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	{{Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Ann Schlee}}		{{Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Ann Schlee}}

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Arbitrarily0 03:10, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Ian Mackenzie-Kerr

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No claim of notability (unless one counts the obituary on The Independent). Just a good book designer doing his job. Damiens.rf 15:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. I do count an obituary in The Independent as a mark of notability. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 20:58, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete I do not. Alio The Fool 21:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment. There is also an obituary in The Guardian. I would argue that obituaries in two of the UK's leading quality national newspapers is a serious indication of notability. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 19:34, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete, a non-notable person who did his job for 50 years. I don't know that there's a bright line on whether obituaries make someone notable; but when a person gets an obituary like this without having had any significant coverage during his life I can't believe it amounts to very much. A beloved, but otherwise completely low-profile, local figure may get an obituary upon death, and while WP:BLP1E doesn't, strictly speaking, apply to a deceased person, I think the principle is worth remembering: "If reliable sources cover the person only in the context of a single event, and if that person otherwise remains, or is likely to remain, a low-profile individual, we should generally avoid having an article on them." To my thinking, that pretty much applies to someone's death as well. Glenfarclas (talk) 22:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment. A professionally written and published obituary is not about someone's death. It is about their life and their contribution to society, especially in the context of articles in national newspapers such as The Guardian and The Independent. So I strongly disagree with you conclusion above with respect to obituaries. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 19:41, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Google book search up top shows plenty of results, the first one being him, showing a picture of one of the book covers he did, his name mentioned. How often does that happen? The other books that mention his work, are probably about him also, it not too common of a name. Dream Focus 00:31, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep - after finding this, this (click on View all), and this. "Just a good book designer" is one thing; a good book designer featured in books about book design is another. Dori ❦ (Talk ❖ Contribs ❖ Review) ❦ 05:39, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

With all due respect, what you've found is (1) a six-page chapter he contributed to a non-notable book, (2) another book where he's thanked in the acknowledgements and mentioned in one paragraph, and (3) a book where he's quoted briefly on a single page about being a typography student, and never mentioned again. I just can't believe this stacks up to notability—and under what, WP:CREATIVE? These short mentions hardly show that he's "regarded as an important figure or is widely cited by peers or successors." In fact the paucity, in a highly specialized field like typography and book design, would tend to show the opposite. Glenfarclas (talk) 06:40, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

What you may have missed: ref #1 also mentions him on the back cover as a contributor, ref #2 has 3 mentions of him, not 2 (Google book search may not want to display the discussion of him on pg 1481, but it still counts), and ref #3 describes him as having "had a long and distinguished career as a book designer."
When a book on book designers describes someone as having had "a long and distinguished career," I'm happy to take their word for it. Dori ❦ (Talk ❖ Contribs ❖ Review) ❦ 03:50, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. per RS and V. Kittybrewster ☎ 11:02, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
~~Delete~~ Doesn't appear to have significant coverage by reliable independent sources. One obituary doesn't make an article. --Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 12:05, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I believe WP:CREATIVE #3 applies. There is a body of work (many books designed by him) with reviews (in multiple obituaries – The Guardian and The Independent – and other journals, books, etc.). I have added some more references. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 17:18, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Change to keep - At the time of my initial comment, I was only aware of the one obituary. --Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 05:08, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Quite obviously notable from the sources given, particularly national press obituaries. Ty 21:10, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletions. – Ty 21:11, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Obits in national papers are not typicaly writen merely about "beloved, but otherwise completely low-profile, local figure"s. The coverage in books about book design would alone be enough to establish notability IMO. Together I think the result is clear. DES 22:00, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Absurd nomination - we do not discount substantial sources for no reason. Colonel Warden (talk) 22:10, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I believe that WP:BEFORE was not followed correctly in this case. In particular, under section 3, it would have been appropriate to add a {{notability}} tag before proposing deletion for this article. I would request that the original proposer follows WP:BEFORE before nominating any further AfDs in future. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 12:20, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Arbitrarily0 03:12, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Nick Meers

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Notability. From the article, it seems it's just a good photographer doing his work. Main claim of notability is that "The National Trust holds many of his photographs", but it unfortunately goes unsourced. Having "produced photographs for over 30 books" doesn't seems astonishing. Good photographer? Yes. Notable? Not from what is said on the article. Damiens.rf 15:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Photography-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 17:57, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. With 30+ published books to his name (including on the front cover as a co-author, not just as a contributor), I believe he is notable and worthy of inclusion on Misplaced Pages. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 18:00, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
- Note that it's not that he have written 30+ books. It's that his photographs have been used in 30+ books , and I don't think this is enough to make a professional photographer notable. --Damiens.rf 18:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
  - Many of the books (e.g., the books listed in the article) are books where he is a co-author, not just a contributor. There is a big difference. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 23:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I have added a reference for the National Trust. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 18:37, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Is it notable? The National Trust holds many photographs of many artist. --Damiens.rf 18:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
- You implicitly suggested that it be sourced (see above) and references are always helpful for verifiability. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 23:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep This photographer seems to be notable as demonstrated by the large number of books of his photography he has published and which are widely available through online bookstores such as Barnes and Noble and Amazon. He has not just provided the photography for a book - he is one of the authors and the books are about his photography - there is a big difference. There is also press coverage of his books: see and Jenafalt (talk) 19:43, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. At present I am dubious over the sources being used here. A search of amazon or barnes & noble does not show that someone is notable, particularly when you look at the sales ranks of the books. It may be an indication of notability, but it doesn't meet any of the recommendations of WP:CREATIVE. Likewise, having taken some pictures for the National Trust website may be an indication of notability but does not prove it. The basic problem at that moment is that there is no reliable independent source for biographical information about the person. If there are more reviews of his work, or if it can be shown that he is widely referenced in photography circles then we might get close to shpowing WP:N. I'm willing to be convinced, but at the moment I'm not seeing it. Quantpole (talk) 00:18, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment. I believe WP:CREATIVE #3 applies. There is a body of work with multiple reviews. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 16:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
  - Like I said, I'm willing to be convinced, but at the moment there is a review of about 4 sentences from the independent, and one hidden behind a pay wall (and neither are even used as references for any text in the article, so I have no idea how in depth the chicago tribune review is). Please, if there are multiple reviews, then either add them to the article or stick them here so they can be assessed. Quantpole (talk) 21:32, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Google news search up top shows articles mentioning him and his photographs. Dream Focus 00:33, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Nomination: Having "produced photographs for over 30 books" doesn't seems astonishing. Good photographer? Yes. Notable? Not from what is said on the article. How true, how very true. Meers' photographs are not in the permanent collection of the V&A (a large photographic collection that's conveniently searchable online). They may well not be in any other museum or art collection either. No Turner Prize nomination for Nick. The highest price at abebooks.com right now for one of his books is $100 (cf $7500 for Tillmans and $20,220 for Cartier-Bresson). Not even any space on my shelves for his books. He's not an artiste but a highly competent craftsman, serving Weidenfeld & Nicolson and the National Trust and others with what they and the public want. (And it's not bad either; cf the luridly colored, saccharine landscapes of some great, great photographic landscape hacks who have companies sell their stuff by the square metre.) But anyway, he's not notable. Neither, I dare say, are most of the thousands of actors and the like who have articles in Misplaced Pages. But just as Misplaced Pages doesn't limit its thespian coverage to the conventionally great (Jean Gabin), the great "characters" (Shelley Duvall), and the mere heart-throbs (Keanu Reeves), but instead allows squillions of articles (mostly poorly sourced, it must be said) on entirely humdrum actors, and does so to the general benefit of the interested public, so Misplaced Pages would be better if it had many more modest, well sourced articles on workmanlike photographers. Producing photographs for over 30 books is not astonishing, but neither is it easy. I can't be bothered to examine the recent history of this article, but as it is now it deserves to stay; indeed, I wish there were more like it. Keep. -- Hoary (talk) 08:03, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep He has an established reputation in his field as evidenced by the number of books where he is the co/author and cumulative other mentions/reviews. Those working in the visual arts seem to have a higher bar applied to them than that in e.g. WP:BAND or WP:ATHLETE. This should not be the case. Ty 21:43, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletions. – Ty 21:44, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Seems both notable and encyclopedic...Modernist (talk) 02:21, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I believe that WP:BEFORE was not followed correctly in this case. In particular, under section 3, it would have been appropriate to add a {{notability}} tag before proposing deletion for this article. I would request that the original proposer follows WP:BEFORE before nominating any further AfDs in future. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 12:20, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was speedy delete per WP:CSD#G12 (unambiguous copyright violation) by Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) —David Eppstein (talk) 04:02, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Ann Schlee

