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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Tone 16:08, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Feyzullah Aktürk

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Not nearly enough in-depth coverage from independent reliable sources to pass GNG, and doesn't meet NSPORTS. Onel5969 23:13, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete as a sportsperson only having achieved in junior level. I more than welcome the article back when the subject has achieved in the senior World Championships. Geschichte (talk) 10:10, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
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Delete Success at the junior level is not sufficient to meet WP:NSPORT or WP:MANOTE. I think there's a good chance he'll have success at the adult level and can have an article then, but right now that requires a WP:CRYSTALBALL. Papaursa (talk) 04:30, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Screw the SNG, this individual meets the GNG. How exactly did you come to the conclusion that he didn't anyways? This source of Milliyet and this one of Fanatik, both reliable, independent and significant and about different things, were already in the article before nomination. In addition to that I found another source of Fanatik, another one by Milliyet, this piece by Habertürk and this article by TRT. ~Styyx 20:54, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Reporting that consists solely of sports results and an article about the state of Turkish wrestling do not constitute significant coverage of this particular individual. Papaursa (talk) 23:52, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

It does, if the individual is a major part of the articles.

Delete. The sources provided in the article and AfD are routine and not SIGCOV. JoelleJay (talk) 02:41, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep passes GNG.--Ortizesp (talk) 02:44, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete: Per Nom, and users Geschichte, Papaursa, and JoelleJay. Screwing GNG would likely fall under "Arguments to avoid". The five points of GNG are inclusive and not discretionary and help determine if a subject has passing or lasting and sustained coverage. A BLP needs more than fan coverage and sports scores. Also, multiple use of the same sources count as one towards notability. It is likely just too soon unless there is more independent coverage out there than I could find. -- Otr500 (talk) 19:07, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete fails WP:GNG though lack of significant coverage; I agree with the source assessment table. BilledMammal (talk) 02:37, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Source assessment table
Source	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
https://www-milliyet-com-tr.translate.goog/skorer/feyzullah-akturkten-altin-madalya-2886462?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp	Routine youth sports reporting: "According to the statement made by the Turkish Wrestling Federation, 97 kilosFeyzullah Akturk, defeated Moldovan Radu Lefter by pin and became the owner of the gold medal."	✘ No
https://www-fanatik-com-tr.translate.goog/feyzullah-akturkten-bronz-madalya-2082184?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp	Routine youth sports reporting: "National athlete Feyzullah Aktürk won the bronze medal in the men's freestyle 97 kilos at the World Youth Wrestling Championship. The national wrestler won the bronze medal by defeating his Chinese rival Reheman Rusidanmu, who came from repechage after his US and Ukrainian rivals, with the point key (11-1)."	✘ No
https://www-fanatik-com-tr.translate.goog/feyzullah-akturk-bronz-madalya-icin-yarisacak-2012461?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp	Routine youth sports reporting: "In the World Youth Wrestling Championship, national athlete Feyzullah Aktürk won the bronze medal match. At the World Junior Wrestling Championship held in Slovakia, national athlete Feyzullah Aktürk won the bronze medal match. Feyzullah Aktürk lost his chance to play for the gold medal by losing to Russian Magomedkhan Magomedov in the semi-final match of 97 kg. The national athlete will face his opponent from the repechage in the third place match."	✘ No
https://www.milliyet.com.tr/skorer/feyzullah-akturk-dunya-ucuncusu-oldu-2495473	Routine youth sports reporting: "National wrestler Feyzullah Aktürk, who hit the mat at 120 kg, defeated Bulgarian rival Daniel Milanov Veselinov 3-0 in his first match, and lost 3-1 to Iranian Naeiim Rahim Hassanzadeh in the quarterfinals. Playing in the repechage match after his opponent made it to the final, the national athlete won the bronze medal by defeating Polish Jakub Brylewski 2-0 and in the fight for third place, Mongolia's Erdenetulga Davaadorj 3-0."	✘ No
https://www.haberturk.com/kahramanmaras-haberleri/93079462-turkiye-serbest-gures-sampiyonasi-sona-erdiagir-siklette-feyzullah-akturk-altin-madalyanin	Routine sports reporting: " In the heavyweight division, Feyzullah Aktürk won the gold medal in the 92 kilograms category,"	✘ No
https://www-trtspor-com-tr.translate.goog/haber/diger-sporlar/gures/akturk-lapsekide-ciceklerle-karsilandi-246678.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp	4 sentences about his winning a medal and being congratulated by a mayor, plus a quote from the mayor.	✘ No
https://www.haberler.com/kirkpinar-baspehlivanlarindan-feyzullah-akturk-14263866-haberi/	4 sentences about his winning a medal and being congratulated by a mayor, plus a quote from the mayor.	✘ No
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/sports/turkey-wins-1-gold-7-bronze-in-junior-world-wrestling/1559245	Name listed among others	✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Coverage is exclusively routine and offers nothing in any depth (or even anything more than 4-5 brief sentences reporting match results). Fails GNG. JoelleJay (talk) 05:20, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete fails WP:GNG though lack of significant coverage as per the source assessment table above. Cassiopeia talk 05:03, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep. I don't really like these source assessment tables. Just because something is presented more elaborately, it doesn't make it true. The only point that the table makes is that the coverage of this person in RS is WP:ROUTINE, but there is no actual argument to back up this assertion - no, providing quotes doesn't make this an argument and just the fact that scores are reported doesn't mean that this is routine coverage. In fact, I would say that the coverage is explicitly non-routine e.g. looking at Milliyet's coverage of the World Junior Wrestling Championships, we see that they do not routinely report on this event, but only choose to report when there is a notable accomplishment by a Turkish national. The coverage is not there because Milliyet routinely reports on this tournament, it is there because Aktürk had a newsworthy accomplishment. This is the case for all the other news articles, and it is possible to weave together a decent, well-sourced biography using these sources. Remember that WP:ROUTINE covers "Planned coverage of scheduled events, especially when those involved in the event are also promoting it" - I don't see evidence of such planned coverage here. I also fail to see how these articles don't meet WP:SIGCOV - there is clearly no need for original research to extract information about the individual, and there is definitely more than a trivial mention of the person in these articles; his accomplishments are the main focus. I am also easily able to find other sources e.g. - note that Aktürk won the Kırkpınar Wrestling Tournanment (which has been held for over 600 years) and earned the title of başpehlivan, which is the most prestigious title in Turkish wrestling. I know this isn't in NSPORTS (although I don't truly see a difference from e.g. College Football Hall of Fame), but it does indicate that further sources are highly likely to be found. --GGT (talk) 14:08, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
I appreciate your giving such a thorough response. The quoted text in the table constitutes the entirety of the text on Akturk in a source, not just a snippet of it, and in most of the articles his performance is mentioned alongside that of all other Turkish competitors. SIGCOV is not achieved with three-sentence tournament recaps, and certainly not with the single sentence on him in Millyet (this is especially true for media coverage of youth athletics, which have stricter notability requirements). The Haberturk article you linked is syndicated ("All Çanakkale news, which is covered by Anadolu Agency, DHA, İHA, is included in this section as it comes automatically from the agency channels, without any editorial intervention by Haberturk.com editors") from the same İHA source as the penultimate two sources in the table. It is local routine signing coverage, and the lack of a byline additionally suggests it is a press release (other AA/İHA articles name the author). Syndicated articles are not intellectually independent of each other; a local paper changing the original news agency headline to highlight a local athlete's performance doesn't suddenly make the coverage non-routine or make him the main focus of an article. JoelleJay (talk) 22:33, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for a detailed reply. The bottom line regarding SIGCOV is that there is no need for original research to extract the content from the article and that it is a non-trivial mention. WP:SIGCOV explicitly states that we are not looking for him to be the main focus of the article - we're definitely not expecting a biographical treatise, and there is no arbitrary cutoff for the number of sentences needed to count as SIGCOV. Of course I'm not denying the brevity of the coverage in each individual source, but there is enough of it across various sources to weave together a good biography without any original research, entirely based upon reliable and independent sources - and that's all we need to clear GNG. Sports articles by Turkish news agencies do not regularly feature author names, so I disagree that this suggests that it is a press release in this instance; on the other hand, it does indicate a judgement of newsworthiness by a national news agency. Local wrestling signups aren't usually picked up by national news agencies as far as I can tell. I should finally note that I'm not too comfortable with the liberal use of copyrighted quotes in this discussion. They're not necessary to make the point and the amount quoted for some articles constitutes a rather significant part of the original work. I'm not convinced that these quotes can be regarded as fair use, so I suggest that you remove them. --GGT (talk) 00:42, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
So, I realize there is a lot of interpretation as to what SIGCOV means, and I think it's helpful to look at it in the context of the NSPORT guidelines as well as the consensus across other athlete AfDs. Firstly, it is extremely difficult for youth competitors to meet NSPORT, particularly because achievements at the youth level are almost never considered encyclopedic (else we would have articles on every Little League World Series player right off the bat _sorry). Nothing beyond brief mentions of his final results would be WP:DUE in an article on Akturk, not that there was much more info on him in any of the news reports anyway. And, per WP:YOUNGATH, NONE of those sources could contribute to notability: High school and pre-high school athletes are notable only if they have received, as individuals, substantial and prolonged coverage that is: (1) independent of the subject; and (2) clearly goes beyond WP:ROUTINE coverage... The second clause... especially excludes using game play summaries, statistical results, or routine interviews as sources to establish notability (emphasis mine).

Secondly, there are millions of people who do not meet any sport-specific notability guideline (SSG) but DO appear in a tremendous number of signing/transfer/draft/injury articles. If this was sufficient for SIGCOV the criterion for meeting basically every SSG would be "college athlete, or varsity HS athlete at a highly-ranked institution". But the community has come to the consensus that such material is not SIGCOV, and that is why sports scores (which is exactly what the first 5 sources are; they are strictly relaying the match outcomes announced to press agencies by the Turkish Wrestling Federation) are explicitly mentioned in WP:ROUTINE.

Regarding the AA agency link you provided, both the article and its picture are bylined: Suha Gur and Serhat Çağdaş, respectively. National news agencies have local chapters where material of local interest is reported, often directly from PR groups ; the IHA article on Akturk meeting a mayor is specifically curated in "Local News -- Canakkale", alongside an announcement that the president of a regional amateur sports league was reelected as its chairman and a report of someone being detained for growing marijuana (with a picture of the seized goods and adorable "ensitive-nosed drug-seeking dog 'Roket'"). JoelleJay (talk) 05:09, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 09:40, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete as some others have said, Junior level is not enough. He can have an article once he has made his name at the Senior level championships.-Imcdc (talk) 07:05, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

Keep. Today he won 2022 European Wrestling Championships, senior level, and ı don t understand what is ur problems with wrestler pages?

The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. I contemplated relisting this, but am comfortable closing this as soft since it's the article's creator requesting review, and there are no substantive additions from other editors. Could also be considered a G7 Star Mississippi 20:18, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Nemo Schiffman

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I created this article almost a year ago, when I didn't know about notability requirements. After looking over this article again, it appears that they do not meet the requirements, with only a few minor roles. Wgullyn (talk) 22:58, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete does not meet our inclusion criteria.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:27, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was redirect. Geschichte (talk) 07:02, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

List of largest wilderness areas in the United States

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Complete content fork with List of wilderness areas in the United States. The complete list is able to be sorted by size, providing the same information. Suggest blanking and redirecting to the parent list. Mdewman6 (talk) 22:45, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Speedy redirect Obvious duplicate hardly needs discussion. Reywas92 01:28, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect as they page does not add any value.Gusfriend (talk) 07:05, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Speedy redirect Nothing new compared to the mentioned article. Sanjoydey33 (talk) 17:38, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Speedy redirect per Reywas. Femke (talk) 19:41, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Liz 04:53, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Gli family zinc finger 4

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Reason Telefocus (talk) 22:25, 1 February 2022 (UTC) Article is not noteworthy.

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Log/2022 February 1. —_{Talk to my owner:Online} 22:43, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Procedural keep. Although the topic appears technical to most readers, Category:Genes on human chromosome 8 has 455 categories. No reason has been given to single out only 1. Geschichte (talk) 10:06, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment without taking a position on this particular article, this is not a valid procedural keep rationale, per WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. It's possible that if this one IS agreed on for deletion that this could be the test case for nuking the other 454. PianoDan (talk) 17:02, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

I disagree with you, since the nominator has not stated the intent of it being a test nomination. The notion that other users should infer what the nominator "possibly" has meant, is not valid. Geschichte (talk) 09:08, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep but definitely warranting the stub status.Gusfriend (talk) 10:35, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Needs more editing and fixes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TzarN64 (talk • contribs) 15:28, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: This needs a broader conversation than what is present here
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 01:13, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 01:57, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep: There's no reason for deletion, so I wish we knew what the nominator saw is at fault here. This singular article seems fine from my perspective; however, if there is a wish to look at these gene article holistically, I would not be opposed. Curbon7 (talk) 23:52, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Weak keep is keep. Tone 16:08, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Uruguay–Vietnam relations

AfDs for this article:

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Previously deleted. Fails WP:GNG. Could not find significant coverage. 3 of the 6 sources merely confirm embassies (or non resident embassy). The fact that Uruguay sells beef to Vietnam is hardly noteworthy given Uruguay sells beef worldwide. LibStar (talk) 22:28, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep GoldenBootWizard276 (talk) 22:33, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

WP:JUSTAVOTE. LibStar (talk) 22:36, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Comment: the page as it stands is useless. The previous version also said "In November 2007, Uruguayan President Tabare Vazquez visited Vietnam". Geschichte (talk) 10:09, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep as I found additional sources , . EnPassant♟♙ (talk) 21:13, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment It's worth noting that even where a country has been identified as a priority for another state's foreign relations, these types of articles are being deleted: Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Spain–Tanzania relations. The simple existence alone of normalised diplomatic and trade relations cannot itself be grounds for an article; given that Vietnam accredits their Argentine representative, while Uruguay has a resident representative, as an ATD redirect to List of diplomatic missions of Uruguay, otherwise delete. Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 22:22, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment: a cursory search in Spanish had shown quite a bit of coverage in Uruguayan and Vietnamese that in my opinion satisfy WP:GNG, although I want to check if there are more. I will be posting those here in a bit. Pilaz (talk)
- Establishment of diplomatic relations in 1993, celebrations and ROTM diplomatic stuff: , , , ; 2012 Uruguay-Vietnam framework cooperation agreement ; Uruguayan president promising to visit Vietnam in 2014 , , . A lot of bilateral discussions on a potential free trade agreement between the two countries in 2021 , , , , . I don't think I'm going to weigh on this yet, but there are also other sources and bilateral official visits out there. Will try to look into them later today. Pilaz (talk) 13:46, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 09:40, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Lean Keep (in between Weak Keep and Keep) - there were some other visits, like the MFA of Uruguay to Hanoi in 2010, the visit of the deputy PM of Vietnam to Montevideo , a 2014 scientific agreement , a trade and investment agreement in 2016 , so I think an encyclopedic version of it all could have its place in the encyclopedia. I think that should be enough for a start-class article. There was also a study that I read while browsing that covered Latin America-Vietnam relations and had two paragraphs about the Vietnam-Uruguay relation, but I can't seem to find it at the moment. Not seeing presidential visits, though, and that's why I'm only lean keep. On the economic front, we're well over the keep mark, though. Pilaz (talk) 18:26, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 22:26, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Paperboy Prince

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Fails WP:GNG WP:POLITICIAN WP:MUSICBIO Yousef Raz (talk) 21:58, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep I'm seeing coverage well beyond what one would expect from a losing politician, including significant coverage in The New Yorker, Business Insider, Rolling Stone, and Washington Post. Mlb96 (talk) 22:29, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- Note @Mlb96 Each of those articles are about the subject's mayoral candidacy. The subject's candidacy received 0.4% of the votes. The WaPo article is about mayoral race with brief mentions of the subject. This level of coverage is expected and consistent with the other NYC mayor candidates for Democrat primary 2021.Yousef Raz (talk) 23:54, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep This article meets WP:GNG. “A topic is presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list when it has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject,”. I do not know what else we are looking for here. Whatever it was that the made journos write about him is none of our concern as editors as far as he passes the criteria, there’s no need to sweat this out. And please, don’t try to convince me to change my mind, we’re not trying to get the winner or loser here. Reading Beans
Delete Incidental coverage of a person in connection with an election is not enough to show notability. Almost all candidates get some coverage, but this coverage is not enough to make us have to create articles on every person who runs for public office and gets coverage for it.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:30, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep A quick google news search brings up multiple reliable and independent sources writing about them. He therefore meets the inclusion criteria. CT55555 (talk) 00:36, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Which could be said for almost any candidate for public office above a certain level. Unelected candidates need to do more than just pass the minimum of GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:28, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Are you agreeing that he meets the GNG? You think he needs to do something more than that? It seems you're moving the argument to why he meets the GNG, whereas I'm just sticking to the point of if he meets it. CT55555 (talk) 13:21, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Meets Notability Guidelines. I've read a few articles about them recently. Came here for more background and was quite shocked to see there was any question at all about their notability. J. Van Meter (talk) 14:54, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Note @User:J. Van Meter He's a minor part of a New York City Mayoral Democrat primary. Its consistent with WP:ONEEVENT. Every person that ever runs in a New York City mayor Democrat Primary will likely get a news article about them.Yousef Raz (talk) 19:02, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Note Yousef Raz, please use the correct pronouns (they/them) when referring to the subject of the article.Sevey13 (talk) 21:12, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep passes WP:GNG, which is sufficient. I don't think WP:ONEEVENT applies here as they appear to also be notable for their music career. NemesisAT (talk) 22:01, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- @NemesisAT:You think they're music qualifies under WP:MUSICBIO?Yousef Raz (talk) 03:27, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
  - It doesn't need to, so long as they meet WP:GNG. Elli (talk | contribs) 05:50, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
    - @NemesisAT: Then why have a separate article defining notability specifically for musicians?Yousef Raz (talk) 19:16, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep seems pretty clear their biography passes the notability guidelines given the sourcing present. Elli (talk | contribs) 05:52, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep Even the current citations in the article demonstrate a wide variety of coverage over a sustained period of time.Sevey13 (talk) 21:11, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment At this point, the chances of this article being deleted are equivalent to a snowball's chance. User:Yousef Raz I encourage you to withdraw this AfD as per WP:SNOW CT55555 (talk) 21:37, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
- @CT55555: I'll wait for the process to complete.Yousef Raz (talk) 22:54, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Strong Keep The sources do seem reliable enough and the subject seems to have coverage in both music and politics — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amoeba69th (talk • contribs) 04:57, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep there are plenty of good citations provided. Caphadouk (talk) 08:29, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep There are enough sources to show that this entry is notable. Historyday01 (talk) 20:35, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. ✗plicit 23:43, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Kulu Abdullahi Sifawa

