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archives and CoI

I notice you were involved in a recent discussion about archives at the WP:CoI policy. I was wondering if you could please have a look at a couple of the questions I've asked about this that were raised to me by people in the industry: Wikipedia_talk:Conflict_of_interest#Archives_exception_-_clarification_please Sincerely, Witty Lama 16:23, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Ah, that's funny, because I was going to post a reply, then saw Smallbones had a good answer already, then saw you had more questions and considered whether or not to jump in. Now that you've somehow read my mind and asked me I'll respond. :) -- Atama頭 16:30, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Prod-2

I noticed you recently added a Prod-2 to a separate company of the U.S. military, citing not enough sources to satisfy WP:CORP. You may be interested in looking at 57th Signal Company (United States) as well. Regards Buckshot06(prof) 21:11, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the notice! -- Atama頭 21:12, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

I've started another discussion; you may wish to comment at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/101st Chemical Company (United States). Buckshot06(prof) 20:59, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Conflict of interest

Please I don't agree completely with your analysis Misplaced Pages:Conflict_of_interest/Noticeboard#Cancellation_of_interwiki_links. It's a conflict of interest because if a sockpuppet insert a content which is correct I don't see why the sockpuppet should be blocked (which is a correct action) but all contributions rollbacked also if they are a "neutral" and correct content like interwiki link. User:Retaggio has re-inserted the same content because has judged the actions of Director exaggerated. The user Direktor seems to see phantoms everywhere and seems to have taken a position where every contributions of every phantom is dangerous and should be rollbacked without any analysis. We are working for the quality of Misplaced Pages and not for personal battles. The action of Direktor seems to have more and more an interest external to the interests of Misplaced Pages (please see his contributions). Thank you for your support. --Ilario (talk) 09:15, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

It isn't a conflict of interest. It's standard to revert the actions of a sockpuppet of a banned and/or blocked editor. Direktor also stated that if you or anyone else reverted him and reinserted the interwiki links then he wouldn't protest. So what is the problem? Did Direktor go against his word and revert back after Retaggio made the changes? I don't see any merit in your complaints. Please see WP:BAN#Enforcement by reverting edits, where it says, "Anyone is free to revert any edits made in defiance of a ban." What Direktor did was completely in-line with policy at the English Misplaced Pages, and frankly I don't care if it would be called vandalism at the Italian Misplaced Pages, it's not vandalism here. I suggest that you drop the matter. Thank you. -- Atama頭 21:15, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Surely I drop the matter adding something to your conclusion taken from your link: "This does not mean that obviously helpful edits (such as fixing typos or undoing vandalism) must be reverted just because they were made by a banned user, but the presumption in ambiguous cases should be to revert." The interwiki is an helpful link and what Direktor done is not "completely" in line with english policies. A policy should be read entirely and not by sentence. --Ilario (talk) 20:04, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

You're absolutely correct. They don't have to be deleted. What Direktor did wasn't necessary. But it was certainly allowed. And there was no reason to report him on it. If you or anyone else thinks that the edits were helpful you can revert to put them back, which is what Retaggio did, and Direktor let it be. So nobody did anything wrong, except for the sockpuppet who shouldn't have been editing in the first place. Thanks! -- Atama頭 02:06, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

TV Guide's List of the 50 Worst TV Shows of All Time

Boy, I do really hate template messages. I did checked that AFD but from reading it at first I didn't thought this article was included but only the greatest all of all time article. Garion96 (talk) 19:32, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Sorry for templating you but I'm trying to get through all the proposed deletion articles that will expire today. I had to dig through the edit history of the article to find the AfD notice myself so I don't blame you for missing it. -- Atama頭 19:34, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

On second thought I'm restoring the prod tag, it was added to the AfD improperly as an afterthought and nobody even commented on it. If anything, that just confirms that the deletion would be uncontroversial. -- Atama頭 19:47, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for re adding the prod tag, the article is now deleted. Saves me some work in making an AFD nomination. Garion96 (talk) 13:18, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Quick question

What's the tag you use if something's been copied from some other site? Please respond on my talk page. Thanks, Purplebackpack89 (talk) 01:07, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Agnieszka Lukasiak

Hi.

Thanks for letting me know about the removal of the proposed deletion of Agnieszka Lukasiak. Apart from the brief mention in the source that you added, do you think that more coverage exists? I couldn't find any, but perhaps it is in other languages. Specifically, do you think that the subject meets the requirements, ie significant coverage in reliable, independent sources?  Chzz  ►  11:19, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

I was going by WP:CREATIVE, under the 4th criteria (specifically, her work has won significant critical attention). Aside from the link I already provided showing that she won the award for one documentary, another one was featured at the 2002 International Documentary Film Festival Amsterdam in 2002, The Nameless War. Forgotten was also featured at the International Women's Film Festival. I don't think she's incredibly notable and I don't think she meets the general notability requirements, but she does seem to meet the more specific inclusion criteria as a filmmaker because of her body of work. If you disagree, go ahead and bring up an AfD, I'd probably argue a "weak keep" but I'm not passionate about the article being kept. Thanks! -- Atama頭 16:08, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Hi; thanks for getting back to me, and the explanation. I agree that it is a bit borderline on notability, but WP:GNG supercedes the various specific guides (as you prob know), so I'll put it to AfD - maybe someone will be able to find something.

No problems with leaving me the notice, I don't mind at all - I'd much rather know about it. I only refactored it because I've PRODded about 100 articles (in reviewing Category:Unreviewed new articles), and of course several were de-PRODded, so I put them all into one section on my talk. Absolutely no problem at all. Thanks again,  Chzz  ►  21:29, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Actually, no, GNG doesn't supersede anything. Remember, these are inclusion criteria, not exclusion criteria. The whole point of having more specific notability requirements such as WP:ATHLETE or WP:NB is not to give additional hurdles for an article to pass in order for it to be considered notable, but to provide alternative ways of showing notability aside from WP:N. See what it says right at the top of WP:BIO#Additional criteria, where it states, "A person is generally notable if they meet any of the following standards." Then again, it also says "meeting one or more does not guarantee that a subject should be included" which I assume keeps inclusionists from using the guideline as a bludgeon in deletion I definitely have no complaints about bringing it to AfD, I welcome other opinions on whether or not she merits inclusion and I'm far from an expert on the notability of filmmakers, but she seems superficially notable to me. Thank you for the notice regarding the AfD (I don't have the article on my watchlist). -- Atama頭 21:44, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Harris

It's a reference to the alias Plaxico tried to use after the gun incident; I just added it for the lulz. Mike R (talk) 17:28, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Lorenzo (singer-writer) (from WP:COIN)

Just letting you know, User:Lorenzo (cantautore) and User:Lorenzo Cappiello have created hoax articles on Lorenzo Cappiello already, with the former being blocked as a sock of the latter. Ten Pound Hammer, his otters and a clue-bat • 18:29, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Awesome, thanks. I AGF'd on this guy until TheLetterM pointed out that his user page is in clear English, and that the claims he made about being a singer signed to Warner Bros were provably false. I'm not surprised that this ended this way. -- Atama頭 20:05, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

I just asked Jéské Couriano to block per WP:DUCK as an obvious sock of Cappiello. Ten Pound Hammer, his otters and a clue-bat • 20:12, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your advice. I'll expand on my concerns on Talk:Charles A. Morgan, III, and give User:CAMorgan3rd a week or two before I make any changes to the article.

Cheers! Geo Swan (talk) 21:16, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

FICS Page flag

Atama-san, there is also a flag on the page that DigitalC re-wrote for the International Federation of Sports Chiropractic (FICS), which says that the page may not meet "notablity guidelines" and could be deleted. The page already went though and passed AfD, as I understand, and I respectfully ask that this flag at least be amended to something more appropriate. Again, as I do have a COI here, I ask that another editor review this matter. Domo. Drsjpdc (talk) 23:15, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Doo itashimashite. :) I'll look at it, a quick go-over shows at least limited notability established but I'll see if it can be improved. The big thing that helps is significant coverage in multiple reliable sources independent of the organization. -- Atama頭 23:35, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

For the record, the page has not passed an AfD. It failed AfD and then a new article was written. However a speedy deletion nomination following that was turned down. DigitalC (talk) 17:03, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. I wondered about that, I had heard that the article was deleted (from a WP:COIN notice) and was surprised at first to see that it was still around. That clears that up! -- Atama頭 17:15, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Hai, domo....Wakarimashita...Sorry, I thought the new one had gone through AfD... regardless, the sources again raise the issue of what is "reliable"... as one can see from the discussion page, one editor thinks that even an Australian University's article is not reliable, presumably, though I think he did not articulate that, because they have a department of Chiropractic ... and Chiropractic journals, and publications not acceptable, when similar medical medical publications are accepted all the time for medical articles. This is the double standard which which I have a problem. I guess the crux of the issue, is when does the "notability" flag come off? And by whom? Drsjpdc (talk) 19:18, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Actually, school newspapers rarely meet the standards placed at WP:RS. The notability flag can be removed if the article can be shown to meet the requirements I mentioned above. I'm working on that as I have time. Nobody is yet arguing for its deletion, though, so I wouldn't worry about it for now. -- Atama頭 19:34, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

It wasn't a school newspaper, it was the University itself - a highly regarded University at that. If you have the time, your eyes would be appreciated over there though. DigitalC (talk) 15:56, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Drsjpdc, you have repeatedly raised an issue in regards to a double standard about Chiropractic journals not being acceptable. I have yet to see this occur, especially if the journal actually has a high academic standard (not JVSR for example). I haven't seen a double standard. In regards to Dynamic Chiropractic meeting WP:RS, consensus has previously shown it to be reliable, but consensus can change. I doubt it will in this case, but Bongo is certainly within his rights to raise the issue of reliability. The notability tag comes off when there is consensus that the article has met WP:N. So far there is only the input of myself and Bongo, and a suspicious account that has no other edits. There is no rush, as there is no deadline to meet. DigitalC (talk) 15:56, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

User:UkFaith

ArbCom is about to suspend the indefinite block (see their talk page for conditions). User:John Vandenberg tells me that you are prepared to mentor the above user. If this remains so, could you please confirm your acceptance at User talk:UkFaith? Many thanks,  Roger Davies 12:33, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Oops

Sorry about removing your comment when I posted. I have no clue how that happened and didn't realize until I saw your edit summary on my watchlist. cheers. -SpacemanSpiff 01:52, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Hello!

Ya like goats, Atama? Icewedge (talk) 03:29, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't dislike them, I would say that I don't really have an opinion. I do like feta though. -- Atama頭 04:27, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

I happen to like goats a lot.

Ya like to party, Atama?? Icewedge (talk) 05:42, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

I will not party with a goat. I will not party on a boat. (Well, actually I have been at a couple of great parties on boats, but no goats in sight.) -- Atama頭 16:38, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Please rank the following items in terms of importance: Nails, Henry II of Castile, C++, Roy Sullivan, Oklahoma, -0. Icewedge (talk) 18:21, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

That looks like it would be a rough RfA question. Nails would be most important because they hold my house together. C++ would be next, because as prominent a programming language as it is, I don't doubt that Misplaced Pages or portions of the Wiki software were written with it; without it there might not be a Misplaced Pages and I wouldn't be posting this. -0 is probably next in importance, because I'm sure that C++ uses it now and again. Roy Sullivan would be next, because I can only imagine that someone bearing that much misfortune had to be drawing trouble away from others (like a human lightning rod). Of slightly less importance is Henry II, who as an usurping king had brought misfortune to others. Of least importance is Oklahoma, because, well, it's Oklahoma. -- Atama頭 21:56, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Did you know...

• ... that according to Hindu mythology, Balipratipada commemorates the victory of the god Vishnu in his dwarf incarnation Vamana, defeating demon king Bali, and pushing him to the nether world?

I didn't! Icewedge (talk) 22:16, 19 October 2009 (UTC)( some text yanked from Template:Did you know, gotta remain GFDL compliant =\ )

I wasn't aware. I haven't studied Hinduism much beyond the Ramayana. I'm something of a fan of Hanuman (who tried to eat the sun because he thought it was a mango). -- Atama頭 22:27, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Ya like mangos, Atama? Icewedge (talk) 23:05, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Indeed, Mango Madness is my favorite flavor of Snapple! -- Atama頭 23:12, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Ya listen to The Killers ever, Atama? Icewedge (talk) 06:17, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Sure, I like some of their songs. Somebody Told Me was probably the first one I heard on the radio, and I liked that. I don't care for Mr. Brightside, for some reason that song is annoying to me, but When You Were Young is good (I first heard that song when I played Guitar Hero III). -- Atama頭 16:55, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

What would you say is your 2nd favorite movie currently? Icewedge (talk) 01:37, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

That's a tough one. My favorite movie is Dark City, aside from that I'm not sure that I have a second favorite. I tend to judge films based on rewatchability, if I enjoyed something the first time I saw it but not on subsequent viewings I don't consider it a "favorite". Maybe Office Space? That's one I've watched many times and never got tired of. -- Atama頭 16:10, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Would you say that you are well described by the phrase "patriotic hero of the proletariat"? Icewedge (talk) 23:22, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

No, I'm not a hero. Not even a sandwich. -- Atama頭 00:02, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Well met, Atama. Well met indeed. See ya around :) Icewedge (talk) 00:19, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Later, Wedgie! -- Atama頭 02:22, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Why head?

Why do you have "head" in Chinese next to your username in your signature? Netalarmtalk 05:24, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Your suggestion at ANI

If you're willing to get involved at Outlaw motorcycle club, I would not only welcome that but happily step away from the whole thing to reduce potential friction. I have complete faith in you to ensure that it's a balanced result. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 16:37, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks DC, would you mind if I ask your advice on one thing or another on your talk page? You've been involved in the discussion in that article for awhile and might have some insights that I'd miss. I won't bother you unless I have to though. -- Atama頭 16:45, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

I'll offer whatever insight I can. Thanks. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 17:02, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

In regard to your list of disputes, note that the article isn't Motorcycle club but Outlaw motorcycle club. The terms "club" and "gang" are only used interchangeably in the specific context of "outlaw" or "1%er" clubs. This article was split off from Motorcycle club quite recently. No points for guessing who was responsible for that. I think your fourth point could be better worded - I believe even Dbratland admits that the alternate use of the term outlaw is a minority view, so the article as it reads now (in large part to Dbratland's editing) is biased toward that minority definition. I'll jump in at the article talk page if someone says something about me that can't be ignored, but otherwise I'll just watch and post here if required. Thanks. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 17:16, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Recently, Dbratland had asked what would trump WP:NPOV. I think the answer to that is WP:UNDUE. I do understand your point and it will be brought up. Thanks! -- Atama頭 17:48, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Splitting the articles was the result of two separate informal requests for comment: Talk:Motorcycle_club#Proposed_restructuring andTalk:Motorcycle_club#Proposed_revisions.2C_going_once.2C_going_twice.... My proposed revisions were put on workpages and were looked at by members of the motorcycling project and others. The change had consensus, and nobody had a problem with saying "outlaw does not necessarily mean criminal" right at the top. Proxy User (talk · contribs) had been wanting to split them for a long time but was vetoed by a pro-MC editor. Perceptions vary.

I don't want to have to go on defending myself on article talk pages. Why not create an RFC about me? These editors could go to town listing all the proof they have that I'm such a supposedly biased editor, and then I would be free to defend myself. Is it a technical problem? If HooperBandP and Delicious carbuncle need help writng an RFC, help can be found.--Dbratland (talk) 19:20, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Please, for Atama's sake, let's not drag this onto their talk page as well. I'm staying away from both the article and talk page so that my presence isn't an issue. I will comment here if I feel something may have been missed or misunderstood, but that doesn't mean you need to follow with a comment of your own. My comment did not attack you or misrepresent your actions. You are welcome to post your comments on my talk page, but please let's leave Atama's user talk page out of this. Thanks. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 03:25, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Got it. You just go right ahead and run around attacking me anyplace you like and don't worry. --Dbratland (talk) 03:32, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

RFA spam

Thank you for participating in WP:Requests for adminship/Kww 3
Sometimes, being turned back at the door isn't such a bad thing

—Kww(talk) 18:14, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Help with FICS Japanese reference

Atama-san: when the World Congress of Chiropractic was in Tokyo in 1997, (June 6,7,8) the Minister of Health of Japan opened the proceedings (yes I was there too), and both the WFC and the International Federation of Sports Chiropractic were co-sponsors of the congress, which was held under the aegis of the WHO for the first time.... this HAD to be in the Japanese papers at the time.... but I admit to illiteracy in Japanese. can you help me find something in the Tokyo papers? Dozo? Drsjpdc (talk) 22:03, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately my knowledge of Japanese is very limited. The language is particularly difficult to read and write, and being able to read a newspaper article written in Japanese is far beyond my abilities. The best I could come up with as a reference was this, which is at a new site that has editorial oversight but isn't written by journalists, I'm not sure if it counts as a reliable source. I tried! -- Atama頭 02:37, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Appreciate your attempt... thought you were fluent. Good try, I as able to use that as a reference for the Congress in Tokyo anyway... I did find three GOOD THIRD party major media references, and added them: Mexico City's El Excelsior; North Jersey's Bergen Record, and caracas' El Universal... don't you think the silly "notability" flag can now come off"?

_{СДжП,ДС} 23:23, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

No, I claim level 2 competency in my userboxes, which means I have more than a basic understanding but far from a fluent level (which would probably be level 4, 5, or of course "N" (native)). Anyway, yeah with those sources I'll remove the tag so that nobody will claim that it was removed by someone with a conflict of interest. Also I'll go through the older sources and flesh them out a bit so that there are more than just links in the References section. -- Atama頭 23:29, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

i des YO! domo arigato gozaimashita!

_{СДжП,ДС} 03:15, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your work over at the FICS page. It has certainly improved the article. DigitalC (talk) 18:45, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

You're very welcome! -- Atama頭 19:17, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Wave strategy

I notice that you requested this page's deletion by WP:PROD, and the page was duly deleted. This is to notify you that the article has been requested for restoration at WP:DRV today and was duly restored. You may wish to list it at WP:AFD. Stifle (talk) 11:46, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Thank you, I have done so. :) -- Atama頭 16:11, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Re: sockpuppet report

7Oceans is just trying to retaliate for his/her own sockpuppet report. Note how I wasn't even mentioned in the evidence section. Anyways surprise surprise, we're all cleared. -Reconsider the static (talk) 23:56, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

User:Elijah White

I've removed the db tag, since speedy isn't really appropriate for User space except for ads. I have, however, nowiki'ed the categories, as those don't belong in user space. You may want to take this to MfD, though. Who then was a gentleman? (talk) 23:14, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. Sheesh, I knew that and just spaced on it. Consider me chastised. I do think there's a bigger problem with the editor anyway, and brought it up with WP:ANI. -- Atama頭 23:18, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

I sent MaC Renegade to afd, since he isn't listening about speedy deletes. Who then was a gentleman? (talk) 23:23, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

ANI Nipples

I really don't want to know what the barnstar would look like, but thanks for the laughs! DMacks (talk) 06:06, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Warning on Edit War

Good afternoon, Atama. For the last years I have been contributing with the articles about Brazilian history, as you can see on my profile and on my discussion page. However, I decided to help and improve the section about Brazilian history in the article about Brazil. The older text was full os mistakes or was sourced only with website information. I simply replaced it with a much improved text sourced with the works of the most renowned Brazilian (Sérgio Buarque de Holanda, José Murilo de Carvalho, Pedro Calmon, Heitor Lyra, Hélio Vianna, etc...) and British (Charles R. Boxer and Roderick J. Barman) historians. I have not finished yet, as I have worked only on the section about colonial and imperial Brazil (there still the republican era to write) and I am being accused by the user Opinoso of being a monarchist and of being biased. It is unbelievable that book sources about the subject is not good enough and a website is! And I took great care to use many different authors (as you can see on the bibliography). What can I do about it? Thank you very much, - --Lecen (talk) 15:47, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Just a note, I left the same warning on Opinoso's talk page, so I'm not taking either person's side in the issue. I see from the talk page of the article that there has been quite a dispute between the two of you. The discussion did not lead to a resolution, on the contrary it led to an edit war which is not the proper way to handle things. WP:DR shows how disputes should be handled. My suggestion to you two is to seek a third party's opinion. WP:3O shows how to request a third opinion, and I would hope that an outside view may allow you two to come to a compromise. -- Atama頭 15:56, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

FYI - Leatherstocking indefinitely blocked

Technical evidence has come forwards indicating that Leatherstocking is a sockpuppet of the Lyndon LaRouche organization sockpuppet farm. I have indefinitely blocked him. More info on ANI and LS's talk page. Georgewilliamherbert (talk) 22:05, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. Ugh, months of mediation for nothing. I appreciate the notice. -- Atama頭 22:15, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

		The Newyorkbrad Dispute Resolution Barnstar
		Thank you for your mediation efforts. You did a great job of serving as a neutral intermediary and helping to resolve disputes.   Will Beback  talk  03:08, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Gee, two barnstars at once!

Thanks Will. I appreciate it. I can't say that I regret doing the mediation, I suppose anything you do with the best intentions is worth doing. And I include you in that as well, your patience during the whole process was commendable. -- Atama頭 05:48, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Barnstar of Clue

		The Guidance Barnstar
		Because I can, and you deserve it. Xavexgoem (talk) 02:58, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

I saw your posts at AN/I about Brazil. Barn-stars seem to be going out of style, so I'm bringing them back with you! :-) Xavexgoem (talk) 02:58, 28 October 2009 (UTC) Yeah, I know, not the most correct barnstar, but I like the way it looks.

Thank you. :) -- Atama頭 05:50, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Did I forget to thank you? ..

Thank you for participating in my RfA, which passed nearly unanimously with 174 in support, 2 in opposition and 1 neutral votes. Special thanks goes to RegentsPark, Samir and John Carter for their kind nomination and support. I am truly honored by the trust and confidence that the community has placed in me. I thank you for your kind inputs and I will be sincerely looking at the reasons that people opposed me so I can improve in those areas ( including my english ;) ). If you ever need anything please feel free to ask me and I would be happy to help you :). Have a great day ! -- Tinu Cherian - 04:29, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

FYI

You are mentioned a few posts later. You might want to take a peek at the prior posts as well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.147.225.36 (talk) 05:44, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Ugh I avoid that site if I can help it. But I guess if I'm mentioned there I've "made it". For what that's worth. Not that I can say they're wrong about me being gullible though. -- Atama頭 05:53, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Hai Dozo

Atama-san, you have not always agreed with me, but I have to say, you have always been objective and eminently fair in your analyses, I have to admit. Perhaps you would weigh in on a matter that is causing a lot of trouble for me now.

Perhaps the first article in undertook to write was an article about my father (I soon was advised about the COI issue). He held a process patent for sustained release medication delivery and we always assumed that thus, he was the first to invent this.

During his fight to get compensated for his patent, he was attacked by "big pharma" and by people he thought were friends. One of them he always avowed planted a guy in his factory who was subsequently caught by the FDA enforcement people, counterfeiting some name brand medications. Because it was my dad's facility, he took the heat. At one point the prosecutors offered him probation in lieu of jail if he took a plea. He fired his lawyer, and went back before the Judge, where the Prosecutors suddenly forgot their promise, and dad tried to withdraw the plea. The Judge disallowed it and he spent one year in federal prison for this, all to spare his family more aggravation. He was a good man, and a good father. He made another successful business in another field after the rubble of this part of his life.

I NEVER dreamed that all of that would be brought out 40+ years later, and compared to Jeffrey Dahmer in an AfD to keep an article that I would prefer to let die.

The Standards for Bios say that for a criminal to be "notable" the crime has to not only be "major" (this clearly was NOT), but the individual must have been "notable" for something else too.

Although I did advocate hard for his notability based on the patent, at the last moment , I saw that they found another patent (which I am sure he never knew about) that did in fact use a very similar process to accomplish what dad's patent did.

Thus, he was in fact not first in the patent, and thus not "notable" there; thus the "crime" cannot itself be used to keep this article now in : ]

I would appreciate your input.

Domo,

_{СДжП,ДС} 15:10, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Hey, Atama, I saw you were following Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Howard Press (3rd nomination) some, and I would suggest that this AfD is totally screwy. These are the exact kinds of articles that the policies Otterathome wields so well are meant to address. There really is no sourcing for most of this stuff, aside from the two small NY times articles which wouldn't create notability for those criminal events, and those adding the criminal/litigation stuff appear to be just as "involved" in some way as the article creator. I think we got into trouble in this article when people were interpreting the patents without any other sources to vouch for what some thought was evidence of notability due to existence of patents/applications, etc. As you know I'm a pretty fervent inclusionist much of the time, but when the system is abused, we can't ignore it, in my opinion.--Milowent (talk) 19:44, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

I would argue for deletion myself. I agree with people who say it's a mess. But I'm staying away from the discussion to avoid the appearance of impropriety. Drsjpdc didn't specifically ask me to go to the article to ask for deletion, but if I did that someone might see his message above as canvassing. But I'll think about it, maybe it would be best if I did anyway. -- Atama頭 19:48, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

I think its fair to disclose whatever you think needs to be disclosed, and then add your opinion if you'd like. The AfD is getting too long to attract many new voices at this point.--Milowent (talk) 14:02, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Domo. I think that as usual, you did this the right way, and found the courage to voice your opinion. As you apparently noted, I left it entirely up to you. I did NOT ask you to vote a certain way. You COULD have voted against me. I just felt you would see what was right and do what you did. I shall try to emulate your style in the future. _{СДжП,ДС} 19:27, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

EnergyToday has Sunrise Powerlink question

Atama, thank you for your note. I'm a bit confused as to where to respond to you, so I hope this is the right place and venue. I noticed that the San Diego Gas & Electric page is very outdated. The Sunrise Powerlink is a very large and controversial infrastructure project and is the company's largest and most important to ratepayers. Omitting any mention of Sunrise Powerlink does a disservice to readers who wish to know more about San Diego gas & Electric. Is there any way the content I added can be replaced and/or modified to bring it up to Wikipeda standards? Thank you very much, Energytoday (talk) 18:29, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Atama, thanks for your prompt response! I agree we don't want the information to sound promotional, just up-to-date. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Energytoday (talk • contribs) 19:10, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

NAC note

I noticed that at ANI you had said that "Per WP:NAC, it was fine." with regards to the Simspons AFD closure. In fact, NAC lists SNOW closures as inappropriate. Just FYI (I didn't know this either till I looked). Cheers. Abecedare (talk)

You're right. WP:SK says that an "early closure" per WP:SNOW is allowed (though discouraged) but I would assume that non-admin closures would be exempt from that allowance, so I went ahead and struck out my arguments on ANI. Thanks for the correction. :) -- Atama頭 00:54, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

I saw your correction at ANI, but honestly it was not my intention to induce you to do that. Personally, I am not in favor of arguments like,

• A: This closure was wrong because sub-caluse 1 of section 2 of WP:NAC says so.
• B: NAC is not a policy. Its just an essay.
• C: So is Snow ...
• D: blah blah

so I was not trying go down that path myself. I much prefer discussions that are based on the spirit and logic that motivated the policies and guidelines in the first place. For example, if say Japan is nominated for AFD, I don't care if an IP closes it without a single!vote being cast (I know one can say that's due to WP:IAR, but IAR can be deleted and that logic would still hold!).

