Talk:Abu Yusuf Al-Turki: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 08:28, 14 October 2014 editEsemono (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers11,063 editsNo edit summary← Previous edit		Latest revision as of 13:21, 9 November 2024 edit undoTom.Reding (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Page movers, Template editors3,879,760 editsm blpo=yes + blp=no/null → blp=other; cleanupTag: AWB
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		⚫	{{Old XfD multi\| date = 29 September 2014 \| result = '''Keep''' \| page = Abu Yusuf Al-Turki}}
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	{{WikiProject ~~Biography\|living=no~~\|class=Start\|~~priority~~=~~low~~\|listas=Toprak, ~~Ümit~~ ~~Yaşar~~\|~~importance~~=~~low}}~~		{{WikiProject banner shell\|class=Start\|blp=other\|listas=Toprak, Umit Yasar\|1=
	{{WikiProject ~~Iraq~~\|~~class~~=~~Start~~\|~~importance~~=~~low~~}}		{{WikiProject Biography\|military-work-group=yes\|military-priority=Low\| needs-photo=yes}}
	{{WikiProject ~~Terrorism\|class=Start~~\|importance=~~low~~}}		{{WikiProject Iraq\|importance=Low}}
			{{WikiProject Military history\|class=Start\|Biography=yes\|Middle-Eastern=yes\|US=yes\|Post-Cold-War=yes\|b1=no\|b2=no\|b3=no\|b4=yes\|b5=yes}}
⚫	{{Old ~~AfD~~ multi \| date = 29 September 2014 \| result = '''Keep''' \| page = Abu Yusuf Al-Turki}}
			{{WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography\|importance=Low\|terrorism=yes\|terrorism-imp=Low}}
	\|blp=no
	}}		}}
			{{Merged-from\|Ümit Yaşar Toprak\|20 October 2014}}

			==Article merged==

			Article merged: See old talk-page ] <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 02:31, 21 October 2014 (UTC)</small>
			: Also noted in the above ] banner. - ] (]) 04:08, 16 September 2023 (UTC)

	==Position of Turki==		==Position of Turki==
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	== Merger proposal ==		== Merger proposal ==
			{{Discussion top\|1=The result of this discussion was to merge the content in the ] article into the ] article. ] (]) 02:25, 21 October 2014 (UTC)}}

	I propose that ] be merged into ]. It covers exactly the same topic; this article seems to be more fully developed, at the moment. ] (]) 23:58, 13 October 2014 (UTC)		I propose that ] be merged into ]. It covers exactly the same topic; this article seems to be more fully developed, at the moment. ] (]) 23:58, 13 October 2014 (UTC)
	:Support, the two articles cover the same individual, they could easily be merged with a redirect set up from the former. ] (]) 03:54, 14 October 2014 (UTC)		:Support, the two articles cover the same individual, they could easily be merged with a redirect set up from the former. ] (]) 03:54, 14 October 2014 (UTC)
	:Support. What are the naming conventions for articles like this? Do we use the birth name or ]? -- ] (]) 08:25, 14 October 2014 (UTC)		:Support. What are the naming conventions for articles like this? Do we use the birth name or ]? -- ] (]) 08:25, 14 October 2014 (UTC)
			*Yeah, let's merge but one of the articles only says he's from ], while the other both says he's ] and "of ]". Maybe we should also add that he speaks ]. So no-one will have doubts that this terrorist is a Turk from Turkey and that he is Turkish. --] (]) 18:47, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
			::Yes, merge and a redirect, since we have two articles about the same person. I think this article with this title should be the remaining article - his ''nom de guerre'' is more notable than his birth name. Turkish ethnicity is important enough to mention (if it is proven via sources) because otherwise there is the implication his ancestry is from recent arrivals from places notable for having Islamist militants, say, Chechnia, or Bosnia, etc. ] (]) 16:12, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
			*'''Strong Support Merge''' - We should only have one primary article about a specific person. Any issues/discrepancies in the article after merging can/will be sorted out eventually. It's too troublesome having to jump from one article to another in order to access all of the information provided for a given individual; it's better if we have it all in one place. ] (]) 02:39, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
			{{Discussion bottom}}

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The contents of the Ümit Yaşar Toprak page were merged into Abu Yusuf Al-Turki on 20 October 2014. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page.

