrelated articles
# Warning by {{user|Cirt}} = warning regarding ''Scientology'' arbitration case remedies.
;Enforcement action requested (], ] or ]) : ] = requested, topic ban from articles related to topic ''Scientology'', then log at ].

; Additional comments by editor filing complaint : Thank you for your time, -- ''']''' (]) 01:46, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested : -- ''']''' (]) 01:48, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

===Discussion concerning Tasbian===

====Statement by Tasbian====
In every single case the inclusion of the judgement 'controversial' itself is unsourced. Where's the < ref > ? ], and on that basis it will be avoided. And don't suffer the originator to "thank for your time": thank him for wasting your time .. with the reminder to avail article talk pages as he's utterly avoided to approach doing.] (]) 02:23, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

====Comments by others about the request concerning Tasbian ====
As shown by Cirt above, he has been consistently makeing bad faith edits to several articles over a wide range or topics. that I made was to remove a POV pushing and in reality, untrue statement. Regardless of how this is handled, he needs to stop one way or another.--] <sup>]</sup> 02:09, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

===Result concerning Tasbian===
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''
<!-- Use {{discussion top}} / {{discussion bottom}} to mark this request as closed.-->
<!-- Use {{hat|result is ... }} / {{hab}} to mark this request as closed if collapsing desired.-->
Not sure a discretionary topic ban can be applied here, as that remedy requires a detailed warning to the user to be given in advance. Instead, I'm going to block the user for ] given the pattern of behavior noted here. This is pursuant to the administrator's power to prevent disruption, not an AE action. ] (]) 06:33, 24 March 2010 (UTC)
:I also notified the user that further disruption will result in a topic ban. ] (]) 17:22, 24 March 2010 (UTC)
{{hab}}

== ChrisO ==

''Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.''
===Request concerning ChrisO===
; User requesting enforcement : <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>'']''</sup></font></b> 16:01, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|ChrisO}}

;Sanction or remedy that this user violated : ]


; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it : ; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
<!-- Supply diffs as evidence here, and explain why they require arbitration enforcement. Any allegation not supported by a diff is usually disregarded. You may also link to an archived version of long discussions instead of supplying very many diffs. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as ], or groundless or ] complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.-->
# First introduction of: ''"campaign to prove the innocence of ]]]"'' into the article -- ] is the concern here, especially with the phrase about Amir who is serving a lifetime sentence without parole for murdering the Israeli Prime Minister (Rabin) in 1995. This exceptional and libellous claim is not stated on ANY Hebrew sources that I've seen (I've looked hard) and ChrisO is now citing BLP as a reason to include it?
# - reintroduction. # - Made a draft on a European ethnic group, which they are currently barred from doing.
# - again+threat. # - Started a page on a Georgian ethnologist.
# - again.
; Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required):
# - one week ban from main article -- ], in which Nahum Shahaf participated as an investigator.
# - one month ban from main article.
;Enforcement action requested (], ] or ]) : Be issued a final ] warning about the Yigal Amir text and his "]" to reinsert it over and over again. Further sanctions at the discretion of reviewing admin.


; Additional comments by editor filing complaint :
(1) ChrisO/George initially nominated the article for deletion after, for a considerable amount of time, ChrisO hasn't wasted many opportunities to call Shahaf and others who agree with him (e.g. ], ] and many others) conspiracy theorists and, on occasion, "whackjob conspiracy theorists".<br>(2) I'm displeased when ChrisO vitiated the concept of the BLP-vio by applying it (in edit summaries) on non contentious content, such as Shahaf completing his Physics Masters at Bar-Ilan University (cited to Shahaf's CV on his personal website), as a reasoning or justification to reinsert the Yigal Amir/Rabin issue through the backdoor despite being reminded of both BLP and BRD policies. This constitutes, best I can see, a repeated, wilful violation of basic content policies to which the editor in concern is fully aware.


;If ] are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see ]):
'''Comments regarding statement by ChrisO:'''<br>
<!-- The following are examples. Write "Not applicable" or similar if this is not a discretionary sanctions enforcement request. Otherwise, fill out at least one line that applies and delete the rest. If you wish to request discretionary sanctions but none of these situations apply, issue an alert yourself instead of making this request, see the link above. -->
* The CV is only used for adding minor detail to already existing publication. There are documented photocopies to many of the statements linked in this page (Samples:) and this website is run by Nahum Shahaf. Also, notes on the ] include the following comment and Dlabot misdirects the discussion, which is not really developed to begin with:
*Previously blocked as a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction for conduct in the area of conflict, see the block log linked to above.
**If it can be established beyond reasonable doubt it's his CV, then it would be OK to say "according to his CV ...". WP:SPS says self-published articles "may be used as sources of information about themselves, especially in articles about themselves". See some of the provisos about use though --Insider201283 (talk) 13:26, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
; Additional comments by editor filing complaint :
* There exists only one English source and ZERO Hebrew sources that suggest Shahaf participated in a campaign to release Yigal Amir. This claim is libellous and cannot be compared with the adding of a date of birth or the addition that he completed his studies with honours. To bring up BLP while inserting this material is a wilful violation of basic content policies.
I likely filed this improperly, but to sum it up they continue to make pages in a scope they were banned from. ]<sub>]</sub><sup>]</sup> 20:25, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

:On the bullet point, I’ve never filed an AE report before, and I wasn’t sure if “block” meant T-ban, p-block, etc., so I just picked whichever one made the most sense. ]<sub>]</sub><sup>]</sup> 21:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
'''Comments regarding statement by Jehochman:'''
:(Not sure if I’m allowed to reply here) I’ve never filed an AE report before, and I wasn’t sure if “block” meant T-ban, p-block, etc., so I just picked whichever one made the most sense. ]<sub>]</sub><sup>]</sup> 21:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
* There really is no comparison between my attempts to keep the page written like a biography and the libellous content ChrisO repeatedly inserted. One is an RfC type of issue on how the community views self published sources for notes such as that Shahaf did his CT work (already cited to ]) at Elscint or that he graduated with honours and the other is on par with the automatic revert standards expected for poorly sourced (and fallacious) libellous, exceptional and contentious content. For comparison I give the Danish reporter who decided to say the Israeli aid team harvested organs at Haiti -- we'd revert this content even though his paper is considered wiki-reliable. You can't compare this with, for example, a self-published blog article where one of the members of the aid team gives extra input to already published content such as the number of beds they had or the exact time they found someone under the rubble.
:: <small>Response to Bishonen. Moved from results section. ] (]/]) 21:58, 5 January 2025 (UTC)</small>

::(RES to Bishonen) That's fair. When starting the AE, it only gave me nine options, none of which seemed to fit right. The third bullet ("Previously given a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction or warned for conduct in the area of conflict on DIFF by _____") didn't seem to fit, as the sanction wasn't for verbal conduct. ]<sub>]</sub><sup>]</sup> 22:05, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
'''Comments regarding statement by Gatoclass:'''
* I've recently quipped on a number of forums about Gatoclass always popping up whenever one of his coterie of favourable editors (e.g. Nableezy, Tiamut, RonaldR, PalestineRemembered) is in trouble. In short, Gatoclass's commentary and analysis on the Yigal Amir "campaign" text is fallacious. That text is defamatory and ChrisO couldn't even present a second source, let alone a proper list, saying Shahaf "campaigned" to free Yigal Amir. He's been noted to the BLP nature of this dangerous statement but kept re-inserting.

; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested : ''The requesting user is asked to notify the user against whom this request is directed of it, and then to replace this text with a ] of that notification. The request will normally not be processed otherwise.''

===Discussion concerning ChrisO===

====Statement by ChrisO====
*This is a remarkably poor smear attempt by Jaakobou. As George has pointed out above, there's a substantial background to this which Jaakobou has somehow "forgotten" to mention. The issues with this article arise from unsourced and poorly sourced edits from Jaakobou:

:1) Jaakobou is repeatedly reverting to a version of the article that includes a series of claims that are either unsourced or are based on unreliable sources.

