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I'm leaving Misplaced Pages for a while in protest

Giano, one of our best editors has finally been driven away from Misplaced Pages, and I've decided to stop editing for a month to protest the poor treatment he has received, and the editorial climate that has allowed this. You could say I am on strike, à la mode (and no that doesn't mean "with ice cream"):

• … I simply can't imagine the amount of disrespect, unilateralism, and pettiness that has been par in the last week or two being tolerated. I have no other way, since I believe in achieving consensus, respecting the minority voices, and never trying to force my will on others, to show my displeasure aside from this. It isn't a storming away. It is a strike. Geogre,

Some things that have bothered me:

• Carnildo's most recent RfA and repromotion against consensus.

• Tony Sidaway's block of Ghirlandajo for his "defiant response" here.

• The RFARB against Ghirlandajo.

• Tony Sidaway's block of Giano for being "hysterical".

ALoan expresses my thoughts well:

• … marked decrease in tolerance … I am no longer sure I know what consensus is, nor that I can trust the ArbCom and the bureaucrats to do the "right" thing. … it now seems to be a blockable offence to fully and frankly (but civilly) exchange views, or to disagree with certain admins, particularly if that disagreement is expressed in forceful (but civil) terms, and that the rules seem to change when it suits the people making the rules. ,

I encourage everyone to use my page for a constructive conversation concerning the above, and the current state of affairs on our 'pedia. I'll check back in a month. Regards all. Paul August ☎ 17:43, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

You have my support

People who don't even know where the articles come from are deciding that their egos' needs are greater than community, consent, consensus, and common sense, are deciding that their private beliefs are superior to the negotiated rules of the site, and are deciding that they know better than all others. For that, they deserve no articles, no input, no debate, no conversation, and no more than the isolation of their self-congratulations and self-adulation. My own strike was a labor action, and I agree with others with the same impulse. Pretty boxes and category tags and stub parades will never take the place of people willing to put their professional-level work on a volunteer project. And, if we were all replaced tomorrow, the replacements, like scabs, would soon join the desertion unless conditions were to change. Geogre 17:52, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

You have good points Paul. Carnildo should not have been promoted the way he was (if at all), and Tony is not one of our best admins. I can't comment anything on Giano, as I am unfamiliar with the case.

If the current trend continues, I would also consider bailing out. So far I am left with the hope that these are just a few irregularities in an otherwise rather well-behaving community (and I think that irregularities have happened in the past too, and the ArbCom/Jimobo have taken pretty good care of the worst ones). (I hope I am right :) Good luck. Hope you come back. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 18:01, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

I endorse the view that things are messed up around here. Carnildo's RfA was a travesty, and there is nothing I can say about Tony Sidaway's behavior of late that doesn't infringe WP:NPA. —Bunchofgrapes (talk) 18:13, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Agreed on both counts. I'm not sure that there's anything that could be said that wouldn't be seen by the subject as a hysterical public attack. Uh-oh, BoG, we might both be blocked now. •Jim62sch• 18:28, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Fuck! Hope your back from your strike soon. --Salix alba (talk) 18:51, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Good luck with your break. I can't stop you going, but I think I am staying for the time being, in an effort to try to counterbalance the prevailing idiocy. I think Geogre's WP:IAA must be the way forward. Please come back in a month - enough good people have left already. -- ALoan (Talk) 19:05, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

I understand your decision Paul, and I also am worried by what's being done to some of our very best editors. Like ALoan and all of us, neither I can stop you from going; but I can pray you to return when the month is past, for the project would be a bleaker place without a man like you.--Aldux 21:12, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

I hope you'll return soon, Paul. SlimVirgin 13:38, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Ah, so this is where the party is; I feel a little out of place in the illustrious company here, but I feel compelled to post here after the singularly unpleasant experience of reading over the administrators' noticeboard and several other pages just now. Talented, committed writers are the heart of this project, especially now as issues of quality, not quantity, become paramount, and without them we cannot move forward. This whole episode is very discouraging, but hopefully something worthwhile can come out of it. Come back Paul, in a month or sooner; the ideal of a great 💕 still deserves all of our efforts, and this project is too valuable to abandon. --Robth 15:36, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm in full sympathy with Paul August's action, and yet I know it will pass quite unnoticed by Misplaced Pages's self-involved "administrators". There needs to be some kind of "sunset law", by which administrators must be "re-certified" at the end of a period: every two years at the most. --Wetman 17:53, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Enjoy your break, and I hope we'll see you back around in a few weeks. I can't say that I entirely agree with you - Giano and Ghirlandjo both badly needed to cool it and weren't getting the message, but at the same time, they're both good editors, and I'm fed up with people being needlessly provocative towards generally good people. Rebecca 23:26, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Email

FYI, I've sent you an email. JoshuaZ 18:24, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Mathematics

You will be missed on Mathematics, where I think you have helped to successfully achieve consensus as we improve the article. Stephen B Streater 18:58, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Email

I've also sent you an Email.--CSTAR 19:56, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

As have I. (Though the Misplaced Pages e-mail tends to be slow and unreliable at times...) Mindspillage (spill yours?) 17:34, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

CfD

Paul, check this out: bunix 01:59, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm back, and thanks

Hi all, I'm back from my "strike". Thanks for all the kind words above. Looks like I missed a lot of things while I was gone. Giano's reincarnation, Tony and Kelly's various resignations, Geogre's proposed de-sysopping by Fred … I hardly know what to say. Paul August ☎ 21:39, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Welcome back, anyway. Charles Matthews 22:11, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Charles. Paul August ☎ 22:13, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

It is good to see you back. I trust you had a good break? -- ALoan (Talk) 23:31, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Just ducky, thanks. Paul August ☎ 01:03, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

What, you were gone? ;-)

Welcome back. FYI, we just lost Chris Hillman, who finally gave up for good. There's been no sign of Lethe activity in weeks. It appears that Charles Matthews, having failed to win a seat on the board, has discovered renewed enthusiasm for editing. If you like geometry mixed with computer science, you may welcome editor David Eppstein (of Geometry Junkyard fame), who has decided to dip his toes in the Misplaced Pages water. Emeritus professor Vaughan Pratt has complete his first major Misplaced Pages contribution, an extended article on Boolean algebras canonically defined.

