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Turkey Start‑class Low‑importance

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Delete

The content has been merged with the incorrectly spelt article 'Sumela Monastrey'. That article should be deleted. There is still work to be done to improve the content - particularly the section regarding buildings. Rob cowie 13:10, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Frescoes

The frescoes have all been vandalized. Not damaged because of movement.--68.91.95.183 (talk) 09:53, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

I'm not sure if "damaged because of movement" was what was being said by the text in the article (it may have been trying to say that parts of the frescoes have been removed entirely) - but it is correct to say that there had been no damage due to movement and so, for clarity, I have removed that vague text that seemed to be saying that there was such damage. Meowy 20:11, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

Move?

It has been proposed in this section that Sumela Monastery be renamed and moved to Sümela Monastery. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. Links: current log • target log • direct move

Soumela Monastery → Sümela Monastery –

• A name dispute which was mentioned in my user talk page. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 21:44, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

• Strong support: Google hits, "Sümela Monastery" 117,000 results vs. "Soumela Monastery" 4,750 results. Cavann (talk) 19:54, 30 April 2013 (UTC)
• Support Google Books since 1990 139x for Soumela Monastery vs 791x for "Sümela Monastery" In ictu oculi (talk) 00:27, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
  • Can you please supply a link showing Google results for Sumela with diacritics versus Sumela without diacritics? I did my own search and Google does not appear to differentiate between the two versions. It just lumps them together. So the question arises where do you base your preference for the version with diacritics? Even the Government of Turkey, Inside the Altindere National Park near Macka, the Sumela Monastery is perched on high cliffs overlooking the Altindere valley spells it without diacritics at least sometimes. Here they even appear to use the names interchangeably: Sümela Monastry RELIGIOUS MONUMENTS Sumela Monastry. In the rest of the text from the Turkish ministry of Culture the name is used without diacritics. Δρ.Κ.  02:20, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
    • The point is there is no o before u, like the current title. Cavann (talk) 02:31, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
      • The point is Sümela and "Sumela" are different spellings, you can't just lump them together as one. Athenean (talk) 02:40, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
      • (edit conflict) @Cavann Well not exactly. The proposed move is to the name with diacritics. I would agree if the move were modified to the name "Sumela Monastery" without the diacritics. Δρ.Κ.  02:43, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
    • Furthermore a GBooks search for "Sumela Monastery" yields 947 hits exactly the same as the diacritics version except that looking at the actual results for both, the diacritics version is much less frequent in both searches, page after page. Per WP:Diacritics:

In general, the sources in the article, a Google book search of books published in the last quarter-century or thereabouts, and a selection of other encyclopaedias, should all be examples of reliable sources; if all three of them use a term, then that is fairly conclusive.

It seems that the non-diacritics version "Sumela Monastery" is much more frequent in GBooks. Δρ.Κ.  02:43, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I would also support a move from Soumela to Sumela. Cavann (talk) 02:45, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

We have a deal. Δρ.Κ.  02:46, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

My own Gbooks search shows 1450 hits for "Sumela" , 1150 for Soumela and only 110 for Sümela , of which the first 3 are false positives (Books LLC). Athenean (talk) 03:54, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

On GScholar I get 145 hits for Sumela/Sümela (impossible to separate the two, but "Sumela" does seem much more common than "Sümela"), and 85 hits for Soumela . Athenean (talk) 03:58, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Based on this, I Oppose the move to "Sümela", but would be ok with either "Sumela" or "Soumela". Athenean (talk) 04:26, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I used quotation marks. That could explain the difference. Δρ.Κ.  04:05, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Excellent. We all agree on "Sumela" then. Δρ.Κ.  04:33, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

• Strong support: I don't think a consensus has occurred. Soumela and Sumela are part of "Greekification",that's why there is no credibility international arena. Google(United Kingdom) Hits results of Sümela Monastery :52.500 and results of Soumela Monastery:16.500 . Officially recognized name :Sümela Monastery.In this regard; can be reached several official evidences. List:

Official Results

• European Parliament/European Parliament resolution on Turkey’s 2010 progress report/Fulfilling the Copenhagen criteria/Number 25
• The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE)/The Status and Issues of the Greek-Orthodox Minority in Turkey/ page 4
• United States Commission on Internationl Religious Fredom (USCIRF)/ Turkey/ Page:272
• United Nations/ UNESCO
• Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Hellenic Republic
• Ministry of Culture and Tourism of Turkey
• Müze.gov.tr

Unofficial Results

• Travelandescape
• Hürriyet Daily News

Consequently,Sümela Monastery is just acceptable. Dialects and punctuation marks that is meaningless according to me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.213.109.191 (talk) 13:24, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

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