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Mid-level Nigerian bureaucrat lacking in sources about her specifically, so WP:GNG isn't satisfied. Clarityfiend (talk) 21:51, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep Sifawa holds a state-level office so meets notability requirements under NPOL.Furius (talk) 02:12, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep *Not* a "mid-level Nigerian bureaucrat". Sifawa is the Commissioner for Women and Children Affairs. Commissioners of Nigerian state governments are a constitutionally-defined position (s.192, 1999 Constitution) which may only be appointed following approval of the State House Assembly. This is clearly within the ambit of WP:NPOL as holding a state-wide office. Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 10:04, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep per Goldsztajn.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 07:36, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. ✗plicit 14:35, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

Ibrahim Ahmad Maqari

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Fails WP:GNG and WP:NBLP. The subject has no significant coverage in sources cited in the article, as well as few other I checked which are not cited. Multiple paragraphs uncited, and WP:Citation overkill just for the statement: "He is the present Imam of the National Mosque Abuja, he's always straddling between Abuja, Zaria and Kano on a weekly basis." – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 21:48, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Source assessment table prepared by User:Kavyansh.Singh
Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
https://www.bbc.com/hausa/labarai-55932475	Per WP:RS/PS#BBC	Per WP:RS/PS#BBC	unable to judge due to the article being in a foreign language	? Unknown
https://sheikhmaqary.com.ng/e-books	apparently a self published website	looks like someone's personal website	merely some pdfs of books	✘ No
https://www.abujanationalmosque.org/management/	primary source, website of the Mosque		I don't see a single mention of "Ibrahim Maqari"	✘ No
https://www.blueprint.ng/appoint-chief-imam-for-national-mosque-abuja/	media outlet with independent coverage		just one passing mention	✘ No
https://dailytrust.com/time-to-appoint-chief-imam-for-national-mosque	media outlet with independent coverage		passing mentions	✘ No
https://www.legit.ng/1414305-paying-ransom-kidnappers-permitted-islam-islamic-cleric.html		not sure	passing mentions, merely using Maqari's statements does not make his notable.	✘ No
https://dailynigerian.com/hausa/saudiyya-ce-ke-horas-da-yan-taadda-babban-limamin-abuja/	media outlet with independent coverage		one passing mention	✘ No
https://hausa.legit.ng/1426412-abduljabbar-sheikh-maqary-ya-yi-karin-haske-bayan-wasu-kalamansa-sun-tada-kura.html		not sure		? Unknown
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 21:48, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete - it is also so poorly written from a grammatical perspective that it's an embarrassment and detraction to Misplaced Pages. Ira Leviton (talk) 02:23, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep - Because the grammatical perspective were fixed and furthermore English is not our native language! We're all here to give our contributions best on our little knowledge. Nobody is perfect, so I think that's the advantage of everyone can edit Misplaced Pages pages as far as he had created an account and has the ability to do so with the wiki rules. Ira Leviton you can help us and fixed some grammatical errors. thank you all Salihu Aliyu (talk) 09:21, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Yes @Salihu Aliyu, I agree that prose and grammar issues should not be a reason for deleting an article. At AfD, we determine notability. But, if the topic is not notable, then no level of editing can make it notable. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:07, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 23:44, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete - Yes I agree, grammar issues are not a reason to deleta an article, if it is otherwise noteworthy. Grammar can be fixed. However, the analysis of the RS here seems to indicate it isn't notable. Deathlibrarian (talk) 01:50, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per nom fails WP:GNG.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 11:05, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Star Mississippi 20:21, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Kulu Bay Resort

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Misplaced Pages is not for self-WP:PROMOTION. I don't see any independent writeups of the place. Clarityfiend (talk) 21:39, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete I would have marked as speedy delete. Blatant WP:PROMO. LibStar (talk) 22:30, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete because it looks like an advertisement.
Delete because Misplaced Pages is not for self promotion.ThePremiumBoy (talk) 11:24, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete fails WP:GNG and blatant WP:PROMO.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 07:37, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. albeit weakly. There is no consensus to delete this. Star Mississippi 01:16, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Edward Mickolus

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No indication in the article or in searches that this article passes WP:ANYBIO or WP:GNG. All references are lacking in either significance, independence, or reliability. Also violates WP:NOTRESUME. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 21:30, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Comment: This looks like a good faith 2011 contribution by now blocked User:Geo Swan. This diff shows the insertion of all the resume info in 2018 by the subject themself. No opinion about the outcome here. BusterD (talk) 21:47, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Weak keep So I came across this article in the references section of Hassan Al-Turabi's article. I think it helps show that it's a good source for the article, but other than that, I can't think of any other reason why he'd count as notable. However, I posted on the talk page and noticeboard specifically without mentioning article deletion since I disagree with Misplaced Pages's notability guidelines in general, but if it violates them, then there's not much else to do other than removal. Seabass715 (talk) 23:02, 1 February 2022 (UTC)Seabass715.
Weak keep? There may be a weak pass of WP:AUTHOR, but the BLP contains a vast amount of dross that should be deleted. Xxanthippe (talk) 01:39, 2 February 2022 (UTC).
Keep Marquis Who's Who doesn't count though and other sources briefly discuss him. But I found some book reviews so inclined towards keep. Coverage: , , . 67.168.136.107 (talk) 22:00, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. (I suspect this is a SNOW keep.) This is a strange keep, given that it comes from the person who completed the nomination (noticing a redlink on February 1's AfD listing and a tag on the associated page), but it is abundantly clear that the subject passes NPROF and the GNG, and further sourcing was fairly easy to come across. Additionally, the comments made by the Yale IP indicate that the underlying deletion nomination was intended as a BLPREQUESTDELETE that, given the circumstances, is being done in bad faith, and given the references, is being requested by a public enough figure (or someone with a connection to him) that the subsection is not applicable. There is a worthy discussion on how much the negative elements with the available sources can/should be discussed while meeting our various BLP policies and guidelines, but that is for the talk page, not Articles for deletion. I will be starting a section header at the talk page and pinging the participants in this deletion discussion there for further handling of the matter. (non-admin closure) Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 04:24, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Roberto González Echevarría

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Completing a nomination for IP nominator 130.132.173.30. No reason was given, but this editor then removed a section with the edit summary Contentious material about the living person named in this article is poorly sourced (blog) and libellous. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 16:33, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

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Some background: The "contentious material" section covered a sexual harassment allegation from 2017. See the removal diff. The main source cited in the paragraph is the Yale Daily News. The case was approved to go to trial in April 2020 () and it got written up in Law.com at the time the allegations surfaced in 2017 (). Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 17:04, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Further, the IP geolocates to Yale University, where the subject taught. The IP left a comment at User talk:GB fan reading, You are a previous editor of the Roberto González Echevarría page. González Echevarría would like the entire page removed from this cite. Would you be able to do that? Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 17:06, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment Although the Yale Daily News url has "blog" as part of it, all the stories on the front page appear to direct to similar urls, and these otherwise appear to be normal Yale Daily News pieces. I think they are as reliable as student newspaper sources usually are. Russ Woodroofe (talk) 17:39, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
That is my assessment as well, likely a CMS item. The more I look at this, the more I see this as not a matter for AfD. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 17:50, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep per WP:NPROF criterion 5. Regarding whether to include the allegations, that's beyond the scope of this AfD, but as this is where attention is, I'll weigh in. It's tricky. WP:BLPCRIME states that for non-public figures (which would include a professor) editors must seriously consider not including material—in any article—that suggests the person has committed, or is accused of having committed, a crime, unless a conviction has been secured. Weighing against that is the fact that the allegations appear strongly substantiated, that the Yale Daily News is one of the most respected student newspapers in the U.S. and therefore very much a reliable source for Yale-related topics per WP:RSSM, and that it appears likely someone with a conflict of interest is trying to tamper with the article (which would nullify WP:BLPREQUESTDELETE considerations for me). I'd be alright seeing this go either way, but at the very least, we can include in the article the aspects that aren't strictly legal. I've done that here. (As disclosure, I came to this AfD through a generally neutral but conversational invitation on WP:DISCORD.) {{u|Sdkb}}  19:57, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. Although I give some consideration to WP:BLPREQUESTDELETE, I think that the notability here is unambiguous: he passes WP:NPROF C5, also WP:NPROF C3 multiple times over, and the citation record (in a low-citation field) looks like a pass of WP:NPROF C1. He's fairly widely quoted on Cuba-related issues. A casual search of JSTOR turns up lots of reviews for WP:NAUTHOR. Comment that basic personal details can probably be sourced to a Yale Alumni Magazine piece . Russ Woodroofe (talk) 20:08, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

He seems to be notable under the GNG from the articles revealed by Google News, which goes beyond NPROF. The Miami Herald feature plus the consistent coverage by RS going to him for quotes on his field of expertise is more than the usual academic. It might even make him a WP:PUBLICFIGURE. Morbidthoughts (talk) 22:04, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep Would not be surprised if the IP who refers to the prof in the third-person is in fact the prof himself. Notability is well-demonstrated for reasons already given. Kingoflettuce (talk) 23:45, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. Clear pass of WP:Prof. Notability is not marginal so BLP1E does not apply. Xxanthippe (talk) 23:48, 2 February 2022 (UTC).
Keep Well sourced. Needs the stuff pulled from the page history, also work to bring text up to standard. Closing admin: feel free to ping me to do this work if kept. Stuartyeates (talk) 00:13, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Star Mississippi 20:37, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Corbin Maxey

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Fails WP:GNG. Surprised this article has existed since 2008 given obvious WP:AUTOBIO, WP:COI, WP:NOTRESUME, and WP:PROMO issues. KidAd • SPEAK 20:27, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete You don't get to write an article on yourself, sad that this self-promotion has persisted. Reywas92 22:13, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete People should not create articles on themselves in Misplaced Pages. This is one of the reasons we really should go to making all new articles go through the AfC process.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:22, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Does seem to have been created by the person themselves. Counts as self promotion. Captain Jack Sparrow (talk) 20:59, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete as per all of the above.TH1980 (talk) 02:56, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was Page should have been restored to my user area as requested. I have moved it there and will not resubmit it until I have found more and better sources. . (non-admin closure) Polycarpa aurata (talk) 23:50, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Letha Weapons

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I've done some searching and while there are a number of passing references, I'm not seeing enough to support an article. Hobit (talk) 20:19, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete Still no significant coverage to justify an article. Just passing mentions, interviews and trivial coverage. GoldenAgeFan1 (talk) 21:07, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete "Just a namedrop" is generally a euphemism for "mentioned in an article, but the coverage is slight". Here, the phrase is literal. Several sources are actually just a one-and-done name. In short, the sourcing to support the notability of the subject is nonexistent. Zaathras (talk) 22:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

I specifically asked for this to be restored to my sandbox. I have moved it there to work on. Polycarpa aurata (talk) 23:34, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

@Polycarpa aurata: Deletion review restored the article to main space. Now that it is back at AfD, we should reach consensus. • Gene93k (talk) 23:38, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The page should not have been restored to the main space. I will not resubmot the article until I have found more and better sourcing. Polycarpa aurata (talk) 23:41, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. While the ideal merger target hasn't been identified, there is consensus to keep the content at a location TBD. That can be handled editorially. Star Mississippi 01:17, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

The Game of Alice in Wonderland

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I came across this while trying to clean up Alice's Adventures in Wonderland. The two sources are dead, as is the link in the attribution template on Talk:The Game of Alice in Wonderland. There is another game, called The New & Diverting Game of Alice in Wonderland, which is probably not notable either but which I see some hits for: . I'd happily be proven wrong here but I don't see a GNG pass. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 02:08, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Comment looks like a probably reliable source. is maybe a bit more than a passing reference. I suspect the (now dead) links in the article may have only a bit more. I'd really prefer not to see this deleted and am hopeful someone can find more. Hobit (talk) 03:08, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Your first link led me to , which has more pictures but the text is mostly a general comment on Alice and not on the game in particular. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 03:40, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Delete, sadly. It seems like some non-notable historical object that sadly did not generate much if any coverage so far. We have one sentence and few pictures here, and the second link seems dead and not saved in the Internet Archive. The book Hobi found has two sentences and I am sorry, it is a passing reference in my book. Ping me if anyone finds new good sources. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 10:32, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Comment. @Hobit and Piotrus: I also found the following: "In the U.S. Selchow and Righter produced a trick-taking game in 1882 while in England Thomas de La Rue & Co. created a 'Go Fish' Alice game around 1899. Both versions adapt John Tenniel's original illustrations." That's on page 27 of doi:10.4324/9781351392143. Now that we can verify this game's existence, maybe a merge to Works based on Alice in Wonderland#Games is appropriate? AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 15:05, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Yes, that seems like a good solution. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 16:55, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

I'm hoping we can find more, but that's much better than deletion. And we have other RSes, so we are well past WP:V. It's just none of them are hugely in-depth. Hobit (talk) 17:41, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Comment: The article has been expanded significantly, if that helps. BOZ (talk) 12:26, 28 January 2022 (UTC)
The expansion relies substantially on , which I do not consider a WP:RS. I think we've discussed the other sources on this AfD already. is arguably SIGCOV; , not so much. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 16:00, 28 January 2022 (UTC)
- BGG is clearly not a RS. The other two most certainly seem to be. What objection do you have to the University of Indiana's page on this topic? Hobit (talk) 03:50, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
  Indiana's page has only one sentence of prose about the game. The rest is commentary about Carroll/Alice in general and pictures from other editions and Alice memorabilia that Indiana has in its library. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 03:52, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
  Ah, my bad. I'd read it as claiming it wasn't a RS, but that's not what you said. You clearly were discussing SIGCOV. Sorry, I think I got your first sentence confused with your second. But to that point, I think we have at least 3 sentences.
  A matching game, The Game of Alice in Wonderland consists of 52 cards: twenty cards numbered 1–20, and thirty–two cards, numbered 1–16 in pairs, with images of the Wonderland characters.
  
  Pictured below are images of cards from the game and illustrations from various editions of Alice in Wonderland in the Lilly Library collection.
  
