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May 30

Origins of Profiterole

Yes all, there is a disturbance in the Force at Profiterole! Some IP editors have been (over the last year or more) swapping it back and forth between Italian and French origins. This seems to have been going on since at least April 2014. Apparently it was invented by "Chef Popelini that worked for Catherine De Medici from TUscany". Anybody know the 'Truth'? 220 of 05:11, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Reminds me of the long-running debate about the origin of the Pavlova - New Zealand or Australia? Anyway, the "truth" (whatever that is) is less important at WP than what can be verified from reliable sources. -- Jack of Oz

Likewise. Perhaps invented is the wrong word. 'Popularized' is probable better, as the chances that nobody up to then, had not mixed these ingredient together to create a profiterole is laughable. It is like saying that John Montagu, 4th Earl of Sandwich invented the sandwich when all he's household did was give the name sandwich to two slices of bread with a filling. Hardly new in even the 1600's -long before he was born.--Aspro (talk) 16:28, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

As noted above. Find a reliable source. Cite it. If different stories are told by different reliable sources, cite them all. --Jayron32 16:37, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Note that for food recipes, it's not that unlikely that two people will come up with a similar recipe at about the same time, independently. This is because there are maybe a billion people in the world creating new recipes (I'm one of them). If a billion people were working on inventions in any other field, you'd expect lots of duplicate inventions there, too. StuRat (talk) 19:03, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Oh dear, I was hoping for some reliable sources! The bit I quoted seems to be in the vein of verbal history or "urban legend" sourced on the page to a blog. So I will likely remove it, if I can't find a reliable source for it. 220 of 01:47, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

The picture at top right of the article don't look like any profiterole I've ever seen. More of a choux bun to my mind. DuncanHill (talk) 01:50, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Ah-ha, I thought, Larousse Gastronomique will have the definitive answer. Which it... doesn't. It says nothing about the origin of the pastry itself, but does note that "the name comes from the word profit and originally meant a small gratuity or gift." (2009 edition, page 836) Presumably the French word profit. Doesn't look like an Italian diminutive ending. --Shirt58 (talk) 05:02, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

@Shirt58: Do you have: Juillet, Claude (1998). Classic Patisserie: An A–Z Handbook. Butterworth-Heinemann. ISBN 0-7506-3815-X? That's used as a source on Choux pastry. 220 of 05:56, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

No, I'm afraid not. (I have very few cookery-related books, as generally I don't use recipes. I've never used Larousse Gastronomique for cooking, I just browse it for enjoyment. And in case I might come across something that doesn't have a Misplaced Pages article. )--Shirt58 (talk) 07:07, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Well, there's an 'important' question I never asked answered! Très bien! (Apparently 'Manchette' means 'cuff') 220 of 13:27, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @DuncanHill: Good point. Does this, Cream Puff, look closer? It's used on List of pastries. 220 of 05:08, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Well - a bit more, but either that's a tiny plate or it's a huge profiterole. And I'd expect a profiterole not to gape. DuncanHill (talk) 10:28, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

De gustibus non est disputandum, a profiterole is a globe-shaped pâte à choux filled with some sort of creme filling. The exact type of cream filling and method of putting it inside the globe are not specified, except by pedants who like to make themselves seem superior by claiming their method of making them is the only true way to make them. --Jayron32 00:05, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

A small such ball, according to OED and every baker's, supermarket, and restaurant I've ever seen offering profiteroles for sale. If it's big enough that you'd sell singly then it's a choux bun, or an elephant's foot, or something like that. DuncanHill (talk) 12:38, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

James Earl Jones tour of "Mice and Men,"

While I was at Purdue doing graduate study, sometime in the period from 1964 to 1968, I saw James Earl Jones and his father, Robert Earl Jones, give a very moving performance of "Of Mice and Men" in an auditorium on the Purdue campus. I see no reference to such a tour in any of the information in Wickipedia (James_Earl_Jones), (List_of_James_Earl_Jones_performances,)and other links. It would be interesting to see such information in an article.

