Misplaced Pages

User talk:Keesiewonder: Difference between revisions

Article snapshot taken from Wikipedia with creative commons attribution-sharealike license. Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat. We can research this topic together.
Browse history interactively← Previous editContent deleted Content addedVisualWikitext
Revision as of 12:14, 11 January 2007 editJustas Jonas (talk | contribs)203 edits Stop your patronizing remarks.← Previous edit Latest revision as of 05:10, 23 September 2021 edit undoMalnadachBot (talk | contribs)11,637,095 editsm Fixed Lint errors in signatures. (Task 2)Tag: AWB 
(426 intermediate revisions by 86 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
{{Signpost-subscription|right}}
==] to the ]==
Welcome, {{PAGENAME}}!


==Archives==
Here are some useful tips to ease you into the Misplaced Pages experience:
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>


* First, take a look at the ], and perhaps dabble a bit in the ].
* When you have some free time, take a look at the ] and ]. They can come in very handy!
* Learn about some of the Misplaced Pages landmarks by trying our ]!
* If you need any ], feel free to post a question at the ]
* Misplaced Pages has a vibrant community of editors. The ] is a great place to see the goings on.
* Remember to use a ]!
* Explore, ], and, most importantly, have fun!
Also, here are some odds and ends that I find useful from time to time:


==Lost week==
*]
Tail end of some issues, never got back about the murder things. Check out ] I think you might like it ]] 02:53, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
*]
*]
*]


== ASIN to OCLC ==
Feel free to ask me anything the links and talk pages don't answer. You can most easily reach me by posting on ].


I noticed on my watchlist. Thank you very much for your work, in almost all cases we probably never should have used an ASIN so I'm glad that someone is switching these out. --] 22:08, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
You can sign your name on any page by typing 4 tildes, likes this: &#x7e;&#x7e;&#x7e;&#x7e;.


:You are most welcome! Some editors will probably also be annoyed. I'm finding that I do need to leave ASINs for AV material, such as . ] <sup>]</sup> 22:16, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
Best of luck, and have fun! &ndash; ]] 22:50, 11 November 2006 (UTC)


== Re: Thank you! == ==Fact template==
Hi, {{tl|Fact}} needs a date= parameter. Was that what you meant? ''] ]'', 23:04 ] ] (GMT).
:Sorted (for that article). Special behaviour of infobox. ''] ]'', 10:57 ] ] (GMT).


==]==
I'm glad you love the course! It's a favorite subject of mine, too. ;) If you're interested in helping out in molecular biology topics, you might want to consider joining the ]. Cheers! &ndash; ]] 16:00, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
*Oh, I see you've already joined! In that case, welcome!


I've edited the entry but wanted you to have a look over it before I remove the various tags. (] 20:42, 31 March 2007 (UTC))
== Molecular Biology ==


:OK cool. Tags have been removed. (] 00:10, 2 April 2007 (UTC))
Hey Kessiewonder,


== Science Collaboration of the Month ==
I too am studying courses which include those in molecular biology. I'd be interested in collaborating on an article with you some time. I've been working on ] lately (let me know what you think.) If you find an article on an interesting subject that is severely laking, ] and I'll help you edit it. &ndash; {{User:je_at_uwo/sig}} 17:22, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
:''Regarding the message you posted on my talk page:''
:: Hey, that sounds good. I doubt I'm more advanced in science (just a lowly undergrad :) but I know my way around PubMed. So, ya that sounds good. I'm not well versed in GI but I'll do some research on the submucosa. I'll check some other stuff too tomorrow. Maybe we can get a couple articles going and a couple other people in on this. I'm at UWO in London, ON. {{User:je_at_uwo/sig}} 23:34, 12 November 2006 (UTC)


{| class="current" style="background: #E6E6FA; border: 1px solid #000000; padding: .5em; margin-bottom: 3px; font-size: 95%; width: auto;"
== Vandalism ==
| style="padding-right: 4px; padding-left: 4px;" | ]
| '''You voted for ] and this article is now the current ]!'''<br /><small>Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ] Misplaced Pages ] article.</small>
|}
] <sub> ]</sub> 19:45, 1 April 2007 (UTC)


== Open solicitation for input/advice ==
Hi, Keesiewonder! Everything that you've ever wanted to know about vandalism can be found at ]. It says it all there with far more detail and clarity than I'm capable at 7am, having woken up with only 4 hours of sleep. ;) &ndash; ]] 12:13, 13 November 2006 (UTC)


Hello! There's been some recent activity getting the ball rolling at ], and if you'd like to join us, I'm sure your input would be valued. In particular, ] has proposed a ], and although I've responded with comments of my own, WW rightly suggested that it should be more than just a two-way conversation. I've noticed some of your own edits on related matters and thought you might be interested. Any suggestions would certainly be appreciated. Otherwise, if this is not of interest to you, or if you've already got a plateful of editing, feel free to ignore this message! -] <sup>]</sup> 01:55, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
==Re: SIS==
Hey Keesiewonder. I wrote a somewhat lengthy reply on ] to your message, so rather than reiterate everything I said there, you can read it there. I'm still not sure what is the proper convention regarding replying to people. Best Regards, {{user:je_at_uwo/sig}} 19:07, 13 November 2006 (UTC)


== I appologise. ==
== Regarding ] ==


I didn't notice. Thank you for showing me. ] 22:32, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
By all means add your name to the project page. We would be more than happy to have you join the project. The more, the merrier! ] 01:40, 15 November 2006 (UTC)


== Re: Stents == == RE:Right behind you... ==


Thanks, seeing on my talk page probably gave me a jump start on you though. ] 23:34, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
I just happened to read yesterday in the NEJM that the FDA is taking some heat over off-label use of stents by surgeons. Apparently the FDA only approves the use of stents for vessels up to a particular diameter, after which the likelyhood of inflammation and thrombosis increases drastically. It will be interesting to see if SIS has any applications in this area. BTW, I like your new userpage. Keep it up! PS J'ai vu que tu peux parler francais avec un niveau elementaire. Moi, j'habitais a France pour 4 mois, alors si tu auras besoin d'aide, je pouvais t'aider! --{{User:je_at_uwo/sig}} 16:21, 15 November 2006 (UTC)


== The ], on the 'pedia == == ]: COI issue ==


Hi Keesie. Do you have an idea of what to do with this article? Postings on the COI board sometimes linger because no-one can figure out what to do with them. I see that you tried to improve the sources of this article. The editor is misbehaving, but not outrageously. There may be a couple of options:
Hey there, Keesiewonder. I just happened to end up at your user page, and noticed some of your userboxes. We share several common beliefs, and that's why I wanted to inform you of another userbox/category that you may find interest in. ''']''' is an organized category of progressive Christian Wikipedians - those who hold progressive, left-wing, liberal or Democratic ideals as well as a strong faith-ethic. I started the category in response to a lack of unification of people of our beliefs, as opposed to our counterpart, the "religious right" or "conservative right". If you'd like to learn more, drop by the link I left you at the headline of this comment, which gives a decent description as to what a "religious lefty" is about. If you find yourself as intrigued as I anticipate, join up! '''{{]}}''' is our userbox, or you can just add '''<nowiki>]</nowiki>''' to your userpage(s). Anyhow, if you've got any questions, comments or just thoughts you'd like to share, drop by my talk page. I'm Editor19841, by the way, from Denver. Thanks for your consideration! ] (]) 23:46, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
:(a) Push back against the weak sourcing of the article. *Literal* application of WP:EL and other standards might cause the sources to be decimated, which would lead to removal of some of the content which could no longer be referenced. (Note that The Dartmouth's web site isn't working at the moment, and the newsgroup links don't open for me). I accept the verdict of the AfD that he is notable enough for Misplaced Pages. Trawling through Google might bring up some better material (but I imagine you've tried that already). Usenet postings not by AP himself probably can't be used as a factual reference about him.
:(b) Ask for a user conduct RFC on AP himself.
:(c) Any other ideas?
We could try to negotiate with AP to get him to abstain from editing the article, but the sourcing is so flimsy right now it's hard to argue that it's a good article. (Plus, except for you and one or two others, it doesn't seem that much energy is being put into improving it). If there's no simple remedy, the COI noticeboard may decide to close the issue and ask people to try ]. ] 04:09, 13 April 2007 (UTC)


== Lutheranism ==
== Dogs Portal Did You Know's ==


The WikiProject Lutheranism ] is under way. Please help improve this month's article, or make a suggestion for next month's article. To add the collaboration banner to your userpage or talk page, use {{tl|Lutheran COTM}}. -- ] 19:29, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
I looked and didn't see any specific criteria on the portal's DYK page. Generally, the DYK's are short sentences containing some of the more interesting items in articles related to the subject. What the specific criteria for inclusion in this portal aren't specified anywhere I can see. ] is the editor who maintains the portal, and you might want to contact him to find out what he wants the selection criteria to be. I have no doubt he will welcome any help. ] 16:45, 18 November 2006 (UTC)


== New article: Reindeer hunting in Greenland ==
== Tamaskan dialogue ==
'''To Tubezone:'''


I have finally gone public with my new article:
Hi! You know, I hate to mention it, but I wonder if the article on ] is as un-noteworthy as the one on Tamaskan Dog. You're much more experienced in all things Wiki than me; what do you think? Happy Thanksgiving!!! ] 15:28, 23 November 2006 (UTC)


* ]
'''From Tubezone:'''
:It's ''obscure'' (700 ghits minus Wiki mirrors), but I don't see it as unnoteworthy as Tamaskan dog. I do find it curious that the photo of a Eurohound was lifted . I would say ''barely'' noteworthy, notable mainly because they are used in notable sled racing events.


-- <i>]</i>/] 07:50, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
:Let's do a little comparison here:
:Eurohound
:Has multiple breeders. The breed is a cross of two specific pure breeds, so what it is can be defined. Names of users are public knowledge and are independent of the originators of the breed (and some apparently fairly well known as sled racers), so there's no COI problem. The ghits are spread among a number of unrelated sources. IOW, we can turn up independent sources for information, so it's possible to ] that the breed exists and that it's accepted as a separate breed. There are no breeder links or self-promotion in the Eurohound article, so it's not spam.
:Tamaskan
:Has one breeder who advertises under multiple names. The true sources of the bloodline of the dog are fuzzy at best, some folks say it's just another ] and even the originator is not real specific about sources. Tamaskan owners all seem to be related in one fashion or another to the same guy who owns the registry and the only kennel that breeds the dog (that's a COI, I think), seems like everything that's known about Tamaskans (including the WP article) comes from the primary source. Most of the Google hits for Tamaskan seem to eminate from two sources: WP and spam by the author of the Tamaskan article. (In some cases the spam is stealthy, like innocent looking blog and BBS questions, eg: one I saw from Wales looking for a "Tamaskan rescue"). The dog breeding community acceptance of this dog as a separate breed is what I would describe as skeptical at best to at worst. So the Tamaskan article has problems with ], ], ], ] and ].
:It seems to me that it usually takes a decade or more to establish a new breed (not just a cross) to the point where even the developer(s) consider it notable enough to start announcing it to the breeding community, but this breed seems to have just popped up out of thin air. I find that implausible and it seems like folks who know more about dogs than I do agree.
:So that's what I think, hope it helps. ] 16:49, 23 November 2006 (UTC)


==WikiProject Iceland Newsletter==
'''To Tubezone:'''
{{Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Iceland/WP Iceland Newsletter}}
:* Excellent! Thank you for your thorough reply, and it does help me understand. I'll follow your lead on this. Regards, ] 16:58, 23 November 2006 (UTC)


