Revision as of 02:31, 25 April 2023 editSmasongarrison (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, New page reviewers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers729,587 edits Category:Social sciences organizations, Added {{WikiProject Organizations}}, Added {{WikiProject Higher education}}Tag: AWB← Previous edit | Revision as of 07:01, 30 May 2023 edit undoDavykamanzi (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Template editors32,767 edits →top: Updating COI disclosureNext edit → | ||
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{{connected contributor (paid)|User1=Davykamanzi|U1-employer=Abdulla Wasel |U1-otherlinks=({{Diff|The Hague Institute for Global Justice|cur|916379662|diff}} |
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External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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- Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110928144443/http://www.denhaag.nl/en/residents/to/Albright-crowns-city-with-new-peace-institute.htm to http://www.denhaag.nl/en/residents/to/Albright-crowns-city-with-new-peace-institute.htm
- Added archive https://web.archive.org/20130927124228/http://www.kpsrl.org/about/our-work to http://www.kpsrl.org/about/our-work
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Sources Bankruptcy Section?
I am thinking of adding a section addressing the bankruptcy of the institute. However I'm having difficulty finding sources other than the recent Volkskrant and Groene Amsterdammer pieces. Any suggestions? Kwataswagri (talk) 08:03, 5 April 2018 (UTC)
213.125.233.82 (talk) 12:16, 6 August 2018 (UTC)there is a public report available from the curator via www.rechtspraak.nl . This in the Dutch language
Rewrite to change tone
I feel that this article may have been written by someone who worked for the PR of the institute itself, as it almost reads as a commercial. I'm planning to rewrite the article to remove peacock words etc. I think that "works" section is a bit too detailed; any suggestions on what to remove? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kwataswagri (talk • contribs) 08:15, 5 April 2018 (UTC)
Lady Sohair A. Salam Saber – President
with respect > new president now for The Hague Institute http://www.thehagueinstituteforglobaljustice.org/the-hague-approach/our-team/ 212.106.94.35 (talk) 13:53, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
Edit request
It is requested that edits be made to the following semi-protected pages:
This template must be followed by a complete and specific description of the request, that is, specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y".
The edit may be made by any autoconfirmed user. Remember to change the |
Updates and general clean-up for the article (diff here; disregard user header code at the top of the page):
- General:
- Fixing refs across the article for consistency as per WP:CITEVAR; dead links rescued.
- {{Use dmy dates}} added.
- Slight edit to HQ image caption (the words "near Plein 1813 in The Hague" removed).
- New "History" section created; "Reports on mismanagement" and "Closure" sections made subsections of "History" section.
- "Projects" subsections eliminated; "Publications" made subsection of "Work" section.
- Disestablishment categories removed from footer.
- Edits:
- Infobox — "Dissolved" year removed; Abiodun Williams replaced by Sohair Salam Saber as current president of the Institute; slight formatting edits to headquarters and URL.
- Lead section — Update on current president of the Institute; Madeleine Albright info moved to "Leadership" section.
- "History" section — "Reports on mismanagement" subsection renamed to "Reports of mismanagement"; Sentences beginning "Shortly thereafter, another organization…" and ending "…which documents in question were destroyed is unclear" in "Reports of mismanagement" subsection removed as that information is not mentioned in the accompanying source given; "Closure" subsection renamed to "Bankruptcy and revival"; updates since bankruptcy added with sources.
- "Leadership" section — Pictures of Abi Williams and Madeleine Albright removed, picture of Sohair Saber added in line with updates in leadership; "Advisory Council" subsection removed as the council is no longer active; new info on Saber and Mohamed Abuwasel added.
- "Work" section — First sentence in Global Governance Reform Initiative (GGRI) paragraph (last paragraph in "Projects" subsection) rewritten; events in "Public discussions" subsection reorganised in chronological order.
- "External links" section — Water Diplomacy Consortium and Knowledge Platform Security and Rule of Law links removed; Institute link replaced with {{Official website}}.
Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 15:14, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
- Not done. Davykamanzi has not complied with WP:PAID. — JJMC89 (T·C) 01:01, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
- COI disclosure provided. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 07:08, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
Reply 27-AUG-2019
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Regards, Spintendo 11:00, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
Updated edit request
It is requested that edits be made to the following semi-protected pages:
This template must be followed by a complete and specific description of the request, that is, specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y".
The edit may be made by any autoconfirmed user. Remember to change the |
Updates and general clean-up for the article (diff here; disregard user header code at the top of the page):
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Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 15:32, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
- The proposal does not contain any actionable requests, being worded as if the changes have already been made (e.g.,
"Sentences beginning "Shortly thereafter, another organization…" and ending "…which documents in question were destroyed is unclear" in the "Reports of mismanagement" subsection were removed"
). If these changes are desired to be made, and have not yet been made, please include the verbatim text of the proposals along with the reasons in one central location here on the talk page. Regards, Spintendo 02:40, 28 August 2019 (UTC)- @Spintendo: I've worded previous requests (which have been accepted) as if the changes were already made, so I don't exactly understand why the wording of my requests here is a problem now. In any case, I've laid out the requests as instructed below.
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Reply 29-AUG-2019
- Where changes to the text have been proposed, the exact verbatim wording of the text has not been included. This verbatim text should be included here, accompanied by references.
- Where changes to the infobox have been suggested, references have not been included to verify the desired changes.
- Where text from the article has been proposed to be deleted, the exact verbatim text has not been included with the request.
Regards, Spintendo 07:25, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
References
- "Template:Request edit". Misplaced Pages. 7 July 2019.
Instructions for submitters, #6: Describe the requested changes in detail. This includes the exact proposed wording of the new material and the exact proposed location for it. Be specific: 'add X', 'delete Y', 'replace X with Y'.
- "Template:Request edit". Misplaced Pages. 7 July 2019.
Instructions for submitters, #3: Almost any edit you suggest should be accompanied by citation to a reliable source.
- "Template:Request edit". Misplaced Pages. 7 July 2019.
Instructions for submitters, #6: ...and an explicit description of any wording to be removed, including removal for any substitution.
Updated edit request 2
It is requested that an edit be made to the semi-protected article at D. (edit · history · last · links · protection log)
This template must be followed by a complete and specific description of the request, that is, specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y".
The edit may be made by any autoconfirmed user. Remember to change the |
Requesting the edits again as outlined in the previous section (diff here; disregard user header code at the top of the page). I do however think that Spintendo has been unnecessarily difficult with regard to reviewing the proposed changes when it was not demanded of me to be as precise in previous requests I've made, because the requests were already clear in what the proposed additions/omissions/edits were, where they were to be made and why I requested them to be made.
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Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 20:56, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
- Just to be clear, the requirements I've sought were not laid out by me — rather — those are the template's instructions. Regards, Spintendo 21:37, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
Updated edit request 3
It is requested that an edit be made to the semi-protected article at A. (edit · history · last · links · protection log)
This template must be followed by a complete and specific description of the request, that is, specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y".
The edit may be made by any autoconfirmed user. Remember to change the |
@Spintendo: Then at least be consistent in enforcing those instructions when dealing with other requests, because having to repeatedly submit the same requests again and again is extremely frustrating. The "current version of the article" in the request below refers to this revision and "the draft" in the request below refers to this draft (diff here; disregard user header code at the top of the page).
