Talk:David Irving: Difference between revisions

Browse history interactively ← Previous edit Next edit →Content deleted Content addedVisual WikitextInline

Revision as of 17:53, 9 December 2023 editHob Gadling (talk \| contribs)Extended confirmed users18,492 edits →Could this be more professional?← Previous edit		Revision as of 21:42, 9 December 2023 edit undoClueBot III (talk \| contribs)Bots1,381,683 editsm Archiving 1 discussion to Talk:David Irving/Archive 11. (BOT)Next edit →
Line 64:		Line 64:
	{{section sizes}}		{{section sizes}}


	== Irving acknowledges gassings ==

	Irving is no longer a "holocaust denier" proper. He now has this weird theory that a smaller number of people were murdered by gassing in every camp except for Auschwitz ] (]) 03:37, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
	:Not sure about whether this claim about Irving is accurate or the details here, but he has long maintained that the scale of killings in the Holocaust was much smaller than was actually the case, and not that they didn't occur. Misrepresenting the scale of the Holocaust is a fairly common form of Holocaust denial (few deniers maintain that no Jews were murdered), and his aspect of his views was part of the reason that he was found to be a Holocaust denier in the libel action he launched (see ). ] (]) 06:34, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Year of German atomic bomb book ==		== Year of German atomic bomb book ==

Revision as of 21:42, 9 December 2023

Skip to table of contents

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the David Irving article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information.

Discussions on this page often lead to previous arguments being restated. Please read recent comments and look in the archives before commenting.

This article is written in British English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, defence, artefact, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

David Irving has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
January 30, 2005	Featured article candidate	Not promoted
August 7, 2005	Featured article candidate	Not promoted
November 4, 2010	Peer review	Reviewed
February 12, 2011	Good article nominee	Listed
August 3, 2011	Good article reassessment	Kept
A fact from this article was featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the "On this day..." column on March 24, 2017.
Current status: Good article

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

This article has not yet been rated on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects.

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

Biography: Arts and Entertainment

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Misplaced Pages's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography
	This article is supported by the arts and entertainment work group (assessed as Mid-importance).

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

Alternative views Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Alternative views, a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of significant alternative views in every field, from the sciences to the humanities. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion.Alternative viewsWikipedia:WikiProject Alternative viewsTemplate:WikiProject Alternative viewsAlternative views
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

Crime and Criminal Biography Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

Journalism Low‑importance

	Journalism portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Journalism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of journalism on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.JournalismWikipedia:WikiProject JournalismTemplate:WikiProject JournalismJournalism
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

Skepticism Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Skepticism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of science, pseudoscience, pseudohistory and skepticism related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SkepticismWikipedia:WikiProject SkepticismTemplate:WikiProject SkepticismSkepticism
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Military history: Historiography / World War II

This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history

Associated task forces:
/
	Military historiography task force
	World War II task force

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.

England Low‑importance

	England portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject England, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of England on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.EnglandWikipedia:WikiProject EnglandTemplate:WikiProject EnglandEngland-related
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Template:Vital article

This article has been mentioned by multiple media organizations:

Cahal Milmo and Aline Nassif (25 April 2008). "Legal victory for B&B owner who evicted Irving for being too moody". The Independent.
Cnaan Liphsiz (5 May 2009). "Misplaced Pages editors: Coverage of Israel 'problematic'". Ha'aretz.

Archives (Index)

This page is archived by ClueBot III.

Section sizes

Section size for David Irving (35 sections)
Section name	Byte count	Section total
(Top)	16,060	16,060
Early life	3,299	3,299
Student years	2,000	5,513
Carnival Times article	3,513	3,513
The Destruction of Dresden	5,470	6,073
1963 burglary of Irving's flat	603	603
Subsequent works	5,168	5,168
Revisionism	17	13,736
Hitler's War	4,701	4,701
Irving's work in the late 1970s and early 1980s	4,954	4,954
Hitler Diaries	3,400	3,400
Other books	664	664
Holocaust denial	21	43,175
Movement towards Holocaust denial	21,567	21,567
Ernst Zündel trial	8,336	8,336
Holocaust denial lecture circuit	13,251	13,251
Racism and antisemitism	4,399	4,399
Persona non grata	5,365	28,974
Libel suit	5,421	5,421
Life after the libel suit	11,498	11,498
2009 Norwegian Festival of Literature	6,690	6,690
Reception by historians	4,897	4,897
Personal life	1,715	2,460
Illness	745	745
In popular culture	1,918	1,918
Works	2,508	2,508
See also	157	157
References	15	10,265
Explanatory notes	48	48
Citations	533	533
Bibliography	7,114	7,114
Reviews	342	342
News articles	2,027	2,027
Film	186	186
External links	1,953	1,953
Total	150,555	150,555

Year of German atomic bomb book

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

In the books section, please change the publication date of The German Atomic Bomb from 1983 to 1967. 1983 might be a later edition or just a reprint. Source: Nuel Pharr Davis, Lawrence and Oppenheimer (1969 British edition), bibliography section, p. 365. I guess at that time, Irving was still considered credible. 2601:644:8584:2010:0:0:0:5FA4 (talk) 07:10, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Done Pinchme123 (talk) 22:10, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Marking as answered —⁠PlanetJuice (talk • contribs) 03:26, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Shouldn’t this be British Court?

The English court found that Irving was an active Holocaust denier, antisemite and racist, who "for his own ideological reasons persistently and deliberately misrepresented and manipulated historical evidence".

Kentish 86.3.134.204 (talk) 20:36, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

No. There is not a single court system in the UK, the Courts of England and Wales are one system, Scotland has a totally different legal system and Northern Ireland has a third. As the case was tried in England it is correct to call it the English court. - Arjayay (talk) 21:06, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 September 2023

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

He is not a holocaust denier. He is the most prominent world war 2 historian. 2600:8802:5713:6400:3058:47C5:9A19:4776 (talk) 09:04, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

Not done -- the change you appear to want would be entirely inappropriate, not least because it is not supported by reliable sources. Thanks for your opinion, though. Nomoskedasticity (talk) 09:39, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

He is a holocaust denier in the most definitive way possible, declared as such by a court of law. 2A00:23C6:1ABE:FC01:C828:3D69:C979:19 (talk) 09:14, 22 September 2023 (UTC)

Could this be more professional?

Obviously this man isn't a very good person and that's a fact that this article needs to express. However, the entire opening section reads like someone's angry diatribe about an ex friend or lover. The problem with this method of presenting information is that the site looks heavily biased and deceptive to younger readers who will see the bias in the article and believe the very conspiracies the man professed because the man can easily be seen as a victim of a smear campaign. Even the page on Adolf Hitler is less aggressively negative but that could be due to the overwhelming support for eugenics and the eugenics movement by many editors on this site(look how whitewashed the article on Cold Springs Harbor Laboratory or the Indian Health Service).

If you know anything about Russian propaganda and pseudo-rightwing people on the internet, then you know that nothing fuels their conspiracies like the perceived victimization of their own kind. Whoever wrote the introduction to this article has greatly helped the neo-nazi cause. Nothing solidifies support in bad causes like the perception of victimization of the people involved. That's what Hitler did to rise to power and whoever wrote much of this article is helping the neo-nazi cause. Be professional when dealing with controversial topics since the wrong words can send the wrong message. The causes of men like him are fueled by the over-active censorship and mudslinging. 2604:2D80:6305:600:1595:C94D:DC4:424E (talk) 17:37, 9 December 2023 (UTC)

Do you have any concrete suggestions? Pure rants do not help. --Hob Gadling (talk) 17:52, 9 December 2023 (UTC)

Categories: