Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 21:09, 27 November 2011

My Talk Archives

Archive 1 Archive 2 Archive 3 Archive 4 Archive 5 Archive 6 Archive 7 Archive 8 Archive 9 Archive 10 Archive 11 Archive 12

Barnstar

		The Peace Barnstar
		Thanks for your help today. CRRaysHead90 | 00:35, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Recent SPI

Hi, thanks for taking timely action. You missed to block the sockmaster I guess? --lTopGunl (talk) 17:35, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

• Another admin might, but it seems rather punitive to me. WilliamH (talk) 18:23, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Ok. I think the edit war's been long enough to justify the preventive stand. Anyway, thankyou.--lTopGunl (talk) 18:26, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Class Project SPI

Hi, I saw you were discussing an SPI in which I and several of my classmates had our edits deleted despite containing quite a bit of sourced information and (hopefully) unbiased material. I was hoping these edits would be restored and it appears that the discussion is leaning towards allowing that to occur. If this is the case, we appreciate it. Also, you asked for editors involved to contact you, so if you have any questions, here I am.Ticctacc (talk) 03:31, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

• Thanks a lot and I'm sorry for the distraction in your project. Please understand that with Misplaced Pages being the 5th most visited site on earth, articles on politicians can - and indeed have - come under intense real life campaigns to present them a certain way, and while we obviously assume that people are trying to help not harm Misplaced Pages, It is not surprising that a recent changes patroller might be a bit concerned when a flurry of new accounts start editing a similar topic. If you find your uncontroversial edits reverted, the best thing to do is discuss them with who reverted them and/or raise a discussion on the article in question's talk page. Tell your classmates to go to this page so they can read this message, and by all means come to me if you have any further questions. WilliamH (talk) 05:22, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

Comment: The edits by class members were all reverted by Arbor8 on the ground that she thought the class project was a case of sock or meatpuppetry and that therefore all the content—irrespective of whether was biased or neutral, sourced or unsourced—should be removed. This has all been discussed in the sockpuppetry case, and the editor who removed the contributions by the civics class is well aware of what has transpired. I don't really see why further explanation or disclosure of identities of the teacher, the students, or the purpose of the class project should be required. Misplaced Pages is supposed to be an anonymous venue, and the edits were by and large constructive. Although someone may voluntarily disclose their identity or their motives, I have never before seen an attempt to require or encourage such disclosure. --Regards--KeptSouth (talk) 14:01, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

I should add that I do not think at all that you were mining for additional personal information on the teacher or the class assignment, but from reading the comments on the SPI page, it seems to me that others were. My view on the info is that if it is neutrally phrased, well sourced and pertinent to the politicians' bios, it should be in the bios, and the identity or motives—disclosed or imputed —of those who add factual information to WP is irrelevant. --Regards--KeptSouth (talk) 15:12, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

To follow up on the discussion at the SPI, I am inclined to think (in contrast to my views of a couple of days ago) that if the edits are non-disruptive, we might be better not investigating this. I'm keenly aware that it is vital we do not mistreat new contributors like these. (Of course, I say this without prejudice to investigating the accounts with CU if they make disruptive or partisan edits.) Does that sound okay, William? I didn't want to close the investigation or take any action until I'd consulted you, because aside from Mailer you're the only other CU who has commented on the case.

KeptSouth, I don't at all think we were "mining for personal information on the teacher", but I do agree it is unreasonable to compel a confirmation of the authenticity of the classroom exercise in the absence of disruptive editing by the accounts. Regards, AGK 12:36, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

AGK - all of that sounds spot on. WilliamH (talk) 20:40, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for following up. I've closed the case. Regards, AGK 16:33, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Need help on the Holocaust denial article

Hi William,

Please help clarify on the Holocaust denial article: "Their estimates must not be presented as a legitimate alternate perspective."

There are different death estimates. According to some holocaust deniers these estimates are telling lies. Jankiel Wiernik was a Polish-Jewish Holocaust survivor. Wiernik writes in his book ‘A Year in Treblinka' that states a camp guard shot him in the shoulder at close range:

Believe it or not, the bullet did not wound me. It went through all of my clothing and stopped at my shoulder leaving a mark.

— Jankiel Wiernik, A Year in Treblinka , page 46

According to some Zionists Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the world’s most dangerous anti-semite. Document reveals Ahmadinejad has a Jewish past. A Neturei Karta Jew hugged Ahmadinejad during the Iran Holocaust-denial conference.

It might be helpful to discuss.

--Regards--Christopher Forster (talk) 13:21, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

• Sure. Firstly, what is the source for this? I mean the source for everything, not just the Wiernik quote. WilliamH (talk) 15:08, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

References

How to get around site registered on Misplaced Pages's blacklist?

1. contains a new external link to a site registered on Misplaced Pages's blacklist
2. contains a new external link to a site registered on Misplaced Pages's blacklist
3. Damien McElroy and Ahmad Vahdat (03 Oct 2009). "Mahmoud Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past - Telegraph". Telegraph Media Group Limited. Retrieved 19 November 2011. {{cite web}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)
4. contains a new external link to a site registered on Misplaced Pages's blacklist

• If the source is on the blacklist, then it is there for a reason. These edits appear to present a Holocaust denial view, namely that the death toll at Treblinka has been grossly exaggerated, as an acceptable argument. As an example, imagine the article on Earth implying that it could be flat, or it could be round. Holocaust denial is a fringe theory and must not be presented as anything more than that. I suspect that the source in question has been blacklisted because other users have tried to cite it either out of misguidance, or because they have an axe to grind. WilliamH (talk) 18:36, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Holocaust Denial Videos.com/treblinkasources.html

Holocaust Denial Videos.com/mov_pages/01_mov.html

Hurry Up Harry.org/2009/02/04/ahmadinejad-snogger-rabbi-friedman-recants/

--Christopher Forster (talk) 21:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Hurry Up Harry is a blog (blogs aren't reliable sources), and as for Holocaust Denial Videos, the website is simply a load of Holocaust denial videos produced by an anonymous person. As academic scholarly material, they are completely worthless and cannot be used in Misplaced Pages, hence why they are blacklisted. Please see Misplaced Pages:Identifying reliable sources. WilliamH (talk) 21:07, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Yankel Wiernik's book is a reliable source?