A pretty little animation of Villarceau circles has won a featured picture slot, as has an animation depicting pi.

I'm disgruntled, as usual, from an excess of boneheaded editors and boneheaded policies, and from a scarcity of interesting questions on the reference desk. Maybe I'll try a Wikibreak myself, when I finish up a couple of projects. --KSmrq 11:24, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Nice to know I was missed K ;-) Thanks for the updates. Sorry to see that Chris finally left. And I hope Lethe hasn't. Otherwise it sounds like some good things (as usual) are going on. I noticed though you left out that 0.999… is now an FA. Is that contributing to your disgruntlement? Is there anything I can do to make you more gruntled? I won't stoop to asking interesting questions on the reference desk though. — Regards Paul August ☎ 12:23, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Did it win FA? I took that page off my watch list when many of the sane editors went on holiday or break or disappeared, and events in real life consumed most of my time and emotional energy. With Melchoir making scores of edits a day, and ganging up with Mets501 to threaten me with a block for 3RR if I objected, I decided to “cut and run”, leaving the field to the terrorists. But it saddened me greatly, and I fear it sets a bad precendent that will only embolden the forces of darkness.

An article targeted at a specific objective has turned into a sprawling monstrosity, most of whose references are redundant or useless and most of whose content belongs in a general discussion of number systems, especially the reals. There are now mathematical and other errors (in the intro, no less), chaotic organization, and language and concepts inaccessible to the original audience. I cannot imagine a typical schoolchild or curious adult will benefit. Instead of understanding, they will be left with intimidation.

As for getting gruntled, I'm sure a trip to Santorini would do wonders. It would remind me that Misplaced Pages has not (yet) gone the way of the Minoan civilization after the Thera eruption, and I'd love to sample the wine, food, and dancing, not to mention the sunsets and other attractions. :-)

Anyway, I suspect the mathematics community remains one of the happier segments of Misplaced Pages, and perhaps we can still have a little fun and do a little good. --KSmrq 11:46, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Glad to se you're back. No it is not a re-incarnation just the same old me - exactly the same in fact. Not a lot has changed. Tell me do you play bridge or poker, I am mentally dividing people up these days - I suspect, like me, you are a bridge player. Giano 20:17, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Giano, welcome back to you too. Yup I play bridge. I was a fairly serious player in my college days, way back when. By the way, I recently had an Italian volcanic adventure. I went up Vesuvio, Mamma Etna, and Stromboli. So I now see where your fiery Sicilian temperament comes from. Paul August ☎ 20:59, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Are those two sets necessarily disjoint? -- ALoan (Talk) 21:23, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Being a poker player — also in my college days — as well as a mathematician I can say with authority that they are not. Paul August ☎ 21:39, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

One bluffs and one calculates; no my temperament is not fiery at all, it is cool calm and collected at all times. Hope you had an interesting holday Paul, and found time to look at some architecture too while you were there. I haven't been to Pompeii for years, do they still show you the atrophied brothel? I remember a school trip to that when I was about 11, we were fascinated, it was the only thing we all wrote about afterwards in detail! Giano 21:45, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes I saw these lovlies (below) at Paestum, as well as the Villa of the Mysteries at Pompeii (I think I've seen the brothel before, don't remember it this time). Paul August ☎ 22:14, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

• Temple of Hera
• Temple of Apollo Temple of Apollo
• Temple of Athena

Glad to see you returned. I hope our paths cross again. -- llywrch 23:09, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. Me too. Paul August ☎ 01:29, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi

Hi, Paul. Bishonen | talk 12:17, 18 October 2006 (UTC).

Hi Bish, How are things? Paul August ☎ 13:13, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Symbol in Subset

Thanks for putting the correct symbol for proper superset in Subset. I'm glad that someone knew where to find it; as my note on the Discussion page said, I was making the best correction that I could in the interim... Pawl 17:30, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome. Paul August ☎ 17:31, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Cleopatra

The info on her alternate deaths was sourced, there was no reason in editing it. The suicide itself is speculation — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.26.131.217 (talk • contribs) 13:53, October 23, 2006 (UTC)

This is the edit I reverted: ). It made several novel assertions about Cleopatra's death, without providing any sources, for those assertions (see WP:V). So I reverted it as "unsourced speculation". If you want to discuss this further the best place to do so is at Talk:Cleopatra_VII_of_Egypt. Regards, Paul August ☎ 15:34, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Today's featured article

Just wanted to let you know a featured article you worked on, 0.999..., was featured today on the Main Page. Tobacman 00:34, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Attalus

Cheers. This gives me the opportunity to congratulate you on that excellent article, which must have taken hours of painstaking work. I knew nothing about the subject in advance (even though I've traipsed round a few Greek ruins in Turkey) and thoroughly enjoyed reading it. qp10qp 15:32, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind words. It took much more work than I'd care to admit. I'm very glad you enjoyed it. Paul August ☎ 15:37, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Vashist Narayan Singh

