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Pervane

Cahen also writes of the origin of the title pervāne, suggesting that it is related to a functionary in Mongol Iran called pervāneji. The original role of the pervāne among the Seljuqs of Rūm was to carry personal messages and distribute favors (p. 221-222). I know that pervane means “propeller” or “flywheel” in Turkish. I have always seen the title translated as “butterfly.” Aramgar 14:04, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

See for translations of pervane.

Pervane (Today!!! if we dont use mechanically, let say for a people;) means a small moth/butterfly -especially a specific one which goes around light at night. Propeller was not invented at that time. Regards.Must. 14:49, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Names for the Sultans of Rum

Hi for the those names they do not use Turkish characters so it is a content dispute and does not violate name changing characters so it needs to be the most common name or accurate. --Karent82 03:49, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Kaykhusraw or Keyhüsrev

For several months now, there has been some debate as to which spelling of the sultan’s name is the most appropriate title for the articles Kaykhusraw I, Kaykhusraw II, and Kaykhusraw III in English Misplaced Pages. The spelling current in English language academic literature is “Kaykhusraw.” Some Misplaced Pages editors prefer the Turkish spelling “Keyhüsrev,” which is understandable given the sultan’s role in Anatolian history and Turkish civilization. Still, “Kaykhusraw” is the form most familiar to readers of English, and Misplaced Pages Naming Conventions suggest that we use this form. Below is a list of credible English language sources. All use the spelling “Kaykhusraw.” The first two books in the list are the essential English language references for the history of the Seljuks of Rum.

• ”Kaykhusraw” Speros Vryonis, The Decline of Medieval Hellenism in Asia Minor and the Process of Islamization from the Eleventh through the Fifteenth Century (University of California Press, 1971), p. 134.
• ”Kaykhusraw” Claude Cahen, Pre-Ottoman Turkey: A General Survey of the Material and Spiritual Culture and History, c. 1071-1330 (Taplinger Publishing, 1968), p. 111.
• ”Kaykhusraw” Stephen Album, Checklist of Islamic Coins, 2nd edition (1998), p. 62.
• ”Kaykhusraw” The Glory of Byzantium: Art and Culture of the Middle Byzantine Era, A.D. 843-1261, edited by Helen C. Evans and William D Wixom (New York: Metropolitan Museum of Art, 1997), p. 416.
• ”Kaykhusraw” Jonathan Phillips, The Fourth Crusade (Viking, 2004), p. 191.
• “Kay-khusraw” The Oxford Dictionary of Byzantium (Oxford University Press, 1991), vol. 2, p. 1117.

The titles of the articles must remain Kaykhusraw I, Kaykhusraw II, and Kaykhusraw III. Aramgar 03:24, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

The meaning of cimri

RE: Jimri: Both of my sources state that Cimri means “the Leper.” While not denying that cimri in contemporary Turkish means “miser,” it is possible that the word has undergone considerable semantic change since the 13th century. One unpleasant quality over time has come to signify another. I would like to keep the translation "leper." Aramgar 17:33, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

About edits for Alaeddin Mosque (Konya, Turkey)

Hi Aramgar: I meant to write explanations of my edits but forgot and wasn't sure it was worth littering up the talk page. Most of the edits relate to spelling, grammar and style. I removed information about the discovery of carpets and about touching mummified corpses because it seemed irrelevant to the mosque's history. Kafka Liz 19:23, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

2007 Peruvian meteorite event

Wow, i don't know whether you made an error or if there's a bug in the system , but it seems that you just posted on the wrong talk page: Talk:2007 Peruvian meteorite event#Evil Plot against Alaeddin Keykubad
--Jerome Potts 05:30, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Check the history. User didn't post it. User originally posted the comment to User talk:Cretanforever , and the comment was subsequently removed by User:Cretanforever , but strangely enough pasted to Talk:2007 Peruvian meteorite event by Cretanforever here. —Viriditas | Talk 13:05, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Page moves

I've left a reply to your comment on my talk page. Sorry again for not getting back to you sooner. Dekimasuよ! 06:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Chormaqan's date of death

I don't know why you kept this statement in the article on Kaykhusraw II, "Baiju and Muhadhdhab traveled to the Mughan steppe in Azerbaijan so the vizier could put his case to the elderly Chormaqan, then ruling the Mongol Empire."

