Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 22:46, 26 October 2006

Template:PCP

Um, I think this article needs some cleanup. some sentances need rewriting and or moving, for instance "Misty caught a Seaking at the Seaking Contest Episode. After a hot battle with an other Challenger of the Contest she won. No one knows where Seaking is now, though it is assumed that all the trainers released them. - Yes they were indeed released." and "Casurin has a crush on Daisy's Luvdisc, "Luverin". Her Luvdisc knows watergun!" -72.66.103.31

"Filling out the female audience identification quotient of the show"

This doesn't look to NPOV to me. I'm taking it out. Azure Haights 22:54, Oct 3, 2004 (UTC)

...TOO. *Too* NPOV. I need to learn to type. Azure Haights

Extreme General's edit

Extreme General, your edit removed a lot of information from this article. Can you explain why you feel that your version is better than that which preceded it? Kelly Martin 03:22, Jun 8, 2005 (UTC)

well im sry, how bout insted of deleting it, why don't we make mine - Misty (Pokemon Game) & the prvious one - Misty (Pokemon)?

You can't just delete something to make your own article! Especially one that is much smaller and less useful than the exsting one! I have reverted to the original, and merged yours into the "non-animé info" section. Sonic Mew 16:08, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

"Never shown romantic feelings"?

Contrary to the article, I thought Misty did show a certain amount of affection for Ash -- particularly in the movies. Is this not true?

That is a matter of debate. But it is clear that she does show some romantic feelings for Ash, particularly in the Orange Islands. Sonic Mew | talk to me 18:27, July 20, 2005 (UTC)

Be careful with the 'Shipping'. As fascinating as it can be, none of it's official, though I do reckon the writers intend for Misty to have a secret crush on Ash. None of this can be proved for sure, however. Kai 00:54, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

I don't think it was ever a secret to anybody other than Ash. Even Psyduck figured out, so obviously the audience was supposed to.

I agree. Even the American directors on the DVD of the first movie recognized this and mentioned it. Kasumi is almost definetely intended to have feelings for Satoshi. Minami-chan 01:41, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Yea, and at the very least in the American version she's meant to have feelings for him (I can't comment on the Japanese version as much), de to the song "Misty's Song." It doesn't happen in the show itself, but it shows that they intend her to have these feelings. The song starts and ends with voice clips of Ash and Misty (with Ash being clueless as usual) and has the chorus:

I wanna tell you what I’m feeling

But I don’t know how to start

I wanna tell you

But now I’m afraid that you might break my heart

Oh, why should anything so easy

Ever be so hard to do

I wanna tell you what I’m feeling

And to say that I love you

PokéShippers actually don't use that as evidence. There is plenty of evidence in the original, though, particularly as her feelings are confirmed in Gotta Catch Ya Later. Sonic Mew 21:27, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

It's still not really proven despite all the hints, though I on the whole agree. So to say she does have the hots for Ash is merely a personal take on things, not one of fact. Kai

Also what's the deal with the 'Since she's left, Ash has realised his feelings towards her' line? It doesn't suggest romantic feelings I'm afraid. Kai

Good. Because I've just deleted the entire section of Ash and Misty becoming a couple. They are too old. Besides, there's been a lot of shipping conflict all around this encyclopedia, so we're deleting all chemistry between Pokémon characters tat have not been verified. Misplaced Pages is a place for facts and truth. Got complaints? Talk to me at my mailbox. Thank you and have a nice day. 65.103.86.243

Thank you for your consistant cooperation by not adding the possibilty of Ash and Misty being together. Because of this, I will see that you will all get medals for your patience. 65.103.86.243

Wait, why were the bits about Misty's feelings for Ash erased? Misty's feelings for Ash were a major part of her character development and one of her major motivations for traveling with him no matter how you try to refute it. You're completely ignoring what she said in the second Pokemon movie (The original Japanese dialogue about how Ash was her burden), how painful her separation was from Ash in Gotta Catch Ya Later (As opposed to May's departure in the last Advanced Generation episode), the entire episode of "Misty Meets Her Match" (Especially how Rudy told Ash he was a "lucky guy"). This isn't an NPOV issue because her feelings were fact. 67.121.107.252 03:46, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

The whole shipping thing is POV. I'm sure every AdvanceShipper could come up with a logic to refute your theories, which proves that the matter depends on your point of view. And with the new season coming up, people are gonna be talking about Ash and Hikari. But none of this crap can be included on Misplaced Pages until there's official confirmation. In other words, this stuff can only be mentioned if any of these girls actually, verifiably and canonically says, "I love Ash Ketchum". And by "canonically", i mean Misty's Song doesn't count. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 06:07, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

I disagree. Are you saying the above examples I listed can't be construed as evidence of romantic feelings? That's ridiculous. How else can you interpret Misty's actions then? What was the point of giving her an entire episode to choose between Rudy and Ash? What was the point of her being teased by Melody in the second movie all the time about Ash being her boyfriend and suddenly near the end of the movie, Misty solemnly says that Ash is her burden? How else can you interpret Team Rocket's teasing that Ash and Misty like each other in the episode "Pokeball Peril?" It's freaking obvious of what the writers had intended; they've bludgeoned us with their intentions in those episodes. It can't be POV when theres facts regarding Misty's crush on Ash and no facts regarding the supposed crush May has on Ash (Coupled with the fact that she left the show with heavy implication that there's reciprocity between May and Drew). Misty's crush has been confirmed, at least in Kanto, Orange Islands, and Johto. Her feelings were the main motivator in her tagging along with Ash and she used the bike as an excuse. The very least we can do on this page is at least acknowledge that those feelings existed prior to Ash going to Hoenn and were one of the major reasons why she followed Ash until Gotta Catch You Later. 67.121.107.252 19:27, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Read WP:V, WP:OR and WP:NPOV before you comment. And for all your "evidence", she's never actually said, "I love Ash Ketchum". Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 06:27, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Misty likes Ash. See how easy that was to solve.--Rat235478683--(and if they ever make an episode where someone goes into the future, Ash and Misty will be together with a kid)

Evidence Misty's List of Evidence Most other shippers agree that Misty's love for Ash is undeniable. In fact, out of all the major and secondary characters, she is the only one who has made her romantic intentions apparent. This evidence became more prevalent throughout the Orange Season.