Also, I am not sure if this is the correct venue for asking this question. I had a great deal of difficulty finding a place to make this comment. It would be nice to have clearer information as to how to do this and other things. There are so many links that it is hard to find the appropriate link. Please clarify. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.78.81.117 (talk) 21:57, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

That would be the Entertainment Desk. StuRat (talk) 22:23, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

No, the Ent. Desk is for asking entertainment related general knowledge questions. In order to point out issues with a particular article, the information should be put on the talk page for the article in question. So pointing out something that is missing from James Earl Jones should go on Talk:James Earl Jones. Dismas| 22:38, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

I assume they want us to confirm, with sources, the details of the performance. Once that info is provided, then it would be time to change the article, either directly, or by leaving the info on the talk page for others to do the update. StuRat (talk) 22:55, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

No, you are wrong and Dismas is correct. The searching out of sourced information on this topic should have been conducted on the talk page of the article. --Viennese Waltz 07:37, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

A performance at a university is rarely considered important enough to single out in an article, even if it does involve his parent ("Darth, I am your father"). Clarityfiend (talk) 23:07, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Not important enough for it's own article, certainly, but a mention of it in the James Earl Jones article would make sense, if it can be confirmed, that is. StuRat (talk) 02:02, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

The performance was reported in The Kokomo Tribune. If someone thinks it should be added to the article, go ahead and do so. John M Baker (talk) 17:31, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

May 31

USA emergency service response

Why is it that in the USA, emergency services will respond to other emergency services calls. For example a police unit might respond to an ambulance call or a ambulance unit might respond to a fire call, if they are nearest to the incident. In the UK, it never happens. Only the emergency service that was called will respond and they call other services if necessary. 194.66.246.51 (talk) 22:54, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

When you call 911, the dispatcher decides what services are likely to be needed based on your description of the incident and dispatches them all. Most places do not have separate emergency phone numbers for different services. Additionally in some locations first responders are multiply trained. In my town every fireman is a trained paramedic and a couple are trained reserve police on the SWAT team. In some cities all police are firefighters. Rmhermen (talk) 23:10, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

In the UK it definately does happen for medical emergencies, a lot of rural Fire Stations are first responders to calls in places an ambulance can't get to in the 8 minute target for a Category A emergency. See for example Warwickshire's scheme. Nanonic (talk) 23:11, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

See also this response from the US city of Red Wing, Minnesota. Nanonic (talk) 23:31, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Police may respond to a fire call for a few reasons: A) Direct traffic, B) give first aid (CPR, etc) if the officer is trained, C) Calm the residents of the structure who are wondering "When is help going to come?", etc.

Ambulances may respond to a fire for things like smoke inhalation or other more serious injuries.

Police may respond to ambulance calls for, again, first aid, traffic control, etc.

The police can often respond the quickest since there are already officers in vehicles out patrolling whereas the fire trucks and ambulances have to come from whatever garage they are in. Dismas| 23:12, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

I was born in England and my mother was taken to hospital in a police car because there was no ambulances available. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.178.114.76 (talk) 23:19, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Indeed police seem to deliver quite a few babies! 220 of 05:41, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Makes a huge amount of sense to me to send whichever service is immediately available/closest. I think Dismas & Rmhermen have already said a lot of what I say here. In a lot of 'emergency' situations, the police would likely be required (or at least very helpful) in addition to the fire brigade /ambulance requested. First aid training is required even for security guard licensing in New South Wales, Australia, and I am quite sure it is required for police applicants here too.

• I came across a situation where police were called to a nearby domestic violence incident, and an ambulance also arrived. I was told it was then standard practice to send medical aid (ambulance) as well to domestic violence calls.
• There is also the fact that a lot of 911 or 000 calls are fake calls, so sending the nearest 'emergency responder' of whatever type, means that the veracity of the incident can be confirmed quicker.
• I also recall watching an American TV series in the 1970s(? I can't remember the name! Emergency ?) where the 'firies' seemed to be very involved in providing treatment to injured persons. That may not be a realistic portrayal of course. I had an idea that US firies are often also trained paramedics, as Rmhermen mentions above. 220 of 05:41, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

* And the TV show I was thinking of was Emergency!. - 220 of 05:57, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Is "firies" the Australian word for "fire fighters"? Dismas| 05:48, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

As an Australian, with no particular language expertise, I believe it is a common colloquialism, at least in Sydney, New South Wales. Ambulance personnel are commonly called 'ambos'. 220 of 05:57, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

@Dismas: Source: "Firies" and Keep your hands off our ambos!", which is about ambos being subjected to assault while trying to help people, another reason why police go to injury type emergencies. Australian Slang may be useful for future reference. 220 of 09:05, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