  Curiouser examples of playing cards for the Alice in Wonderland Game

By themselves, not a ton, but with the art included? I'd say we're over the edge of significant coverage. Add to it the fact that the Lily Collection includes this and documents it makes it feel like something we should have here too. YMMV. Hobit (talk) 15:13, 29 January 2022 (UTC)

I've been going back and forth. I think I'm at weak keep Two okay sources on an older topic where such sources are harder to find. That said, I think an article, rather than list, on the topics of AiW games might make sense. Hobit (talk) 03:50, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep. Being the first game published about one of the most popular chidren's books in history establishes notability. The search for further sources continues, but it could be that someone will have to go through microfiche rolls of American newspapers of 1882 to find further information. Guinness323 (talk) 06:33, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
Being the first X of Y does not make something notable. There has to be significant coverage about it. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 06:42, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep per Hobit and Guinness323, although I would note that if a volunteer has access to Newspapers.com then we don't need to bother with microfiche. :) BOZ (talk) 16:23, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
I looked it up in newspapers.com and I see nothing. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 16:37, 29 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 20:12, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Merge to Works based on Alice in Wonderland#Games - BGG is generally not considered a reliable source due to being user generated, and the two other sources are fairly weak in actual information on the game - the Indiana University page, for example, really only has a couple of sentences of actual coverage of the game itself. Its really not enough to sustain an independent article, but should certainly be included in the main article on works based on Alice. Rorshacma (talk) 19:27, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
- Things is that I think we should have more than a sentence. Our coverage, should for example, include the art. The proposed target it too broad. But I agree a standalone article seems like too much... Bah. Hobit (talk) 03:05, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. ✗plicit 04:55, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

Bal Vikash Secondary School

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Fails WP:GNG and WP:NORG The Banner talk 19:55, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Prior result was no consensus, so a soft delete would not make sense at this stage.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a ☕️ // beans // 20:33, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete fails WP:ORG. LibStar (talk) 01:01, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to List of schools in Nepal. nirmal (talk) 13:01, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete as this school clearly isn't notable. I couldn't even find any trivial information about it. In the meantime I'm not sure redirecting the article is a good option since the target article doesn't contain any information about the school, likely never will, and obviously it doesn't serve any kind of encyclopedic purpose to redirect the name of the school to something that lacks any information about it. So I'm going with delete instead of redirect. --Adamant1 (talk) 08:07, 13 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete: Fails WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES. - Hatchens (talk) 13:05, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Liz 19:41, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Amalthea (technical summit)

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Advertising for a rather recent started series of meetings (started in 2010) by a very recently started university (started 2008). Many sources are not about the summit or are just passing mentions. So besides the advertising, I doubt about notability. Re-created article after normal procedure. The Banner talk 19:51, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 20:41, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz 06:28, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete sourcing comes entirely from the event organizers, no independent coverage at all. Anton.bersh (talk) 02:04, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment It isn't clear to me that the sourcing all comes from the event organizers. The references are PDFs that seem to have been downloaded to the IIT Gandhinagar system - perhaps through the library? Some of the articles, like this one state that they are from The Times of India Ahmedabad. That said, I have no idea whether local editions of the Times of India are considered RS. It's also a shame not have to have the original citation in the article (with effort, that perhaps could be done). I do think it would be a good idea to remove unreferenced info, reducing the article to only the facts that can be sourced. Lamona (talk) 03:58, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
I do not think the article you linked to provide any useful coverage. For one, it quotes the whole paragraphs from a certain lecture, so it would hardly be considered independent. Secondly, I don't see any coverage of the event in general, just one particular lecture. Anton.bersh (talk) 19:04, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep I usually vote Delete on techfests but this one was actually covered by quite a number of reliable sources, including several articles in TOI and DNA. Don't get me wrong, it needs a lot of copy-editing, it is promotional and full of trivialities, most of the facts aren't sourced and the ones that are deserve better citation etc. However, notability-wise I think it has decent coverage to remain a short article and I don't think Blow it up and start over is the right solution in this case. --Muhandes (talk) 11:06, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
Could you please specify which sources you consider reliable independent and in-depth? Anton.bersh (talk) 18:58, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
This and this are for sure reliable secondary sources. Together with the rest I think they provide enough coverage to establish notability for a short article. --Muhandes (talk) 08:19, 21 February 2022 (UTC)
delete after looking over the references that have been provided I'm of the opinion that there is only extremely trivial, indirect coverage of this tech summit. Like the one from The Times Of India is literally one paragraph in an article about something else that doesn't even discuss the summit because it's about "The Speech Jammer", whatever that is. Whereas, the "DNA article" appears to be a self published promotional puff piece. --Adamant1 (talk) 09:38, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. RL0919 (talk) 18:58, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

John S. Darling

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Subject fails WP:GNG as far as I can tell. WP:BEFORE (Newspapers.com and Google Books) turned up nothing for me but minor mentions alongside other artists in a few news articles in Richmond, Virginia. I found nothing specifically about him, or otherwise any significant coverage in WP:RS. The tone of the standing article is promotional as well. If significant coverage of him can be found I'm happy to withdraw the AfD, but I didn't see it. EnPassant♟♙ (talk) 18:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete Since no sources that would constitute passing GNG have been identfied.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:40, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- The fact that this has existed as an unsourced article for over 13 years is not encouraging. We really need to stop letting articles exist without sources for so long.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:41, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Similar to the nominator, I found only minor mentions on Newspapers.com, nothing to sustain an article. There was very little elsewhere. Curiocurio (talk) 20:27, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete No references. GoldenBootWizard276 (talk) 22:27, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete followed by move of the old page to this page and a history undelete. Interested editors should checkmthe content to make sure it is correct . Spartaz 11:48, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Block, Inc.

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This page appears to be a duplicate of the existing Square (financial services company) article. I propose that the article be reverted to the redirect that it was prior to 1 February. Chrisclear (talk) 18:07, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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See Talk:Square (financial services company)#Splitting proposal for more info DownTownRich (talk) 18:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Redirect to Square (financial services company) because this is just a duplicate of it. ThePremiumBoy (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 07:55, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
The company has changed its name. The page should have been moved to the new title instead of copy-pasted at the new title.— Diannaa (talk) 15:30, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment As nominator, I agree with ThePremiumBoy, that Block, Inc. should redirect to Square (financial services company). Chrisclear (talk) 16:37, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Redirect per nom - DownTownRich (talk) 17:07, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete, and then move the Block article to this title, which will leave the redirect around the other direction. W Nowicki (talk) 19:11, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect because it is a duplicate.Fulmard (talk) 19:28, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Move Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc. (and I mean this title) since Square, Inc. has already been renamed to Block, Inc. The article's title should reflect to the company's current name. (EDIT: I mean, Move to this page, but use the old page as a redirect) 20chances (talk) 14:02, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Comment @20chances: Do you mean (1) Redirect Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc. or (2) Move Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc.? If you are advocating for (1), the outcome is that (a) a lot of content from the Square (financial services company) will be deleted and (b) the page history for the surviving Block, Inc. article will only start in December 2021. Chrisclear (talk) 10:04, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Comment @Chrisclear: I think I was trying to say is that we should keep all of the Block, Inc. article from Square (financial services company) and rename it to its current name. Hopefully I got the clarification right. Also, I was aware about the consideration from what it should be named. I think I was the first to propose to naming it to Block, Inc. though some have thought of renaming it under "Block (company)". I may consider Block, Inc. though I HAVE used it for an infobox for the company. 20chances (talk) 15:21, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
    - Comment @20chances: It sounds like what you are advocating is option (2) from what I wrote above, ie., Move Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc.. While it may sound pedantic, this is quite different to what you wrote previously, which was "Redirect Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc.". If my assumption is correct, would you mind amending your post with the timestamp of 14:02, 3 February 2022 (UTC)? Chrisclear (talk) 15:34, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
      - Comment @Chrisclear: Yeah, I was trying to get the meaning right but yeah. I got that adjusted And apologies if I forgot the timestamp on the last one. I forgot to mention, as for the naming of the article, are we going for "Block, Inc." or something else? 20chances (talk) 16:00, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to this one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TzarN64 (talk • contribs) 15:31, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete. While I agree with the redirect !votes above in principal, it appears this company has indeed changed its name, so this article should be deleted, and then Square (financial services company) should be moved to this title. The page should simply have been returned to a redirect, and then Moved. This is a cut and paste move, and should have been handled without coming to AfD. If an admin takes a look at this I might suggest a speedy close, since this is all housekeeping at this point. Onel5969 21:57, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Comment In principal, I agree with most of what you have written. Furthermore, I agree that Square (financial services company) should be moved to Block, Inc., to reflect the name change. However, in practice, that move was proposed on 14 December and (unfortunately) rejected on 21 December. There is also a practical consideration as to what the article should be titled, eg. Block, Inc. or Block (financial services company) or Block (company) or something else. Chrisclear (talk) 09:47, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect - how, User:Chrisclear isn't a duplicate article, always a redirect - which doesn't need an AFD. Nfitz (talk) 00:42, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
~~Keep~~ Redirect - With the acquisition of Afterpay by Block Inc. closing on 31 January there is now another significant business unit under Block Inc. that is not Square (payment system) and it is time to have Square (financial services company) become a redirect to this page. Is there somewhere that a combined discussion taking into account all of the pages can take place?Gusfriend (talk) 11:12, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
- Comment1 With regards to your last sentence - a discussion is taking place at The talk page for Square (financial services company). Chrisclear (talk) 11:26, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
- Comment2 Regarding your suggestion to "keep" and "have Square (financial services company) become a redirect to this page" would mean that (1) A lot of content from the Square (financial services company) would be deleted, including but not limited to edits made to Square (financial services company) since 1 February, and (2) The history of the Block, Inc. article would only commence in December 2021. I believe that a better solution would be a two-part process. Part 1: redirect Block, Inc. to Square (financial services company), which is covered by this deletion discussion. Part 2: move Square (financial services company) to Block, Inc.. This would ensure that (1) content is not deleted unnecessarily and (2) page history is maintained. Chrisclear (talk) 11:31, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
  - I will make a comment on the talk page of Square (financial services company) that it should be renamed and recommend a redirect, possibly with protection, of this page whilst we are waiting for the page rename.Gusfriend (talk) 22:10, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete as a copy/paste move. Move the Square article here and perform a history merge if needed to preserve attribution. Star Mississippi 00:14, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Liz 06:35, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

Killing of Usama Nadeem Satti

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References and web search don't indicate this rises above routine coverage. Star Garnet (talk) 17:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep Dawn have a full article on it, it's a notable event reported on by credible press. CT55555 (talk) 00:41, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- WP:MILL, WP:NOTNEWS, WP:PRIMARYNEWS. Star Garnet (talk) 01:53, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - To expand: On a world-scale, the media covers thousands of murders/killings/unnatural deaths at a high level of detail annually. It is not WP's place to compile that information, or even the few hundred that were covered most closely. Wikinews, sure. The four articles I nominated for deletion after browsing through the 30-odd 2021 murder/killing/death of X articles fall short of the others in level of news analysis and impact on outside events (I'm also skeptical of plenty of the others, but I could at least see a competent argument for them meeting at least one of the WP:EVENTCRITERIA). While they certainly received signicant coverage in the media, that is in the form of news reports. We don't have the secondary sources to satisfy SIGCOV. Could this incident gain notability through a book, law, or otherwise? Sure, in the way that some of today's paintings may get articles in 40 years. But until they have gained that secondary coverage, these are WP:NOTMEMORIAL material. Star Garnet (talk) 16:30, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep as this is not simply a "killing", it is an extra-judicial killing by police/security forces that has provoked a good deal of protest in Pakistan, as well as evidence of a police cover-up. It is also interesting to have this article to compare with similar article concerning police involved killings in other countries. This article has a number of lines of development apparent in the sources that are not yet covered in the article. The current article content does not determine notability. Also, possible future coverage should be considered. Existing reports indicate there is more to come in this story, so it should be allowed to develop. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 08:08, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, as it is well sourced, but the article does need more expanding. Davidgoodheart (talk) 04:44, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: For more time for policy based input
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 00:06, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment Pakistan has an illustrious history of brazen extra-judicial executions and this event is not an outlier. That being said, I can easily argue this article to run afoul of NOTNEWS but rather than suggesting deletion, will request a merge to Encounter killings in Pakistan once it is created. TrangaBellam (talk) 06:45, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Liz 06:35, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

Killing of Robert Delgado

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References and web search don't indicate this rises above routine coverage. Entry at List of killings by law enforcement officers in the United States, April 2021 is sufficient. Star Garnet (talk) 17:20, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep GoldenBootWizard276 (talk) 22:29, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

WP:JUSTAVOTE. LibStar (talk) 00:57, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep I see a lot of reliable media coverage of this event. It is notable and therefore meets the criteria for inclusion. CT55555 (talk) 00:44, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- WP:MILL, WP:NOTNEWS, WP:PRIMARYNEWS. Star Garnet (talk) 01:53, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - To expand: On a world-scale, the media covers thousands of murders/killings/unnatural deaths at a high level of detail annually. It is not WP's place to compile that information, or even the few hundred that were covered most closely. Wikinews, sure. The four articles I nominated for deletion after browsing through the 30-odd 2021 murder/killing/death of X articles fall short of the others in level of news analysis and impact on outside events (I'm also skeptical of plenty of the others, but I could at least see a competent argument for them meeting at least one of the WP:EVENTCRITERIA). While they certainly received signicant coverage in the media, that is in the form of news reports. We don't have the secondary sources to satisfy SIGCOV. Could this incident gain notability through a book, law, or otherwise? Sure, in the way that some of today's paintings may get articles in 40 years. But until they have gained that secondary coverage, these are WP:NOTMEMORIAL material. While this incident may have initially appeared to have the potential to have a WP:LASTING impact, that has not been the case, and seems unlikely to. Star Garnet (talk) 16:32, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, for the reasons of those who want to keep this article. Davidgoodheart (talk) 22:15, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. This police involved shooting is not a routine "killing". Since the death of George Floyd, Police legitimacy in the USA has become subject to protests as well as some commentary by academics. If this article is deleted then it is likely that content will be inappropriately added to articles like George Floyd protests in Portland, Oregon. Keeping this article provides a home for this content, rather than having it added elsewhere. Because of the current high profile of police involved shootings in the USA, it is likely that more article like this are going to be created by contributors. Give this article time to develop, as there is probably more to come on the subject. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 09:13, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Further input needed especially as it relates to news v. notability
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 00:07, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was merge to Pro Football Hall of Fame. ✗plicit 23:45, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Ralph Hay Pioneer Award

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Award is only given periodically, specifically this award has only been given out nine times since 1972. There seems to be some notability, but sources don't seem to be totally independent. I would support this being Merged with Pro Football Hall of Fame since that's where the award comes from, but I don't know if the award should have it's own space. Some content can be salvaged there. Spf121188 (talk) 16:44, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Log/2022 February 1. —_{Talk to my owner:Online} 16:59, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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Merge with Pro Football Hall of Fame, as the origin of the award. ~EDDY ~ 20:52, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Pinging Vinnylospo, What are your thoughts on merging your article into the Pro Football Hall of Fame article? I think the content you've put in this article is perfect for supplementing that page. Let us know what you think. Spf121188 (talk) 15:52, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
Merge with Pro Football Hall of Fame per above. Not enough WP:SIGCOV in independent sources to establish notability as a standalone topic, but certainly enough to warrant a mention in the merge target article. Frank Anchor 16:20, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. —⁠ScottyWong⁠— 21:45, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Murder of Esther Brown

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References and web search don't indicate this rises above routine coverage. Star Garnet (talk) 16:53, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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~~Strong~~ keep Before commenting I read what meets the criteria for routine events. This is absolutely not routine. https://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Notability_(events)#Routine_coverage CT55555 (talk) 00:47, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- WP:MILL, WP:NOTNEWS, WP:PRIMARYNEWS. Star Garnet (talk) 01:53, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - I see we're essentially having the same conversation on two delete pages, but they may not be closed by the same admin, so I'll say it here too: I'm open to being persuaded, but I'm inviting you rather than to link to policies, be really specific about which part of them you say applies here. I've read the NOTNEWS and I've read the GNG and I've read ROUTINE and this event is not routine, and it's not original reporting and it's not a news report and it is generally notable, so if you wish to persuade me to change my mine (and I'm open to being persuaded) then please really spell it out clearer please. CT55555 (talk) 13:09, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
    - On a world-scale, the media covers thousands of murders/killings/unnatural deaths at a high level of detail annually. It is not WP's place to compile that information, or even the few hundred that were covered most closely. Wikinews, sure. The four articles I nominated for deletion after browsing through the 30-odd 2021 murder/killing/death of X articles fall short of the others in level of news analysis and impact on outside events (I'm also skeptical of plenty of the others, but I could at least see a competent argument for them meeting at least one of the WP:EVENTCRITERIA). While they certainly received signicant coverage in the media, that is in the form of news reports. We don't have the secondary sources to satisfy SIGCOV. Could this incident gain notability through a book, law, or otherwise? Sure, in the way that some of today's paintings may get articles in 40 years. But until they have gained that secondary coverage, these are WP:NOTMEMORIAL material. Star Garnet (talk) 16:29, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
      - I respect your good faith AfD here, I'd like to hear other opinions before opining further myself. I remain "keep" having downgraded from "strong keep" and will be open to being persuaded, hoping that others join in. For now, I'm watching and listening. CT55555 (talk) 16:56, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Putting aside whether or not the 'significant coverage' that the event received qualifies as SIGCOV (the sources are reliable but not secondary), I would suggest you look at WP:EVENTCRITERIA. Particularly this paragraph: "Editors should bear in mind recentism, the tendency for new and current matters to seem more important than they might seem in a few years time. Many events receive coverage in the news and yet are not of historic or lasting importance. News organizations have criteria for content, i.e. news values, that differ from the criteria used by Misplaced Pages and encyclopedias. A violent crime, accidental death, or other media events may be interesting enough to reporters and news editors to justify coverage, but this will not always translate into sufficient notability for a Misplaced Pages article." Star Garnet (talk) 22:58, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. A murder with rape of an old person in their own home by a sex offender they did not know is not "a routine murder". It is atypical and is the sort of crime that results in political campaigns being started or commissions of inquiry to pin the blame on somebody. Allow this article time to evolve for a few years. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 08:23, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment The 81 women killed in 28 weeks (Guardian) is the only WP:SECONDARY source I have found, and it only mentions Esther Brown, in a list. Beccaynr (talk) 00:04, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep, because it has significant coverage and is completely not routine. Davidgoodheart (talk) 20:25, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep - significant coverage, good sourcing. Per WP:GNG at this point. BabbaQ (talk) 22:46, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per WP:NOTNEWS - after WP:OR/WP:SYNTH was removed, there is no indication of enduring notability. This subject also does not appear to objectively meet the GNG, e.g. fn3, It is common for multiple newspapers or journals to publish the same story, sometimes with minor alterations or different headlines, but one story does not constitute multiple works and the brief burst of coverage is not WP:SUSTAINED. Beccaynr (talk) 23:39, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: For more consensus on NOT NEWS/Notability and depth of sourcing.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star Mississippi 01:18, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep/Comment I already opined above, so don't double count this, but I also waivered, so restating for clarity. Also noting that specific feedback was sought on here goes. I see that NOTNEWS gives four things to avoid. 1 - Original reporting. This is not original reporting, everything is cited. 2 It warns against creating articles for routine news of "announcements, sports or celebrities", my anlysis is that trivial content should be avoided. I don't think this article makes that mistake. 3 NOTNEWS tells us to make it about an event, not a person, as this article does. 4 NOTNEWS tells us to avoid celebrity gossip or diary type stuff. This article is not that. To me, this article clearly does not make any of the mistakes that NOTNEWS warns to avoid. And it meets the GNG. I'd also say that this event was covered in The National, the BBC, Sky News and the Glasgow Times. The quality of the Glasgow Times I am uncertain of, but the others are credible news sources with their own employed journalists and editors, the suggestion that some newspapers in some places just copy each other's content is not credible, in this context, to me. This article meets the GNG and none of the comments above, which I've considered carefully, convince me otherwise. CT55555 (talk) 02:47, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment WP:NOTNEWS also states, Misplaced Pages considers the enduring notability of persons and events, and per WP:N, Misplaced Pages's concept of notability applies this basic standard to avoid indiscriminate inclusion of topics, which per the GNG, should include WP:SECONDARY sources to provide the most objective evidence of notability, which would distinguish this article from a brief burst of news articles about a tragic event. Per WP:SBST, Even a large number of news reports that provide no critical analysis of the event is not considered significant coverage, and this is why this 12-sentence article does not appear to meet the GNG. Similarly, the WP:EVENT guideline states in the nutshell section, An event is presumed to be notable if it has lasting major consequences or affects a major geographical scope, or receives significant non-routine coverage that persists over a period of time, and this criteria also does not appear to be supported by the available sources at this time. Beccaynr (talk) 04:43, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

