Talk:Nigel Dodds: Difference between revisions

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	I had a look. It seems to me that most of those editors are confused. In 1973 Northern Ireland was divided into 26 district council areas. One of those was the District of Londonderry which was given city status because within it lay the smaller City of Londonderry. The smaller City of Londonderry still exists today and has a Lord Lieutenant. (see http://en.wikipedia.org/Lord_Lieutenant_of_the_City_of_Londonderry ) In 1984, the larger 1973 creation known in full as "The City and District of Londonderry" had its name changed to "The City and District of Derry", but that did not affect the smaller City of Londonderry that lies within it, whose official name still remains "Londonderry". The 1973 creation "The City and District of Derry" has now been disbanded, but the original pre-1973 City of Londonderry continues. Meanwhile the County of Londonderry is, and has always been Londonderry. The Royal Mail postal district is also officially called Londonderry.		I had a look. It seems to me that most of those editors are confused. In 1973 Northern Ireland was divided into 26 district council areas. One of those was the District of Londonderry which was given city status because within it lay the smaller City of Londonderry. The smaller City of Londonderry still exists today and has a Lord Lieutenant. (see http://en.wikipedia.org/Lord_Lieutenant_of_the_City_of_Londonderry ) In 1984, the larger 1973 creation known in full as "The City and District of Londonderry" had its name changed to "The City and District of Derry", but that did not affect the smaller City of Londonderry that lies within it, whose official name still remains "Londonderry". The 1973 creation "The City and District of Derry" has now been disbanded, but the original pre-1973 City of Londonderry continues. Meanwhile the County of Londonderry is, and has always been Londonderry. The Royal Mail postal district is also officially called Londonderry.
	Anyway, none of this should matter as regards Nigel Dodds since he was born in County Londonderry, and I don't agree with you that Derry is the common name for either the city or the county. People use both, as does the media, and Nigel Dodds himself uses Londonderry. Would it not be polite, since its a biography of a living person, to use the preferred usage of the subject in question? http://www.nigeldodds.co.uk/profile Why use what would be the choice of his political opponents? An encyclopaedia needs to be accurate. It's not about promoting what a small active group of editors, at one moment in time ten years ago, decided that they would like the facts to be. ] (]) 19:23, 14 April 2015 (UTC)		Anyway, none of this should matter as regards Nigel Dodds since he was born in County Londonderry, and I don't agree with you that Derry is the common name for either the city or the county. People use both, as does the media, and Nigel Dodds himself uses Londonderry. Would it not be polite, since its a biography of a living person, to use the preferred usage of the subject in question? http://www.nigeldodds.co.uk/profile Why use what would be the choice of his political opponents? An encyclopaedia needs to be accurate. It's not about promoting what a small active group of editors, at one moment in time ten years ago, decided that they would like the facts to be. ] (]) 19:23, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

			::And just one more question. What makes you personally so keen to make sure that Nigel Dodds, a unionist, is described as coming from Derry as opposed to Londonderry, when everybody knows that Nigel Dodds himself would call it by its official name 'Londonderry', as do most people in Northern Ireland? What is your personal interest in all of this? I thought that care had to be taken with biographies of living persons, and that sensitivity had to be shown. And why would you not allow it to read Altnagelvin, County Londonderry? Why was it so important to you to come to this article and revert to Derry? Would an Irish republican politician born in Northern Ireland like it if wikipedia insisted on describing him as British, which he technically would be? Why are you trying to wind Nigel Dodds up? I thought the policy regarding living biographies, where opinions and controversies are concerned, was to side with the view of the person in question, where that view would be known, as it is in this case.

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Untitled

Dodds would almost certainly call Derry Londonderry so that's the preferred term in this context I think. Please let's not have yet another childish rv war on that subject!!!

I think "a party not known for its intellectualism" is a bit pov (although I've a feeling I put it there in the first place!!!) so I've removed it. Happy to discuss. Gerry Lynch 22:10, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Although Derry seems to be the standard term on Misplaced Pages, the inclusion of the official name does'nt overly bother me. I would rather keep the reference to intellectualism, as it seems to mark the party out from most of the others.

Lapsed Pacifist 01:51, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

Even though I probably wouldn't dispute the fact, the reference to "intellectualism" is definitely POV, so I've removed it. Stu 10:56, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

POV-pushing

From your edit history, it's clear that you do not believe that Northern Ireland is a legitimate state. You are entitled to that opinion; however, you are not entitled to push this opinion by rewriting articles to remove all references to "Northern Ireland". This latest tactic is just another version of your old "six counties" and "north-east" gimmicks. They didn't work; neither will this. Stop playing games and wasting both our time. Demiurge 00:57, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

I presume you're addressing me, Demiurge. Feel free to put any interpretation you like on my edits, they will stand or fall on their own merits. There are no fewer than seven instances in this article where the words "Northern" and "Ireland" appear consecutively. Were I 'rewriting articles to remove all references to "Northern Ireland"', I think I might have been slightly more thorough. Were you to write "Dodds travels regularly to Britain to attend parliament", and a particularly obstinate user insisted that you use the word "England" instead, you might have a better grasp of my reasoning.

Lapsed Pacifist 04:42, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

Who else would he be addressing LP? There are seven instances of 'Northern Ireland' in the article as this is the official name of the country being referred to. Simple as that.

The sentence "Dodds travels regularly to Britain to attend parliament" is completely different matter. England is part of Britain. Northern Ireland is not a part of Ireland in the context to which you are inferring. Stu 15:39, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom but it is not part of Britain. Millbanks (talk) 19:57, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

fair point Millbanks. I should point out to Stumason that Northern Ireland is part of Ireland. However, it is not part of the Republic of Ireland. Codu ⁄_(c) • 17:52, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

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Derry-Londonderry edit warring

Is there a notice anywhere on this article saying that WP:1RR applies? I couldn't help but notice this when skimming the log of currently active bans and blocks (and then zooming in on a participant or two to find out what the "edit warring" was about). 204.52.215.107 (talk) 04:23, 26 February 2009 (UTC) Also, this is pretty OLD edit warring: judging from the above comments, it's been going on since 2005! 204.52.215.107 (talk) 04:23, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

I have reverted your edit. In Ireland related articles counties are not added when they are evident, such as "Galway, County Galway" and so on. The style manual does not say to use both, only which term applies to the city and which to the county. O Fenian (talk) 20:15, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Post-nominals

Since he's now a Privy Counsellor, there should presumably be a "PC" amongst his post-nominals. Andrew Gwilliam (talk) 13:02, 12 June 2011 (UTC).

Not clear

It is not clear if the brick was thrown at Dodds deliberately or not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.126.93.17 (talk) 11:34, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

Londonderry

The post 1973 city and district council area, now defunct since 1st April 2015, and which changed its name from Londonderry to Derry in 1984, included the actual city and extended into the county. The actual city and the county are both still officially called Londonderry, as is the postal district. Dodds was born in Altnagelvin hospital which today still lies inside County Londonderry. Dodds himself, being a unionist would be happy with the use of the correct name. I can see no justification for using a shortened version. It's not about consensus. It's about fact, otherwise any majority of editors at any time could name any place in the world anything that they liked.

Sorry, but Misplaced Pages works on the basis of consensus and on the basis of WP:COMMONNAME, not official names. That's why, up to 2011, we had an article at Libya, not at "Great Socialist People's Libyan Arab Jamahiriya." A majority of editors couldn't name a place anything they like because names have to be backed up with reliable sources. If you disagree with this, you should seek to have it changed at the talk page of WP:IMOS, but be aware that this issue has been discussed to death on the Derry talkpage (for example here) and you'd likely be flogging a dead horse. Valenciano (talk) 10:15, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

I had a look. It seems to me that most of those editors are confused. In 1973 Northern Ireland was divided into 26 district council areas. One of those was the District of Londonderry which was given city status because within it lay the smaller City of Londonderry. The smaller City of Londonderry still exists today and has a Lord Lieutenant. (see http://en.wikipedia.org/Lord_Lieutenant_of_the_City_of_Londonderry ) In 1984, the larger 1973 creation known in full as "The City and District of Londonderry" had its name changed to "The City and District of Derry", but that did not affect the smaller City of Londonderry that lies within it, whose official name still remains "Londonderry". The 1973 creation "The City and District of Derry" has now been disbanded, but the original pre-1973 City of Londonderry continues. Meanwhile the County of Londonderry is, and has always been Londonderry. The Royal Mail postal district is also officially called Londonderry. Anyway, none of this should matter as regards Nigel Dodds since he was born in County Londonderry, and I don't agree with you that Derry is the common name for either the city or the county. People use both, as does the media, and Nigel Dodds himself uses Londonderry. Would it not be polite, since its a biography of a living person, to use the preferred usage of the subject in question? http://www.nigeldodds.co.uk/profile Why use what would be the choice of his political opponents? An encyclopaedia needs to be accurate. It's not about promoting what a small active group of editors, at one moment in time ten years ago, decided that they would like the facts to be. 86.162.190.142 (talk) 19:23, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

And just one more question. What makes you personally so keen to make sure that Nigel Dodds, a unionist, is described as coming from Derry as opposed to Londonderry, when everybody knows that Nigel Dodds himself would call it by its official name 'Londonderry', as do most people in Northern Ireland? What is your personal interest in all of this? I thought that care had to be taken with biographies of living persons, and that sensitivity had to be shown. And why would you not allow it to read Altnagelvin, County Londonderry? Why was it so important to you to come to this article and revert to Derry? Would an Irish republican politician born in Northern Ireland like it if wikipedia insisted on describing him as British, which he technically would be? Why are you trying to wind Nigel Dodds up? I thought the policy regarding living biographies, where opinions and controversies are concerned, was to side with the view of the person in question, where that view would be known, as it is in this case.

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