@220 of Borg: Thanks heaps! Dismas| 09:30, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

The postman is a "postie" in Australia and sometimes also in Britain. When police attend a traffic accident an ambulance often attends as well even though there may be no injuries. That seems to be sensible advance planning. The police will often ask someone involved in an accident if they want an ambulance. They're actually trained in midwifery in case a baby arrives unexpectedly. I think all the emergency services have basic training in the others. The basic training is widespread - the inspectors in my local street market go through a course in first aid. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 11:38, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Ambo/s http://www.nzherald.co.nz/ambo/search/results.cfm?kw1=ambo] and postie are also extensively used in NZ . Don't think firie/s is so common though. Nil Einne (talk) 02:10, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

June 1

LI FU RAN, Ph.D. (talk) Baybayin.--William Thweatt 05:09, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

There is also Buhid alphabet, Hanunó'o alphabet, Tagbanwa alphabet, Kulitan alphabet. However none of these scripts (including Baybayin) date to 1000 AD. They are estimated by some to have originated in the mid-to-late 13th century, at the earliest, although a much later date is probable. The oldest known writing in the Philippines is in the Old Javanese or Kawi script which dates to the time period you are asking about. You may also find this to be of interest: Indic Scripts of Insular Southeast Asia: Changing Structures and Functions--William Thweatt 06:37, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Circumnavigation of the Europe-Asia-Africa land mass

We don't often think of it in this way, but Europe-Asia-Africa is one contiguous land mass - the Suez Canal aside. My questions are:

• Does this land mass have a name? Eurasica, perhaps?
• Has anyone ever circumnavigated it? If so, who was the first?

Thank you. -- Jack of Oz 07:12, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Old World (one possibility) also links to the clunky-sounding Afro-Eurasia, which in turn provides the equally vile Eurafrasia. Clarityfiend (talk) 07:50, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. That led me to Vega Expedition. Those people had the basic idea, but they cheated and left out Africa. -- Jack of Oz 08:25, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

The land masses that combined to form these continents have names - Pangaea, Gondwanaland and others. It is more than just Europe/Africa/Asia - the bulge of Brazil fits into the Bight of Benin in West Africa because they were originally joined but drifted apart. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 11:32, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Yes, thanks, I know something about continental drift and tectonic plates, but this is not really relevant to my question. -- Jack of Oz 11:59, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

• I do not know the answer to your question, but I am willing to guess that it's someone listed in List of Russian explorers, since sailing the Russian Arctic coast would be the hardest part of the journey. --M@rēino 14:48, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

(e/c with GH Myrtle below) That assumes anyone has done it at all. A scan of that list was not fruitful, but thanks for the idea. I'd have thought it would be such a major undertaking - probably second only to a circumnavigation of the entire globe - that it would be very well known. I'm thinking it's never been done; I can't even find any evidence anyone's ever even tried and failed. I'm sure there'd be some intrepid travellers who've sailed in all or most of the waters surrounding this enormous World Island at various times in their lives. But doing the complete circuit in one discrete voyage? Maybe I'd better get in touch with Guinness World Records. -- Jack of Oz 21:30, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

The first circumnavigation of the Americas was only in 1970. I suppose it's possible that a circumnavigation of Afro-Eurasia has never been undertaken. Ghmyrtle (talk) 21:27, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

...and the first solo circumnavigation of the Americas was by Matt Rutherford in 2012. Ghmyrtle (talk) 21:36, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

They're both listed in our List of circumnavigations. -- Jack of Oz 21:53, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

June 2

Hawaiian cuisine and pineapple

Here in Finland, a restaurant dish "Hawaiian style" usually means anything made from pork or chicken with pineapple, and possibly very mild chili sauce, on it. However, the article Cuisine of Hawaii claims that pineapple was first cultivated in Hawaii in the 19th century, after contact with the Europeans. Is the pineapple in any way an authentic part of Hawaiian cuisine or is it just an invention for the tourists? JIP | Talk 21:12, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Do you consider the tomato to be an "authentic" part of Italian cuisine? Same deal, except Italians have had access to tomato a bit longer than Hawaiians have had access to pineapple. The fruit grows well there, they seem to like it, and they've had a few hundred years to work it in to their local cuisine. Compare spam musubi, which is distinctly Hawaiian, regardless of the fact that spam (and pork) are not native to HI. You may also be vindicated by reading Hawaiian_pizza, which was invented in Canada, not clear on if Hawaiians even really like it. SemanticMantis (talk) 21:47, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Pigs are as native as people to Hawaii, having arrived together. Spam admittedly wandered in a bit later. Rmhermen (talk) 12:10, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Also if I'm understanding correctly, rice wasn't really introduced until the mid 19th century, after pineapples. Nil Einne (talk) 03:10, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

June 3

Notability Problems

--ColinFine (talk) 07:58, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Death not treated as suspicious

Note that this question does not relate to any particular real-world case. If the police discover a body, and then make a statement saying that the death is not being treated as suspicious, presumably that rules out foul play. So what are the other possible causes of death? I can think of suicide, a health problem (e.g. a sudden heart attack) and accidental death. Are there any others? --Viennese Waltz 11:47, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Coroner's verdicts may help.--Phil Holmes (talk) 14:52, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Some info at Death_by_natural_causes and cause of death. The former has a few book refs, as well as a less reliable article on Slate that says for the USA "Most states recognize five different manners: homicide, suicide, accident, natural, and undetermined." SemanticMantis (talk) 14:58, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

But it is very often a euphemism for "the death is believed to have been self-inflicted", i.e. suicide. It usually applies where the death was not by natural causes. I mean, if a person went to bed one night and died of heart failure in their sleep, there's no way the police would raise the question of suspiciousness, not even to deny it. Suspiciousness only potentially comes into play when there's apparently been some unnatural occurrence, such as violence, or poisoning/drug overdose, or falling from a height etc, and that could include accidents and murder, but it could also include the person deliberately doing something to themself. -- Jack of Oz 22:38, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Yes. The cops probably have to be a little careful, because they don't want to prejudge the coroner's report. That kind of comment is also used to indicate that they don't consider the public to be in danger. ←Baseball Bugs carrots→ 00:00, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Brian Tracy

Could you please create an article about this man? He is very famous but for some reason he has no Misplaced Pages page. 49.145.33.23 (talk) 13:08, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

I think your idea of "very famous" is probably quite different from that of Misplaced Pages. --Viennese Waltz 13:21, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Please see Misplaced Pages:Requested articles. ―Mandruss ☎ 13:21, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

As Mandruss implies, this is not the place to request new articles. But as to fame, well, I hadn't heard of the fellow (even if he is from the same country as me), but a Google search for his name (in quotes, i.e. searching as a phrase) said there were over 14,000,000 hits, and most or all of the top 20 seemed to be about the same person. The search also produced multiple ads for him. So while it might be more the result of effective self-promotion, I think that's at least prima facie evidence of notability. And there are Misplaced Pages articles on him in (at least) Albanian, Azerbaijan, Farsi, Finnish, German, Hebrew, Kazakh, Polish, Russian, and Swedish, just not in English.

On the other hand, if you follow that red link, you'll see that articles on him in English have been created three times in the last 8 months or so, and each one deleted on a basis like "no references to support notability" or "unambiguous advertising". So maybe he's really not notable and that was the right decision. I'm drawing no conclusion one way or the other. --174.88.135.200 (talk) 18:06, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Infestation of tiny bugs

Some tiny bugs have recently started appearing in my bathroom, especially at night - see photo here. They're less than a centimetre long and they scurry around the bathroom floor. I haven't seen them anywhere else in the house. What are they called, should I be concerned about them and how can I get rid of them? --Viennese Waltz 22:43, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

They look like silverfish to me. These eat paper and clothing especially in damp conditions. You are likely developing holes in things. You will be better off without them. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:49, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Definitely look like silverfish. And if you're seeing this many out in the open, imagine how many are in the walls, etc. I recommend you call your local pest control company. ←Baseball Bugs carrots→ 23:56, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Second Coming And The Environment

Jesus will come back very soon, so why should we care about the environment? Is this an excuse?

Gyotu (talk) 03:38, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Hurricanes, Tornadoes and Bushfires in Christmas (cont.)

There are hurricanes, torandoes and bushfires in Christmas? But Christmas is in winter and hurricanes, tornadoes and bushfires usually occur in the summer.

125.255.167.126 (talk) 03:41, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

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