I already commented earlier, so really tried to avoid repeating my points and focus on the specific point that the admin? wanted input ons, but now you have brought other points up, so I'll comment on them: On notability, every source cited is secondary, they are journalists commenting on events that they were not involved. On WP:SBST, this is not "routine" nor a "press release" and while one source was tabloid, neither the National nor BBC are tabloid. There is one aspect of WP:SBST that I'll acknowledge doesn't support my argument to keep, and that is the need for there to be analysis, the sources do all tend to say what happened without analysis, so I'll concede that point. But I don't think the length of the article is a point to argue on, there's plenty that can be added to it and AfD is not the correct process if we think the article is too short, the correct response to that is to work on the article (I did add a bit to it some days ago, I might do more later). The question of if reporting on the event will continue with time - it's a bit early to tell, we can speculate, it could be argued either way. As someone said above, the brutal rape and murder of an older person by a stranger is an exceptionally uncommon event and it's reasonable to assume that public commentary will be sustainable, but we could speculate either way, Misplaced Pages does have articles about recent events, so that is no reason to delete. So in summary, I see the things you are pointing to, I accept some validity to the lack of analysis and I acknowledge the unknown about the sustainability of interest. And I remain in my opinion to keep. (I got an edit conflict, as I posted this, so replying to the first version) CT55555 (talk) 05:03, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Where this clearly runs afoul of NOTNEWS is part 2. This is simply a series of news reports strung together. This isn't the fault of the article; there's nothing but news reports to draw from. There are no SIGCOV-passing sources. 95%+ of media coverage (reports, interviews, human interest stories, breaking news, editorials, investigative reports, etc.) is not SIGCOV-passing coverage, and does not contribute meaningfully to GNG-worthiness. In this case, it's straight reporting of facts, with negligible analysis. The set of events isn't generic, but murder and/or rape of older people is hardly groundbreaking, and it isn't noted as being so. There's nothing to suggest that this event will have a meaningful impact on larger events, which is the essense of notability as it relates to societal topics. Star Garnet (talk) 05:33, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

I respect the point you are making, even if I don't share your conclusion. I won't add more, as it would be repetitive. I'm confident the closing admin will give both our different conclusions fair consideration, along with hopefully more perspectives. All the best to you. CT55555 (talk) 05:40, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete. WP:NOTNEWS applies. Stifle (talk) 10:59, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep - Yes this is absolutely not routine and surely should be kept. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.102.255.40 (talk) 20:40, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep I believe this incident escapes the confines of WP:NOTNEWS due to the unique circumstances of the attack, which was perpetrated by a repeat offender who had been released from prison. Besides for the ongoing coverage leading up to and including the perp's conviction in court, the case has a WP:LASTING effect due to politicians weighing in on it, such as "The Scottish Conservatives are now calling for greater transparency around parole decisions." StonyBrook (talk) 23:40, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep - coverage is good, event is significant. Doczilla _{@SUPERHEROLOGIST} 19:35, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. ✗plicit 23:46, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Murders of Kylen Schulte and Crystal Turner

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References and web search don't indicate this rises above routine coverage. Star Garnet (talk) 16:52, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep If this case had been routine, it would not have been receiving the sustained national and international coverage that it has been getting, per WP:GEOSCOPE. There has been WP:DEPTH of coverage in this case, partly due to the fact that the event occurred in the same time and place as the events surrounding the killing of Gabby Petito, leading to considerable speculation about who the perpetrator/s might be. By all accounts, the event was highly unusual for the location in which it happened. StonyBrook (talk) 17:06, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
- Those are passing coverage (classic WP:PRIMARYNEWS), and any sustained coverage in this case is routine coverage of the stages of a crime investigation. WP:DEPTH specifically discourages using articles like the Independent one (and the vast majority of possible sources for this event), noting similarities/contrasts to a notable event, as evidence of notability. The event warrants a paragraph in the Petito article, nothing more. Star Garnet (talk) 18:41, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Before commenting I read what meets the criteria for routine events. This is not routine. https://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Notability_(events)#Routine_coverage CT55555 (talk) 00:49, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- This is run-of-the-mill murder coverage, i.e. routine. WP:NOTNEWS, etc., etc., etc. Star Garnet (talk) 01:53, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
  - I've read the policies that you link to, but I don't specifically see parts that back up what you are arguing. And I do see where the event meets the general notability requirements. I'm open to being persuaded, but you've not persuaded me. Can you really specifically point out where this should not be on wikipedia, rather than linking to a policy, spell out the parts that you think apply? Until then, I remain unpersuaded. CT55555 (talk) 13:05, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
    - On a world-scale, the media covers thousands of murders/killings/unnatural deaths at a high level of detail annually. It is not WP's place to compile that information, or even the few hundred that were covered most closely. Wikinews, sure. The four articles I nominated for deletion after browsing through the 30-odd 2021 murder/killing/death of X articles fall short of the others in level of news analysis and impact on outside events (I'm also skeptical of plenty of the others, but I could at least see a competent argument for them meeting at least one of the WP:EVENTCRITERIA). While they certainly received signicant coverage in the media, that is in the form of news reports. We don't have the secondary sources to satisfy SIGCOV. Could this incident gain notability through a book, law, or otherwise? Sure, in the way that some of today's paintings may get articles in 40 years. But until they have gained that secondary coverage, these are WP:NOTMEMORIAL material. Specific to this case, WP:DEPTH states that "Media sources sometimes report on events because of their similarity (or contrast, or comparison) to another widely reported incident. Editors should not rely on such sources to afford notability to the new event, since the main purpose of such articles is to highlight either the old event or such types of events generally." Star Garnet (talk) 16:28, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
      - Thanks, I appreciate this context. I don't want to make a hasty comment, so I'll reflect on this. May I just ask one other question of you, I see AfD described a some sort of last resort whereby we should try to improve articles before deleting them. Would you say that you or anyone has done that with these four examples? CT55555 (talk) 16:35, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
        No problem, I should have made a clearer case in the original nomination. While I didn't edit the article (which I did for several of the other pages that I didn't nominate), I did search for sources that could help satisfy SIGCOV, and came up empty. Star Garnet (talk) 17:12, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
- Putting aside whether or not the 'significant coverage' that the event received qualifies as SIGCOV (the sources are reliable but not secondary), I would suggest you look at WP:EVENTCRITERIA. Particularly this paragraph: "Editors should bear in mind recentism, the tendency for new and current matters to seem more important than they might seem in a few years time. Many events receive coverage in the news and yet are not of historic or lasting importance. News organizations have criteria for content, i.e. news values, that differ from the criteria used by Misplaced Pages and encyclopedias. A violent crime, accidental death, or other media events may be interesting enough to reporters and news editors to justify coverage, but this will not always translate into sufficient notability for a Misplaced Pages article." Star Garnet (talk) 22:58, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. This double murder has been linked by the media to the Killing of Gabby Petito because they occurred within days of each other and in the same vicinity. Both cases also involved the same police department. However, the media speculation connecting the two cases was not substantiated. If one is to consider other possibilities, such as merging with another article then the Killing of Gabby Petito would be a candidate merger option, even though it is not connected. Keeping this as a separate article in some ways protects other articles from inappropriate addition of content. There is enough coverage, worldwide, simply because of the coincidence in space and time for it not to be a "routine" murder or "routine" coverage. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 08:47, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, article is well sourced and I agree with those who want to keep this as it is clearly not routine. Davidgoodheart (talk) 20:17, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep - plenty of good sources. Sustained coverage. BabbaQ (talk) 22:44, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep the unsolved nature of the crime and the FBI investigation into a possible connection to the killing of Gabby Petito appears to be generating sustained and significant coverage in diverse sources, which could further develop the article, e.g. Newlyweds told friends about a ‘creepy guy’ at their Utah campsite. Five days later, they were found shot dead. (Washington Post, Aug. 26, 2021), Details released in deaths of newlywed couple at campsite (Associated Press, Sept. 9, 2021), Utah newspaper pens apology for coverage of double murder in Moab (Independent/Yahoo, Sept. 10, 2021), Utah authorities make rare public appeal for help solving Kylen Schulte and Crystal Turner homicides (Independent/Yahoo, Sept. 29, 2021), Unsolved murders and Petito case leave dark cloud over Moab (Associated Press, Oct. 3, 2021), Remembering the light: Local artist creates sculpture in memory of Kylen Schulte and Crystal Turner (Salt Lake Tribune, Jan. 8, 2022), FBI says Petito, Laundrie not involved in double murder outside Moab (FOX13, Jan. 20, 2022), Investigators Have 'Persons of Interest' in Moab Murders of Crystal Turner and Kylen Schulte (People, Jan. 24, 2022, also reported in the Independent), Family still searching for answers in Utah double-murder investigation (WTKR3, Jan. 25, 2022). Beccaynr (talk) 00:52, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. ✗plicit 23:47, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Martin Heuberger

AfDs for this article:

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Only thing that has happened since previous AFD is some ref-bombing with WP:ROUTINE sources. If no one is interested in this subject, let alone write an actually meaningful article about him, there is no encyclopedic value in an article about him. T v x1 16:40, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep, AFD is not cleanup, and this is a stub about a clearly notable person (as was established in the previous AFD), even if you may be tempted to redirect to Germany men's national handball team, the source of his notability. Suggest to withdraw this AFD. —Kusma (talk) 17:14, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Not going to withdraw this. The claim that this subject is notable is a joke. Cleary no-one is interested in this person, or else a meaninful article would have been written a long time ago. There is nothing that proves the encyclopedic value of this article.T v x1 23:34, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
"else a meaninful article would have been written a long time ago"... well, it sometimes takes a while, and non-inclusion is not an indicator for non-notability (else we couldn't write any new articles anymore; in the last year alone, I created articles on people including Max Wallraf and Emil Utitz, who are clearly worthy of inclusion despite having had no articles). It is clear that a sports biography can be written about Heuberger (successfully lead his hometown club to the Handball-Bundesliga, managed the national team, did something else, now manages junior national team). Easy to find more sources: , , . —Kusma (talk) 09:35, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

This article has existed like this for ten years. Five years since the last AFD. That’s more than enough to make “it takes a while” a ridiculous excuse. Clearly no one is interested in this person thus justifying a standalone article. Accept reality and stop filling Wikpedia with rubbish articles.T v x1 06:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
@LeFnake and @Malo95 have now expanded the article, which is much more helpful than us all arguing here about what potential the article has. It still isn't great, but at least now lists some of the person's sporting achievements. @Tvx1: please tell me which of my Misplaced Pages articles is rubbish and why, and I'll try to fix it. Most of my rubbish articles are 15 years old now. —Kusma (talk) 20:25, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Expanded with nothing but WP:ROUTINE information. Nothing that actually establishes notability. Let me ask you a question? What are you obessed with blocking deletion of this article? Why is this person so important to you? Why would it be such a drama for you if this were deleted?T v x1 00:26, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
I am not interested in this person at all (I don't care about handball). I came across this deletion discussion because I look at all Germany-related AfDs. I care about improving Misplaced Pages, and so I argue to keep or to delete as needed. Sometimes others agree with me, sometimes they don't. But my personal approach isn't the issue here. The Deutschlandfunk Kultur and Handball World sources are significant coverage. There are enough sources interested in the person, not just mentioning him. —Kusma (talk) 03:47, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep - Kusma says it. There's no time limit on these things. Ingratis (talk) 02:09, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Nothing you state is a valid keep argument.T v x1 06:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep - Notable and as Kusma said above, no need to delete. If someone wants to expand it, they can, even if not he stays notable. Kante4 (talk) 16:20, 2 February 2022 (UTC)— Note to closing admin: Kante4 (talk • contribs) is the creator of the page that is the subject of this XfD.

You came up with the exact same nonsensical arguments five years ago. Literally no one was interested then and is now to expand this, because there simply isn’t anything to expand this with and because no-one is interested in this subject. I really don’t understand why you are so hell-bent on keeping an article that has no encyclopaedic value whatsoever. Moreover, when you claim something is notable, you need to prove that. Something isn’t notable just because you say so.T v x1 06:38, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Why are you commenting on every single voter who does not share the same feeling as you do? Just let the AfD run out and see how it went (pretty clear right now, tbh). Kante4 (talk) 15:16, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Comment. I'm not particularly impressed with the sources in the article and found during AfD, since they seem to be heavily interview-based rather than independent analyses. If all that can be found on him is restatements of his quotes there's not really any encyclopedic merit to a standalone article. JoelleJay (talk) 02:47, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep - I agree that there is a lack of secondary source, but I found those in german , , . Nowadays, he played 164 matches in best handball league, played 26 international matches with Germany, was a successful manager of Germany men's national junior handball team between 2002 and 2011 (leading to 2 titles in Junior World Championship in 2009, 2011 and 2 titles in European Junior Championship in 2004 and 2006) and with Germany men's national handball team, he headed two major competitions (7th at 2012 European Championship and 5th at 2013 World Championship). Ok he is not the best known handballer, but I think we should keep this article. --LeFnake (talk) 09:41, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Just playing matches in a sport doesn’t make one notable. Everything you provided is WP:ROUTINE. Notability is achieved through significant coverage in independent sources. You just haven’t provided any justification for keeping this.T v x1 15:51, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

No, he did not just played matches in a sport, he played 164 professional matches in 1st handball League (Bundesliga), 26 international matches with Germany (one of the best national team) and has been Germany's coach for 3 years, heading two major competitions (7th at 2012 European Championship and 5th at 2013 World Championship).--LeFnake (talk) 07:38, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep He's 100% notable. He was head coach of one of the best and most watched handball team in the world. And most media groups in Germany has a lot of articles about him. (taz: 49; FAZ: ~117; Spiegel: 10; RP Online: 481; Süddeutsche: 23; baden.online: 905) I know most of this is only WP:ROUTINE but I didn't looked at all this articles and some will have deeper coverage. And he will pass WP:GNG without any problems. 🤾‍♂️ Malo95 (talk) 07:45, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Handball. Just being a coach of a team in a sport doesn’t make you notable. Not every sport is fundamentally notable. What we need is significant coverage, which no one so far has been able to provide. You only give a personal feeling about notability.T v x1 16:28, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Significant coverage is already provided. It looks for me that your personal feelings are in play here. Here an other example of a source which provides a complete interview of him and the women's coach (part 1 and part 2). It is a interview in one of the most prestigious magazine in the world. And here an other article. I really don't know what you want more. 🤾‍♂️ Malo95 (talk) 17:20, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Interviews are not considered acceptable for notability purposes unless they include SIGCOV by the interviewer (otherwise they are WP:PRIMARY and not independent); that one clearly does not. The second source is better, since, despite having a lot of quotes, there appears to be independent analysis by the reporter. JoelleJay (talk) 18:30, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

I found more articles about him from the ARD (National public-service broadcaster)

Start as national team coach:, &
End as national team coach: , and (This would be a news broadcast in the tv, but in the archive not able to play)

The second big national broadcaster ZDF has also an article about the end:

This two broadcaster talked for sure in there sports program about the start and the end of Heuberger. They also showed handball games which he gave interviews etc. And these games watched several millions of people. I really don't know how you have the feelling that he is not notable. If he wouldn't be notable most coaches of all team sports wouldn't be notable as well.🤾‍♂️ Malo95 (talk) 11:06, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep, the only "bombing" taking place here is the WP:IDONTLIKEIT WP:BLUDGEONing in this discussion. For context, Germany is one of the few countries in the world which actually has fully professional handball, with good attendances, media coverage etc, which, more importantly, has been demonstrated in this discussion. The article/subject is a bit beyond the need for debating certain details of this or that source, which is an editorial question belonging to the article's talk page. Geschichte (talk) 06:16, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Eddie891 _Work 17:18, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Mary A. Conlon

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Does not appear to meet WP:BASIC. No WP:SIGCOV on her career. – DarkGlow • 16:37, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Redirect to Walton High School (Bronx) at least if someone can find a source verrifying she was the founder. If not, we need to delete this. Since there are no sources, there is no verrified content to merge.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:47, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
~~Comment~~ Keep - Her obituary was in the New York Times , and I added that and a few more sources. I am looking for more sources as I have not yet found anything that specifically says she founded the Walton School, though she was its principal. DaffodilOcean (talk) 00:10, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

I believe her obituary in the New York Times is WP:SIGCOV, and it's certainly a reliable source. Her work in establishing the Bronx Day Nursery is covered in a 1927 book on the Bronx . The other citations confirm her role as principal of schools. I cannot find a citation for the school's first graduation, nor that she watched the construction of the school so I left {{citation needed}} in two places. DaffodilOcean (talk) 12:34, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

I think you are not weighing the fact she was local to the New York Times coverage area.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:51, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

There is nothing in WP:GNG about locality of sourcing. That is a made-up requirement by people who want GNG to be based on significance when really it is based only on coverage. —David Eppstein (talk) 00:38, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Well, some local coverge clearly runs into problems of violating not news guidelines. We really should add better guidelines on local coverage.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:21, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

~~Weak~~ keep Even if you accept the argument that the NYT is more likely to publish obituaries about people from NY, it would still be equivalent to a state-wide newspaper, so providing SIGCOV. In addition with the paragraph in the 1927 book, that should just about establish notability. Femke (talk) 18:46, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep I'm finding more about her in Google Books, in particular this delightful (?) lengthy testimony before a US Committee on Communist Propaganda, in which she gives details about a small number of students taking May 1 off, which was apparently a sign of dangerous communist ideas, and of pamphlets found in the neighborhood. Being called on to testify before a congressional committee shows her stature. She is also credited with running an experiment on the teaching of shorthand and praised by the Classical Journal for introducing the study of Greek in the schools. These all show that she was a significant educator. There are regular bulletins of the NY education department that we may be able to use to fill in some of the factual details and other hits on G-Books that I haven't gotten to. Lamona (talk) 21:37, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Lamona - nice job on the added sources. DaffodilOcean (talk) 14:54, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep. NYT obituary should be enough but the newly added sources strengthen the case for notability. —David Eppstein (talk) 17:30, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Enough sources have been located to clear the wiki-notability bar. XOR'easter (talk) 18:53, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Meets WP:GNG. -Kj cheetham (talk) 12:14, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Stifle (talk) 16:19, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Mary Dees

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This is an article on an actress who spend all her career in uncredited roles, with one exception. The exception is 4-minutes of standing in in a film for the lead actress who died during production. However they had someone else dub in the voice, so she was just a physical stand in. Our sourcing boils down to a "home town women makes big" coverage article that is predicting this will lead to true stardom, but that does not happen, another paper covering the incident because it is a rarity that someone dies during filming and you need to film them afterward, her papers having been archived, and a primary source on her birth. She clearly fails the acress notability guideline, because even if her one role was significant, that requires multiple roles, and all her other roles were so far from being significant they were not credited at all (it is not even clear she was credited for her stand-in). So I see no way that this article meets our inclusion criteria, and no way that our sourcing is enough in-depth to meet GNG. John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:05, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep. She had a by-lined obituary in The Guardian when she died in 2005.. Combined with the other more contemporary coverage already in the article she meets WP:BASIC. pburka (talk) 19:39, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, Saratoga film was a big deal back in the day (New York Times from 1937), and the Guardian obituary is convincing in terms of enduring coverage. Pikavoom 10:51, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep articles in The Guardian and The New York Times are sufficient to meet WP:GNG. NemesisAT (talk) 12:08, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Meets WP:GNG and WP:BASIC by sources listed by prev. editors. Samsmachado (talk) 19:00, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was redirect to List of Maharashtra cricketers. ✗plicit 23:48, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Ajay Chavan

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WP:BLP of a cricket player, not making or reliably sourcing any claim to passage of our inclusion standards for cricket players. The only notability claim being made here is that he exists, and the article fails to say anything about him that could even be measured against WP:NCRICKET, such as what league he played for Maharashtra in. And while there is an external link to a paywalled subscription-only database of cricket statistics, that means I can't get into it to see whether it adds a meaningful notability claim or not -- but there are no footnotes being cited at all to verify anything any other way.
So I'm willing to withdraw this if somebody who can access CricketArchive, and/or some evidence of Indian sports media coverage, can actually add something to this article that would constitute a notability claim -- but we don't keep unsourced articles just because there might maybe possibly be a stronger notability claim than anybody has been arsed to actually include in the article, we keep unsourced articles only if somebody can prove it. Bearcat (talk) 15:37, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Comment. I've restored the content and rewritten it, but all we have here at the moment is a database entry. I haven't looked for significant coverage yet, but List of Maharashtra cricketers seems like an appropriate WP:ATD if none can be found. _wjemather 16:02, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete We lack sourcing that would lead to passing GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:54, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to List of Maharashtra cricketers 1 FC and 9 LA matches for Maharashtra, but I'm not really seeing anything to suggest a GNG pass in English language sources. Redirect a suitable WP:ATD. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 19:17, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Redriect per Rugbyfan22. A technical pass of NCRIC but, there really isn't much on him; any users with access to Hindi sources able to find any additional stuff on him? StickyWicket (talk) 16:57, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. ✗plicit 13:30, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Kaka Muhammad Umar

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No significant coverage and the article was created by a blocked user. Sabeelul hidaya (talk) 12:16, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

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Delete Per nom, there is no significant coverage. Both this article and the university he founded have been tagged for notability since 2019. Under the article itself, it fails GNG.-Cupper52 18:12, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Previously nominated via WP:PROD, ineligible for soft deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 13:01, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 14:40, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete: I added the basic information and reference about this person into the Jamia Darussalam article, but the reference is no more than a passing mention. Fails to demonstrate individual notability. AllyD (talk) 20:45, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The Cannon Film Company

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Non-notable company. Article created by the owner. MClay1 (talk) 13:30, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete There is not enough news coverage on this. MartinWilder (talk) 18:53, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. ✗plicit 13:47, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Guadacanal Resort

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This unsourced "suburb" article seems from the few available sources online to simply be a holiday resort, and at the wrong title to boot (should be "Guadalcanal", not "Guadacanal"). Fram (talk) 13:21, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete The coordinates don't point to a resort, but to Lungga community. Reywas92 20:32, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
When I mentioned this at Misplaced Pages:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 February 1 § Ironbottom Sound: The Guadacanal Campaign (which is where I'm assuming Fram noticed this article), I made an effort to verify its existence, especially at this unusual spelling, and found nothing. Really all of the Honiara suburbs articles need a lot of attention, and some probably should be redirected for lack of meaningful content; but of those I've spot-checked, this is the only one that outright fails verification. (I'd bet there's one or two more, though.) So, delete unless someone can find sources. -- Tamzin (she/they) 03:07, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was speedy deleted per WP:G5. Sir Sputnik (talk) 01:44, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Greg Maluma

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Appears to be related to Gregson Maluma which was deleted after clear consensus here. Some of the sources appear to be new so I'm not sure that this qualifies for speedy deletion. A lot of the sources look like self-published spam and there is no claim to meeting WP:NACTOR, WP:ANYBIO, WP:NSPORT or any other guideline. Source analysis to follow. I did a WP:BEFORE search but found nothing additional. Spiderone 13:15, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Source assessment - fails WP:GNG Spiderone 13:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Source assessment table
Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm12739962/		WP:IMDB	Just a profile page	✘ No
https://contents101.com/2021/09/18/greg-maluma-biography-age-educational-career-and-net-worth/		Clearly a user-generated page rather than professional work		✘ No
https://www.radiotimes.com/programme/b-8ud37w/martial-arts-mind-and-body/			Passing mention	✘ No
https://nofilmschool.com/u/gregmaluma	This is Maluma's own user page	https://nofilmschool.com/about - filmmakers can make their own user page on this site. This is what Maluma did.		✘ No
https://www.musicinafrica.net/directory/greg-maluma		This is a social media site where artists can promote themselves. It is unreliable and doesn't indicate notability.		✘ No
https://nofilmschool.com/u/gregmaluma			As per #4	✘ No
https://web.archive.org/web/20220130051520/https://newscolony.com/entertainment/greg-malumas-biography-fact-career-awards-net-worth-and-life-story/		Unreliable content scraper		✘ No
https://viadeo.journaldunet.com/p/greg-maluma-7966008	Personal profile created by Maluma	Personal profile created by Maluma		✘ No
https://www.amazon.com/kyokushin-kenbukaikan-technical-syllabus-karate-ebook/dp/B09PDVKMT2		Anyone can sell on Amazon	Linking this on Misplaced Pages is a form of advertising and fails to establish notability. Anyone can sell a book on Amazon	✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Spiderone 13:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete As per nom, fails WP:GNG, WP:NACTOR. DMySon (talk) 14:35, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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The result was speedy delete. Liz 03:21, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Trackpedia

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Fails the general notability guideline. The only sources I could find were forum posts, affiliated pages and unreliable YouTube and Vimeo videos. Page creator appears to have been a single-purpose account dedicated to promoting the website on Misplaced Pages. – Teratix ₵ 13:01, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete per nomination. Article is written like an advertisement, and I'm shocked that this was nominated for deletion before this. Spf121188 (talk) 13:35, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete – Per nominator's comments. Quite an audacious bit of advertising. Subject lacks meaningful coverage and what exists does not warrant an article. 5225_C (talk • contributions) 13:47, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete - Promotional article for an apparently non-notable subject. HumanBodyPiloter5 (talk) 14:23, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per above. Not only does it read like an advertisement, it also solicits advertising. Kablammo (talk) 14:29, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Advertising material and promotional content. Mann Mann (talk) 07:19, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per nom. Promotional tone aside, the sources on this page fail WP:SIGCOV, and other than brief mentions in book sources, I was unable to find any that pass. Heartmusic678 (talk) 12:36, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
G11 Speedy delete this promotional content. -"Ghost of Dan Gurney" 21:09, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
I think it's starting to snow Spf121188 (talk) 15:48, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete though CSD:G11 does not apply since this article is not “exclusively promotional,” it is somewhat descriptive of the topic. However this is still a clear fail of GNG per nom Frank Anchor 02:22, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Liz 03:19, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Doru Sechelariu

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Unable to find significant coverage of the subject of this largely unsourced WP:BLP, with a WP:BEFORE search only seeming to return WP:ROUTINE coverage, passing mentions, or sources which do not appear to be independent of the subject. Ideally someone who can read Romanian could help with determining whether there are any suitable sources which could get this article up to the WP:GNG. HumanBodyPiloter5 (talk) 06:47, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Delete – Subject fails the GNG. The article claims he is/was a professional driver but GP3 was not a professional series. Either way, not enough coverage to prove notability. 5225_C (talk • contributions) 09:04, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Neutral – After looking at MSport1005's comments clearly there aren't zero sources. I wouldn't say he unambiguosly passes GNG, and I'd personally prefer deletion, but there appears to be coverage in Romania so it doesn't seem as bad as it did. 5225_C (talk • contributions) 21:20, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Keep — I don't speak Romanian, but I could find these with ease: , , , , covering his "promising" career and his future aspirations, apparently covering an incident with the police, is more of a passing mention as a young up-and-coming Romanian talent, , two visibly non-ROUTINE announcements, and , , , which suggest some sort of relevance as an F1 pundit/expert in his country. Funnily enough, he was the subject of an F1-related april fools joke: , and even the gossip press talks about him nowadays , . I might have a second look later to see if I can find more, but just based off this (combined with the fact that he completed a full GP3 season) he seems to comfortably meet GNG. MSport1005 (talk) 16:05, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Comment I'm undecided for now. He completely fails WP:NMOTORSPORT, so we turn over to WP:GNG. Looking at MSport1005's sources, bits in Adevarul / (per WP:GNG they count as one source) are good examples of secondary non-trivial coverage. Automarket seems good enough, but I am not sure whether that website is a reliable source. Fanatik one is an interview, and thus isn't independent to count for notability. Realitea Sportiva one just copies Fanatik's interview. Cancan is a tabloid website, making it not reliable. Evenimentul Zilei bit has only 3 sentences (2 of those being short) about him, so I can't call that WP:SIGCOV. SportAuto is a quote farm (meaning it's not independent), and MotorsportNews is a mere blog. Gazeta Sporturilor contains his analysis of Hamilton-Verstappen battle, but is of very little importance in terms of his own notability. TVS24 is yet another blog, Cancun again, WP:TRIVIA April Fools, WowBiz isn't a significant coverage of Doru. I'll try to dig for more sources if possible (including my research on Automarket), but for now I'm leaning delete. Jovanmilic97 (talk) 17:08, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Alright, I've had another look at them. #1/#5 and #2 are SIGCOV (Automarket indeed is reliable). #4 as you say is just a copy, #7 and #8 aren't sufficiently extense. The ones you wrote off as blogs (#9, #11, #13) I'm not sure they actually are, as messy as they might look (their reliability might need review though). The fact that a newspaper like Fanatik (#3) went to interview him, tabloids (#6, #15) talk about him without even needing to introduce him, and GSP (#10, #12) have him as their go-to expert suggest clear notability within Romania. #14 I never intended it as SIGCOV, and #16 is a tabloid and refers to him as "Dumitru's son" so we can ommit those two. We're left with potentially 6/7 proper sources, plus whatever we can find in an advanced WP:BEFORE search, so I'm heavily inclined towards keep. MSport1005 (talk) 20:17, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for your input. It appears that you have found some sources which I was unable to find in my searches. I'm still not fully convinced that this meets the WP:GNG, but the Adevarul sources probably take the article half-way to meeting it. HumanBodyPiloter5 (talk) 10:15, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 12:16, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep sources shared by MSport1005 appear to establish notability per WP:GNG. NemesisAT (talk) 22:22, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. RL0919 (talk) 19:10, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Bilal Ziani Guennon

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Seems to fail WP:GNG. Can't find any newspaper articles or the like on him. Just barely scrapes by WP:FOOTYN having made a 84th-minute substitute appearance in the CAF Champions League for Wydad AC. Robby.is.on (talk) 09:32, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Delete - there is longstanding consensus that scraping by on NFOOTBALL with one or two appearances is insufficient when GNG is failed so comprehensively, as is the case here. If sources are found please ping me. Giant Snowman 10:57, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep seems to pass GNG from a cursory Google search.--Ortizesp (talk) 14:47, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
- @Ortizesp: Could you link examples of references? I only posted this AfD because I didn't find any from my own "cursory Google search". Robby.is.on (talk) 09:34, 28 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep passes WP:NFOOTY and subject is 22 years and actively playing for a club playing in a Fully professional league.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 22:08, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Where does it say that he is actively playing there? The article says he is not. Geschichte (talk) 08:23, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Delete. I didn't find any news reports using "Bilal Ziani Guennon" or "Bilal Guennon", although there was one routine hit with "Guennoun". It looks like Ziani is what he goes by. Regardless, none of these searches turned up anything approaching significant coverage. And meeting NFOOTY is irrelevant. JoelleJay (talk) 20:18, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 12:13, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete. From what it appears, player hasn't appeared in any professional games in his career? Josh (talk) 18:40, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Only the 6 minutes against Kaizer Chiefs so far. Geschichte (talk) 09:55, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. czar 16:56, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

TerraDrive

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This niche RPG seems to fail WP:GNG and WP:BEFORE is of little help (the only indepedent sigcov surce I see is the cited ArsTechnica piece ). It seems this was a 2007 era attempt to promote an upcoming product - the article hasn't improved much since and still states "It is scheduled for release at PAX: The Penny Arcade Exposition on August 26, 2007." This is also a near fork of a related game TerraDrive Live which seems even more niche (google just gives about ~200 ghits for this...). We also had an article about the developer, that was deleted a long while ago it seems (Technomancer Press). PS. I am not sure how to make a bundle AFD (since TD Live is de facto a fork). If this is deleted, I guess TDLive can be prodded? _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 10:24, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Piotrus, I have tagged TerraDrive Live for deletion in this nomination discussion. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 02:21, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Delete both. They don't seem to meet any criterion for notability I can find. FalconK (talk) 03:21, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: TerraDrive was previously nominated via WP:PROD, ineligible for soft deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 12:12, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete: Both articles clearly fail WP:GNG. Searching for sources, I only really found this Ars Technica article about TerraDrive Live (), and then absolutely nothing else. One article does not an article make. Nomader (talk) 02:50, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Waterland WaterPark (Thessaloniki)