== Science Collaboration of the month ==
'''From Blufawn:'''
I would just like to stick up for the Tamaskan people here and say how very wrong you are and you should really check the facts before you write such damaging and libel things.
Firstly this breed is not another Utonagan and anyone who knows dogs can see that by looking at the photographs of the two seperate breeds. I don't believe for one second that all Tamaskan owners are related thats a very ignorant thing to write. The Tamaskan Register is run by a committee not 'some guy' and there are breeders in Finland, USA and UK so they can't all be the same guy can they??
Of course all the information comes from only a few sources, its a rare breed thats not recognised how many websites do you expect.
I wish for you to remove these idiotic comments from this page. ]


{| class="current" style="background: #E6E6FA; border: 1px solid #000000; padding: .5em; margin-bottom: 3px; font-size: 95%; width: auto;"
:'''To Blufawn from Tubezone:''' I know I should reply on Ms. Blufawn on her talk page, but as the whole conversation is here:
| style="padding-right: 4px; padding-left: 4px;" | ]
:I think my analysis was by and large correct. A long period of time went by where this article was up, then an AfD was posted, and none of the issues raised were adequately addressed, and still haven't, your ''contentions'' aren't convincing ''to me'' at least. Also, a long thread on this subject at dogsey.com was deleted, (which, IMA, was started by a very innocuous looking posting) that might have turned up other objections. From what I can tell, there just weren't any mentions of this breed prior to this year at all, no one has brought any up, either.
| '''You voted for ] and this article is now the current ]!'''<br /><small>Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ] Misplaced Pages ] article.</small>
:There are lots of odd breeds out there, while there's plenty of debate on dog breeds, (see: ] for an example) few seem to have generated the general hostility this one has. Also, especially on odd and rare breeds of dogs, the visual characteristics often don't seem to be standardized to the point where one can say "This and this dog are different because they look different", which may be why people would ask for 5 generation verified pedigrees on purebred dogs... There may be people out there who have such a thing for "Tamaskans", but I have not seen anyone claim or advertise that. ] 06:24, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
|}
] <sub> ]</sub> 21:07, 2 May 2007 (UTC)


== Barnstars ==
::'''From Keesiewonder to Tubezone:''' I see your note to Blufawn on my talk page. I haven't decided whether I'll paste it for her to see. The reason the entire discussion is there is because, surprise ... she deletes dialogue on her talk page after she is finished with it. I decided to keep a copy of it around since you never know when it may come in handy. Saturday, after she resurrected this mess on my talk page, she blanked the AfD, which was quickly returned by someone else (maybe the nominator of the AfD). About 12 hours later, an administrator deleted the AfD discussion, probably at her request. I managed to get him to restore it provided I'd agree to clean it up. So, I'm waiting for instruction from him on the mechanics of doing that w/o making more enemies. i.e. the Afd clearly states do not edit the AfD, and I've been asked to do so by an administrator, so ... Anyway, I, obviously, do not support this idea of having heated discussions and then having them deleted by appealing to the authorities so when you run Google on your topic, the heated discussions do not show. Interestingly, in the private copy I have of the AfD, where I've drafted deletions to make it "cleaner," it appears that most of what needs to be taken out was written by Blufawn. Ugh! Thanks for listening. ] 12:26, 18 December 2006 (UTC)


Please offer your opinion on the two ] for WikiProject Lutheranism. '''] <sup>]''' </sup><small><sub>]</sub></small> 18:19, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
'''To Blufawn:'''


==Icelandic language==
Regarding the following, which you placed on my talk page ...
Please show your support for ] by voting for the ] article for the Article Creation and Improvement Drive! '''To place your vote, please !''' <br>] 09:52, 6 May 2007 (UTC)


==Any chance of your help?==
''I would just like to stick up for the Tamaskan people here and say how very wrong you are and you should really check the facts before you write such damaging and libel things. ... I wish for you to remove these idiotic comments from this page. ]


It looks like you're not very active any more :(. I hope you're well, that's the main thing. If you ever do look in again, I wonder if you could help with what seems like a very difficult ISBN search. User:Awadewit, who I think will shortly bring this article to ], has asked for help in finding this one at ]. The only person I know with the investigating skills for this is yourself. I'd appreciate your help; but don't worry if you don't feel like it. Cheers. ] 23:16, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
... '''Please be sure you know who is writing what, and respond to the proper author.'''


:Oh, Ed Johnston has had a look at it and it seems a dead end for ISBNs. You sound slightly down :( is it colleagues or the work? I do remember it's not so long since you moved before. I hope it sorts itself out. (If you need to talk, just e-mail; I'm a good listener.) At least you haven't been on the Martin Luther page recently, which would have taken a few years off your life, believe me. (I've retired from that graveyard of hopes permanently, for my own sanity, what I have left of it.) Thanks for responding! ] 01:27, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
So, two people were having a conversation on their individual talk pages. If you don't like what one of them wrote, I think the one you're struggling with is Tubezone, not me. And, that aside, asking a user to remove idiotic comments from their talk page seems, well, to use your words, a bit idiotic. Why were you visiting my talk page? Also, remember we're not talking about an article on the Tamaskan dog or rare breeds or anything as well visited and read as you seem to be assuming. We're talking about talk pages. I am more than entitled to think about the topic without ill placed "feedback" from you, don't you think? Please consider an apology, and contacting Tubezone yourself if you don't like our dialogue. If you read carefully, you will see that I had very little to do with the content. Regards, ] 17:15, 16 December 2006 (UTC)


== ] Newsletter ==
'''From Blufawn:'''


{{Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Iceland/Outreach/Newsletter May 2007}} // ''']''' <sup>(])</sup> on behalf of ] 21:01, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
I apologise Keesiewonder I didn't notice it was Tubezone until I re-read the comments, I am very sorry. I typed Tamaskan into google and this page was in my search so it is very noticeable even if it is on a talk page. Would you mind removing perhaps the more libel things from Tubezones comments? Thank You ] (equivalent to 80.223.126.199)


== ] Newsletter ==
'''To Blufawn:'''
Thank you for the apology. I feel the conversation can stay where it is. Before you asked, I too thought to remove any wiki-links to Tamaskan that I could find that I had placed. If you search again on Tamaskan, I believe you'll see that you now find fewer references. ] 18:05, 16 December 2006 (UTC)


{{Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Iceland/Outreach/Newsletter June 2007}} <small>Delivered by ''']''' <sup>(])</sup></small> 06:19, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
== Charles Darwin Good articles box ==


== Science Collaboration of the Month ==
I don't know if it would be possible to change that box directly. I think the people at ] created the template, which gets transcluded into the various talk pages. The only way to change the Darwin template would be to change the base template getting transcluded, and someone would probably revert such a change pretty fast. The best thing I can think of to do would be to contact the project above and ask them to create a more specific biologist template, based on the ever increasing number of good articles. But I think they created the existing template because they didn't want to get what they saw as overspecific. If you can convince them that there is cause to get more specific, that would probably be the easiest way to get the change you suggested. Sorry I couldn't be of more help. ] 17:35, 25 November 2006 (UTC)


{| class="current" style="background: #E6E6FA; border: 1px solid #000000; padding: .5em; margin-bottom: 3px; font-size: 95%; width: auto;"
== Re: Church Street, Burlington (VT) ==
| style="padding-right: 4px; padding-left: 4px;" | ]
| '''You voted for ] and this article is now the current ]!'''<br /><small>Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ] Misplaced Pages ] article.</small>
|}
] <sub> ]</sub> 19:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


== Majic photo ==
Hi, Keesiewonder. You have to be an admin to see deleted articles, but that article really was a candidate for speedy deletion. Its text read as follows: ''Church street has a homeless guy that walks around dropping the f-bomb and tells people to suck . Church Street has the famous resturaunt of Rusty Scuffers. Mike Lonergan, the head coach of the mens basketball team goes there with his family that includes Luke Higgins.'' Not much good stuff there. :) &ndash; ]] 05:06, 29 November 2006 (UTC)


Hello Keesiewonder,
== 85.92.183.119 spam reply ==
I certainly wasn`t expecting any photo from my flickr site to be used on wikipedia,so when Majic`s photo turned up,I was rather taken aback.Please could you credit the photographer with his name under the photo?It is the owner,D.Lindsay.I don`t want him to think I am taking any credit for his work!!!!!I have removed the photo from my site until I have put his name on it.
I have one of his puppies,she is also on my Flickr site.I have had kees for over 20 years now,and it`s good to see a rather special girl on such a well known site as wikipedia.


Hoping you can help me,keeskerfuffel
As it turns out, that vandal was temporarily blocked earlier today (yay). I don't normally deal with spam vandals, but I'm pretty sure the reason that it took so long was simply because not enough people bothered to put the warning templates on that page, and because it may have taken some time to get the attention of an administrator (they're the only one that can block users). Hope this answers your question, feel free to ask me if you have any more questions! --] ] 12:37, 30 November 2006 (UTC)


:FYI, I've passed this on to the user who I believe posted the photo. to the note I left. ] <sup>]</sup> 21:04, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
*Oh, I nearly forgot. If you'd like more info on IP blocking, check out ]. --] ] 12:38, 30 November 2006 (UTC)


==Philately WikiProject==
The policy of letting anons edit wiki is very well established, it's been there since the very beginning of wiki, and it's very probably never going to change. Therefore, it's tricky to get information on the possible debates about it. Try looking at ], ] number eleven on the list. Hope this helps. --13:29, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
You are listed as a participant in the ]. Today I have created an inactive list consisting of those participants who have not made any ] edits for more than six months. I was going to use a 3 month cut off point but felt generous. You may be one of those editors, so if I have moved you and you want to remain an active participant, please forgive me, and move your name back from the inactive list to the active list. If you are still active on Misplaced Pages but are inactive in philately I hope there is no harm done in listing you as inactive. We really need more active participants for all philatelic articles. The ] has been running for some time and I am doing occasional updates, ] is a candidate for ] (that would be the first philatelic article), and several of the redlinks have been filled but we need more activity so if you are around please participate. Otherwise thanks for the work you have done in the past. Cheers ] 00:28, 25 June 2007 (UTC)


== ] Newsletter ==
== AfD ==
{{Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Iceland/Outreach/Newsletter July 2007}} → To unsubscribe from this newsletter, please remove your name from the ] · Delivered by ''']''' · 04:14, 1 July 2007 (UTC)


== note to self ==
Thanks for letting me know about that AfD. If you want to vote keep and don't know what to say, you can always write "keep per above". HTH, ]&nbsp;(]&nbsp;<small>•</small>&nbsp;]) 01:26, 2 December 2006 (UTC)


I have a strong theory about connections.
== This month's winner is ]! ==
==] ]==
Hi. I'm sorry to bother you, but as a LoCE member, I just wondered if you would be willing to have a look through the ] article. It is currently a Featured Article Candidate and needs a copy-edit for grammar by someone who hasn't yet seen it. Any other ways to improve the article would also be welcome. Thank you very much, if you can. ] 17:48, 8 July 2007 (UTC)


==] status==
{{MCB AID|current=RNA interference|last=proteasome}} &ndash; ]] 14:35, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
The ] project is under consideration to be moved to {{t1|inactive}} and/or {{t1|historical}} status. Another proposal is to ] or redirect the project. You have been identified as a project ] and your input as to this matter would be welcomed at ] and at the ]. Thank you! <small>Delivered on behalf of ] 16:03, 10 August 2007 (UTC)</small>


==ISSN== == Old message ==
Hi, Ive published my ] script for ISSNs at ]. ''] ]'', 22:23 ] ] (GMT).


Hi I noticed a in my archives that I had not replied to about . (Kingboyk had said it was probably a bug.) The answer is that the template was transitioning from default parameter to a named parameter, all the dated clean up tags now use "date=". Rgds, ''] ]'', 09:16 ] ] (GMT).
==Folding@home==
Just a note of thanks for your patient, calm tone and your supporting research on wikipedia contributions from voters in the F@H SCOTM nomination, during the recent vexatious discussion. Best wishes, ] 04:16, 4 December 2006 (UTC)


== Academic Journals project ==
==AfD again==
very useful suggestion you made, and will be a good precedent for the future. ] 05:44, 4 December 2006 (UTC)


Hi, a journals project has been launched at ]; please drop in and share your thoughts on how Misplaced Pages can improve in this area. ] 15:54, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
== Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot ==


==Clinical trial==
] predicts that you will enjoy editing some of these articles. Have fun!
Hi. I've been working a lot on the ] page. In the Talk you mentioned that medical devices must be tested in several phases before approval. As this is outside the scope of my knowledge, can you check out the page and make any additions you feel are necessary? Thanks] 14:35, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
----
;STUBS:<!--''']:'''-->
'''Dogs'''
:] (nice Moroccan herding dog)
:] (Turkish guard dog)
:]
:]
:] (ancester to Schnauzers???)
:] (nice Balkan dog)
:] (would be fun since its in the Spitz family!)
'''Dog things'''
:] (says almost nothing)
:] (might be interesting; does Bridget have this?)


== WikiProject Dartmouth College ==
'''Molecular Biology'''
:] (monoclonal antibody with catalytic activity)
:]
:]
:] (British scientist; therapeutic monoclonal antibodies)


{| class="messagebox standard-talk" cellpadding=2
'''Ireland'''
|-
:] & ]
| ]
----
|
'''Cleanup''' ] (would be good experience!)
As a current or past contributor to a ] article -- or an alumnus/na of the College -- I thought I'd let you know about ''']''', a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of the ]. If you would like to participate, you can visit ], where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks and related articles. Thanks! ] 19:38, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
----
|}
;Add Sources
:]
:]
:]
----
;Wikify
:]
:]
:]
----
;Expand
:]
:]
:]


== T-DNA ==
SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. Your contributions make Misplaced Pages better -- thanks for helping.


I saw you had voted for ] as MCB collaboration of the month back in 2006. I started an article in place of the redirect, so just wanted to let you know in case you want to get involved. Thanks! - ] (]) 18:48, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
If you have '''feedback''' on how to make SuggestBot better, please tell me on ]. Thanks from ], SuggestBot's caretaker.


==] roll call==
P.S. You received these suggestions because your name was listed on ]. If this was in error, sorry about the confusion. -- ] 22:40, 5 December 2006 (UTC)


{| style="background:#cedff2"
==all caps==
|-
Thanks for pointing that out with the all caps comment. It really looked like that guy was signing that comment. I need be more vigilant at looking at actually history of comments. Thanks again. ] 03:12, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
|]
==Brookfield==
|Greetings from the ''']'''. Your name is listed on our ], but we are unsure how many of the people listed there are still active contributors to the League's activities. If you are still interested in participating in the work of the League, please follow the instructions at the ''']''' to add your name to the active members list. Once you have done that, you might want to familiarise yourself with the ], which has replaced the old ] subpage. As the old system is now deprecated, the main efforts of the League should be to clear the substantial ] which still exists there. <br>The League's services are in as high demand as ever, as evinced by the increasing backlog on our requests pages, both ] and ]. While ] and ] reviewers regularly praise the League's contributions to reviewed articles, we remain perennially understaffed. Fulfilling requests to polish the prose of Misplaced Pages's highest-profile articles is a way that editors can make a very noticeable difference to the appearance of the encyclopedia. On behalf of the League, if you do consider yourself to have left, I hope you will consider rejoining; if you consider yourself inactive, I hope you will consider returning to respond to just one request per week, or as many as you can manage. Merry Christmas and happy editing, '']''.
I have done what librarians like me usually do: I emailed him from my university account. ] 02:54, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
|}
:I received today,
<blockquote>
Dear David,
Thank you for your message. I was born in 1955.
Best wishes,
John Brookfield
</blockquote>
I already put it into the article. I hope we don't get flack that it was just email.] 01:26, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
:I always keep email, forever. Essentially, all my work is done there (open access advocacy). I think not yet on the page.] 17:19, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


==Merge Proposal==
== work on the Dogs project ==
There is a ] going on about whether or not to merge ] and ] together. Your input would be greatly appreciated. ] (]) 18:23, 3 February 2008 (UTC)


== Martin Bucer up for Featured Article Review ==
{{The Fauna Barnstar|You've done admirable work with ] since it's inception, and it wouldn't be anywhere near what it is without your invaluable work. Thanks for all you have done, and all I hope that you plan to do in the future. ] 17:33, 16 December 2006 (UTC)}}
I just wanted to let you know that you can cast your vote of "support" or "oppose" to the ] article as a potential featured article at ]. Thanks! --]--] (]) 21:42, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


== AfD page == == translation dispute ==


There is a discussion going on whether the name of that German church body can be translated or not (it appears like this on the english pages of this church's homepage). One user changed the name of this Church (actually a federation of several Lutheran, United and Reformed churches) and it's regional member churches to the German form because he says their names can't get translated. so the article on the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Bavaria now appears under its German name because he says the "concept" can't be translated into English. Please go to the discusson page of the Evangelical Church in Germany and have your say --] (]) 02:05, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I can restore the page, but would you be then so kind as to clean it up afterwards? There's some nasty language there. ] 14:41, 17 December 2006 (UTC)


== ] == ==Survey==


Hi Keesie!
I just left the newbie a message on his talk page; with any luck, he won't try this sort of thing again. Regarding the move, go ahead. I'll check to see if you did anything wrong, but I think you've got the procedure down. I'll check to see if you make any mistakes, but I doubt you will. :) ] 20:42, 17 December 2006 (UTC)


I have put together a survey for female editors of Misplaced Pages (and related projects) in order to explore, in greater detail, women's experiences and roles within the Wikimedia movement. It'd be wonderful if you could participate!
== Tamaskan Dog ==


It's an independent survey, done by me, as a fellow volunteer Wikimedian. It is not being done on behalf of the Wikimedia Foundation. I hope you'll participate!
I am regrettably as in the dark about this particular process as you are, having never been involved in anything like this before. I ''think'' that what he's asking for is just eliminating or improving some of the more objectionable language from the various parties, but I've never dealt with anything specifically like ex post facto adjustment of official wikipedia records, so I don't want to stick my neck out too far here. My best guess is to just ask the admin in question if he can either clarify what s/he means or point toward an example of the kind of cleanup being requested. Sorry I couldn't be of more help here, but I am '''way''' out of my depth on this one. ] 19:24, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
:Wonderful work on finding out about it. I guess that such a thing has come up before, but in all honesty I'm surprised that it has come to the point of creating an established procedure for it. Thanks for the info. :) ] 15:03, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


==You helped choose ] as this week's ] winner==
{| class="notice noprint" style="background: PapayaWhip; border: 1px solid SteelBlue; margin: 0 auto; text-align: center"
|]||Thank you for your support of the ''']'''.<br>This week ''']''' was selected to be improved to ] ].<br>Hope you can help.
|} ] 03:49, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


Any questions or concerns, feel free to email me or stop by my user talk page. Also, feel free to share this any other female Wikimedians you may know. It is in English, but any language Wikimedia participants are encouraged to participate.
==]==
I appreciate your contributions - to the survey and to Misplaced Pages! Thank you! ] (]) 05:29, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


== ''Ichthus'': January 2012 ==
I did some cleaning up on this page, straightening out some NPOV statements (eg: about whether wolfdogs are hybrids or not) and added references to the ] page and the DEFRA - ] wolfdog report. Please take a look at it. ] 09:26, 22 December 2006 (UTC)


<div style="font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">
:I found out how to combine references in an article. See ] for an example. Also, I think leaving the USDA article in as an external link as well as a reference: it's an easy read, it goes into more detail, and it's an essay (albeit a well referenced an authoritative one), essays can't go into WP. I think I'll save a copy in case the USDA ever takes the link down, and try to incorporate the most important factual points into the WP article. ] 11:17, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
{| style="text-align:center; border:10px solid black; background-color:black; width:100%;"
|-
|]
|- padding:15em;padding-top:5em;"
|style="font-size: 350%; color:gold; "|<br>'''<big>I</big>CHTHUS''' <br><br>
|- padding:15em;padding-top:5em;"
|style="color:gold;"|'''January 2012'''
|}
<div style="background-color:#FFF; font-size: 120%;font-weight:bold;">
''In this issue...'' <br />
*]
*]
*]
*]
</div>
-----
<center><small>''Ichthus'' is the newsletter of Christianity on Misplaced Pages &bull; It is published by ]<br>For submissions contact the ] &bull; To unsubscribe add yourself to the list ]</small></center>
</div>
<!-- EdwardsBot 0237 -->


== Seamus (dog) ==
== Welcome to ] ==
], an article which is part of ] has been proposed for deletion. Feel free to join the discussion. ] ] (]) 21:27, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
Thank you for your interest in VandalProof, Keesiewonder! You have now been added to the list of authorized users, so if you haven't already, simply ]. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me or any other ], or you can post a message on ]. ] <sup>(] • ] • ])</sup> 17:16, 27 December 2006 (UTC)


== WikiWomen's Collaborative ==
== Cancelled ISBNs (as in ]) ==


{| style="background:#ffdeb5; border:1px solid #f60; margin:0.5em; padding:0.5em;border-radius: 8px;"
Hello Keesiewonder! It's good to see somebody working on the invalid ISBNs. In the case of ] I believe that you have not hidden the problem from the ever-watchful SmackBot. For one thing, the colon after the word 'ISBN' has turned off the ISBN magic, but SmackBot watches specifically for colons, and it'll find it eventually. I'd suggest it's more reasonable to just remove the ISBN. Sometimes one of the regular editors will object, but if they don't, I think we're better off without it. Invalid ISBNs represent bad information, and it's not clear that they belong in an encyclopedia. ] 02:30, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
|-
:Thanks for letting me know; I was afraid of exactly what you have alerted me to. I'll remove the ISBN from the article. If an invalid ISBN is on the talk page, will that also get flagged? Keesiewonder 02:36, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
! colspan="2" style="font-size: 150%;" | WikiWomen Unite! <br />
::I see that there are a handful of Talk pages in CAT:INVALID, so it does flag them. To avoid flagging you could perhaps insert a word between the acronym 'ISBN' and the number. ] 02:46, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
|-
:As I see it, the invalid ISBNs are in use in the library catalogs (WorldCat, etc.) and are used as indexing by various individual library catalogs. So an invalid number is not entirely useless. The choice is to delete entirely or do something like, I think, putting them in a nowiki area with I S B N after the main citation should work. --] 21:57, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
| <div style="background: #fff;margin-right: 10px;">]</div>
:This example of an invalid ISBN in the original cataloging is from the ] article:
| style="text-align: left;" | Hi '''{{ {{{|safesubst:}}}ROOTPAGENAME}}'''! Women around the world who edit and contribute to Misplaced Pages are coming together to celebrate each other's work, support one another, and engage new women to also join in on the empowering experience of shaping the sum of all the world's knowledge - through the '''WikiWomen's Collaborative'''.<br/>
* Amini-Philips, Isaac C. (1998) ''Establishing a chronology for Ekpeye history'' Emhai Print. & Pub., Port Harcourt, Nigeria, ISBN 978-33527-9-1{{:Please check ISBN - Calculated check digit (2) doesn't match given.}} ; Both the UCLA and Yale catalog MARC record list this same ISBN, the only other library listed in WordlCat as holding this volume, New York Public Library - Research, does not display MARC records, nor show any ISBN. --] 21:57, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
As a WikiWoman, we'd love to have you involved! You can do this by:
:My understanding is that it is the spaces that prevent Smackbot from seeing the ISBN. I believe that most of the invalid ISBNs are typos in Misplaced Pages, based on a very small sample. I think OCLC numbers are more useful than LCCN. Some catalogs will key off of OCLC numbers, but most will not. I hope mare will in the future. --] 22:28, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
*Liking the and share your tips, projects, and connect with other WikiWomen
::Thanks that OCLC format works great! --] 22:52, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
*Join the conversation on our
*Reading and writing for our
We can't wait to have you involved, and feel free to drop by our ] (under construction) to see how else you can get involved!<Br/>
<br/>Can't wait to have you involved! ] (]) 04:31, 9 October 2012 (UTC)
|}
<!-- EdwardsBot 0380 -->


