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Watching Anti-Science POV admin candidates

• None for now.

Articles on Quackademic Medicine

Below are articles articles, mostly medical but some in the sciences, that promote ideas or POV's that might endanger human life. Feel free to add your own, but I'm watching and cleaning up these articles. Please sign if you add something.

• List of medicinal herbs-lacks any references, and implies these drugs can help.Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Herbalism-same as above Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Homeopathy-ridiculous Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Attachment therapy-don't let your children go there Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC) This has been rewritten since User:AWeidman (Dr Becker-Weidman) and his 6 socks were indef banned. Fainites 16:45, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
• Medicinal plants of the American West-more unsourced POV edits Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Alternative medicine-more of the same Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Naturopathic medicine-Actually not completely off the wall, but some parts are bad. Orangemarlin 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
• Er, Duesberg hypothesis and poppers could both use more work, and talk about endangering lives... especially the former. MastCell 18:54, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
• I'd also add ephedra to the list... I did a lot of work cleaning it up and it's not so bad anymore (it actually references the serious harms and deaths associated with ephedra supplements in a way that goes beyond referring to the FDA as jackbooted thugs, now). But much of the same material is duplicated in ECA stack, which I haven't been as successful with, and which I fear gives an erroneous impression as to the safety record of ephedra-containing dietary supplements. MastCell 19:20, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
• Arguably, Reflexology, though that's probably not actually dangerous, just ridiculously oversold. Adam Cuerden 00:51, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
• Vaccine controversy. Anti-vaxers are really dangerous. -- Fyslee / talk 08:27, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
• Hulda Clark. A dangerous scam. -- Fyslee / talk 08:27, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
• Gary Null. Advocates nonsense. -- Fyslee / talk 08:27, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
• Joseph Mercola. Advocates nonsense and repeated run ins with the FTC. -- Fyslee / talk 08:27, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
• rebirthing, reparenting, Power therapies. Primal Scream therapy. I would treat Neurolinguistic Programming as the main hub for many of them though. Its a subject that seems to be the main pseudoscientific umbrella that is used by most of them to give the false impression of scientific appearance. Its incredibly widespread and extremely misleading to the less scientifically literate. Here is a good source; . Phloem (talk) 05:33, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

anyone who wants to work on this complex of article, I'll be glad to help. Time we got to the pseudo-psychology. DGG (talk) 21:18, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

try Eisner in The death of psychotherapy, Chapter 3 "Cathartic Therapies:From Primal to est". A little out of date but .... Fainites 22:20, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

• coral calcium. I just put in some references, but there is a lot more that can be done. That someone would think that coral calcium can be used as a panacea for all types of cancer when in fact excess calcium can, in some cases, be detrimental to certain cancer treatments means that we should be very careful how the claims of the coral calcium fanatics are treated. ScienceApologist (talk) 21:38, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
• Mannatech. An article about a company that purveys sugars, calling them health products (glyconutrients). Antelan 02:39, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Medical articles

Below are articles that I believe, along with any trusted science and medicine editors who may wish to contribute, meet the simple test of being well-written, do not give undue weight to fringe theories, and are either WP:GA or WP:FA:

• Alzheimer's Disease
• Rotavirus

Articles_for_deletion/Thule_Society

Have a look Misplaced Pages:Articles_for_deletion/Thule_Society LeadSongDog (talk) 18:29, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm not getting the reason for deletion? It seems notable enough. Sure, it needs a complete NPOV workover, but I'm not sure it deserves deletion. But, drop a note here, maybe I'll see your point. OrangeMarlin 00:52, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Wasn't the AFD self explanatory? The article has been there for six years without a single citation. There's no way of verifying where anything in it came from short of retracing every prior editor's steps. There's at least one large edit that looks very much like it was a copy-paste from somewhere unstated. It's full of unqualified extraordinary claims without evidence. However, it looks like I'm the only one troubled by this.LeadSongDog (talk) 03:01, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Re: Introduction

Hi OrangeMarlin! It's great of you to make attempts to rid Misplaced Pages of anti-Semitism. I have not actually encountered any anti-Semitism from non-Arab Wikipedians, but that's probably because I don't really edit articles unrelated to Israel (except anime and hockey, sometimes). I will be glad to help you in fighting anti-Semitism, but take into account that I know very little on most subjects covered in Misplaced Pages, especially US-centric ones. I only focus on Israel-related entries - call me narrow minded; I prefer 'narrow specialist' :)

About the Canucks - As it says on my userpage, I have lived in Burnaby, British Columbia in the past, which made the Canucks my home team. They're a good team and I still follow their progress now, even though I live very far from Vancouver and the team isn't doing that well anyway. There's no opportunity to play hockey in central Israel either - mostly because people don't play, so it's hard to find enough people for a game who also have the necessary equipment - even if it's a street/roller hockey game. And I'm not going to move to the north anytime soon.