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I failed to detect significant coverage from indepedent reliable sources. C messier (talk) 10:56, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete – fails WP:GNG. Best I could find outside of personal blogs was this from GTP Headlines, a marketing agency for the travel industry in Greece. Despite lack of WP:RS qualifications, they post a top 10 list in Greece supposedly compiled by TripAdvisor. While the top 4 water parks are discussed by GTP, Waterland barely makes the list and is nothing more than a passing mention. --GoneIn60 (talk) 18:55, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Tone 16:08, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

St. Augustine's College (Malta)

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Issues with notability _Signed, Pichemist 10:26, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep. Historic secondary school. Easily enough sources available to satisfy WP:GNG. as with any other secondary school in the western world. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:08, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
We don't see 'any other secondary school in the western world' with an article tough, I suppose. _Signed, Pichemist 18:49, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

He copies and pastes almost the same message into every AfD related to secondary schools in the western world, universities, really spin the wheel, and never provides the references he claims exists either. Even though there are supposedly easily enough of them to satisfy WP:GNG. Most of the time the his "votes" are ignored by whoever closes the AfD. So it's not a super big deal, but it is a bit pedantic if not borderline disruptive. I'm hoping someone will report him to ANI for it eventually, but it's better to just to ignore him in the meantime, WP:DFTT. --Adamant1 (talk) 00:35, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

No, I'm afraid I don't copy and paste. And stop the suggestions that editors whose opinions differ from your own should be reported to ANI, which is arrogant in the extreme. As I have said before, Misplaced Pages is becoming a deeply unpleasant place. Try not to contribute to it. And, incidentally, how dare you suggest that I am a vandal or a troll per WP:DFTT! This is a clear breach of WP:NPA and WP:AGF. I would suggest you take a look at my contributions to this project. A vandal or troll I most certainly am not. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:49, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

I could quote at least a dozen times in the last couple of months where you've said almost the exact same thing in your "votes." I'm not going to bother though because they are pretty easy to find. In the meantime maybe you can tell me how the essay on your user page is a presumption of good faith, contributes to a pleasant environment, and doesn't come off as extremely arrogant. --Adamant1 (talk) 23:58, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

That's not copying and pasting. That's saying the same thing because that's my opinion, as I am entitled to do without being accused of being a vandal or a troll or it being suggested that I should be "reported" for daring to express an opinion that is different from yours. The essay on my userpage reflects how I feel about those who come here to delete rather than expand and the unpleasantness that results if they are challenged, and I stand by it. I have been here a long time; I have seen how AfD discussion has got nastier year on year and how those who want to delete react when their views are opposed. And I am not directing an attack at anyone in particular. You clearly are. Kindly desist and do not accuse me of things that are patently untrue. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:36, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

I'm not sure how you equated me saying I hope someone reports you eventually for repeatedly making un-constructive comments in AfDs into me suggesting you should be reported for "daring to have opinions that are different then mine" but whatever. I could literally give a crap if you have different opinions then me. That's not my issue. Outside of that, it's kind of weird that on the one hand your being so adamant that I should respect your opinions and feelings, while on the other your insulting me over mine by calling me arrogant and making such a brew haha over this. Why not just respect my opinions and feelings about it instead of insulting me? If your so concerned with AfDs being civil, then don't call people names or make a massive issue out of nothing like your doing here. I was reading a guideline or something about trolling the other day, and it said something along the lines of "trolls make non-constructive edits because they are powerless to do anything else" or something like that. Which I think perfectly describes what your doing in AfDs about schools. Your free to disagree though. I could really care less. Obliviously the term troll is subjective and people are going to have differing ideas on what constitutes trolling. So maybe don't attack me for "daring to express an opinion that is different from yours" about it. --Adamant1 (talk) 21:42, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

If you genuininely can't understand why a long-serving and highly productive editor may not be particularly keen on a comment directed straight at him which says "Most of the time the his "votes" are ignored by whoever closes the AfD. So it's not a super big deal, but it is a bit pedantic if not borderline disruptive. I'm hoping someone will report him to ANI for it eventually, but it's better to just to ignore him in the meantime, WP:DFTT", then I have nothing further to say other than learn to moderate your language and reread WP:AGF and WP:NPA. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:03, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

I don't care about your "standing" or how productive of a user you are. This isn't an elite tennis club in the Hamptons or whatever. Being a longstanding, "highly productive" editor doesn't exempt you from the obligation to provide references in an AfD when you claim they exist. Nor does your "standing" justify the clearly insulting user page essay. Tone it down, support your claims of notability with some evidence, and I wouldn't have an issue with you. In the meantime it's hard to take your complaint about me saying your trolling seriously when your fine using the term on your user page. Which is literally the only reason I brought it up. If you think the term "troll" is a personal attack and bad faithed, cool, then don't use the term and I won't either. It's that simple. In the meantime though, I'm not to concerned about using a word to describe your behavior that you clearly have no issue with. WP:AGF and WP:NPA aren't one way streets. --Adamant1 (talk) 21:11, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

You clearly don't get the difference between a comment on an AfD page aimed squarely at an individual editor and an opinion essay on a userpage which mentions no particular editors. Never mind. I'm sure most other editors do. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:28, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

I get the idea that your are still in complete denial over the outcomes of the 2017 RFC about notability of schools. The Banner talk 18:39, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

I get the idea that you didn't read my first comment and the comments of almost everyone else on this AfD. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:11, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

I must agree with @Necrothesp on this one. _Signed, Pichemist 15:57, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

Whatever our personal opinions or the outcome of this particular AfD, there's been multiple ANI complaints in the last couple of months where people were sanctioned or warned for writing extremely similar messages in AfDs and not backing them up with evidence. From what I remember of those people got a pass because of their success rates either. Let alone because they were long-time contributors or whatever. Personally, I don't care that much about it, but the wider consensus is clearly against people writing two or three sentence votes that lack any sort of supporting evidence. Also, I think if people are going to participate in AfDs they should at least be willing to put the minuscule amount of effort into this that it takes to copy and paste a reference they say exists. Otherwise, leave it to other people who are willing to and work on other areas of Misplaced Pages. --Adamant1 (talk) 04:24, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

there's been multiple ANI complaints in the last couple of months where people were sanctioned or warned for writing extremely similar messages in AfDs and not backing them up with evidence. From what I remember of those people got a pass because of their success rates either. Let alone because they were long-time contributors or whatever. Really? Because I can't find a single ANI case like this "in the last couple of months". Care to provide us with a link to at least one of these "multiple ANI complaints in the last couple of months where people were sanctioned or warned for writing extremely similar messages" so we can see what you mean? I've never known an editor to be sanctioned for expressing their opinion at AfD so long as it was not attacking another editor. I've seen the occasional editor who doesn't like their views being challenged call for such sanctions (probably not at ANI, however), but I've also seen those calls dismissed out of hand as ludicrous. I would be extremely worried about the direction in which Misplaced Pages was heading if such sanctions or even warnings were imposed. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:51, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

I've been accused of malicious intent recently because I almost always vote keep, but the editor never replied when I challenged their accusations. NemesisAT (talk) 12:22, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Unfortunately you have to get used to it (you shouldn't have to, but it's become the nature of "debate" here). It's been happening to me for several years now. I tend to have a live and let live policy. I'll vote keep if I have strong feelings that something is worth keeping, but won't usually bother voting delete if I don't because I don't think that AfDs where you don't really have strong feelings either way are worth the hassle. It really upsets deletionists, who seem to think it means I want to keep everything. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:14, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Unfortunately I can't find the ANI complaint right now, but someone was topic banned from AfDs for three months a few days ago for repeatedly asserting things were notable without providing evidence, among other things. There was also the ARS members who were either blocked or warned for similar things. One of which was repeatedly asserting that things were notable and being unwilling to provide references when people asked for them. Personally, I'm not really upset about how you vote. Really, I just think that providing references when you say something is notable shows respect for the process and other users. Plus, I really hate to see things get deleted just because keep voters can't be bothered to click a mouse button. Really, if we are all in this to improve Misplaced Pages I don't see how not providing a reference does that. Wouldn't it be better to provide the references your able to find so they can be added to the article? I don't think that's such an unreasonable request. --Adamant1 (talk) 13:45, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

So neither you nor I can find this or any other incident on ANI. How very odd! Especially given there are, according to you, "multiple" cases over the last couple of months. However, I suspect you may be referring to this. A case where an editor merely posted "Keep, for the reasons of those who want to keep this article" on every AfD in which he participated. Which, as I'm sure you will appreciate if you read it, bears no resemblance to anything I have posted on AfDs. But, of course, that's just one of the "multiple" incidents you claim have occurred. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:00, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

I'm not sure what your talking about when you just found one of the incidents and I was pretty clear about the other one involving ARS members, which is easy to find, but sure dude. Neither of us found anything. Right. Anyway, as far as I'm concerned there's only a superficial difference between repeatedly saying "Keep, for the reasons of those who want to keep this article" and repeatedly saying "keep because clearly this is notable." To quote from ANI complaint about Davidgoodheart's behavior, "it casts serious doubt on this editor's review of the deletion discussion and source material," "clearly not at AfD to individually assess each article's merits," "Davidgoodheart clearly has difficulty understanding how to participate usefully in deletion discussions," "I have been discounting these comments due to their obvious pro forma nature once I noticed it was the same wording repeated in multiple AfDs...this approach to commenting is inappropriate and has gone on far too long." Literally all those quotes could apply to you. Especially the last one. Your literally repeating the same thing over and over. Nothing in how you vote shows that you are assessing articles on their own merits or reviewing the source material either. Let alone is your participation in AfDs discussions at all useful. You just get ignored and someone else provides the references. --Adamant1 (talk) 14:38, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep quite a lot of sources available through a Google search, I've added some to the article. NemesisAT (talk) 15:57, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep as has coverage in Times of Malta added to the article together with other reliable sources coverage so that deletion is unnecessary in my view, Atlantic306 (talk) 00:09, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Question -- Most of the article implies that it is only a primary school. If so, surely it is NN. Whatever it is, this is a poor stub of an article. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:02, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
It appears to be both a primary and a secondary school. Primary schools may still have articles if they pass GNG, they are not "surely" non-notable. NemesisAT (talk) 12:58, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete from what I can tell the references are extremely trivial, passing mentions and related to mundane, non-notable facts. Outside of that there is nothing that would constitute the in-depth, direct coverage required by WP:GNG. Sorry, but there isn't really a scenario where a Misplaced Pages article about someone stealing a public address system from the school would work. let alone be encyclopedic. Same goes for them temporarily moving into a different school building, which three references in the article are about. --Adamant1 (talk) 06:50, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
The school has existed since 1848. Given the level of sourcing available online I think its highly likely newspaper sources exist from earlier as well. The problems with the premises are far from mundane and appear to have been controversial. There are several articles already cited that focus on the subject, which establishes notability per WP:GNG. NemesisAT (talk) 12:53, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

I assume your comment of the "controversy" relates to what I mentioned about someone stealing the PA system. I wouldn't exactly call that a controversy. Except maybe to a couple of mom's at a soccer game, but then anything would qualify as controversial. Personally I prefer standards of notability that don't include things a couple of mom's at a soccer practice would gossip about, which is literally everything. Really, the whole "controversy automatically equates to notability" thing is ridiculous in the first place. Misplaced Pages isn't a tabloid. We aren't here to provide people the latest news on celebrity dating gossip or whatever. --Adamant1 (talk) 22:28, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

I was referring to the controversy surrounding the expansion of the school, which seems to have gone on for several years. I'm not aware of a PA system being stolen, perhaps you're thinking of the article where computers were stolen? NemesisAT (talk) 12:37, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Oh, OK. It didn't seem like that was a controversy. Yes, computers, a PA system, and I think a few other things. In case your wondering, I singled out the PA system being stolen because computers and computer parts regularly get stolen from schools. PA systems though, not so much. So I think the PA system being stolen is slightly more notable then the computers. Although both are still extremely mundane and probably not worth mentioning in a Misplaced Pages article. --Adamant1 (talk) 22:51, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Source analysis please. Assertions and grandiose statements are as useful in determining a consensus as a bucket of warm spit would be.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz 11:56, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Source assessment table
Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/marsa-state-school-building-to-house-st-augustine-primary.460618		Times of Malta is a long-running print newspaper, appears to be reliable		✔ Yes
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/old-medical-school-to-be-transferred-to-st-augustine-college.435876	Third-party perspective discussing the school and government's actions		Article focuses on the school	✔ Yes
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/house-committee-approves-transfer-to-st-augustine-college.437582			~ Very short article, but does focus on the school	~ Partial
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/1-792-student-vacancies-in-church-schools.397277			Passing mentions	✘ No
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/medical-school-building-offered-as-solution-to-st-augustine-school.409756			Article focuses on the school	✔ Yes
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/Heartbreak-for-students-as-new-computers-stolen.551324	Article based on account from a member of staff at the school		Focuses on an incident that happened at the school	✘ No
https://newsbook.com.mt/en/st-augustine-college-to-restore-historic-home-to-extend-secondary-school/		Small website with little information available on it	Article focuses on the school	? Unknown
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Please see the source assessment table above. I was perhaps being a bit harsh on Newsbook, I have no reason to beleive it isn't reliable. Meets WP:GNG. NemesisAT (talk) 12:19, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep, as there is sufficient significant coverage to meet GNG; it does all come from a single source, when multiple sources are typically preferred, but I believe we need to take into account the size of Malta and the fact that there are less reliable sources there than there are for other countries. BilledMammal (talk) 13:37, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep per NemesisAT. Sourcing is sufficient to meet minimum requirements of GNG. --Jayron 32 14:18, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep regardless of the endless swirl around schools/ORG and my personal feelings therein, it appears that this particular school meets the GNG. Beyond the ones IDed above, I found this, which provides some history worth adding/sourcing. Star Mississippi 18:27, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was withdrawn by nominator. (non-admin closure) – AssumeGoodWraith (talk | contribs) 02:47, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Autonomous circuit

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Single sentence unsourced article that has remained unchanged for ~13 years. – AssumeGoodWraith (talk | contribs) 09:46, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep A Google search shows that there's a LOT of research in this area. While this article is currently just a definition, there seems to be more to be said on this topic, to the point where I think it certainly meets WP:GNG. I'll add what seems a reasonable reference, and hopefully someone with a more relevant area of expertise can do more. PianoDan (talk) 17:11, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Sandstein 10:07, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Olimjon Karimov

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Has only made appearances in WP:NOTFPL leagues to date (checking Football Database as well as Soccerway) so no claim to WP:NFOOTBALL. Searches such as this and this only provide trivial coverage so WP:GNG is not established. Spiderone 09:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 20:16, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete: Does not appear to have WP:SIGCOV so fails GNG. Per nom, delete. GauchoDude (talk) 16:09, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. If people think a redirect is warranted, they can create one, although it appears unlikely to me that somebody would search for this phrase. Sandstein 09:25, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

M&M Desexualization Controversy

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WP:NOTNEWS. Not every flash-in-the-pan "controversy" or talk show host stupidity needs an article here. Fram (talk) 08:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete per WP:NOTNEWS. These days people raise such "controversies" on everything everyday, but being a notable subject requires more than the mocking by a TV-host. Cavarrone 10:46, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
This is not worth an article, but the anthropomorphized M&M commercials are. People have been talking about the oddly sexualized nature of some of them, casual violence/cannivalism, etc. for some time now. So reframe to be about that broadly. I thought about doing it myself, but I can't bring myself to start an article about a commercial campaign. — Rhododendrites \\ 14:12, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- We already have a lengthy M&M's#M&M's characters section, isn't that sufficient. The M&M's article also has a very long section on "marketing", with little focus on encyclopedic discussion of the marketing, but a rambling series of trivia like "In 2007, M&M's introduced a limited-edition raspberry flavor called "M&M's Razzberry Chocolate Candies"." A cleanup of the main article, with one line about the "controversy", may be feasible. Fram (talk) 14:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
  - What I mean is that section could probably stand to be its own article. If someone did that, there might be cause for a few words about this (certainly not as a "controversy"), but it would be undue in the parent article so I guess Delete otherwise. — Rhododendrites \\ 13:55, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per Cavarrone. I'd like to add: NOT-WP:LASTING. It's so funny and sad that this wasn't successfully prodded. It's precisely this that was frivolous (with reference to the edit summary), and not the proposed deletion. twabin 17:01, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep GoldenBootWizard276 (talk) 22:31, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete M&M's#M&M's characters should cover it without the usual 'culture war' kvetching (as long as the yellow M&M remains the kind and nervous soul he is, I don't care about the rest of it). Nate • (chatter) 23:14, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete as Misplaced Pages is WP:NOTNEWS. I get that performers are always trying to drum up a reaction to whatever is going on in pop culture, but Misplaced Pages is a place to cover long-term factual information, and not short term bursts of opinion. Shooterwalker (talk) 15:56, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep content somewhere: Readers would be best served by this episode being covered somewhere in our coverage of m&ms and the recent mascot changes, with the barest mention of Tucker's views. Carlson's attitude to sexual issues leads him to make the most bizarre comments on these things. I fear to know the inner workings of his brain.--Milowent • 22:25, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to M&M's#M&M's characters per WP:NOTNEWS, that way if any content does need to be preserved it can be done so. Devonian Wombat (talk) 23:29, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete These are twitter people starting the controversy. TzarN64 (talk) 15:35, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete unlikely to be WP:LASTING. Will likely stay undue for the main M&M's article. Femke (talk) 19:48, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete I can't believe this page got made before Twitter got bored of the M&M thing. This realistically shouldn't even be on the main M&M page, let alone have it its own page. BuySomeApples (talk) 23:33, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Merge a few sentences to M&M's. Does not appear to have generated enough secondary coverage to warrant a separate article, however. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:19, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Fails WP:SUSTAINED. If a company thinks so many people are getting sexually attracted to their anthropomorphic candy mascot that they have to change it, that's their perogative and not a real "controversy". ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 16:50, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to M&M's#M&M's characters. Never heard about this incident, I thought I was the only one who thought some of the M&M characters were oddly sexualized for a candy mascot. Surprised to hear someone objecting to a desexualization of an anthropomorphic character but it's not worthy of an article. Liz 03:36, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was Rename to List of rowing clubs. Sandstein 09:21, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

