| Revision as of 15:17, 6 October 2016 view sourceJehochman (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Page movers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers46,283 editsm Reverted edits by 188.162.80.155 (talk) to last version by Zzuuzz← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 22:31, 14 January 2025 view source Masem (talk | contribs)Administrators187,582 edits →Usability and discoverability: ReplyTag: Reply | ||
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| ==Usability and discoverability== | |||
| == On this day... == | |||
| I would expect the main page of the encyclopedia to prominently feature both a table of contents and a search feature. This page has a lot of trivia, which is a nice secondary function, but no longer seems to serve its primary functions very well. It does have a search feature, but it's a small icon up at the top in a bar of icons, rather than being front and center and already open with a box to type in words (in the style of a search engine, like ). | |||
| Today is the first day of the Jewish year. Worth mentioning, isn't it? ] (]) | |||
| :It was mentioned, on ]. The confusion is due to differences in calendars and timekeeping. Under the ] days begin at sunset. Under the ], which evolved from ], days begin at ]. To deal with the difference, Misplaced Pages is simply following the common practice of listing events on the Hebrew calendar on the date the begin under the Gregorian calendar. --'']'' <sup>]</sup> 10:41, 3 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| ::But today will still be the first day of the Jewish year until sunset (although I'm not sure which sunset would apply for front page purposes - only where UTC is used?) I realise there may have to be an easy compromise to avoid having to set up special timers for such events. I'm guessing that "common practice" probably represents just such a compromise. ] (]) 11:15, 3 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :: Understandable, although there is a point to the comment above. Thanks. ] (]) | |||
| :::We used to list it on two dates: the Gregorian day that includes the beginning of the Jewish day, then the actual day itself, but it didn't seem particularly fair that Jewish holidays got to be listed twice due to a quirk in the calendar, whereas secular holidays and those of other religions only got to be shown once. I suppose I can take it up with the folks at ] to see which day they would prefer Jewish holidays to be shown on. <span style="font-family:Verdana; ">—''']''' <small>{]}</small></span> 16:01, 3 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| == List of articles? == | |||
| Can we make a list of articles in reverse chronological order, so that way we can see which ones are newer. It would be pretty helpful when looking for pages that need more info. If something like this already exists, can you let me know? | |||
| ] (]) 15:01, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :Is ] what you're looking for? ] ] 15:12, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| ::Yea, this is exactly what i meant. Thank you! ] (]) 17:29, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| == Question == | |||
| First of all: ''Welcome! This page is for discussing the organization and layout of the main page. It isn't for general questions or for encyclopedic content.'' Yes, I know that, but nobody tells me WHERE to find the place for questions of encyclopedic content. I know as well, that I can ask on the debate page of the specific article (in this case ], but nobody's looking there because that's not exactly a very much-frequented article. It would be nice if you could add something like ''If you have a general question or a question of encyclopedic content please go ].'' | |||
| So, I was wondering if anyone is an expert in Greek football. There are a lot of football clubs that are actually departments of big sports clubs (and the football department having a different name than the original club), and it is always hard to impossible to find information on the history of the names of those departments. Now I stumbled over the football club PAE Aris (]), which is part of the sports club ]. So far, so good. Now my question: Since I'm working on a football archive I'd like to know since when the football department of AS Aris is called "PAE Aris". The club itself was founded in 1914 as "PS Aris" as a pure football team, with the "P" standing for "football". The next years, many other sports departments (e. g. basketball) evolved, so in 1926 PS Aris renamed to "AS Aris" with the "A" standing for "athletic" to reflect that there are many sports played in that club. Today, the football department is called "PAE Aris" while the sports club itself is still officially named AS Aris. I don't find any information about since when "PAE Aris" is used. I doubt that the club's football team is called that way since 1926. | |||
| It's a bit weird we visibly link to ], but the only link to ] (which is important enough it's linked to from every page on the site) is hidden behind the pancake menu icon in the upper left. We do have templates like ] that could be used directly on this page as a better gateway to actual articles, for those that are curious but don't have any particular query in mind or are looking for inspiration. ] (]) 20:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
