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Revision as of 19:10, 30 December 2009

December 30

NEW NOMINATIONS

College men's basketball head coaches by team in the United States

large group nom underway, pls hang on until it is complete. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:57, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Are you planning on listing all of them, why not stop there, theres baseball manager, head football coaches, nba coaches, etc. You could really get the deletion log rolling.--Levineps (talk) 19:10, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Baltimore Bullets scouts

Category:Baltimore Bullets scouts - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Overclassification. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:59, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• For this and all the other sports-related categories you've just nominated here, is any upmerging appropriate, or just outright deletion? Seeing the likely merge targets will help others better evaluate why these particular categories are unnecessary subdivisions or intersections. Additionally, the category creator had a habit of removing many categories he apparently considered redundant when he would add his own, so all of that should be reviewed. No opinion on the merits of this CFD otherwise. postdlf (talk) 18:06, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Milwaukee Bucks owners

Category:Milwaukee Bucks owners - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Overclassification. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:58, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Many other teams in the NBA and other sports have an owners page.--Levineps (talk) 13:20, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Detroit Shock executives

Category:Detroit Shock executives - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Overclassification. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:57, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Jewish American rappers

Category:Jewish American rappers - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Overclassification. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Keep well-defined and defining category. Alansohn (talk) 15:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Jewish American atheists

Category:Jewish American atheists - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Too strange. Very vague. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:54, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete - I agree with the nominator. Too obscure a topic. Lord Spongefrog, (I am Czar of all Russias!) 14:01, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Keep - I think this divides up the expansive American Jews category and being an athiest is related to religion so it's not just a random category
• Keep despite the apparent oxymoron, this is a defining characteristic. Alansohn (talk) 15:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Two concerns.

1. First, is this just a group of Jewish Americans who happen to be atheists, making this an arbitrary intersection of two unrelated characteristics, or are their Jewish Americanism and atheism substantially related and connected? The answer to that may be complicated given the dual nature of Jewishness as an ethnicity and a religion.
2. Second, will the existence of this category segregate these individuals either within either of the category structures that intersect here? In other words, will they only be categorized as Jewish Americans through their atheism, and will they only be categorized as atheists through their Jewish Americanism? Some may view the solution to that as permitting nonexclusive categorization, such as putting an individual in both this category and Category:American atheists. If that's to be the solution, it should be noted that the category creator removed all such categories he considered "redundant" when populating this one, all of which should be reviewed in any event given that editor's ban from edits category space. postdlf (talk) 17:34, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete People by religious belief is subcategorized by nationality, not ethnicity, so these individuals should be double-listed in "American atheists" and in "Jewish Americans."- choster (talk) 18:15, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
  • This would then be the first such ethnic subcategory of Category:American atheists, and also the first religious subcategory of Category:American Jews, in which it is inexplicably not included. postdlf (talk) 18:47, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Upmerge to Category:American atheists and Category:Jewish atheists per choster as an unnecessary triple-intersection of people by nationality, ethnicity, and religious belief. We have category trees for people by nationality and religion, by religion and nationality, and even by religion and occupation for a limited number of occupations to which religion is directly relevant, but no Category:People by ethnicity and religion or Category:People by ethnicity, nationality and religion. –BLACK FALCON 18:44, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Historical events occurring near Christmastime

Category:Historical events occurring near Christmastime - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Delete. Kind of a vague, flexible category. What is "near Christmastime"? (Judging by the store displays at Wal-Mart when I lived in the U.S. and Canada, I think it begins shortly after Labor Day.) For that matter, what is "Christmastime"? Dec. 25 only? Dec. 25 plus the day before and day after? Give or take 3 days, or a week? Or does it go all the way to Epiphany? What about the "orthodox Christmas" issue? Do things happening around January 6/7 work for this category if it happened in an "orthodox" country? Do we categorize everything that happened on December 25 into this category? It seems that this is why we have the articles December 25 and those for the other days in December and January. How does "near" fit into how we define the date range? ... (I could go on, but I would, as usual, be belabouring the point.) Good Ol’factory 11:52, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete- the liturgical Christmas season runs for 12 days following Christmas... so, "Christmastime"? Advent all the way to Orthodox Epiphany? Why not just "Historical Events that Occurred in December?" Wal-Mart Christmas that runs from All Saints Day until the merchandise is gone? There's no standard for inclusion, and no objective basis for having this category. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 12:14, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• 'Delete per nom and per Bradjamestown. Vague and undefining. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:30, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Presidents of Georgia Alliance of African American Attorneys

Category:Presidents of Georgia Alliance of African American Attorneys - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Delete: The list in the category text is already in the main article. Further, none of these people appear to have articles to add to this category, resulting in a one-article category. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 10:46, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete. Creator of the category (as well as the main article) is among those listed, a possible conflict of interest. Kevin Forsyth (talk) 13:22, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Delete. We are very unlikely to ever need a category for this. The subject may be notable but he still shouldn't be writing about an organisation he is involved in. I suggest somebody tries to clean up his article. I am just going to tag it a bit. --DanielRigal (talk) 13:33, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Delete. All non-notable. Kittybrewster ☎ 16:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Ngo Dinh Diem

