Misplaced Pages

User 84.154.xxx.xxx et. al.

John, I ask you to express your position on user 84.154.xxx.xxx's vandalism and continuous provocations in Safavids talkpage. Tomorrow I hope to file a formal complaint against him in Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_comment#General_user_conduct. I already filed a formal complaint against LIGerasimova there. Today I have been virtually terrorized in Misplaced Pages. Besides continuing personal attacks by LIGerasimova and user 84.154.xxx.xxx today another anon user vandalized the contents of the Azerbaijan page. This makes me think that a deliberate campaign is being waged against me in Misplaced Pages by several anon and registered users. On a different matter, today I have been dragged in yet another revert war over Nagorno-Karabakh page against my will. Whereas the discussion over the contents of Nagorno-Karabakh page is under control by third party editors Davenbelle and Cantus, whom I asked for a third party opinion, I cannot withstand alone against these anon vandalism edits and personal attacks. That's why I ask you to help me in dealing with the vandalisms in Misplaced Pages. You certainly saw that the deeds of the user 84.154.xxx.xxx clearly constituted a vandalism and insult based on editor's ethnic background and his malicious postings can also be considered as personal attack and provocation against me. Hope to hear from you on this issue.--Tabib 22:26, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I wanted to give you update about 84.154.xxx.xxx. Now he interferes with his irrelevant and provocative postings to the ongoing discussion in the Karabakh talkpage. Methods used are similar to the ones in the Safavids talkpage page. He is apparently a chauvinist and fanatic who lost in civilized discussion and now tries to take "revanche" through such base and malicious methods.--Tabib 22:39, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

French nobility

Is it common practice to capitalize French noble titles (as has been done on War of the Spanish Succession)? I was under the assumption that one would normally leave French titles in the lower case; this is certainly how it is done in the French language, and we do not seem to be translating "duc" to Duke, etc. -- Emsworth 23:05, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

It might look odd to see "Duke of Marlborough" and "duc de Vendome" in the same article, but this might be more attributable to the duke-duc distinction than to the different capitalization. -- Emsworth 00:25, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Talk:Gdansk/Vote

The voting page is now in the preparation stage at Talk:Gdansk/Vote, and introduced at Talk:Gdansk. Comments are welcome. -- Chris 73 Talk 03:49, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the move. About the announcement: Should this be done now or only when the voting starts? I would for now announce it only on Talk:Gdansk, and make a major anouncement when the voting starts. I don't want to confuse voters too much -- Chris 73 Talk 04:05, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)

Oh, yes, that makes sense. But you should start the voting soon. People tend to get confused and start voting if there's a poll up. john k 04:06, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Survey guidelines recommends Consensus must be reached about the nature of the survey before it starts. Allow about a week for this process. While I think a week is too long, a few days should be good. My personal preference is also the earlier the better. When should we start? -- Chris 73 Talk 04:10, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)

Why don't we start on Friday, or thereabouts? But perhaps sooner... I dunno. john k 04:12, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Changed date to Friday February 18 to Friday March 4 -- Chris 73 Talk 04:19, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)

reverts

It's considered extremely bad etiquette to simply revert someone else's work. Jimbo Wales compares it to a slap in the face, noting that it means "I looked through everything you did and found nothing worth keeping". AaronSw 05:01, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

In some instances, reverting is quite necessary, and I will certainly not apologize for reverting in general. And I will certainly not apologize for reverting to the pre-you-and-Kuratowski's-Ghost version of From Time Immemorial, either previously or now (although I will note that, until this time, I have never reverted your version - I reverted Kuratowski's Ghosts absurdities to the version that existed before you or he got to the article.) A version which, in the introductory sentence, introduces what would appear to be a snide comment from Noam Chomsky as though it is a serious challenge to the authorship of the book has no standing to complain of being reverted. Furthermore, you so completely rewrote the article as to make it very difficult to see what exactly the difference is. At the very least, you need to make the argument for why your version is better than the consensus version that most of the other users involved in this page - Jayjg, Zero, and myself, notably, with Zero and myself certainly having at least as low an opinion of the work as you do - have agreed on. And when you introduce egregious, unsupported POV, don't be surprised if it gets reverted. john k 05:11, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I cited Jimbo Wales, Misplaced Pages's creator. Do you have any evidence for these views? (Specifically, I refer to your claims that attempts to NPOV should be reverted if they are "snide", that additions can be reverted back to a "consensus version", and that whole edits can be reverted if they include "egregious, unsupported POV".)

1) Jimbo's word is not law (or policy, for that matter), unless he is speaking ex cathedra.

No, but it's something. You have provided no evidence.

2) It is also considered bad form to completely eliminate an old article and rewrite it, without prior consultation.

Why? Is this written down anywhere?