Ash Catches A Pokémon Ash, willing to continue his journey alone, is followed by Misty. Upon noticing her pursuit in Viridian Forest, Ash puts her on the spot and asks her, "Why are you still following me?". Misty sweatdrops and unconvincingly stutters back, "M...My bike! I'm holding you responsible for my bike!". Her obvious insincerity clearly shows the bike isn't the reason she is following Ash. Why she is following him is made apparent near the end of the episode where she says "I've never known anyone like him. He really does love Pokémon". She does so in body language befitting that of an infatuated girl. Also, in her statement, it is pretty much implied that she has an interest in knowing Ash, who at this point, is a total stranger; a textbook case of a sudden crush. Poké Ball Peril Team Rocket introduces the concept of PokéShipping officially into the anime. Near the end of the episode, James says "I think we may have captured a pair of romantic creatures in our little cage" after which Jessie swoons and Meowth blurts out, "They're lovebirds!". The idea of Ash and Misty as a couple becomes the major sub-theme throughout the subsequent Orange Season, culminating into events in the 2nd movie. Ash and Misty deny it all, of course. Navel Maneuvers Danny, the Navel Island Gym Leader, quickly picks up on the nature of Ash and Misty's relationship during one of their arguments and says, "I can see the two of you are pretty close". After Misty asks what he meant by that, he replied, "What's that saying? 'You always hurt the one you love...". Danny, much like Team Rocket before him, is clearly observing something beyond friendship between Ash and Misty, thus reconfirming the idea of AAML in the Orange Season. Wherefore Art Thou, Pokémon After the Nidoran kiss and evolve, Tracey comments about whether the battle or the kiss made them evolve. The idea of kissing embarrasses Misty and provokes Ash to ask the question, "Do people change when they get kissed?", after which Misty answers to him, "Guess we'll have to find out ourselves..." It doesn't get any more obvious than that. Misty Meets Her Match This entire episode alone serves as conclusive evidence that Misty not only likes Ash but possibly has developed a case of young love for him. Rudy, the Trovita Island Gym Leader, has a case of "love at first sight" with Misty after she saves his sister Mahri. After several advances from Rudy, Misty agrees to what is essentially an impromptu date with Rudy, leaving Ash and Tracey to themselves. According to accounts of the original Japanese version, during the dance after the date, Rudy not only asked Misty to stay on the island, but to marry him. What is significant here is that Misty was actually considering his proposal, evidenced by the fact that she didn't refuse him outright. Throughout Ash's gym battle with Rudy, Misty clearly showed which boy meant more to her, finally rooting for Ash in the end. Rudy finally sums up the entire theme of this episode in three words, "She wants him," thus continuing the theme of AAML along with Danny and Team Rocket. The Power of One P2K, otherwise known as 'The Power of One', or 'Revelation Lugia' is the conclusion to everything related to Misty's love for Ash in the Orange Season. In this movie, Misty gets competition in the form of Melody, the Festival Maiden of the Legend Ceremony. Melody, upon greeting our heroes, immediately comes up to Ash and plants a kiss on his cheek, provoking a glare of jealousy from Misty. Also, after Melody's performance at the festival party, she quickly kneels in front of Ash and grabs hold of his arm, provoking Misty to gasp and growl again in subdued jealousy. What really confirms Misty's love once and for all is found near the end of the movie, when Misty openly admits to Melody that Ash is "her burden" and goes off to rescue him in Melody's place, essentially cementing a "desired exclusivity" with Ash. The Light Fantastic When Misty introduces Ash to this ep's Nurse Joy, Joy quickly exclaims, "What a little cutie!", referring to Pikachu on Ash's head. But Misty and Brock mistakenly think she's referring to Ash. Brock is left completely shocked, but Misty not only gets shocked, but quickly develops the same jealous expression she displayed when Melody flirted with Ash; proof positive she still has the same feelings for Ash even in the notoriously unshippy Johto season. The Heartbreak of Brock While giving a pep talk to Brock about pursuing a possible relationship with Temaku, Misty says, "Take it from me, it's a lot easier to like someone who likes you than to like someone who doesn't." Brock then asks her "How do you know?", after which Misty gasps, blushes, then coyly replies "Well that's...what I've heard..." Misty is clearly referring to her crush on Ash. It is clear she is not referring to Brock (much to the dismay of GymShippers) since she is openly encouraging Brock to pursue Temaku, and her history clearly shows she wants Ash. Love, Pokémon Style When Macy first invites Ash out to lunch, Misty quickly cuts in between the two and comments that Ash is "booked". Later in the same scene, Macy question's Misty's right to interrupt in Ash's personal affairs when she's not his girlfriend. Misty looks quite unimpressed as Macy continues to flirt with Ash. Gotta Catch Ya Later Editor's note: This episode is currently under debate on the merits of some scenes. Therefore this episode's entry should be considered incomplete.

