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| * '''Overturn''' deletion. (''Copied and pasted from previous DRV'') There was no consensus to delete. In addition, several of the supposedly stronger arguements don't make any sense to me. For example, how is the fact that not all 8000 mathematicians with a particular Erdos number (or range of numbers) are not notable enough to have a wikipedia entry even relavant to the discussion, much less a reason to delete? We don't delete categories about people who were born in year 1957 just because not everybody born in 1957 is notable enough to have a wikipedia article. As for accuracy, this has not been demonstrated to be a problem. Misplaced Pages has policies reguarding truth vs verifiability using reliable sources. As for Erdos numbers not reflecting ones skill as a mathematician and similar comments, unless a person's Erdos number is 0, this is a strawman. Erdos numbers have never been presented as such, although no doubt many mathematicians with Erdos number 1 are extremely and uncommonly good mathematicians. But this is not what they measure. | * '''Overturn''' deletion. (''Copied and pasted from previous DRV'') There was no consensus to delete. In addition, several of the supposedly stronger arguements don't make any sense to me. For example, how is the fact that not all 8000 mathematicians with a particular Erdos number (or range of numbers) are not notable enough to have a wikipedia entry even relavant to the discussion, much less a reason to delete? We don't delete categories about people who were born in year 1957 just because not everybody born in 1957 is notable enough to have a wikipedia article. As for accuracy, this has not been demonstrated to be a problem. Misplaced Pages has policies reguarding truth vs verifiability using reliable sources. As for Erdos numbers not reflecting ones skill as a mathematician and similar comments, unless a person's Erdos number is 0, this is a strawman. Erdos numbers have never been presented as such, although no doubt many mathematicians with Erdos number 1 are extremely and uncommonly good mathematicians. But this is not what they measure. | ||
| : As a mathematician, I like being able to see somebody's Erdos number at a glance when I come across a math biography. It makes wikipedia a more useful and valuable online encyclopedia for me. (Yes, I could go over to MR and type in the guys name, but I generally wouldn't bother to do so as a wikipedia reader, unless it was to add the information as an editor.) It is a significant part of mathematical culture and folklore, and a part of mathematical culture which has been popularized to a great extent in the general public, also. People are interested in the individual Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians, even if this is not the most important and significant peice of information contained in a biographical article. And the list of those interested does not only include other mathematicians. (As a side note, in my opinion, large Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians is just as interesting as small numbers. If the subject of a math bio has an Erdos number of 14, this is something that I would be fascinated to stumble across in an article, and after stumbling across this little peice of information, I would definitely be inclined to go over to MR and start tracing the collaboration paths, at least late on a friday afternoon. I would also click on the category to see who else has a bio here who has such a large finite Erdos number.) | : As a mathematician, I like being able to see somebody's Erdos number at a glance when I come across a math biography. It makes wikipedia a more useful and valuable online encyclopedia for me. (Yes, I could go over to MR and type in the guys name, but I generally wouldn't bother to do so as a wikipedia reader, unless it was to add the information as an editor.) It is a significant part of mathematical culture and folklore, and a part of mathematical culture which has been popularized to a great extent in the general public, also. People are interested in the individual Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians, even if this is not the most important and significant peice of information contained in a biographical article. And the list of those interested does not only include other mathematicians. (As a side note, in my opinion, large Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians is just as interesting as small numbers. If the subject of a math bio has an Erdos number of 14, this is something that I would be fascinated to stumble across in an article, and after stumbling across this little peice of information, I would definitely be inclined to go over to MR and start tracing the collaboration paths, at least late on a friday afternoon. I would also click on the category to see who else has a bio here who has such a large finite Erdos number.) --] 13:07, 10 November 2007 (UTC) | ||
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Revision as of 13:07, 10 November 2007
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10 November 2007
Vangteh
- Vangteh (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore|cache|AfD)
- It was deleted "hoax?, no sources", but User:Khumpita has listed claimed references in User talk:Anthony Appleyard#Vangteh. In summary, Vangteh seems to be claimed to be a small (WP:NN?) petty kingdom that existed in Burma before British times. The odd style is likely because his first language is not English but Burmese. Anthony Appleyard 09:42, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
Category:Erdős numbers
- This is a relisting of the 7 November DRV, per its closure.
- The original DRV nominator provided this link as an explanation.
- The closer further explained his closure at Misplaced Pages talk:Categories for discussion/Log/2007 October 28.
- I'd like to add to that to suggest that while I agree with User:Kbdank71's closure rationale for the discussion as it stands as a single discussion (and accepting that consensus can change), if I were to take into account the previous discussions, and a few of the comments at the recent DRV (including my own), I think that a case could be made to restore the 1, 2, and at most 3 of the numbered categories. Anything larger than 3 isn't supported by the "keep" arguments, as far as I could see. So I'd like to request that, since this is a "group nomination", if you feel that the closure should be even partially overturned, please specify exactly which categories you would like to see restored.