That is entirely inaccurate. Chormaqan does not rule the Mongol empire (Ögedei Khan does at this time) and he has been dead for about two years and that's why Baiju is commanding the Mongol units around that area. Timothy May has extensively done researched on Chormaqan and he gives the date of his death in 1241. Just check his article that he wrote, http://www.historynet.com/mh/blchormaquan/ Lrguy 09:16, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Alanya Castle

Parti Pehlivan ! I intend to extend Alanya Castle considerably in a few days and in the article, I would like to use the spelling for the sultan to Alaeddin Keykubad I. İtirazın yoqsa tabi (if you see no inconvenient, that is...). Cretanforever 11:57, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Do what you like at Alanya Castle. I would prefer to see 'Ala al-Din Kayqubad, but do what you want. I have seen other disagreements of this type handled in a similar way. If it's okay with you, I will move this section to my talk page. Aramgar 20:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

40 Martyrs of Sabaste

Hello Aramgar, I linked "God: Sole Satisfier" with the Martyrs because theologically these martyrs reveal the fact, by their lives, that God is the only one to fulfill life's meaning. These martyrs are a witness to the Christian experience of God as Sole Satisfier. Yours Jc3schmi (talk) 16:00, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Lloyd-Jones

I would say nominate it for speedy deletion as it seems like a cut and dry case, but unfortuantely redirects are not speedy deletion eligible unless they're clearly typos. You'll need to open a redirects for deletion discussion for it. Put the {{rfd}} tag on the top of the redirect page (above #REDIRECT) and then add {{subst:rfd2|redirect=RedirectName|target=TargetArticle|text=Reason the redirect should be deleted}} ~~~~ under today's date heading on this page, replacing TargetArticle and Reason as appropriate. Hope this helps, WP:RFD also has information on the process. Mr Senseless (talk) 05:00, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Sorry for butting in, but wouldn't it just be easier to redirect Lloyd-Jones to the new stub? --Elonka 05:47, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Ah, found another solution. I took the liberty to redirect Lloyd-Jones to the disambiguation page at Lloyd Jones, where I also added several other "Lloyd-Jones" candidates. If you know of any others, please feel free to add them.  :) --Elonka 05:59, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Thanks to both of you for the help. Aramgar (talk) 13:08, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Not a problem Mr Senseless (talk) 15:05, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Rûm

Feel free to re-add your material. I actually found a few books that back up the roman stuff after I deleted it from the page. I just haven't found the time to re-add the material myself. The reason I am so interested in Rum is because Chinese Song Dynasty records mention a series of foreign envoys that visited China once in 1081 and twice in 1091. The 1081 records mention a king with the title of Caesar and the 1091 records mention that the envoy returned to "rum". A Chinese scholar speculates that the the contact between Byzantium and China was in an attempt to enlist aid against the turks. Other historians believe it was the turks themselves that visited China. (I am a huge fan of Crusader and Chinese history by the way.) You can read more about this in the Crusades article here. The info begins on the third paragraph down. Sorry if I caused you any trouble. --Ghostexorcist (talk) 14:29, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Couldn't resist

Kafka Liz (talk) has given you a kitten! Kittens promote Wikilove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Share the WikiLove and civility with everyone and keep up the excellent editing! Send kittens to others by adding {{subst:Joy message}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Ok, so there are cuter kittens out there... Kafka Liz (talk) 19:56, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

Franco-Mongol alliance

Hi, and welcome to discussions at Franco-Mongol alliance! I very much look forward to having someone else in the discussion who is actually familiar with the related history.  :) If you have a moment, could you please review the Talk:Franco-Mongol alliance#Introduction sentence thread and offer your opinion? It's something we've been working hard on, to ensure consensus. It appears that your most recent comment on the page agrees with the previous consensus in the Intro Sentence section, but I'd like to confirm that I have your meaning right. Thanks, Elonka 22:35, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Other thises and thatses

• I thought I'd mention to you that if you want, you're welcome to blank or archive your own talkpage. So if you'd like to get that old block stuff removed, you are free to do it at any time.

• Also, if Kafka Liz would like to participate in any of the same discussions about Mongol-related things or other topics, she too is welcome to offer her opinion. If she does though, in order to head off any concerns, it would be best if, if there is any question of controversy, that she (or you) clearly states somewhere in the discussion that you know each other offline, but that you are participating as individuals, and not as a "voting block". I would also be extremely cautious in any situations that look like votes or polls. However, as long as you're clear on disclosure, it's probably fine for both of you to participate.

If you have any questions, let me know! :) --Elonka 01:07, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

Talk archives

Hiya, I took the liberty of tweaking your talkarchive link a bit, to make it a bit more standard. If you don't like it, feel free to change it back, but this way it'll probably be a bit easier to maintain if/when you have more archives in the future.  :) Let me know if you have any questions, Elonka 23:23, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