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I'm not completely convinced this writer is notable. The only one claim to notability is being once nominated for the "Booker Prize". Is this enough? Also, (although unrelated to AFD or notability concerns) the whole of the article's text appears in her bio at "http://www.davidhigham.co.uk/html/Clients/Schlee". Who's the copyright violator. Damiens.rf 15:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 17:56, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. See the Misplaced Pages article at Man Booker Prize: "The winner of the Booker Prize is generally assured of international renown and success and, for this reason, the prize is of great significance for the book trade. It is also a mark of distinction for authors to be nominated for the Booker longlist or selected for inclusion in the shortlist." Here is a review of Ask me No Questions: http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-27192021_ITM I see that the article has been deleted. This is probably one of the cases where an alleged copyvio is best dealt with by stubbing the article and removing the copyvio text, rather than by deleting the article outright. – Eastmain (talk) 01:11, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Arbitrarily0 03:13, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Nick Schlee

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It seems this artist haven't reached notability yet. His main claims of notability are having won two medals from the "Royal Drawing Society" (is this notable? I don't know) and having some of his word held by some universities and museums, but everything goes without a source. Damiens.rf 15:01, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep. Schlee's work has been widely exhibited and is held in collections of museums and universities. See WP:ARTIST section 4(d). I believe Schlee meets the criteria. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 21:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep The Google news search only mentions his works were in a museum, that notable enough. Google book search, second page, reveals he was featured in "Artists in Britain since 1945, Volume 2‎". So some consider him a notable artist. Dream Focus 00:37, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep per all of the above. Werner Heisenberg (talk) 01:44, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep per all of above. Schlee is indeed in The Dictionary of Artists in Britain Since 1945, which is a reputable source (not a "vanity" publication). Misplaced Pages follows sources. Ty 01:50, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- I'm sure there are many artist there. --Damiens.rf 13:59, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Seems notable and encyclopedic...Modernist (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy Keep The nomination seems uncertain ("I don't know") and there has been no attempt to discuss the matter at the article's talk page per WP:BEFORE. Colonel Warden (talk) 22:14, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I believe that WP:BEFORE was not followed correctly in this case. In particular, under section 3, it would have been appropriate to add a {{notability}} tag before proposing deletion for this article. I would request that the original proposer follows WP:BEFORE before nominating any further AfDs in future. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 12:17, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 17:36, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Jive Software

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this article is terrible, has practically no references, and has been tagged for months without being cleaned upElimccargar (talk) 23:27, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep - nomination itemises reasons for improving the article, not deleting it. --Escape Orbit 23:31, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep reliable sources are easily found, and deletion should not be used for articles simply needing cleanup. Further, this is likely a pointy deletion in response to this. I gave the nominator some advice about deletion of this article recently. tedder (talk) 23:43, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Oregon-related deletion discussions. -- tedder (talk) 23:44, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment Nomination seems pointy based on Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Blogtronix (2nd nomination)--Jac16888 00:46, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep - plenty of sources out there, gets covered in the regional paper The Oregonian all the time, ditto with the Portland Business Journal. Needs clean-up, not a deletion. Aboutmovies (talk) 04:08, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Has received extensive coverage in The New York Times (see: ), among other sources, and is obviously notable. Steven Walling 08:16, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 14:47, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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Note: This debate has been included in the list of Business-related deletion discussions. - Smerdis of Tlön (talk) 15:07, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, but very, very weakly. This calls itself a software company in the enterprise social-networking business. It does not appear to produce well known products under its own brand, or market them to the general public. It isn't notable in the non-technical sense, and makes no claim to technical or historical importance, or any other credible claim to public note. We either need stricter standards of a sort that would exclude behind the scenes businesses like this, or else abandon any pretense to excluding spam and throw open the gates to articles written by marketing consultants. This sort of thing just does not belong. But if PC World and the New York Times have published stories about it, it probably meets the consensus for current standards. - Smerdis of Tlön (talk) 15:13, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment. I don't think the current nomination is really WP:POINT-y either. It is, instead, a symptom of the sort of thing we're always going to face by allowing articles about businesses that are "notable" under WP:GNG but not really. "My competitor has an article; why shouldn't the business that interests me?" When you're dealing with May-fly business startups in software space, coverage in adequate sources may be a bit of a crap-shoot, or at least a function of your marketing people's connections. - Smerdis of Tlön (talk) 15:26, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep - It made The New York Times, as pointed out above. The. New. York. Times. Yes, that New York Times. Samboy (talk) 16:06, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was nomination withdrawn (non-admin close). Cnilep (talk) 21:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Leopold Frankenberger, Jr.

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Redirect to Alois Hitler#Leopold Frankenberger where he has a paragraph. He is the possible grandfather of Adolf Hitler, not notable in his own right. Boleyn (talk) 17:54, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 14:47, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Withdraw nomination for the moment while redirect and merge discussions play out. Boleyn (talk) 21:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC) By the way, the creator of this article is indef blocked as a vandal and sockpuppet. Alio The Fool 21:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was merge into World Pyro Olympics. This was a reasonable result because the event has not established its own notability but exists in the context of a notable series of competitions. Non-admin closure per my discretion. Chutznik (talk) 20:25, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Philippines international pyromusical competition

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Future event - no evidence of notability. — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 14:45, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Philippines-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 17:54, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment - Bizarre, but it's the Philippines (sorry, Honey), and it's about two months premature. Userfy? Bearian (talk) 04:29, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Arbitrarily0 20:44, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Weak Keep It fails WP:CRYSTAL for less than another month, why not leave it alone and see what happens? RadManCF (talk) 23:45, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
Perhaps merge into World Pyro Olympics. --Pink Bull 05:41, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. NW (Talk) 20:21, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Great Junction Street

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Appears to be an average city street; not notable. Nyttend (talk) 14:15, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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Comment: Coverage here: Polarpanda (talk) 18:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete unless substantially expanded in Afd period. The street appears to be the start of the A901 road, but its article A901 road (Great Britain) is only a mere redirect to a list. Peterkingiron (talk) 21:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Arbitrarily0 20:45, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep Appears to be an average drive-by nomination made without following the due diligence of our deletion process. I have expanded the article by reference to some of the numerous sources. Colonel Warden (talk) 17:40, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Kindly assume good faith on the part of the nominator. Nyttend (talk) 04:17, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep "The street was the site of a triumphal arch which was constructed for the reception of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert in 1842." Google Book search for it and "triumphal arch" reveals some notable mention of it for that prominent feature. Dream Focus 13:36, 24 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Reasonably detailed article with ample room for expansion. I added an image, but more are available. --DThomsen8 (talk) 03:52, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. Reasonable road article with historical context adding notability. -- Banjeboi 07:01, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was speedy delete per WP:CSD#G11. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Bradley Aircraft

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A company that's "...not none in the industry due to most of the projects remaining secret,..." is not likely to be very notable. This is especially true as they are reported to be giving them away "...but not yet selling them in any form." I am unable to find any references to this company but please note they should not be confused with Bradley Aerospace which does appear to be a real company. Enter CambridgeBayWeather, waits for audience applause, not a sausage 12:57, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I am also nominating the following related page:

Delete Directory listing shows that it apparently has an annual revenue of $52,000 and employs a staff of approximately 1. Polargeo (talk) 13:42, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was no consensus. Arbitrarily0 11:49, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

John Xintavelonis

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unreferenced stub. fails WP:BIO and WP:ENT. no significant third party coverage LibStar (talk) 07:11, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment transcluded at Articles for Deletion at this timestamp, was incorrectly listed previously. --Taelus (talk) 12:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete No significant third party coverage, well maybe a small amount at a local Tasmania level. Does not meet WP:ENT, really scraping it for significant roles in multiple notable productions. For example yes the lion king is notable but here he is in the Melbourne version of the Lion King (which may not be independently notable) where he operated and I assume spoke for the puppet Pumbaa. This appears to be the biggest role of his career to date. Polargeo (talk) 14:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
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Weak keep and improve article. Appears to have a notability for stagework in Australia. , Schmidt, 00:15, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, just. He was the 10th most newsworthy Tasmanian in 2008: 1, not that that's saying much in and of itself, but it does give insight into the significance of the coverage he has received. His multiple significant roles in notable stage shows, such as the Lion King and Billy Elliott would marginally get him across WP:ENT. --Mkativerata (talk) 06:09, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Arbitrarily0 11:42, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Hindu Culture - Facts

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Procedural nomination. Article was proposed for deletion, after previously having a prod contested. Nominators concerns listed as:

"Opinion essay, completely unsourced WP:OR" Taelus (talk) 12:26, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Merge to the Hindu marriage article (which is entitled Vivāha), and add sources or a bibliography to that article. This is, as noted, an essay, and it's overly long because of comments like "Traditions and customs are very much necessary for a society to flourish. A Civilization is said to be complete only when it has certain customs and traditions." A lot of the commentary is the author's opinion ("This proves that ancient men knew today's scientific proofs - Men are intelligent and agressive than Women, While Women have more memory power and emotional than Men; and that Women are easy victims of evil by nature." Nevertheless, there are some facts among these facts. Mandsford (talk) 13:19, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete there are usually facts in any personal essay. I see no use in merging one long unreferenced (and poorly named) article with another long unreferenced article. We end up with an extremely long unreferenced article which is very likely to repeat information within itself. In other words a total mess. Polargeo (talk) 14:24, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete the only info that can be considered factual is the quotes from 2 texts, which are public domain, but are used here to promote original research. i suppose someone could put them in wikiquote, but do we even know the quotes are accurate. absolute, total, unsalvageable mess, title makes it a pov fork from other articles on hindu culture.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 16:21, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
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Delete Apart from OR, this looks like a case of WP:ADVOCACY from the anti-498A/feminism people.--Sodabottle (talk) 17:37, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete per WP:NOR, WP:NOT#OR 1 & 3, WP:SOAP 1 & 2, WP:POVFORK. Author states on talk page: "This article... is the general opinion of every individual born in India;" that's quite a statement. User:Mercurywoodrose said it best, "absolute, total, unsalvageable mess." Wine Guy Talk 18:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. Sorry for the procedurally incorrect PROD, I'll try harder to avoid that in the future. I unfortunately didn't think then that there was anything to save, and I agree with the comments above to the same effect. Glenfarclas (talk) 20:37, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: Essay. Joe Chill (talk) 22:34, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: As per above. -- (User) Mb (Talk) 11:42, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: No good reasons to keep it :-) -- Rajith Mohan 06:24, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Arbitrarily0 11:23, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Busy Bee Mall

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Procedural nomination, was proposed for deletion with a prod previously declined in the history. Concern listed by nominator was:

"Non-notable former local flea market." Taelus (talk) 12:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment Might be worth a mention in Massapequa Park, New York. We have a new author who has knowledge to assist in adding content to the article about that Long Island town. Although I don't think this merits its own separate article, I encourage the author to use the info in an existing page. Mandsford (talk) 13:24, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete as non-notable. I would encourage user to add minor information along with sources to appropriate higher level articles as mentioned above. Polargeo (talk) 14:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete per nom. Racepacket (talk) 16:21, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
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Delete, I PRODded this when I saw it roll by the end of Special:NewPages, sorry I didn't notice it had been PRODded before. Anyway, I stand by the view I expressed ("Non-notable former local flea market"), whether under WP:GNG or the failed proposal Misplaced Pages:Notability (shopping centers). Thanks for putting this here, Taaelus. Glenfarclas (talk) 18:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Weak delete - There actually is an article featuring the mall in the New York Times. However, beyond that, I can only incidental mentions. -- Whpq (talk) 17:06, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete Other than the New York Times article, I could not find any other notable sources mentioning this market/mall. --FaceMash (talk) 23:48, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 17:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

List of words censored by search engines in the People's Republic_of_China

AfDs for this article:

Articles for deletion/List of words censored by search engines in the People's Republic of China

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Per WP:IINFO and a lack of notability. Additionally, this list is nearly impossible to be updated in time. Most of the content are out-of-date. Jimmy Xu (talk) 11:12, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Strong Keep "Misplaced Pages is not censored" either. Censorship practices are most certainly notable, as are methods of detecting dissidence in a police state. The only valid objection that I see here is that some of these may be out of date. Even the fact that certain words were censored in the past is notable, regardless of what nation it's taken place in. Here in the United States, when we were at war with Germany, sauerkraut was referred to in the press as "liberty cabbage". More recently was the silly "freedom fries" that some people took seriously. Mandsford (talk) 13:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. I have added a References section to avoid original research accusations. Let's source the article, even though it's trivially easy to verify the claims. -- Dandv (talk) 13:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Strong Keep. You can easily find tons of sources if you try to search "Search engine+censorship" or some similar keywords in some Chinese search engines, say google.cn. Maybe people outside China don't give a fuck about this, but I don't think that would make the article fail WP:N. Blodance (talk) 14:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep This may be a job for the cleanup crew. There is no good reason to delete. Polargeo (talk) 14:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment I may say that this list is uncompleted and wouldn't complete at any time (unless Chinese government stop its censorship). If the leading section is kept and the article is moved to some name like "Search engines censorship in the People's Republic of China" that would be fine, but if this is still a list, maybe it's not very suitable. BTW, apologies for my English.--Jimmy Xu (talk) 14:56, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Internet censorship in the People's Republic of China exists. Is it not useful to have an article on what is censored as long as it is well sourced it should not matter if it changes or is never completeable. The topic could be narrowed if editors thought the inclusion criteria were too broad and the list was getting out of control. Polargeo (talk) 15:24, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep per above. Grue 15:35, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Strong keep per Blodance. Racepacket (talk) 16:22, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NJA (t/c) 11:01, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Outkasted Outlawz