Propose renaming Category:Ngo Dinh Diem to Category:Ngô Đình Diệm

Nominator's rationale: Debate. This is more of a "test case"-type debate I want to see than anything else. I'm confused with how we treat diacritics in category names. The main article is at Ngô Đình Diệm; the category is without diacritics. So, in a situation like this: (1) do we add the diacritics to the category?; (1a) if no, why not?; (2) if no, does that mean we should be removing diacritics from other categories that have them? (2a) if no, why not? And if the answers to (1) and (2) are both "no": (3) how do we reconcile this? Good Ol’factory 08:57, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Rename per nom, but recreate as a category redirect. We decided (discussion) that "appropriate conversion of hyphens into en-dashes or vice versa" should be performed and even codified it as a speedy renaming criterion. I can't think of a good reason for us not to apply the same principle to a different special character, though I will state that I have reservations about making "appropriate conversions into titles with diacritics" a speedy renaming criterion (mostly so that issues involving romanisation and diacritics in native-language spelling versus common English usage can receive full discussion). A few months ago, I probably would have opposed this proposed change; however, I am content to follow the consensus reached in the linked discussion. –BLACK FALCON 09:20, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Opposed as impossible to type. A category redirect could be placed in reverse, so if anyone copied the article title it'll still work, but I don't think diacritics in categories are necessary. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 11:54, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
  • You answered (1) and (1a); can you also answer (2), (2a), and (3)? I'm not challenging you, I'm just curious as how we work this more globally. Good Ol’factory 11:59, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
    • Why not just create the category redirects from the plain version when the diacritics are used; from the diacritics version when the plain version is used, and just accept that the status quo is logically inconsistent. Changing all these really strikes me as more work than it is worth, when category redirects can be used to achieve the benefits of both the accuracy of diacritics, and the ease of not having to deal with them. That way the whole question becomes a non-issue to editors and a bot will do all the work once the system is set up. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 12:26, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
      • Yes, that could work; I don't see why some of the "real" categories should be diacritic-filled and others diacritic-less, though. If we adopted one way or the other, it would be much easier to implement in the long run. Good Ol’factory 12:30, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Support Rename to match full title of parent article, with a redirect available. Alansohn (talk) 15:57, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Dance disambiguation pages

Category:Dance disambiguation pages - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: -- Delete. Disambiguation pages do not need, and generally cannot be categorised. All dab pages are categorised in Category:Disambiguation pages. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 08:51, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Ballet disambiguation pages

Category:Ballet disambiguation pages - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Disambiguation pages do not need, and generally cannot be categorised. All dab pages are categorised in Category:Disambiguation pages. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 08:49, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Prince protégés

Category:Prince protégés - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Delete. Kind of like a "students of ..." category. We generally don't categorize people (or groups) by mentoring relationship or connection to a notable person. Good Ol’factory 04:51, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete If all the artists were notable primarily for their association with Prince— and indeed the category charter specifies those "mentored" by him— I don't think it would be unreasonable. In practice, however, it is difficult to distinguish "influence" from "inspiration" from "association" from "collaboration" from "tutelage" from "mentorship," and indeed the contents of the category seem to include any artist who has ever worked with him on anything at any time. So I would list the truly intrinsically tied articles like The New Power Generation directly in the parent, and remove the category from the others.- choster (talk) 18:23, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Post-disco

Category:Post-disco - Template:Lc1

Category:Post-disco music

Category:Post-disco musicians

Category:Post-disco groups

Category:Post-disco albums

Category:Post-disco songs

Nominator's rationale: Delete all. "Categorizations should generally be uncontroversial; if the category's topic is likely to spark controversy then a list article is likely to be more appropriate." I believe the controversy of the topic as shown in this AfD proves that categorization is not the right way to go here. The genre is suspect as are many of the inclusions within this category. Wolfer68 (talk) 04:50, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Edgar Degas

Category:Edgar Degas - Template:Lc1

Nominator's rationale: Delete. Unless populated, only creates an extra level of categorization before Category:Works by Edgar Degas is reached. Either populate with non-works articles or delete. I'm not sure what it could be populated with, otherwise I would do it. Good Ol’factory 04:31, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Presidents of the Swazi Senate

Propose renaming Category:Presidents of the Swazi Senate to Category:Presidents of the Senate of Swaziland

Nominator's rationale: Rename. Propose renaming to match main articles Senate of Swaziland and List of Presidents of the Senate of Swaziland. Good Ol’factory 00:20, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

• Rename per nominator. Looks uncontroversial, but it doesn't fit the speedy criteria. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:40, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Rename per nominator. Can't anticipate opposition since the list-article is so named. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 11:56, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
• Support Rename to match title of parent article. Alansohn (talk) 15:58, 30 December 2009 (UTC)