::1.1) Much of the background section of the article in Jaakobou's version is sourced to a ''curriculum vitae'' published (in Hebrew; . It's on a user-generated group blog or wiki (see ). A discussion at ] unanimously concluded that this was not a reliable source. As there was a unanimous agreement from all editors other than Jaakobou that this should not be included, I removed it per ].

::1.2) Jaakobou is repeatedly adding a citation which reads in full "Israeli Census - Verified March 23, 2010". This was discussed at ], which unanimously concluded that it was not a proper citation; as one uninvolved editor said, it is "not substantially different from adding a footnote that says "I read it somewhere"." As there was a unanimous agreement from all editors other than Jaakobou that this should not be included, I removed it per ].

:2) Jaakobou is repeatedly, on overt POV grounds, deleting material cited from reliable mainstream sources.

::2.1) A mainstream newspaper report, "", written by Ed O'Loughlin and published by the '']''. Jaakobou rejects this source because he views Ed O'Loughlin as "an anti-Israeli" and "a Hamas supporter" . (These accusations are, needless to say, BLP violations in their own right.) As the reason for removing this was bogus, I restored it.

::2.2) Rejection of quotes from '']'', a major Israeli newspaper. The article's subject sued ''Haaretz'' for defamation two years ago, though it's unclear whether any proceedings are actually ongoing. Jaakobou has repeatedly argued that this makes ''Haaretz'' an unreliable source for any facts concerning Nahum Shahaf. None of the ''Haaretz'' articles cited post-date the defamation suit. The underlying factor appears to be a POV rejection of the newspaper; Jaakobou has denounced ''Haaretz'' (despite it being an Israeli newspaper!) as "an anti-Zionist publication", hence unreliable. As the reason for removing this was bogus, I restored it.

:3) Addition of uncited material. Jaakobou is repeatedly reverting to a version which includes an uncited paragraph (see from "Shahaf's investigation" onwards) as well as other uncited claims, as well as peacock quotes of no obvious relevance to the article's subject. This has been pointed out repeatedly on the talk page to no effect. As this material was unsourced, I removed it per ].

Do I need to point out what ] says right at the top of the policy page? "Contentious material about living persons that is '''unsourced or poorly sourced''' — whether the material is negative, positive, neutral, or just questionable — should be '''removed immediately and without waiting for discussion'''". This is what I have done, explicitly citing WP:BLP as the reason for removing this material. Quoting further from ], "Editors who find themselves in edit wars over potentially defamatory information about living persons should bring the matter to the Biographies of Living Persons noticeboard." That is what I have also done . Everything that I've done in this respect has been by the letter of ]. I see no reason why I should be sanctioned for following the letter of the BLP policy.

By contrast, Jaakobou's removal of content has been for completely improper reasons, as I've set out above. The material I added is sourced to multiple mainstream reliable sources in English (his claim that there are no Hebrew sources is a red herring; just because sources aren't online doesn't mean they don't exist). See ] for a summary of the sources. By contrast, an editor's personal dislike of an individual journalist or an individual publication is not valid grounds for removing content. The material Jaakobou added is either unsourced or poorly sourced. WP:BLP ''requires'' the removal of such material.

I might point out that over on the BLP noticeboard ] recommended referring the matter here if Jaakobou continued inserting unsourced or poorly sourced material. This intervention is a fairly transparent attempt to get a retaliation in first. -- ] (]) 22:26, 25 March 2010 (UTC) <small>(Comment moved to this section from the general discussion section below by <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 22:30, 25 March 2010 (UTC)</small>

====Comments by others about the request concerning ChrisO ====
;Comments by Durova
Just stating in general terms that self-published sources could be used within biography articles to provide positive information about the subject. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 16:27, 25 March 2010 (UTC) <small>(Comment moved to this section from beneath the main header by <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 16:48, 25 March 2010 (UTC))</small>
:Thank you for the move, Sandstein. Apologies for the misplacement. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 17:06, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
:Thank you for the explanation, George. It would be unusual but not unheard-of for open edit sites to get abused to post spoofed information as if it were self-published. Not saying that's happened here, but it did happen in another BLP that related to a different arbitration. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 20:46, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
;Comments by George
*The problem, Durova, is that the curriculum vitae (CV), which is alleged to be self-published, is hosted on a website that says that it's made up of user-generated and uploaded content; from the About page: " editors and bloggers are an elite group of users (mainly voluntarely) that voluntarely post interesting and relevant articles to share with their communities... Editors can even post their own original articles and photos." I ], and it was found to ''not'' be a reliable source by uninvolved editors. Now, Jaakobou has made some interesting arguments for why he thinks it is self-published by Shahaf, and I invited him to bring them up at RSN, but thus far he has chosen not to. Oh, and editors should probably review ]. ←&nbsp;]<sup>&nbsp;]</sup> 20:22, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
*One thing regarding Jaakobou's additional comments: ChrisO did not nominate the article for deletion—I did, on the basis of ]. Oddly, Shahaf's Rabin assassination theories was given as one of the things that made Shahaf notable for more than one event. ←&nbsp;]<sup>&nbsp;]</sup> 20:27, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
*Editors should note in the diffs that ChrisO wasn't ''only'' re-inserting the Rabin assassination theory material, but also reverting pretty extensive insertion of material by Jaakobou, which was itself unsourced or poorly sourced biographical information. ←&nbsp;]<sup>&nbsp;]</sup> 20:34, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
*General comment: Why is this issue being brought up here? Where is the ] concerning this information? Where is the discussion about whether or not the information (regarding Shahaf's Rabin assassination theories) is properly sourced? Where is the discussion about whether it constitutes a violation of BLP? On the one hand, you're claiming that the CV is hosted on Shahaf's personal website, while at the same time objecting to content about Rabin assassination theories when there is a section of that same website named "Rabin assassination". In general, I find the information on Shahaf's theories to be properly cited to reliable sources, but I wouldn't oppose a discussion on the subject via ]. ←&nbsp;]<sup>&nbsp;]</sup> 20:34, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
*Also, for editor's info, this filing comes a day after ] on the BLP noticeboard. Essentially, I think the two editors, each believing they were reverting BLP-violations by the other, got into a minor edit war, as Jehochman described. It wasn't particularly long or heated, so hopefully these issues can be resolved through ]. ←&nbsp;]<sup>&nbsp;]</sup> 21:01, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
;Comments by IronDuke
As someone who has made major contributions to the article, I would say as a general note, there's been a concerted effort to denigrate the subject, both by removing positives and enhancing (at least what are perceived to be) negatives. I also wonder at the insistence on suggesting NS engaged in a "campaign to prove the innocence of Yigal Amir." I see no source which supports that emphasis, and the sources I've seen mention NS's beliefs in this only in passing. I don't think I've even seen a source that suggests what NS thinks the mechanics of the actual assassination actually were unlike, for example, his work on Muhammad al-Dura. Further, in a BLP when good faith questions arise, it is important to gain consensus before reinserting questionable material. <font color="green">]</font> 03:49, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
:I don't think this is a fair description of what has been happening. George and RomaC have been doing good work (without my involvement) on cleaning up the article to take out unsourced or poorly sourced material. George has taken material to the RSN to obtain feedback. Nobody has objected to including "positive" material ''if'' it can be reliably sourced. The main issue of contention here is that one editor - Jaakobou - is repeatedly restoring unsourced or poorly sourced material which all other editors who have reviewed it have ''unanimously'' said should not be included. Don't forget, the onus is on an editor to show why content should be included; Jaakobou is editing against a unanimous consensus. As ] says, "In order to ensure that information about living people is always policy-compliant (written neutrally to a high standard, and based on good quality reliable sources) '''the burden of proof is on those who wish to retain, restore, or undelete the disputed material.''' Editors adding or restoring material must ensure it meets all Misplaced Pages content policies and guidelines, not just verifiability of sources." Jaakobou has not come close to ensuring this; he hasn't even addressed many of the concerns that George has raised, as the lengthy discussions on ] (see e.g. George's comments at ]) demonstrate. -- ] (]) 09:37, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

; Comment by Gatoclass

First of all, I must say I am somewhat suprised by Jehochman's initial response below re ChrisO's insertion of allegedly "controversial" material. It appears that from ], there is plenty of verification for the statements added to the article by ChrisO - although admittedly there is only one source which describes the theories advanced by the BLP in question as "conspiracy" theories.