Article merged

Article merged: See old talk-page here — Preceding unsigned comment added by David O. Johnson (talk • contribs) 02:31, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Also noted in the above Merged from banner. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 04:08, 16 September 2023 (UTC)

Position of Turki

Al-Turki was just a sniper according to the Guardian . It doesn't seem that clear right now. Another source indicates that he was the leader of the group. That would leave it unclear what has happened to Abu Mohammed al Jolani, who has been the known leader of the Al Nusra Front. David O. Johnson (talk) 03:21, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

How important this person is? I don't think he should have an article... many snipers die, many group leaders died. It doesn't mean anything. He could lead a group of three men for what we know. --Anulmanul (talk) 13:19, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

I agree; the reason the article was created was it was initially reported that he was the overall leader of the Al-Nusra Front. Now that that does not seem to be case, I'm going to nominate the page for deletion.David O. Johnson (talk) 21:19, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

You do very well. I have seen sources like this one which speak of him as a 'commander'. As we know a commander may command an army or a platoon. In the first case the commander sure would be notable, whereby probably not in the latter one. Do you agree? --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 21:26, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Abu Mohamed Al Jolani is still the overall leader of the Al Nusra Front . It seems as though Al-Turki was a local commander, and therefore not worthy of his own article.David O. Johnson (talk) 21:54, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Just because someone is a local commander doesn't mean he shouldn't have his own article. His name appears is 10s of thousands of newsources in almost every language including the top news agencies. That in itself merits notability. Étienne Dolet (talk) 22:15, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

I agree with Anulmanul and David O. Johnson. A sniper or a commander, not a leader. As such does not deserve an article. --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 18:50, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Of Turkish descent?

Étienne Dolet, where did you see that this person was 'of Turkish descent'? The word Turkish in the news item is used for any citizen/national of Turkey and the news does not speak of his ethnicity. So this edit of yours has no basis at all. As you know very well and use occasionally here in Misplaced Pages, Turkish citizens or nationals may well be of Armenian, Greek, Kurdish, Circassian, Hemshin or whatever other ethnicity. You will know better than anyone else why you needed to specify this 'of Turkish descent' without any justification but it cannot stay there. If you have any arguments to the contrary beware that the discussion may go to other places before you present them. Please kindly remove that wrong edit. --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 21:04, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

You added another source now that does not speak of 'of Turkish descent', right? Do you have a special reason to find an ethnicity to this Turkish citizen? --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 21:31, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

"Türk asıllı" means "of Turkish origin" which, by default, means he's of Turkish descent. Étienne Dolet (talk) 21:40, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Not really, but if you so much wish it to be so, find a reliable source for that claim, not that ridiculous page. --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 21:45, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Look up any Turkish dictionary if you're not familiar with the language. Asıllı means kökenli (). Kök means roots. Hence the reason why asıllı means, by default, descent. And the source is reliable since the information can be easily verifiable through other 3rd party news articles. Étienne Dolet (talk) 21:55, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

I see no source that says he was a Syrian citizen. The sources, esp the Hurriyet one, say he was Turkish. Altering infobox on that basis. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 02:13, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Merger proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was to merge the content in the Ümit Yaşar Toprak article into the Abu Yusuf Al-Turki article. David O. Johnson (talk) 02:25, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

I propose that Ümit Yaşar Toprak be merged into Abu Yusuf Al-Turki. It covers exactly the same topic; this article seems to be more fully developed, at the moment. David O. Johnson (talk) 23:58, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Support, the two articles cover the same individual, they could easily be merged with a redirect set up from the former. Gazkthul (talk) 03:54, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Support. What are the naming conventions for articles like this? Do we use the birth name or Noms_de_guerre? -- Esemono (talk) 08:25, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, let's merge but one of the articles only says he's from Turkey, while the other both says he's Turkish and "of Turkish ethnicity". Maybe we should also add that he speaks Turkish. So no-one will have doubts that this terrorist is a Turk from Turkey and that he is Turkish. --Why should I have a User Name? (talk) 18:47, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, merge and a redirect, since we have two articles about the same person. I think this article with this title should be the remaining article - his nom de guerre is more notable than his birth name. Turkish ethnicity is important enough to mention (if it is proven via sources) because otherwise there is the implication his ancestry is from recent arrivals from places notable for having Islamist militants, say, Chechnia, or Bosnia, etc. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 16:12, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

Strong Support Merge - We should only have one primary article about a specific person. Any issues/discrepancies in the article after merging can/will be sorted out eventually. It's too troublesome having to jump from one article to another in order to access all of the information provided for a given individual; it's better if we have it all in one place. LightandDark2000 (talk) 02:39, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. Categories: