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Revision as of 20:59, 13 March 2008

Rockpocket (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) has been an administrator since 10 November 2006.

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I'll sometimes reply on your talk, but will frequently (increasingly often) reply here.

Archives

2006 1) 3 January 2006 – 17 March 2006 2) 18 March 2006 – 20 May 2006 3) 21 May 2006 – 8 June 2006 4) 10 June 2006 – 29 July 2006 5) 1 August 2006 – 31 October 2006 6) 1 November 2006 – 30 November 2006 7) 1 December 2006 – 31 December 2006 2007 8) 1 January 2007 – 28 January 2007 9) 29 January 2007 – 25 February 2007 10) 1 March 2007 – 31 March 2007 11) 1 April 2007 – 28 April 2007 12) 1 May 2007 – 22 May 2007 13) 23 May 2007 – 4 June 2007 14) 5 June 2007 – 5 July 2007 15) 7 July 2007 – 5 August 2007 16) 9 August 2007 – 10 September 2007 17) 11 September 2007 – 15 October 2007 18) 17 October 2007 – 30 November 2007 19) 1 December 2007 – 31 December 2007 2008 20) 1 January 2008 – 1 February 2008 21) 2 February 2008 – 29 February 2008

Giano

Thanks Rockpocket, for the info. GoodDay (talk) 00:44, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Citizendium

You considered leaving the joys and excitement of Wikepedia behind for the sterile life at this other place? Well, I would have missed you. I suppose that it is possible to do both, but only if you don't mind having your RL identity attached to the one on Misplaced Pages in a definitive way. ៛ Bielle (talk) 02:03, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

I thought about it for a while, during the period I was seething over a run in I had with StuRat. But I don't really edit in my area of professional expertise all that much here, so I wasn't really convinced it would be a particularly productive move. Besides, there is something about the organized chaos that is Misplaced Pages that I quite enjoy and I have grown quite attached to some of the personalities here. I certainly don't have the time to do both, so I decided to come back ;).

Hello

Thanks for the welcome. Hopefully I should stay around for a while now. :) -Localzuk 10:38, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Analysis

Hello, Rockpocket. I remember you once analyzed a month or so of RD activity, also counting the related changes made in article-space, I don't know how, but I think that's what you did. I can't find it though. Do you know what I'm talking about and, if so, do you have a link? I want to somehow include it at WP:RDAC. Thanks. ---Sluzzelin talk 11:47, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Hello. I have been neglecting WP:RDAC recently, I hope to update it soon. Anyway, the stats are at User:Rockpocket/Ref desk stats, feel free to use them however you wish. Rockpocket 19:29, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! Funny, I seemed to remember you having counted all subsequent article changes performed by desk volunteers in a given time period, even minor and untemplated changes. Maybe by using "related changes" or something. Was I mistaken? ---Sluzzelin talk 14:25, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

No, I didn't do that, I'm afraid. I wouldn't even know how to! At the time of the analysis I counted the number of articles that had the {{WPRDAC}} template. There was 68 articles improved in 10 months. Rockpocket 18:45, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

unsuccessful Rfa candidate reaches new lows

Here he is mentoring a relatively new contributor to also become uncivil. http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Ss06470#second_warning.2C_no_personal_attacks

":In the edit summary, put an apology for (if that's accurate) failing to AGF (assume good faith). Or you can add an apology insertion right after the struck out text. Like this:

Scuro has evil intent, obviously in the pay of the drug companies "

What irks me is that he knows better.--scuro (talk) 03:35, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

The apprentice is now practicing the lesson taught by user Abd. http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Attention-deficit_hyperactivity_disorder_controversies#Media_Coverage_of_the_ADHD_Controversy_should_not_be_a_list_of_everyone_who_wrote_an_article_related_to_ADHD_controversy.