List of rowing blades – Club oars

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Unsourced (tagged since 2011) gallery with no indication of notability for the topic as a group (individual oars will be verifiable, but that isn't sufficient to have an article here). Only external link is a hobby website, not the kind of source that establishes notability either. Fram (talk) 08:15, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

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Weakest Keep but certainly needs citation. This is a tough one as it empirically does NOT meet Misplaced Pages's guidelines, but the nature of it (a list of information relating to a broader topic) is of value to that broader topic, which itself has established clear notability. That said, following a few of the club links, it appears that most of them have their own colors (usually in the same image as found here) so this list is a nice reference, but not strictly required. -Markeer 13:22, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep Valid information list. Plenty of things listed have their own articles as well, so valid navigational list as well. Dream Focus 14:24, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
- I must have missed it. Which of these rowing blades have their own articles? Fram (talk) 14:50, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
  - The clubs, like Drummoyne Rowing Club have their own article. --evrik 16:53, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
  - This list not just the color of their oars, but the names of the clubs, that's what linked to. Just rename it to List of rowing clubs. So far the Category:Lists of rowing clubs only has List of rowing clubs on the River Wear and List of rowing clubs in Australia. Dream Focus 15:01, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
    - Okay, reusing information for a list with a different focus then. That wasn't really clear from your original post... Fram (talk) 15:25, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep Valid information list. --evrik 16:15, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
- Copying the text from someone else's vote, which they afterwards had to clarify completely as the original vote didn't make much sense, isn't really helpful. Keep as is, "keep" as a completely repurposed and retitled list, or something else? Fram (talk) 16:21, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
  - Why are you being so aggressive and critical? I thought it was pretty straightforward. Why belabor the issue. I have now started adding references. --evrik 16:31, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
    - So no reason to keep this actually. Fram (talk) 16:34, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
      - This is a lot of negativity for a Monday morning. It's a valid list, it has sources. --evrik 16:53, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
        But that's not what creates a valid list. You need sources for the topic as a whole, not just (primary) sources for the individual entries. You could create list of rowing clubs whose president is called John and find sources for that as well, that doesn't mean that it is a valid list. Fram (talk) 17:11, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
        It's part of a broader topic, which is itself notable. --evrik 17:24, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
        And...? How does this translate to a keep for this list? Notability is not inherited, that an unnamed briader topic is notable has no bearing on this topic. Fram (talk) 19:06, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Rename it to List of rowing clubs. --Bduke (talk) 22:16, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
I would lean towards delete here but I think this needs to be looked at alongside List of rowing blades and List of rowing blades – National team oars. These articles are badly sourced and I cannot find anything other than very niche and unreliable sources speaking about this as a subject. I have a feeling that all of these fail WP:LISTN. I cannot see the argument for navigational purposes unless each individual rowing blade had its own article. To argue for navigational value this would need to be List of rowing clubs as Bduke said above. If reliable sources can be found - I say keep and merge the three. If not - delete all three. Vladimir.copic (talk) 03:46, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Rename to List of rowing clubs as per above. Remove all the non-notables. The distinction of just being a club is more notable than the colours of their oars (or other uniformed equipment). Ajf773 (talk) 09:48, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
Comment At this point the consensus is to keep the article. --evrik 21:39, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
- Uh, why do you add your interpretation of the consensus at a random point in the discussion? The closing or relisting admin will decide this, they don't need the article creator (or the AfD started) to tell them what the consensus is. Fram (talk) 15:04, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 07:44, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Rename as mentioned above. Gusfriend (talk) 08:59, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Rename to List of rowing clubs, since the current topic does not meet WP:NLIST. MrsSnoozyTurtle 21:11, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment I would sugges merging to National Team oars or List of rowing blades – School and university, but that would make those unwieldy.--evrik 21:39, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Liz 03:16, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Kakistocracy

AfDs for this article:

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WP:DICDEF. While the article contains several sources, none of them provide substantial coverage of Kakistocracy itself and I can’t find evidence that it’s anything more than novel way to say the government is a pack of thieves and liars. RaiderAspect (talk) 00:13, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Keep - Not a lot of in depth discussion, but there is certainly RS here to indicate the term is being used, and enoough context and usage indicate what its about. Deathlibrarian (talk) 02:35, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep, passes WP:GNG, based on being the subject of many reliable, independent, secondary sources.

References

André Spicer (18 April 2018). "Donald Trump's 'kakistocracy' is not the first, but it's revived an old word". The Guardian. Retrieved 26 January 2022.
William L. Kovacs (2019). Reform the Kakistocracy; Rule by the Least Able Or Least Principled Citizens. Newman Springs Publishing. ISBN 9781640965140.
Abadjian, V. (2010). "Kakistocracy or the true story of what happened in the post-Soviet area". Journal of Eurasian Studies. 1 (2): 153–163.
Ornstein, N. (2017). "American Kakistocracy" (pdf). The Atlantic.
Gușă, A.R. (2021). "The Romanian Kakistocracy: The Public Sector's Ethos during the Post-communist Transition and its long-term impact" (pdf). Revista de Stiinte Politice (69).

SailingInABathTub (talk) 11:28, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Comment I don't believe that any of the sources meet the substantial coverage requirement that GNG and DICDEF require. To quote from WP:DICDEF: such articles must go beyond what would be found in a dictionary entry (definition, pronunciation, etymology, use information, etc.), and include information on the social or historical significance of the term. These sources all use the term Kakistocracy, explain its definition, and sometimes include some of its etymology - but they swiftly move on to their real subject, the political culture of various nations/governments. --RaiderAspect (talk) 15:11, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

... so, the social and historical significance of the term then. SailingInABathTub (talk) 15:32, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Delete — I agree with the comment above. Unlike e.g. kleptocracy, for which there is serious academic analysis of the term of what makes a regime kleptocratic, that is not true of kakistocracy, which is for all intents and purposes just a fancier way of saying idiocracy (a term that inspired a whole movie, but is still not notable as a political science term in itself). The "scope and use" of the term is very simple: it's bad government by idiots. It does not entail some broader reference to how the government functions, like kleptocracy, or its mode of decisionmaking, etc. There's not a whole lot else that can be said about it. WhinyTheYounger (WtY)(talk, contribs) 19:05, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
- Adding a caveat to the above that there does appear to be a novel attempt to define kakistocracy systematically à la kleptocracy etc. in Abadjian 2010, a journal article by an independent researcher. The definition offered does not seem to have been replicated or examined elsewhere. WhinyTheYounger (WtY)(talk, contribs) 17:37, 27 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 07:37, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep The sources describe this beyond just a definition and there is adequate content and context here for notability. Open to a merge target, but deletion isn't warranted here. Reywas92 14:16, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep I think there's enough to go on here that the "just a dictionary definition" concern, while understandable, isn't fatal. Whatever ails the page, deletion doesn't seem like the right fix. XOR'easter (talk) 21:55, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Sandstein 10:06, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

2026 Tamil Nadu Legislative Assembly election

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This topic clearly passes WP:TOOSOON, and there is no reason behind the creation of this page. Itcouldbepossible 07:31, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Comment Article appears to be moved to Next Tamil Nadu Legislative Assembly election by MPGuy2824 Justi yaya 10:24, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
The Afd tags weren't present on the page when I moved it. If there is a way to undo this move, please do so. -MPGuy2824 (talk) 10:43, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
@MPGuy2824 It cannot be possible. I started the AfD before you moved it. I started the AFD at 07:31, 1 February 2022 UTC, while you moved the page at 08:58, 1 February 2022‎ UTC. So it sums up that you moved the page after I started the AFD. Why? Itcouldbepossible 11:07, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
@Itcouldbepossible This was the state of the page just before my edit and subsequent move. As you can see, no afd tags were present (they were previously removed by the page creator). I should probably have checked page history, and wouldn't have done the move if i knew the Afd had already started. -MPGuy2824 (talk) 11:25, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Afd tags were re-added by me after the move, apologies for not noting this beforehand, thought the edit summary was enough. Justi yaya 12:15, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
the AFD notice was removed by SAMAR FIRDOS ASHRAF (ASHRAF ALAM) with Special:Diff/1069233990. Sorry about the confusion caused D: Justi yaya 12:30, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
@Justiyaya There is no need for you to apologize. The initial confusion was created by Samar. Itcouldbepossible 13:01, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

@MPGuy2824 Ok. Sorry for accusing you wrongly. Itcouldbepossible 13:01, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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Delete: WP:TOOSOON Currently there is no coverage about this election in reliable sources. This article should be created when media and other major news broadcasters start covering this election. Nitesh003 (TALK) 11:57, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete TOOSOON. Indeed, it cannot even be said definitively as of now if the elections will be held in 2026. Captain Jack Sparrow (talk) 18:59, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep and move to Left 4 Dead (franchise). Liz 06:24, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Left 4 Dead (series)

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A "series" with only 2 video games, a lot of the article either duplicates content from Left 4 Dead, is WP:OR or irrelevant. If the massive amounts of original research were removed it would be a relative stub and would probably remain so given the unlikelihood of a 3rd game now that Back 4 Blood exists. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 06:52, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Strong Keep The article absolutely needs improvement, but that's not a reason for deletion. The series as a whole is clearly notable based on the sourcing, and an article covering the franchise as a whole allows for coverage of the cancelled sequel, spinnoffs, and comics. This is a classic case of WP:NOTCLEANUP. Qwaiiplayer (talk) 14:28, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
It is not convincing that the little information on permanently cancelled Left 4 Dead 3 cannot be moved to a section at the end of Left 4 Dead 2. The fact remains that it is a series with 2 games, the 2nd of which is so similar to the first that it literally incorporates all the first one's campaigns in it to the point where it's obsolete. There is not really any need for discussion of changes made throughout the series because there are hardly any. Comics can also be talked about in the Left 4 Dead article without WP:UNDUE weight. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 16:16, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep- per Qwaiiplayer's comments above. I'm inclined to agree that even though this article definitely needs improvement, it seems notable enough given the sources already cited. And the parent article gives coverage to spin-offs and cancelled sequels as noted above. Spf121188 (talk) 14:36, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Keep But maybe move to Left 4 Dead (franchise) since it covers comics, spin-offs and other stuff as well.★Trekker (talk) 15:27, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- Comment I'd support this move. Qwaiiplayer (talk) 15:36, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Merge to both of the respective game's articles. There's long-standing consensus that two entries is not enough for a series article. NOTCLEANUP is irrelevant - the article is completely duplicative and redundant - all content can easily fit into the original game or sequel's article, because that's all there is to talk about. It has to fall into one or the other. Sergecross73 msg me 17:09, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep and move to Left 4 Dead (franchise) The franchise includes more than just the two video games, and it's clearly a notable franchise overall. This article covers things that wouldn't make sense to cover in any of the articles about the individual entries in the franchise, such as the merchandise and the cancelled sequel, so it is not entirely duplicative or redundant. Mlb96 (talk) 22:15, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
How so exactly? The Midnight Riders songs are explicitly linked to Left 4 Dead 2 and have nothing to do with Left 4 Dead 1. Besides that, toys and action figures just cover a couple sentences and can be mentioned in passing in either or both of the articles without it being undue.

The Left 4 Dead 3 info can be mentioned in the Legacy section of Left 4 Dead 2, being the game that directly follows it. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 07:47, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep and support moving to (franchise). Yes it is only a 2-game series, but there's clearly additional media, and the combination of both games have cultural elements to them that are covered at that level. It is entirely possible to cover all that in only two articles, but this three-article approach makes it a bit easier for organizating the information. Certainly it is not an issue of notability with the series/franchise as a whole. --Masem (t) 13:53, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Strong Keep The articile has some issues, but worthy of an article TzarN64 (talk) 15:39, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. See also Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/A. Albert. Whether a redirect is useful here and where to might need further discussion. Sandstein 09:18, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

A. Wilcocks

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Fails WP:GNG through lack of significant coverage, either provided or identifiable. Unlikely that any can be found, as per Olympedia "there is some confusion about the precise identity of this athlete" BilledMammal (talk) 06:32, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete we really know nothing about this person. Inclusion criteria also do not overcome the need for articles to meet GNG. Beyond this treating a team medal the same as an indvidual medal does not quite make sense to me. I would say the medal rule would suggest we have articles on the teams that won the medals if they can be sourced to reliable sources, but I do not think it reasonble to assume that every member of every team that won a medal is notable. This is especially true because in some competitions in some Olympics there were only 2 teams, so everyone in the competition was on a team that won a medal. That would also have applied if any competiton had only 3 teams. I have not exhastively studied the Olympics, but knowing there were some 2 team competitons makes me suspect there were 3 team ones as well.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:21, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete agree with nominator. There is not any coverage. MartinWilder (talk) 18:52, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Having won a silver medal, he passes the updated WP:NOLYMPICS guidelines. At worst this should be redirected to Rugby union at the 1908 Summer Olympics. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 21:43, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to Rugby union at the 1908 Summer Olympics. After looking at the Olympedia article it looks like the name may be spelled in some sources as Willcocks and at least this reference refers to the Devon player as J. Willcocks. If the subject's first name can be discerned we may have more luck establishing notability, but if we cannot find referencing to identify the subject's first name, correct spelling of his name, or even if we have the correct first initial I can't see how a standalone article is merited. Best, GPL93 (talk) 03:01, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep He was a member of a medal winning team. as per WP:NOLYMPICS guidelines. Jowaninpensans (talk) 10:56, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete or redirect, per GPL93. GNG has not been uncovered, and a suitable redirect exists. JoelleJay (talk) 02:49, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment: Note that an Alexander Wilcocks also exists, so a redirect for this term would not be suitable as it would be ambiguous. BilledMammal (talk) 05:37, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Liz 23:16, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Gregg P. Sullivan

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Previously prodded and deleted; restored via a request from the subject through volunteer response team. This article struggles to meet notability guidelines for creative professionals and the general notability guideline. A biography of living people article with long term WP:SPA and WP:COI issues from multiple angles, and overall lacks depth in significant coverage in multiple published reliable secondary sources. What coverage that is provided and seems to exist, is largely trivial and tangential. Seddon 04:14, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Delete due to lack of significant coverage, particularly in the context of the COI. BilledMammal (talk) 06:33, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete I agree. Fails WP:GNG MaskedSinger (talk) 11:51, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Some coverage found on him via Google search results. Seemed to has had worked extensively. 2601:8D:8700:5E10:D5E0:983D:E9A4:B0E8 (talk) 11:04, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was redirect to Lacrosse at the 1904 Summer Olympics#St. Louis Amateur Athletic Association. See Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/A. Albert. Sandstein 09:20, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

A. M. Woods

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Fails WP:GNG through lack of significant coverage, either provided or identifiable. Such coverage is unlikely to be found, if it even exists, as all we know about him is that he won silver in the 1904 Olympics, that his last name is Woods, and that his first initials are A. M. BilledMammal (talk) 06:19, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep: Athletes presumed notable if they had won a metal at any modern (post 1896) summer Olympics. WP:NOLYMPICS While I can't find the discussion for reliability for the two sources, it shows up as green in User:Novem Linguae/Scripts/CiteHighlighter Justiyaya 07:50, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- Per WP:NSPORT, it doesn't replace WP:GNG, and so GNG must still be met. BilledMammal (talk) 08:08, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Per WP:NSPORT: "The article should provide reliable sources showing that the subject meets the general notability guideline or the sport specific criteria set forth below." BeanieFan11 (talk) 15:14, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
    - 1904 Olympics were hardly a normal Olympics with a true process of choosing competitotrs who were seen as the best avialble. Treating medaling there the same as medaling at other Olympics is to ignore the actual conditions under which they were held.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:17, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
    You forgot the prior sentence: This guideline is used to help evaluate whether or not a sports person or sports league/organization (amateur or professional) is likely to meet the general notability guideline, and thus merit an article in Misplaced Pages and the succeeding sentence: If the article does meet the criteria set forth below, then it is likely that sufficient sources exist to satisfy the inclusion criteria for a stand-alone article. But you knew this already. JoelleJay (talk) 02:56, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment: At the Missouri History Museum there are two books of the St. Louis Amateur Athletic Association. which good be help full: Annual report and . Maybe somebody can visit the museum or ask for more details. 🤾‍♂️ Malo95 (talk) 09:03, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- I don't believe either of those would be considered independent or reliable, though the annual report might contain information about him, such as his name or date of birth, that could be helpful in finding additional information if such information exists (the Annual handicap athletic meet seems less likely to contain such information, as I assume he was not disabled) BilledMammal (talk) 09:52, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Considering how many medals were won in 1904 by a men with a wooden leg, I am not sure I would assume the not disabled part.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:18, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
    I contacted the Museum and good a scan of the 1904-1905 Report. I uploaded the report to archive.org. The only sentences about the Olympics are: "Second prize was taken in the Olympic championships. A match game was won against the best team from the Six Indian Tribes of Canada." So there no new information about the players. 🤾‍♂️ Malo95 (talk) 10:17, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete we really know nothing about this person. The 1904 Olympics were more just an addition to the 1904 WOrld's Fair then a true Olympics. Inclusion criteria also do not overcome the need for articles to meet GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:17, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Meets the criteria at WP:NOLYMPICS as currently written. If that changes, then the issue can be revisited. Attempts to get around this resemble WP:WIKILAWYERING rather than following the intent of the policy. Canadian Paul
- He does, but per WP:NSPORTS WP:GNG must still be met. BilledMammal (talk) 01:38, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete. No evidence of GNG, which trumps any subguidelines of NSPORT. JoelleJay (talk) 02:52, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to Lacrosse at the 1904 Summer Olympics. Therapyisgood (talk) 02:11, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Evidently fails WP:GNG. Avilich (talk) 03:08, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect as suggested by Therapyisgood, per WP:ATD. I'm under the general impression that many participants in the early Olympiads did not receive a lot of attention. Of course, I'm happy to be proven wrong. gidonb (talk) 04:21, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Liz 06:10, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