Secondly, it's clear that Jaakobou has inserted material that is either inadequately sourced or wrongly sourced - confirmed by the two threads at BLPN. According to policy, ChrisO was perfectly within his rights to remove it, so I don't see a problem there. That leaves Jaakobou's reinsertion of substandard sources into a BLP to deal with. In my experience, this is a typical modus operandi for Jaakobou - insertion of badly sourced, or completely unsourced material, while removing well sourced material because of alleged "bias" of the authors. This kind of thing can be deeply frustrating to good faith editors. Given Jaakobou's many appearances at noticeboards like this for similar behaviour, I have to ask myself - how much longer is it going to be tolerated? ] (]) 07:10, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

===Result concerning ChrisO===
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''
<!-- Use {{discussion top}} / {{discussion bottom}} to mark this request as closed.-->
<!-- Use {{hat|result is ... }} / {{hab}} to mark this request as closed if collapsing desired.-->

Awaiting statement by ChrisO. I am perplexed, to say the least, how ChrisO can justify the cited edits as BLP enforcement. He's inserting controversial content at the same time he's removing other controversial content. This looks like edit warring by ChrisO and Jaakobou. ] <sup>]</sup> 20:34, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

: Both ChrisO and Jaakobou have been edit warring. Do you both understand this and agree to stop? ] <sup>]</sup> 11:09, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

== Pieter Kuiper ==

''Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.''
===Request concerning Pieter Kuiper===
; User requesting enforcement : -- ''']''' (]) 16:35, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

; User against whom enforcement is requested : {{userlinks|Pieter Kuiper}}

;Sanction or remedy that this user violated :
*All articles in topic ] are on existing Article probation, from ]
*]
*]

; ] of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation ''how'' these edits violate it :
# Unsourced change to ] article in Scientology topic, article ].
# Removal of sourced information from page ].
# ], following me over to ] submission page in attempt to get nomination derailed. -- ''']''' (]) 16:43, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
# ] violation, claiming personal interpretation somehow trumps ].
# Again, removal of sourced information, from page, ].
; Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required):
# Warning by {{user|Cirt}} -- warning regarding making unsourced changes to ] article, ].
# Warning by {{user|Cirt}} -- 2nd warning regarding making unsourced changes to ] article, in scope of Scientology topic.
# Warning by {{admin|Cirt}} -- 3rd warning regarding making unsourced changes to ] article.
;Enforcement action requested (], ] or ]) : Block, and/or topic ban, per discretion of reviewing administrator. -- ''']''' (]) 16:35, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

; Additional comments by editor filing complaint :
*See also at ].
*On related matter, user {{user|Pieter Kuiper}} appears to be exhibiting form of ], importing a dispute from ], see for example, comment by the user acknowledging this behavior .
Thank you for your time, -- ''']''' (]) 16:35, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
:'''Comment:''' Let's hope that a warning to {{user|Pieter Kuiper}} regarding behavior, subsequently logged at ], should be sufficient to deal with the issue. -- ''']''' (]) 19:02, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
::Sandstein: The source indicated that the subject was 16 years old in 1991, and the source was published in December. Which made it very likely that Saxton was born in 1975. ] But once the source was challenged I realized it was better to withdraw that particular information entirely - as it was possible Saxton might have been born in late 1974. {{user|Pieter Kuiper}} did not actually provide a source for his changes. -- ''']''' (]) 22:33, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested : ; Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested :
*. -- ''']''' (]) 16:38, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
<!--- In the line below, replace USERNAME with the username of the editor against whom you request enforcement. --->

===Discussion concerning Pieter Kuiper===

====Statement by Pieter Kuiper====
What? I have not hounded Cirt in general, I have only tried to counter his pushing of ] as a Scientiology big shot. Which he was not, he was just a kid when he joined, and left the "elite" a few years later at 21. I do not know what I am supposed to write here. Do I need a lawyer?

Cirt is clearly an expert at wikilawyering. He has been throwing the Book of Misplaced Pages Rules at me, and leaving "warning" at my user page from the beginning. In order to prepare this kind of denunciation. Or to try to tick me off and report me for incivility. But as can be seen in the history of ], it was Cirt who invented a year of birth, which was of by a year. Yet he put this year in a fact box, with a reference. Clearly inventing false factoids like this is against BLP policies. It was a serious error, which could have had serious consequences for the subject. So I changed it. But Cirt stubbornly reintroduced his false fact.

So I want to report Cirt for breaking the rules on BLP. I see that he is an admin: he should be desysopped. /] (]) 19:03, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

:Response: This "court" is biased in favor of rule-book waving admins. Why are you warning me for having corrected false factoids in the "doubly sensitive area of BLP and Scientology"? Cirt did not have his facts straight. ] allows calculating age from birth dates, it does not allow guessing a year of birth from vague information in a news report. If all these high-ranking officials say that such a thing is routine on enwp, this place is in real trouble. The warning is grossly unfair, instead I should be thanked for having spotted this. As to collegiality, constructiveness, AGF and friendliness, it is also Cirt who is displaying problematic behaviour: when I had corrected the false birth year, cirt did not ask me to explain why I thought that he was wrong. He just reverted, not only that, but he wrote a , accusing me of defamation, threatening to report me here, and to block me.
:So where does one appeal? /] (]) 07:17, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

====Comments by others about the request concerning Pieter Kuiper ====

=====Comments by Sandstein=====
Initial comment prior to any reply by Pieter Kuiper: Sanctions under ] are not allowed as long as the request does not include a diff of a warning of the sort required by the cited remedy. All that could conceivably result from this request, therefore, is such a warning. (A block for disruption under normal admin authority does not appear to be immediately necessary on the basis of the provided evidence.) <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 16:46, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

I am limiting my review to the five diffs provided by Cirt and the explanations given by Cirt why he considers them problematic. Questions:
* : To both: What text in the supports either 1974 or 1975 as the year of birth?
* , and : To Pieter Kuiper: The reads: "The cited Aaron Saxton, who rose to a senior level in the Sea Org ..." In view of this, why did you undid Cirt's addition twice with the edit summaries "Saxton was not a senior official" and "Saxton being "senior" at 21 would need a much better source"?
*: To Pieter Kuiper: Please explain your reason for this edit.

I would appreciate an answer by both Cirt and Pieter Kuiper, respectively, within two hours of their next edit, or I may choose to operate under the assumption most unfavorable to them should I decide to take any administrative action as a result of this request. Thanks, <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 22:20, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

:1) As you can see for yourself, the does not say exactly what year Saxton was born. It says the Saxton was made a guard when he was 16, which was apparently before he was sent to California in 1991. This could also be consistent with a birth date in 1973 or even earlier. I knew birth year was 1974 from subject's own statement (which Cirt himself had uploaded to Commons), but Cirt an ''"independent reliable secondary"'' source, so I did not replace the newspaper reference.
:2) Your diff refers to what I explained on the talk page: "''Saxton left Sea Org when he was 21. An inflated description of an individual in the media cannot justify including him in this list with a spokesman, with the founder and his wife, and with others that Scientology itself describes as having held high rank in the organization. ... a source that deals with the organization in general.''" Cirt's newspaper source does not support that Saxton was a senior official of the Scientology church, it just says that he attained a senior level in ], which seems a very spartan kind of boot camp. A drill sergeant or something could be described as "senior level".
:3) I looked at what linked to the Aaron Saxton article, I noticed the DYK nomination, which had the most boring hook. So I voted against. Anything wrong with that? /] (]) 23:14, 25 March 2010 (UTC)