The departure of Misty from the group is a very emotional affair. After all is said and done, Misty says to herself, "Well, Ash Ketchum, finally, I know how you feel about me". A Date With Delcatty In the original version, Misty initially rejects Georgio because there is "someone else". Taking into account of Misty's evident feelings in the series prior to this episode, it is inferred that Misty was making a reference to Ash. Luvdisc is a Many Splendored Thing When discussing the romantic issues between the Luvdisc, the way by which Misty encourages Luverin to never give up is delivered with such intensity that it is implied that she shares the same attitude for her feelings towards Ash. Ash's List of Evidence Even PokéShippers will admit that Ash has not shown any overt proof of liking Misty. This reality often provokes shippers opposed to PokéShipping (especially PalletShippers) to question Ash's sexual orientation as well. However, what we do believe is that Ash is capable of liking Misty, and furthermore, that Ash is undeniably heterosexual. This list combines evidence of both those facts.

School of Hard Knocks Ash and Brock gawk and blush over a picture of Giselle, the top beginner at Pokémon Tech. Later in this episode when Giselle appears in person, Ash grows big puppy dog eyes, blushes heavily, and comments, "She's real pretty, isn't she?". Much to the dismay of PalletShippers, this proves that Ash is attracted to females. Ash has never shown any definitive attraction to his own sex. Ghost of Maiden's Peak: Our hero does a double take when Misty appears with her hair down and dressed in a formal kimono. Upon seeing her, the camera switches to his perspective, the bubbly background usually associated with passionate moments is used, romantic harp strings are played, and Misty's surprised facial expression clearly shows she is being looked at with interest. Also, the entire theme of the episode was romance-oriented, so it's only logical to assume this scene between Ash and Misty is as well. Princess vs. Princess Ash, thinking Misty is entering the Princess Festival Contest to take a picture with the movie star host, gets a little jealous, groaning with his arms crossed, "You must really want that picture with Fiorello...". Surprisingly, Misty reassures him she's only doing it for the doll set. Ash, whether he's aware of it or not, feels threatened by the presence of another male in Misty's life. Navel Maneuvers Climbing Navel Island's central mountain, Misty tells Danny the gym leader to be extra careful. Seeing how much concern Misty is giving to Danny, Ash with the same jealous expression yells, "What's she so worried about him for?!". He's distracted so much by Misty's little crush on Danny that he loses his concentration and falls down the mountain a bit. Much like his behavior in "Princess vs. Princess", another male getting Misty's attention seems to bother him. Hints For those already convinced about PokéShipping, there do exist events which suggest inconclusively, something along the lines of romance. But the difference between hints and proofs are that proofs are essentially ironclad and undebatable in contemporary debate, whereas hints are quite debatable, and are open to interpretation. The following is a listing of some that are considered to be debatable hints, all of which vary in strength and worth.

Showdown at Pewter City Misty is surprisingly eager to start a Pokémon-sharing relationship with Ash in this episode and gets very upset when Ash refuses. Later, while Ash is charging up Pikachu's electric sacs, Misty again offers help to Ash and gets snubbed. She then grumbles and says, "What do I care..." and runs off. Misty somewhat admits by her behavior and dialogue that she's really interested in getting to know him better. Clefairy and the Moon Stone Misty, at the beginning of this episode, continually keeps mentioning how "romantic" the surroundings are. She continues to do this not only in this episode, but subsequent episodes as well. The Waterflowers of Cerulean City At the outskirts of Cerulean City, Misty attempts to dissuade Ash from going into the city by tempting him to go to Vermilion City. She does so by mentioning the "neat Pokémon, the yachts pulling into the harbor, and a spot way up on a hill where you can sit and watch a romantic sunset". The mentioning of a romantic scene subtly suggests what she might have intended for all along, especially with how many times she's talked about romantic things in previous episodes. Pokémon Scent-sation! Misty unaware that Ash is disguised as a girl among the crowd, using the same girlish demeanor she used in "Ash Catches A Pokémon", dreamily admits to the group, "I wish Ash would've heard that story..." She openly is expressing a desire for Ash's presence. Also, during Ash's gym battle with Erika, the girls in the crowd start acknowledging Ash's skill and how much more impressive he is than he looks, provoking Misty to smile with reassurance. The Legend of Dratini At the beginning of this episode, Ash is marching and singing the show's theme song (I think). Misty is right behind him and longingly stares at him until they reach the Safari Zone warden's house. After Ash sings out his last lines, Misty imitates his enthusiasm and sings her own lines as well. You know the old saying, "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery." March of the Exeggutor Squad Misty goes into perhaps the most extreme fits of blushing in the history of the series, all provoked by a simple compliment from Ash about her skimpy stage outfit. No one blushes like that out of mere embarrassment. She clearly holds Ash's opinion of her in exclusive priority. The Misty Mermaid At the end of this episode, Ash tells Misty how amazing she was at her performance of the underwater play. Misty disproportionately calls Ash's comments "sweet talk" and reminds him of the bike he owes her, something she supposedly forgot about back on Cinnabar Island. Make Room for Gloom Upon arriving at the Xanadu Nursery, Brock spies on a pretty girl behind the window, after which Ash comes to look and says he doesn't see a pretty girl. Misty then says, "Just turn around" and giggles, clearly addressing Ash. Ash then jokes about her hallucinating, then starts chuckling. Ash, finally spotting a Gloom behind the window, asks Brock if "he's getting 'misty' over a gloom," This causes Misty to pull Ash's mouth wide with her fingers and ask him what is he saying about her, mistaking Ash's 'misty' comment with herself. Both seem to be blushing in the midst of their playfulness. Forest Grumps At the beginning of the episode, Ash and Misty are surprisingly close to one another while tending to their Pokémon. Brock on the other hand is away from them asleep behind a tree. Upon reunion, Ash and Misty exclaim each other's names in joy while the camera focuses on their faces. What's interesting to note is how the scripting and animation seem to focus just on their reunion alone. Scott and The Battle Frontier!! When Ash finally arrives home after his travels in Hoenn, he finds Misty at his house. She makes a point of being there, specifically so that she could see Ash as soon as he arrived back from Hoenn even though she apparently has no idea how soon exactly he would be returning. For all she knew, she could have been expecting a wait spanning multiple weeks. Azurill is a good excuse to go down there but it does not explain her behaviour: Why did she stay at Ash's mother's house, and not at the Oak labs? Why was she waiting at Ash's mother's house for days and days for Ash's arrival, especially given that they didn't know exactly how long Ash would take to return? Why was she so concerned about getting to see Ash as soon as he arrived? How can her somewhat wistfully delivered line of how Ash is the same as always be explained? Why couldn't she have simply delayed her trip down there until Ash had already arrived? evidence--Rat235478683--