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Non-notable unreleased album with little or no media coverage of substance. Fails WP:NALBUM. Prod removed without comment. TheJazzDalek (talk) 10:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Albums and songs-related deletion discussions. —TheJazzDalek (talk) 10:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete or merge with one of the artists - I can't find any sources on this, which would suggest a delete, but if there are any out there I haven't been able to pick up a merge seems more appropriate (especially given that it's only a sentence or two long). Panyd 12:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete, no coverage outside of blogs and YouTube. Does not yet meet WP:NALBUMS or WP:GNG. J04n(talk page) 14:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: I can't find significant coverage for this album. Joe Chill (talk) 00:56, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. Lacks significant third party coverage. JBsupreme (talk) 19:03, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Nomination withdrawn non-admin closure Bradjamesbrown (talk) 13:39, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Prohibited degree of kinship

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This doesn't appear notable (WP:N). Incest is notable, but I can't find any direct coverage of this as stated. Khin2718 (talk) 08:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Social science-related deletion discussions.
Delete If any sources were to be found, the information could be merged to Incest. As it stands now, delete and redirect to Incest. Wine Guy Talk 10:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC) Delete !vote struck, looks fine in restored form. Wine Guy Talk 19:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy Delete - Article on Consanguinity and Incest already exists, no reason to have another one discussing the exact same thing. Panyd 12:34, 13 January 2010 (UTC) Article expansion makes this vote void. Panyd 12:59, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep I think we should judge the article on the content that it had last week before the nominator pared it down to its current form . Mandsford (talk) 13:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep The extensive coverage of this phrase and the legal implications of it mean that this is not by any means a deletion issue. Polargeo (talk) 15:13, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I can't find any direct coverage of this phrase (as specified in WP:N) as an independent topic, only sources using it as a synonym for incest or containing trivial mentions in text. Khin2718 (talk) 19:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

In other words, someone needs to find sources showing this is notable, not just a random phrase or redundant.Khin2718 (talk) 19:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Revert and keep. Sources cited in text are sources. You don't get to gut an article and then claim it should be deleted as unsourced. - Smerdis of Tlön (talk) 15:27, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I have restored the article to it's pre nominator form and then restored the AfD tag. I thought this the quickest way to do this. Polargeo (talk) 15:35, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The article had been merged into incest and cousin marriage.Khin2718 (talk) 18:42, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. It's not the same as incest. I found the article a useful reference for some genealogy research that I was doing. I don't understand why people would claim that it's not notable. Bluewave (talk) 16:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I'm sorry to hear that. Hope you're ok. Polargeo (talk) 18:01, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Humor is one of those things you have to be careful with, a lesson I've learned the hard way over the years. Clearly, that comment was intended as a harmless joke, but I'd be pissed if it had been directed at me. Mandsford (talk) 19:22, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

It's useful is an argument we're supposed to avoid, unless you can find sources showing notability. Khin2718 (talk) 19:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment The term is also used in laws regarding nepotism. I've added this usage to the article (with ref.); there appears to be plenty of usage of the term in this sense . Wine Guy Talk 20:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

That may be a saving argument. However, all should note that this page still needs major cleanup, including removal of the material merged into cousin marriage, incest and Affinity (canon law) and removal of false statements. More material on nepotism would be especially good, if anyone wants to make that contribution.

The editor who nominated this article for deletion wishes to Withdraw the nomination.
Uninvolved editors are asked to review the debate and close it as Nomination Withdrawn.
{{{1}}} Thanks, Khin2718 (talk) 00:15, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. This certainly needs to be expanded, but the concept is used in the law of Wills. I could find dozens of notable cases about the topic. Bearian (talk) 04:33, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. I expanded out a small set of examples regarding jury service, but I'm no expert. Edward Vielmetti (talk) 07:49, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep I don't see anything wrong with the original long version . Someone decided to just chop it up and merge bits into other articles, and do mass deleting. Will the information moved to other articles remain there? Or will someone there decide it isn't necessary? Why isn't it valid to show what all the major religions and cultures of the world think of this? And what does the jury selection policy of one state in one nation have to do with anything? This article was originally about forbidden marriage. Perhaps a new title would be appropriate for it. Kinship is defined is "relationship" in the Webster online dictionary. Prohibited degree of kinship could include homosexual relationships, which are prohibited in some religions and nations. Listing that homosexual marriages are forbidden, would fit in the new article, but no reason to include that all homosexual activity is illegal, that a different article. There may still be laws against mentally ill people marrying in some areas. The article can be developed. Dream Focus 08:11, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Also, prohibited kinship/relationship could involve the age of the victim. Just listing how it is forbidden to marry someone based on being a relative, having the same last name even if not related, age seen as too young in that society, homosexuality, or mental illness, would be a fine article. And some religious people are banned from marrying anyone who has been excommunicated by their church. Some might have laws against marrying someone from a different ethnic group(there is still some nations out there which are very racist). Dream Focus 08:18, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Nomination withdrawn. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 11:30, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Robert Rønnes

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~~No indication of notability found at independent, reliable sources -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 08:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)~~

Withdrawing nomination - the opposes have convinced me that this should not be deleted, although the article does need work -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 11:30, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. —-- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 09:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. —-- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 09:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment A search on Google Scholar yielded no hits; Google Books either had his own books, or minor mentions; Google News has no hits; Google News Archive has 6 hits, none of them major. I cannot find evidence of notability as required by both WP:N and WP:MUSIC -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 09:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

To be honest, I'm not sure what you expected to find regarding a person notable as a performing classical musician in Google Scholar, Books or News. Wine Guy Talk 10:40, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep In my opinion this subject meets WP:MUSICBIO, as he is not only orchestral player, but also a composer, chamber musician, and soloist recording for a notable label - Naxos . See also his profile at the Music Information Centre Norway and the Norwegian Academy of Music.--Vejvančický (talk) 09:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment The CD'S were released by BIS, an independent classical label focusing on Scandinavian and Baltic composers. The label has its production under Naxos. --Vejvančický (talk) 10:12, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep Meets WP:MUSICBIO 5. Has released two or more albums on a major label or one of the more important indie labels (i.e., an independent label with a history of more than a few years and a roster of performers, many of which are notable). He is the featured soloist on two recordings made by BIS Records . With a little bit of research for WP:RS, I think he would pass criteria 6 as well ...musician who has been a member of two or more independently notable ensembles. The article requires sources, not deletion. Wine Guy Talk 10:40, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NJA (t/c) 11:01, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Heath high school soccer