=====Comments by Durova===== ===Discussion concerning Lemabeta===
<small>''Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 ] and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.<br />Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.''</small>
Re: Sandstein, this topic is also covered by ] which ] for administrator action. Pieter Kuiper has been wikihounding Cirt recently. The only edit that Pieter Kuiper has ever made at the "Did you know" process was yesterday when Pieter attempted an out of process rejection of Cirt's most recent submission about Scientology although the article clearly qualified for DYK. Pieter has followed Cirt to several Scientology articles where Pieter has been obstructing Cirt's work, mainly by Pieter's introducing ageist original research, and Pieter has removed reliably referenced information while referring to an adult BLP subject as a "kid". Cirt has done nothing to provoke this person. This looks like a reasonable attempt on Cirt's part to clear the air. The subject of Scientology has been through four arbitrations; we don't need someone who pursues vendettas or picks fights. A formal warning may prevent this problem from spreading. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 17:45, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
:It's disappointing to see the aggressive statement from Pieter Kuiper. The "false factoids" incident Pieter refers to is another incident of Pieter Wikihounding Cirt. Per ], Cirt had calculated the birth year of ] based upon a statement of subject's age. Pieter followed Cirt to the article and altered the birth year without providing a new source. Shortly afterward Pieter started a talk page thread to accuse Cirt of policy violation. Ten minutes after the thread started Cirt cooperated, but Pieter refused to provide sources: instead he told Cirt "Google, and thou shalt find." The underlying issue was whether the BLP subject had been born in 1975 or 1974: if Pieter continues to make bones of contention over things that are so minor, that could upend the delicate equilibrium the Scientology topic has maintained for the last ten months. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 19:22, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
::To Pieter: your statement appears to be asserting that Cirt deserves to be desysopped because of a single routine calculation that he withdrew ten minutes after you complained about it. No actual harm was caused by briefly posting a birth year as 1975 instead of 1974; it's the kind of thing that normally clears up in five minutes of editorial discussion. Can you see how your refusal to provide a source could appear to be vandalism at first, and afterward gives the impression of itching for a fight? Scientology is a sensitive subject that reenters arbitration at en:wiki almost on a yearly basis. Cirt has written many good articles and featured articles that have helped to stabilize the area. More good faith would go a long way. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 23:31, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
:::If Cirt and you regard guessing someone's year of birth from rather vague information in a newspaper article as routine, both of you have serious problems with ]. If I had not insisted, the false information would still be there. Cirt was not asking, but demanded "''independent reliable secondary''" sources, which I did not have. He just clung to his own guesses, and he still seems to regard them as justified. It is beyond me how one can think that the date of the news report enters the "routine calculation". /] (]) 23:39, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
:::::Please move the comment to your own section, Pieter. The way this transpired could have been handled a lot better. Cirt agreed with you and withdrew his assertion ten minutes after you explained a problem with it. It is customary to provide sources when one makes a change to a BLP article; do you see how it caused difficulties to withhold that source and accuse the other editor of bad faith when he attempted to engage you in dialog? After you followed him to several other articles that left him with little choice other than AE. Let's work this out with a handshake. <font face="Verdana">]</font><sup>'']''</sup> 00:02, 26 March 2010 (UTC)


=====Comments by Orderinchaos===== ====Statement by Lemabeta====
Yeah, my bad. Didn't realize translation of a page of ethnographic group would count as a violation of my topic ban about "history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed" I recognize my mistake. --] (]) 20:30, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
I became aware of ] through his ]y behaviour at AfD and DYK in my home area of Australian politics. When I looked into it, it seemed to be a more broadly consistent pattern of following ] around on topics in any way connected with or related to Scientology. Many of the other issues re DOB of Aaron Saxton are red herrings; Pieter did not deal with this matter in good faith and seemed more interested in undermining the other user (it could simply have been added with a source to the article, without the need for all the rest). This sort of stuff happens (without the attending drama) all the time in my project due to inconsistent information supplied about elected state politicians by state governments, and nobody's ever terribly worried about being proven wrong by a better source (much less being desysopped!!). Cirt has neither provoked these actions, nor responded in kind. I am in agreement with Durova that a formal warning, with sanctions following if the user continues the conduct, would be a suitable resolution to this matter. ] 01:19, 26 March 2010 (UTC)


:Ethnographic groups and cultural heritage are '''related but distinct concepts'''. An ''ethnographic group'' refers to a '''community of people''' defined by shared ancestry, language, traditions, and cultural identity. In contrast, ''cultural heritage'' refers to the *''practices, artifacts, knowledge, and traditions preserved or inherited from the past''. But cultural heritage is indeed a component of ethnographic groups.
===Result concerning Pieter Kuiper===
:So i don't believe ethnographic group should be considered as either history of the Caucasus or cultural heritage. ] (]) 20:56, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.''
::In my opinion, cultural heritage (both tangible and intangible) '''emerges from''' ethnographic groups but '''does not define the group itself'''. ] (]) 20:57, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
<!-- Use {{discussion top}} / {{discussion bottom}} to mark this request as closed.-->
:::I think ethnographic groups fall under the category of Ethnography, or even socio-cultural antropology but for sure not cultural heritage. ] (]) 21:09, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
<!-- Use {{hat|result is ... }} / {{hab}} to mark this request as closed if collapsing desired.-->
::::I understand, i already apologized on my talk page for this accident. I will not repeat this mistake again. ] (]) 21:13, 5 January 2025 (UTC)


====Statement by (username)====
Thank you for the replies, Cirt and Peter Kuiper. My assessment of the request is broadly similar to that of Durova and Orderinchaos. People may in good faith disagree whether one should qualify this person as a "senior official" in this "SeaOrg", or how (if at all) one should extrapolate his age from the information in the source at issue. But Pieter Kuiper chose to pursue this disagreement in a needlessly aggressive fashion: by reverting Cirt twice, asking on the talk page, following Cirt to DYK to "vote" (meaninglessly, as ] is not a vote) against the article being featured there, calling for Cirt's desysop here (which is entirely ridiculous) and generally giving the impression of having the main aim of entering into conflict with Cirt rather than resolving the content disagreement in a collegial, friendly and ] manner. As we know, this mode of editing is unfortunately not uncommon on Misplaced Pages. That does not make it acceptable, especially in the doubly sensitive fields of BLP and Scientology. For this reason I am '''warning Pieter Kuiper''' to stop editing Scientology subjects in anything but a collegial, friendly and constructive manner (as would be expected, e.g., among real-world co-workers) consistent with ], or he may be made subject to sanctions under ] and/or ]. As to Cirt, I do not see a need for a warning or sanction on the basis of this discussion, as he correctly the calculated date of birth (whose initial inclusion ]) after Pieter Kuiper contested it. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 05:36, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
<!-- Copy and paste this empty section below the most recent statement and replace "(username)" with your username. -->