That discussion concluded a while ago, and should never have taken place. This talk page is for discussing ways to improve the article, not shipping. Anything decided on in this discussion cannot go into the article because anything from the anime counts as original research because it is not explicitly stated. Also, we've all read the Bulbapedia article on the subject, so this is just taking up space. THL 21:49, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, Misty likes Ash.--Rat235478683--

Misty Williams

According to imdb, Misty's last name is Williams. Can anyone confirm that? - Plau

see: ]

Misty has no official last name at the moment. I am also pretty sure that May's surname is not Oak! Sonic Mew | talk to me 16:24, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

That would be one sucky name. I think her last name's "Waterflower." Darth Katana X 06:26, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

"Waterflower" is also a fanon name, however. Sonic Mew 16:58, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

"Waterflower"? That's a little too obvious, wouldn't you say? 65.103.86.243

She doesn't have one...Leave it at that. Michael 00:18, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Kid-- Stop replying to outdated comments. The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 14:34, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Prima

I know this is minor, but the line about it being debateable if Prima is in fact Lorelei isn't correct. I guess not many know this, but the Japanese name of the episode she appears in was "Shitennou Kanna! Koori no tatakai!!" As Shitennou is the Japanese name for the Elite Four and means "Four Kings of the Sky" (or more commonly Four Emperors) and Kanna is Lorelei's Japanese name, the best English title would have been "Lorelei of the Elite Four! Ice Battle!" The English version episode was called "The Mandarin Island Miss Match."

So Prima is or is not Lorelei? I don't think that clears it up; I have been wondering about this since I first saw the episode. Michael 00:20, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Don't be too pessamistic

The regular VA is going to come back. Don't worry. 71.111.215.224 21:25, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

OK, I've changed most of the character pages to not be so pessamistic. The VAs won't be replaced. If that's vandalism, please forgive me. 71.111.215.224 22:49, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Do you mean pessimistic? 70.113.220.11 19:01, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Misty's age

In episode three Kasumi after finding Caterpie asleep beside her she says 「今日まで生きてきて十年間最低最悪の朝だわ」which loosely translated means "This is the worst morning I've ever had in my 10 years of life!" 70.113.220.11 19:01, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow, is that really true? Perhaps you could post that fragment somehow, so we all can see? - Face 20:40, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

I dunno...maybe Misty was talking about one set of ten years, in which an extra six was good. Woah, I'm jumping to conclusions. 70.58.211.220

Listen carefully, I won't be saying this again -- Forget about the damn unverifiable ages. The Raven's Apprentice 15:04, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Well I think it was said in the anime that Misty is older than Ash, and Ash was 10 when he left on his journey. He was approximately 12 in Johto I believe. In the third episode she'd have been around 11 probably. Cao Wei 06:07, 27 July 2006 (UT

Wow those are horribly irresponsible parents... lol. Lordofchaosiori 16:06, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

*Yawns* Just keep your theories away from the article until you have concrete, reliable, verifiable sources to back them. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 15:32, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Why did Misty leave?

Does anyone know why the makers of the show chose to have Misty leave Ash and company? I think this would be important to add to the article. --Brandon Dilbeck 21:28, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

The writers never publicly revealed why. --The Raven's Apprentice 06:06, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

She was just more expendable than Brock when it came to introducing May and Max. --Sonic Mew 20:14, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Atheist?

Well, Misty is an atheist. She does not believe in God.

For example, let's say that she's a Catholic. I am sure they would at least show a scene where she is praying to God, saints, or the Virgin Mary, going to mass, or worrying about commiting a "mortal sin" if that is true. But she does not act because she's afraid God will send her to hell for doing something akin to a "mortal sin" nor does she pray at all. Since Misty does not display ANY religiousness (for any religion), it is safe to say she is an atheist.

134.139.21.29 20:53, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Pikachu's also athiest, right? Because Pikachu never goes to church in any of the episodes I've seen. Squirtle was also never seen praying, if I'm correct. And Bulbasaur never once said anything religious. And Charmander, Pidgeotto, Butterfree—none of them carry a bible or anything. Joking aside, since it doesn't seem to be very significant to her character that she doesn't follow any religion (or maybe she does but we don't see it in the cartoon), I'm going to go ahead and remove her from the category of fictional athiests. Please refrain from adding every Pokémon species article to the fictional athiests category, too. --Brandon Dilbeck 21:07, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

How can a Pokemon be an atheist or religious? Humans practice religion, not Pokemon. I doubt most Pokemon are capable of understanding religious beliefs like humans are. 134.139.21.29 21:19, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

I never see Misty work with a camera, does that mean she doesn't know how? We don't know, and just like her religion, it doesn't belong on the wikipedia article. Sonic3KMaster 21:33, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Also, could you imagine Pikachu recieving communion? It is not practical, how could anyone imagine Pikachu going to Church. Well, Misty has been around for about two hundred episodes and she did not show any signs of religious beliefs at all. How could Bulbasaur say anything religious without Meowth to translate it. And Squirtle spends most of his time in the Pokeball. And where do you think Charmander, Butterfree, and Pidgeotto might get a Bible from? Maybe they converted when Ash let them free (Charmander being a Charizard, of course), but as I said before, only humans practice religion, not animals or Pokemon.

