Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 08:31, 30 December 2005

Welcome to my talk page. Please sign and date your entries by inserting -- ~~~~ at the end.
Start a new talk topic.

Please post new messages at the bottom of my talk page. Please use headlines when starting new talk topics. Thank you.

Discussion of my editing at Alternative Medicine

Your latest edit to the Alternative medicine page appears to be a copy/paste, and maybe a copyvio. I've reverted it, could you perhaps write up a summary, and reference to the study itstead? Ronabop 16:31, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Looks much more consistent with the rest of the page now. :-) Ronabop 23:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks! I'm still learning and appreciate the helpful suggestions. Now I need help with the Alternative medicine section about "Problems with the label "alternative"". It's far too shallow and needs supporting arguments, but AED doesn't seem to think so. -- Fyslee 06:46, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Check the talk archives and article history for some of the discussions on the labels used, but let me warn you, the archives and history are *filled* with acrimonious and contentious debates on the labels used (CAM, C/AM, AM, etc.). Some of the old POV warriors may have left, but to drag out an old cliché, "there be monsters there". I guess if nothing else, the history of that article can teach you a lot about the difficult sides of wikipedia. :-) Ronabop 07:59, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

I'm not at all surprised...;-) As the Assistant Listmaster for the Healthfraud Discussion List, I'm used to dealing with this stuff daily, and often feel we are dealing with cultists, rather than people who use rational arguments. There are some who do stick to reason and evidence, but not many. If the subject interests you, you're welcome to join.....;-) -- Fyslee 09:28, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

If you want to know what I think, please feel free to ask rather than speculate. Misplaced Pages is an encyclopedia, so copying and pasting abstracts or quotes is a lazy, inappropriate way to build an article. By referencing "POV warriors" and "monsters", I'm not sure if Ronabop is referring to me or not, but I'm quite sure an examination of the article and Talk page histories there will show that there are no double standards in my edits. I would suggest paraphrasing the information you would like included with appropriate references. AED 17:26, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Hi AED,

As a newcomer here, I appreciate all the help I can get. I can see what you mean about too many quotes, etc. I have a suggested solution. I'm not sure if it's proper to do it, so let me know what you think.

How about if I create another page for the quotes and references, and then just leave a link to that page in the article?

I would also appreciate your help with a creating a sandbox (see below). -- Fyslee 19:22, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Per WP:WWIN, Misplaced Pages is not the proper place for a collection of quotes. If you're interested in doing that, check out Wikiquote for links to the Wikiquote websites. References and citations should go at the bottom of the article in a section entitled "References". I've created a sandbox for you at User:Fyslee/Sandbox. Keep up the good work. AED 19:44, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the sandbox! -- Fyslee 08:31, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

The reference section is for references, not for collecting quotations. If there is a certain point you are attempting to make, try posting the quote(s) on the Talk page. If we allow one POV to post quotes, then the other POV must be allowed to do the same. The article then becomes a list of quotes rather than an encyclopedia article. AED 21:14, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

I have looked at Wikiquote and Wikisource, and am not sure which one is most appropriate, if at all.

Maybe I'll try putting them in the "References" section, as you suggest. I hope AED finds that acceptable....;-)

As it is now, the section about "Problems with the label "alternative"" - while quite true - is opinion without any documentation. An encyclopedia deserves better than that. While the Dawkins quote is a good one, it doesn't quite fit the bill. (It should be at the top in a "Definition" section.) I have better quotes for documentation.

In fact, is there a standard template to use for such articles? At SkepticWiki we use one for this type of subject, the ACM Template copied here: Fyslee 21:19, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

START TEMPLATE

Definition

Origins

Quotations

Discussion

Related Topics

• Alternative and Complementary Medicine

References

Comments

For all contributors:

• Try to keep the "Definition" as straight and encyclopaedic in style as possible. Use the "Discussion" section for editorialising

• Use the references section for footnotes to books and other sources

END TEMPLATE

My Tools

• User:Fyslee/Sandbox

Current works in progress:

1. New Quackbusters entry

2. Alternative medicine section about "Problems with the label "alternative"". It needs resources as documentation for the current (true) opinion.

SCAM

Recently, an article you wrote, SCAM, was deleted. The information in the article was insufficient to make it notable enough to qualify for an article. Feel free to recreate the article after a few weeks if you feel you can include new information asserting its notability. Don't forget to cite your sources. Thanks for your contributions to Misplaced Pages!--File Éireann 23:48, 29 December 2005 (UTC)