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	:Sure. But we do need to consider whether the English or Hawaiian form of the name is more appropriate for an article. I'd argue that the state should be 'Hawaii', just as we have 'Mexico' rather than 'México' for that country. ] (]) 18:15, 5 January 2025 (UTC)		:Sure. But we do need to consider whether the English or Hawaiian form of the name is more appropriate for an article. I'd argue that the state should be 'Hawaii', just as we have 'Mexico' rather than 'México' for that country. ] (]) 18:15, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

			== A barnstar for you! ==

			{\| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
			\|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" \| ]
			\|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" \| '''The Original Barnstar'''
			\|-
			\|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" \| As a speaker of an indigenous language, I greatly appreciate your work! ] (]) 20:20, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
			\|}

Revision as of 20:20, 8 January 2025

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Word/quotation of the moment:

Astrology has no effect on reality, so why should reality have any effect on astrology? – J.S. Stenzel, commenting on astrological planets that astrologers acknowledge don't really exist

(Previous quotes)
The official state rainbow flag of Russia (official in JAO since 1996) Do you think the liberals are using these school shootings to further their anti-tragedy agenda? — Col. Erran Morad, Who Is America?, s01e01 yod-dropper — (when you need something that sounds like an insult) ALL keys matter — response to the scale-wandering rendition of the national anthem at CPAC 2021 The Lunatic-in-Charge becomes the Lunatic-at-Large Lame duck à l'orange (AKA canard à l'orange) It is a mortifying circumstance, which greatly perplexes many a painstaking philosopher, that nature often refuses to second his most profound and elaborate efforts; so that often after having invented one of the most ingenious and natural theories imaginable, she will have the perverseness to act directly in the teeth of his system, and flatly contradict his most favorite positions. This is a manifest and unmerited grievance, since it throws the censure of the vulgar and unlearned entirely upon the philosopher; whereas the fault is not to be ascribed to his theory, which is unquestionably correct, but to the waywardness of Dame Nature, who, with the proverbial fickleness of her sex, is continually indulging in coquetries and caprices, and seems really to take pleasure in violating all philosophic rules, and jilting the most learned and indefatigable of her adorers. The philosophers took this in very ill part, and it is thought they would never have pardoned the slight and affront which they conceived put upon them by the world had not a good-natured professor kindly officiated as a mediator between the parties, and effected a reconciliation. Finding the world would not accommodate itself to the theory, he wisely determined to accommodate the theory to the world. — Washington Irving, Knickerbocker's History of New York Pela primeira vez na sua vida a morte soube o que era ter um cão no regaço. For the first time in her life, death knew what it felt like to have a dog in her lap. — José Saramago, Death with Interruptions / Death at Intervals It is now generally accepted that the megaliths that make up Stonehenge were moved by human effort. — as opposed to by what? Anybody who says you only have yourself to blame is just not very good at blaming other people. — It's Happy Bunny When poppies pull themselves up from their roots and start out, one after the other, toward the sunset – don't follow them. — Slavko Janevski, 'Silence' And the dough-headed took their acid fermentation for a soul, the stabbing of meat for history, the means of postponing their decay for civilization. — Stanislaw Lem, Return from the Stars The Church says that the Earth is Flat, but I know that it is Round, for I have seen its Shadow on the Moon, and I have more Faith in a Shadow than in the Church. — (commonly misattributed to Magellan) In the early years of the study there were more than 200 speakers of the dialect, including one parrot. — from the WP article Nancy Dorian Mikebrown is unusually eccentric and not very bright. Astronomers have not noticed any outbursts by Mikebrown. — from the WP article 11714 Mikebrown Ecce Mono Keep Redskins White! "homosapiens are people, too!!" a sprig of spaghetti "I've always had a horror of husbands-in-law." awkwardnessful anti–zombie-fungus fungus "Only an evil person would eat baby soup." (said in all sincerity)

(Previous quotes)

Do you think the liberals are using these school shootings to further their anti-tragedy agenda?
— Col. Erran Morad, Who Is America?, s01e01

yod-dropper
— (when you need something that sounds like an insult)

