| Revision as of 09:45, 1 January 2025 editCalistemon (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers85,518 edits add 2 new articles, remove 5 more than one month old← Previous edit | Revision as of 08:10, 3 January 2025 edit undoMitch Ames (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers187,824 edits →Excessive out-of-scope information and SYN on Esperance articles re traditional ownership: new sectionNext edit → | ||
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| For those in Perth who wish to attend in person please email me and I will share the details rather than post a private address here. ]] 10:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC) | For those in Perth who wish to attend in person please email me and I will share the details rather than post a private address here. ]] 10:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC) | ||
| == Excessive out-of-scope information and SYN on Esperance articles re traditional ownership == | |||
| Regarding my recent reverted changes to , , , , , and using Merivale as an example ... | |||
| (1) The text {{talk quote| | |||
| The traditional lands of the ] and ] people, both of the ] nation, occupy most of the Shire of Esperance, including the area around Esperance. The eastern tribes of the Wudjari, the Njunga, are seen as a separate people for cultural reasons, having adopted different cultural practices. The ], in the west of the shire, forms the boundary between the two groups }} | |||
| is interesting, but off-topic in this article (note the absence of the article's subject "Merivale" in that text), independently of sourcing or synthesis, which is why I removed it. It certainly belongs in ] (which currently has most of that information, except "Young River"), but not in every locality article. I again propose that it should be removed. | |||
| (2) The statement ({{U|Calistemon}}'s words, or mine) that | |||
| {{talk quote|... Merivale are on the traditional land of the latter .}} | |||
| or | |||
| {{talk quote|Merivale is on the traditional land of the ].}} | |||
| is ] because none of the references say that. WP:SYNTH says, with my emphasis here: | |||
| {{talk quote|If one reliable source says A and another reliable source says B, do not join A and B together to imply a {{em|conclusion C not mentioned by either of the sources}}.}} | |||
| I invite Calistemon, or anyone else, to provide a reliable source that says "Merivale is on Njunga land", or the "]". | |||
| Both (1) and (2) apply equally to ], ], ], ], which have identical wording. Both issues may also apply - to some extent - to other articles under ], but I haven't yet checked the details. | |||
| In some cases an appropriate specific source may exist. For example https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/language-region-njunga explicitly shows Myrup on Njunga land, but even then we're assuming (albeit probably reasonably) that the Noongar-named place is the same place as the English-named ]. Possibly better is https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/__media_downloads/131390/Nyungar%20Boodjera%20Wangkiny%20final%2020141.pdf (from https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/information-and-resources), which "identified official geographical names of places in the Southwest of WA derived from Nyungar language", and which includes Myrup and Neridup. ] (]) 08:10, 3 January 2025 (UTC) | |||
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Yagan Mia - meaning
Input is sought at Talk:Wireless Hill Park § Yagan Mia - meaning. Mitch Ames (talk) 09:13, 26 October 2024 (UTC)
File:Mullaloo Beach.jpg
An IP is claiming that File:Mullaloo Beach.jpg isn't actually the right location. The image is used here and on Wikidata. If incorrect it will need to be removed from usage and renamed on Commons. Commander Keane (talk) 05:40, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
- Looks like a shot from near the North Mullaloo Beach look out. Hack (talk) 07:29, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
- Clearly from there. The shape of the beach, the carpark in the distance, even the number of windows on the white flat roof house on the left match google maps exactly. The-Pope (talk) 16:03, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
Recent change
A change in the main list of caves of sunny west oz has been moved, without discussion, fellow editors understanding of the change would be appreciated. List_of_karst_features_in_Western_Australia JarrahTree 01:28, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- I made this change based on the difference in scope between the lede and the list's name. Should have left a move summary, sorry.
- Kingsmasher678 (talk) 01:47, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- Moves like that should have had a notification here, simply out of courtesy. Also the terminology and explanation in the lead paragraph is not something that is slipped between. A list of caves is in reality different from a list of the karst features, and should be kept separate. JarrahTree 05:14, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- Have you read the article in question? Genuinely asking, because I was simply retitling what was already present. I did not create a new list, the current one was mistitled and didn't match what the title said it was. If you have an issue with the content you are welcome to change it to only have caves in it, then revert the move.