Well Misty nevers thanks God for anything too. Who does Misty thank when she wins a Pokemon battle? She did not pray for Charizard's health (nor did Ash Ketchum) after Tad's Polywrath used Ice Beam on Charizard.

So where is the evidence that Misty believes in ANYTHING that is supernatural (How do you know she might practice a religion, but not in the anime?). Remember, you have about 300 episodes of Pokemon to show that she does. In the absence of such evidence, it is safe to say that she is an atheist. 134.139.24.226 20:33, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, there's no evidence to suggest that she is athiest (unless you can find a reputable website that tells that she is). Making your own assumptions based on a lack of occurrences in a cartoon is original research, and you're not supposed to add information to Misplaced Pages unless you can find sources for these facts. So show us some resources or else you can't add her to the category of athiests. --Brandon Dilbeck 20:40, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Well why is it wrong to say her religion's unknown. I only got interested in this once I say the talk page. I have seen about 300 Pokemon episodes and I have never seen her do anything religious. So that statement I added is accurate. 4.232.174.45 00:25, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

• The fact that there is no evidence of her practicing other religions is not proof of Atheism; it is a complete lack of proof for anything.
• Unless it makes a difference, when something is unknown we do not mention it in the article. The character's religion, or lack of one, obviously does not matter because it does not affect any decisions that they make.

In conclusion, the lack of proof for atheism, and the complete unimportance of religion in the Pokémon series is keeping this stuff out of the article. Besides, she would be Buddhist if she were anything, Christianity is a minor religion in Japan, and Satoshi Tajiri had one of those reverse swastica things put in a trading card, so he's probably Buddhist. The Hybrid 02:09, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's at least worth noting in the article that she does not practice any religion at all in the anime. Personally, I have stopped watching Pokemon after May and Max got added to the plot. In all the episodes I've seen she doesn't practice religion at all. I think this should be mentioned in the article, as it's an interesting piece of triva. Well, at least keep that in the article because of it. I do think it's premature to say she's an atheist. 4.232.72.151 12:47, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

That's stupid. She doesn't kiss Max in the anime, either. Maybe we should make a couple hundred megabytes dedicated to things she doesn't do? -Amarkov 13:09, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

There is a major difference between interesting and important. Only the latter is allowed to make it into articles. Also, we do not share your deffinition of interesting. This is why interesting doesn't get into articles; who's definition of interesting are we supposed to follow? Religion plays no role in the anime; therefore, it is not important. The Hybrid22:21, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Hybrid-No stereotyping please. Alvin6226 02:47, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I didn't realise that I had. Where did I stereotype? The Hybrid Lives 04:46, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

I think he meant not to speak for others about what we all think is interesting. --Brandon Dilbeck 04:53, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh ok, I'll watch that in the future, sorry. The Hybrid Lives

Well, Misty is atheist. Here's the definition of atheist on wikipedia:

"Strong or positive atheism is the belief that gods do not exist. It is a form of explicit atheism. A strong atheist consciously rejects theism and may even argue that certain deities logically cannot exist.

Weak or negative atheism is the absence both of the belief that gods exist and of the the belief that gods do not exist. In other words, anyone who is neither a theist nor a strong atheist is a weak atheist."

So Misty is a weak atheist because she has an absence in the belief of the existence of god or gods. Does anyone have evidence that does possess some belief in the supernatural? 134.139.24.182 19:09, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Religion is not once mentioned in this article. Religion is not once mentioned in this series. Religion is not once mentioned in any Pokémon game, anime, or manga. The burden is on you, Mr. Anon, to provide some reference in a reliable source that refers to Misty as an atheist. Until then, knock it off. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 19:20, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

So Pokemon depicts a world where religion does not exist. Is that what you are saying? 134.139.24.182 19:30, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

No, it is just that IN THE DEPICTION, there is no religion. For instance, just because a certain novel does not happen to mention pianos does not mean it is set in a world without pianos. It's just that pianos are irrelevant to the plot of the novel. The same thing happens here. -Amarkov 21:35, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

• Religion doesn't get into the TV show, the games, or the manga. That doesn't mean that it doesn't exist in the Pokémon world. A lack of proof that Misty practices religion is not proof for Atheism. There is no evidence at all for anything. A lack of evidence for one side is not evidence for the other; Misplaced Pages just doesn't work that way. Religion or no religion in the Pokémon world, it is completely irrelevant to the plot. In my opinion, Athiest or not none of this deserves to get into the article.
• This whole thing is completely irrelevant. Besides, do you really think the writers thought that far ahead? Misty is nothing, the writers didn't give her a religion, just like they didn't give her a last name. Misty is a cartoon character, it is a complete waiste of time to debate things that the writers never decided.
• Also, without reliable, secondary sources we are not allowed to put this into the article. Putting this into the article violates one of the 5 pillars of Misplaced Pages, so it cannot be done. THL 05:46, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

I am not the person who keeps saying that Misty is atheist, but it is correct to say her religion is unknown, so that is why that information should be added to the article. 4.232.174.114 16:30, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

We have never seen Misty consume human flesh, should we say that it is unknown if she is a cannibal? THL 16:53, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Lol, are you implying that it is unknown Misty might be a Catholic with the human flesh example?... You should read this wiki article: Transubstantiation.