ALL keys matter
— response to the scale-wandering rendition of the national anthem at CPAC 2021

The Lunatic-in-Charge becomes the Lunatic-at-Large

Lame duck à l'orange (AKA canard à l'orange)

It is a mortifying circumstance, which greatly perplexes many a painstaking philosopher, that nature often refuses to second his most profound and elaborate efforts; so that often after having invented one of the most ingenious and natural theories imaginable, she will have the perverseness to act directly in the teeth of his system, and flatly contradict his most favorite positions. This is a manifest and unmerited grievance, since it throws the censure of the vulgar and unlearned entirely upon the philosopher; whereas the fault is not to be ascribed to his theory, which is unquestionably correct, but to the waywardness of Dame Nature, who, with the proverbial fickleness of her sex, is continually indulging in coquetries and caprices, and seems really to take pleasure in violating all philosophic rules, and jilting the most learned and indefatigable of her adorers. The philosophers took this in very ill part, and it is thought they would never have pardoned the slight and affront which they conceived put upon them by the world had not a good-natured professor kindly officiated as a mediator between the parties, and effected a reconciliation. Finding the world would not accommodate itself to the theory, he wisely determined to accommodate the theory to the world.
— Washington Irving, Knickerbocker's History of New York

Pela primeira vez na sua vida a morte soube o que era ter um cão no regaço.
For the first time in her life, death knew what it felt like to have a dog in her lap.
— José Saramago, Death with Interruptions / Death at Intervals

It is now generally accepted that the megaliths that make up Stonehenge were moved by human effort.
— as opposed to by what?

Anybody who says you only have yourself to blame is just not very good at blaming other people.
— It's Happy Bunny

When poppies pull themselves up from their roots
and start out, one after the other, toward the sunset –
don't follow them.
— Slavko Janevski, 'Silence'

And the dough-headed took their acid fermentation for a soul, the stabbing of meat for history, the means of postponing their decay for civilization.
— Stanislaw Lem, Return from the Stars

The Church says that the Earth is Flat,
but I know that it is Round,
for I have seen its Shadow on the Moon,
and I have more Faith in a Shadow than in the Church.
— (commonly misattributed to Magellan)

In the early years of the study there were more than 200 speakers of the dialect, including one parrot.
— from the WP article Nancy Dorian

Mikebrown is unusually eccentric and not very bright. Astronomers have not noticed any outbursts by Mikebrown.
— from the WP article 11714 Mikebrown

Ecce Mono

Keep Redskins White!

"homosapiens are people, too!!"

a sprig of spaghetti

"I've always had a horror of husbands-in-law."

awkwardnessful

anti–zombie-fungus fungus

"Only an evil person would eat baby soup." (said in all sincerity)

On mutually intelligible

You reverted my edits on Bono dialect saying “Dolphyne does not say Bono and Fante are mutually intelligible”. This is incorrect and misinformation as Dolphyne always saids Bono is mutually intelligible with other Akan dialects of Akuapem, Asante, Akyem, Fante etc as seen here (p.88)]. Check and verify before I go on to my edits Bosomba Amosah (talk) 13:35, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

That's why it's helpful to provide a full reference for your claims.

The Bono article as currently written reflects Dolphyne. I did now change it from a 'dialect' to 'dialect cluster', as Dolphyne says that Bono is not a single dialect. — kwami (talk) 21:22, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

Bono is a dialect not a dialect cluster. Dolphyne conducted the based on grouped towns because of proximity to each other. That doesn’t make it a dialect cluster. This is also the same for all the Akan dialects. For instance, in Fante dialects, Gomoa, Ekumfi, Breman etc varies yet a unified orthography has been chosen. Page 88 saids it is dialect; her research on Akan languages also say it is a dialect. Bosomba Amosah (talk) 11:19, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