3) Reverting is certainly acceptable in some cases, and I think many people would agree with a broader application of it than your quote suggests. To take an extreme example, if Holocaust was modified, and the first line was changed to read "The Holocaust is an alleged murder of Jews created by the Zionist conspiracy", I think nearly everyone would feel justified in simply reverting the change without reading on to see if there were any potentially useful additions added later on. To restate in a somewhat different form what I said before, if an editor is going to completely rewrite an article without making any obvious improvements (and, having looked over your changes, I remain unconvinced that anything you changed is an obvious improvement), and making some highly obvious extremely POV statements, they should not be surprised if they are reverted. Especially since you have never said what is wrong with the consensus version of the article that you are reverting from. john k 05:42, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

On a less important note, I'm sort of curious what my version featured that was "egregious, unsupported POV". AaronSw 05:30, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

The insinuation that Joan Peters did not author the book is egregious, unsupported POV, at least in the way you put it. That it is in the first sentence makes it even more egregious. Hundreds of books have been written that claim that Shakespeare did not write Shakespeare. Our article on Shakespeare, however, contains nothing like what you have put in the Peters article, which as far as I can tell, is there simply on the strength of a single unsupported comment by Noam Chomsky. john k 05:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Did Peters not actually author the book? I never wrote that, I don't believe it, and I never tried to imply it. Some people think she wrote it, some people think she didn't. My understanding was that the article had to be neutral on the question to be NPOV, so that's what I did. If I had my way, I'd take the line out, but my personal opinions are irrelevant -- NPOV is what matters.

British Governments

Hi, you should probably know I've created a List of British Governments and put up succession boxes on the pages. Keep up with the good work in transcribing this stuff.--Pharos 01:42, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

• I've been adding the succession boxes to the top, just because most readers aren't likely to read all the way down (just taking in the Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer etc.) What do you think?--Pharos 02:14, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Sorry about the duplicate box on Liberal Government 1905-1915; I didn't see the box you had put up. In general, my concern is that most users (like me just now) will completely miss the box at the bottom of the page (it's many page-screens down, particularly with the later ones), and never get directed to the info on the other Governments. Certainly the table is the main point of the page but a high position for the box does not really imply otherwise and only makes vital information more accessible and stresses the importance of Government formation and dissolution in the parliamentary system.--Pharos 02:38, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Well, the early articles that Opera Hat made are good because they have text at the top that explains the formation of the government and has links to both the preceding and succeeding one. We should try to do that for all of them. john k 02:42, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

LaRouche

Hey John, just wanted to let you know, in case you've not been following the case, that the arbcom today closed the case against Herschelkrustofsky and he's been banned from editing LaRouche-related articles for one year, and is also on POV patrol for a year regarding any other edits he makes. Final decision here Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2. Best, SlimVirgin 06:08, Feb 17, 2005 (UTC)

Warbox

I'd be happy to see your suggestion for a warbox. I am also happy to see your arguments on the relevant talk pages. I am definetly not happy with vandalism of the PSW, the battlebox was found useful by many contributors to this article. It can be improved, but deleting it is not a good idea. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 10:57, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

However, using the battlebox as though it is a warbox is unacceptable. Why? Please point me to the Wiki policy that would support this. I find war and battle articles similar enough so that battlebox can be used in both types of article, and I find them very informative whenever they are used. I can't understand why we can sum up things in battle but not in war (note some battles lasted longer and were more complex then some wars). Your reasons are not justified, you base your actions solely on your own POVed opinion 'since you think something is unjustified and wrong'. Using your arguments one can delete anything (sections, categories, etc.). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 00:30, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

To stop that nonsense I created Template:Warbox. Both of you should be ashamed. Instead of losing your time for discussing this, simple creation of separate template by copy and paste took me less than one minute. Przepla 00:38, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Talk:Gdansk/Vote

Hi. Could you check once more Talk:Gdansk/Vote? I will start the poll in about 12 hours, unless Szopen needs more time to select a period. See Talk:Gdansk/Vote/discussion. Maybe you could also put both pages on your watchlist? I really want this to work, and end the revert wars on dozends of pages. Thanks -- Chris 73 Talk 12:52, Feb 17, 2005 (UTC)

Voting has started, I am announcing it on different pages now. -- Chris 73 Talk 00:12, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)

Yeah! It seems to be working. Voter turnout is pretty good for the first two hours. I also added a small template on related article talk pages and some invitations to vote on user talk pages. The template is Talk:Gdansk/Vote/Notice and text is on User:Chris 73/Work. It would be great if you could also add these to other article/user talk pages. BTW, i have voted on every question except #1: Period before 1308. That one i am no sure about. What is your suggestion? Well, let's keep an eye on it for two weeks, and then count the results. Best wishes, -- Chris 73 Talk 02:32, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)