- Kingsmasher678 (talk) 05:30, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- Moves like that should have had a notification here, simply out of courtesy. Also the terminology and explanation in the lead paragraph is not something that is slipped between. A list of caves is in reality different from a list of the karst features, and should be kept separate. JarrahTree 05:14, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- I have been very aware of the list since it was first created:
13:24, 3 April 2007 Hesperian talk contribs 21,661 bytes +21,661 ←Created page with 'This is a list of caves in Western Australia'. It includes all named caves that occur in the Australian Speleological Federation Karst Index Database (KID)...
I would consider that the edits since 2007 and clarification of the karst features over time have made it a problematic list, in that it was created with claimed named caves, and it has evolved into identification of karst features... JarrahTree 05:41, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- I see! I'll take a look at it in the morning, it is quite late my time.
- Kingsmasher678 (talk) 05:57, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- It appears to me that this Karst(what ever that is) list is something that should be on Wikidata, return this to a list of named caves. Gnangarra 12:28, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
User:JarrahTree
It is with a sad heart that I inform the Western Australian contributors of the sudden passing of JarrahTree. Please email me if wish to attend the funeral, otherwise we can dedicate Dec 15 meetup to reflecting on what JarrahTree has done over the last 19 years, 6 months, 1 week and 1 day. Gnangarra 07:20, 3 December 2024 (UTC)
Memorial Service for JarrahTree
Wikimedia Australia is supporting JarrahTree's family to stream his memorial service on 20th December at 10am Australian Western Standard Time(AWST) details are at https://wikimedia.org.au/Memorial_Service_for_JarrahTree . Emails to the family expressing condolences or sharing memories can sent via this link as well.
For those in Perth who wish to attend in person please email me and I will share the details rather than post a private address here. Gnangarra 10:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)
Excessive out-of-scope information and SYN on Esperance articles re traditional ownership
Regarding my recent reverted changes to Merivale, Myrup, Sinclair, Monjingup, Windabout, and using Merivale as an example ...
(1) The text
The traditional lands of the Wudjari and Njunga people, both of the Noongar nation, occupy most of the Shire of Esperance, including the area around Esperance. The eastern tribes of the Wudjari, the Njunga, are seen as a separate people for cultural reasons, having adopted different cultural practices. The Young River, in the west of the shire, forms the boundary between the two groups
is interesting, but off-topic in this article (note the absence of the article's subject "Merivale" in that text), independently of sourcing or synthesis, which is why I removed it. It certainly belongs in Shire of Esperance (which currently has most of that information, except "Young River"), but not in every locality article. I again propose that it should be removed.
(2) The statement (Calistemon's words, or mine) that
... Merivale are on the traditional land of the latter .
or
Merivale is on the traditional land of the Njunga.
is synthesis because none of the references say that. WP:SYNTH says, with my emphasis here:
If one reliable source says A and another reliable source says B, do not join A and B together to imply a conclusion C not mentioned by either of the sources.
I invite Calistemon, or anyone else, to provide a reliable source that says "Merivale is on Njunga land", or the "reliable source has published the same argument concerning the topic of the article".
Both (1) and (2) apply equally to Wittenoom Hills, Neridup, Mount Ney, Esperance (suburb), which have identical wording. Both issues may also apply - to some extent - to other articles under Category:Esperance, Western Australia, but I haven't yet checked the details.
In some cases an appropriate specific source may exist. For example https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/language-region-njunga explicitly shows Myrup on Njunga land, but even then we're assuming (albeit probably reasonably) that the Noongar-named place is the same place as the English-named Myrup, Western Australia. Possibly better is https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/__media_downloads/131390/Nyungar%20Boodjera%20Wangkiny%20final%2020141.pdf (from https://www.boodjar.sis.uwa.edu.au/information-and-resources), which "identified official geographical names of places in the Southwest of WA derived from Nyungar language", and which includes Myrup and Neridup. Mitch Ames (talk) 08:10, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
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