In this case, given that the AFD was open for only 11 hours, <10 people had commented on this popular topic (inlcuding 2 who favored deletion, no policy based argument had been made for keeping, nor any attempts made to source the article or establish its notability (through independent sources), and given that "episodes and characters" are a hot-button issue on wikipedia, a SNOW close even by an admin would have been unjustified IMO. Just my 2c. FWIW, my preference is to find 1-2 more independent sources to show that the topic is notable, and then to retain this article. Abecedare (talk) 01:07, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

I understand. My original point was that it was a bad idea. I've seen numerous AfDs where a half a dozen people "vote" one way, then someone comes along and posts some really excellent argument and/or discovery and are followed by a dozen who agree (including a few of the original people changing their minds). I only argued that technically it wasn't against policy. There are a lot of things that a person shouldn't do that aren't against policy. :) -- Atama頭 02:37, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Overuse of WP:Point

WP:POINT requires disruption to the encyclopedia. Filing a sockpuppet request against a sockpuppet when the prior request was closed without conclusion does not appear to be pointy, and in any case, you should WP:AGF that my motive is what I said it was - to get PennySeven removed from the recall request for not being a user in good standing. If I were to prove my point experimentally as opposed to making it via process, I would start removing all of the stuff that PennySeven put in articles about cost accounting - a topic I know nothing about, in an attempt to edit war and get PennySeven blocked so that he would no longer be in good standing and would be removed from the request. Certainly, you can tell the difference. The overuse of WP:POINT to mean "disagress with me about how to approach disagreemens," is really beneath. I request that you retract. Hipocrite (talk) 20:50, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Wasting time with a useless sockpuppet report that you know very well isn't going to resolve anything is what I would consider to be disruptive. I don't see good faith in your actions, so I won't assume it. Saying that you would choose a different disruptive behavior if you truly wished to make a point isn't very compelling. As WP:POINT states, "Discussion is the preferred means for articulating problems with policies or the way they are implemented." If you don't like the way the older SPI was concluded you should discuss matters with the administrator who closed the report. What you have done fits in perfectly with the examples given in the guideline, it could even be added as another example.

• If someone closes a sockpuppet investigation with a conclusion you disagree with...

• do discuss the matter with the administrator who closed the report.
• do not open another report immediately afterward with no additional evidence to get a different result.

In addition, I stated that you were being "pointy" which means that you were at the least on the verge of violating WP:POINT. I stand by what I've said. -- Atama頭 21:04, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

On another note, I have looked at PennySeven's recent contributions and I do agree that this is a troublesome user. I just don't agree with making another sockpuppet report. -- Atama頭 21:12, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

I wash my hands of it, and you. When P7 scalps a good admin, it's on your head. Period. Hipocrite (talk) 21:14, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't really have anyone I would call a "friend" on Misplaced Pages (for whatever reason) but Sarek of Vulcan is at least someone I have a great deal of respect for, and I certainly despise what PennySeven is trying to do at Misplaced Pages:Administrator review/SarekOfVulcan. That has a lot to do with my opinion that this is a troublesome user. If you wanted to bring up a complaint at ANI or elsewhere I'd support you. -- Atama頭 21:21, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

reverted your edit

Hey, I have reverted your edit at Aryan Khan (Afghan actor) because he is not the son of Shahrukh Khan or Guri Khan. Aryan Khan is another actor from Afghanistan. (Ketabtoon (talk) 22:47, 29 October 2009 (UTC))

Thank you for that, I had the two confused. :) -- Atama頭 22:49, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

It is not a problem. It happens when you have so many biographies from all over the world. (Ketabtoon (talk) 22:59, 29 October 2009 (UTC))

Ray Joseph Cormier

Thank you for your participation in the Afd discussion of the subject. According to Misplaced Pages article traffic statistics, 128 Wikipedians viewed the article since the Afd tag but only 7 offered a comment and vote.

This in no way can be considered ¨canvassing¨ but since Misplaced Pages holds independent, reliable sources in such high regard as the basis for any article, I have to set the record straight. Without exercising any critical thought, you based your comment on someone else´s false impressions.

You might not be a Canadian, but The Vancouver Sun, The Edmonton Journal, The Calgary Herald, The Ottawa Citizen, Le Droit, Le Soliel, The Kansas City Times, Maclean´s Magazine and others not listed, ARE NOT as KillerChihuahua says, ¨His sources are small newspapers¨, but the major dailies in Canada´s major Cities spread over several years from coast to coast, including The Whitehorse Star in the Yukon.

Just to accept ¨If you take a look, the "news" seems to be mostly Caused a fuss at the local courthouse and got arrested for Disorderly Conduct kind of thing.¨ as a reflection of the reality, and basing your conclusion on that, is unworthy of a serious Wikipedian. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but it should be based on fact, not emotion. DoDaCanaDa (talk) 16:06, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Nehara Pieris

Hello, Atama … FYI, the {{AfD}} tag has been removed from Nehara Pieris (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) twice in the past 24 hours, once by Nimonline (talk · contribs), and once by a WP:SPA anon from Sri Lanka (the most recent of several from the 124.43.xxx.xxx range) … it looks like Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Nehara Pieris will have to be relisted to get more feedback, but I thought that as the nom, I should notify you in case you missed the changes on your Watchlist (I have got to get a life! :-) … Happy Editing! — 138.88.125.101 (talk · contribs) _{16:44, 31 October 2009 (UTC)}

		The Barnstar of Diligence
		For your recent diligent work at WP:COIN (which I had not visited until today): thank you. hamiltonstone (talk) 05:54, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you very much. :) -- Atama頭 06:22, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Westbang

The PC World review is a copy of the MacWorld review so I removed it. Joe Chill (talk) 21:44, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know, I should have looked closer at it. That stands to reason because both magazines have the same publisher. -- Atama頭 21:45, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Help in various tasks

Hey there! Thank you for responding at WP:COI/N. I have registered 2.5 years ago to Misplaced Pages, but I had a Wikibreak of over one year. It made me to forget alot of things. I am Very familiar with reverting vandalism, and fairly familiar with CSD, but still I have alot to learn again (like COI). I was wondering that you seem like very experienced user, so is it okay to ask you if I have questions. I need to learn everything again as I just recently came back.  Ilyushka88  talk  21:54, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Ask me anything you wish, and don't worry about asking too much. I don't mind at all. And welcome back! -- Atama頭 21:55, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you! happy editing.  Ilyushka88  talk  21:57, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Apologies

Sorry I did not get back to you on the RFA where you requested more input prior to you posting. To be more specific it is a general feeling of community involvement, the editor does not do the community oriented things such as editing talk pages RFAs and the like that I would like to see from an admin. RP459 (talk) 15:06, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Cold Stone

Atama, I wanted to thank you for reading the Cold Stone Creamery page and writing some neutral responses to the back-and-forth between editor Jeremy and myself. However, I really must protest his actions. He came to that page and made major edits, some of them listing incorrect information, with no citations. When I pointed this out, rather than correct the information or apologize, he defended the rights of editors to edit pages whenever they saw fit - but he went and changed his incorrect information with more incorrect information, and changed the citation, which was incorrect as well. When I pointed this out, he lectured me on wiki etiquette and threatened that if I didn't stop my thread he would call in the admins on me. I have every right to debate a point in the discussion page of an article, and I was doing no editing of the main article myself, at all. I am not going to back down from a threat when I know another editor is wrong.