- And since the canvassing of the previous discussion(s) has been seen as an issue, I would also ask that no canvassing be done during this discussion. I'll leave a notice at the original closer's talk page, and at the talk page of WikiProject Mathematics. That should be more than enough. - jc37 09:16, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Weak endorse closure, for the reasons above. If closure is overturned, only supporting the restoration of Erdős numbers 1 and 2. I think even 3 is probably stretching it. - jc37 09:16, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Overturn deletion. (Copied and pasted from previous DRV) There was no consensus to delete. In addition, several of the supposedly stronger arguements don't make any sense to me. For example, how is the fact that not all 8000 mathematicians with a particular Erdos number (or range of numbers) are not notable enough to have a wikipedia entry even relavant to the discussion, much less a reason to delete? We don't delete categories about people who were born in year 1957 just because not everybody born in 1957 is notable enough to have a wikipedia article. As for accuracy, this has not been demonstrated to be a problem. Misplaced Pages has policies reguarding truth vs verifiability using reliable sources. As for Erdos numbers not reflecting ones skill as a mathematician and similar comments, unless a person's Erdos number is 0, this is a strawman. Erdos numbers have never been presented as such, although no doubt many mathematicians with Erdos number 1 are extremely and uncommonly good mathematicians. But this is not what they measure.
- As a mathematician, I like being able to see somebody's Erdos number at a glance when I come across a math biography. It makes wikipedia a more useful and valuable online encyclopedia for me. (Yes, I could go over to MR and type in the guys name, but I generally wouldn't bother to do so as a wikipedia reader, unless it was to add the information as an editor.) It is a significant part of mathematical culture and folklore, and a part of mathematical culture which has been popularized to a great extent in the general public, also. People are interested in the individual Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians, even if this is not the most important and significant peice of information contained in a biographical article. And the list of those interested does not only include other mathematicians. (As a side note, in my opinion, large Erdos numbers of individual mathematicians is just as interesting as small numbers. If the subject of a math bio has an Erdos number of 14, this is something that I would be fascinated to stumble across in an article, and after stumbling across this little peice of information, I would definitely be inclined to go over to MR and start tracing the collaboration paths, at least late on a friday afternoon. I would also click on the category to see who else has a bio here who has such a large finite Erdos number.) --Ramsey2006 13:07, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
JAMAA
This is a notable service club that is present at many schools across the United States. That fact alone is sufficient enough to credit JAMAA as a notable club and surely worthy of an article at Misplaced Pages. Again, I believe that this deletion is a personal attack on me by a certain administrator. Please review at your earliest convenience. Thank you. Rhythmnation2004 04:02, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Comment Here are some references for JAMAA:
- Rhythmnation2004 04:12, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- The 1st source proves it exists at one school (it just lists it). The second proves a girl was once in it in another school. The 3rd proves that the same school as the first one exists (in a list of other activities). The fourth proves it exists at another school in a list of other activities (plus Misplaced Pages can't be used as a reliable source). None of this proves notability. It proves existence, not notability. Metros 04:20, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Comment from deleting admin Nothing in the article proves notability to me, that's why it was speedied as a non-notable organization. The closest to establishing notability is the line: "It appears in several schools throughout the United States" which is far from concrete notability. Metros 04:20, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Response to deleting admin Metros, I am a little confused by your interpretation of what qualifies as "notable". A club that exists at many schools is surely notable, as there would be users who would search for JAMAA and contribute to the article. The entire goal of the Misplaced Pages project is to create a 💕 that users can come to to get information about any subject imaginable. Since JAMAA is a reputable organization, there will surely be curious minds who want to know exactly what it is. Therefore, an article not only contributes but is essential to the project. In this case, existance indeed establishes the notability of the club. Rhythmnation2004 04:23, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Comment I apologize for the fourth reference. The official source can be found at the website for that school. Rhythmnation2004 04:25, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Where is the proof it is notable? Just because it exists does not mean it's notable. Take a look at Misplaced Pages:Notability (organizations and companies). Metros 04:27, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
It is notable in that according to the page you referenced above, "Organizations are usually notable if the scope of activities are national or international in scale and information can be verified by sources that are reliable and independent of the organization." The activities are indeed national in scale, as I have given evidence of three schools, all in different areas of the United States, that have this club. I also provided sources that are independent of the organization. Rhythmnation2004 04:32, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Respectful request for third-party intervention. I believe that this is an unfair conflict, as we are both aware that because of former biases which you hold against me, you have no intention on restoring this page, regardless of how many sources I provide. Therefore, I hereby respectfully request that an administrator other than Metros, or any administrator with whom he is affiliated, give their input in this issue. Rhythmnation2004 04:52, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Endorse speedy deletion. "Appears in several schools throughout the United States" is not an assertion of notability. Sandstein 09:25, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Response. Well then can someone please tell me exactly what classified as "notable"? Because according to the direct quotation from Misplaced Pages:Notability (organizations and companies), this article indeed qualifies. What additional proof does this article need to prove that this is a notable organization? Rhythmnation2004 12:24, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Note: WikiProject Organizations has been informed of this ongoing Deletion Review. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 12:36, 10 November 2007 (UTC)