== WikiWomen's Collaborative: Come join us (and check out our new website)! ==
== "Cannot Locate" ==
I recognize I am a relative newcomer to WP and to fixing ISBNs. (i.e. please don't bite the newcomers; I'll try to not bite the elders.) However, I have to say I do not particularly like the tendency to insert "cannot locate" after ISBNs that are tagged as being in error. Please see ] for an example. I trust there is a way to insert this text so it does not appear as part of the article for the basic reader (as opposed to the ISBN hunters/fixers); I think I've already done this myself sometime in the last several weeks. Plus, for those that truly, truly truly cannot be found with a valid ISBN, there are at least three other numbers that can be used and linked to (OCLC, LCCN, ASIN). Please note more times than not, I am finding I am able to find a valid ISBN, though: see
for an example.


{| style="background:#008080; border:1px solid #40E0D0; margin:0.5em; padding:0.5em;border-radius: 8px;"
I am content that the "cannot locate" items appear to remain tagged as having an invalid ISBN, and am of the type that will come along and relatively quietly really clean them up rather than leave them 97% finished. I certainly am not as fast as other folks at fixing these, so maybe such a work flow, even with the unprofessional looking (to me, anyway) "cannot locate" is perfectly fine. Just thought I'd share my observation on this ... Thanks for your time. And please move this elsewhere if you find it appropriate. Kind Regards, ] 13:03, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
---- |-
! colspan="2" style="font-size: 150%;" | WikiWomen - We need you! <br />
*Talk pages are not processed: these are all cut and paste from articles.
|-
*"Cannot locate" could be put in html comments "&lt;!-- -->" - it is a bit of a self-ref, talk to ], very friendly guy.
| <div style="background: #fff;margin-right: 10px;">]</div>
:''] ]'', 13:12 ] ] (GMT).
| style="text-align: left;" | Hi '''{{ {{{|safesubst:}}}ROOTPAGENAME}}'''! The '''WikiWomen's Collaborative''' is a group of women from around the world who edit Misplaced Pages, contribute to its ], and support the mission of free knowledge. We recently updated our website, created new volunteer positions, and more! <br/>
----
Get involved by:
Ok ... I'll correspond with ]. Can you elaborate on your first bullet item above? I'll go make some more coffee since my brain may not be completely awake, but ... I'm not sure what you're talking about here ... sorry ... :-( ... ] 13:19, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
*Visiting our ''']''' for resources, events, and more
:"If an invalid ISBN is on the talk page, will that also get flagged? " Happy new year. ''] ]'', 13:31 ] ] (GMT).
*Meet other women and share your story in our ''']'''
:Ah - a question from a different thread! And, what is "these" in "''these are all cut and paste from articles''?" ] 13:44, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
*Participate at and "like" our ''''''
::The "talk" pages that are in ] - three of them I think. ''] ]'', 13:48 ] ] (GMT).
*Join the conversation on our ''''''
*Reading and writing for our ''''''
*Volunteer to write for our blog, recruit blog writers, translate content, and co-run our Facebook and receive perks for ''']'''
*Already participating? Take our and share your experience!
Thanks for editing Misplaced Pages, and we look forward to you being a part of the Collaborative! -- ] (]) 01:16, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
|}
<!-- EdwardsBot 0437 -->


== ] ==
Ok; I think I'm on the same page as you now. I must have asked my original question in a thread from another day poorly. I was wondering whether it would be a good idea to store the invalid and/or canceled ISBNs on '''article''' talk pages, especially when changing a SmackBot identified ISBN in error to an OCLC. I like the idea of keeping the "bad" ISBN around, but do not want it to get flagged by SmackBot if I store it on an article's talk page for safe keeping. It sounds like you are saying that article talk pages are not processed, so I could optionally store said "bad" ISBNs there w/o triggering SmackBot. I was not (yet) (intentionally) asking about ISBNs flagged on '''user''' talk pages ... but, when I am perplexed by this, I will hopefully remember what you've told me today. Regards, ] 14:04, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
----
:Hi Keesie, Just a quick note. I must feed dog (Border Collie) and angry cat (Calico) and coffee proof my comments. My comment (Cannot locate) was intended to let another toiler be aware that a ISBN had been looked at. I "typically" use Amazon and Abebook (Using both to search by title and author name). I have used LoC for other searches but not for this effort. I really wasn't sure who was looking at what, when or where and after discussing this with Rich was my *indicator* that someone had looked at the item in question. I didn't want to disregard the abilities of other. I had concluded the "C" row last night and did a couple D's before I quit for the night. All things considered, I tend to agree with EdJ that a final solution would be to leave the title ref and remove the incorrect ISBN. Since many that are left are foreign I sure expected a *type* expert to step into the fray. Off to feed the pets and myself. Back later. Ekotkie 16:13, 1 January 2007 (UTC)


{{Misplaced Pages:Arbitration Committee Elections December 2015/MassMessage}} ] (]) 16:20, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
:It'll all work out! Given the way I work, I'd prefer the error tags for bad ISBNs remain (as they have been) so I have a chance to find the really awful ones. I'd also prefer that we don't have reference pages all over the place that have reference lists that say "cannot locate." I've done several foreign (to me) language ones the last few days including Chinese ones. But ... it is not terribly important ... since we all have the same goal of cleaning the ISBN mess up as best we can. So ... when do you think we'll be under 1000? Ever? (Hi to your pets, BTW.) And Happy New Year to you. Regards, ] 16:20, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
<!-- Message sent by User:Mdann52@enwiki using the list at https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User:Mdann52/list&oldid=692040667 -->


== ArbCom 2019 election voter message ==
::Do I detect an eternal optimist? As a retired aerospace engineer I value structure and the ISBN process, as I have seen so far, is not it. My bride is a retired State U librarian who now catalogs church library books and shakes her head at this mess. This is like the business of "where to put the dashes?" Who cares? Just get the number straight. I think Amazon and Abe took the right approach and didn't use any dashes. BTW, Have you read the discussion area on the Cat:Invalid page? Ah yes, the language ones. I too have plowed through a bunch of them and resolved quite a few. I take them, one ISBN at a time and just try to do my best. As you have no doubt noted, many errant ISBN's have mis-worded/fragmented titles. This is a time consuming process that I would not have time for if I wasn't retired. As to leaving the template data, there is a flaw there also. The bot template is written to not show up for the normal page viewer, thus, my short comment will draw attention to the fact that there is and error of some sort. I have had a couple page developers ask me about my comment and all have corrected the information after receiving an explanation. As to getting down to 1000....ha, For awhile their I was getting discouraged that the bot would never quit filling stuff into the A row.Ha. Rich has a counter on his page but I don't know how accurate it is. The bot has finished its tour and Progress has been made. I feel sometimes like I have done "hundreds" but thats just me. Lots to think about but we have a new year and as Rich loves to say.....be bold. Have a great first day of the new year. I ssw where you are owned by pets also. Aren't we the lucky ones? ] 17:40, 1 January 2007 (UTC)


<table class="messagebox " style="border: 1px solid #AAA; background: ivory; padding: 0.5em; width: 100%;">
==Can I assist?==
<tr><td style="vertical-align:middle; padding-left:1px; padding-right:0.5em;">]</td><td>Hello! Voting in the ''']''' is now open until 23:59 on {{#time:l, j F Y|{{Arbitration Committee candidate/data|2019|end}}-1 day}}. All ''']''' are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.


The ] is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the ]. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose ], ], editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The ] describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.
If you'd like me to comment at the AfD, could you give me a link, and I'll take a look. By the way, what does your username mean, if I may ask? ] 19:48, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
:Oh, don't worry about mentioning your animals (the photos are cute), I'm an animal nut too, particularly cats (I think if there was a kittens channel on television, I could watch it all day, no problem). Our cat Cable is only now recovering from the fireworks displays last midnight, which traumatised the poor fellow.


If you wish to participate in the 2019 election, please review ] and submit your choices on the ''']'''. If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{tlx|NoACEMM}} to your user talk page. ] (]) 00:08, 19 November 2019 (UTC)
:I did hop across to that AfD, and what a no brainer. Wow, your research skills and pertinacity are impressive! Now I know who to come to for a certain type of expertise in future. ] 21:39, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
</td></tr>
</table>
<!-- Message sent by User:Cyberpower678@enwiki using the list at https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Misplaced Pages:Arbitration_Committee_Elections_December_2019/Coordination/MMS/02&oldid=926750292 -->


== {{Wikiproject Prussia Invite}} ==
==Charles Whitham - Western Tasmania ==
Ok, so I had not put a note or withdrawn the reference - I wish I had now - the state reference library of tasmania has not got the correct isbn ( Ihave had a drawn out conversation with them about it) - the shire of queenstown when they reprinted - didnt put the correct ISBN number in - I personally think that the extra numbers are meaningless to the average australian user for instance (I ihave a copy of the 1949 edition and the 2003 or whatever reprint) . I think its a time wasting wild goose chase - I would rather cite the 1949 edition that had no isbn to avoid the whole issue. I am sure you are doing a very good job - and well done - but this particular remedy in my mind is pointless! The thing is the currently available reprint has the wrong isbn of which the correct ones hasnt been fo8und (even national library of austyralia is no help on this) - and really - there are not that many on the second market to warrant the amazon monster even knowing about it ( I know many books that never get in their clutches thank god) So pplease for all your effort - the oclc and amazon numbers might look good but i suspect they are no real help to the average punter/tourist whio buys a copy in Strahan or Queenstown with the wrong isbn anyways! I probably dont make much sense - have a happy new year ] 15:52, 2 January 2007 (UTC)


] (]) (:
::OOPS - Sorry I have repeated myself quite unnecesarily - rather than revert - thanks for your trouble in those arts - I can confirm the isbn is wrong - and the book is being sold on the west coast of tassie - and yes people are buying copies of a book with dud isbn- maybe it will go down in history as one of the quirks of western tasmania history ( I knew charles's nephew - it think it was when I was living on the west coast in the mid to late 1970's) - sorry I am so verbose - I thought I had made a nyr resolution about redcing talk page things. sorry!] 16:19, 2 January 2007 (UTC)


== ] of ] ==
No worries, and Happy New Year! It's neat to meet someone who knew Charles' family! This book is cited heavily through the English Language Misplaced Pages with an invalid ISBN as published by the publisher. Such incorrect ISBNs trigger automatic processes such as SmackBot to tag articles that have "invalid ISBNs." People doing research worldwide, not just in Australia, will have a much easier time, I suggest, finding a book that has a valid OCLC than one that has an invalid ISBN. Later today, I will suggest a compromise format for citing this particular work that should not trigger SmackBot. I'm sure we can come up with something that will work for everyone. Also, we can always retain the ivalid ISBN on the article's talk page; article talk pages do not, as far as I understand, cause error tagging by SmackBot. Kind Regards, ] 16:32, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
]


