| Revision as of 14:41, 9 May 2012 editVanished user lt94ma34le12 (talk | contribs)8,065 edits →Blatant pov pushing child grooming← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 17:45, 31 August 2024 edit undoLowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,299,766 editsm Archiving 1 discussion(s) to Talk:British Pakistanis/Archive 2) (bot |
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== Good article status == |
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This article has recently been granted good article status, though ], it might not meet all the criteria. Thanks to Sansonic for a problematic section. I've also noticed that the article layout doesn't follow the guidelines at ] and will fix that now. I'm not sure whether there are other problems, but the fact that these issues were missed means there might be. ] (]) 14:23, 29 January 2011 (UTC) |
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:The ] of the article seemed to be particularly problematic in terms of grammar and formatting, so I've what seemed to be the most obvious errors. There are a few statements that could do with being referenced. ] (]) 14:46, 29 January 2011 (UTC) |
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This article is full of factual errors, e. Ghulam Noon is not Pakistani but Indian. The majority of 'Indian' restaurants are not owned by Pakistanis but Bangladeshis. Two thirds of Soth Asians in the UK are not Punjabi. Thats just the tip of the inaccuracies. <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 22:36, 22 April 2011 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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:The article only states that Indian restaurants in a particular region of the UK are mostly owned by British Pakistanis and that statement is accompanied with a source from ''The Guardian''. Two thirds of British Asians ''are'' of Punjabi descent, this statement is again accompanied with a source, remember that the term 'British Asian' includes British Indians many of whom are of Punjabi origin. This article has previously been passed as being factually verifiable and there have been no major changes to it since then. If you feel that there are any other issues which need explaining or otherwise then please do discuss here, if not we will assume that all is well. ] (]) 23:42, 10 June 2011 (UTC) |
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Unfortunatley that is correct there are huge errors in this article. The main article is incorrect. The reason is that it seems to suggest that the Kashmiris are living in the North and not the south and in fact stated that the ethnic groups of pakistan that live in london are punjabis, sindhis muhajirs and pushtuns. The reality is that kashmiris in london are larger than anyone single of the above groups. Please actually visit the areas that Pakistanis live in Ilford, walthamstow, leyton, and cricklewood among others. Further please note that the south includes apart from Luton, High Wycombe, Aylesbury, chesham, Watford, Hemel Hempstead, Bedford, Peterborough, oxford, woking, maidenhead, reading and slough. Please check what the single largest ethnic group is in all of these towns and the Kashmiris will be the largest by far. |
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Further please also note that the Kashmiris and Punjabis amount to about 85% of pakistanis in the UK. Nearly all the Pakistanis in England hail from southern Kashmir areas around Mirpur and the punjabis from the northern districts of Jhelum, Rawalpindi, Gujarat, sialkot and Attock. They all therefore more or less come from similar backgrounds. Very few are from urban areas like Lahore or Multan. |
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There is no evidence that the people from southern kashmir are more conservative or less educated than those from other areas. Please note that the southern universities have large amounts of Kashmiris as has already been explained. The reason that the author in the article said that the kashmiris are in northern universities was based on his wrong information about the north and south. This has already been clarified. Further the ward with the highest propertion of pakistanis in the UK is pendle in lancashire ( 77%) and it is about 90% punjabi. The errors continue unabated in this article. There is no reference to valuable statistical evidence but instead anecdotal evidence. <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 14:23, 9 June 2011 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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:Simply visiting an area of London is not enough because we need sources to prove your point. The fact that Punjabis are from Jhelum, Rawalpindi, Gujarat and sialkot is reflected in the article and the fact that many are from irrigated farms is also reflected in the article. Sources from the ''BBC'' and the ''New Statesman'' confirm that the Mirpur area (of Kashmir) is more conservative than some other parts of Pakistan. Your claims of Kashmiri students in universities of a particular area would need sources if it were to be included in the article, the article does not claim that Kashmiris are ''only'' in the north of England. Your claims of Pendle having the highest proportion of Pakistanis is interesting and could be included if you give a link to a source. The article is well sourced with reliable broadsheet newspaper and academic references. If you feel that there are any other issues which need explaining or otherwise then please do discuss here, if not we will assume that all is well. ] (]) 23:42, 10 June 2011 (UTC) |
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== Move discussion in progress == |
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== Mango == |
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There is a move discussion in progress on ] which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. <!-- Talk:British Indians#Requested move 17 March 2023 crosspost --> —] 10:47, 17 March 2023 (UTC) |
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I don't see the relevance of the mango material. That some shops stock mangoes made in Pakistan doesn't seem particularly interesting/relevant. The article is about Pakistanis in the UK, not products made in Pakistan. Selfridges and Harrods aren't British Pakistani organisations. The picture of the mango is also confusing. It's just a picture of a standard mango, not even of one made in Pakistan (would be hard to tell the difference anyway). ] (]) 22:12, 31 July 2011 (UTC) |
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:I think that it is an interesting bit of information. I also think that it is relevent because there it mentions that these mangos were previously only stocked and sold at ] wholesale outlets (to cater exclusivly for a British Asian market). But that now tastes/preferences previously only consumed by British Asians are now consumed by a more holistic British market, fits in with the section with is about Economics/Business. The picture is good representation of a simple mango, though it could very easily be changed to that of a Pakistani mango, if that seems more reasonable.--] (]) 15:35, 1 August 2011 (UTC) |
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::The sources for Harrods and Selfridges don't even mention British Pakistanis, so it may be OR to decide it's relevant here. It's like writing in the ] article that soy sauce imported from Hong Kong is sold in Sainsbury's: it's simply irrelevant to the article. The most we can say really is that British Asian shops stock mangoes sold in Pakistan. ] (]) 16:09, 1 August 2011 (UTC) |
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:::I would like to establish a consensus, comments from other editors would be welcomed.--] (]) 17:44, 1 August 2011 (UTC) |