Well, he obviously "reported" me. He posted something on my personal page about being in the admin file now and that I am "required to respond" I clicked on the link but I just see a list of people and things and I am not one of them. It seems at least three editors showed up on the Cold Stone page to "moderate" but no one has said I have done anything wrong. Now, do i have a bad report somewhere because of this? I looked at his page and he seems to be a well decorated wiki editor, but I don't think that gives anyone carte blanche in denouncing other editors on a whim and running to wiki moderators and filling reports on innocent people like myself. What is the penalty for threatening another editor with calling in moderators and then the moderators finding nothing wrong with your actions?

I want a guarantee from someone that there isn't a negative report on me out there in the wiki administrative area.

I would like someone to review what he posted on my personal page, that combined with what he wrote on the Cold Stone page, it is clearly intimidation and is nothing short of, "don't question me or argue with me or I will report you. I don't have to answer to you, and you have to be nice to me or you get reported."

Thanks again. Akuvar (talk) 05:04, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

RfD nomination of Jam hot

I have nominated Jam hot (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) for discussion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at the discussion page. Thank you. Jezhotwells (talk) 15:33, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

Mediation in Gibraltar

Hi Atama, I'm back and ready to take part in the process. Best regards and sorry for the delay --Ecemaml (talk) 23:11, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

Iwaterpolo

Hi, can you help me and look at this edit. Most of it is incredibly nice, a new distribution is added to Misplaced Pages. But then there is the link to and plug for SOCR. I'm just not sure what to say. PDBailey (talk) 01:48, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

I removed the SOCR reference, since he has provided a different reference for the information already given. I've also cleaned up a couple of other things in the article. -- Atama頭 18:47, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

AfD nomination of Victor I. Petrik

An article that you have been involved in editing, Victor I. Petrik, has been listed for deletion. If you are interested in the deletion discussion, please participate by adding your comments at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Victor I. Petrik. Thank you.

Please contact me if you're unsure why you received this message. Kinoq (talk) 13:46, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Your expertise is required here

Hi there Atama, I created a page about Dr Zhongjun Cao and it has attracted the deletion tag almost immediatly. Dr Zhongjun Cao was a victim of a Curry bashing murder in Melbourne Australia last year. The attack attracted worldwide media attention plus condemnation. There is also a continuing saga where the family of Dr Zhongjun Cao are conducting a petition at what they obviously see as the leniency of the sentencings. This in no way influences my .... hmm, enthusiasm for having this article here. I actually only discovered the petition part when expanding the article as it's still in it's infancy if you like. Could you please pop over and have a look and feel free to comment on it and see what you think. Thanks (Jimmy Heat (talk) 12:54, 11 November 2009 (UTC))

Clarification on citations with possible COI

Regarding this revision, I did include several citations, one of which I had contributed to. You removed this citation arguing "Author has a self proclaimed COI ". According to the COI self-citation guidelines, self-citation is allowed, as long as it is appropriate and not excessive. Could you please clarify your reasoning? You are absolutely correct that there were 2 citations for the specific fact that was referenced. I was certainly not trying to promote my work, but gave what I thought was an appropriate broad NPOV citation. If eliminating self-citations is a standard Misplaced Pages policy, this is certainly fine. Thanks. Iwaterpolo (talk) 20:35, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I very much appreciate the information you're adding to Misplaced Pages. It's helpful and I would hate for it to stop, and I would argue against anyone who would want to prevent you from continuing to improve the encyclopedia. But the volume of citations you have done to SOCR could be considered "excessive". In cases where it's not explicitly necessary (in that you can reference something other than SOCR, as you've done in the negative multinomial distribution article) I suggest that you not do so, or at least that you suggest it on the talk page of the article first. -- Atama頭 20:42, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I forgot to mention, thank you for declaring your affiliation when you created the article. That will go a long way toward helping people assume that your edits are done in good faith (I believe that they are). -- Atama頭 20:43, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

User talk:Jwesley78

Thank you. I appreciate your skillful assistance. (The cursing was a response to Jwesley's repeated uncivil attacks; everyone has their breaking point.) I hope User:Jwesley78 will be respecting this. I've never really understood the Japanese non-confrontational dispute method, but I think, looking at your edits here, on Jwesley78's talk page, etc., I've just witnessed it in action, and expect it to see it work. Thank you for that as well. --98.248.113.11 (talk) 20:52, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

You're welcome. I'm actually not Japanese, I just studied it for a number of years in high school. My dispute method is something I've learned on Misplaced Pages from reading policies and making mistakes. Thank you for your kind words. -- Atama頭 21:26, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I was not being "uncivil". I'd like somebody to be specific about where I went wrong. The only thing I know I've done wrong is state "vandalism" in the comments of my edits on the IP's talk page. Other than that I've tried to be friendly. Here is the state I left the user's talk page in. Here is the state I left the Groupon talk page. Where on these pages was I uncivil? Jwesley₇₈ 21:28, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

We actually have a civility policy, WP:CIVIL, that tries to show what is meant by uncivil behavior. Often when people say "uncivil" on Misplaced Pages, that doesn't mean raging like a maniac (which a lack of civility often equates to in the "real world"), it just means violating what is laid out in that policy and similar behavior. Uncivil behavior can include inappropriate edit summaries (specifically mentioned in the policy) and reverting somebody who is blanking their user talk page, see WP:WARNING where it states that "repeatedly restoring warnings does nothing but antagonize users". You've said on the IP's talk page that "any non-constructive edit" can be considered vandalism, but that's absolutely untrue. Reading WP:VAN, it is strongly stated that the edits must be deliberately disruptive, and says, "Even harmful edits that are not explicitly made in bad faith are not vandalism." The policy tries to make it very clear that the edits that the IP were making were not vandalism.

You've made mistakes, and that's okay. I screw up all the time myself on Misplaced Pages. Everyone is allowed to make mistakes now and again. While you have a legitimate dispute with the IP in regards to content at the Groupon article, labeling the edits as vandalism and even going so far as to report to the vandalism noticeboard was wrong to do. If I was the one who had done that, I would apologize and move on, which is what I suggest you do as well. -- Atama頭 21:47, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Atama, four times (123 and 4) he has added a "Final Warning" to my talk page. I would call that uncivil, if for no other reason that violating the 3 revert rule. Jwesley₇₈ 21:58, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

• And for an IP, he sure knows his way around a Misplaced Pages AFD discussion! Jwesley₇₈ 22:04, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Oh boy, I wasn't aware of that. That's certainly not good. Technically, that's enough to get a person blocked. Just a note to you, Jwesley78, even tendentious repeated additions of warnings aren't vandalism but they're certainly bad. Again, you should both just walk away here, or somebody is going to get blocked eventually. :( And as to knowing their way around AfDs, the funny thing about IP editors is that you never know how much experience they have. The IP could have been editing for many years, there's no way to trace it. There's no reason to assume anything nefarious about that. -- Atama頭 22:06, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I added a final warning ONCE, and immediately changed it to be non-final. Much later, I added a second (non-template) final warning. But I should not have given him a taste of his own medicine. I followed you to AFD, by the way. And no, I'm not new here. I've opened up an ANI, as J won't walk away or stop the abuse. --98.248.113.11 (talk) 23:56, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the update. -- Atama頭 23:57, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Invitation to participate in SecurePoll feedback and workshop

As you participated in the recent Audit Subcommittee election, or in one of two requests for comment that relate to the use of SecurePoll for elections on this project, you are invited to participate in the SecurePoll feedback and workshop. Your comments, suggestions and observations are welcome.