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Non-notable per WP:NSPORT, unreferenced. Prod contested by creator. MuffledThud (talk) 08:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. —MuffledThud (talk) 08:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy Delete A7. Wine Guy Talk 10:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy Delete A7, not notable enough to be merged. Panyd 12:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment Most high school athletic teams are not notable enough for their own separate article. Some of the achievements noted herein can be mentioned in a shorter form in the Heath High School article, but the usual practice is to include a link to webpages. School pride notwithstanding, if we were to allow team rosters and game results for one school, we would have to do it for every school's sports team in every sport. Mandsford (talk) 13:45, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete, but not speedily (this doesn't really fall under A7) — clearly not a notable topic. Nyttend (talk) 14:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I am admittedly a bit rusty on CSD/AfD; it's been a while since I was a regular participant. So that I may better understand the guideline, could you explain how this does not fall under A7, An article about a real...organization (e.g. band, club, company, etc., except schools),...that does not indicate why its subject is important or significant. Wine Guy Talk 18:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment I think that Wine Guy is right in suggesting that this could be speedily deleted; in practice, people usually differ about whether an article's subject is important or significant. To interpret the policy in the most strict construction of the words, an article about Abraham Lincoln could be speedily deleted by an administrator if it didn't include a sentence saying "Abraham Lincoln was significant." Mandsford (talk) 19:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete – Unnotable. I could see a sentence or two on the team in the school's article, but a full page with things like a full roster and description of a controversial match (shockingly, every call went against Heath) isn't appropriate. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 02:09, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete - as per above. GoCuse44 (talk) 05:21, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football related deletions. ChrisTheDude (talk) 12:39, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete - non-notable junior club, no significance or coverage.--ClubOranje 21:13, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. Non-notable junior club. --Carioca (talk) 18:06, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. The overall concept of humans being killed by dogs is notable, the individual entries on the list of course need to be properly sourced but do not need to be notable in and of themselves. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:48, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

List of people killed by dogs in the United States

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Entries in Lists of people articles should have individual notability. Not a single entry in this list has its own article. (There's Diane Whipple but she is not currently on the list.) Also, given that we don't have accurate sources that tells us the total number of fatal attacks per year there is no way to verify the completeness of the list. This would normally not be a problem but the article uses statistics from the list to explicitly point out the over-representation of Pit Bulls in fatal attacks. This is original research. Any useful non-list info should go into Dog attack. Dodo bird (talk) 02:30, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Keep or Move The proposed deletion misses the point of the guideline.

"Many articles contain (or stand alone as) lists of people. Inclusion within stand-alone lists should be determined by the notability criteria above"

The "Notability criteria above" state,

"Within Misplaced Pages, notability is an inclusion criterion based on the encyclopedic suitability of an article topic. The topic of an article should be notable, or "worthy of notice"; that is, "significant, interesting, or unusual enough to deserve attention or to be recorded."

The List of people killed by dogs in the United States is a valid topic for the same reason that the List_of_fatal,_unprovoked_shark_attacks_in_the_United_States is a valid topic: fatal shark attacks, like fatal dog attacks, are unusual occurrences and are therefore "worthy of notice". As it happens, both the Pit Bull and Dog attack article references the List of people killed by dogs in the United States just as the List_of_fatal,_unprovoked_shark_attacks_in_the_United_States is referenced by the Shark Attack article. The list proposed for deletion has therefore been ranked as a "High" importance list by Misplaced Pages:WikiProject_Dogs.

With regard to "Completeness of the list", it's easy enough to add:

This list is incomplete; you can help by adding missing items. (August 2010)

rather than using it as an excuse to demand the deletion of the entire article.

The claim of "original research" fails since the percentage calculations (percentage) are merely arithmetic summarizing the list entries shown in the article itself, and so merit exemption under WP:CALC." Astro$01 (talk) 04:33, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

If the big hang-up here is that this is a List of People... then it seems to me an easy compromise is to rename the list to be List of Fatal Dog Attacks in the United States, at which point the people are merely ancillary information to complete the description of the fatal dog attack, rather than the main point of the list. Astro$01 (talk) 23:30, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Delete Non-encyclopedic list. Seems like a soap box for the pit bull law that I know very little about, but I know exists.Lollipopfop (talk) 22:24, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

New Rule: No one in this discussion can take into account the facts about how many of these dogs were pit bulls. This information has not been intentionally slanted by people with a bias against pit bulls. By this I mean, there are not a bunch of fatal dog attacks that involved cocker spaniels or some such that have been slyly left off the list by POV sneeks. If the facts contained make pit bulls and pit bull mixes look bad and the ones you know are lovely dogs, BE THAT AS IT MAY! It the business of Misplaced Pages to report the facts as they are, not to make sure that they don't support one view over another. Get a valid reason or don't opine in this section. In my humble opinion, of course. Chrisrus (talk) 23:46, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Delete Non-encyclopedic list. The article itself states that "There are a limited number of studies concerning the number of human deaths caused by dogs in the United States, and the number of attributed fatalities is difficult to validate..." --Crunch (talk) 05:42, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Delete as Misplaced Pages is not an indiscriminate collection of information. The entries in the list are only notable for their deaths, and Misplaced Pages is not memorial site. Armbrust _Contribs 13:21, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Keep a very important list-article with good citations, an excellent chart, and all notable incidents. People wanting to research this topic, such as myself, find this list very useful. If you want to see what a "memorial site" article looks like, see Diane Whipple, this is not a memorial but collection of important information. Chrisrus (talk) 14:16, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Delete the people who died are not notable. Their deaths are not notable. I couldn't find anything on individual animals but isn't the sheer length of this list indicative of a rather common occurrence? Anyhow, even if the dogs are all notable through WP:GNG, a list combining them with a non-notable criterion is not. --Pgallert (talk) 17:12, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 14:21, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
Delete, collection of non-notable people; original research. Stifle (talk) 18:51, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
Keep Darn well sourced and I don't see any kind of original research here. It should be made more plain this isn't all the killings, but otherwise I don't see a problem. Hobit (talk) 05:46, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
Delete too broad of a list of non-notable people, people get killed by dogs every year, in Miami several times it's occured several times in the past few years. Secret 17:15, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
Delete - List of non-notable people and not encyclopidic. Derild 49 21 ☼ 21:17, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 05:37, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Relisting debate to give other users a chance to respond to Astro$01's proposal to refocus the article on the events, not the people. -- King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 05:38, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Strong Keep, but Move to "List of Fatal Dog Attacks in the US", so that users like some of those who voted "delete" will stop thinking of it/calling it a list of people. It's a list of notable "Events", gives some idea of how many events, and what they have or don't have in common, and how important it is/isn't. Chrisrus (talk) 06:08, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
- Chrisrus, this is your second "keep" vote at this AfD. I think editors at AfD should vote only once. More votes by one person could be confusing for a closing admin/editor. --Vejvančický (talk | contribs) 08:47, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
- If you consider this as an event, it's WP:NOT#NEWS applicable here. Secret 22:24, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Keep I agree with Hobit. The article contains important and well referenced information. --Vejvančický (talk | contribs) 08:47, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Keep. Important information, well-sourced and well-written. --Crunch (talk) 17:01, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
- For both of you how it's important information? It's a list of non-notable people WP:NOT#NEWS applies here. Secret 22:19, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Weak Keep, prefer Merge - there are legitimate concerns about original research here, as well as giving undue attention to the deaths of non-notable people. However, the article is well-written and useful, and provides reasonable evidence that dog attacks in the United States are a notable subject. I would prefer this article to be merged into Dog attack or rewritten to be about Dog attacks in the United States rather than simply a list, but as it is I think it is probably acceptable. Robofish (talk) 22:36, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
- I'm fine with a Merge as long as the list is removed. Secret 22:41, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
- Note that the "non-list" part of the list is already duplicated in the Pit bull article and it is not without its problems.--Dodo bird (talk) 05:46, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
Keep Source or remove unreferenced material, discuss entries that may or may not fit the criterion. Notability is a concept that does not extend to articles contents. We need a way to talk about material of some importance that does not warrant a full article, and combination articles are lists are the obvious way. For one thing, those (sometimes called deletionists) who want to limit the number of articles about dubiously notable subjects in Misplaced Pages should approve very much of keeping lists such as this, for it removes the pressure to turn borderline notable things into full articles. If I were what is sometimes called a rabid inclusionist I would instead say, instead, keep , but as a summary, and expand each item possible into a full article. DGG ( talk ) 04:21, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
- What criteria is there? There is no grey area here. It's simply a list of all the people who were killed by dogs. We already have more than 150 entries for a 5-6 years period. Going by the CDC study, we would have 327 more for 1979 to 1999. A complete list for just the past 30 years would have 500-600 entries. I doubt most entries would be anywhere close to meeting the notability guidelines. When we total the deaths per year and % of specific breeds involved in those deaths (or draw any other conclusions) using the table, we are using those news sources as primary sources. It's using original research to push a POV. Anything that is of importance in the list when seen as a whole(such as circumstances of attack, age of victim, breeds involved, year by year trend) should be in prose form in Dog attack(or appropriate spin-off) and drawn from secondary sources. --Dodo bird (talk) 05:46, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Comment: I've noted that some of the concerns here refer to the insufficient notability of individual events listed in the table. This is not a point here, in my opinion, WP:NOTNEWS is unapplicable. The topic - deadly dog attacks in the USA - is what we should judge. It is a notable topic, as is confirmed by the cited studies, and the detailed and verifiable information on individual attacks is a bonus here. There's no POV in the article, the summary follows secondary sources, especially the claims about the deaths per year and % of specific breeds involved. I can see no benefits for this project in deleting this kind of information. --Vejvančický (talk | contribs) 08:46, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Keep Useful information, well-sourced. What should be included is a very different debate from whether the page should exist Vartanza (talk) 07:12, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
Merge any notable/sourced information to Dog attack or any suitable target, but don't include the list of non-notable events and individuals per WP:NOTNEWS. --Jmundo (talk) 23:24, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
Merge any non-list info to Dog attack and then redirect. As mentioned previously, there have been hundreds if not thousands of recorded lethal dog attacks in the United States. A complete list is neither maintainable nor encyclopedic. Someguy1221 (talk) 06:29, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
Keep but reformulate list as "attacks" not "people attacks." I don't see WP:POV issues here, I think this is far enough from WP:OR that that's not an issue as per WP;CALC, the article seems sourced and WP:V. WP:NLIST, on the other hand, seems to me to be a bigger question. NLIST would definitely address this article if it were really only a list. While it is not only the list, I understand the concerns, and to my mind the real encyclopedic value of that list is not the victim names but the other information about the attacks, it seems simple enough to simply reformulate the list, remove the victim names, and call it a day.--j⚛e decker 16:43, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete all. Jayjg 03:39, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