===Result concerning Lemabeta===
:In reply to Pieter Kuiper, warnings are not sanctions and as such not subject to appeal, but you may appeal any sanction (such as blocks or topic bans) that may be imposed upon you in the future as provided for in the relevant arbitration remedies. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">]</span></small> 08:23, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.''
<!-- When closing this request use {{hat|Result}} / {{hab}}, inform the user on their talk page if they are being sanctioned (eg with {{AE sanction}} or {{uw-aeblock}} and note it in the discretionary sanctions log. -->
*<!--
-->
* I don't see Lemabeta mentioned in the case itself, but they're currently under ] from "the history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed". ] (] • she/her) 20:26, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:To be fair, when you click above to add a new enforcement request, the template states:<br><nowiki>;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]</nowiki><br><nowiki><!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced ---></nowiki> ] (]/]) 20:32, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*{{tq| Didn't realize translation of a page of ethnographic group would count as a violation of my topic ban about "history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed"}} @]: what did you think "the history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage" meant? I think it's pretty obvious that that an article on an ethnic group from the Caucasus and about an ethnologist who writes about that region is covered by your topic ban. ] (]/]) 20:37, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:Note that I've deleted ] as a clear G5 violation. I think ] is a bit more of a questionable G5. ] (]/]) 20:46, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:Your definition of "ethnographic group" includes the phrases "shared ancestry" (i.e., history), and "shared&nbsp;... traditions" and "shared&nbsp;... cultural identity" (i.e., cultural heritage). Your attempt to exclude "ethnographic group" from either of the two categories in your topic ban is entirely unpersuasive, particularly since your topic ban is to be "broadly construed". ] (]/]) 21:13, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:@]: this doesn't seem like a mistake to me, but I'm okay with a logged warning here. ] (]/]) 21:29, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:@]: This is about violating the TBAN. Per my response to leek, I think the issue is with the AE request template, which is a bit unclear. ] (]/]) 22:00, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:@]: I don't think a block is needed here, but the next violation, definitely. ] (]/]) 22:06, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*:@]: They were "reviously given&nbsp;... contentious topic restriction", the topic ban at issue. ] (]/]) 22:09, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
* {{re|Lemabeta}} Not every single thing you could write about an ethnic group would fall under cultural history, but that's not really relevant on the Rachvelians page, where the History section was entirely about their cultural history, even containing the words {{tqq| highlighting their ethnographic and cultural identity}}. There's a reason we use the words "]" on most TBANs, and a reason we encourage people to act like they're TBANned from a broader area than they are. (Consider: Would you feel safe driving under a bridge where clearance is exactly the same height as your vehicle? Or would you need a few inches' gap to feel safe doing it?){{pb}}This does seem like a good-faith misunderstanding, so if you will commit to not making it again in the future, I think this can be closed with a clarification/warning. But that's an important "if". If you want to argue semantics, then the message that sends to admins is that you don't intend to comply with the TBAN, in which case the next step would be a siteblock. <span style="font-family:courier"> -- ]</span><sup class="nowrap">&#91;]]</sup> <small>(])</small> 21:10, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
*{{u|EF5}}, I don't understand your {{tq|"Previously blocked as a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction for conduct in the area of conflict, see the block log linked to above"}} statement, can you please explain what it refers to? ]? Lemabeta's block log is blank.
:That said, I'm unimpressed by Lemabeta's lawyerly distinctions above, and also by ]. I'll AGF that they ''were'' accidental, but OTOH, they surely ''ought'' to have taken enough care to realize they were violations; compare Voorts' examples. I suggest a block, not sure of what length. A couple of weeks? ] &#124; ] 21:36, 5 January 2025 (UTC).
::{{u|EF5}}, OK, I see. Blocks and bans are ], and the block log only logs blocks. ] &#124; ] 22:02, 5 January 2025 (UTC).

Latest revision as of 03:34, 9 January 2025

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    PerspicazHistorian

    PerspicazHistorian is blocked indefinitely from mainspace. Seraphimblade 03:34, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning PerspicazHistorian

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    NXcrypto (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 15:53, 19 December 2024 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    PerspicazHistorian (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log


    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    WP:ARBIPA
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 17:57, 18 December 2024 - removed "discrimination" sidebar from the page of Hindutva (fascist ideology) even though the sidebar was inserted inside a section, not even the lead.
    2. 17:59, 18 December 2024 - tag bombed the highly vetted Hindutva article without any discussion or reason
    3. 10:15, 18 December 2024 - attributing castes to people withhout any sources
    4. 12:11, 18 December 2024 - edit warring to impose the above edits after getting reverted
    5. 17:09, 18 December 2024 - just like above, but this time he also added unreliable sources
    6. 18:29, 18 December 2024 - still edit warring and using edit summaries instead of talk page for conversation
    7. 14:46, 19 December 2024 (UTC) - filed an outrageous report on WP:ANI without notifying any editors. This report was closed by Bbb23 as "This is nothing but a malplaced, frivolous personal attack by the OP."
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    • Already 2 blocks in last 4 months for edit warring.
    If contentious topics restrictions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:CTOP#Awareness of contentious topics)
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    I do not see any positive signs that this editor will ever improve. So far he has only regressed. Nxcrypto Message 15:53, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

    While going through this report, PerspicazHistorian has made another highly problematic edit here by edit warring and misrepresenting the sources to label the organisation as "terrorist". This primary source only provides a list of organisations termed by the Indian government as "terrorist" contrary to MOS:TERRORIST. Nxcrypto Message 03:12, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested


    Discussion concerning PerspicazHistorian

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by PerspicazHistorian

    • By far I am also concerned how my edits were forcefully reverted without a proper reason despite providing enough references. Please check how I am getting attacked by them on Chandraseniya_Kayastha_Prabhu Page.

    I didn't know about the three-revert-rule before User: Ratnahastin told me about this: User_talk:PerspicazHistorian. Please grant me one more chance, I will make sure not to edit war.

    • In the below statement by LukeEmily, As a reply I just want to say that I was just making obvious edit on Chandraseniya_Kayastha_Prabhu by adding a list of notable people with proper references. And according to Edit_warring#What_edit_warring_is it is clearly said: "Edits from a slanted point of view, general insertion or removal of material, or other good-faith changes are not considered vandalism." It was a good faith edit but others reverted it. I accept my mistake of not raising it on talk page as a part of Misplaced Pages:BOLD,_revert,_discuss_cycle.
    • As a clarification to my edit on Students' Islamic Movement of India, it can be clearly seen that I provided enough reference to prove its a terrorist organisation as seen in this edit. I don't know why is there a discussion to this obvious edit? Admins please correct me if I am wrong.
    @Valereee, Yes I read about 1RR and 0RR revert rules in Misplaced Pages:Edit warring#What edit warring is#Other revert rules. I now understand the importance of raising the topic on talk page whenever a consensus is needed. Thank You ! PerspicazHistorian (talk) 07:16, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
    Yes, I will commit to that. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 13:10, 20 December 2024 (UTC) Moved comment to own section. Please comment, including replies, only in this section. Seraphimblade 13:19, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
    At that time I was new to how AFD discussions worked. Later on when Satish R. Devane was marked for deletion, I respected the consensus by not interfering in it. The article was later deleted. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 11:54, 21 December 2024 (UTC)
    • Hi @Doug Weller , I just checked your user page. You have 16 years (I am 19) of experience on wiki, you must be right about me. I agree that my start on Misplaced Pages has been horrible, but I am learning a lot from you all. I promise that I will do better, get more neutral here and contribute to the platform to my best. Please don't block me.
    P.S.- I don't know If I will be blocked or what , according to this enforcement rules, I just want to personally wish good luck to you for your ongoing cancer treatments, You will surely win this battle of Life. Regards. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 12:23, 21 December 2024 (UTC)Moved comment to own section. Please comment, including replies, only in this section.Valereee (talk) 15:30, 24 December 2024 (UTC)
    • 1) I just asked an user @Fylindfotberserk if the page move is possible. What's wrong with it? I still have not considered putting a move request on talk page of article.
    2) Many of other sources are not raj era. Moreover I myself have deleted the content way before you pointing this out. Thank You ! PerspicazHistorian (talk) 06:29, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    even @NXcrypto is seen engaged in edit wars before on contentious Indian topics. see1see2 PerspicazHistorian (talk) 06:37, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    as mentioned by @Valereee before, Please discuss at talk, not here; we don't deal with content here. You can discuss content related topics on talk pages of articles rather than personally targeting a user here in enforcement. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 06:42, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    @Valereee I once filed a complaint to find it @NXcrypto is a sock (out of a misunderstanding, as all were teamed up similarly on various pages). I think he felt it as a personal attack by me and filed this request for enforcement. Please interfere. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 06:47, 29 December 2024 (UTC) moving to correct section Valereee (talk) 13:24, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    1)Yes I usually edit on RSS related topics, but to ensure a democratic view is maintained as many socks try to disrupt such articles. Even on Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh page, I just edited on request of talk page and added a graph. I don't think its a POV push.
    2) My main interest in editing is Hinduism and Indian History topics.
    3)There have been certain cases in past where I was blocked but if studied carefully they were result of me edit warring with socks(although, through guidance of various experienced editors and admins I learnt a SPI should be filed first). I have learnt a lot in my journey and there have been nearly zero case of me of edit warring this month.
    Please do not block me. PerspicazHistorian (talk) 14:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    • @Valereee I beg apologies for the inconvenience caused, thanks for correcting me. I will now reply in my own statement section. @Bishonen I am a quick learner and professionally competent to edit in this encyclopedic space. Please consider reviewing this enforcement if its an counter-attack on me as mentioned in my previous replies. You all are experienced editors and I have good faith in your decision-making capability.PerspicazHistorian (talk) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
    • @Vanamonde93@Bishonen I have edited content marked as "original research" and "mess" by you, I am ready to help removing any content that might be considered "poorly sourced" by the community. Please don't block me.PerspicazHistorian (talk) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
    • @Valereee This enforcement started for edit-warring and now I feel its more concerned to my edited content(which I agree to cooperate and change wherever needed). After learning about edit wars, there has been no instance of me edit-warring, Please consider my request.--PerspicazHistorian (talk) 08:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
      @Valereee I am not a slow learner, I understand the concerns of all admins here. I will try my best to add only reliable sources, and discuss content in all talk pages, as I already mentioned here. PPicazHist (talk) 12:55, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
      @Valereee@UtherSRG I think admins should focus more on encouraging editors when they do good and correct when mistaken. I have made many edits, added many citations and created much articles which use fine citations. The enforcement started out of retaliation by nxcrypto, now moving towards banning me anyways. I started editing out of passion, and doing it here on wiki unlike those who come here just for pov pushes and disrupt article space(talking about socks and vandalizers on contentious Indian topics).
      The article prasada doesn't only has issue on citations, but the whole article is copypasted from the citations I added. I just wanted to point that out. Remaining about Misplaced Pages:CIR, I am currently pursuing Btech in cs from IIT delhi, idt I am a slow learner by any means. Still, happy new year to all ! PPicazHist (talk) 14:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
      @UtherSRG You mean to say, "The prasada is to be consumed by attendees as a holy offering. The offerings may include cooked food, fruits and confectionery sweets. Vegetarian food is usually offered and later distributed to the devotees who are present in the temple. Sometimes this vegetarian offering will exclude prohibited items such as garlic, onion, mushroom, etc. " is not copy pasted by this website? Is this also a wiki mirror website? How would you feel if I doubt your competence now? PPicazHist (talk) 14:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
      @ UtherSRG I just asked others to share their opinion in the enforcement. With all due respect, I don't think its wrong in any sense. PPicazHist (talk) 15:13, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
      To all the admins involved here,
      • I agree to keep learning and apologize if my previous edits/replies have annoyed the admins.
      • I have not edit warred since a month and please see it as my willingness to keep learning and getting better.
      • Please give me a chance, I understand concern of you all and respect your opinion in the matter. But please don't block me from editing from main article space. I promise that I will abide by all the rules and will learn from other editors.
      PPicazHist (talk) 15:22, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by LukeEmily