LOL. Yes, I am a ex-catholic. I can't believe I fell for that stuff. I'm actually laughing right now just thinking about it. THL

Do not put this thing in the article again. We have yet to reach a consensus. THL 16:55, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Anyway, do you see what I am saying though? THL

umm... what had happened!?

Someone edited out the part of the article that says that "There was a huge uproar on Misty leaving that agitated misty fans and they tried to get her back, but so far their cries have gone unheard." and the sad part is, that statement is actually true. See, Pokecommunity, Serebiiforums, Bulbagarden, and the tcg player forums actually had quite an amount of these clubs and topics (and unfortunately, flamewars kind of started by May fans and my own brethren (ie, Misty fans.) alike.). They may be fansites, but since there was quite an amount of these threads asking these and saying that she must return (And thus leading credence to the sources of that line.) that should not have been deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.32.187.30 (talk • contribs)

Forums aren't considered a reliable source. Sorry. -Amarkov 18:22, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Er, wouldn't it count as a primary source in this case? Am I missing something? --Sonic Mew 18:31, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, you're probably right. A secondary source would still be nice. -Amarkov 18:40, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

More Misty Atheism

Maybe Misty converted to Catholicism and became a nun and eats human flesh after her sisters came back to Cerulean City ;). If that happens, goodbye Misty as she cannot be a Pokemon trainer in a convent, I really loved her atheism :). 134.139.21.41 21:46, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Well I hope that does not happen, I really liked Misty and I hate May and Max so much. 4.232.174.88 02:31, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, it's always funny to the people who don't have to deal with the crap. Though, I must admit, this one was actually pretty fun. THL 05:12, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

At the risk of stirring things up again, Misty was actually seen holding a cross to ward of bad spirits in one episode. (The Ghost of Maiden's Peak). --Sonic Mew 21:35, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

That may be, but she was also using items used to ward off vampires in conjunction with it - garlic, a stake, and a hammer. In short, she may simply have tried to turn (scare off) the Gastly using the cross WITH the zombie-hunting equipment. -Jeske 21:43, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Because of the cross thing, do you want to add her to the category of "Fictional Christians"? Or the cross can take on some none-religious meaning? I will be interesting to see the latter perspective's arguments because I find it extremely hard to imagine that Misty is Christian. I think it is best to say her religion is unknown and not to state if she is an atheist or not. 4.232.174.88 02:23, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

I will add her to the category of fictional Christians, so post your objections here after you delete it. Or you might think that she IS Christian, and there would be no need of removing it. The cross thing shows that she is a Christian. 134.139.24.37 00:48, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Yet you ignore the fact she was also wielding tools for vampire-hunting, and a cross is linked with general persecution of the undead. She was trying to use them WITH the cross. -Jeske 00:54, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

This whole religious discussion is pointless. Even if we were to come up with something from the Pokémon universe that made perfect sense, there are no notable, secondary sources for any of this. I doubt there are even non-notable secondary sources. None of this can end up in the article, because anything we come up with is original research. THL 23:06, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, come on. This whole Misty thing so not Blastoise. We've got to have sources for these articles I really want to see a good source for this Misty business. --Brandon Dilbeck 00:26, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

What's that supposed to mean that it is "'so' not Blastoise"? I don't get the Blastoise part. 4.232.174.88 02:18, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Its a joke. The Blastoise article was vandalized by someone very creative. They added a section called Blastoise in Language or something like that; naming supposed catchphrases having Blastoise in them that were used around San Jose. One of them was That is so not Blastoise, meaning that the thing being talked about wasn't as cool as Blastoise. THL 11:58, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Explaining the joke is so not Blastoise. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 12:34, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm sorry, please don't kick my Arseus.THL 12:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Enough. Consensus has clearly been established that Fictional (religion) is not appropriate for this article. I have sprotected it to keep the single anon from constantly reinserting these ridiculous categories. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 00:54, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, could we just say the Misty is an empiricist then? She only believes in the existence of things that we can see. 134.139.24.37 01:16, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

How about we stop speculating as to the religious or spiritual beliefs of a character in a children's cartoon? - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 01:19, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, she is a skeptic, just say that... it does not imply anything religious at all. Misty does not believe in anything dogmatically, and always uses analytical reasoning. 134.139.24.37 01:21, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Please provide a reliable source that calls her a skeptic. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 01:23, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Besides, if we're going to call her a skeptic, why not say she's of undecided sexual orientation, too? -Amarkov 01:25, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you so much for protecting this article. Now, IP(s) we will not add anything to this article until you provide us with sources. Anything that you come up with is original research unless it has a source, and putting it in the article is not allowed. Don't take this the wrong way, but everything you all have said thus far has been completely and totally useless because it doesn't have sources. It is like you have simply ignored what I have been saying. Come back with a source, or don't come back at all. That is what policy dictates, and that is final. THL 01:34, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Now, can we just ignore them unless they come back with sources? THL

How about adding the fact that Misty was fishing when she first met Ash. That could be verified by looking at an episode summary or by having access to the first episode of the show. 134.139.24.37 01:43, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Um... Is there a point you're trying to make there? Because I missed it if there was. -Amarkov 01:45, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Those facts are what we like to call Fancruft. Stop trying our patience, come back with sources or don't come back at all. THL 01:50, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

:::: Well, watch that episode, she was fishing in the first episode when she met Ash. After that Ash "borrowed" her bike. After the first episodes, she forgets about why she followed Ash in the first place, until Ash wins his badge from Blaine after defeating a tough Magmar. Misty then remembers that Ash destroyed his bike when they are leaving Cinnabar Island to go to Viridian City.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=mTQ--_N1_-k

She also coaches Ash in the Indigo conference, except in the battle with Jeanette Fisher on the grass field. I think that info should be added. I do not think that is speculative like her religion (or lack of it). Again, it is in those episodes.