For the Arbitration Committee,
Risker (talk) 08:01, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Adminship

Hi there. Just for my curiosity, I read a few months back that you thought about running for admin. Are you still thinking about that? Regards SoWhy 18:19, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, I was. I've been a proposed deletion patroller for awhile now and I think I have enough experience that if I was given adminship I could start helping clear out expired prods. I worry about my main article space contributions, I am not great at expanding articles. I've tried getting both iPhone and World of Warcraft to GA and haven't succeeded yet. But if nominated I'd run, certainly. -- Atama頭 20:10, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

FYI I would support that nomination... RP459 (talk) 20:12, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

Hmm, yes, content work is usually sought at AFD although I know from my experience that it's not vital. When I ran for admin, I had not a single article credit and only started some writing after several months on the "job". You could try DYK to show that you know how to write articles but it's, as I said, not vital imho. Your approach to speedy and proposed deletion shows that you are aware that content improvement is preferable to deletion and should be done whenever possible. Also, you have more than 2000 deleted contributions, probably almost all of them in the article main space(?). Also, you have an interest and experience in both dispute resolution and WP:COI/N (a place that needs more admins iirc). I would offer to review you and to nominate you if I find nothing concerning. Regards SoWhy 20:26, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

I have done a lot of work with proposed deletions (adding prod-2 tags to show support, double-checking their eligibility, adding more justification to deletion) and generally those articles get deleted. I also edited many World of Warcraft-related articles when I was a new editor that were later deleted (rightfully so, though it was painful at the time to see them go). Thank you for your offer and I would very much welcome a review and a nomination if you feel it is merited. (Oh, and I have been wanting to bluelink Yokohama Foreign General Cemetery and submit it for DYK but I haven't gotten to that yet.) -- Atama頭 21:05, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

Go for it whenever you feel ready and if you have any questions, just ask. Regards SoWhy 21:28, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

(Intervention from talk page stalker) - Go for it! I too was very hesitant, having only ever started 3 articles, and never having improved anything above sourced stub level; but having declared it up front, so far (touch wood) no one has opposed me because of lack of article work. I think the RfA community has got less demanding in this respect. Cheers, JohnCD (talk) 21:43, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

iPod Touch images discussion

In case you're interested, I'm having a friendly discussion with User:Seraphimblade about File:Ipod Touch 1st Generation.JPG and File:IPod Touch 2.0.png. They claim fair use on the grounds that a photograph or rendering without the icons would not convey enough information to serve its purpose, and have been nominated for deletion. I think that the renderings IPod Touch 1G.svg are 2G are as good as we're going to get. Personally, I'm starting to favor deletion, but I wanted for everyone to get a chance to weigh in first. Bear in mind that it will probably set a precedent for what we can do at iPhone, and good luck with your RfA! HereToHelp 05:17, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

Just thought I would thank you...

Noticing your RfA reminded me of our interaction at Talk:World of Warcraft, and the thought occured to me that I should thank you for your kind words towards me! We do need more friendship amongst editors after all, and the discussions with all editors ended happily at the end of the discussion. Best of luck with your RfA! --Taelus (talk) 12:26, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

Mitchell Muncy

I wikified the Mitchell Muncy article that you created as part of WP:NEWT and added some references. -- Eastmain (talk) 17:17, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

Gib

Hi, Atama. I think we are losing some focus in the capture of Gibraltar discussion in the Gibraltar main article. In part, it is surely my fault, as I thought we had an agreement on what to put in the History of Gibraltar article and edited it - which unfortunately has fired up a new line of discussion. I think it would be very nice if you could come by and tried to make some neutral recap or something. Thank you very much indeed for your time. I think we really need a mediator to cool things down and help all of us focus on content and sources. --Imalbornoz (talk) 08:19, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

OK. I think that we'll be able to reach a consensus in the History main article much more easily than in the Gibraltar article, as we don't have the constraint of space there, and almost all (maybe even all) facts are more or less accepted by all parts (it's more an issue with which terms to use). Thanks a lot for your effort (I think it is very much needed), I guess we are not an easy gang to mediate with. --Imalbornoz (talk) 17:46, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Fribbulus Xax's RfA

Thanks, Atama, for supporting me in my RFA. It passed unanimously. I am very grateful of your input – if you have any further comments, let me know! Fribbulus Xax (talk) 12:10, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

COI

So, from this edit and other policies I can infer that I can add articles about myself, family members, close friends, companies that I work for, not state the COI and as long as I appear largely productive, that is all fine. Don't you think the policy should say that more explicitly, that COI is really a minor offense and is really adds nothing over other Misplaced Pages policies? I think that would be much more helpful for other editors when looking at COI edits and trying to figure out what to do. Answer: just keep the articles in good shape and don't worry about it. PDBailey (talk) 15:17, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

WP:COI is not a policy. It is a set of guidelines designed to help identify editors who may have a conflict of interest and has suggestions on how an editor with a conflict of interest may participate in an article when other editors object to the edits they've made. As the guideline says, "If you do write an article on an area in which you are personally involved, be sure to write in a neutral tone and cite reliable, third-party published sources, and beware of unintentional bias." If an editor with a COI causes no disruption, there's little reason to insist that they stop editing an article. While assisting people at the COI noticeboard, I've seen a few cases where editors not only were productive at articles that presented a conflict of interest, but they improved articles from stubs to GAs. -- Atama頭 16:56, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

I forgot to add, that an editor who edits disruptively with an undisclosed COI can get a lot of negative attention drawn to them. When such an editor is "found out", other editors lose good faith and I usually see their disruptions dealt with more harshly. It's not that a COI doesn't matter, but it's only when that COI is coupled with disruption that it becomes a problem. -- Atama頭 17:07, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

I see, thanks. I guess that is clear from statements like, "If you contribute to Misplaced Pages on behalf of clients, you owe it to both them and the encyclopedia to make very sure you understand the standards for content here, and do not insert promotional material." PDBailey (talk) 19:37, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Remember using edit summaries

I'd hate to oppose your RFA for that PS: If you forget them, turn on the "warn me if I forget the summary" feature in your preferences :-) Regards SoWhy 16:48, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

That's called bumping the Enter key while trying to type. I hope having a bad keyboard doesn't hurt me! (The keyboard I have is the kind with an enter key that's twice as tall as a normal one.) -- Atama頭 16:55, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Oh, and I did change my preferences to stop that, I should have done that a long time ago because that's not the first time I goofed up like that. Thanks for the tip! -- Atama頭 16:58, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

We learn every day, my padawan.