Glad to hear from a fellow soldier. Two of my friends currently serve in the Medical Corps. Cheers, Ynhockey 20:31, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Allopathic

Do you want to try Misplaced Pages:Dispute resolution ? Bryan Hopping 00:49, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

I've actually asked that you be permanently blocked. It's a better solution, because if it were only me, then it would work. But every editor disagrees with you except for CAM nutjobs. So, I've asked previously, and I'll ask again, stay off my page. I'm hoping you're indefinitely blocked soon. OrangeMarlin 00:51, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

This sure seems like a personal attack to me. Bryan Hopping 01:31, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Hopping, I honestly think you and OrangeMarlin have gotten off on the wrong foot. The way I see it, you are a prolific writer of good D.O. content that Misplaced Pages needs. As far as I know, the only substantive issue that I've ever had with you is your usage of what I consider a tendentious term for MDs across article space. OM, if Hopping can restrain himself from inappropriately labeling MDs, and explain why he called us 'liars', you should take a tour of his work. Aside from the allopathic pushing, the balance is quite good - at least what I've seen. Antelan 12:27, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

"you are a prolific writer of good D.O. content that Misplaced Pages needs." Thanks. I appreciate that. I know we have our disagreements, but I appreciate you taking the time to identify some positive contribution I've made. Bryan Hopping 11:16, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, I'm happy to identify your good edits, which are plentiful. I believe that an RfC on your behavior is imminent, and in my statement, I will express both my appreciation for the work that you have done as well as my strong rejection of your refusal to cease, in the face of community input, what I see as tendentious editing across article-space with regards to "allopathic." Given the amount of feedback you have received and rejected with regards to this single term, I don't know what else to do besides bring this to the greater community for input. Antelan 19:58, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Hopping is certainly about 10,000,000,000X better of an editor than the racist, anti-Semitic neo-Nazis that I'm dealing with elsewhere. I'd rather Hopping just stop this Allopathy crap, and then maybe he can help out. I never knew about this Allopathic label until I was reviewing one of his GAC's (or maybe FAC's), and noticed the label. He has to stop however. OrangeMarlin 15:39, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Absolutely. Antelan 16:47, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Unfortunately, he's now moved on to doing this with images. Antelan 20:02, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I think now we are approaching the definition of a true POV-warrior, who does not like to play nice. I think I'm going to place a rapid delete label on that. It's unsourced. OrangeMarlin 13:18, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

God Save the South

FYI - it looks as though not perma-banning this editor actually had some useful repercussions. I watchlisted his talkpage, and today noticed this. A quick look through that editor's contribs found this and this. I pointed this out on IRC, and voila. Black Kite 13:16, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

In this case, God Save the South's account functioned as what we call, a "honey pot". Then, it was ban hammer time. --Filll (talk) 13:22, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

You know, this makes me feel better. Maybe putting up with editors, that say "Jew Comedian" is perfectly acceptable, is the cost for blocking the more notorious racists on this project. GSTS may have a purpose.  :) OrangeMarlin 15:36, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Truth be told, another editor and I were already watching that one closely, but I didn't mind seeing things happen a bit sooner and more swiftly than they otherwise would have. Cheers. :) Gwen Gale (talk) 05:48, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Re Apologies

Hey Orange; sorry for the late reply. It wasn't the arbitrary break itself I was concerned about but the fact that removes piled in all of a sudden. It looked, as I said, like people had been rounded up. So I waited for further comments. In the end, I did ultimately agree with the substance of the removes.