IPA characters on General Alphabet of Cameroon Languages table

Hello, I see that you've reverted my edit to add IPA charts to the IPA consonant table on General Alphabet of Cameroon Languages for no given reason. My aim was to bring that article in line with other articles documenting orthographies like Devanagari and Hangul by detailing the indicated IPA values alongside their representations in the orthography. It improves the reading clarity for users who can understand IPA and doesn't affect others, so I would like to know what your rationale was in reverting my edit, in case there's something I'm missing. Thank you. Citation unneeded (talk) 14:36, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

It wasn't the IPA for those letters, AFAICT (if you have a source that confirms it, please let us know), and because the alphabet wasn't designed for a particular language, there might not be a one-to-one correspondence with the IPA anyway. — kwami (talk) 17:22, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

My edit translated the information already present in the article (the table) into IPA characters, not adding anything uncited (although there is no citation for the table itself). It was a natural extention of the current article, and the verifiability of the table is a different matter altogether.

While it is true that since this is a "general alphabet", the letters do not have specific phonetic values, it is nonetheless helpful to detail the characters in the table for the same reason that there is a table in the first place. You'll notice that narrow transcription (// not ) is used, which makes it clear that the IPA does not denote specific phonetic qualities, but rather indicates the kind of sound that is denoted by each letter. Citation unneeded (talk) 17:54, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

Except that they were not the sounds of each letter. What you provided was OR and clearly wrong. If you have a RS, great, otherwise, no. — kwami (talk) 18:14, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

We have three options: either we get rid of the table since it is unsourced (thereby significantly reducing the usefulness of the article and removing what may be one of the only sources of this information online), we add the IPA characters so as to make the article easier to read or we keep the article as it is.

The first option is clearly too extreme (you're not contributing to an encyclopedia if you're removing information from it) and subscribing to the third leads to the second (as I've demonstrated). Are you seriously considering making the article useless bc the original creators used sources which are now lost? Citation unneeded (talk) 18:52, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

We follow sources per WP:RS. If you had sources that met those criteria, we could follow them. But you obviously don't, so we leave the article as-is. — kwami (talk) 19:21, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

unichar

Just in case you missed it, an fyi. {{Unichar}} was revised a while back such that the description is no longer required. If given, it is treated as an editor convenience and courtesy. This change was prompted by subtle and not-so-subtle vandalism and pov "corrections". So {{unichar|26A5|Hermaphrodite}} (for example) will display as U+26A5 ⚥ MALE AND FEMALE SIGN: it is not possible (using the template) to override the canonical name. As will {{unichar|26A5}} (U+26A5 ⚥ MALE AND FEMALE SIGN again). 𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 15:43, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks. — kwami (talk) 20:16, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Nomination for merger of Template:Infobox language

Template:Infobox language has been nominated for merging with Template:Infobox proto-language. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. PK2 (talk; contributions) 09:21, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

Hawaiian place names

You and I seem to be the two active people on this front, and I've noticed a lot of your accurate moves for island names were undone by people who don't seem to understand how Hawaiian works or what the actual place names are locally. I think our conversation last year in the Maui fires was actually met with a pretty broad consensus to remedy this, but I suspect there's going to be some slight issues with the (never followed) MOS:HAWAII, which is frankly just wrong in treating a consonant as a diacritic, and people who assume their understanding as a tourist reflects the reality on the ground. We've already got a tension in articles that accurately render the place names being titled inaccurately, as well as general Wikipedians thinking the ʻokina isn't a consonant.

I've posted in the Hawaii Wikiproject, but I was wondering if you'd be interested in helping me rework the Hawaii MOS to stop it from validating this English vs Hawaiian tension that simply doesn't exist in reality? Warrenᚋᚐᚊᚔ 14:02, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

Sure. But we do need to consider whether the English or Hawaiian form of the name is more appropriate for an article. I'd argue that the state should be 'Hawaii', just as we have 'Mexico' rather than 'México' for that country. — kwami (talk) 18:15, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	As a speaker of an indigenous language, I greatly appreciate your work! Newyorkwildcat (talk) 20:20, 8 January 2025 (UTC)