The article ] has been ]&#32;because of the following concern:
::Thank you being tolerant of my raving. I think the problem with my western tasmania project ( I seemed to have either started most of or populated most of the more obscure articles) is that whitham is citeable in most of the articles - I dont know whether to cite the 1949 edition- which the main libraries have, or include the 2003 edition - with the incorrect number within a parenthesis or note in some way - what do you think? ] 16:38, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
<blockquote>'''] and no ] by independent sources'''</blockquote>


While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be ].
SatuSuro, please let me know what you think of my first idea for a suggested compromise. You may see it in all its glory at ]. Please feel free to edit there (assuming the Wiki Gods allow it) if convenient for you. (And, no need to apologize; these pages are near and dear to you, as is the content, I expect. I'm the "intruder!" But a curious, kind one. Maybe I'll be so lucky as to see the Western Coast of Australia some day ... or any part of Australia, for that matter). Kind Regards, ] 17:40, 2 January 2007 (UTC)


You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your ] or on ].
::Rule number one on wikipedia - no one owns. I only go to battle with POV issues on the west coast - or kids with nothing better to do (Strahan article) apart from that I have no problem with modificcation. The more the intruders the better then it makes sure I am kept honest - so thanks! Next one - I shouldnt try talk messages at 2 am after seeing the latest james bond movie - the head was in too many places.. The one after that the OCLC link is great! just like the locations for my fathers books (similar holdings different subject - and fifteen to ten years older) . Thank you for the effort. ] 01:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the ], but other ]es exist. In particular, the ] process can result in deletion without discussion, and ] allows discussion to reach ] for deletion.<!-- Template:Proposed deletion notify -->
Technicality - I have also cited ]'s ] - I will do a similar thing and actually I will create whitham and western tasmania articles later today (he and his book are notable) so that we can put your excellent full cite there - and maybe do links for the subsidiary articles that link ] 01:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC) So please if you could leave that citation for 24 hours I should catch it! ] 02:09, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

:*'''''Cool!''''' Glad to be of help, and to contribute a bit to your inspiration! ] 02:01, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
:Dont let me even start about west coast tasmania or west coast australia (I live in western australia) - I'll never get off talk! ] 02:09, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

== Consider the benefits of the OCLC template ==

Hello Keesie. I admire the relentless march of your ISBN fixes! Since you have added some OCLC numbers, you might want to consider the ] that was invented by ], another ISBN-fixer. A typical use would be <nowiki>{{OCLC|48825404}}</nowiki> in the case of the Charles Whitham book, for example. This expands to {{OCLC|48825404}}, which gives a clickable OCLC reference that defaults to the 'Libraries' tab in OCLC, rather than the 'Details' tab, which is sometimes blank. If you use it in the 'cite book' template, you can just replace 'id=ISBN XXXXXXXXXX' with 'id=<nowiki>{{OCLC|XXXXXX}}</nowiki>. Anyway, it saves typing! ] 17:16, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

== Cannot locate ==

{{discussion at|User_talk:EdJohnston}}

You might be interested in . Please know I'm not trying to cause trouble ... :-) ... ] 13:06, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

:I've posted again on Ekotkie's page. I've gotten a bit frustrated with seeing the messy "cannot locate" on article pages when I am subsequently able to locate the correct ISBN on my first or second try. Sure, I cannot clean up 30 bad ISBNs in an hour. I prefer to take the time and really, really get it right. Oh well. I'll clean them up, eventually, if they remain tagged as bad. I won't see them, though, if they're deleted. Regards, ] 15:58, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

I think I see your point about LOSING the SmackBot-marked entries from the system in favor of the 'cannot locate' indicators. My guess is that EdK's suggestion would ultimately result in a 'confirmed bad' template or some such, worded in a more politically appealing way. There is a school of thought (advocated by ] for example) that since the bad ISBNs may still be able to retrieve some results on the web and on bookstores, we are hurting our readers by ignoring and neglecting them. So such a template would state 'confirmed bad, but still useful'. (Sorry I can't exert my political brain to find a more pleasant way of describing the situation). So my vote would be to KEEP all the originally SmackBot-marked entries in ] regardless of any 'cannot locates' that might be added to the visible text. Unfortunately then we would have TWO statuses of badness, the never-visited badness and the visited-once-but-not-fixed badness. This is not good for the maintainers.

I'll correspond further with EdK on this. ] 00:12, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

----
::Hi Guys -- There's certainly no hard feelings on my account; we're a team, as I see it. We're amidst a massive collaborative effort here, and there are rarely 100% right answers. No worries, please! :-)

::A bit of a personal story that may back up my perspective at bit: About 6 months ago, I didn't even really know Misplaced Pages existed. But, I started hearing about it everywhere. I recently enrolled in an online Master's degree program, after being out of school for many years. The course I had over the summer was "just" a writing class; the instructor insisted that we were not to use Misplaced Pages for anything we submitted to her. She emphasized scholarly resources, i.e. peer reviewed journals only. So something as oft over my head as ''Scientific American'' could not appear in anything we submitted. It was a great class, and I learned a lot. This fall I took a molecular biology class. The instructor was much less strict on where we got our sources (even though the first class was supposed to prepare me for writing well in the second), so, students quickly slipped in to essentially using Misplaced Pages for everything. Well, this drove me wild, having just finished the writing class. My message was perhaps quietly appreciated by the professor, but as far as I could tell, my student colleagues just didn't get it. They had no qualms about writing about deep scientific topics, using only WP for their source, even though WP can be edited by anyone (no, this does not count as a scholarly definition of peer reviewed, in my opinion), and even though the moment they copied and pasted from WP may be a moment when it was filled with "garbage." Fortunately for me, I managed to turn this around in my mind - I adopted an 'if I cannot beat them, join them' attitude and started editing on WP. So far, it has been a gratifying experience.

::What's my point? Well, if I pull up an article as a student researcher, and see "can't find ISBN" in the footnotes or reference list, and see a tag at the bottom that says 'articles with invalid ISBNs,' for me, perhaps me only, it dramatically diminishes the integrity I give to the article and its content. (I would have had this feeling when I was in high school too.) Thus, I feel if we do not have a valid ISBN, then we should not display it for the "average" readers eyes. The other parts of the work's citation (author, title, publication year, etc) should still prove adequate for the reader to locate the source if they so choose. Meanwhile, I feel we should retain the problematic ISBN in the wikicode or a database or something so it can be a tool for the sleuths who try to find the correct ISBN or an alternate catalog number. Basically, I feel every time we press 'save page' for an article, we ideally should feel it is fit for publication. Yes, there will be mistakes, but do we need to deliberately display them?

:] 04:20, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

==Cannot Find Tags ==
I have just finished removing all (cannot find) tags from CAT:INVALID pages, A,B,C,D, and that small part of E that I have just started working on. Those were the only ones I worked on. Any use of a tag that I used was to note the absence of a correct ISBN was only intended to flag this error to a user who was looking for a particular reference and might attempt to use one that was in error. It was not to cause heartburn as to the quality of the pages product or the author of the page. I seriously doubt that a typical user will go into edit mode to verify the accuracy of an ISBN, thus, I elevated the comment to the visible area for all to see. This was intended to be a short term solution and would allow others to use additional resources to find and correct the defective ISBN. I am currently using 6 different tools to search out ISBN's. In all honesty I feel the best answer, at this juncture is to just eliminate the errant ISBN and press on. There are over 2000 ISBN that need to be resolved. Let the user seek out his/her own ISBN, if one is even needed. I would rather give the readership an accurate title and author's name then to give them a bogus ISBN.Ekotkie 06:22, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

:Sounds fine ... I feel we're all essentially saying the same thing albeit in slightly different ways. ] 11:58, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

==Head against brick wall==

Well, I have a reason for interest in that AfD too, now, because I'm an opponent of the wording "verifiability, not truth", which I fear isn't easily understood by Misplaced Pages novices, and I'm a supporter of the proposed policy ], which would combine ], ], and ] in one, making it much easier to explain policy to people by a reference to one short, clear page. This AfD is a case in point where it would be useful, in my opinion.

I've just read your experiences and opinions above. I have the same mixed feelings about Misplaced Pages: on the one hand, much of it is utter rubbish; on the other, it has breathtaking potential. The better articles (my favourite article on Misplaced Pages is ], which I hold up as a beacon of what Misplaced Pages can achieve. I'm certain it is the best article on him in existence.) When I joined Misplaced Pages, I first just pottered about for months, adding bits here and there to articles: but then I started to feel that it was all just drops in the ocean, and that I had nothing to show for it; so now I concentrate on a small few articles, either copyediting ones by non-English-speaking editors which I think could make featured article, or trying to build something good myself, as with ] (I've got a job seeing the computer for all the tomes about him stacked up in front of me here). If I had any hope for you, it would be that you aim your best work at potentially high-quality articles, where it won't go to waste. In fact, most top-quality editors find ISBN work tedious, I suspect, and would be delighted with your assistance. What I like about you is that you do your thing in a hand-crafted way; good editors particlualrly hate it when they are jumped on by impersonal bots and tagging sprees (one of our best editors has recently been frustrated into leaving over that sort of thing), but I'm sure they would warm to your human touch. ] 17:58, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

:Note to self re OPAC in India ->

I realize that your posting asks no question, but I tried to follow up anyway. I opened the link you provided, but in a few random trials, looking for (1) a web site that would respond, (2) an OPAC search screen, (3) all books by anyone named 'Markar', I didn't have any luck. I've gone from thinking that there are no OPACs there, to believing that the search might be worthwhile, though lengthy. ] 20:59, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

:Hi EdJ! I'm losing the train of thought a bit here ... sorry ... Who is Markar? I would have expected you to mention one of the names in ]. If you've been following all my posts everywhere relating to this topic, my personal/work colleague checked out the Hindi Misplaced Pages, and didn't find anything on this chap ... How much longer till the AfD closes? ] 21:30, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Sorry for the 'brain fault'. I ought to have searched for 'Parmar', per the AfD, which has already closed, with a comment by the deleting administrator about the 'hilarious content' which is not entirely unjustified, but perhaps unkind. I'm impressed that you have ways of searching the Hindi Misplaced Pages. After this was all done, I asked myself whether WP might already have featured articles about Indian topics that we could ask people to go and look it when they wish to write about that area, who want to know what to aspire to which still meets WP standards. I confess that I did look at your contribution history, and in that way came across the AfD, and since I used to participate more in AfD debates, I am irresistibly drawn in to anything interesting. ] 23:07, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

:] (it's not illegal to store this, is it?)