I believe you wanted to !vote delete, right? ~ trialsanderrors 18:45, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes thanks for catching that and pointing that out to me. Paul August ☎ 18:48, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Paul, can you explain the change from \equiv to = in Analytic signal?

this diff

the two mathematical statements that you changed are true only because of their definition. there is no other reason for equality there other than equivalence. (you can answer here or the article talk page, i'm watching both.) r b-j 22:27, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi r b-j, I've copied your question to talk page, and replied there. Paul August ☎ 17:02, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for reverting the vandal on my page. Hu 02:01, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

You're very welcome. Paul August ☎ 02:03, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Changes on Element (mathematics)

Thanks for editing Element. Really. It's a bit below par, and could a bit of content. However, I noted that you replaced ${\displaystyle \in }$ with ∈. On IE (the browser that I use at school; I use Firefox at home), the latter is displayed as box: it's an unsupported character. So, if you have no objections, I'd like to change it back so that on all browsers, the true symbol is displayed. Is that OK? --Gracenotes § 20:13, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

OK. Paul August ☎ 20:19, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Dionysus

All praise for restoring the lost bit of text (with footnote link) about Prosymnus. Andrew Dalby 15:50, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Aww shucks twern't nothin. Paul August ☎ 16:03, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I've nominated myself for the Arbitration Committee

After some thought, and talking it over with some folks I respect, I've decided to volunteer for ArbCom. You can read my candidate statement. Paul August ☎ 15:14, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but will you be happy there, will you have anything in common with any of them? Giano 15:31, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

I will be happy to be of some help. Are you worried I'll burn out? Yes I know the job is stressful. But I care about our encyclopedia, and I want to serve in the best way I can. If that means a bit of stress, perhaps it's worth it. As for getting along with other members? Yes I am an odd geeky antisocial eccentric old bird who spends half his life staring at a computer screen, having little in common with most other folks. But I count Mindspillage and Theresa Knott as good friends. I hope to have Geogre with me, maybe Filioct will return. I'll survive. Paul August ☎ 16:42, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Oh well then your choice - I may even campaign for you, second thoughts perhaps beter if I don't!!! I suppose I could even nominate myself, now that would put that proverbial cat amongst the pidgeons - I shall think on it, it would at least keep everyone on their toes. :-D Giano 08:30, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Nice candy-date statement, except that I think if you are serious about getting yourself elected then the last sentence is a problem. I appreciate the honesty and the gesture of support for others, but it suggests a vote for you is misplaced. Maybe you can find a better wording.

For me, this would transcend public service and tend to martyrdom. Still, the rare happy ending is highly rewarding, and it's nicer to be a referee than a combatant. Best of luck; you have my support. --KSmrq 09:22, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your support K. Since I would only risk being burned at the stake, in pixels, rather than in the flesh, I remain reasonably sanguine ;-) I would accept it as a personal test of character to be able to maintain a positive attitude under such circumstances. As for my statement of support for fellow candidates Geogre and UnivitedCompany, you are not the only one who thinks it odd (see Questions). So perhaps the last sentence is a problem. I was not trying to convey any hint of my not being serious about my candidacy. I take the ArbCom and being on the ArbCom very seriously. While I am not exactly salivating at the prospect (for the reasons alluded to above), nevertheless, I care deeply about the encyclopedia, I want to serve, the ArbCom plays an important role, and I believe I can help. At the same time however, I also believe there are two candidates who can perhaps help more. Simply put if I were Jimbo and I had to choose only two, out of the three of us, I would choose them. One of the concerns I had while mulling over whether to nominate myself or not, was that I might somehow displace other potencially better candidates. I don't know if any of this is "better" worded. You are a good writer, I would appreciate any suggestions for a better way to express this. Paul August ☎ 17:12, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, I work at writing well, though sometimes it makes me think Prometheus got off easy. Here's one possible rewording:

• "Several excellent editors have volunteered for ArbCom in this election cycle. I would be especially pleased to see User:Geogre and User:UninvitedCompany serve."

Or, say nothing in your candidate statement but add statements of support to their questions page (or other appropriate place). The last sentence of a candidate statement carries special weight, and we want to know who you are and the benefits to us of supporting you. If you keep (some version of) this material, consider moving it and using something else for the last paragraph. --KSmrq 08:01, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

• You know what's weird to me? I tried to make it clear in my own answers, but this isn't a question of either/or. This is about the persons and their outlooks, not about "this is how things must go." Hopefully, we all know that compromise is the thing. I can be adamant about something, but that doesn't mean I'll run over people with a steamroller. Maybe we've had some steam roller drivers before, I don't know. Geogre 16:07, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

ArbCom "Tongue in Cheek" Question" for Paul August

Hi Spartaz. I've answered your Tongue in Cheek Question ;-). Thanks for asking. Paul August ☎ 20:55, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thank you. Your response made me smile out loud. :) Spartaz 20:57, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

;-) Paul August ☎ 21:01, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

65.164.168.38

You recently blocked 65.164.168.38 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log) (about 15 seconds ahead of me). Should we go back and look at his previous "contributions" to see if they've all been caught? (I don't want to duplicate effort.) — Arthur Rubin | (talk) 19:34, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

There are not that many. I'd be happy to look at them. Paul August ☎ 19:37, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

OK, I've looked at all of the IP's edits. I've reverted a couple, all the others were reverted by other editors. Paul August ☎ 20:07, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Jason's dubious edits