Vote going well so far. I have created an article for the Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages Signpost at User:Chris 73/Signpost, so User:Michael Snow can include it in the next signpost (if he wants to, possibly with some more editing). Please have a look, and feel free to edit the page. It also mentions you as one of the organizers of the vote, hope this is OK. I also included your point about the usage of Danzig for 1466 to 1793, maybe you can enhance this a bit. Thanks -- Chris 73 Talk 02:08, Feb 19, 2005 (UTC)

Robert Carr/Leonard Robert Carr, Baron Carr of Hadley

The move has run aground - the software won't let me move the second page to the first, though the disambiguation page has been relocated. Are you able to sort this one? Timrollpickering 01:29, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

IPA Pronunciation

I thought it was there because I've heard so many people (mostly Americans, I guess) pronounce that name with a long a... Wyss 16:29, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

PRC, ROC, mainland China, Taiwan, etc.

Hello John Kenney. Thank you for joining the discussion over the titles of China-related topics articles. Would you mind help explain to the contributors who opposed renaming because they thought the new titles are confusing, that how these terms differ from each other, and how the choice of one of these terms as a title is important. Thanks in advance. — Instantnood 18:13, Feb 19 2005 (UTC)

Same here. I found it difficult to convince the guys who insist in that way, without acknowledging the fact that the meaning of two terms do not overlap. Therefore I need people like you to help and see if there is any alternative way to resolve the issue. — Instantnood 18:23, Feb 19 2005 (UTC)

Hello john k. The vote and discussion at Misplaced Pages:Requested moves#Economy of Taiwan → Economy of the Republic of China is getting messy. Do you think there's anything that we could do? — Instantnood 12:37 Feb 28 2005 (UTC)

Kemal Ataturk -> Mustafa Kemal Ataturk_Mustafa_Kemal_Ataturk">

What the hell are you doing by reverting a redirect? Topic was moved. --Cool Cat| My Talk 01:50, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Atatürk

john, while you are right with respect to the "full name", it appears more sensible to call the article Kemal Atatürk as this is the most commonly used name in Turkey. While King George VI goes by the name George, his birth name was Albert and you will surely agree that no one would go and search for King Albert George VI --StuffedTurkey 02:33, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

You are right. But still biograpy has full name. I am glad your intentions were not destructive. While I acknowlege my error, Anyone searches for Kemal Ataturk is redirected to the actual article. What do you think of the man btw? --Cool Cat| My Talk 07:23, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

As you might tell I am new to a lot of functions of wikipedia. How should I take the administrators attention for a move? --Cool Cat| My Talk 07:30, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Deletion of Classical definition

The Wikipedian community has saw fit to delete The Classical definition of republic. I found more corraborating evidence and, on the Votes for Undeletion, They are still voting to keep it deleted. I think this is highly unfair. Is there a cabal going around voting things off that they don't like? I have put external link to Wikinfo:Classical definition of republic and they delete that also. It has been deleted twice from Republic. What's going on here? Misplaced Pages is not "Free and Open-Content". There is a group controlling what gets said around here. I have been reading about "Republics" all my life. I even quote from a Modern Scholary work that used the term "Classical Republic". And they still delete. Something is not right here. WHEELER 15:04, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

PLEASE VOTE

• Misplaced Pages talk:Requested moves - help save Requested Moves, bring friends. I'd hope you vote to keep voting at RM instead of running away to cabal at distant talk pages. —ExplorerCDT 19:11, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Cardinal-Infante Ferdinand

Thanks for reworking the article. My english always comes out a bit funny if I translate it from German. -- Chris 73 Talk 03:46, Feb 23, 2005 (UTC)

Infante: No that was purely my screw-up. Glad you fixed that, too! Chris 73 Talk 03:53, Feb 23, 2005 (UTC)

in German it is also de:Kardinalinfant Ferdinand, and I made the same wrong conclusion, but did not change the page. User:Piotrus asked me if I could translate this for him. -- Chris 73 Talk 03:58, Feb 23, 2005 (UTC)

AaronSw on Norman Finkelstein

Have you seen AaronSw's contributions to Norman Finkelstein (re: From Time Immemorial)? Any thoughts on them? Jayjg 22:45, 23 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Infanta Isabella Clara Eugenia of Spain

Thanks again for the fixing. Piotrus asked me for a translation, and I did my best. But, since i am a scientist by trade and not a historian, some things like the difference between viceroy and King are hard enough for me in German, let alone in English. Anyway, Thanks! Also, it seems your edit duplicated one section 1.1 Youth and Family. Could you have a look? -- Chris 73 Talk 03:49, Feb 24, 2005 (UTC)

I agree with many of your points in the Danzig/Gdansk discussion which I have read with great interest, but I also believe Danzig should be called Danzig before 1308. You may be interested in reading a short history of Danzig here: http://www.z-g-v.de/english/aktuelles/?id=56#danziger Greetings from Munich