Ghazan coin

Thank you for the great info! This is one of my coins, and it is indeed beautiful. Would you be able to confirm the exact legend? Is it: ﻢﻠﺳﻭ ﻪﻴﻠﻋ ﻰﻠﺻ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻝﻮﺳﺭ ﺪﻤﺤﻣ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻻﺍﻪﻟﺍﻻ/ ﺰﻳﺮﺒﺗ ﺏﺮﺿ/ ... ﻊﺒﺳ ﺔﻨﺳ ﻰﻓ Lailahe illallah Muhammed resulullah salli aleyhe. Duribe Bāzār fi sene 701
If so, would you have the capability to fill-in the arabic as well? Best regards. PHG (talk) 05:42, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Typing in Arabic is a rather cumbersome process on the computers I use. For the sake of time please allow me to use Latin script. Obverse field: Allāh / lā ilāh illā / (darb bāzār) / Muhammud / rasūl Allāh. Obverse margin within the frame: sallā (3:00) / Allāh (12:00) / ‘alayhi (9:00). Obverse margin outside the frame: sana (4:00), ahad (1:00), sab’am… (11:00-8:00).

The kalima of the field is standard on most Islamic coins. The mint is written in small letters above the big Muhammad. sallā Allāh ‘alayhi means “God bless him”; the Allāh is used twice, once in the kalima and once in this phrase. The date is annoyingly abbreviated.

The Arabic on the reverse is limited to the large Ghāzān Mahmūd of the third line down, the tiny Allāh between Phagspa characters I mentioned yesterday, and the date, I think, written again on the right side. The rest is Uighur.

Your coin is a variation of GA-281 in Ömer Diler’s Ilkhans: coinage of the Persian Mongols and #2172 in Stephen Album’s Checklist of Islamic Coins. Hope this helps. I enjoyed identifying it. Regards, Aramgar (talk) 15:06, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Nawruz

Nawruz has his own article here: Nawrūz. I created it 6 weeks ago in my attempt to have more info on Mongol generals/emirs, of which Mulay is a part. Regards, PHG (talk) 09:59, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Inscription in Sinop Picture

Hi. I noticed that you had made a request for assistance in uploading a picture of the inscription at Sinop at the Kaykaus I talk page. I think the page could use the picture. Do you still need help. If so, I'd love to help you upload the picture to wikipedia. Since you have taken the picture yourself, there shouldn't be any problem with it. If there is any help you need, you can always leave me a message at my talk Page. Cheers. Sniperz11 12:09, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Good for you then mate. Take care. Really looking forward to that pic. If theres any help you need, dont hesitate to drop me a line. I'll try and help out any way i can. Good luck editing wikipedia. Sniperz11 19:49, 19 January 2008 (UTC

At this point, I am not convinced that this is such a good picture. I took it originally with the aim of working through both the Greek and the Arabic, not as an illustration for Misplaced Pages. Aramgar (talk) 20:18, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Its an excellent picture mate... dont worry about it. I think its an excellent addition to Misplaced Pages. Sniperz11 21:13, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Crusades resources

Thanks for the offer, it's very much appreciated. Right now, I just need the books. When I took a class on the Crusades in college, we used Runciman, and that was about it, so I really don't have many books on the time frame. I have a few that are on the early Crusades, the First and Second and Third ones. And that's about it. So I'm looking for new current stuff on the Crusades. I've managed to mostly catch myself up on the Anglo-Norman stuff, finally. So now I guess since I got dragged into the whole Franco-Mongol mess, I'd better start adding to my Crusades library. Ealdgyth | Talk 03:25, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

Franco-Mongol alliance

Hi Aramgar, could you kindly stop reverting the Franco-Mongol alliance article to a version which has no user consensus (Talk:Franco-Mongol alliance#False claim of consensus)? Thank you. PHG (talk) 05:31, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

PHG, Aramgar is acting properly, in accordance with talkpage consensus. Something that I wish you would start doing. You've gotten warnings from multiple uninvolved admins now, maybe it's time you started listening to them? --Elonka 08:24, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

Anadolu Selçukluları

thank you, i edited the page according to your way. i didnt know you are in a discussion with someone in article. i edited because many people(especially turkish users) may redirected to "great seljuk empire page" according to incomplete entance. so, i dont edit the main entrance. respects.--Orkh (talk) 23:23, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

i dont know how to redirect, by the way you changed the entrance again. you know this shape is not healty for turkish users.--Orkh (talk) 23:47, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

no, i dont know more names, thanks arkadaşım--Orkh (talk) 11:56, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Hi Aramgar

Hi Aramgar. You know as well as I do that Elonka has no consensus to delete the 120k of content and 300 academic references that have been accumulated over a period of 6 months. I am upholding Misplaced Pages's rule that, in the absence of a consensus, the status quo should prevail. I will gladly cooperate, as always, with other users, as long as Misplaced Pages rules are respected and important content is not just deleted away and abusively replaced. I have no intention to give way to Elonka and a few of her friends who are blatantly flaunting normal editing rules. Respect existing content, discuss it, and we can move forward from that. Regards. PHG (talk) 13:57, 6 February 2008 (UTC)