"Can't we limit people to one sentence?" This is a Wiki, as you've heard before :). Certainly on some reviews I want to scream because of the massive comments, but what to do. People will say what they like. Marskell (talk) 19:54, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I really don't have the time to read everyone's comments in certain articles. I run a large company, and I swear I'd fire the first person who made an argument that wasn't bullet pointed, succinct, and logical. The long-winded, dull commentary from certain editors just doesn't get far. They're arguing with themselves! OrangeMarlin 14:49, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

E kala mai

Orangemarlin... I know you asked me to not post on your talk page, but I just wanted to sincerely apologize to you personally for my actions yesterday. It was never my intention to make you feel like you were being personally attacked. Personal attacks harm the community, and should not be permitted. I am also sorry for edit warring on the Expelled page. While I still do not understand how my edits were biased toward the film/Creationist point of view (especially since I too am an evilutionist... to dispute evolution occurs is madness), I am sorry for edit warring. Edit warring does not lead anywhere good. I hope we can move past this dispute. I understand we have had other disagreements in the past, but I am truly interested in working constructively with you in the future. I think you are a good editor... especially on medical/science articles. Again, e kala mai, my deepest apologies. I hope you will accept this and grant me your forgiveness. Mahalo nui, Orangemarlin. --Ali'i 14:05, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Accepted. I don't like being called a vandal, but apparently that's over. Now, you have to realize, you have a reputation, in my eyes (I speak for no one else) of supporting the Creationist POV. I don't care about that, but the neutral POV is not the Creationist one. And this movie is an attack on Evolution, which is scientifically not in dispute by anyone with a science or rationalist background. Anyways, let's put water under the bridge, and I withdraw your "ban" from my talk page.  ;) OrangeMarlin 14:47, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you, Orangemarlin. I am a little unsure how I got pegged as supporting the creationist point of view, since I haven't really ever edited anything in that sphere of coverage (and whole-heartedly believe in evolution based on the overwhelming evidence), but I appreciate your forgiveness nonetheless. :-) See you around. --Ali'i 15:04, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

One favor. Can you please translate your Hawaiian sayings now and again?  :) OrangeMarlin 15:17, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

ʻAʻole pilikia. :-) Mahalo is fairly common... means "thank you". Mahalo nui loa means "thank you very much". E kala mai means "I'm sorry." And ʻAʻole pilikia means "no worries." I'll try to keep it to a minimum if I edit on your talk page. A hui hou (see you later). :-) --Ali'i 15:27, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I spent a few weeks in Hawaii while in the Navy. I learned no Hawaiian whatsoever. Ok, Aloha.  :) OrangeMarlin 15:37, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Hey, this reminds me of my page a few months back.  :) One of these years I'll get around to checking out the Polynesian languages. A hui hou.  ;) •Jim62sch• 22:35, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

At my advanced years, I have probably forgotten more English than I remember! Remember. Hmmm what does that mean again? OrangeMarlin 22:49, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Hey, I shot you an email on a separate topic. Thought you'd like to know. --Ali'i 13:58, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Dispute resolution

Above, User:Hopping suggested dispute resolution. Looking at Misplaced Pages:Dispute resolution, I think we've already gone through all of the relevant steps leading up to RfC. Do you concur? If so, would you consider certifying an RfC if I began one? If there's another step before RfC that we can utilize, I'd be happy to try an alternate route first. Antelan 16:42, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Let's do the RfC. It's important to have the evidence in case we need to ask for a community ban. He's already been blocked, so I will certify it. I'm sure others will too. OrangeMarlin 22:50, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Expelled

Man, I can't even keep up with all of this madness going on with this movie (or propaganda piece). I seriously, seriously wonder if some of the editors on that page have some underlying reasoning for their voracious editing on the article. Bet ole Ben Stein is slipping them a few bucks on the DL. I've never seen such traffic and article editing for such a awful, awful film. Now if only some of the great films actually got that attention. Baegis (talk) 18:43, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

I am barely able to keep up with it. I'm going to take the policy of reverting any edit that isn't done by the editors that I trust. Anonymous ones get no faith. And to think, I loved his role in Ferris Bueller. Damn. OrangeMarlin 19:30, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

I should have known that he was a bit sneaky. Clear Eyes might as well be renamed to "Burn (the living hell out of your) Eyes". Plus he was a writer for Tricky Dick. For shame! Baegis (talk) 19:38, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Hi Orangemarlin, if you take a view to the overview section, please consider commenting in the section here. I'd like to assure you that I've worked on improving a number of articles relating to secularism and the separation of church and state, and have no view to promoting the movie; in any case, I simply think all the traffic is a reason to go for quality now while people are here. I know you'd like to keep the article in good shape as well, so I'm just asking that we try to discuss what we can. Regards, Mackan79 (talk) 04:43, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