Hi Paul. Just writing to say that the 'dubious edits' on the Jason article did not seem dubious to this user. Can you please elaborate? Solipsist3 01:40, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Soliosist3. Well part of my revert was ok. This is the dubious edit I wanted to revert. Thanks for pointing our my mistake. Paul August ☎ 02:22, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks very much for being so obliging and helpful, Paul, however I must point out that you spelt my name wrong above. Solipsist3 is not tolerant of typos. Solipsist3 06:24, 4 December 2006 (UTC) Further to this case, Solipsist3 has decided after a late night emergency meeting that Paul August's name shall be added to the prestigious and exclusive list of Best Friends that appears on Solipsist3's user page. Solipsist3 hopes that Paul August is appropriately humbled by this honour. Solipsist3 06:45, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry for the typo and this belated reply, I've only just noticed yours above. Indeed I am most honored to be so designated, it is always nice to be befriended. Regards, Paul August ☎ 17:43, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

Self-link in recursion

Hello, I put that self-link in Recursion because I thought it was funny - nobody objected on the talk page. Several serious encyclopedias have this in the see also-section - why can't we? :) - basically, it was intentional, nobody seemed to mind, can you please put it back? toresbe 23:31, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Toresbe. Sorry I never saw your comment on the talk page. I'll leave a reply there. Paul August ☎ 23:47, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, I've edited the talk page now. I will pend on your approval, as written. toresbe 00:12, 27 November 2006 (UTC) -- Just a reminder, I've updated the talk page now. Will you please give your thoughts? Regards, toresbe 03:01, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

I've done so. Paul August ☎ 04:05, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

ArbCom questions

Hi. I'm Ral315, editor of the Misplaced Pages Signpost. We're doing a series on ArbCom candidates, and your response is requested.

1. What positions do you hold (adminship, mediation, etc.)?

2. Why are you running for the Arbitration Committee?

3. Have you been involved in any arbitration cases? In what capacity?

Please respond on my talk page. We'll probably go to press late Monday or early Tuesday (UTC), but late responses will be added as they're submitted. Thanks, Ral315 (talk) 01:59, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Filter

Hi Paul,

As you've noticed, I'm on a tear through general topology, which was going well, until I went to revise/merge/update filter (mathematics), when I stumbled on a very simple conceptual issue. Could you look at the talk page, and tell me what I'm doing wrong? linas 16:13, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Linas. Well I've read your comment but I agree with Zundark, I don't see the problem. Every superset of any element of a filter is also an element of the filter. Paul August ☎ 16:44, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Can you say why it is "bad" that: ${\displaystyle U=(-0.5,1.5)\cup (x-\epsilon ,x+\epsilon )}$ is an element of the filter, for any x and epsilon...? Paul August ☎ 16:48, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Nabokov

• "Of course, it would have been unseemly for a monarch to appear in the robes of learning at a university lectern and present to rosy youths Finnigan's Wake as a monstrous extension of Angus MacDiarmid's "incoherent transactions" and of Southey's Lingo-Grande. . ." (Pale Fire , 76).

I assume this is what Filiocht had in mind. I would so love to put this in as a footnote and not even mention it's being fiction (and utter nonsense). . . I do think it conveys Nabokov's opinion pretty well. What do you think? Chick Bowen 20:29, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Chick. Well the passage that contains the Pale Fire ref is problematic for various reasons (it wasn't added by Filiocht by the way). It is out of place in a paragraph that begins "Joyce's influence is also evident in fields other than literature.", it duplicates the intent of the "in Nobokov's case … " passage just above, and I don't see where Nabokov "listed" it as "one of the 20th century's greatest prose works". So I think we should simply cut that part and merge the rest, with the previous remark above. I'll do that now. As for reflecting Nabokov's opinion of the Wake, I don't see a problem with citing that amusing Pale Fire quote, but I think there are plenty of other sources as well. Paul August ☎ 20:54, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good, and yes, you're right about the redunancy. There is something in Strong Opinions, I think, but I can't lay my hands on it right now. But it's not nearly as fun as the Pale Fire bit. By the way, I think that James Joyce Ramble image probably should go--I don't think it's really adding anything. Chick Bowen 21:03, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes I agree about the Ramble. Paul August ☎ 21:12, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Hello from a random user

I believe you would (will) make an excellent member of the arbitration committee. They are very short-staffed, and (I believe) a bit frazzled. I have little experience on Misplaced Pages in relation to your own, but in my humble opinion the presence of an editor such as your self would be greatly appreciated and sorely needed. Happy Editing! NinaEliza 05:32, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Nina, thanks for your kind words. Paul August ☎ 05:49, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Well that's embarrassing

(hangs head, and makes appointment with eye doctor). Chick Bowen 01:10, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

;-) Paul August ☎ 01:15, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Portfolio for ArbCom

On Misplaced Pages:Arbitration Committee Elections December 2006/Summary table, I added a column "Examples" with links that exhibit a candidate's arbitration skills. My motivation is that as a voter, I don't want to just rely on a candidate's words, but also see their actions. Moreover, I believe a portfolio of "model cases" to remember in difficult situations can be useful for each candidate, as well.

I entered one case, in which I was involved, you may want to check if this expresses what you feel is a model case. While you're gone, I will also go through your questions page and see if I can find more there. — Sebastian (talk) 00:24, 4 December 2006 (UTC)    (Please reply on this page.)

Well, when you get back ...

When you get back, you'll find two unanswered questions from me on your ArbCom question and answers page. Please have a look. --Cyde Weys 17:55, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Cyde. I've just now returned from a long trip. I'm exhausted, jet lagged, hungry, need a shower and a drink, have a suitcase full of dirty close, unopened packages, piles of mail, very full email inbox, recorded telephone messages, hungry cats, … well you get the idea. I will answer your questions as soon as time and circumstances allow. Regards, Paul August ☎ 01:16, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Paul! I read your reply. You know, you were my favorite candidate and you were the first for whom I voted since I value your levelheadedness. So when you write "Do I still think he would make an excellent arbiter? Yes." it is not what I expected from you. The obvious question is: Why? Geogre's attitude may not have been "vicious", but it violated WP:NPA - a policy that holds for every user, and should be a non-brainer for arbitrators. I agree with the argument "nobody is perfect", and I would sympathize with shrugging this off if he had apologized. But afaik he did not do so, which makes him seem less willing to learn from his mistakes than the average person. How does this qualify for an arbitrator?