Great Ned. You belong here guarding this site from the likes of me and them. Oh is that insulting? My apologies. Where are you Scuro? Or have you taken on a few user names Whoops My apologies

User Abd also speaks of restraining me. Are editors to restrain other editors or are we act in good faith? What action would be most effective to make this stop?

http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Ss06470#Your_comment_on_Talk:Attention-deficit_hyperactivity_disorder:_controversies_on_22:45.2C_29_February_2008

Dr. Sobo, you are correct that there has been long-term biased push on these articles, and Misplaced Pages is vulnerable to such efforts. Short-term push can be dealt with, but long-term, persistent warping of an article by someone really determined to do so can be very effective. However, be careful. Thinking of Misplaced Pages as a battleground can lead you into some serious mistakes, such as that here. Archiving of Talk is essential. If it is done incorrectly, it can be fixed. History remains for all of it. Nothing is lost. But the goal here is the article, not Talk. I've been distracted elsewhere, or I'd have been more active restraining the particular editor who is tangling with you. Abd (talk) 16:41, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

--scuro (talk) 05:06, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Ref desk

Interesting stuff like this is the reason I watch the ref desk :). Seraphim♥ 00:04, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm glad to hear it, Seraphim Whipp. I too enjoy finding unlikely gems of obscure information while browsing the desks. Rockpocket 18:47, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Email

Rock, you have a fairly important email from me. Please reply soon as you can, it's important. I think there's some things you need to know ASAP. SirFozzie (talk) 03:01, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

User:Qwenton

I believe you recently unblocked Qwenton following his temporary ban for for harassing other users and after his vandalism of other users' pages, and warned him to stop making personal attacks. You might like to look at his postings since being unblocked, specifically: "Liar and cheater Emeraude says I vandalise user pages..." and "Trickster and con-man One Night In Hackney..." from this page and his unwelcome additions to my talk page. It seems to me that he intends to carry on his vendetta, and from his comments in the AfD that he is not prepared to accept consensus in the BNP article that led to his outbursts. Emeraude (talk) 11:38, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm...... One Night In Hackney₃₀₃ 23:02, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I blocked the user for the continuing incivility and attempts to harass other users. Hope that is all right with you. --John (talk) 23:10, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Thats fine by me. He doesn't seem to get the message, does he? Rockpocket 18:42, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Disambiguation

Yup, I'd just figured out that there was something afoot. I think I'm going to revert myself (at least, in those cases that haven't already been reverted) until such time, if any, as neutrality is achieved. --AndrewHowse (talk) 20:53, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your offer but I'll revert myself first. That way I can believe that I've avoided making it any worse. D'you think it's possible that vivisection ought not to be a dab page? --AndrewHowse (talk) 20:58, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree, based on the dozen or so pages I looked at. I'm a little surprised that this diff didn't generate more controversy. I'm wondering if I have the energy to take this on. --AndrewHowse (talk) 21:25, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

WP:HARASS

Rockpocket, I am being harrassed by Traditional unionist on my talkpage. It resulted from my removal of his addition of Unionist pov from the Dunmanway article. Could you please revert his pov change and warn him about 3RR and pov insertion. I do not want to engage myself - but this is a good test of whether the civility that some Admins have been preaching actually applies in practice. If TU isn't dealt with the choices become limited somewhat. Sarah777 (talk) 22:45, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I've just complained elsewhere about this accusation. I fail to see how I've been unreasonable.Traditional unionist (talk) 22:47, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Brteach of WP:3RR by TU:

1. cur) (last) 23:35, 8 March 2008 Traditional unionist (Talk | contribs) m (9,744 bytes) (Reverted 1 edit by Sarah777; Independence granted in 1949, recognised from 1937 or 1922, not 1918. (TW)) (undo)
2. (cur) (last) 23:33, 8 March 2008 Sarah777 (Talk | contribs) (9,753 bytes) (Independance declared 1918 thus Brit was occupying army; pl DO NOT reinsert pov) (undo)
3. (cur) (last) 23:29, 8 March 2008 Traditional unionist (Talk | contribs) m (9,744 bytes) (Reverted 1 edit by Sarah777; 1918 is not independance - pov. (TW)) (undo)
4. (cur) (last) 23:27, 8 March 2008 Sarah777 (Talk | contribs) (9,753 bytes) (post 1918 election; thus fact, not pov) (undo)
5. (cur) (last) 17:51, 8 March 2008 Traditional unionist (Talk | contribs) m (9,744 bytes) (→History: pov) (undo)
6. (cur) (last) 14:57, 3 March 2008 Dppowell (Talk | contribs) (9,753 bytes) (rm unsourced statement (13 months)) (undo)

Sarah777 (talk) 23:02, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Just a brushfire Rock! Thanks for your patience - as always :-) Sarah777 (talk) 01:59, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I made a reasonable edit, it was reverted in an unreasonable way. I opened a discussion about it, I was dismissed as "aggressive". Then a campaign opened, which is not unreasonable to call harassments against me, simply for disagreeing with an editor who was recently unblocked with a promise of civility. And this isn't the only article she's breaking the verifiability rules on . So I'm warned for approaching 3RR, but the other editor gets away with breaking the conditions for an unblock, throwing a violent strop, and being disruptive for hours? We all cross the line sometimes, but I'm pretty unhappy about this is being handled.Traditional unionist (talk) 11:11, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

It was a pov edit reverted in a reasonable way - then you started edit warring. Your statements on my page were aggressive. I broke no conditions as there were none - the block would have expired in a matter of hours anyway. And there were no "verifiability rules" broken! The only reason I agreed to the ONIH compromise was because I realised that this dispute could potentially to every village in Ireland - NOT because I thought my edit was not 100% correct. And that yours was 100% pov. Sarah777 (talk) 14:30, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

And the reason I took the case to various Admins rather than tackling your pov directly was because that is what I was advised to do by said various Admins and I cannot see anything wrong with the way it was handled - I was also told (by several Admins) that if I made another revert it would be 3RR (which I knew anyway). You are being provocative; you are well aware that I have been editing many articles for over a year to eliminate any suggestion that the view that Ireland was legally Independent as a result of the formation of the First Dail is less legitimate than the Unionist/British view. Sarah777 (talk) 14:37, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

TU. I "warned" you that you were approaching 3RR because you were approaching 3RR. I also "warned" Sarah for the exact same thing. I did so because I didn't want to have to block anyone for 3RR when it could be avoided. I wasn't aware there was any conditions to Sarah's unblocking, so that was not a factor in my response. Could you point me to where those conditions were elucidated? If you are unhappy with my "warning" then remove it from your page. I don't mind. Look, everything was resolved they way it should be, with discussion on the talk page. Can we all move on, please? Rockpocket 23:08, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Banned Users

Hello Rockpocket. Thanks for informing me of Vk's previous promise to limit himself within Boxing articles. I sure wish he'd stop creating 'sockpuppets'. There's always editors out there, who can't/won't appreciate what being 'indefinetly banned' means. GoodDay (talk) 19:56, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, we have heard that promise before. The irony is, of course, that were he to actually respect the block and go and do something productive for a few months before coming back to Misplaced Pages, then he probably would be permitted to edit again under probation. But each time he sock puppets that becomes less likely. Its worth remembering that he was indef blocked this time not because of attacks or incivility or POV pushing on controversial articles, but because he used sock puppets last time he was indef blocked and used one to vote stack in the ArbCom election. His boxing socks are easy to spot, but God knows how many other accounts he has at the moment and what he is using them for. Rockpocket 21:21, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm also disappointed in VK's usage of uncivil language. GoodDay (talk) 22:05, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I hardly even notice anymore. The consequences of excessive and persistent swearing and insults is the inability to articulate. People stop listening to what you have to say. Rockpocket 22:16, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Nip in bud?

Would you take a look at 1801 in Ireland and the edits by Astotrain? He added a flag to the article; in the entire series of hundreds of articles there are no other images used. Also the flag - if allowed - will lead to chaos and warring on this series. I made one revert but feel the sooner we move this to discussion the better. Sarah777 (talk) 22:55, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I have asked Astrotrain to stop adding it back. It is needlessly provocative with marginal encyclopaedic value. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Rockpocket 23:01, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

But if I may offer a bit of advice, Sarah. Have a read of WP:VANDAL. Astrotrains edits were not vandalism. If you don't like your good-faith edits being labeled as "POV", then don't label others' as "vandalism". Doing so will likely elicit an "aggressive" response, like the one you took issue with yesterday. Rockpocket 23:12, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Well Rock, maybe I shouldn't have called them that in the edit summary (civility etc) but my views on the the nature of the addition of the flag are clear - you'd not have me tell lies I hope? Sarah777 (talk) 23:54, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

OK. I shouldn't have called them that - period! Sarah777 (talk) 23:56, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Good call, my rule of thumb is to avoid the v-word as much as possible, in doing so I find that people respond more favorably. Rockpocket 00:06, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Discussion on WP:TER. One Night In Hackney₃₀₃ 23:19, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Rockpocket, I have left a rely for you on User_talk:Domer48 regarding your comments there and Astrotrains talkpage.--Padraig (talk) 20:20, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Giano II