A. Dubois

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Fails WP:GNG through lack of WP:SIGCOV, either provided or identifiable. Unlikely that significant coverage can ever be identified, as all we know about him is that he won Bronze and Silver at the 1900 Olympics, that his last name was Dubois, and his first initial was A. BilledMammal (talk) 06:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete we really know nothing about this person. The 1904 Olympics were more just an addition to the 1904 WOrld's Fair then a true Olympics. Inclusion criteria also do not overcome the need for articles to meet GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:15, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete unless more information is added about who he was. Gusfriend (talk) 06:03, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete ~~redirect~~ to Rugby union at the 1900 Summer Olympics#France (Mixed Team). WP:V, a core policy, provides: "If no reliable, independent sources can be found on a topic, Misplaced Pages should not have an article on it." In this AfD, it is not contested that nothing is known about this man, not even his first name, except that he played in an Olympic rugby match. It is therefore not possible to write a WP:V-compliant biographical article about him. The "keep" opinions that only make reference to notability guidelines that establish a mere presumption of notability must be disregarded because they do not address the actual sourcing situation as established in this AfD. That a redirect is a reasonable alternative to deletion is not contested. Sandstein 09:17, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Amended to delete: I overlooked that there were reasonable arguments against a redirect. We don't therefore have consensus for one. People are free to create and then to contest such a redirect. Sandstein 16:38, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

A. Albert

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Fails WP:GNG as it lacks WP:SIGCOV, and none was identifiable. Further, it is unlikely that significant coverage can ever be identified, as all we know about him is that he competed as part of the winning French team in the 1900 Summer Olympics, that his last name was Albert, and that his first initial was A. BilledMammal (talk) 05:58, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete we really know nothing about this person. The 1904 Olympics were more just an addition to the 1904 WOrld's Fair then a true Olympics. Inclusion criteria also do not overcome the need for articles to meet GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:14, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep As a gold medal winner, he passes the updated version of the WP:NOLYMPICS guidelines. At worst this page should be redirected to Rugby union at the 1900 Summer Olympics. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 21:41, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete or redirect, per above. GNG is hardly to be expected for Olympians in this era. JoelleJay (talk) 02:58, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, gold medal winner clearly notable.--Ortizesp (talk) 02:29, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
- How, exactly. What sources do we have that constitute Sigcov? It is time we stop falling back on unwaranted sports notability guidelines. The evidence is very clear that there were times when Olympic gold medal winners did not recieve sufficient coverage to justify articles. The allowance of notability for all gold medal winners was not based on actual evidence there was in general sourcing to justify articles, and so it is a very bad SNG. Also, the guidelines on sports SNGs make it clear that to actually justify keeping an article the subject still has to meet GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:07, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete and do not redirect We don't even have this person's full name, and we're supposed to believe he gets an insta-exemption from passing GNG? No way. Now, the issue is that A) Rugby is a teamsport, so coverage of individual team-members is not 100% guaranteed and B) "Albert" is a common enough name that it's both B1) fruitless trying to find sources for this without access to specialist sources, as any search is likely to yield way too many false positives and B2) it would not necessarily mean that readers are actually looking for this specific person (Albert André could be a plausible target, if someone for some reasons got the two names there in the wrong order; and of course Albert (surname) lists at least two other persons who could reasonably be the target). And of course Even the Olympedia database used a source quite frankly says that "little is known about him". While NOLYMPICS might be a better guideline than it was before, it is still not in and of itself a criterion for inclusion (as the answer to the FAQ on NSPORTS says, GNG still needs to be met), and here there are good reasons to think that it is unlikely for GNG to be met, in this case even more than the mere age of the subject. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 15:12, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
- Regarding redirects, one of those at the disambiguation page is also referred to as A. A. Albert, and a A. Albert Yuzpe also exists. I don't think we can reasonably redirect this page. BilledMammal (talk) 21:34, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep passes WP:ANYBIO as a gold medal is "a well-known and significant award or honor." There is no doubt that the subject received the medal WP:V. --Enos733 (talk) 18:28, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Did you even read the darn page you're citing? "People are likely to be notable if, not "guaranteed". This is a fine counter-example... RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 19:55, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Redirect to Rugby union at the 1900 Summer Olympics Normally I'd argue that winning the first ever gold medal in Rugby in the Olympics, not only clearly meets the recently tightened WP:NOLYMPICS but is also a very clear pass of WP:NRUGBY. But we can't even identify the player's name here! But given that numerous sources list him as A. Albert it's very reasonable that it could be a search term, and redirect seems obvious to me. Nfitz (talk) 21:25, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete per RandomCanadian. Evidently fails GNG. Avilich (talk) 02:35, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. The consensus is that GNG is met by the sources found during the discussion. (non-admin closure) Enos733 (talk) 05:05, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Peppy Martin

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Unsuccessful candidate for political office. Thoroughly fails WP:NPOL and WP:GNG. Curbon7 (talk) 04:29, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Keep. Martin certainly fails NPOL (though not for a lack of trying!), but she does seem to pass the GNG. Newspapers.com gives me , all of which seem to be reliable and in-depth. This seems to exceed routine campaign coverage: the second source, for instance, writes two years after the gubernatorial election that Martin "embarrassed state GOP leaders with her poor showing and her campaign tactics. She drew just 22 percent of the vote, a smaller share than any previous Republican candidate for the office." And while most coverage focuses on the 1999 election, her frequent efforts to run for just about every political office in the Commonwealth of Kentucky ensure that she's not a "low-profile individual" for purposes of BLP1E. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 04:51, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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Redirect to 1999 Kentucky gubernatorial election. Do not meet WP:NPOL independently. KidAd • SPEAK 18:13, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep. based on new sources provided by Extraordinary Writ. Caphadouk (talk) 00:30, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep passes WP:GNG based on sources by Extraordinary Writ.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 01:21, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep, for the reasons of those who want to keep this article. Davidgoodheart (talk) 22:15, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was keep. Drmies (talk) 18:09, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Welsh Devolution

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Article is cobbled together from various bits and pieces of Welsh history, but they do not add up to an article about "devolution", which is a somewhat technical term--and as the very first reference makes clear, that process as such started in 1999. Treating the entire history of Wales as a prelude to this recent phenomenon is a violation of SYNTH. This article is redundant to Devolution_in_the_United_Kingdom#Wales, and the links in there. Drmies (talk) 02:36, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

I have just deleted a large section of the page which is perhaps not as relevant, like you say to the title of "Welsh Devolution". I feel that the content of the page is much more fitting of the title. Thank you for drawing my attention to this. The content of the page now fits the title well so please do not consider deleting. I have worked very hard on this. Thank you for your time.TG11TG15 (talk) 02:59, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep Quite flabbergasted by this one. Obviously this is a very notable topic that should be covered in it's own article. AFD is not clean-up nor is Welsh devolution an idea that started in 1999. John Gilbert Evans wrote two books detailing the history of Welsh devolution from 1937-1998 , . The topic has been also been covered extensively in other academic literature: . Per WP:THREE, I'll leave it at those examples so as not to waste people's time. Vladimir.copic (talk) 03:40, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep an acceptable SPINOFF from Devolution in the United Kingdom#Wales on the basis of summary style: the UK devolution page is a broader overview article, and doesn't/shouldn't cover Welsh devolution in the depth a stand-alone article can. Stumbled across this by accident as I reverted the original creator's edits to a different article. Most of the remaining C18/19th section looks relevant, as does nearly everything from 1949 onwards, and it carves out a content niche not directly covered elsewhere. Clean-up is required, but there's plenty of potential for future expansion. I don't believe it meets the threshold for WP:TNT. Jr8825 • Talk 04:30, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Keep per the previous two arguments (and also rather surprised this would be nominated). I would actually restore some of the material up to the early modern period sections that established Wales as legally part of "England" and the suppression of the Welsh language, at least as some kind of short summary of the starting position. At the moment, it seems like Wales appeared out of nowhere, or was always legally part of England.OsFish (talk) 04:47, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Speedy keep - easily notable. BilledMammal (talk) 06:34, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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I appreciate the constructive comments. Please feel free helping me out with tidying the article up or giving me any further recommendations for improvement.TG11TG15 (talk) 11:53, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
I have added prehistoric and medieval headings with brief summaries as per feedback. Any other suggestions? Thank youTG11TG15 (talk) 12:41, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
- It's clear from Special:Diff/1069182402 versus Wales#Roman era (Special:PermanentLink/842435878#Roman era) and Special:Diff/1069186134 versus Special:Diff/1050873964 (Welsh independence#21st century), to name just two, that you are copying within Misplaced Pages without attribution. Shuffling about already-written content from other people does not help to make a case that this is an original article on an as-yet-uncovered subject, and belies your claim to have "worked very hard". As someone who has written articles from scratch, I can assure you that what you are doing is a far cry from working very hard. You are passing off other people's work as your own. You've not been putting in any work at all.
  This probably explains these, which I noticed first:
  - Only capitalize proper nouns. wikt:devolution
  - Always give the page number when citing books.
  - Including the Roman Empire but missing out the Wales Act 1978, the Kilbrandon Commission, and the 1979 Welsh devolution referendum is not following the scholarship of legal/political experts on the subject, who all start by at least summarizing them.
  - Read some books:
    - Williams, David (1998). "Devolution: The Welsh perspective". In Beatson, J. (ed.). Constitutional Reform in the United Kingdom: Practice and Principles. Hart Publishing. ISBN 9781901362848.
    - Williams, David (1975). "Wales and Legislative Devolution". In Calvert, Harry (ed.). Devolution. Professional Books.
    - Foulkes, David Llewhelin; Jones, James Barry; Wilford, Rick; Foulkes, J. Barry, eds. (1983). The Welsh Veto: The Wales Act 1978 and the Referendum. University of Wales Press. ISBN 9780708308318.
    - Bogdanor, Vernon (2001). "Wales". Devolution in the United Kingdom. Oxford University Press. ISBN 9780192801289.
- Uncle G (talk) 13:32, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
  - Apologies for not citing the previous authors. I was not aware the wikipedia authors were cited. I assumed that article reference only was required. I'll avoid this in future. Thanks for pointing out. TG11TG15 (talk) 13:55, 1 February 2022 (UTC) I'll just contribute from scratch from now on. TG11TG15 (talk) 13:58, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
    - I think the first thing you need to do here is decide if "Welsh devolution" is a thing that started in 1999 or not, and adjust your sourcing accordingly. And what is "Devolution from the Romans"? Maximus just left--your source says nothing about him "devolving" anything. And that's the problem I have with the article: as far as I'm concerned, 90% of it has nothing to do with any kind of devolution--it's simply the history of Wales as an area/nation/state/whatever. User:Jr8825 says that the "larger" (UK) article needn't go into all the detail, and that may be true--but the current article doesn't do that either, it just pulls in anything. Drmies (talk) 17:22, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. ✗plicit 13:31, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Krishna Dharma

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Fails WP:NAUTHOR and WP:ANYBIO. No major awards or achievement. He has written a few translations of Indian mythology books, but none of them seem to be notable. There are a few book reviews, other sources are self published, dependent and connected with ISKCON. In previous AfD, it was claimed that his books have been translated to other languages. First those are translations of the original Indian work. Secondly those translations serve as propaganda material for ISKCON, which funds their printing. It cannot be taken as a sign of notability. Venkat TL (talk) 18:53, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

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Keep. Seems to meet the guidelines for notability: His work has been cited in academic texts ( , , , ) and journals (), and his Mahabharata, at least, seems to have been reviewed in a number of publications other than the Guardian link in the article (India Today, the Quest, etc.). Hardly seems like the stuff of "propaganda" to me. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 11:29, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
Keep He is best known as the author of popular literary adaptations of ancient Indian epics. --E.Im anoff 20:45, 21 January 2022 (UTC) — E.Imanoff (talk · contribs) is a confirmed sock puppet of Elshadiman (talk · contribs).
Says who? All translators of Indian epics are not notable. No evidence his work is popular. Venkat TL (talk) 06:23, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

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Delete. His work might have received coverage, but notability is not inherited, so that coverage does not apply to him. BilledMammal (talk) 06:36, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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Delete The "Dwyer & Cole (2007)" reference in the article is a bit misleading, as the source is "Notes on Contributors" section of the book (one of the essays in the collection is by the subject). The other mentions found above are in similarly in bibliography sections. Guardian article (Meek 1999) is on the book he wrote and doesn't focus on the subject. hemantha (brief) 18:10, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete. My BEFORE failed to find anything and Hemantha analysis below demolishes the references in the article. Seems like the subject fails NAUTHOR/GNG. Not all authors are notable, and translators are even less likely to be so. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:16, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Transportistas Unidos Mexicanos

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Fails WP:CORP. I can find no substantive third-party reliable sources regarding the firm, only LinkedIn and various directory listings. There is no corresponding article on es-wiki. Sable232 (talk) 00:55, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

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Neutral, I found . I doubt an article could be written with those sources, though. (CC) Tbhotch 20:16, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Liz 03:12, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Leimin Duong

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Fails WP:BIO. Could not find significant coverage. Establishing a beer company or being on 100 Women (BBC) doesn't confer automatic notability. LibStar (talk) 01:15, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

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Delete per WP:SIGCOV. _{دَستخَط،}اِفلاق 08:44, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
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Delete Gnews has one hit in a Dutch/Belgian newspaper and one in Vietnamese. She founded a brewery but hasn't risen above others who have done something similar it seems. Oaktree b (talk) 20:08, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Weak delete Compared to Helana Sawires I think there is not quite enough yet, and the subject does get a bit more than a passing mention in multiple languages, hence TOOSOON. There is some sourcing available showing some leaning towards BASIC but there is not enough. Aoziwe (talk) 10:54, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
Comment The coverage in The Daily Telegraph and Sydney Morning Herald passes IRS, but possibly it's not enough to meet GNG, I've certainly seen worse refs and the pages survived-- I could go either way on this one. Cabrils (talk) 21:09, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Nagarathar Sangam of North America

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The only reliable source here does not talk about the organization itself (ctrl-f sangam)/its history and is more of a person's account of one event. Per guidelines shown here, an organization is "notable if it has been the subject of significant coverage in multiple reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject". The other sources of the article are not independent of the subject and a Google search does not bring any reliable sources either (which is why the article would have original research). Also note, that the article was previously deleted here. DareshMohan (talk) 01:04, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 01:14, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU 06:58, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete: Falis WP:GNG, nothing comes up in google news. - SUN EYE 1 07:10, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 15:24, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Kent Sasse

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Questionable coverage found. Originally created by a user that has been banned for paid editing and sockpuppeting. Nominating rather than PRODing because he has been published and since I'm not familiar with the field, I'm asking other editors to see if he passes WP:ACADEMIC. BriefEdits (talk) 23:58, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. BriefEdits (talk) 23:58, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Medicine-related deletion discussions. BriefEdits (talk) 23:58, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
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Delete when a source is "local x's book does y" you are heavily dealing with the type of local inserest stories that do not show notability. We should also do all we can to avoid Misplaced Pages turning into Who's Who, which means ridding it of articles created for pay from the subject.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:09, 25 January 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 00:29, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Delete. Although the original heavily-promotional wording has been trimmed back, this still appears to have no purpose other than promotion. We have no evidence of academic, author, or general notability. —David Eppstein (talk) 01:20, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Sources fail GNG, most just link to self-published material or the the individuals book itself. Only one appears to be independent, but probably lacks notability due to just being a local paper. Epluribusunumyall (talk) 06:22, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
Delete Leaning delete, simply seems to be a long-time bariatric surgeon. I get one or two hits in GScholar that could be him, first initial matches. The paid creation/sockpupuet doesn't help with the notability. Oaktree b (talk) 20:05, 2 February 2022 (UTC)