Dawidowicz

Thank you, John, that's very interesting. I've read her The War against the Jews and The Holocaust and the Historians. I take it the Friedländer book you mention is Nazi Germany and the Jews: The Years of Persecution, 1933-1939, which I ordered just recently so I'll be reading it soon. I'll also look out for the Browning. It's hard, as a non-specialist, to know how to judge them, so I appreciate your input. Best, SlimVirgin 06:40, Mar 1, 2005 (UTC)

RfC

Hello there. I am recently being listed on RfC. Feel free to comment as you wish to. I regard it as a way out and to have the matter settled. Thanks. — Instantnood 18:24 Mar 1 2005 (UTC)

The sharing at RfC seems to be over. I have made a response there. Please take a look. I do hope that with everyone's effort Misplaced Pages will soon be the best encyclopedia ever. :-D — Instantnood 21:25 Mar 5 2005 (UTC)

Talk:Gdansk/Vote...mopping up

Hi. The vote on Talk:Gdansk/Vote will end this Friday, March 4 0:00. Thank you very much for your support and arguments in the discussion! I think overall it worked out pretty good, although there are always things that I would have done slightly different in retrospect. Especially the Enforcement vote came across too strong, my main goal was to have reverts excepted from the 3RR and to be able to block users if they repeatedly go against community consensus. I didn't really want to have it declared as vandalism.

Anyway, i am currently preparing the text for the announcement of the results of the vote. While the vote still can change, I think most parts are pretty set. I have prepared a text at User:Chris 73/Work#In preparation for the ending of the vote. Of course, if the vote outcome changes, I will change the text accordingly. I also try to tone down the vandalism part a bit, emphasizing assume good faith, don't bite newcomers. Also, about the after 1945 comments: Personally, I think dual naming after 1945 is useful in many but not all instances, but then as a native German speaker i may be a bit biased about that. Hence i added This rule is to be followed in the case of a dispute, if there is no dispute, deviations from this rule are possible. to the notes of the vote results. Maybe we should also add Agreements for a different naming may be reached on the talk pages of individual articles anytime. or so.

Could you have a look, and maybe make some suggestions and changes? The second box This page is affected by the results of ... should go on the template Talk:Gdansk/Vote/Notice, the other text with heading below the respective votes. Also, some of the votes will be ignored due to the low edit count of the voters. Could you doublecheck these, too? Especially User:Silthor, who has about 80 edits, but only 10 after 2003. I would exclude him, but if you think otherwise we can include his vote. I am also planning on writing another article for the signpost, similar to Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages Signpost/2005-02-21/Gdansk or Danzig, to announce the vote outcome. Again, thanks a lot for your help, I really hope this vote ends at least some edit wars. -- Chris 73 Talk 03:59, Mar 2, 2005 (UTC)

The vote for 1466-1793 is close, but I think Danzig wins. When i set up the vote, i added that An absolute majority (50% or more) wins the vote, where neutral and abstain votes are excluded. About the edit count: I am not sure if there is a fixed rule somewhere. There is some discussion on Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for adminship/Archive 20#Sockpuppet voters, mentioning 100-300 edits and 3 months, but no results came out of this. (Note: The german wiki requires 200 edits for voters). A limit of 200 edits would remove more voters, but would lead to lots of discussion. About interpreting the votes: I would love to revord the Enforcement text, but that would be inappropriate. My attempt in summarizing the results is at User:Chris 73/Work#In preparation for the ending of the vote, giving it only a slight spin by adding notes to the results. Oh, and I also plan to protect the page after the vote ends, with further discussion on Talk:Gdansk/Vote/discussion if needed. -- Chris 73 Talk 04:21, Mar 2, 2005 (UTC)

Done. Closed the vote. Could you check Talk:Gdansk/Vote and Talk:Gdansk/Vote/Notice for errors? Anything that I should have done differently? I am also planning another Signpost article, draft on User:Chris 73/Signpost. Feel free to edit it. Again, thank you very much for your support! -- Chris 73 Talk 01:42, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)

Well, at least one vote was a not-logged in user, two others have edited only this page. I think it is valid to subtract the total of 12 votes. Maybe one or two votes can be argued about but overall i think it is comparable to what is used on e.g. WP:RfA. As for verification: Well, I asked you :) Do you think the counting is correct? We could also ask User:Jayjg, who listed some voters as low edit count. We could also ask User:Mirv, who did some vote-count-comments, but he seems to have sort-of left with 172. In general we could ask any of the admins that voted. However, I would wait until there are complaints. How does this sound to you? Also, do you think the rewording of vote #10 is good? Any comments are very welcome. -- Chris 73 Talk 05:57, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)

Nazi Party

A year ago, you proposed, and User:Sam Spade supported, a move of the article to the longer form of the name. I'm sorry, not to have discussed the matter then - I don't know how active I was, nor if that page was on my watchlist back then, but now I must conclude that there has been quite a few attempts by Wikipedians to stress what I perceive as fringe revisionist views by means of hinting at the alleged "Socialism" of the party.