:EdJ, No need to confess, or at least you shouldn't feel bad, about perusing my or anyone else's contributions list. ! Early on in this particular AfD, I was curious about the Hindi WP. Today, when I took a break from work to check the discussion, and realized I had 1-2 people in my workplace who might know about Parmar, or at the very least could read Hindi, I just had to ask. You're a mathy person, right? If I remember correctly from your user page? My undergraduate degree is in math and economics. I don't remember the details (I bet you do!) but in a combinatorics class, I remember the professor displaying an example of ... it takes only some very small number of connections to connect any two people in the world ... I don't remember the proof or the the number of connections, but it was something like 5. So, if true, then there would only be, say, 5 connections between me and Parmar. With networking, we ought to be able to accomplish that pretty easily. Thanks for your correspondence. ] 00:49, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

==Martin Luther Page==

Keesiewonder, thanks for sharing my concern about "Slim Virgin" and this person's unilateral edits. I've done a google search on this person and researched this person's history on Misplaced Pages and let's just say that we have in this person a notoriously flagrant violatoer of Misplaced Pages policies, and, frankly, a Misplaced Pages bully. The only way to deal with this king of thuggery is simply to keep reverting this person's edits. If you and I do this every day this person may lose interest and go away, but, on the other hand, "she" and I put "she" in quotes for I've learned there is every reason to believe this person is not a "she" at all, may call in her other allies on these Jewish POV issues and they will cause problems. But if you want, you and I and anyone else who share our concerns can just keep reverting this person's vandalism on the Luther page. ] 11:21, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

:Hmmmm. Ok, let's see if there's a politically correct way a la Misplaced Pages to deal with this. I'm relatively new, as I said. And, by the looks of your empty user page, empty talk page, and contribution list that began less than 8 hours ago, you look even newer to me. Just an observation; I realize you may have other accounts with much longer histories. Anyway, if what you're telling me is true, then the bulk of users on WP would probably join forces with you and/or us and the end result may be that at a minimum, administrator privileges, for example, may be taken away temporarily. My life experience tells me that getting in to a revert war in hopes that we win is probably not going to have the intended effects we seek.

:Please don't get me wrong; I am quite proficient at causing a tremendous amount of effective trouble ... but ... do not like to be a troublemaker ... Nor do I feel that people who know me well see that as my purpose in life. My instincts tell me to try to proceed with the information you have offered me in a 'right' way, rather than just responding in a manner that may be perceived as responding in kind.

:I expect other users are going to quickly see this part of my talk page and may offer some advice on how to proceed. May I also suggest that you and I, in all our spare time (HA!), figure out how to proceed with the existing policies on WP? For me, that means locating and reading about what options undoubtedly already exist for dealing with a situation such as this one involving an administrator. I realize that being an admim has perhaps little to do with the ML article, but, perhaps more than a revert war, it is something that SV would notice in a broader way. Thanks for your correspondence, I assure you I am female!, and if you prefer, you may email me at the link to the left. Kind Regards, ] 11:44, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
Since there was a request for advice, I can't hold back my own two cents here. Without even looking at the ML article, and considering just your comment here, I'm assuming you're in a potential edit war with a person who happens to be an administrator. There are various procedural remedies but they are kind of slow. If there's no claim the administrator has abused his powers, then IMHO it's a plain old edit war among equals in which WP:RFC (Requests for comment) can be considered. Another idea is to find a 'parent project' for the ML page, and you could post there a specific question, asking those editors to look at the page and offer advice. I know this has often been done with positive results in the math and physics projects. Since this could be a 'religious war' kind of deal, you could look through past AfDs in which religious issues have been discussed, and ask one or more of the closing administrators (or AfD proponents, or just anybody) for advice. If a bunch of local editors have got into a weird state, bringing in new observers can help. ] 03:08, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
:Got your update on my talk page. Since you pointed me to the thread at ML, I sympathize with the struggle, but it seems you may no longer be the coolest head there (though you were until recently). ] 03:53, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

==ISBNs and ASINs==
A's are down to two entries now. I've created {{tl|ASIN}}
*{{ASIN|B0006R304U}} <br>
- although I don't really like using ASINs

''] ]'', 12:50 ] ] (GMT).

== Sure , i'll try ==

Sure i'll try to find any citations ISBN if possible.Anyway the page has already been deleted. We can move on to some other page.
] 16:01, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

== Info on the ISBN-fixing activity now on my user page ==

Hello Keesie. Please take a look at the new version of ] where I tried to summarize the ISBN-fixing activity. Let me know if I missed out on some useful bit of advice for newcomers. So far, there has not been a real project for this work, but it wouldn't hurt if the effort looked a tiny bit respectable, since our changes are sometimes questioned by people who don't know what it's about or why we're doing it. Anyone who starts fixing ISBNs 'automatically' joins the project, whether they want to or not, it's very democratic. :-) ] 22:45, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

:Ok. Looking at this and giving you some kind of feedback is my next WP task today. I'm delighted to be considered part of the project! :-) ] 20:27, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

: I'll add things as I think of them ... one by one ...

# Excellent idea to keep a log of the number of incorrect ISBNs we're dealing with. For the overly detailed among us, maybe a second number in the log for the number of total articles would be nice too for some perspective.
# I would reword this sentence: ''The full list of articles still to be fixed can be found at: Category:Articles with invalid ISBNs''. Perhaps yielding: ''The current list of articles with one or more ISBNs requiring fixing can be found at: Category:Articles with invalid ISBNs.''
# Consider not mentioning Misplaced Pages:List of pages with Invalid ISBNs at all. Us "old timers" will get rid of it soon enough. For people seeking a nice project to work on, if this kind of "work" is their thing, there's no point in overwhelming them with two lists. Especially since probably 99% of what is on the List version is either already fixed or is on the Category version.
# If you could find out what kind of schedule SmackBot is on, i.e. frequency of run, does it check all of the English Misplaced Pages during each run, etc., that'd be great, or at least something I personally would find helpful/useful/interesting.
# ''However there are relatively few of those numbers in Misplaced Pages.'' -> There are relatively few ISSN fixers? There are relatively few ISSNs needing fixing?
#FWIW, my personal preference, most to least, is ISBN, OCLC, LCCN, ASIN ... i.e. reverse the last two.
#Maybe try drafting a guideline's section. It could include things like
::*Only include an ASIN if you cannot find a valid one of the other three cataloging numbers.
::*Don't worry if you don't know the 'proper' placement of the dashes since an auto-something-or-other will come along to fix it (eventually).
::*If you start with a page with an ISBN tagged as being in error, and need to supersede it with, say, an OCLC, consider leaving a courteous message on the article's talk page explaining what happened and leave the invalid ISBN visible inside html code. (An example of this will be necessary so it remains visible to editors and invisible to readers.) You may also want to leave a copy of the original citation with the "bad" ISBN on the talk page.
::*If you're really stuck, move on to the next ISBN in error; if you don't like to leave things unfinished, make an effort to get help from people who may be able to help such as the frequent contributors to the article or the article's talk page, relevant portals, forums outside of Misplaced Pages, other ISBN fixers on Misplaced Pages, etc. Concise clues from your seemingly unsuccessful findings are most welcome within the html code written above. If you need to be more verbose about the situation, use the article's talk page.
::*Be especially careful when editing articles with complicated reference list structures such as 75 in text citations.
::*Be certain to do what you can to maintain the existing citation style in the article. If the article is using APA, stick with APA. If the article is using CMS, stick with CMS. If there is no citation style, or it is a mess, tactfully consider tidying things up by converting to citation templates, alphabetizing lists, etc. This is completely optional, since your primary intent is probably to clean up the "bad" ISBNs.
::*Expect that there will be articles where the editors most familiar with the material will want to continue listing the ISBN, even if it is "bad." This is okay. A possible compromise may be to list the ISBN as I S B N since it appears that SmackBot does not identify bad I S B Ns, only bad ISBNs.
::*It is ok to end up deleting an ISBN entirely, yielding a book citation that is just author, title, publication date ... or whatever the article editors want. It is probably best to communicate this on the talk page over at least a couple days ... i.e. try not to delete the ISBN in one sitting. Come back another day, try to find it again, correspond with those who may care about the article content, and, if all else fails, eliminate the ISBN, and leave a trail on the talk page regarding what happened.
:8. I made a list of tools I like using when doing ISBN work. You can find it on my user page, and, I'll put it here for you as well. <br>
:'''Tools to help:'''<br>
:* (When I've been really stuck, I've plugged the bad ISBN in to this tool and run WorldCat on each possible alternative ISBN check provides.) <br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*<br>
:*]<br>
:*<br>
:*www.booksinprint.com - (if you have access) <br>
:*National libraries<br>
:*Talk page of article w/ISBN in question<br>
:*User placing ISBN in question<br>

Ok -- That's my first draft pass thinking about this. Hope you're not sorry you asked. Kind Regards, ] 21:55, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

==]==
I picked up your name from the Wiki dog project page, would you please chime in on this debate and cast a vote. thank you ] 02:00, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
:You can vote to '''Overturn''' at the link provided above, and please state your reasons. Thank you. ] 02:30, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
:In addition, they have deletion votes for the ] and ] ] 03:22, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
==Thank you==
For working with this editor. I'm backing out of the discussion, because I'm not as knowledgable as you are on it. The content of the article in question (now that I've read it on the mirror site), was gorgeously written and fascinating to me. I had a pure-bred Olde English Sheepdog as a child, so that's my "dog in the race" (lol).

There's got to be something he wants to do - I hate to see an editor like this so discouraged. It would truly suck if my first article got deleted. He also writes far better than myself. On a side note, I'm really hoping that the extinct breeds are covered more on Misplaced Pages some day. I find the topic of extinct animals and plants fascinating, but I also understand why they aren't covered right now. Sincerely, ] 14:24, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

::I probably should have clarified that I'm not knowledgeable at ''all''. I just advocate for new users getting into the appropriate Wikiproject or projects that fit their interests. Headphonos posted his message on Jimbo Wales talk page, which I patrol occasionally (until I'm thoroughly annoyed, then I remove it - lol) so I thought I'd help him out. But really, this is our fork in the road. I do want to say I think you're a fine member of Misplaced Pages, and I'm glad our paths crossed. I appreciate your kindness and civility. Sincerely, ] 23:31, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

== I had forgotten all about ==

the Hitler Book Incident. it was one of the the early times when I realized that I was going to make my own way through wikipedia and stay off other folks turf. My addition to the hitler book list was deleted because I used a different format than someone there thought I should have used. When I find something like that I change it rather than deleting it, but I figured that I'd just back out. Thanks for the ] link, I'll check it out. I post a lot of book references because I'm a book person, but I never have included the ISBN. By the way, I have a ] but have never looked it up on wikipedia. Let's see what this link brings. ] 15:18, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

== Bulldogs ==

Personally, I need to understand the distinction between extinction and recreation of a breed better. If I remember correctly, the article that was deleted was about a recreation effort (]). Before I champion for the breed and the breed's article, I need to be absolutely certain it is not akin to something like the Keesiwonder's Olde English Bulldogge, for example. Even if 30 people have one of these dogs in 10 different countries, that still does not immediately mean to me that WP should have an article about them.

(The following note was copied by Keesiewonder from another user's talk page since they were not really part of the dog content part of the conversation.)
:Hello ], does the ] article have enough external links and reference book citations for you to vote to "keep"? If not, then it reaffirms my conversation with Anon that hundreds of additional articles on the ] can be successfully deleted. IMHO rare and extinct breeds should be allowed at wikipedia not only the one's recognized by the major ] and/or the ]. The establisment of organizations such as or the recognize these issues. If members of the Wiki dog project aren't online with these statements, then the project is doomed to be dramatically downsized, with some editors, myself included calling it a wiki failure. In regard to the ] article that was deleted by an adminstrator without even a vote being called here is nice piece of history on the breed . I like the aluminum street sign best myself -:) ] 15:54, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Hi Headphonos. My approach with this is to do one thing at a time. Right now, I am focused on getting the speedy delete of Winston Olde English Bulldogge overturned. Regardless of what I might say in an AfD on that article, I do not like the fact that from what I can tell, it was speedy deleted inappropriately. I am interested in this issue in part because I want to better understand the "powers" and "privileges" of admins. Most of my books are in storage right now, which is very frustrating for me. So, I just came back from a trip to a local Borders. One book I bought was an encyclopedia-like book on dogs. Stay tuned, keep the faith, and be patient! :-) Kind Regards, ] 20:00, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Also, I tagged a comment of my own on to the original note I saw from you about the 1800 breeds that would have to be deleted if ... I asked for the list in good faith. You could email it to me, also in good faith. ] 20:07, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
----
Ok ... one thing that needs to be straightened out is if you would like to see some changes implemented at either of the two major dog projects at Misplaced Pages, your best approach would be to contact them directly on their project pages. You may certainly say that you and I have corresponded. But, I do not want to try to represent the project in full on individual user talk pages. Let's move this conversation to one or both of the dog related projects, if you feel there are some serious changes that should be made. I am probably one of the most recent members of each project, so to single me out as the one to talk with may not be the best approach.