    PerspicazHistorian also violated WP:BRD by engaging in an edit war with Ratnahastin who reverted his edits and restored an article to a stable version by admin. Also, I want to assume good faith but it is surprising that PerspicazHistorian claims that he did not know the three revert rule given that he has more than 800 edits.LukeEmily (talk)

    Statement by Doug Weller

    I'm involved so just commenting. I don't think this editor is competent. I had to give them a community sanction caste warning as they were making a mess of castes. See this earlier version of their talk page.]https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User_talk:PerspicazHistorian&oldid=1262289249] and User:Deb's comment that "It was very unwise of you to keep moving Draft:Satish R. Devane to article space when it has not passed review. As a direct result of your actions, a deletion discussion is taking place, and when this is complete and the article is deleted, you will be prevented from recreating it. Deb (talk) 14:44, 4 December 2024 (UTC)" There have also been copyright issues. I strongly support a topic ban. Doug Weller talk 11:00, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

    I won't be involved in the decision. No more treatments for me, just coast until... Doug Weller talk 12:50, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

    Statement by Toddy1

    This is another editor who appears to have pro-Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) and pro-Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) views. I dislike those views, but find it rather alarming that Misplaced Pages should seek to censor those views, but not the views of the political opponents. Imagine the outrage if we sought to topic-ban anyone who expressed pro-Republican views, but allowed Democrat-activists to say whatever they liked.

    A lot of pro-RSS/BJP editors turn out to be sock-puppets, so please can we do a checkuser on this account. And to be even-handed, why not checkuser NXcrypto too.

    If we want to talk about WP:CIR when editors make mistakes, look at the diff given by NXcrypto for "Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested" - it is the wrong diff. He/she did notify PerspicazHistorian - but the correct diff is .

    A topic ban from Indian topics would be unhelpful, unless given to both parties. Misplaced Pages is meant to be a mainstream encyclopaedia, and BJP and RSS are mainstream in India. Loading the dice against BJP and RSS editors will turn Misplaced Pages into a fringe encyclopaedia on Indian topics.

    I can see a good case for restricting PerspicazHistorian to draft articles and talk pages for a month, and suggesting that he/she seeks advice from more experienced editors. Another solution would be a one-revert rule to last six months.-- Toddy1 (talk) 13:55, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

    Statement by Capitals00

    I find the comment from Toddy1 to be entirely outrageous. What are you trying to tell by saying "Misplaced Pages is meant to be a mainstream encyclopaedia, and BJP and RSS are mainstream in India"? If you want us to entertain those who are in power, then we could never have an article like False or misleading statements by Donald Trump.

    You cannot ask topic ban for both editors without having any evidence of misconduct. Same way, you cannot ask CU on either user only for your own mental relief. It is a high time that you should strike your comment, since you are falsely accusing others that they "seek to censor" this editor due to his "pro-Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) and pro-Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) views". You should strike your comment. If you cannot do that, then I am sure WP:BOOMERANG is coming for you. Capitals00 (talk) 15:20, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

    Statement by Vanamonde93

    Toddy1: I, too, am baffled by your comment. We don't ban editors based on their POV; but we do ban editors who fail to follow our PAGs, and we certainly don't make excuses for editors who fail to follow our guidelines based on their POV. You seem to be suggesting we cut PH some slack because of their political position, and I find that deeply inappropriate. Among other things, I don't believe they have publicly stated anywhere that they support the BJP or the RSS, and we cannot make assumptions about them.

    That said, the fact that this was still open prompted me to spot-check PH's contributions, and I find a lot to be concerned about. This edit is from 29 December, and appears to be entirely original research; I cannot access all of the sources, but snippet search does not bear out the content added, and the Raj era source for the first sentence certainly does not support the content it was used for. Baji Pasalkar, entirely authored by PH, is full of puffery ("first to sacrifice his life for the cause of Swarajya", and poor sources (like this blog, and this book, whose blurb I leave you to judge), from which most of the article appears to be drawn. Appa (title), also entirely authored by PH, has original research in its very first sentence; the sources that I can access give passing mention to people whose names include the suffix "appa", and thus could perhaps be examples of usage, but the sources most certainly do not bear out the claim.

    I will note in fairness that I cannot access all the sources for the content I checked. But after spotchecking a dozen examples I have yet to find content PH wrote that was borne out by a reliable source, so I believe skepticism is justified. We are in territory where other editors may need to spend days cleaning up some of this writing. Bishonen If we're in CIR territory, just a normal indefinite block seems cleanest, surely? Or were you hoping that PH would help clean up their mess, perhaps by providing quotes from sources? That could be a pathway to contributing productively, but I'm not holding my breath. Vanamonde93 (talk) 18:00, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

    Thanks Bish: I agree, as my exchanges with PH today, in response to my first post here, have not inspired confidence. . Vanamonde93 (talk) 20:22, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

    Statement by UtherSRG

    I've mostly dealt with PH around Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Ankur Warikoo (2nd nomination). They do not seem to have the ability to read and understand our policies and processes. As such, a t-ban is too weak. The minimum I would support is a p-block as suggested below, though a full indef is also acceptable. They could then ask for the standard offer when they can demonstrate they no longer have WP:CIR issues. - UtherSRG (talk) 20:05, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

    Based on these two edits, I'm more strongly leaning towards indef. - UtherSRG (talk) 12:27, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
    They now indicate they believe the article they edited was copied from one of the websites they used as a reference, when in reality the website is a mirror/scrape of the Misplaced Pages article. I believe we are firmly in WP:CIR territory here. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:25, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
    This is a mirror of the Misplaced Pages article. - UtherSRG (talk) 16:29, 31 December 2024 (UTC)