| So my question is: When did the name of the football department of AS Aris change to "PAE Aris"? It would be nice if someone could help me out!--] (]) 22:14, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :We do have something like what you suggest at the top of this page, underneath the text that you copied to here.("For questions about using and contributing to Misplaced Pages") In your case I would suggest the Help Desk. ] (]) 22:16, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :For specific questions like this head along to ]. ]] 22:19, 4 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :Agree about the trivia, but remember opinions here come from the trivia writers. Last time I looked at portal usage statistics, it looks like a few people click to see what they are, and most of them don't click anything further. ] (]) 03:55, 14 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
| ::And also see the ] too. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 08:56, 5 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| :This appears to be an objection to the ], not the contents of ] itself. The default skins on desktop and mobile both have a large search box or icon right at the top of every page. The desktop skin also has a link to ] in the menu shown on every single page. If you don't like the way that requires opening the menu before that link is visible, I suggest you bring it up on an appropriate talk page for the skin (perhaps ]) or at the ]. ] ] 14:09, 14 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
| :For help in general to find where might be best to ask questions, first check the talk page of the article on the subject you're asking about; it might be well-trafficked and therefore a good forum. If not, there should be one or more banners for WikiProjects, which are larger projects grouping articles in a certain field; these will have general talk pages for the project as a whole (so, if I'm looking at a film but the film's article is quiet and little-read, I can ask about it at the talk page of ]). Failing that, if you have a quiet project too, you can try directly asking people who have edited the article or similar articles on their talk pages—maybe I can't find information about Manchester City WFC, but I see that someone has edited a lot of articles on the men's club, so I can ask them if they know what I need to know. ] ] 09:37, 5 October 2016 (UTC) | |||
| ::Yes, I'm objecting to the fact that the primary functions of the main page are hidden in a menu and in an icon rather than being directly on - if not the most prominent things on - the page. | |||
| ::Wouldn't changing the skin change ''all'' pages? That seems like the wrong answer, since it wouldn't make sense to put the Contents listing on every page, nor would it make sense to have an open search bar on every page. Unlike the main page, I would expect the primary means of navigation to be clicking on links to related articles, as opposed to browsing through topics. (Search is sort of intermediate on those pages, so an icon seems like a good compromise.) -- ] (]) 21:52, 14 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
| ::I see no reason why we can't have in the top box "Welcome to Misplaced Pages" a visually predominant search bar. Doesn't touch the skin. ] (]) 22:31, 14 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
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General discussion
ShortcutsUsability and discoverability
I would expect the main page of the encyclopedia to prominently feature both a table of contents and a search feature. This page has a lot of trivia, which is a nice secondary function, but no longer seems to serve its primary functions very well. It does have a search feature, but it's a small icon up at the top in a bar of icons, rather than being front and center and already open with a box to type in words (in the style of a search engine, like ).
It's a bit weird we visibly link to Misplaced Pages:Contents/Portals, but the only link to Misplaced Pages:Contents (which is important enough it's linked to from every page on the site) is hidden behind the pancake menu icon in the upper left. We do have templates like Misplaced Pages:Contents/TOC navbar that could be used directly on this page as a better gateway to actual articles, for those that are curious but don't have any particular query in mind or are looking for inspiration. Beland (talk) 20:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
- Agree about the trivia, but remember opinions here come from the trivia writers. Last time I looked at portal usage statistics, it looks like a few people click to see what they are, and most of them don't click anything further. Art LaPella (talk) 03:55, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
- This appears to be an objection to the WP:SKIN, not the contents of Main Page itself. The default skins on desktop and mobile both have a large search box or icon right at the top of every page. The desktop skin also has a link to Misplaced Pages:Contents in the menu shown on every single page. If you don't like the way that requires opening the menu before that link is visible, I suggest you bring it up on an appropriate talk page for the skin (perhaps Misplaced Pages talk:Vector 2022) or at the village pump. Modest Genius 14:09, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
- Yes, I'm objecting to the fact that the primary functions of the main page are hidden in a menu and in an icon rather than being directly on - if not the most prominent things on - the page.
- Wouldn't changing the skin change all pages? That seems like the wrong answer, since it wouldn't make sense to put the Contents listing on every page, nor would it make sense to have an open search bar on every page. Unlike the main page, I would expect the primary means of navigation to be clicking on links to related articles, as opposed to browsing through topics. (Search is sort of intermediate on those pages, so an icon seems like a good compromise.) -- Beland (talk) 21:52, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
- I see no reason why we can't have in the top box "Welcome to Misplaced Pages" a visually predominant search bar. Doesn't touch the skin. Masem (t) 22:31, 14 January 2025 (UTC)