You seem like a nice guy, so I'll try to be nice in return. I despise long, tendentious discussion sections. People ought to make their point, but they don't, and it becomes a long thousand line boring discussion, with some people whining, some people bitching, and others accusing each other of bitching and whining. I don't need someone to tell me what is or is not NPOV. Use verified and reliable references, don't whitewash, and it's done. I'll make my reasons for changes known in the edit summary. If someone restricts commentary to 4 sentences TOTAL, I will join the discussion. I promise. But if I have to read a a small novel, and my mind isn't changed, why bother? OrangeMarlin 04:48, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Richard Dawkins FA

Hello Orangemarlin. How are you? This is the first time I am talking to you. I noticed your name on the talk page of Filll and I have seen your contributions.

Orange, I have nominated the article Richard Dawkins for the FA status. Please see the article. Your contributions will be helpful. Regards, Masterpiece2000 (talk) 02:45, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

If I may be permited a moment of levity...

Bensteinian Rhapsody Hrafn_Stalk 04:46, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

ROFLMAO. That was just too good. Thanks for some levity. OrangeMarlin 04:50, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Don't change the spelling of words

Misplaced Pages is an american site. Stop chaning things to british spelling.

Misplaced Pages is not an "American" site. We use the spelling that is commonly used in the subject matter of the article. Please see the Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style, specifically the Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style (spelling). Mahalo. --Ali'i 18:23, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Your participation requested

(Cross-posted to several users' talk pages)

Your participation on User:Raul654/Civil POV pushing would be appreciated. Raul654 (talk) 19:45, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

3RR warning

Note: You've now violated the WP:3RR for reverting more than 3 times in 24 hours, on Expelled:No Intelligence Allowed. If you continue to edit war on this article, you will be blocked from editing. ⇒SWATJester 22:23, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Actually, if you spent a second reviewing my edits, I did not make the same reverts over 3 times. And if you spent a second reviewing my edits you would see that I was trying to prevent an edit war by keeping inflammatory, anti-ID comments from being added, which is being as fair as I can be. Lastly, these edits were done last night. Because I don't like you and you despise me, you choose to leave this uncivil comment? Great job SJ. OrangeMarlin 22:32, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Please read the rule. Reverts do not need to be the same. "An editor must not perform more than three reverts, in whole or in part, on a single page within a 24-hour period. A revert means undoing the actions of another editor, whether involving the same or different material each time." (from WP:3RR). You do not prevent an edit war by inflamming it. You prevent an edit war by coming to WP:RFPP and requesting protection. Lastly, I don't have any feelings either way towards you. The warning stands. Do not continue to revert that article.⇒SWATJester 22:39, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes, you have treated me with disrespect on a number of occasions. If you want me to spend time digging it up, I shall. Because of your intense dislike of me, instead of a friendly piece of advice such as, "hey, I know you're an experience editor, so I'm giving you a pass on this one, but really, you should not have made that many edits." I might have responded, "but I was kind of reverting on both sides of the issue." You might have responded with the rule, and we would have been done. No, instead, you took about the most uncivil approach possible by throwing a canned warning on my talk page. This warning is disrespectful if not just plain uncivil. But I'll tow your line, because you have the power to block me, and you're looking for a reason to bait me and block me.OrangeMarlin 22:55, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm certainly not looking for a reason to block you, otherwise I would have just done it. I agree with the idea that you want to quell the edit war on that article, but you went about it wrong. It's not uncivil to tell you A: you violated the rule, and b) if you continue you'll be blocked. That's not uncivil: that's a statement of fact. Keep a thick skin please, especially if you're going to wade into controversial articles. ⇒SWATJester 23:04, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

And that comment I can read. I have a thick skin. Note the Nazi vandalism to my page this morning. OrangeMarlin 23:10, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

As a jew, I'm glad to see that vandal blocked. ⇒SWATJester 23:18, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