I don't know if renaming the article would be of any help, but I think I understand that the Nazi Party is the most common name in English, and that Misplaced Pages's policy is to give that precedence.

Kind regards!

--Johan Magnus 13:43, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

...matter closed. :-)

French Revolution

You are making some pretty massive changes to at least two articles relating to the French Revolution without citing any sources. While I think that what you are writing is generally correct, there are a few statements I do not necessarily agree with. Since I have no idea where you are drawing your material from, it's hard to follow up. I'm not asking for line-by-line citation, but could you at least indicate in a general way what you are using for sources? -- Jmabel | Talk 22:53, Mar 8, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the prompt response. FWIW, you also hit Causes of the French Revolution. Again, this looks mostly right, and I mostly just wondered where it came from: your source should certainly be added to the "references" at the bottom of each article you are working on. I'll try to get a closer look some time soon and be more precise with any issues I have. -- Jmabel | Talk 23:12, Mar 8, 2005 (UTC)

Oops, sorry, I saw some similar edits on both rarely changed (but often vandalized!) articles and didn't notice that two of you were at work! -- Jmabel | Talk 23:19, Mar 8, 2005 (UTC)

Godwin's law comment at Talk:Calcutta

I think you forgot to sign. Susvolans (pigs can fly) 09:33, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Bring back quickpolls

I think it's time that quickpolls be re-evaluated as a solution to short term disputes between users. What say you? --Ryan! | Talk 05:19, Mar 11, 2005 (UTC)

Lord Denning

There is a move to rename the article on Lord Denning see:Talk:Alfred Denning, Baron Denning. Philip Baird Shearer 09:19, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Talk:Norman Finkelstein

Would you do me a favour and respond to a question on Chomsky/Finkelstein/Peters on Talk:Norman Finkelstein? Jayjg 15:25, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC)

John, if you can justify spending a few minutes on a very inconsequential question, would you mind reading the most recent posts and casting a vote for either your proposed language or mine, which is "initially rejected"? Or, if you think it makes more sense, perhaps you could endorse my proposal to put the Finkelstein excerpt from Image and Reality in the actual article, which would enable us to insert "According to Finkelstein..." after all, and presumably make everyone happy. I personally think that's the best solution. I'm also interested if you have any responses to my post about the term "journal", just for my own edification, and if you have any personal experience with Finkelstein's scholarship and would like to comment. Thanks. sneaky 01:03, Mar 15, 2005 (UTC)

"Mainland China" in titles

Hello john k. I have proposed at Misplaced Pages talk:Naming conventions (Chinese) to change the title of some articles and categories. Would you be interested to join the discussion and say something? — Instantnood 07:31, Mar 12, 2005 (UTC)

Livonian states and Holy Roman Empire

John, looks like you and I have a little disagreement about Livonian states in List of states in the Holy Roman Empire. I made some comments about it in Talk:List_of_states_in_the_Holy_Roman_Empire.

Succession after Abdication

Thank you for your reply in Talk:Succession to the British Throne. That makes good sense to me. As such it was and is no big deal at all: parliament can pass pretty much any law it decides on the matter. Thincat 11:48, 16 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Lorraine and France

Category:Dukes of Lorraine is currently under Category:French history. It seems to me that france-stub or france-bio-stub is as good of a classification as any for something pertainign to French history. (Certainly better than the generic bio-stub, which is bursting at the seams right now.) If they were really absolutely not French, then perhaps that categorization should be corrected. (I was just going on the basis of how the categories are already structured.) Perhaps a French history stub would be more appropriate? -Aranel ("Sarah") 14:24, 16 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Württemberg

Since there are no maps and the Württemberg article does not link to Oels/Olesnica (or dukes/duchy of thereof), I am just not sure if this is the right translation of 'witenberg' from Polish text. I will change it for now though, leaving Polish name in parenthesis, in case sb wants to correct it later. I just noticed that German article on Olesnica has a great history section, now I just need to find sb to translate the relevant part (17th century) :) --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 19:01, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Move for 'Count Loris-Melikov'

A move is requested for the article you had placed your comment on. Please join the voting on Talk:Michael_Tarielovich_Loris-Melikov if you're still interested. DmitryKo 17:31, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Writers

You might want to vote on Misplaced Pages:Categories_for_deletion#Category:Writers_who_have_killed_themselves. -- User:Docu

HRE compared with EU

You removed the following sentence:

Except for its Christian character, the Empire may be thought of as anticipating the European Union of today.