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Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 05:00, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
- @Spintendo: I honestly don't think I can get any more specific than this without copying the code from my draft onto this talk page. Once again, the above request contains "the verbatim text to be added, the verbatim text to be deleted and the reasons for each change" as you pointed out here. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 02:12, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
- The three items I've asked for are not in one central location. The COI edit request review process is a two-way street, with my ability to review your request being dependent on your ability to follow the instructions. Asking editors to go out of their way to implement changes on your behalf, and then refusing to accommodate them when they do, is a difficult sell in the best of circumstances — but I wish you luck with that, all the same. Regards, Spintendo 13:25, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Spintendo: So what exactly is missing then? You're not making it easy for me to understand exactly what you need to process the request either. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 14:06, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
- The three items I've asked for are not in one central location. The COI edit request review process is a two-way street, with my ability to review your request being dependent on your ability to follow the instructions. Asking editors to go out of their way to implement changes on your behalf, and then refusing to accommodate them when they do, is a difficult sell in the best of circumstances — but I wish you luck with that, all the same. Regards, Spintendo 13:25, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
@Spintendo: If this isn't verbatim and "in one central location" enough for you now, I don't know what else you're going to need to process this request.
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Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 15:57, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
Paid editing
@Davykamanzi: Am I correct in saying that you have been paid to make these edits? Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 17:55, 12 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: Yes. I've provided disclosure on that at the top of this talk page and on my own talk page. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 18:05, 12 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: alright, cheers. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 19:21, 12 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: Were you planning on reviewing the edit request? Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 02:17, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: I’ll see what I can do, but it looks quite a task. It will probably be this afternoon that I get round to it though. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 06:26, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: Were you planning on reviewing the edit request? Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 02:17, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: alright, cheers. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 19:21, 12 September 2019 (UTC)
Questions and comments on proposed changes
Hi Davykamanzi, here are questions and comments regarding the proposed changes:
- This source is in another language, did you use a machine to translate it, or can you speak that language?
- I can't access this source, but I believe it is also written in the same language.
- What reference does 'The Dutch government granted up to €20 million in subsidies for the Institute.' come from? It important is properly attributed as it is a rather bold claim. (just saw this ref mentioning the money, needs to be added as an inline citation).
- I'm very concerned about the amount of blame piled on the first president Williams. It appears as if you are trying to distance the institute from him and make him the sole cause of bankruptcy. I would like to see some clear evidence that this is the case - I don't really think it is.
- 'The Hague Institute and the Stimson Center, based in Washington, D.C., gathered "a select group of eminent statespersons and public intellectuals" to address global threats and challenges related to fragile states, climate change and the cyber-economy.' is backed by a primary reference - I don't think this should be here.
- The 'Public discussions' section is based off of a primary reference up to ref number 26. Concerning, to say the least, especially as the section covers the institute and others.
- The 'Publications' section is based off of a primary source. This is also concerning as there are claims such as 'variety publications based on research and analysis', 'empirical evidence' and 'The Hague Approach principles have subsequently been endorsed by current and former UN and global leaders including San-Hyun Song, Judy Cheng-Hopkins and Jan Eliasson.'. Claims like this must be sourced by secondary, independent reliable sources.
I hope I have helped, and I also I hope that my points and comments are fair and are justified. I am looking forward to hearing back from you, so that we can discuss this further. As mentioned, I am pretty busy in real life so I might be delayed in responding and doing any further work requested of you. Please tell your client that I'm working my hardest to help the article whilst sticking to policy. Regards, Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 16:52, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
Pinging Spintendo for further thoughts. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 16:56, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234:
- The first two sources you mentioned are indeed both in another language (Dutch) and machine translation was used for both of them. A substitute for dead link can be found here, which also mentions the €20 million in subsidies from the Dutch government (guess I just forgot to add a ref to that info as well).
- The info on the alleged mismanagement of the funds by Williams was already present in the article; I just carried out a number of formatting and grammatical edits to clean up the content, so it's not exactly me pinning any blame or trying to distance the Institute from him (I know this is irrelevant, but thought it was worth pointing out anyway). The existing sources all seem to point to him as a major factor in the bankruptcy of the Institute, so I can't say for certain whether other factors may have contributed to the bankruptcy, nor have I found any sources with information pointing to other potential factors in the Institute's bankruptcy.