Also, you may want to be careful about implying that the project members are not on board with certain issues and/or statements. Especially if you have not been participating on the project talk pages. (I don't know whether you have, or have not.) But when I first read your notes, I felt like you were making all kinds of assumptions that I hadn't heard about or seen substantiation for ... at least not yet. It is a pretty loaded statement, isn't it, to project that the dog projects are doomed to be downsized and deemed a wiki-failure if they don't do what you are suggesting? How long have you been a editor on Misplaced Pages? How long have you worked with the dog project members? Do you think that even if several dog project editors were willing to work with you on your visions for the projects that significant changes like an overhaul of dog related categories would happen within, say, even a week's time? Let's assume good faith here, all the way around, and find a way to work together, please. I have seen some good points in some of your posts, and would be more than happy to try to flush them out with you. But, we need to collaborate. ] 00:02, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
----
'''Q''': does the ] article have enough external links and reference book citations for you to vote to "keep"?<br>
'''A''': For me, it is not about the number of external links and/or book citations. Not quantity, but quality. These two may be wonderful; I don't have them on my desk, but since they are easy to find in the places I like to check, they seem fine. I would like to see some additional ones from a different publisher. Also, while there are two books listed at the end of the article, not a single statement is cited within the article. If you'd like, I could pass through it lending my opinion on where a citation is necessary. ] 00:18, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

'''Statement''': If not, then it reaffirms my conversation with Anon that hundreds of additional articles on the List of dog breeds can be successfully deleted.

'''Response''': Please don't try to bully me in to an answer one way or another. I assure you I will consider our topic carefully, but, if not allowed to think for and to express myself on the issue you brought to my attention, then, we may not work well together. Also, I would like to know what the 1,800 articles are that you feel violate current policy per the dog projects on Misplaced Pages. I have asked for this multiple times (but only today, I know), but, have yet to receive clarification from you on this. I'll be patient, but will take notice if you don't respond within, say, a week, or, if I see you posting lots of material, but not responding to what I have asked.

'''Statement''': IMHO rare and extinct breeds should be allowed at wikipedia.

'''Response''': That sounds fair. Can you give me, say, 6 significant and completely different examples where you see this has not happened?

'''Statement''': Keesiewonder will be the first to admin she is confused about all the different kinds of Bulldogs. When she is asked about Bulldog A, and provides answers pertaining to Bulldog A, questions come back about "Bulldog B", "Bulldog C" and "A Bulldog that Sounds like Bulldog A but Might Not Always be Bulldog A." Could you make a nice list for me of what is going on here? Here's what I've seen, just on WP. How are all of these related? Which ones are equivalent, if any?<br>

==List of Bulldog Breeds on Misplaced Pages==

]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
], British Bulldog<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
] <br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>
]<br>

== Guideline draft needed ==

Hi Keesie, thanks for your very thorough review of my notes on ISBN-fixing! Since you would like there to be a guidelines document, do you want to start writing one? For instance, you could create it as a subpage under User:Keesiewonder, and I could add a link to it from the other document. ] 03:55, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

:Certainly; I'll let you know when it's ready. ] 13:57, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

==Voting thing==
Ok, thanks for the note and correction. I appreciate your effort at the ] page. --]<sup><small>( ] | ])</small></sup> 19:12, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

== Judeophobia ==

*Very few academic sources will refer to persecution of Jews until the 1800's as anti-Semitism, though once you get into Christian Europe you will find more examples. In ancient history however, and Jews in Muslim lands, much more often it will simply be referred to as "persecution" as the Jews weren't being targeted any more than any other group (again until the rise of Christianity). -- '''] <sup>]&nbsp;•&nbsp;]&nbsp;]</sup>''' 22:10, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

:Ok, yes, that makes a lot of sense. Thank you! Might there be good reasons, then, to have an article on Judeophobia. It seems like you have articulated a clear distinction between Judeophobia and anti-Semitism; yet the former redirects to the latter in WP.

:Another thing I've been trying to form an opinion on is why only one person is mentioned in WP' anti-Judaism category - i.e. a category for one person, one sub-category, and one article. Of course and unfortunately anti-Judaism exists. But is there only one person for all of time who can be assigned to that category? I've struggled with this some on the talk page at the Martin Luther article; you may have already noticed it. If you can help me think through this one ... I'd greatly appreciate it. Kind Regards, ] 22:22, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
==Hi Keesie==
<gallery>
Image:Lynx kitten.jpg |A Eurasian Lynx kitten. Isn't she pretty? Hope you're doing well:).] 14:03, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
</gallery>

== A lone voice in the wilderness... ==

I hate to say it, lady, but I think you might have seen how inactive the projects are. Very few people will respond to anything, as most of them are primarily interested in their own favorite breeds, and know little if anything about anything else. The one I knew who might have helped, Blufawn, understandably begged off because of what happened to the Tamaskan Dog article, although she did respond to my talk page. I did however change my own opinion after her comment accordingly. Also, unfortunately, few people have the ready access to information that you do, and often can't respond with any real knowledge about the subject. Right now, you are probably carrying a lot of the dog work on your own shoulders, and I sincerely wish we could get others to help more often. I wish it were otherwise, but... Also, we can be hopeful and say that they are all really, really, really busy today. I know I'm tied up elsewhere right now, but I will try to respond when I know something about the subject myself. Unfortunately, I regret to say, that really ain't that often. I know that this is probably very small consolation, but I just wanted you to know that someone did see your notices. ] 00:10, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

::You can always try "spamming" (whatever, contacting) each individual member on their talk pages, or via email. That's what I intend to do with Sexuality and Sexology, as well as Wikiproject Psychology:). ] | ] 15:28, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

:Thank you both for your perspective. Mass mailing/contacting is really not my style. I'll just keep doing what I'm doing. I believe in my "work" here and my message ... eventually it'll all come together. Regards, ] 00:29, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

== Updated ISBN_fixing page ==

Hello Keesiewonder. I updated ] in response to your suggestions. I think keeping the List is still worthwhile, because it's a means of communication about difficult numbers. If you do decide to write up your proposed Guidelines, I'll link to that as well. Can you put the list of Tools on the same page, or do you prefer that we link to your User page for those? ] 16:05, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

:I will do a guidelines and tools document draft; haven't forgotten; just too busy in real life. ] 00:25, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

=== Your patronizing remarks and personal insults on the Luther page ===

It's fairly obvious to me, and no doubt anyone else who reads your comments, that you can't participate on the Martin Luther page without emotionalizing everything. The patronizing tone you take over against new users, your constant references to your style and how busy you are...well, it's just getting old. Maybe you should consider sticking to "real life" since Misplaced Pages seems to be a source of such personal frustration and angst for you. Stop the personal attacks. And stow the patronizing remarks. It's just absurd. And, grow up for heaven's sake. If you can't stand the heat, then get out of the kitchen, etc. ] 12:14, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 05:10, 23 September 2021

The Signpost
24 December 2024

Archives

Cataloging, Citing, ... 1
Dogs 1
Misc 1
Religion-Faith-Dialog-... 1
Science 1
Sockpuppets, Trolls, Harassment, ... 1


Lost week

Tail end of some issues, never got back about the murder things. Check out WP:TW I think you might like it SatuSuro 02:53, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

ASIN to OCLC

I noticed this edit on my watchlist. Thank you very much for your work, in almost all cases we probably never should have used an ASIN so I'm glad that someone is switching these out. --Gmaxwell 22:08, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

You are most welcome! Some editors will probably also be annoyed. I'm finding that I do need to leave ASINs for AV material, such as here. Keesiewonder 22:16, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Fact template

Hi, {{Fact}} needs a date= parameter. Was that what you meant? Rich Farmbrough, 23:04 30 March 2007 (GMT).

Sorted (for that article). Special behaviour of infobox. Rich Farmbrough, 10:57 1 April 2007 (GMT).

Doug Skinner

I've edited the entry but wanted you to have a look over it before I remove the various tags. (Emperor 20:42, 31 March 2007 (UTC))

OK cool. Tags have been removed. (Emperor 00:10, 2 April 2007 (UTC))

Science Collaboration of the Month

You voted for Infrared and this article is now the current Science Collaboration of the Month!
Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ideal Misplaced Pages science article.

NCurse work 19:45, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Open solicitation for input/advice

Hello! There's been some recent activity getting the ball rolling at WikiProject Journalism, and if you'd like to join us, I'm sure your input would be valued. In particular, User:Wiki Wistah has proposed a guideline for editing articles about newspapers, and although I've responded with comments of my own, WW rightly suggested that it should be more than just a two-way conversation. I've noticed some of your own edits on related matters and thought you might be interested. Any suggestions would certainly be appreciated. Otherwise, if this is not of interest to you, or if you've already got a plateful of editing, feel free to ignore this message! -Tobogganoggin 01:55, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

I appologise.

I didn't notice. Thank you for showing me. MichaelJE2 22:32, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

RE:Right behind you...

Thanks, seeing this on my talk page probably gave me a jump start on you though. Stardust8212 23:34, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Archimedes Plutonium: COI issue

Hi Keesie. Do you have an idea of what to do with this article? Postings on the COI board sometimes linger because no-one can figure out what to do with them. I see that you tried to improve the sources of this article. The editor is misbehaving, but not outrageously. There may be a couple of options:

(a) Push back against the weak sourcing of the article. *Literal* application of WP:EL and other standards might cause the sources to be decimated, which would lead to removal of some of the content which could no longer be referenced. (Note that The Dartmouth's web site isn't working at the moment, and the newsgroup links don't open for me). I accept the verdict of the AfD that he is notable enough for Misplaced Pages. Trawling through Google might bring up some better material (but I imagine you've tried that already). Usenet postings not by AP himself probably can't be used as a factual reference about him.
(b) Ask for a user conduct RFC on AP himself.
(c) Any other ideas?

We could try to negotiate with AP to get him to abstain from editing the article, but the sourcing is so flimsy right now it's hard to argue that it's a good article. (Plus, except for you and one or two others, it doesn't seem that much energy is being put into improving it). If there's no simple remedy, the COI noticeboard may decide to close the issue and ask people to try dispute resolution. EdJohnston 04:09, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Lutheranism

The WikiProject Lutheranism Collaboration Project is under way. Please help improve this month's article, or make a suggestion for next month's article. To add the collaboration banner to your userpage or talk page, use {{Lutheran COTM}}. -- Pastordavid 19:29, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

New article: Reindeer hunting in Greenland

I have finally gone public with my new article:

-- Fyslee/talk 07:50, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Iceland Newsletter

May 2007
Latest Announcements & Discussions Welcome to the first instalment of the WikiProject Iceland Newsletter! The main aim of this newsletter is to keep you informed of the goings-on in the Iceland WikiProject, so that you can help use improve our articles!

Our New Look
As you may or may not have noticed, our project page has recently had an overhaul, please give us feedback and suggestions as to how we can improve it and you can decide what content goes on the page!

Icelandic language
The Icelandic language article has been nominated for the Article Creation and Improvement Drive. Please vote for the article so that we can get it up to FA!