Re. the perceived discrepancy between Cyde's two questions: Cyde addressed this here; I can see how this fits together: Cyde wants to avoid situations like the one we witness here. One way to do so is to ask candidates not to endorse or unnecessarily comment on other candidates. — Sebastian 23:25, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Note

Hi Paul, just to let you know that you reserve the right not to answer the questions. I recommend that you refer to this, this and this for some context first. - Best regards, Mailer Diablo 15:40, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Mailer. Oh dear, perhaps I ought to go away again. I see that there are things needing looking into, I just don't have the gumption at the moment (see my response to Cyde above). Thanks, and my best regards too, Paul August ☎ 02:29, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

• Please take your time, no rush here. :) - Cheers, Mailer Diablo 04:41, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

You got my "vote"

Since I posted these questions en masse, I'm probably going to "vote" en masse as well. I admire your candor. NinaEliza 00:04, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Heracles

Thank you for restoring the "foreign language" links deleted by User:68.190.89.38, who treads the borderline of vandalism. --Wetman 06:47, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Well thanks for the thanks, but it is Hectorian, who I believe deserves the credit. Best regards, Paul August ☎ 06:58, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

ArbCom Elections

Hi there, my name is Neille and I'm a producer at a public radio show called Weekend America. We're doing a piece on the ArbCom elections and would love to chat with you as a front runner if you have a few minutes today or tomorrow. Thanks! I'm at: nilel (at) marketplace (dot) org Neille i 19:49, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Neille. Sure we can chat, anytime. Paul August ☎ 19:56, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

I see someone has contacted User:Giano II as well. Can we have a link to a transcript after it happens, please :) -- ALoan (Talk) 12:55, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes that would be nice. Paul August ☎ 15:00, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

How did it go? Blnguyen (bananabucket) 06:05, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I declined to participate in the show, so I don't know anymore about it. Paul August ☎ 06:18, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Big O notation

I noticed that you deleted the alternate definitions an anon (156.56.70.58) added to the page. These definitions were incorrect so I'm glad you removed them. I thought it was best to have alternate exists-forall definitions for all of the entries, though, so I added some to the article. This is just a heads-up: the definitions I added aren't the same as the anon's. CRGreathouse (t | c) 08:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi CRGreathouse. Yes the anon's definitions were clearly incorrect. Your defs left out |g(x)|, I've fixed them. Regards, Paul August ☎ 16:53, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the correction. As for auto-signing, I'm not sure what you mean. "~~~~" produces "CRGreathouse (t | c) 17:13, 13 December 2006 (UTC)" and "~~~" produces "CRGreathouse (t | c)" for me (and presumably something similar for you, without the t|c), but I imagine you already knew that since you signed your post above. If you mean customizing it, you can do that by clicking on "my preferences" at the top mid-right of your screen. CRGreathouse (t | c) 17:13, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Edit: Perhaps you mean the 'unsigned' notice, which is {{unsigned}}.

When I left my comment on your talkpage, I forgot to sign my message. But then It was signed automatically for me. Take a look at your History page. Paul August ☎ 17:19, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Looks like a bot that is automatically signing for users all across the encyclopedia. Very nifty. As a test, I, Cyde, am leaving this unsigned.

Yes, I like it to, but it doesn't seem to always work :( Paul August ☎ 18:24, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Not sure why the 'bot didn't pick Cyde's edit up, but here - User:HagermanBot - is an explanation of what it signs or not. Newyorkbrad 18:28, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Hrmm, it looks like the bot hasn't been running for over an hour now. Maybe it malfunctioned, or its owner shut it off? --Cyde Weys 19:11, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

HagermanBot does not sign any comments that have links to User or User talk space, and your unsigned comment above had just such a link. NoSeptember 04:33, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Test of HagermanBot

Test (not signed)

Try again (test)

Loyalty and ArbCom recusal

The issue of loyalty to friends and the question of whether I would recuse in an ArbCom case in which I had a conflict of interest, has come up on my vote page. Ii seems like a good idea for me to respond here:

I would like to assure everyone that I most certainly would recuse. Yes I have developed some very wonderful Wiki-friendships. (Who knows, perhaps one day with you ;-)) I am loyal to those to the extent that I am willing to go the extra mile, during rush hour traffic, detour, get lost, seek alternate routes", fix a flat, run out of gas, and hitch hike to wherever I'm needed. However none of this extends to my judgments about what is best for Misplaced Pages. In my view, the encyclopedia always comes first.

Paul August ☎ 18:55, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Loyalty and ArbCom

I said that because I feel that loyalty is something that is rarely tested and yet plays a critical role in how we act. Your endorsement of Geogre and UninvitedCompany raised quite a few eyebrows, and when closely questioned on it you claimed neither one was particularly controversial. At least a few people decided then and there that while you were an excellent editor and fairminded you might not be totally impartial.

I'd like to expand this, so that you don't get the wrong idea, or think that I disrepect you or your viewpoint. One thing I'm very firm about, no matter how long I'll be at Misplaced Pages, is that I shouldn't be an admin. The primary reason for that isn't my incivility, or my tendancy to sarcasm and irony, but rather my loyalty and inability to act in an impartial manner. I take it so far as to not touch articles on medical care, Neverwinter Nights, the PRC, or any other topic where I have both personal expertese and a strong opinion. I would never try to mediate between a friend on Wiki and another user, either.