    Result concerning PerspicazHistorian

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

    PerspicazHistorian, can you explain your understanding of WP:edit warring and the WP:3RR rule? I'd like you to read thoroughly enough to also explain wny someone may be edit warring even if they aren't breaking 3RR. Valereee (talk) 21:58, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

    @PerspicazHistorian, that explanation of edit warring is a bit wanting. An edit war is when two or more editors revert content additions/removals repeatedly. Even a second reversion by the same editor can be considered edit warring. Best practice -- and what I highly recommend, especially for any inexperienced editor -- is the first time someone reverts an edit of yours, go to the talk page, open a section, ping the editor who reverted you, and discuss. Do you think you can commit to that?
    Re: your question on why your "obvious edit" was reverted: we don't deal with content issues here, only with behavior issues, but from a very quick look, the source is 50 years old, and using a list headed "TERRORIST ORGANISATIONS LISTED IN THE FIRST SCHEDULE OF THE UNLAWFUL ACTIVITIES (PREVENTION) ACT, 1967" that includes a certain organization as a source that the organization should be described as a terrorist organization is WP:ORIGINAL RESEARCH; in their revert NXcrypto provided an edit summary of "Not a reliable source for such a contentious label. See WP:LABEL." Please discuss at talk, not here; we don't deal with content here. Valereee (talk) 11:28, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
    I'm seeing this as a CIR issue. I'd like input from other admins, if possible. I'm a little concerned that setting a tban from IPA is just setting a trap. Maybe a p-block from article space would be a kinder way to allow them to gain some experience? Valereee (talk) 13:28, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    @PerspicazHistorian, have you seen how many times I or others have had to move your comments to your own section? This is an example of not having enough experience to edit productively. Please do not post in anyone else's section again. Valereee (talk) 16:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
    I do agree we're in CIR territory, and the concerns expressed are completely valid. I don't think this editor is ill-intentioned. They just don't seem very motivated to learn quickly. Well-intentioned-but-a-slow-learner is something that can only be fixed by actually practicing what you're bad at. I'd prefer an indef from article space which gives them one more chance to learn here before we send them off to mr.wiki or Simple English to try to learn. Not a hill I'm going to die on, though. Valereee (talk) 11:36, 30 December 2024 (UTC)
    @PerspicazHistorian, like Uther I have major concerns about the edit you made yesterday, which included replacing a citation needed tag with these sources. The first is a company that markets astrology services. The second is the site for a religious sect. Neither is a reliable source for explaining the concept of prasada in Wikivoice. You made this edit yesterday, after you'd confirmed here and on my talk that you understood sourcing policy.
    The reason for an indef from article space is to allow you to learn this policy: You would go into article talk and suggest sources to fix citation needed tags. Another editor would have to agree with you that the sources are reliable before they'd add them. Valereee (talk) 12:51, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
    • A tban from IPA for PerspicazHistorian would be a relief to many editors trying to keep this difficult area in reasonable shape. However, Valereee makes a good point about 'setting a trap': it's doubtful that PH would be able to keep to a tban even if they tried in good faith. I would therefore support a p-block from article space. Bishonen | tålk 16:48, 29 December 2024 (UTC).
      Vanamonde93, no, I don't really think PH can usefully help clean up their mess; I was following Valereee, who has been going into this in some depth, in attempting to keep some way of editing Misplaced Pages open for PH. It's a bit of a counsel of desperation, though; there is very little daylight between an indef and a p-block from article space. Yes, we are in CIR territory; just look at PH's recent supposed evidence on this page for NXcrypto being "engaged in edit wars before on contentious Indian topics": one diff of an opponent complaining on NXcrypto's page, and one diff of somebody reverting NXcrypto. What do those actually prove? That NXcrypto has opponents (big surprise). So, yes, as you suggest, I'll support an indef as well. Bishonen | tålk 20:09, 29 December 2024 (UTC).
    • Is there a length of time proposed for the p-ban or would it be indefinite? Barkeep49 (talk) 17:06, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
      I would say indefinite; not infinite, but I'd be wary about letting them back into articlespace without some kind of preclearance. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 18:39, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
    • It looks to me like there is a consensus for an indefinite partial block for PerspicazHistorian from article space. Unless any uninvolved admin objects within a day or so, I will close as such. Seraphimblade 06:31, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
      Given PH's recent slew of requests on multiple admin talk pages, yes, please do. - UtherSRG (talk) 12:58, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

    References

    1. "Significance of Different Type of Prasad in Hinduism For God". GaneshaSpeaks. Retrieved 2024-12-30.
    2. "What Is Prashad". Shree Swaminarayan Mandir Bhuj. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

    LaylaCares

    There is consensus to remove LaylaCares's EC flag. Vanamonde93 (talk) 17:55, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning LaylaCares

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Vice regent (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 08:00, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    LaylaCares (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log


    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/ARBPIA
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 13:54, December 17, 2024 EC gaming


    If contentious topics restrictions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:CTOP#Awareness of contentious topics)
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    Pretty obvious case of EC gaming. Account created on Nov 17, 2024, then about 500 mostly minor edits followed by the first substantial edit ever was the creation of this article on Dec 17 (subsequently moved to draftspace).VR (Please ping on reply) 08:00, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested


    Discussion concerning LaylaCares

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by LaylaCares

    Statement by Aquillion

    Question: Assuming it's determined that they gamed the extended-confirmed restriction, would the page they created be WP:G5-able? I've asked the relevant question in more detail on the CSD talk page, since it is likely to come up again as long as we have such a broad restriction on effect, but I figured it was worth mentioning the issue here as well. --Aquillion (talk) 14:16, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by Dan Murphy

    Please look at Draft:Hamas–UNRWA relations, written by the account under discussion. It's a hit job, originally placed in mainspace by this account. Anyone who wrote that shouldn't be allowed with 1 million miles of the topic.Dan Murphy (talk) 23:14, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by starship.paint

    I've edited Draft:Hamas–UNRWA relations, so Dan Murphy's link is inaccurate for the purposes of this discussion. For the version of Draft:Hamas–UNRWA relations with content only written by LaylaCares, click this link. starship.paint (talk / cont) 10:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning LaylaCares

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • I agree that this looks like EC-gaming. Absent evidence that the edits themselves were problematic, I would either TBAN from ARBPIA or pull the EC flag until the user has made 500 edits that aren't rapidfire possibly LLM-assisted gnomish edits. Vanamonde93 (talk) 17:02, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
    • I agree on the gaming piece and would suggest mainspace edits+time for restoration of EC. I will throw out 3 months + 500 (substantive) main space edits. Barkeep49 (talk) 17:16, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
    • I agree with Barkeep but I'd up it to 4 months. I don't believe that a TBAN is necessary at this point. voorts (talk/contributions) 04:45, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
    • @Aquillion: I agree that the draft should be G5'd, but will wait for consensus to develop here. voorts (talk/contributions) 01:00, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      I don't think the wording of WP:ECR allows for deletion of a page that was created by an EC user. (ECR also seems to forget that anything other than articles and talkpages exists, but I think the most reasonable reading of provision A still allows for G5ing drafts at admins' discretion if the criteria are met.) That said, a consensus at AE can delete a page as a "reasonable measure that necessary and proportionate for the smooth running of the project". Deleting under that provision is not something to be done lightly, but I think for a case where a page's existence violates the spirit of an ArbCom restriction but not the letter, it'd be a fair time to do it. And/or this could make for a good ARCA question, probably after PIA5 wraps. -- Tamzin (they|xe|🤷) 03:48, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    • I would just pull EC and require the editor to apply via AE appeal for its restoration. They should be very clearly aware that receiving such restoration will require both substantial time and making real, substantive edits outside the area, as well as an understanding of what is expected of editors working in a CTOP area. Seraphimblade 01:22, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    • I see a clear consensus here to remove the EC flag. For clarity, when I proposed a TBAN above it was because removing this flag is an ARBPIA TBAN as long as the ECR remedy remains in place; it's simply a question of whether the editor get the other privileges of EC or not. I don't see a consensus on what to do with the draft, but given that other editors have now made substantive contributions to it, I don't believe it's a good use of AE time to discuss the hypothetical further. Vanamonde93 (talk) 17:55, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