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== New section seems to be a defamation == |
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== Lords == |
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The complete Pakistani community in Britain is the subject of this article. Since the crimes of one individual cannot be used to denigrate the entire community, start a new section by engaging in discussion on the talk page so that this content can be added with everyone's approval. <span style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;">]</span> 04:07, 3 April 2023 (UTC) |
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"Cameron also appointed Lord Ahmed, a Kashmiri born politician, a life peerage, which made Ahmed the first Pakistani peer in the UK." |
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:It says Home Secretary said that, and it is true that she said that, if defamation is your worry file a case against her. Moreover she doesn't said all british pakistani are involved in grooming gangs. She just said that all those involved in gooming gangs are "almost all british pakistani". ] (]) 08:26, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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Totally false. It was Lord Ahmad of Rotheram appointed by Labour years ago who was first Pakistani peer. Recently (2010) Cameron has appointment Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon who is a different person. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 00:02, 24 September 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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::It's a violation of ] to include Braverman's claims without including sources that have established that she's wrong on the statistics, e.g. . ] (]) 12:55, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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:::] Add her statement as well as information from the sources you mentioned. Add everyone's point of view, we are not sitting here to decide who is correct or who is wrong. ] (]) 15:06, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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::::This is a volunteer project, {{u|AbhishekSaini1910}}; please don't tell me what to do. ] (]) 16:42, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::I wasn't ordering you to do it, i was just giving opinion what should be done. I forgot to write "we should" in starting pf my comment. ] (]) 22:17, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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== Grooming Gangs[ == |
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:Your claims would need a source. ] (]) 19:18, 25 September 2011 (UTC) |
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::The IP appears to be correct. According to , Nazir Ahmad was born in Pakistan and made a peer in 1998. ] (]) 19:36, 25 September 2011 (UTC) |
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Why this page doesn't contain anything regarding Grooming Gangs, while those at the top of british government, themselves saying that grooming gangs are made up of "almost all british Pakistani" |
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== Kashmiris == |
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Home Secretary Suella Braverman said that the perpetrators of such crimes are “groups of men, almost all British Pakistani”. To the BBC she said the gangs were "overwhelmingly" made up of British-Pakistani males. British Prime Minister Rishi Sunak has vowed to do whatever it takes to root out grooming gangs and put more perpetrators behind bars. The UK PM announced a new Grooming Gangs Taskforce to tackle the menace. |
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''"Many Kashmiris have named their businesses after the Pakistani region. One of the largest companies incorporating such a name is Kashmir Crown Bakeries, which is a food making business in Bradford. The company is a major local employer and is the largest Asian food manufacturer in Europe. The owner, Mohammed Saleem, claims that combining traditional Kashmiri baking methods with vocational British training has given his baking business a multi-million pound turnover."'' |
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This paragraph strikes me as being little more than a thinly disguised advertisement for Mr Saleem and his bakery. As such I would suggest it has no place in this article. <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 15:32, 14 October 2011 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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] (]) 08:21, 9 April 2023 (UTC) |
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== Typo in 4.1 Kashmiris == |
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== Genetic defects material == |
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I've reverted to re-add this material, {{u|Colormaxxing}}, after it was previously reverted by another editor. You now need to follow ] and make the case for the addition here on the talk page. I also asked for input at ]. One of the major problems seems to be that you're extrapolating from a small study limited to Southern Derbyshire to the whole British Pakistani population. ] (]) 20:08, 17 May 2023 (UTC) |
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:NB: Colormaxxing has since been blocked as a sockpuppet. ] (]) 07:10, 22 May 2023 (UTC) |
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== British Airways image == |
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Assuming in paragraph two, "was dominated by rigid hierarchies. Economis boom brought dramatic" the word "Economis" should be altered to "Economic". ] (]) 22:54, 16 December 2011 (UTC) |
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:{{Done}}, thank you for pointing this out--] ] 23:17, 16 December 2011 (UTC) |
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I do not think it is neccessary to mention Imran Khan's happiness of British Airways returning. It had nothing to do with the rest of the paragraphs. ] (]) 13:15, 31 August 2024 (UTC) |
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== Blatant pov pushing child grooming == |
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This incident involving a gang of british pakistanis does not deserve mention unless other incidences are mentioned about other communitys this is basically cherry picking of events and an obvious pov push ] (]) 14:15, 9 May 2012 (UTC) |
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:I agree with this. I especially find the long quoting of one POV in the source article without reference to police opinions on the matter baffling. ] (]) 14:32, 9 May 2012 (UTC) |
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::Unfortunately these events did involve a lot of cherry picking.<small style="border: 1px solid;padding:1px 4px 1px 3px;white-space:nowrap">''']'''.''']'''</small> 14:41, 9 May 2012 (UTC) |
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The complete Pakistani community in Britain is the subject of this article. Since the crimes of one individual cannot be used to denigrate the entire community, start a new section by engaging in discussion on the talk page so that this content can be added with everyone's approval. 𝘚𝘢𝘯𝘦𝘮𝘈𝘺𝘩𝘢𝘯07 04:07, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
Home Secretary Suella Braverman said that the perpetrators of such crimes are “groups of men, almost all British Pakistani”. To the BBC she said the gangs were "overwhelmingly" made up of British-Pakistani males. British Prime Minister Rishi Sunak has vowed to do whatever it takes to root out grooming gangs and put more perpetrators behind bars. The UK PM announced a new Grooming Gangs Taskforce to tackle the menace.