Glad I could remind you of something. I know the situation you describe, the preferences option and the qSig user script both saved me countless times when I accidentally was about to save a page. :-) Regards SoWhy 17:06, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

WP:NEWT

Hi Atama,

Like other editors I'm somewhat unhappy with the current WP:NEWT project, though I can see that it's based on good intentions. Further I believe you participated in WP:NEWT in a spirit of good faith and as such I do not believe that participation should prevent the Misplaced Pages from being denied the excellent Administrator that you undoubtedly would make. As such I will not be joining those who are changing their !votes at your RfA. Crafty (talk) 20:19, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Loosely in regards to NEWT, can I ask if you intend to fix the BLP, Mitchell Muncy, you created as a test? Its a bit disturbing to me that you chose to intentionally write a poor article about a living person. I understand the importance of treating new users and their article attempts with respect, but playing around with BLPs seems a poor experiment. Anyways, I didn't want to stubbify it further if you intended to fix the issue. Thanks and happy editing! Shell 20:48, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I do intend to fix it up. It the first BLP I created (and I think the second article that I created from scratch, rather than expanding an existing stub). I redlinked it some time ago in the Banned Books Week article that uses Muncy as a reference and had planned for awhile to turn it blue. I'll try to clean it up somewhat today if I can, thanks. -- Atama頭 20:56, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Awesome - thanks! Shell 21:04, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Hi - I wanted to express my admiration for you in regards to WP:NEWT - it was a refreshingly original idea, and creative thinking about ways to diagnose probable problems at Misplaced Pages, particularly ones that draw out more hard data and good anecdotes, are definitely to be commended. It seems this particular project went off the rails because of particular problems that were unforseen - it is hard for experienced editors to simulate decent contributions by inexperienced ones, so as a result some participants erred on the side of disruption. Also, a dynamic evolved where editors competed to embarass new page patrollers, which was very unfortunate. But I want to encourage you to keep trying - we should be WP:BOLD in working to improve Misplaced Pages, and the type of creative spark that creates things like WP:NEWT is rare and should not be allowed to fail. Best, Ray 06:58, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you Ray, I appreciate that. If someone were to ask me what my worst fault was as a Wikipedian, I'd say that I'm not bold enough. As I get more experience, though, I've been trying to improve that. -- Atama頭 08:03, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Congratulations

Or maybe that should be condolences. :) In any case, I'm glad the NEWT thing did not sink your RFA. I believe that you had good intentions going in, and I don't think it was a major lapse in judgment. Gigs (talk) 22:40, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you. It's not official yet but barring some disaster in the next half hour or so I think it will pass. I appreciate your note about NEWT, after the comments of others and much thought I personally think that NEWT was a mistake with good intentions (both the project, and my involvement in the project). The one good thing about NEWT is that I think I really did feel what it was like for a bold new editor to have his efforts undone and I have more empathy for them (I was very much not bold as a newbie and my mistakes were minor and didn't draw much attention). NEWT also has increased my interest in NPP, and I think I might take a hand at it (keeping in mind what I learned from NEWT). But I've turned my attention away from NEWT itself (which seems to have died now anyway). Again, thanks for your kind words. -- Atama頭 22:49, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Congrats! あたまごいいですよ！　 7  23:39, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Doomo arigatoo, Nana-san. :) I appreciate it. -- Atama頭 23:41, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Congrats

— Rlevse • Talk • 23:51, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Mazel Tov!

On your appointment as an Administrator! May you always Protect the Wrong Version. Crafty (talk) 00:13, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

I'll do my best. :) Thanks Crafty! -- Atama頭 00:14, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Yatta! Impressive RFA, I'm glad it turned out the way it did, and I hope you'll have time to keep up your participation at RFA too, we need you! - Dank (push to talk) 00:33, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

I'm sure I will, thanks. :) -- Atama頭 00:35, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Congaratulations. :)- Sinneed 01:18, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Awesome RFA, Congratz! RP459 (talk) 01:44, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Congrats! Well deserved. Good fortune going ahead, and may your finger never slip over the deletion button at the main page or the sandbox. Ray 02:24, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks Sinn and RP and Ray! -- Atama頭 06:53, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Congratulations on passing the RFA and welcome to SWAT?. I am very sorry to see that the NEWT thing had this impact but I think you will find it comforting though that no one could find any reason to oppose you apart from this minor involvement which I think shows that your contributions are otherwise excellent. So have fun with your new buttons and if you have any questions at all on adminship, do not hesitate to ask me at any time. Regards SoWhy 10:03, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the shirt, and everything else! (And why is there a bullseye on the back of it?) -- Atama頭 10:51, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

*whisper* "Damn, he noticed, what we do, what we do?!" Err...that's nothing to worry about. It's just the official adminship logo for the back of shirts! Can't have that ol' mop on everything! "phew! That was close..." Regards SoWhy 11:03, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Congratulations. Four days in, I find having a mop has changed my view of things much more than I expected - and it is even harder to retain some semblance of a life IRL! JohnCD (talk) 11:46, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Congratulations, I wish you the best of luck and experiences as you move forward. --Taelus (talk) 11:58, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

I'm a bit late, but well done! GedUK  08:33, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you all, I appreciate your support, and I promise to use the tools with care (I'll try not to hit my thumb with a hammer). -- Atama頭 15:20, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Gibraltar

Would you mind dropping by the Gibraltar page, where the compromise text from Friday is now being ignored, a new text being proposed and three Spanish editors standing around congratulating one another and ignoring everyone else. Justin talk 21:49, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

I've been reading it and trying to figure out how to jump in. I'll comment shortly. :) -- Atama頭 21:55, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

UNINDENT

You might also care to look at History of Gibraltar and the tendentious edits going on there, such as changing the start of the 2nd World War from 1939 to 1940, and removing sources claiming they don't support the edit but not explaining why. You may also care to note my comment on Encemaml's talk page that I'm not going to get into a conflict with him anymore. The edits today seem to me to be deliberately disruptive to get a rise. Justin talk 22:13, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

		The Barnstar of Diplomacy
		Belated thanks for the diplomatic approach towards the previous issues at Vivek Kundra and University of Queensland-Reconsider the static (talk) 11:49, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you RtS. :) -- Atama頭 16:53, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Request

Is there anything you can do to intervene with Ecemaml?

Yesterday he was changing the date of the start of WW2. Today he is adding goat herders as notable people from Gibraltar. In both cases edit warring to keep them. Justin talk 00:02, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

I'm supposed to stay impartial as a mediator. If it has gotten to the point where an editor is being disruptive then mediation might have to be stopped. I've watchlisted the History article and I'll take a look to see if Ecemaml has been violating the 3RR rule. -- Atama頭 00:27, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

OK thats not a problem, I really wasn't asking you to take sides, I guess I didn't express myself too well. More of a request to remind all editors that in agreeing to mediation we agreed not to disrupt the article.

Today its the Gibraltar article and now Cremallera has just reverted, I wouldn't care but now they're edit warring to kept text riddled with English and Grammar errors. I really do think this is now getting disruptive and they're starting to ignore what is being said on the talk page. No strike that, they are ignoring the talk page.

Would you mind awfully asking a neutral admin to look at the last couple of days activities? For now I'm going to take a 2 day wikibreak as I kinda feel they're deliberately trying to wind me up and I do have a temper. Justin talk 00:40, 26 November 2009 (UTC)