    AstroGuy0

    AstroGuy0 has been issued a warning for source misrepresentation by Voorts. No other reviewers have expressed any wish for further action. Seraphimblade 06:29, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning AstroGuy0

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Hemiauchenia (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 03:41, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    AstroGuy0 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log


    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Misplaced Pages:Contentious topics/Race and intelligence

    (Even though this isn't the usual R&I fare, I consider the intersection of "Race/ethnicity and sex offending", to come under "the intersection of race/ethnicity and human abilities and behaviour")

    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 03:19, 4 January 2025 Asserts that "A majority of the perpetrators were Pakistani men" despite the cited source (freely accessible at ) does not mention the word "Pakistani" or any variant once.
    2. 01:40, 4 January 2025 Describes the sex offender ring as "Pakistani" in the opening sentence when the cited source in the body says that they were only "mainly Pakistani"
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    If contentious topics restrictions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:CTOP#Awareness of contentious topics)
    Made aware of contentious topics criterion: 01:52, 4 January 2025
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested


    Additional comments by editor filing complaint:

    This new user seems intent on POVPUSHING regarding "Asian/Muslim grooming gangs" and making contentious claims that are not backed up by sources. Hemiauchenia (talk) 03:44, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

    Discussion concerning AstroGuy0

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by AstroGuy0

    Statement by Iskandar323

    This rather dated "Asian/Muslim grooming gangs" malarkey from the UK has recently been pushed on social media by a certain US tech billionaire and is now recirculating in right-wing social media and the blogosphere, partly in connection with UK politics, so this trend could flare before it dims. Iskandar323 (talk) 03:50, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning AstroGuy0

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    The second diff was before AG0 received a CTOP alert. I've alerted AG0 to other CTOPs that they've edited in, and I am going to warn them for their conduct in diff #1 without prejudice to other admins determining that further action is warranted. voorts (talk/contributions) 04:33, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
    I also looked at the source, and it indeed does not in any way support the claim made; it does not mention "Pakistani" even once. This is a fairly new editor, but I think we need to make it very clear to them that misrepresentation of sources is not something we will tolerate. Seraphimblade 04:59, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    Given that AstroGuy0 has already been issued a warning, I don't think anything further is necessary, and will close as such unless any uninvolved admin shortly objects. Seraphimblade 18:23, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

    Lemabeta

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Lemabeta

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    EF5 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 20:18, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Lemabeta (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log


    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Eastern Europe#Final decision
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 5 Jan 2025 - Made a draft on a European ethnic group, which they are currently barred from doing.
    2. 4 Jan 2025 - Started a page on a Georgian ethnologist.


    If contentious topics restrictions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:CTOP#Awareness of contentious topics)
    • Previously blocked as a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction for conduct in the area of conflict, see the block log linked to above.
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    I likely filed this improperly, but to sum it up they continue to make pages in a scope they were banned from. EF 20:25, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

    On the bullet point, I’ve never filed an AE report before, and I wasn’t sure if “block” meant T-ban, p-block, etc., so I just picked whichever one made the most sense. EF 21:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    (Not sure if I’m allowed to reply here) I’ve never filed an AE report before, and I wasn’t sure if “block” meant T-ban, p-block, etc., so I just picked whichever one made the most sense. EF 21:45, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    Response to Bishonen. Moved from results section. voorts (talk/contributions) 21:58, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    (RES to Bishonen) That's fair. When starting the AE, it only gave me nine options, none of which seemed to fit right. The third bullet ("Previously given a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction or warned for conduct in the area of conflict on DIFF by _____") didn't seem to fit, as the sanction wasn't for verbal conduct. EF 22:05, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    Here

    Discussion concerning Lemabeta

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Lemabeta

    Yeah, my bad. Didn't realize translation of a page of ethnographic group would count as a violation of my topic ban about "history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed" I recognize my mistake. --Lemabeta (talk) 20:30, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

    Ethnographic groups and cultural heritage are related but distinct concepts. An ethnographic group refers to a community of people defined by shared ancestry, language, traditions, and cultural identity. In contrast, cultural heritage refers to the *practices, artifacts, knowledge, and traditions preserved or inherited from the past. But cultural heritage is indeed a component of ethnographic groups.
    So i don't believe ethnographic group should be considered as either history of the Caucasus or cultural heritage. Lemabeta (talk) 20:56, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    In my opinion, cultural heritage (both tangible and intangible) emerges from ethnographic groups but does not define the group itself. Lemabeta (talk) 20:57, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    I think ethnographic groups fall under the category of Ethnography, or even socio-cultural antropology but for sure not cultural heritage. Lemabeta (talk) 21:09, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    I understand, i already apologized on my talk page for this accident. I will not repeat this mistake again. Lemabeta (talk) 21:13, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Lemabeta

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • I don't see Lemabeta mentioned in the case itself, but they're currently under a topic ban imposed by a consensus of AE admins from "the history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed". theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 20:26, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      To be fair, when you click above to add a new enforcement request, the template states:
      ;Sanction or remedy to be enforced: ]
      <!--- Link to the sanction or remedy that you ask to be enforced ---> voorts (talk/contributions) 20:32, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    • Didn't realize translation of a page of ethnographic group would count as a violation of my topic ban about "history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage, broadly construed" @Lemabeta: what did you think "the history of the Caucasus and its cultural heritage" meant? I think it's pretty obvious that that an article on an ethnic group from the Caucasus and about an ethnologist who writes about that region is covered by your topic ban. voorts (talk/contributions) 20:37, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      Note that I've deleted Draft:Rachvelians as a clear G5 violation. I think Mate Albutashvili is a bit more of a questionable G5. voorts (talk/contributions) 20:46, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      Your definition of "ethnographic group" includes the phrases "shared ancestry" (i.e., history), and "shared ... traditions" and "shared ... cultural identity" (i.e., cultural heritage). Your attempt to exclude "ethnographic group" from either of the two categories in your topic ban is entirely unpersuasive, particularly since your topic ban is to be "broadly construed". voorts (talk/contributions) 21:13, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      @Tamzin: this doesn't seem like a mistake to me, but I'm okay with a logged warning here. voorts (talk/contributions) 21:29, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      @Bishonen: This is about violating the TBAN. Per my response to leek, I think the issue is with the AE request template, which is a bit unclear. voorts (talk/contributions) 22:00, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      @Bishonen: I don't think a block is needed here, but the next violation, definitely. voorts (talk/contributions) 22:06, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
      @EF5: They were "reviously given ... contentious topic restriction", the topic ban at issue. voorts (talk/contributions) 22:09, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    • @Lemabeta: Not every single thing you could write about an ethnic group would fall under cultural history, but that's not really relevant on the Rachvelians page, where the History section was entirely about their cultural history, even containing the words highlighting their ethnographic and cultural identity. There's a reason we use the words "broadly construed" on most TBANs, and a reason we encourage people to act like they're TBANned from a broader area than they are. (Consider: Would you feel safe driving under a bridge where clearance is exactly the same height as your vehicle? Or would you need a few inches' gap to feel safe doing it?)This does seem like a good-faith misunderstanding, so if you will commit to not making it again in the future, I think this can be closed with a clarification/warning. But that's an important "if". If you want to argue semantics, then the message that sends to admins is that you don't intend to comply with the TBAN, in which case the next step would be a siteblock. -- Tamzin (they|xe|🤷) 21:10, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
    • EF5, I don't understand your "Previously blocked as a discretionary sanction or contentious topic restriction for conduct in the area of conflict, see the block log linked to above" statement, can you please explain what it refers to? This T-ban? Lemabeta's block log is blank.
    That said, I'm unimpressed by Lemabeta's lawyerly distinctions above, and also by their apology for "accidental violations". I'll AGF that they were accidental, but OTOH, they surely ought to have taken enough care to realize they were violations; compare Voorts' examples. I suggest a block, not sure of what length. A couple of weeks? Bishonen | tålk 21:36, 5 January 2025 (UTC).
    EF5, OK, I see. Blocks and bans are very different, and the block log only logs blocks. Bishonen | tålk 22:02, 5 January 2025 (UTC).