Only rarely do I disagree with your edits, that overall strikes me as just as competent and intelligent that I wish all additions to be. Neither do I disagree with removing this actual wording, which I feel to be a little bit weak, but I wonder if it would be possible for you to address this issue instead of removing it.

A few years ago, I was a student of political science (well, in fact I'm still, but I've hidden from my duties in that area), and my firm impression is that the concept (read: fear) of HRE's spirit re-expressing itself in the inherent weaknesses of EU's inter-governmental structure and processes is a recurrent theme both among academic lecturers and in the more qualified public debate on the European Union.

If this would be possible for you, I'm convinced the result would be much superior to the result of for instance my effort, that always is handicapped by my limited proficiency in your mother tongue.

Best regards!

/Tuomas 17:33, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Hey mister historian, telly me history

I need views of what historians think of Armenian Genocide, I want the article to be factual not propoganda based on either side. --Cool Cat 18:14, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Greco-Turkish relations

I am fine with the removal of the lock. I have few productive edits (mentioned on discussion) that I want to proceed with. --Cool Cat 18:14, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Mustafa Kemal Ataturk

I still think his full name should apear as the title. His given name was Mustafa. He was refered as Mustafa Kemal untill he was given his last name. Then He became Ataturk. --Cool Cat 18:14, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Can I ask why you edited my post?

I normaly do not like material I added to discussion removed without me beeing told in my Talk page. --Cool Cat 00:30, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I am teribly sorry I thought it was you but apperantly it was some other user. Please accept my apologies of falsely acussing you. --Cool Cat 00:50, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

What do you think of my other suggestions? --Cool Cat 07:50, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

"Mainland China" vs. "People's Republic of China"

Hello John. Would you be interested to join the discussion and the poll at Misplaced Pages talk:Naming conventions (Chinese) over the use of "mainland China"?

There are also some polls on deletion of categories at WP:CFD for #category:Laws of mainland China, #category:Companies of mainland China and #category:Cities in mainland China. — Instantnood 19:57, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Voting Warschau/Warsaw

Hi. Since you have edited on pages with disputes about the names of German/polish locations, I would invite you to vote on Warsaw/Vote to settle the multi-year dozends-of-pages dispute about the naming of Warschau/Warsaw and other locations.--Schlesier 08:41, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Unbalanced

I really didn't appreciate your personal attack on me due to my remarks about the Pope's new moniker. I believe that wikipedia is collectively the people's knowledge. In that it is a device to allow society to form amalgamated definitions of things. Therefore it is not necessary to apply the old rules of social/academic hierarchy to this new animal. The principle that I was arguing against was that very "old animal" that has dominated thought to such an extent that people like you view me as "Unbalanced." I was merely transitioning news into history using our wonderful shapeable body of knowledge that we have (thanks to it's creators, who are also worthy of the title "the great") at our fingertips. While people are very capable of citing exactly what it is that Misplaced Pages is NOT... I would like to say that wikipedia IS a new system of knowledge management that does not require the same old policies that repressed the common man's input. We don't have to wait to copy-edit word-for-word an article out of a print encyclopedia. Misplaced Pages has handed knowledge to the masses in nearly the same way that democracy has handed power to the masses. What I am saying is that we don't need fuedal overoards like you coming in and calling our actions illegitimate. We each have an equal amount of authority. And I am sure that that fact just makes your skin crawl.--Wraybm1 21:32, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

User:Schlesier

I am very unhappy with the activities of User:Schlesier, but I find it extremely hard to believe this person is actually German, who is even referring to Litzmannstadt as the "original" name of Lodz. I suspect this is a Polish provocateur who wants to discredit Germans and the Danzig/Gdansk vote specifically. I would suggest the ridiculous Warsaw vote is deleted.

Please come and vote!

Following the long discussion at Misplaced Pages talk:Naming conventions (Chinese) regarding proper titling of ROC-/Taiwan-related topics, polls for each single case has now been started here. Please come and join the discussion, and cast your vote. Thanks. — Instantnood 06:17, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks John. — Instantnood 08:22, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)

The new Duchess of Cornwall

I wonder if we might have your views at Talk:Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall. There appears to be a user, User:Jguk, who insists that it is inappropriate to refer to her as "Princess of Wales." Comments would be appreciated. -- Emsworth 12:28, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

"China"/"PRC" vs. "mainland China" for page titles

Following the long discussion at Misplaced Pages talk:Naming conventions (Chinese) regarding proper titling of Mainland China-related topics, polls for each single case has now been started here. Please come and join the discussion, and cast your vote. Thank you. — Instantnood 12:57, Apr 9, 2005 (UTC)

Hi. I'd really appreciate your comments on Lodz Ghetto. I've been working on it for two days, and want to find ways to improve it. Thanks. Danny 18:52, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Generic information about popes