Taking this back to my vote, I feel that your loyalty to your friends is admirable. If you trust Geogre and UninvitedCompany, if you feel they are better qualified and agree with their platforms, then I am glad you are brave enough to say that publically, and that you value your friendship with them over the votes it might have cost you, unlike some people who would have backpedaled on such a thing. However, that type of loyalty does not eagerly lend itself to impartiality. While I appreciate the fact you would recuse yourself in a case where you felt you had a conflict of interest, I'm unable to vote support since I don't know if you would recognize such as a conflict of interest. You seem a very calm, uncontroversial man with calmly held opinions and a desire to help improve Misplaced Pages, and I don't know how well you would handle things if one of your friends got hounded out of Misplaced Pages and backstabbed like MONGO is now.

I appreciate your comment and honesty, apologize for the length of this comment, and hope you accept this in the good faith I write it in. Good luck in your election effort.

--Elaragirl 19:09, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Elaragirl, Thanks for your very thoughtful post and your kind words.

As a human being and a mathematician, I have to admit that you are correct, I am not totally impartial, but I sincerely hope and believe I am impartial enough, to be a good member of ArbCom. Ultimately this is for other people to judge. However, If you mean that folks who have no attachments to people or ideas make the best judges — I take your point — but I'm not sure I can agree.

You might also want to consider the possibility that any mistaken judgments I might have, may have more to do with my ignorance than my partiality (I know out of the frying pan into the fire!).

By the way, for the record, a couple of things. First, I've had virtually no personal contact with UninvitedCompany. And second, the reason I have not, as you say "backpedaled", is out honesty not loyalty.

Anyway I appreciate your response, and I most certainly do accept your good faith. I respect other opinions and will think about what you've said. Thanks again.

Paul August ☎ 21:43, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Template:Ent

I appreciate you fixing the use of rf/ent in infinity but I was sorta hoping to use that as a test bed. It's the only article I've found that has spaces in the template calls *and* more than one note. Glad someone is handling this. Gimmetrow 06:00, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Well it is easy enough to create a test page. Paul August ☎ 06:03, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

True, and I have done that. But it would be better in the long run to handle the leading spaces in the template. I think I have the solution for that. Gimmetrow 06:21, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Ares

Sorry if you thought I was vandalizing Ares. My intent was to break apart the section into two paragraphs, which I just did. Please do not hesistate to tell me if this edit shouldn't be done. s d 3 1 4 1 5 final exams! 23:49, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

I didn't think that you were vandalizing the page. Rather I supposed you were just trying to remove what you thought (mistakenly} to be an extraneous right parenthesis. Paul August ☎ 01:14, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Happy holidays!

Thanks! And to you. Paul August ☎ 19:08, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Mathematics and God

I've added the "{{prod}}" template to the article Mathematics and God, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but I don't believe it satisfies Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion, and I've explained why in the deletion notice (see also "What Misplaced Pages is not" and Misplaced Pages's deletion policy). Please either work to improve the article if the topic is worthy of inclusion in Misplaced Pages, or, if you disagree with the notice, discuss the issues at Talk:Mathematics and God. You may remove the deletion notice, and the article will not be deleted, but note that it may still be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached, or if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria. Ioannes Pragensis 10:53, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Welcome

Hi, and welcome to the History of Greece WikiProject! As you may have guessed, we're a group of editors working to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of topics related to Greek history.

A few features that you might find helpful:

• Our sidebar points to most of the useful pages within the project.
• The Announcements and Open tasks section is updated quite regularly. You can watchlist it if you're interested; or, you can add it directly to your user page by including {{HOGOpenTasks}} there.
• Most important discussions take place on the project's main discussion page; it is recommended that you watchlist it.
• The project has a monthly newsletter; it will normally be delivered as a link, but several other formats are available.

There are a variety of interesting things to do within the project; you're free to participate however much—or little—you like:

• Interested in working on a more complete article? The History of Greece peer review department would welcome your help!
• Interested in a particular area of Greek history? There is already one task force, and you could initiate the creation of more focusing on specific topics or periods.
• Want to know how good our articles are? The assessment department is working on rating the quality of every military history article in Misplaced Pages.

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to any experienced member of the project, and we'll be happy to help you. Again, welcome! We look forward to seeing you around!

WikiProject History of Greece Newsletter - Issue IV - December 2006

The December 2006 issue of the WikiProject History of Greece newsletter has been published.

You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link.

Thank you.--Yannismarou 15:24, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

ArbCom

Congratulations! ;-) SlimVirgin 03:34, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Is it congratulations or condolences? In any case thank you. Paul August ☎ 03:50, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations. I'm very glad you were chosen for the ArbCom, in what has been perhaps the best election yet. You'll make a great arbitrator. Cheers, -Will Beback · † · 11:35, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

• Thanks and best wishes for taking on this demanding role. KillerChihuahua 20:55, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Condolescences, obviously ;-))))) Apart from jokes, I'm really happy you did it, your exactly the type of editors that are needed for the job. Oh, and happy new year! :-))))--Aldux 21:22, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