So, 'Catherine' is a sockpuppet of Giano's. Well, I think I'll depart the discussion, as sockpuppetry humour is 'dishonest' humour, IMHO. Thanks for identifying 'Catherine', for me. GoodDay (talk) 20:22, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

There are some laughs to be had with Ma'am, but, yes, now is probably a good time to depart. Rockpocket 20:34, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

You have mail

As above. One Night In Hackney₃₀₃ 22:50, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Bearnstar

Thanks for the Bearnstar. I know we are supposed to "be polite and assume good faith" when answering questions on the reference desk (and I usually am), but I just couldn't help myself this time. Glad to know I made you laugh. Thomprod (talk) 12:09, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Big thanks

You really didn't have to do that, but thanks very much! It was very sweet of you :) --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:28, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for that

Thanks for the comments on the barnstar. --Domer48 (talk) 20:45, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Northern Ireland flag issue

Hi Rockpocket, I've seen mention in a couple of places that you are interested in helping find a consensus solution to the ongoing edit-warring related to use of the "Ulster banner". This would be most welcome — we need an experienced mediator (or two, or three...) for assistance. A few months ago, I (perhaps semi-naively) tried to help with the last attempt, archived at Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for mediation/Northern Ireland flag usage. That mediation failed miserably for three reasons, in my opinion:

1. User:Dantheman531 was not experienced enough to mediate this case, and was absent for extended periods
2. User:Padraig, as the spokesman of one side of the debate, was unwilling to concede any compromise, only agreeing to positions he had previously agreed with
3. User:Astrotrain, as the other spokesman, was unable to adequately articulate his position, and many of his comments appeared "poisioned" by past actions

This is not intended to be a list of personal attacks — it's just my personal assessment of what happened.

My own opinion, as someone who is relatively detached from the issue (I'm not Irish or British), is that there is a compromise position remaining to be found, but it does require some good-faith movement from both sides. My attempt at documenting (in a fair amount of detail), what I thought that middle-ground position was is described in this thread. Please take a look at the previous discussion (and the archives of Talk:Northern Ireland have a lot of this too). Hope this helps — Andrwsc (talk · contribs) 20:59, 11 March 2008 (UTC

Any compromise has to be supported by RS AND V in line with wikipedia policy, astrotrain has failed to provide these for the uses he wants, this whole debate would be simply resolved if he provided these, yet he either won't or can't do so, but still wants to use the image anywhere in WP ignoring WP policy. So why should we agree to the insertion of POV and OR to appease a edit warrior, which breaches the findings of the troubles arbcom.

The problem is that admins are not implementing the rulings of the arbcom in this instance, I was threatened with 1RR probation for making one revert made by a anon IP, a anon IP that was later blocked for edit warring on the same article, yet Astrotrain has a long list of blocks for edit warring on this issue and been warned before that he would be placed on arbcom probation if he edited warred on this issue, yet he is able to return after a few months and start again and nothing is done except him being warned again.--Padraig (talk) 22:17, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

If he continues to edit war, we now have a measure to curb that. No problem there, if another round of edit-warring occurs then I will have no hesitation of adding him to the probation list. As for having gone through this before, well, that is why I proposed you look at what AT is going to propose with fresh eyes. Perhaps he will come up with proposals not dissimilar to the ones you put forward last time. That sounds like it could be fertile middle ground. If his proposals are not policy compliant and lack verification, then there is little chance of them going forward, so you don't have to worry there either.

I would recommend, though, that you don't dismiss any effort to resolve conflict on these articles without even hearing what is being put forward. That really isn't a reasonable stance to make and as I said before, with these things the reasonable editors tend to move forward and those unwilling to be reasonable get marginalized. I believe you are a reasonable editor who is, perhaps understandably, sick and tired of this. But please don't bail out now. lets hear what AT has to say first and see if it has anything workable.