You do realize that although I don't find Intelligent design very useful, the background racism we see around here (not frequently, but just enough) just makes me want to scream. OrangeMarlin 00:18, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Wait a minute, you're a Member of the tribe? I guess my mitzvah will be to follow your advice. But on the other hand, Ben Stein is technically an MoT too. What to do????? OrangeMarlin 00:19, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

How about, I just reverted the vandal that hit your user page. And I'm glad you'll take my advice this pesach. ⇒SWATJester 00:20, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

There was a vandal? Grrrrrr. While you're here, because Uber is aiming to get me, can you take a look at Mannatech. I don't really care about the article, but there's an editor who's at 3RR, and he's pushing company sponsored research, that doesn't qualify as WP:RS as independent research. I'm kind of bored with that edit war, because it's clear that a company shill is editing the article. OrangeMarlin 00:23, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps add into that paragraph that he's including that the research was funded by Mannatech (if you have a source for that). That way, it's out there for people to decide on their own how much weight to give it. ⇒SWATJester 00:39, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I did. He deleted it. I'm at 2RR, so I don't want to get into a 3RR situation, then Uber will run over here and tag me out of spite. OrangeMarlin 00:45, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Well first step is to not make assumptions about Uber's motives. It's really hard not to do sometimes (I'm guilty of it too). Remember, no edit is so critical that it can't stay up for a day or two so you're not in a 3RR situation. Just slow down, take a day of from that article, and then look at it again with a fresh eye. ⇒SWATJester 01:05, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Io io editor

Note this and this comment. Based on how it is received, I may start a post at AN/I. Figured you'd be interested. WLU (talk) 16:46, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

This guy again. I'm interested in assisting, because he needs to get his ego under control. He's a intelligent, well-read editor, but it's his way or no way. Not really helpful to medical articles. OrangeMarlin 16:54, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Nope, looks like I'm going ahead. Will RFC/U instead, possibly tomorrow or Monday. In the meantime, I'll be building a case here. Feel free to add if you'd like, please separate into your own section though. WLU (talk) 17:18, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

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Wikify

• Empty nose syndrome...WTF??
• Sensory substitution..WTF????

Suggezzbot...goin' sleep now...zzzzzzzzzzz.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Casliber (talk • contribs) 16:16, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Empty freakin' nose syndrome???????? You've got to be freaking kidding me. Casliber, this drive by annoying me is going to require an RfC. I'm now going to have to take drugs. Empty nose syndrome. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.OrangeMarlin 00:23, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

PMID 17875850. You know, I almost became an ENT... MastCell  20:48, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

ENT? I guess slightly better than a proctologist. OrangeMarlin 23:05, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Expelled

Hi. I noticed you reverted my edit, claiming they were "POV". I moved the Box Office information (which I did not add myself, and actually trimmed it down for relevance) because box office performance is part of "reaction" to a film, and a valid part of any movie article, as I've seen on many other such articles. I changed the "f" in "fascism" to lowercase because it's not a proper noun, and shortened some section titles because succinct ones that are more to the point are more appropriate, so long as they accurately summarize a section. Can you explain why you feel that these constitute POV edits? Thanks. Nightscream (talk) 04:17, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

I disagreed with your change in section titles. OrangeMarlin 04:36, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

(Personal attack by GSTS removed. KillerChihuahua 19:18, 20 April 2008 (UTC))

Puppy, how can I have fun with the KKK-trash if you revert it. I'm now going to pout in the corner. And eat some steak. OrangeMarlin 23:04, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Can you check whether your revert on the talk page actually achieved what you intended. Look at the diff, the software might have messed something up. The summary states it is a revert, but the diff looks like different, what's going on? This certainly doesn't look like what you intended, am I wrong? --Merzul (talk) 23:50, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Never mind, I misread the edit summary, you probably did intend that. I reverted to your version. (Not because I care whether you were right to revert Nightscream's deletion, it's about 5 lines of off-topic discussion, but because that was the version before I started to assume bad software.) --Merzul (talk) 01:03, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

It's inappropriate for someone to delete discussion, except for very specific reasons like personal attacks. To delete the discussion of someone like Dave Souza, an admin, and a prolific editor is completely inappropriate. I guess when I reverted, there was some ancillary damage. OrangeMarlin 01:25, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Awwww...someone appreciates it

sports chiro AfD

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Sports_Chiropractic Mccready (talk) 15:15, 21 April 2008 (UTC)