But, this isn't the place to add every single little detail on Misty. Adding oodles of minutiae is about as good as playing Russian Roulette with a gumwad-loaded revolver. -Jeske 01:56, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

The anime is a primary source, by the way. Basically, what you want added to the article is the definition of fancruft. THL 01:58, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Now I have to go. Please, read Misplaced Pages's policies. If you are doing this in bad faith, stop. I assume good faith to a point, but COME ON! THL 02:03, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Nope, it does state in the article that... "However, this plot point later becomes moot, as Misty actually forgets why she started traveling with him in the first place". Well, she does remember it in that episode, rendering that statement false. She was also upset. I'll stop with the atheism thing, but please acknowledge (in here, not the article) that it is a possibility. I am saddened that the writers did not explicitly state her religious beliefs. Fine, I'll stop with her philosophical and metaphysical beliefs. 134.139.24.37 02:08, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, of course it is a POSSIBILITY. But that doesn't mean it's important enough of one to take note of. -Amarkov 03:23, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

It must be remembered that only important things get into articles. THL 13:57, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

And I'll acknowledge that had the writers given any of the characters religious standpoints, atheism would be a likely candidate for hers. THL 14:00, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Do not edit my user page. I know that what you were saying on it wasn' in bad faith, and definatly wasn't vandalism. Please, if you want to talk to me, use my talk page by clicking my green L; you do not edit someone's user page. Yes, I am an atheist, but I don't get into cartoon characters enough to wonder about their religion; mainly because the writers don't think that far ahead.. THL 00:43, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

New Hoenn Image Needed

A bot removed the unsourced image of Misty in her Hoenn outfit. Does anyone have a sourced image of her? THL 14:32, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Would hacking Serebii's image help? --The Raven's Apprentice 15:23, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

EDIT: By the power of Google bestowed upon me by the kindness of the Internet, I have detected that the original image came from here. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 15:28, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

That was fast! Thanks RA. If you haven't already, could you list it as a source; I don't know how to do that. I'll go ahead and restore the image. THL 17:18, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Anything for Misty! Anyways, added the source, and I do hope that OrphanBot doesn't go a step further by asking where they got the image from; it's a Freewebs site, displaying the images on it is probably copyvio as well. --The Raven's Apprentice 03:47, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

That is one of the advantages of bots, they cannot think. Anyways, thanks again. Cheers THL 05:02, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Why do you keep thanking me?! The article isn't anyone's private property, we're all supposed to manage it. Shall we now tweak the Wikimedia software to make it thank an editor every time they make an edit? Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 05:44, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

I was just trying to be polite. You saved me a lot of time reading about what pictures work on Misplaced Pages, how to upload them, and finding an image for the article. I was just trying to show appreciation for doing something that I had requested. Anyways, happy editing. THL 03:22, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Excessive politeness can be a bit irritating sometimes. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 05:46, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Gaaaaaaaah, shaddup the both o' yas! --Brandon Dilbeck 14:01, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Now, that's more like it. (Esperanzians would disagree, of course). --The Raven's Apprentice 14:07, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Just as I prophesied would happen, it's been tagged again. An invisible comment on the Image Page: Where was this image originally published? A random freewebs site isn't a sufficient source We have A Man In Black's legal ethics to thank for this. --The Raven's Apprentice 12:45, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Huh, I just saw this. Yeah, if a Pokémon image gets tagged as problematic, it's probably me doing it. In general, we need to know where the image was originally published, who scanned it (if applicable), what copyright status it's under, and if it's fair-use what our rationale for fair use is. Images found on random websites are almost never kosher. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 12:51, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

But the fact remains that "A thief isn't a thief until he (or she)'s caught." Unfortunately, you caught us, and now we'll have to find another Hoenn image. Yours irritatedly, The Raven's Apprentice 13:05, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

This really sucks! THL 23:01, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

My reaction to A Man In Black's abiding by laws. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 03:39, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Nice. THL 04:42, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Gentlemen (and ladies?), I present before you Image:Misty AG.jpg, hacked from Serebii.net. May the law be Misted over! May the Black be covered up by the Blue of the Mist! --The Raven's Apprentice 05:34, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Sweet, I hope we can keep this one. THL 05:49, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

If someone would add what episode it's from it'd be okay. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 07:24, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

AAAAAAAARGH!! How does it matter?! Isn't the fact that it's from the anime enough?! Bow to the Mist! --The Raven's Apprentice 12:43, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

It isn't about what episode it is from, it is to show her new Hoenn outfit. THL 14:57, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

We need to know where this image was originally published. Referring to the Pokémon anime narrows it down to one of 400-some episodes and however many movies there are now. I can guess what season this is from based on the outfit, but a republisher of Misplaced Pages isn't going to know that. We need to know what episode. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 15:34, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Unfortunately, looks like I'll have to concede. Let's see-- She's only appeared in 5 episodes, and a few specials, in that outfit. So we just need to go through Serebii's images of those episodes. But I have an important school project to start tomorrow, so I can't do that. Anyone? --The Raven's Apprentice 15:46, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

I'll do it. THL 21:51, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Episode 411: A Real Cleffa-Hanger. Episode 409 by American airings. Cheers THL 22:08, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Added to image page. Cheers, The Raven's Apprentice 13:50, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Yet more Misty atheism

Until I removed it a while ago, an entry on the Misty dab read: Misty (atheist), an Atheist
Needless to say, the article redirects to this one. --The Raven's Apprentice 15:54, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

By the way, I just found this MISTY1. Now, who copied what from whom? --The Raven's Apprentice 16:00, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Odd. Misty (atheist) is up for deletion, by the way.