Believe it or not, the bullet had not really hurt me. It had gone through all of my clothing and stopped at my shoulder, leaving a mark.

— Yankel Wiernik, A Year in Treblinka , CHAPTER 14

--Christopher Forster (talk) 15:25, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Wiernik is a primary source, and it's really secondary sources we ought to be citing, not them. It's not really up to us to decide which primary sources to give consideration to - that's what secondary sources do. WilliamH (talk) 20:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Is there enough academic freedom for secondary sources to publish articles about Holocaust Denial? --Christopher Forster (talk) 21:09, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Langwieder lake district

On 24 November 2011, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Langwieder lake district, which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that a lake (pictured) in the Langwieder lake district that originated as a pit from which more than 2,000,000 cubic metres of gravel were excavated for highway construction was once voted the cleanest lake in Munich? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Langwieder lake district.You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Orlady (talk) 15:14, 23 November 2011 (UTC) 00:02, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Cung Le's Nationality, please view my Talkpage

I posted this on The Bushranger's talkpage as well. I am requesting for more editors to look at the current evidence provided and determine a final conclusion, especially since Cyberpower may have not verified his source as compared to the sources I have provided. I am trying to deal with this in a civil manner and would not try to make any personal attacks towards editors nor try to threaten to sue Misplaced Pages, joke or not. However, I am questioning the source of information regarding Cung Le's Nationality given by both the user Glock and even Cyberpower, who said he was handling the matter. As Misplaced Pages requires, a source of information needs to be verified. The source for his nationality given by Cyberpower apparently is a user on Facebook that claims to work for Cung Le and knows specifically which citizenships/passports that he holds. I am asking directly for more administrators to step in and view and verify this source to be legit, as compared to all the sources I have provided including direct tweets and quotes from Cung Le himself and his website. I further ask for the admins to tell Glock to stay away from my Talkpage and other ways of communicating because I find his comments absolutely ridiculous, outrageous, and disruptive, while I am trying to deal with this in a civil, respectful, and reasonable manner. All I ask if for everything to be verified, just like Misplaced Pages requires. I find the co-worker who claims to be Cung Le's co-worker rather suspicious, and evidence must be shown on how he knows the information that is being seeked. If this can not be provided, I ask that Cung Le's Nationality be reverted back to an American of the U.S.A. Please clarify if you can. This is the Facebook user in question who claims to be working for Cung Le and knows exactly which citizenship he holds: redacted This is Cung Le's facebook page (redacted) where a user claims to represent Misplaced Pages (Cyberpower?) directly posted on Cung Le's wall and received a response from the user who claims to know specifically what type of citizenship and passport that Cung Le holds. However, he has yet to provide enough evidence that 1) He actually works for Cung Le 2) That he specifically knows that he has a Vietnam passport. To me it is highly suspicious, if this can be proven otherwise and that his claims are legit, I will stop from dispute and no longer further try to research this issue. But again, all I ask is for more admins to take a look at this. No disrespect to you Cyberpower, but I just find the current source from a Facebook user that claims to work for Cung as not enough proof. PinoyFilAmPride (talk) 09:15, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

William, I saw that you redacted those Facebook links. I did not know if it's against Misplaced Pages policy to use Facebook links. However, I just wanted to show you what I saw and hopefully you took a look because I was wondering exactly what source Cyberpower was using. PinoyFilAmPride (talk) 10:28, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

I goofed when considering source reliability. I will revert any change. WilliamH, please explain why you blocked Pinoy.—cyberpower (Talk to Me)(Contributions) 10:35, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I'm a clerk at the Dispute Resolution Noticeboard. I'm trying to figure out what exactly caused you to indef PinoyFilAmPride, however the best I can come up with is a Privacy argument. If this is the case please let me know as I'm trying to straighten out your oversighting of their posts that you left partially on the page. Hasteur (talk) 13:14, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

You Got Mail

Block reason needed

User talk:Glock17gen4 is requesting an unblock. I have declined it, preliminarily, but if you could indicate on his user talk page, in general terms (specifics not needed, just generally) what he did to get blocked, that would be very helpful to me and other admins who may come by to respond to his unblock requests. --Jayron32 01:19, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

And another one. User talk:PinoyFilAmPride is also requesting an unblock. I know you have a reason to block these accounts, but really you need to leave a block notice or a nice handwritten note explaining why they are blocked, if not for their edification, then at least for us admins that need to deal with the usual unblock requests. I'd like to respond to these people intelligently, so a simple note explaining what they did wrong (again, not for them, but for the rest of us) would be nice. --Jayron32 02:45, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

And a third: User talk:Cyberpower678. Upon my own investigating, all three blocks seem related, but since you didn't let anyone know why they are blocked or how they are related no one can respond to the unblock requests. Please advise. --Jayron32 02:50, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

• Thanks. I have declined all three requests and sent them to WP:BASC based on your email. I agree that the situation is far too messy for simple admins to deal with, and as such, should be passed upstairs. --Jayron32 03:00, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

New message ref: investigation

Hello. You have a new message at Djathinkimacowboy's talk page.

1. Yankel Wiernik (1945). "A YEAR IN TREBLINKA". AMERICAN REPRESENTATION of the General Jewish Workers' Union of Poland. Retrieved 24 November 2011.