I think my reversion was more due to the fact that titles such as "Pope" and "Bishop of Rome" had been removed in addition to some of the more obscure ones. After a bit of thought, I think I'm going to reword the introduction a bit to put the more common titles first, and move the formal title stuff to Pope. Once a new Pope is elected, I agree that it makes sense to copy the title stuff to their page. 64.7.131.61 23:09, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) Oops, that was me. Forgot to sign in. JYolkowski 23:11, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Greco-Turkish relations

I do not see why it is still locked. It is not wiki to not allow users to contribute. I do not see a reason for it to stay locked as discussion is dead. My recomended edits are clearly visible. --Cool Cat 08:02, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I need your help

Hello John. A request for arbitration has been filed against me at WP:RFAr by Snowspinner as the AMA advocate for jguk. What do you think I can do? — Instantnood 20:45, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

It is a policy dispute, on the conflict between political NPOV and common names, and on the enforcement of the NPOV section of the naming conventions for Chinese-related topics. If you have any comment or opinion feel free to contact me at my talk page, or advocates who are helping me with the arbitration, Wally and Wgfinley. Thanks. :-D — Instantnood 21:55, Apr 12, 2005 (UTC)

Hungary politics stubs

Thanks for your contributions -- could you add {{politics-stub}} and {{bio-stub}} to them? Thanks! --Zantastik 07:55, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The way you're tagging them is better. Thanks! --Zantastik 16:33, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Head of State (reply)

I was and am fully aware you were fully aware that a provisional president is not the same thing as a king, I didn't ever suppose the opposite. :-) I'm also fully aware that it would be useful if the navigation were made easier, I completely agree with you on this. But in my opinion it would be confusing and disturbing to mention a person in a box explicitly reserved for something else. I suggest we should look for another solution to enable continuous navigation. (Maybe through a more general term, or a separate link under the box?) Adam78 02:21, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

OK, maybe it depends on the formatting as well, how obvious the difference is made. I'm afraid it's a wider problem about succession boxes. However, until we find anything better, do it as you wish, I won't object, as long as the difference is at least as obvious and yet discreet as it is now on the page Karl I of Austria, and if it is done in the same format. Thanks for your job. Adam78 02:45, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Peerage titles

Sorry, was looking for a consistent way to link to the source of the peerage title, and saw a link in another title. Will figure something else out. Willhsmit 05:18, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The article Hamilton does state that it's a clan, so if you know a little about the subject it might need a fix. Willhsmit 05:18, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Duchess of Cornwall

It seems that a change has once again been made to the article "Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall." Do you think it wise to have a vote on the issue? I see no other way of resolving the disagreement. -- Emsworth 22:11, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

We could use something like this: Should the lead sentence include a reference to Camilla as "Princess Charles, Princess of Wales"? This is short, and involves the simple choices of Yes and No. Perhaps there might be an explanatory note stating that "Duchess of Cornwall" would be used in the majority of the article. -- Emsworth 22:56, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I have set up the poll; perhaps you would consider voting. -- Emsworth 19:55, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Don't know whether this is still on, but IMO "Princess of Wales" should be out of the question, since it's simply not a title given to Camilla, though her now-husband is Prince of Wales. He is also Duke of Cornwall and Camilla, as his wife, took the title Duchess of Cornwall. Princes Charles might be ok. though, I don't know. Str1977

What Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Rankings project is not

• This is not suggesting a hierarcal system.
• It will be used only by users who want to use it.
• Only ranking will be assigend to users who want to use it.
• The idea ment to make it like barn stars, but based on regular contribution.
• It is currently a prototype, likely that it is nothing like the final version.

I urge you to reconsider your vote based on this clarification. Thanks --Cool Cat 08:46, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Titles again

Why are the articles about three successive queens consorts titled Queen Alexandra, Mary of Teck and Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon? Our policy on this is not only absurd, it is also inconsistent. I agree that Queen Mary would be a problem, since there have been other Queen Marys, but she could be disambiguated as Queen Mary (Queen consort) or something like that. I persist in my view that the QM should be called Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother, since that is what she was called for most of her life. But if we have this policy at least let's apply it consistently by moving Alexandra to Alexandra of Denmark. Adam 07:53, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Image:Rzeczpospolita 1920.png

It's mostly about size, you know... I gave the big circles for all the capitals and all the big cities. Cities like Łódź or Warsaw had several hundred thousand inhabitants in 1920's and 1930's (Warsaw reached 1M in 1924), while Kaunas had less than 100.000. Finally, it was not a capital and after the recent problems with some Lithuanian nationalist I decided not to suggest that Kaunas was the Lithuanian capital in any way. Being called a nazi and a Slavic monkey that should be sent to a gas chamber is more than enough to make me think that Lithuania is not the most important part of the world on my map. Especially that it's a map created basically for the P-BW. Halibutt 03:43, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

All the other towns with big dots were big, while Kaunas was small. Stettin had roughly 300.000 inhabitants, Łódź 500.000, Warsaw roughly a million, Kraków ca. 250.000, Lwów had 300.000, Bratislava had some 200.000, Breslau - more than 600.000, Koenigsberg - 300.000, Tallinn - roughly 200.000, Vienna had almost 2 millions, Pskov - almost 200.000, Moscow - almost 3 millions and so on. Kaunas was nowhere near that big.