It WAS, anyway. As well I forgot to sign or I wouldn't have seen the redlink. -Amarkov 00:07, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Never mind, it was a spelling error. Ignore the above post. -Amarkov 02:37, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I recomended it for speedelete because it was vandalism. Apparantly they listened; I feel special :) THL 01:41, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, I addded it there, but it is not deleted yet. You should learn how to spell "atheist" ok! I will not add her to the category of atheist anymore. I really love Misty, and I hate the fact that she left.

Best wishes 134.139.24.70 01:57, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Awww, I don't feel special anymore :( THL 01:59, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

MISTY LIKES ASH!

The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.

No. It's a POV violation however you try to spin it. Until an official source says otherwise. -Amarkov 00:08, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.

Didn't you listen? That's POV, not fact. Sign your comments please.--SUIT 00:19, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

No. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

You know, if you really believed it should be in the article, you would put it in yourself. -Amarkov 00:26, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

O.K.--Rat235478683--

You misunderstand. I wasn't inviting you to do it... -Amarkov 00:41, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

If it is added again, it'll probably be reverted.--SUIT 00:48, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

O.K. and it's a shame too. I thought Misplaced Pages was a site that told the facts and it's as clear as day that Misty likes Ash. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

I don't know where you got the idea that Misplaced Pages was supposed to have all the information you can find on everything. It isn't. -Amarkov 01:09, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

O.K. and it's a shame too. I thought Misplaced Pages was a site that told the facts and it's as clear as day that Misty likes Ash. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

But it ISN'T a fact. It's speculation. When an official site says "MISTY LOVES ASH!!! STOP ARGUING ABOUT IT!!!", you can add it. -Amarkov 01:14, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Until then, don't add it.--SUIT 01:15, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Stop repeating yourself, Rat23478683. The anime doesn't say it EXPLICITLY (meaning word for word); therefore, it is original research and putting it in the article violates one of the 5 pillars of Misplaced Pages. It will not be in the article, sorry. THL 01:33, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

It would appear that Rat23478683 has put us on a list of enemies located on his user page, I feel special :) THL 01:42, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Returning to the point: A few sources do say that Misty likes Ash. There's Misty's Song, for one, and Misty's goodbye in "Gotta Catch Ya Later". OK, so both of them probably didn't originate from Japan, but they're still official as far as the English version goes, and references to them should be included. The real problem lies in doing that from NPOV, and keeping it that way. --The Raven's Apprentice 13:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

As an afterthought: I don't know if the entry's still there, but pokemon.com, when asked whether Misty would ever be returning to the show, started blabbering about the wonders of love in an attempt to distract the fan. --The Raven's Apprentice 13:57, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I think the only reason Rat235478683 keeps repeating the same argument is because that's the only argument he or she has (and it isn't a very good one, for obvious reasons). Also, if we were to simply state that Misty has had feelings for Ash, and provide a good, reliable source for the statement, I don't foresee any POV issues, except that "novice editors" would probably come around and try to expand it until there's bad information that's not sourced. --Brandon Dilbeck 13:59, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

The pokemon.com entry is still there. Go to the site, check the Mailbag, flip to the second page of the "Recent Mailbags" section, and click the "How to Catch Deoxys Explained" topic. Last question there. Can't get clearer. So much for AdvanceShippers. Cheers! --The Raven's Apprentice 14:16, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure there is a good, reliable, source, which is why I didn't think it should go in. But if you can find one, just put it in. -Amarkov 14:23, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

The song and the episode can be cited as sources. But if you're looking for secondary sources, you might as well forget about editing Pokémon-related articles; you're never gonna find any for anything. --The Raven's Apprentice 14:26, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Secondary sources I would actually trust less, here. I just didn't know that there were primary sources. -Amarkov 14:30, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm suprised to; I figured they were saving the answers for the last episode or something. THL 14:47, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I guess it doesn't get much clearer than that. Should we put also put in the article that she will be returning? THL 14:50, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

They never said she'd be returning. --The Raven's Apprentice 15:12, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

It was so heavely implied tha they might as well have. Normally I oppose putting things that are implied in articles, but that was the most extreme case of implying something I have ever seen. THL

The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

You should hear yourself!

The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. No. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. O.K. and it's a shame too. I thought Misplaced Pages was a site that told the facts and it's as clear as day that Misty likes Ash. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. O.K. and it's a shame too. I thought Misplaced Pages was a site that told the facts and it's as clear as day that Misty likes Ash. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.

Care to provide any sources for us, Rat235478683 (t c)? --Brandon Dilbeck 20:53, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I do. You guys are in denial, knowing I'm right and you're wrong. The heading says it all. Put it in the article, please.--Rat235478683--

Oh ya Brandon Dilbeck they thing you wrote about, "I think the only reason Rat235478683 keeps repeating the same argument is because that's the only argument he or she has (and it isn't a very good one, for obvious reasons). Also, if we were to simply state that Misty has had feelings for Ash, and provide a good, reliable source for the statement, I don't foresee any POV issues, except that "novice editors" would probably come around and try to expand it until there's bad information that's not sourced.", you sure will be editing it alot. SCREW YOU! --Rat235478683--