- As for your last 3 points, I couldn't find any reliable sources to reference info on the Stimson Center, the "Public discussion" section or the "Publications" section as you outlined, so I decided to just clean up the content and see what happens. I completely understand that the content in those sections could be deleted or at least left with {{citation needed}} or {{better source}} tags.
- Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 21:26, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234 and Spintendo: I understand you probably both have other things going on, but it's been over 2 weeks since I put up the most recent request on this talk page. I don't mean to keep nagging but any implementation of the actionable sections of the request would be greatly appreciated; I'm also doing my best to answer any queries as quickly as possible to move things along. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 04:03, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 10:40, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- I would support the changes you want to make. However, I would appreciate a response from another, more experienced editor. Spintendo would be ideal, but he has left this matter. I think we need to look elsewhere for another opinion. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 15:57, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: I consulted Hugsyrup as well but he's away for the next week on vacation, and no other editor besides Spintendo seems to have shown interest in sorting out this edit request since it was lodged. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 21:02, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- I would support the changes you want to make. However, I would appreciate a response from another, more experienced editor. Spintendo would be ideal, but he has left this matter. I think we need to look elsewhere for another opinion. Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 15:57, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 10:40, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234 and Spintendo: I understand you probably both have other things going on, but it's been over 2 weeks since I put up the most recent request on this talk page. I don't mean to keep nagging but any implementation of the actionable sections of the request would be greatly appreciated; I'm also doing my best to answer any queries as quickly as possible to move things along. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 04:03, 15 September 2019 (UTC)
@Willbb234: The discussion seems to have stalled and no other editors seem interested in providing their input. If you think the proposed changes can be made, I'd kindly ask that you implement them. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 16:10, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: Done, but I've removed quite a large portion based on primary evidence, as mentioned above. Don't feel as if this matter is complete, I would still appreciate the response from another editor, but I feel it is appropriate to implement the changes as this current time. I might do some more trimming of information based on primary references. Regards, Willbb234 (please {{ping}} me in replies) 16:25, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: Thanks for your help. Of course I'll still be looking out for the other editor's response and any future changes to the article. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 18:34, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
- Expanded edit summary 18-SEP-2019: Text which was referenced by the subject organization and which involved third parties or was WP:PROMO was omitted. The text has also been reorganized in a linear format, with the History section containing earlier leadership (as distinct from later leadership), earlier projects, bankruptcy, revival and then the new leadership section being placed in that order. The previous alignment did not specify which part of the Institute's History was being recounted. With the institute existing in two different phases (pre and post bankruptcy) that difference should be delineated. The section headings on "mismanagement" were removed and that text was integrated into the history section itself, per WP:CSECTION. Regards, Spintendo 19:02, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Willbb234: Thanks for your help. Of course I'll still be looking out for the other editor's response and any future changes to the article. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 18:34, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Davykamanzi: - I am now back and taking a look at this as promised, although it looks as if the majority of your proposed changes have been implemented. Are there particular questions outstanding that I can have a look at? I'm happy to assist, just a little reluctant to need to read through the whole thread history and compare your requested changes with those implemented by Willbb234 if I can help it! Hug 09:15, 24 September 2019 (UTC)
- @Hugsyrup: Everything's pretty much been covered, but you're welcome to look over everything if you want to. Davykamanzi → talk • contribs • alter ego 13:42, 24 September 2019 (UTC)
Comments
Happening to come across this article, it struck me as promotional -- and then I saw this talk p. and understood why. The way it was revised sentence by sentence, can sometimes be ineffective in removing promotional tone. which can come about as the result of a ,es of multiple small items of puffery , and such common characteristics as overuse of the organization's name. I'm going to do what I usually do, which is edit it myself. (This isn't intended to take away fro mthe work of the good editors who have lookedat itprevious and much improved it, but sometimes a different approach is needed. DGG ( talk ) 06:31, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
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