London - Game of children

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These are four supposed children's games from India for which no sources are given and for which I can find none. My PRODs were removed without comment by the author, who has also declined to answer my inquiry on his talk page about sourcing. I realize one should expect it to be hard to find sources about backyard games in India, but unfortunately we need to have them. Glenfarclas (talk) 07:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. -- Bradjamesbrown (talk) 10:21, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment: all four games are regional variants and might be known by different names in different states. I have known (by other names) and played three of them myself. But reliable sources would be difficult to find. I think number of phd thesis exist for such games. But unpublished dissertations won't meet RS standards. Will have to look for regional language books.--Sodabottle (talk) 10:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Merge all three into an article called Traditional Indian children's games. We have an entire Category:Children's games that would be more accurately called "Games that Wikipedians played while growing up in the United States, the United Kingdom, Canada or Australia". However, there does need to be sourcing regarding the existence of these games. An article based on one's childhood memories is only original research. Mandsford (talk) 13:57, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Game-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 01:19, 21 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete - There are better known games that aren't notable enough to have their own articles. EeepEeep (talk) 05:04, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete delete them all! Per nom andyzweb (talk) 06:54, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Pmlineditor ∞ 10:19, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. I'd like to pre-emptively quash any unfair claims of WP:BIAS -- if you have sources, show them. Put up or shut up. JBsupreme (talk) 18:31, 21 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. No possible way to verify. Bearian (talk) 01:53, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Merge per Mansford. Title says it all. Merge seems like a good idea Buggie111 (talk) 03:29, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Arbitrarily0 11:50, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Mad squad dancers

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No sources presented. There is an assertion of notability but there is no evidence given. The article creator has also violated WP:COI. Oren0 (talk) 06:49, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete - I can find a couple of reviews of this groups from a small newspaper called The Daily Gleaner I can't find anything that would assert notability. Panyd 12:46, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete per noms above and reasoning NJA (t/c) 11:00, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Nomination withdrawn. heading to WP:SNOW.. LibStar (talk) 22:53, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Aleksandr Dulichenko

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fails WP:BIO and WP:PROF nothing in gnews. very little in gscholar. LibStar (talk) 06:42, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. —David Eppstein (talk) 06:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Weak keep. You are searching for an uncommon spelling of his name. Searching for either "Duličenko" or "Дуличенко" gets greater numbers of hits in Google news, Google scholar, and Google books; the first name can be omitted, as most of the hits seem to be for the right person. And in any case the times and languages in which he was most active are not the ones best indexed by Google. I think the editorship and festschrift, while somewhat obscure, are enough for WP:PROF. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Listed at Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Constructed languages/Esperanto task force. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. In addition to what David Eppstein said, there is a biographical entry about him in "Encyclopedia of Rusyn history and culture". Nsk92 (talk) 15:00, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep per all of the above. Werner Heisenberg (talk) 01:47, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep for all the reasons outlined; but improve it. (Yes, I am an Esperantist.) --Orange Mike | Talk 04:09, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. Once again: for contemporary non-English subjects, absence of Google footprint of evidence is not evidence of absence of notability. Please. Power.corrupts (talk) 23:43, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

google news covers various languages. it is often a good indicator of notability. if this individual has a well sourced Russian article (none exists) I would not have nominated it. if people can find foreign language sources they are welcome to. LibStar (talk) 14:21, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. He passes WP:PROF as a professor with a festschrift, which demonstrates significant peer esteem. Personally I think the existence of a festschrift should be mentioned explicitly in WP:PROF. This on its own makes him worthy of inclusion in my view. Of course non-English speaking and non-scientific academics will have lower Google rankings in general and I do not believe Misplaced Pages should be Anglo-centric in this regard. — Jonathan Bowen (talk) 10:56, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
- Just a remark: festschrift is in fact already explicitly mentioned in WP:PROF, see item 3 in WP:PROF#Notes and examples. Nsk92 (talk) 11:06, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was No consensus The argument that it is written as an advertisement is an issue that can be fixed by editing the article a bit, which one contributor here has volunteered to do. The only other issue on the table is notability, and there is not a convincing argument one way or the other on that point, defaulting to keep. Beeblebrox (talk) 00:29, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Fluid Friction Comics

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fails WP:CORP. no significant third party coverage . LibStar (talk) 05:56, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete Fails WP:CORP, WP:GNG and any other notability guideline which may or may not apply. Additionally, violates WP:ARTSPAM; the only content contributor is User:SpencerDouglass (talk), who is listed as the company's Business Development Manager. This user has a history of creating non-notable articles including a biography of himself. Twice. Wine Guy Talk 09:38, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Weak keep - it does need a hefty rewrite but there is a list of their coverage at the end of the article (I have been keeping an eye on this for a while and don't feel notability is a problem). My worry is they seem to have gone awfully quiet leaving one edition of DevShard (from a proposed 15) although there is still some activity and the movie adaptation is ongoing - it seems like they have got wrapped up in other projects but Kevin Grevioux has got involved with them so they haven't vanished (not that'd necessarily be a grounds for deletion but it does mean we can't rule out more in addition to what is already there). (Emperor (talk) 04:34, 17 January 2010 (UTC))

Delete written like an advertisement, no indication of notability and a possible CoI for a major editor. Simonm223 (talk) 15:22, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep - concerns over advertising can be easily addressed (which I'd be happy to do myself). Notability might be borderline, but enough sourcing seems to exist to validate an article. Regards, Arbitrarily0 20:56, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was speedy delete. Author Blanked Page Ronhjones 21:27, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

All faiths religious movement

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Contested prod. Spontaneous, not notable religious movement. OliverTwisted (Stuff) 05:34, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete Clearly non-notable. Aside from the fact that no reliable sources can be found anywhere, this looks to be a purely a promotional article. The article says "The All Faiths Movement was birthed out of the desire of a simple theology student to begin a religion that absorbs all religions..." and "This movement was born on 12 January 2010." In other words, this is apparently a theology student's idea, which they proceeded to write an article about (under the username User:Allfaiths, which reinforces speculation of a conflict of interest and pure promotion).Swarm 07:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

My post is not promotional as explained in the discussion section. John Wesley was a student at Oxford when he started the Holy Club which became Methodism. Your argument is therefore invalid.Allfaiths (talk) 07:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I fail the see the logical progression of how John Wesley's founding of Methodism makes your article non-self promoting.Byjupiter (talk) 19:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete, obviously, per WP:NFT. Glenfarclas (talk) 08:42, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete, this is shameless self promotion. If this movement does catch on and become noteworthy, then it would merit inclusion in Misplaced Pages. Simply put, a religious movement birthed yesterday could not have generated a following or garnered enough attention to be noteworthy. Byjupiter (talk) 19:17, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. The parent institution may well be notable, though it does not appear to have an article in the Greek Misplaced Pages; but this is one department of one school within it, and there is no indication of notability. JohnCD (talk) 19:57, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Department of Rural Development and Rural Business Administration

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I have some real concerns about the notability of this college. Google test doesn't show any link to the college, and we are at about 4th or 5th in the results. Tbsdy lives (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) 05:25, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment. This search appears to show that there is no reference to the college's website in the Greek Misplaced Pages. Perhaps editors who read Greek could comment on the notability of this department or the institute as a whole. If the institute is genuine, the English Misplaced Pages should probably have an article on it. – Eastmain (talk) 07:04, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
That's a good idea... should have thought about that... - Tbsdy lives (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) 08:14, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Greece-related deletion discussions. – Eastmain (talk) 07:04, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete - a single article (which has yet to be written for English Misplaced Pages) should cover all of Alexander Technological Educational Institute (TEI). The level of detail here in terms of course offerings is too specific to be allowed for an English or American University. Hence, I would delete with the hope that the article's creator could focus on the larger institution, TEI. If coverage of the entire Institute then grows to the point of needing to split off parts into a separate article, split off by department may not be the best way to go at that time. Racepacket (talk) 23:16, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Expand/rename to cover Alexander Technological Educational Institute and remove the course detail. TerriersFan (talk) 17:48, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete It is absurd to have an article on one department of an institution of minor notability. I don't see a lot of point in renaming it: if anyone can write an article on the whole institute they can start from scratch: there is so little here worth including that it would be no extra trouble really. JamesBWatson (talk) 23:14, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NJA (t/c) 11:04, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The Gas Station

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This is a mixtape without any sources that establish its notability. PROD was contested with the reason "Added two additional sources", but both sources are track listings without additional substantive content. Yappy2bhere (talk) 05:14, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete, not a notable mixtape as the nom explains. Besides which, this is yet another page with a track listing and zero encyclopedic content, so at minimum WP:NALBUMS counsels, "Album articles with little more than a track listing may be more appropriately merged into the artist's main article or discography article, space permitting." Glenfarclas (talk) 08:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: I can't find significant coverage for this album. Joe Chill (talk) 22:13, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was merge to Robert Baker Aitken. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 00:24, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Diamond Sangha

AfDs for this article:

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Fails WP:N (WP:ORG). This organization is not notable. The external links are primarily to websites that promote this organization in some way, and not to 3rd party sources.None of the Google News hits on it qualify as significant coverage; they all mention Diamond Sangha incidentally in relation to the actual subject of the article, which in most cases, is Robert Baker Aitken. Further, none of the Google Scholar hits are about Diamond Sangha. They simply mention it as an institutional affiliation of the author or subject of the article. That means the subject of the article is notable, not Diamond Sangha. If someone can show me a single third-party article that is about Diamond Sangha itself, and not about Robert Baker Aitken, I will be happy to withdraw the nomination. ɳoɍɑfʈ 05:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Merge to Robert Baker Aitken. He is notable, and he founded the center, the information in the Diamond Sangha article could be incorporated nicely into Aitken's article. The center itself is not notable; the nom says it all. Wine Guy Talk 09:58, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The article indicates it was co-founded by his Aitken's wife, who has her own Misplaced Pages article. --Pink Bull 01:17, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

We could merge it there, then. Good call. Care to cast your vote? ɳoɍɑfʈ 04:09, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

that's the thing: i'm not sure where to merge the article, into the article on the husband, into the article on the wife, or both. this becomes even more problematic when deciding where to redirect the article name. so i guess, i'm on the record to merge the article, just not sure where exactly.--Pink Bull 04:34, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

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Comment This between both this and the last deletion nomination, this article has 2 Delete votes, 1 Merge vote, and 1 Keep vote, with the Keep vote saying "At worst this should be merged." I'd support merging as well, so that's 3 merges and a delete, as a secondary. ɳoɍɑfʈ 22:09, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
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Comment (Continued from above in reply to Pink Bull) While Anne and Robert Aitken did co-found the center, he was the spiritual leader as Rōshi (Zen Master). Then his Dharma heir took over, who in turn trained the current Rōshi; so the spiritual lineage (Kechimyaku), an important concept in Buddhism, traces back to Robert. He also has a much more significant bibliography, and is a more significant figure in general than Anne. That's why I suggested that the information from this article be merged to Robert's. Wine Guy Talk 06:59, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

in that case, merge to Robert Baker Aitken.--Pink Bull 15:00, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

Merge and redirect, If someone may want to be WP:BOLD, merge what ever is worth keeping before the closing admin redirects. Jeepday (talk) 23:25, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Procedural early keep. No one is proposing that the information in the article ought to be removed from Misplaced Pages entirely. Therefore, there is no point in having the discussion here. A merge discussion can take place on the article talk page if people feel it is necessary. NW (Talk) 03:57, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