• Congratulations, and hope you enjoy this new role (despite sometime being a thankless job.) ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 21:15, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks to you all. Will, I hope I live up to your expectations. KC, I will definitely hope for some of those good wishes to come true. Yes Aldux, condolences indeed, but I will try my best, and Buon anno to you too ;-) Jossi, I don't think "enjoy" is the word I'd use, but as in gifts, it's the thought that counts ;-) To all, thanks for your kind words, I hope I am, and continue to be, deserving of them. Any advice, counsel or criticism will be very welcome. If you think I've made a mistake, I want to know. If think I've done a good job, thanks will be much appreciated. I can use all the help I can get. Thanks again, and Buon anno a tutti :) Paul August ☎ 23:33, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations, Paul! Best of luck with ArbCom! =) Nishkid64 23:44, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Oversight

Hello. Congratulations for your election. You now have oversight access on the English-language Misplaced Pages. Please read Misplaced Pages:Oversight before using this feature. Cheers! guillom 10:02, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Paul. In addition, please subscribe to Oversight-l. And congratulations on your new status. Redux 13:13, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations

Or should I say, my sympathies.  :) I just saw the announcement on your appointment to the ArbCom. Wear the hat well. User:Zoe|(talk) 17:10, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

There's a hat?! They haven't seen fit to give me one yet. Are we supposed to buy our own? Thanks Zoe. Paul August ☎ 17:28, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

You might want to make your own out of tin foil.  :) User:Zoe|(talk)

Congrats! Guettarda 18:52, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Guettarda.

Congratulations! Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 17:28, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Oleg. I hope I can count on you and others for some help from time to time, I will need it.Paul August ☎ 17:38, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

What kind of help? Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 05:26, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

All kinds, opinions, advice, relevant arguments, moral support, an occasional joke, a shoulder to cry on, whatever. Paul August ☎

Jokes, eh? Here you go:

• A mathematician wanders home at 3 a.m. His wife explodes, “You’re late! You said you’d be home by 11:45!” The mathematician protests, “I’m right on time. I said I’d be home by a quarter of twelve.”
• Upon his death, the Pope finds himself in a long line at the Gates of Heaven. He steps to the front, announces himself, and is told to wait his turn like everyone else. As he waits, grumbling, he sees a mathematics professor walk up and be shown in immediately. When he goes to protest he is told, “Shhh. That’s God! He thinks he’s a mathematics professor.”
• An engineer, a physicist, and a mathematician find themselves in an anecdote, indeed an anecdote quite similar to many that you have no doubt already heard. After some observations and rough calculations the engineer realizes the situation and starts laughing. A few minutes later the physicist understands too and chuckles to himself happily, as he now has enough experimental evidence to publish a paper. This leaves the mathematician somewhat perplexed, as he had observed right away that he was the subject of an anecdote and deduced quite rapidly the presence of humor from similar anecdotes, but considers this anecdote to be too trivial a corollary to be significant, let alone funny.

More on demand. :-D

As for advice, forget it. The last time I offered you advice, it was a suggestion for rewriting the last line of your candidate statement. Like most people offered advice, you ignored it; and now look at the mess you’re in! ;-) --KSmrq 08:57, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Wow thanks K, you'll never know how much I needed a good laugh just now! I especially enjoyed the third. And yes I'm certainly in a mess. As for your advice, as a purely tactical matter your advice was shown to be correct. And it wasn't ignored, it was simply not followed, there's a difference ;-) Paul August ☎ 18:00, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Glad it helped. Been there. Just ask. --KSmrq 21:13, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

I add my congratulations. Now in the service of your newfound responsibilities could you kindly hop on over to the requests for arbitration page and please fix the Giano situation and heal the community as a New Year's present for all of us. I'll give you till Tuesday because of the holiday. :) Regards, Newyorkbrad 18:04, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Unblocking Issue

Hello my honorable friend, Paul August. I am terribly sorry my venerable friend for posting on your talk page, but other respectable administrators such as User:Mangojuice have suggested for my issue to be brought to a higher authority for speculation. Please see my contributions at User:Darin Fidika and my banning issue at User talk:Darin Fidika for further analyzation. I beg of you to look into this case and see it's injustice.

Currently at the moment, I have been permenantly blocked by User:Nihonjoe for "continuous blatant copyrighting of images and information". Due to the fact that absolutely none of my articles that I have created within the recent past are copyright violated to any extent - it couldn't always hurt to add a source though, I am being permenantly banned simply for forgetting the copyright property of a few images that I have uploaded. If I ask for any clarification of this issue, Nihonjoe will simply bring back an old topic from a samurai incident.

Within this incident, Nihonjoe deleted well over 800 of my samurai articles truly because most of them were based off of a single source. I, along with other admins had previously said we would assist in the expansion of these articles from other sources to diminish the copyright violation, but Nihonjoe decided to delete practically everything, including over 200 various other samurai articles that I created from multiple sources such as the Life and Writings of Musashi and the Samurai Sourcebook. After this issue, Nihonjoe falsely accused me of copyrighting information when I truly wished to assist the Misplaced Pages foundation to the very best of my knowledge. Thus, at this point, I am being thought of as some type of vandal that continuously "steals" information and images when there is no true justification. Every administrator that has responded to my unblock requests on my talk page simply always base their conclusion upon the samurai incident while not looking into the issue at all - thus they reject my good will as nonsense. The samurai incident ended without me being blocked and for no true punishment put on me due to Nihonjoe's unjustified resolution - I probably deserved to be temporarily blocked due to my ignorance however. Whatever the case please do not harm Nihonjoe, since he was obviously uninformed of the entire situation and only acted impulsively. I believe ones incompetence should always be improved upon rather then punished for, as when it comes to Nihonjoe's case.

Thus, I ask if you could unblock me so that I can continue to extend my eternal devotion to the Misplaced Pages foundation. I intend on expanding various famed novels such as Journey to the West, animes, books, and much more. I only truly wish for Misplaced Pages to be a place of greatness, and I will gladly extend my loyalty to this foundation at your will's descision as I have done in the past.