Andrwsc. Thanks for that summary. I'll have a look over the threads when I get a chance. Rockpocket 22:25, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I'am prepared to look at his proposals, but I'am not prepared to have a rehash of the previous mediation attempt again, if his proposals include RS and WP:V sources then they will be welcome, but without those then no compromise with him is possible. Also I'am not going to discuss each template or article individually as that is just a waste of energy and has already been tried and failed.--Padraig (talk) 22:35, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

For crying out loud, Padraig, focus on the issue not the person. You continue to throw around wiki policy alphabet soup and criticize Astrotrain's edits. Forget about him, if that helps. What does it take to get a consensus that all Misplaced Pages editors can work with? It's not just about the two of you. — Andrwsc (talk · contribs) 22:50, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Consensus (on Wiki) is 60% percent of a vote - and clearly defined as such (ref User:John). It certainly isn't meant to be something that all editors can accept; not even nearly all! Sarah777 (talk) 00:06, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Still hurting about losing that one Sarah? I always like these quotes on this subject:

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you. (from the Christian Scriptures)

Repair the evil done to you with something that is better. And lo! The enemy who did evil to you may turn into a close and true friend. (from the Muslim Scriptures)

In all seriousness, it might be better not to deliberately misrepresent what I have said on the subject of consensus, as I know how much you like editing here. --John (talk) 00:24, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Good luck; I had a bash at trying to find some common ground. See: User_talk:Major_Bonkers/Archive_Aug_2007#Ulster_banner. --Major Bonkers (talk) 12:18, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Urgent

Rock, some Admin called "Thatcher" has added my name to a list of blocks related to the "Troubles" Arbcom. I had specifically pointed out that I was no party to that nor were the blocks (for dissing some warring Admins) related to it. Yet Thatcher added my name. I reverted. Please investigate asap. Regards Sarah777 (talk) 00:18, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

What is the basis for adding me to this list? That I'm Irish and therefore guilty? I am on the verge of a mega incivility on Thatcher's page. Sarah777 (talk) 00:21, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm running very late for an appointment Sarah, so I'm afraid I don't have time to deal with this until later this evening. Thatcher is a clerk and it is his job to ensure thing are, erm, clerked properly. He is also a very polite man (or indeed a woman, but not that Thatcher, before you ask!), so please explain to him nicely that you were not party to that ArbCom and have never been sanctioned under its remedies, therefore you don't believe you should be listed there. When I get back (probably early morning in the civilized world) I will inquire further about it myself. Rockpocket 00:30, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm off to 'mo leaba' myself; I had already explained all this after Fozzie......Gawd this gets complicated....zzzzzzzSarah777 (talk) 00:38, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Please help (not urgent)

If you know, please can you tell me what's happened to Werdnabot? Werdnabot is supposed automatically to archive my Talk page, but now appears as a red link on the large banner at the top of the page. Meanwhile, the rubbish is continuing to pile up! I wouldn't mind so much, but I've also helped out a new editor (West one girl) by adding the template to her page as well. Trust you are well; thank you for any help you can give. (I also reckon you need a long service medal to go with that VC of yours... !) --Major Bonkers (talk) 12:25, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your help. (I notice that you don't often see 'thank you' on your Talk page!) --Major Bonkers (talk) 10:29, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Hello

Hi Rockpocket. Am I being too sensisitive or paranoid? or does the User page Catherine de Burgh, violate User Page policies. It seems more like a sock-puppet or simply a Joke page. Just curious. GoodDay (talk) 20:22, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

• I will not be called a sock pocket on my own Encyclopaedia (with a diphthong), I have been here for a great deal of time, and I can assure the site is better for my presence. I hold no grudges at all against you, not in my nature. In fact you have my greatest support, in your edits here. I note you live on Prince Edward Island, how nice that must be, all those penguins and things to look at - quite charming. I remember when one of my late husbands was Governor General, we passed by on the yacht, and I wanted to stop, but my husband pointed out That musical play Anne of Green Gables, which has run every year on the Island for more than forty years, was in full voice, so he had the boilers stoked instead. Such a pity as I expect the locals must be word perfect by now, the finale must be rather like Aida - at La scala (do you know La Scala? - very provincial, but they do change the program every season) except of course the Italians cry, such an emotional race, no stiff upper lip like we Brits. I can assure you I violate nobody or their pages. I'm sure that nice Mr. Rocketpocket will confirm this. Do give my love to the penguins - such attractive intelligent creatures. Catherine de Burgh (Lady) (talk) 20:59, 13 March 2008 (UTC)