Needed Articles You can help us out by starting any of the following articles:
To unsubscribe to this newsletter, please sign your name in the appropriate section here.

Science Collaboration of the month

You voted for X-ray crystallography and this article is now the current Science Collaboration of the Month!
Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ideal Misplaced Pages science article.

NCurse work 21:07, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Barnstars

Please offer your opinion on the two proposed Barnstars for WikiProject Lutheranism. Pastor David (Review) 18:19, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Icelandic language

Please show your support for WikiProject Iceland by voting for the Icelandic language article for the Article Creation and Improvement Drive! To place your vote, please click here!
Max Naylor 09:52, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Any chance of your help?

It looks like you're not very active any more :(. I hope you're well, that's the main thing. If you ever do look in again, I wonder if you could help with what seems like a very difficult ISBN search. User:Awadewit, who I think will shortly bring this article to FAC, has asked for help in finding this one at Talk:Sarah Trimmer#Various and sundry. The only person I know with the investigating skills for this is yourself. I'd appreciate your help; but don't worry if you don't feel like it. Cheers. qp10qp 23:16, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Oh, Ed Johnston has had a look at it and it seems a dead end for ISBNs. You sound slightly down :( is it colleagues or the work? I do remember it's not so long since you moved before. I hope it sorts itself out. (If you need to talk, just e-mail; I'm a good listener.) At least you haven't been on the Martin Luther page recently, which would have taken a few years off your life, believe me. (I've retired from that graveyard of hopes permanently, for my own sanity, what I have left of it.) Thanks for responding! qp10qp 01:27, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Iceland Newsletter

May 2007
Latest Announcements & Discussions Welcome to the first instalment of the WikiProject Iceland Newsletter! The main aim of this newsletter is to keep you informed of the goings-on in the Iceland WikiProject, so that you can help use improve our articles!

Our New Look
As you may or may not have noticed, our project page has recently had an overhaul, please give us feedback and suggestions as to how we can improve it and you can decide what content goes on the page!

Icelandic language
The Icelandic language article has been nominated for the Article Creation and Improvement Drive. Please vote for the article so that we can get it up to FA!

Needed Articles You can help us out by starting any of the following articles:
To unsubscribe to this newsletter, please sign your name in the appropriate section here.

// ENewsBot on behalf of Max Naylor 21:01, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Iceland Newsletter

June 2007
Latest Announcements & Discussions Proposals
May Newsletter · To unsubscribe to this newsletter, please sign your name in the appropriate section here. Delivered by ENewsBot.

Delivered by ENewsBot 06:19, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Science Collaboration of the Month

You voted for Nuclear magnetic resonance and this article is now the current Science Collaboration of the Month!
Please help to improve it to match the quality of an ideal Misplaced Pages science article.

NCurse work 19:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Majic photo

Hello Keesiewonder, I certainly wasn`t expecting any photo from my flickr site to be used on wikipedia,so when Majic`s photo turned up,I was rather taken aback.Please could you credit the photographer with his name under the photo?It is the owner,D.Lindsay.I don`t want him to think I am taking any credit for his work!!!!!I have removed the photo from my site until I have put his name on it. I have one of his puppies,she is also on my Flickr site.I have had kees for over 20 years now,and it`s good to see a rather special girl on such a well known site as wikipedia.

Hoping you can help me,keeskerfuffel

FYI, I've passed this on to the user who I believe posted the photo. Here is a link to the note I left. Keesiewonder 21:04, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Philately WikiProject

You are listed as a participant in the Philately WikiProject. Today I have created an inactive list consisting of those participants who have not made any philatelic edits for more than six months. I was going to use a 3 month cut off point but felt generous. You may be one of those editors, so if I have moved you and you want to remain an active participant, please forgive me, and move your name back from the inactive list to the active list. If you are still active on Misplaced Pages but are inactive in philately I hope there is no harm done in listing you as inactive. We really need more active participants for all philatelic articles. The Philately Portal has been running for some time and I am doing occasional updates, Postage stamps of Ireland is a candidate for featured article (that would be the first philatelic article), and several of the redlinks have been filled but we need more activity so if you are around please participate. Otherwise thanks for the work you have done in the past. Cheers ww2censor 00:28, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Iceland Newsletter

July 2007
Latest Announcements and Discussions
  • Unfortunately renewable energy in Iceland failed its featured article candidature. You can still help improve the article, and help to get it up to FA standard!
  • Last month we welcomed three new members to WikiProject Iceland.
  • The Icelandic language article was the ACID article for last week. The article now includes sound samples and a text extract.
 Proposals
May Newsletter · June Newsletter

→ To unsubscribe from this newsletter, please remove your name from the spamlist · Delivered by ENewsBot · 04:14, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

note to self

I have a strong theory about connections.

Sheerness‎ FAC

Hi. I'm sorry to bother you, but as a LoCE member, I just wondered if you would be willing to have a look through the Sheerness‎ article. It is currently a Featured Article Candidate and needs a copy-edit for grammar by someone who hasn't yet seen it. Any other ways to improve the article would also be welcome. Thank you very much, if you can. Epbr123 17:48, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

WP:CVU status

The Misplaced Pages:Counter-Vandalism Unit project is under consideration to be moved to {{inactive}} and/or {{historical}} status. Another proposal is to delete or redirect the project. You have been identified as a project member and your input as to this matter would be welcomed at WT:CVU#Inactive.3F and at the deletion debate. Thank you! Delivered on behalf of xaosflux 16:03, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Old message

Hi I noticed a message in my archives that I had not replied to about this edit. (Kingboyk had said it was probably a bug.) The answer is that the template was transitioning from default parameter to a named parameter, all the dated clean up tags now use "date=". Rgds, Rich Farmbrough, 09:16 28 August 2007 (GMT).

Academic Journals project

Hi, a journals project has been launched at Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Academic Journals; please drop in and share your thoughts on how Misplaced Pages can improve in this area. John Vandenberg 15:54, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Clinical trial

Hi. I've been working a lot on the Clinical trial page. In the Talk you mentioned that medical devices must be tested in several phases before approval. As this is outside the scope of my knowledge, can you check out the page and make any additions you feel are necessary? ThanksSofia Roberts 14:35, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Dartmouth College

WikiProject Dartmouth College

As a current or past contributor to a related article -- or an alumnus/na of the College -- I thought I'd let you know about WikiProject Dartmouth College, a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of the Dartmouth College. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks and related articles. Thanks! Dylan 19:38, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

T-DNA

I saw you had voted for T-DNA as MCB collaboration of the month back in 2006. I started an article in place of the redirect, so just wanted to let you know in case you want to get involved. Thanks! - tameeria (talk) 18:48, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

League of Copyeditors roll call

Greetings from the League of Copyeditors. Your name is listed on our members page, but we are unsure how many of the people listed there are still active contributors to the League's activities. If you are still interested in participating in the work of the League, please follow the instructions at the members page to add your name to the active members list. Once you have done that, you might want to familiarise yourself with the new requests system, which has replaced the old /proofreading subpage. As the old system is now deprecated, the main efforts of the League should be to clear the substantial backlog which still exists there.
The League's services are in as high demand as ever, as evinced by the increasing backlog on our requests pages, both old and new. While FA and GA reviewers regularly praise the League's contributions to reviewed articles, we remain perennially understaffed. Fulfilling requests to polish the prose of Misplaced Pages's highest-profile articles is a way that editors can make a very noticeable difference to the appearance of the encyclopedia. On behalf of the League, if you do consider yourself to have left, I hope you will consider rejoining; if you consider yourself inactive, I hope you will consider returning to respond to just one request per week, or as many as you can manage. Merry Christmas and happy editing, The League of Copyeditors.

Merge Proposal

There is a discussion going on about whether or not to merge WikiProject Dogs and WikiProject Dog breeds together. Your input would be greatly appreciated. Coaster1983 (talk) 18:23, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Martin Bucer up for Featured Article Review

I just wanted to let you know that you can cast your vote of "support" or "oppose" to the Martin Bucer article as a potential featured article at Misplaced Pages:Featured_article_candidates/Martin_Bucer#Martin_Bucer. Thanks! --Epiphyllumlover--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 21:42, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

translation dispute

There is a discussion going on whether the name of that German church body can be translated or not (it appears like this on the english pages of this church's homepage). One user changed the name of this Church (actually a federation of several Lutheran, United and Reformed churches) and it's regional member churches to the German form because he says their names can't get translated. so the article on the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Bavaria now appears under its German name because he says the "concept" can't be translated into English. Please go to the discusson page of the Evangelical Church in Germany and have your say --93.130.249.56 (talk) 02:05, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Survey

Hi Keesie!

I have put together a survey for female editors of Misplaced Pages (and related projects) in order to explore, in greater detail, women's experiences and roles within the Wikimedia movement. It'd be wonderful if you could participate!

It's an independent survey, done by me, as a fellow volunteer Wikimedian. It is not being done on behalf of the Wikimedia Foundation. I hope you'll participate!

Just click this link to participate in this survey, via Google!

Any questions or concerns, feel free to email me or stop by my user talk page. Also, feel free to share this any other female Wikimedians you may know. It is in English, but any language Wikimedia participants are encouraged to participate. I appreciate your contributions - to the survey and to Misplaced Pages! Thank you! SarahStierch (talk) 05:29, 28 September 2011 (UTC)

Ichthus: January 2012


ICHTHUS

January 2012

In this issue...

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Misplaced Pages • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here

Seamus (dog)

Seamus (dog), an article which is part of WikiProject Dogs has been proposed for deletion. Feel free to join the discussion. Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Seamus (dog) (2nd nomination) HHIAdm (talk) 21:27, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

WikiWomen's Collaborative

WikiWomen Unite!
Hi Keesiewonder! Women around the world who edit and contribute to Misplaced Pages are coming together to celebrate each other's work, support one another, and engage new women to also join in on the empowering experience of shaping the sum of all the world's knowledge - through the WikiWomen's Collaborative.

As a WikiWoman, we'd love to have you involved! You can do this by:

We can't wait to have you involved, and feel free to drop by our meta page (under construction) to see how else you can get involved!

Can't wait to have you involved! SarahStierch (talk) 04:31, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

WikiWomen's Collaborative: Come join us (and check out our new website)!

WikiWomen - We need you!
Hi Keesiewonder! The WikiWomen's Collaborative is a group of women from around the world who edit Misplaced Pages, contribute to its sister projects, and support the mission of free knowledge. We recently updated our website, created new volunteer positions, and more!

Get involved by:

  • Visiting our website for resources, events, and more
  • Meet other women and share your story in our profile space
  • Participate at and "like" our Facebook group
  • Join the conversation on our Twitter feed
  • Reading and writing for our blog channel
  • Volunteer to write for our blog, recruit blog writers, translate content, and co-run our Facebook and receive perks for volunteering
  • Already participating? Take our survey and share your experience!

Thanks for editing Misplaced Pages, and we look forward to you being a part of the Collaborative! -- EdwardsBot (talk) 01:16, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!

Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Misplaced Pages arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:20, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

ArbCom 2019 election voter message

Hello! Voting in the 2019 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 on Monday, 2 December 2019. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Misplaced Pages arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2019 election, please review the candidates and submit your choices on the voting page. If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{NoACEMM}} to your user talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 00:08, 19 November 2019 (UTC)

== Just copy the source code and paste it on the talk page of the user you wish to invite.

This user has been invited WikiProject Prussia please consider checking us out.

==

Kaiser Kitkat (talk) (:

Proposed deletion of Council of Docked Breeds

Notice

The article Council of Docked Breeds has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

WP:NOTDIRECTORY and no WP:SIGCOV by independent sources

While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion.