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Revision as of 01:17, 4 November 2010 editShuki (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users11,955 edits →Comment on recent Edits by user: Gilabrand: interesting← Previous edit Latest revision as of 13:56, 23 January 2024 edit undoCewbot (talk | contribs)Bots7,676,264 editsm Maintain {{WPBS}} and vital articles: 2 WikiProject templates. Create {{WPBS}}. Keep majority rating "C" in {{WPBS}}. Remove 2 same ratings as {{WPBS}} in {{WikiProject Israel}}, {{WP Palestine}}.Tag: Talk banner shell conversion 
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== Comment on recent Edits by user: Gilabrand == == Comment on recent Edits by user: Gilabrand ==


I am not sure why the article was cut in half but unless further explanation is provided - I will undo these changes. I am not sure why the article was cut in half but please provide further explanation on this.
Thank you and please if you have specific comments post them and I will address them as best as I can. Legitimate criticisms will be taken seriously but entire cuts like those recently made will not be respected. Thank you and please if you have specific comments post them and I will address them as best as I can.

-Ka Yaffa <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 17:10, 1 November 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> -Ka Yaffa <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 17:10, 1 November 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


:You do know that WP is a collaboration of people from around the world who can edit articles. This Misplaced Pages Public Policy Initiative sounds interesting but it does not seem to give you academic freedom to OWN the article. --] (]) 01:17, 4 November 2010 (UTC) :You do know that WP is a collaboration of people from around the world who can edit articles. This Misplaced Pages Public Policy Initiative sounds interesting but it does not seem to give you academic freedom to OWN the article. --] (]) 01:17, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

::Good point. I think I may have been misguided on how to think about this task but I understand and agree with your concern. Thanks, --] (]) 12:56, 17 November 2010

==Cleaning up the POV and misuse of sources==
Hello Ka Yaffa. I suggest you start doing the test edits for your project on a less contentious subject. You filled up the article with extremely non-neutral statements based on sources that do not comply with Misplaced Pages policy, repeated the same information several times and introduced passages that were not written in proper English. The photo layout was unattractive and did not illustrate the subject. The purpose of Misplaced Pages is to write well-sourced, well-written articles in a neutral tone. Your input to date has been non-neutral, sensationalist, politically slanted, repetitive and poorly worded. You have introduced WP:SYNTH (applying some generality to the specific case here, with no reliable source making that connection), and given coverage to certain incidents that is excessive in the context of an article as short as this. Additionally, non-English sources should be replaced with English ones as you can find them, so that readers on English Misplaced Pages can access them. I hope this explains why the article was copyedited and revised, and will help you in further productive editing. Good luck, --] (]) 11:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


:Hi ] thank you for your comments and edits. I do not believe that the article was filled with non-neutral statements and from the looks of your edits it seems that this is not a question of the article's neutrality but rather your own personal disapproval of the sources. I intentionally incorporated local newspaper sources in Arabic because I think that it is important to include a diversity of voices and perspectives in Misplaced Pages, if a statement is not made in English or Hebrew - it should still be considered valid. I also want to note, that in every instance that I used such a source it was to display a certain sentiment felt by residents and I stated it to be as such. If Ajami residents write in local newspapers that they believe that there is a Judaization project taking place parallel to gentrification - then that should not be considered sensationalist but it is rather a perspective that must be incorporated as it is representative of the Palestinian residents of Ajami. Understanding that you are part of the Wiki Israel project and that is your own personal agenda - please respect that diversity in opinion I am trying to bring forth in this article. For this purpose I have incorporated an extensive array of sources ranging from Jpost, Ha'aretz, Academic sources as well as local online newspapers.

:I have also noticed that you have edited my edits with inaccurate information yet kept my citations, as in the case of the MAKAN article. Again, I do appreciate your edits but please be more considerate and edit in a more productive manner rather than just cutting out sections.

:Thank you, --] (]) 12:06, 16 November (UTC)

==Use of Arabic sources==
KaYaffa, this is English Misplaced Pages. If you use Arabic sources, you are required to provide a translation, as per Misplaced Pages policy. See ]. Please refrain from ascribing any personal agenda to me. I am not a member of any project. I am here to improve the encyclopedia content of Misplaced Pages, and that should be your goal, too. Please remember that this article is not a forum for airing the "sentiments" of Ajami residents expressed through letters to a local newspaper. --] (]) 07:06, 18 November 2010 (UTC)


== Recent page makeover== == Recent page makeover==
Line 16: Line 32:


-Ka Yaffa -Ka Yaffa

==Ajami mosque==
Hi, I just finished reading this article, and wanted to say a couple of things. It is a very interesting read, and a good general overview of the topic, so thank you. It has certainly inspired me to do some more research on the topic. I wonder, what has happened to the Ajami mosque after the Israeli authorities 'annulled' its Waqf status? Also, I see there is an external link the Peres Center for Peace, but I wonder what existed before the Center was built? I was also interested to read about the Arab-Jewish Community Center, and it led me to think about the co-existence of Palestinian and Jewish residents in Ajami. Are there efforts to improve the socio-economic situation of the Palestinian residents? One final thing from me, having looked at the other comments and also the history page, it seems that there have been a number of cuts and edits to the article. It is not for me to comment on whether these cuts were fair or not, but bearing in mind this is a difficult topic to tackle, I think Ka Yaffa has done very well in improving the article. I see that this article is part of the WikiProject Israel. What about adding Wikiproject Palestine, just to give this article the objectivity that is advocated by the Misplaced Pages community? ] (]) 22:12, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

:As an editor, your a free to make changes yourself, and many of your concerns are perfectly legitimate. ''It is not for me to comment on whether these cuts were fair or not,'' It certainly is your right to comment here. As for the use of the word 'Palestinian', it is not objective to use this term to describe the Arabs in this neighborhood for a number of reasons, one of which before 1948, Jews were Palestinians too. --] (]) 23:03, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

:: According to this line of thought however, the use of the term Arab is not appropriate (or exact) either since technically a lot of Israeli Jews are Arab or of Arab descent. It is therefore more relevant to use the term Palestinian because very few, if at all, Israeli Jews would currently identify as Palestinian and the term is not used to refer purely to Arab Palestinians of Christian or Muslim descent. --] (]) 17:05 28 November 2010

==Palestinian Wiki Project==
I think this page should be added to the Palestinian Wiki Project, since it addresses an area that was part of historic Palestine until 1948 and a number of Palestinian folks still live there. <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 00:27, 21 November 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:Added. ]<sup>]</sup> 13:27, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

:I agree, I petitioned for it to be added and I think that it is now officially part of the Palestinian Wiki Project. Many residents of the Ajami neighborhood continue to identify as Palestinian and it certainly is a part of historic Palestine. ] (]) 5:02 28 November 2010 <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 22:00, 28 November 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Gentrification projects ==

The Term "Palestinian Arab" should be stricken from the "Gentrification projects" section since these "Arabs" 1. have Israeli Identity Cards and are registered as Israeli citizens 2. an Arab State of Palestine does not currently exist. To label them "Palestinians" just because they identify as such does not make it a reality. At this point in history they are Arab citizens of Israel or "Arab Israelis" weather they like it or not. If nationality was based on with whom one identifies or what one feels fine... but nationality is based on international laws etc... 29 March 2011 (UTC) Abuboo <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) </span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Question basic source ==

which is used as the only source for some key information at the start of the article, does not seem to me to satisfy ]. The sources it names, starting with a tourist guide, don't inspire extra confidence. This needs replacing. Is there any other source for a Maronite beginning? ]<sup><small>]</small></sup> 02:00, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

== External links modified ==

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== Additiional detials needed for the artickle ==

I think a map of Ajami neighborhood would be beneficial for the article. Also some demographic data's about population composition is lacking.] (]) 23:52, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

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Comment on recent Edits by user: Gilabrand

I am not sure why the article was cut in half but please provide further explanation on this. Thank you and please if you have specific comments post them and I will address them as best as I can. -Ka Yaffa —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ka Yaffa (talk • contribs) 17:10, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

You do know that WP is a collaboration of people from around the world who can edit articles. This Misplaced Pages Public Policy Initiative sounds interesting but it does not seem to give you academic freedom to OWN the article. --Shuki (talk) 01:17, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
Good point. I think I may have been misguided on how to think about this task but I understand and agree with your concern. Thanks, --Ka Yaffa (talk) 12:56, 17 November 2010

Cleaning up the POV and misuse of sources

Hello Ka Yaffa. I suggest you start doing the test edits for your project on a less contentious subject. You filled up the article with extremely non-neutral statements based on sources that do not comply with Misplaced Pages policy, repeated the same information several times and introduced passages that were not written in proper English. The photo layout was unattractive and did not illustrate the subject. The purpose of Misplaced Pages is to write well-sourced, well-written articles in a neutral tone. Your input to date has been non-neutral, sensationalist, politically slanted, repetitive and poorly worded. You have introduced WP:SYNTH (applying some generality to the specific case here, with no reliable source making that connection), and given coverage to certain incidents that is excessive in the context of an article as short as this. Additionally, non-English sources should be replaced with English ones as you can find them, so that readers on English Misplaced Pages can access them. I hope this explains why the article was copyedited and revised, and will help you in further productive editing. Good luck, --Nopleazy (talk) 11:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


Hi Gilabrand thank you for your comments and edits. I do not believe that the article was filled with non-neutral statements and from the looks of your edits it seems that this is not a question of the article's neutrality but rather your own personal disapproval of the sources. I intentionally incorporated local newspaper sources in Arabic because I think that it is important to include a diversity of voices and perspectives in Misplaced Pages, if a statement is not made in English or Hebrew - it should still be considered valid. I also want to note, that in every instance that I used such a source it was to display a certain sentiment felt by residents and I stated it to be as such. If Ajami residents write in local newspapers that they believe that there is a Judaization project taking place parallel to gentrification - then that should not be considered sensationalist but it is rather a perspective that must be incorporated as it is representative of the Palestinian residents of Ajami. Understanding that you are part of the Wiki Israel project and that is your own personal agenda - please respect that diversity in opinion I am trying to bring forth in this article. For this purpose I have incorporated an extensive array of sources ranging from Jpost, Ha'aretz, Academic sources as well as local online newspapers.
I have also noticed that you have edited my edits with inaccurate information yet kept my citations, as in the case of the MAKAN article. Again, I do appreciate your edits but please be more considerate and edit in a more productive manner rather than just cutting out sections.
Thank you, --User:Ka Yaffa (talk) 12:06, 16 November (UTC)

Use of Arabic sources

KaYaffa, this is English Misplaced Pages. If you use Arabic sources, you are required to provide a translation, as per Misplaced Pages policy. See WP:NONENG. Please refrain from ascribing any personal agenda to me. I am not a member of any project. I am here to improve the encyclopedia content of Misplaced Pages, and that should be your goal, too. Please remember that this article is not a forum for airing the "sentiments" of Ajami residents expressed through letters to a local newspaper. --Yespleazy (talk) 07:06, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Recent page makeover

Hi Everyone - Just to update anyone that may be interested in this page: I am a Georgetown student working as part of the Misplaced Pages Public Policy Initiative. I just posted a draft of my entry on to the website and welcome any advice, comments or criticism. I would love to keep building on and improving this page so please let me know if you think it needs more work/editing or feel free to do so yourself as well.

-Ka Yaffa

Ajami mosque

Hi, I just finished reading this article, and wanted to say a couple of things. It is a very interesting read, and a good general overview of the topic, so thank you. It has certainly inspired me to do some more research on the topic. I wonder, what has happened to the Ajami mosque after the Israeli authorities 'annulled' its Waqf status? Also, I see there is an external link the Peres Center for Peace, but I wonder what existed before the Center was built? I was also interested to read about the Arab-Jewish Community Center, and it led me to think about the co-existence of Palestinian and Jewish residents in Ajami. Are there efforts to improve the socio-economic situation of the Palestinian residents? One final thing from me, having looked at the other comments and also the history page, it seems that there have been a number of cuts and edits to the article. It is not for me to comment on whether these cuts were fair or not, but bearing in mind this is a difficult topic to tackle, I think Ka Yaffa has done very well in improving the article. I see that this article is part of the WikiProject Israel. What about adding Wikiproject Palestine, just to give this article the objectivity that is advocated by the Misplaced Pages community? Act25 (talk) 22:12, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

As an editor, your a free to make changes yourself, and many of your concerns are perfectly legitimate. It is not for me to comment on whether these cuts were fair or not, It certainly is your right to comment here. As for the use of the word 'Palestinian', it is not objective to use this term to describe the Arabs in this neighborhood for a number of reasons, one of which before 1948, Jews were Palestinians too. --Shuki (talk) 23:03, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
According to this line of thought however, the use of the term Arab is not appropriate (or exact) either since technically a lot of Israeli Jews are Arab or of Arab descent. It is therefore more relevant to use the term Palestinian because very few, if at all, Israeli Jews would currently identify as Palestinian and the term is not used to refer purely to Arab Palestinians of Christian or Muslim descent. --Ka Yaffa (talk) 17:05 28 November 2010

Palestinian Wiki Project

I think this page should be added to the Palestinian Wiki Project, since it addresses an area that was part of historic Palestine until 1948 and a number of Palestinian folks still live there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ismee (talk • contribs) 00:27, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Added. Tiamut 13:27, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
I agree, I petitioned for it to be added and I think that it is now officially part of the Palestinian Wiki Project. Many residents of the Ajami neighborhood continue to identify as Palestinian and it certainly is a part of historic Palestine. Ka Yaffa (talk) 5:02 28 November 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.161.133.154 (talk) 22:00, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Gentrification projects

The Term "Palestinian Arab" should be stricken from the "Gentrification projects" section since these "Arabs" 1. have Israeli Identity Cards and are registered as Israeli citizens 2. an Arab State of Palestine does not currently exist. To label them "Palestinians" just because they identify as such does not make it a reality. At this point in history they are Arab citizens of Israel or "Arab Israelis" weather they like it or not. If nationality was based on with whom one identifies or what one feels fine... but nationality is based on international laws etc... 29 March 2011 (UTC) Abuboo —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.43.142.217 (talk)

Question basic source

This source which is used as the only source for some key information at the start of the article, does not seem to me to satisfy WP:RS. The sources it names, starting with a tourist guide, don't inspire extra confidence. This needs replacing. Is there any other source for a Maronite beginning? Zero 02:00, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

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Additiional detials needed for the artickle

I think a map of Ajami neighborhood would be beneficial for the article. Also some demographic data's about population composition is lacking.Tritomex (talk) 23:52, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

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