Perhaps it was the capital, and perhaps it was only a temporary capital, I don't really want to get into it. Sorry, but disputing the status of Wilno and Kaunas as well as history of Lithuania and all those tiny differences in wording is simply not worth my time. I sticked to the criterion of size and I must say that I'm quite happy with it. Halibutt 13:01, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

Conventional ancient Egyptian chronology

I've responded to your post on the talk. I don't know if you've read it, so I'm just letting you know its there. -JCarriker 07:31, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

"Old Encylopedia"

You ask me about articles I created (on popes particularly) taken from an old encyclopedia. Your surmise is correct: It was the Britannica, 9th edition. Malcolm Farmer 18:17, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Centre Party

I see your tag on the centre party page and wonder if you would care to inspect the Pius XII page which needs a revert , badly .I see you study such a subject ,is why I ask ! I guess Im at my talk page ....Flamekeeper 17:40, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Dear John, in regard to the Centre party entry structure, I have done what I can do at the moment, taking over many things from the German wiki. Hope you like it. Str1977 23:18, 18 May 2005 (UTC)

Ancient Near Eastern chronology

Hi John -- synchonizing the dates between Egypt, Mesopotamia, Anatolia & elsewhere has been a hope of mine. (I'm taking a break from it at the moment: I got overwhelmed with trying to understand all of the research I had accumulated, so I'm relaxing by overwhelming myself by researching another topic. ;-)

However, there are a number of challenges to making this so. One is that Misplaced Pages needs some kind of discussion of how the current chronology for these nations was determined; this helps more serious contributors to WP deal with the perennial problem of kooks, fringe theories, & original research. Another is that even the experts often differ amongst themselves over exact dates, even when using the same arguments (e.g. two Low Chronology proponents may each offer dates for an event that differs by 5 years)! And lastly, to offer such a framework in an NPOV manner requires research in order to say that "Professor X dates the beginning of King ---'s reign to A, while Professor Y dates it to B." (I was very fortunate in finding a list already compiled for the kingdoms of Judah & Israel.)

And I proposed at one point that when discussing the history of the Pharaohs in an article, we should adopt the practice of stating, say, "in the 5th regnal year", rather than "in 1320 BC", seeing how the experts themselves don't always agree which exact year in the contemporary era the Pharaoh's regnal years equate to.

Something of a start has already been made in the article Chronology of the Ancient Near East, where a number of synchronisms have been set forth. But I feel we need to build a broad consensus first over which dates we should standardize on. My list was offered as a first step towards this, but I don't feel I was able to stir up any interest in this topic. -- llywrch 16:31, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Normally, I'd be happy to help, but I'm trying to focus on getting some articles written on Ethiopian history. I have about 40 queued up in various states of completion I hope to post within the next few days -- & berate me if they don't appear, because it will be only because WP distracted me again! But a couple of editors I have worked with in the past (besides the names on the WikiProject:Ancient Egypt) who have shown an interest in this topic & should be recruited for this are Dbachmann & Wetman. And I'm probably forgetting a couple of folks who might be equally interested. -- llywrch 03:27, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Pietro di Candia

You write: "What the fuck do you think you're doing?" I'm not entirely sure what your question is here, although your manner of going about asking it is so obviously inappropriate that it hardly needs to be commented on. I moved that article to a better title. - Nat Krause 03:36, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The idea you seem to have that other Misplaced Pages editors deserve to be verbally abused by you ought to be offensive to anyone who is interested in having a modicum of civility in this project. Since you are interested in Misplaced Pages policy, you make want to take a look at Misplaced Pages:Profanity and Misplaced Pages:Wikiquette. Can you please point me to which naming conventions you are looking at that say Pietro di Candia is simply wrong as an article title? - Nat Krause 03:51, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Incidentally, I'm not hiding behind wikiquette: I'm quite happy to discuss the merits of the move and it's entirely possible that I was mistaken. I'm taking the substantial portion of this discussion to the relevant article talk. - Nat Krause 13:04, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Pope Benedict XVI

It seems that people are needed to defend the His Holiness style on Pope Benedict XVI. There is a campaign right now from a handful of people to unilaterally remove it. FearÉIREANN 23:15, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)