Thank you very much my friend for your time and consideration.

-- User:Darin Fidika (30 DEC) (EST)

A request for assistance

Would you support the concept of moving the Earhart "myths" to a separate page or article? The reason for my suggesting this is that the main article should be an accurate and scholarly work while the speculation and conspiracy theories surrounding the disappearance of Amelia Earhart are interesting, they belong in a unique section. Most researchers, as you know, discount the many theories and speculation that has arisen in the years following her last flight. Go onto the Earhart discussion page and register your vote/comments...and a Happy New Year to you as well. Bzuk 05:02 3 January 2007 (UTC).

Need your Oversight privileges please

Could you please check the oversight log and see if any edits have been hidden from the page history of the article Lebanon. There have been a few recent changes to the text that I can't locate in the page history. Could you check for any possible abuse? Thanks a lot. —LestatdeLioncourt 17:18, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Malebranche

Yes I have reasons to doubt that. I am preparing an University exam about Dante's Inferno and making quite deep studies on that. On the books I have (La Divina Commedia by Bosco-Reggio, Le Monnier 1988, and Inferno di Dante by Vittorio Sermonti, Rizzoli 2001 and these two books list an extensive bibliography each) that is not mentioned. Moreover it says that some critics tried to combine names of Black hguelphs families to the names of the devils. The only correspondence was Rubicante to Cante Gabrielli da Gubbio, the podestà of Florence who signed the exhile act for Dante. I can go on and on... I just wrote a pege on italian wikipedia it:I Malebranche where all those names where analized, they are quite funny. Some times they are similar to some family names (Malebrance, Raffacani, Rubaconte) but these are florentine families, not just from Lucca, and this can apply only to some devils, other are taken fro popular devil-characters (Alichino from French Hallequin, Farfarello from a kind on follet), others are invented by Dante. If you wish you can copy this in the discussion page of the list. Sometimes also books gets wrong, but comparing as many as possible we can try to get a more valid idea. Thank you--Sailko 12:24, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Can you change back? I would really cancel the reference to Lucca in that paragraph. --Sailko 12:45, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Ok I agree with you about removing the reference to Lucca there. I've made another edit to that entry to clarify the entry a bit more. Thanks for taking an interest in this unfinished list. It is more or less complete through Inf., XXIX, perhaps you might like to work with me on finishing it? Paul August ☎ 19:42, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I have to study only Inferno, I am checking item to item, I found very complete so far. I will try to add something --Sailko 01:07, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

WP:MFD for WP:PAIN

Was this because you changed your mind, or because you realized that the discussion had closed? If the latter, you might be interested to know that it's open again. Grandad 20:45, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

The latter. Thanks for the heads up. Paul August ☎ 22:24, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: Just wondering

Of course. :-) Flcelloguy (A note?) 23:06, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Giano

I notice Fred bauder pulled the plug on the Motions in prior cases relating to Giano . What's the current situation - is the intention to bring a RFAR against him, bring a RFAR regarding IRC, quietly drop it all and hope it goes away or is there deadlock behind closed doors? I'm very concerned about all this. The discussions I've seen from the logs are quite reprehensible and the justifications implausible, is Giano to suffer another RFAR for some righteous indignation whilst others can act with impunity because of a technicality that their actions were conducted "off-wiki". I don't imagine you can give any kind of detailed response but it would be nice to know what's going on rather than Fred just deleting the motion without comment. Many thanks. --Mcginnly | Natter 02:09, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

I think it was fairly clear that there wasn't enough support for those motions to pass, that is why I suspect that Fred removed them. There has been much discussion on all the issues you mention, but we haven't reached any conclusions yet. Frankly I've been quite disturbed by what I've seen in those logs. I will pass along your concerns. Paul August ☎ 04:15, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Paul. --Mcginnly | Natter 09:51, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Signpost interview

Hello, and congratulations on being named to the Arbitration Committee. The Misplaced Pages Signpost is doing a post-election interview with the arbitrators elected this year. Please answer these questions to the best of your ability. We request that responses be submitted any time between now and Monday, 17:00 UTC, to guarantee that your responses will be published. Please reply on my talk page. Thanks, Ral315 (talk) 04:27, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

1. How do you feel about getting the opportunity to serve on the ArbCom?

2. What do you think of the election? Do you think they were conducted properly? What could have been improved, in your opinion?

3. What would you say to those who supported you? Opposed you?

4. What do you think of the other Wikipedians who were appointed along with you?

   Test

5. After about two weeks on the job, what are your initial thoughts?

   Test

6. How active a role do you plan to take on ArbCom workshop pages, and in writing ArbCom decisions, a role that has historically been handled mostly by just a few individuals?

7. What do you think are the strengths of the ArbCom? Weaknesses?

8. If you could change anything, what would you change? Why?

9. Do you plan on finishing your term? If you had to make a choice right now, when your term expires, would you run for re-election? Why or why not?

10. If there's one thing you could say to the Misplaced Pages community, what would you say, and why? Is there anything else you would like to mention?

Pi

Can I ask why this was reverted? I am trying to muddle through the edit history now that Pi has been semi protected. The reference to pi is sourced on the wikipage the editor gave. Hazelorb 03:30, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Sorry I didn't look closely enough at that edit, I thought it was vandalism. Paul August ☎ 05:50, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Yea, I figured, when I looked at the edit history (you were reverting the one before that). :) Hazelorb 05:59, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Email

Did you get my email? --Cyde Weys 21:45, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes. Thanks for your input. Paul August ☎ 22:39, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Signpost updated for January 22nd, 2007.

Weekly Delivery

You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot 06:40, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

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