G-spot amplification

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To determine if the topic is notable enough for a more prominent write up (new section) in G-Spot, should be merged, or deleted outright because it verges on Misplaced Pages:Advertising#Wikipedia_is_not_a_soapbox. Roy Boy 04:00, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Merge to G-spot Does not meet stand alone general noteabillity clause for a stand alone article. -- Sk8er5000 (talk) 07:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep This article covers G-spot amplification, G-spot augmentation and G-shot. Now whilst this may or may not be the best place for it, it is certainly a notable medical procedure and should not be merged to G spot. Polargeo (talk) 15:58, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, references show significant coverage, satisfying WP:GNG. Werner Heisenberg (talk) 01:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Medicine-related deletion discussions. -- Pcap ping 11:21, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Weak keep per PMID 17766626 and ABC news, but it looks like it needs some WP:NPOV rewriting. Pcap ping 11:28, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep Notable procedure, more balanced info now. Mattopaedia 12:00, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Strong merge - just tip this junk/drivel over to a brief mention in G-spot (something that recently strongly suggested is a myth, making this a placebo proceedure of a myth). Reliable secondary source (per WP:MEDRS) would use PMID 17766626 to indicate but one of a number of cosmetic vaginal procedures with "lack of data supporting the efficacy". That anybody sought cosmetic surgery for the G spot I suppose mildly amusing, but that belongs in article on G-spot as a one liner noting this American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (reliable source) view. I disagree with Werner Heisenberg's view that the referencees show significant coverage - some titilating TV commentary does not make notability (most of those refs probably should be removed as failing to meet WP:MEDRS) - but if some firm statistic brought to bear on numbers performed (eg 10,000 procedures in US in last couple years) then yes notable for being a significant minority viewpoint, but otherwise per WP:NPOV "the views of tiny minorities should not be included at all". David Ruben 18:22, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. Amusing, yes, and it needs to be rewritten, but because of PMID 17766626 and ABC news, it should be an article (with due weight given to the journal published source and the rest of the cruft and iffy sources removed). SandyGeorgia (Talk) 04:35, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
I removed the cruft, non-reliable sources, and text not supported by sources. Google scholar lists 14 sources: it's notable. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 05:11, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. Given the fact that the AMA thought it notable enough to actually have a position on it, the fact that there are several reliable sources and finally because the project isn't running short on hard drive space. If amplification worked for Fender and Marshall, there's no reason it shouldn't for G-Spots. Only in America folks! --Fred the Oyster (talk) 03:24, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was speedy delete. G4 see Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/UPWA Pro Wrestling Nancy 08:54, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

UPWA wrestling

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Obscure, small-time regional wrestling league. Google searching doesn't confirm notability, nor claims of an MTV connection. Warrah (talk) 03:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

We filmed footage for MTV. Never claimed we were a show on MTV. We are broadcast through out the southeast and have been covered in the local press. We have over 500-1000 people per show and also have been in talks to have affiliates around the country. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kickingitoldschool (talk • contribs) 05:24, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 07:14, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Truman National Security Project

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No evidence of notability, no references. Google research shows its "fellows" are twentysomethings who occasionally write blog posts on low-traffic blogs and hold other day jobs. THF (talk) 20:54, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete Notability is missing in this one. --Stormbay (talk) 02:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Weak keep- Well, sources. The article as it stands has nothing even resembling a reliable source. SF Chronicle barely mentions it, Obama attends a forum organized by the subject, but the article is more about Obama than the TNSP, Similar from Britain's Guardian, Mentioned in the Boston Globe, Very passing mention in the Washington Post, and a fellow of the TNSP testifying for the Senate. Lots and lots of passing mentions, tons and tons more I could have quoted where the TNSP was mentioned in a the credentials when quoting one of their fellows. There's so many mentions, and the ones I've cited have gone over 4 years, that I think there's enough notability to build a real article here, but I can't find the nice, in-depth article that would cement my mind towards keeping this. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 02:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete unless the article's authors can demonstrate notability through a source other than their own website. I imagine that the article can be brought up to code, although in looking at the website's own posting of mentions in the press , I agree with Brad that there seems to be no article about the group itself. Maybe you should call Rush or No-spin Bill. Mandsford (talk) 14:06, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Jayjg 02:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Government and Politics

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Delete. This page is primarily about the UK. This bias could be fixed but I don't think it is a topic that needs inclusion in WP. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 19:41, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete This is actually an article about the A Level so is not correctly named. The only A Level subject I can quickly find with its own article is Advanced level mathematics. I don't see the need to merge this article anywhere because a list of course content for this examination is not really[REDACTED] material. Polargeo (talk) 20:14, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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The result was delete. NJA (t/c) 11:03, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Hadith in praise of Umar

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Also nominating Hadith of Umar and the Qur'an. Same concerns -- Raziman T V's Alternate account (Talk - Contribs) 19:52, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Page is basically just a collection of quotes. They can go to Wikiquotes. The little non-quote content is a minute subset of Sunni view of Umar and Umar -- Raziman T V's Alternate account (Talk - Contribs) 19:48, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete no significant content without the quotes which should be in wikiquote not here. Polargeo (talk) 22:11, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep and expand. There is surely going to be both classical and modern commentary, especially on a hadith which appears to be central in the dispute between Shi'a and Sunni. Those qualified to find it should look. DGG ( talk ) 04:12, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes a commentary would be good but not a quote farm. All of these articles were created in 2006 by User:Striver all of the quotes, in all three articles come from one book History of the Caliphs,[REDACTED] is being used to repeat this classic text, this is a big WP:NOT. The main article Sunni view of Umar has 103 of these quotes, see Sunni view of Umar#References. The two sub articles being considered for deletion have 32 Hadith in praise of Umar#References and 10 Hadith of Umar and the Qur'an#References. Any commentary can easily go into the main article and the quotes reduced down to a few examples in that article. So delete the sub articles and clean up the main one. Polargeo (talk) 05:56, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Some of the other articles have already been deleted Hadith of Umar and prophecy by prod in 2007, and many more after the following deletion debate Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Hadith of the demise of Muhammad. It appears a couple of the articles unfortunately escaped this mass deletion. Polargeo (talk) 07:00, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Might be fun looking for quotes in the other 1000+ articles created by this user. Striver (talk · contribs · deleted · count · pages created) Polargeo (talk) 07:33, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete - if this was expanded to include a commentary I would change my vote to keep. It could be a great look at a very important work. As it stands though it isn't an article, just a series of quotes with a few sentences to give a context. Panyd 14:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
~~Keep~~. Needs style editing. "Could be expanded but this is not yet done" is not a good reason to delete. That is ultra extreme Immediatism. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 00:31, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Please read my comments. I also think this article is a fairly useless content fork. Any expantion or commentary on this is far better in the more sensibly named Sunni view of Umar, which is also mostly a Hadith quote farm at present. The Hadith in praise of Umar and Hadith of Umar... articles which we are debating appear to exist merely because the creator couldn't fit all of his hadith quotes into his main article Sunni view of Umar. Commentary and encyclopedic content seem to have been a secondary consideration. Polargeo (talk) 11:40, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Content forks, created in good faith, should, in my opinion, by default be merged and redirected. That somebody made the article is strong evidence that it is a reasonable search term. Changing to redirect to (I guess) to Sunni view of Umar. Keeping the quotes in the history is not a bad thing. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 00:11, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

The traffic stats to the article are nothing more than the background noise that you would expect for a long standing linked up article like this. No google news, scholar or book hits whatsoever but an odd amount of search hits which I suspect somehow originate from the[REDACTED] article (have a look through them). I think the titles of all of the articles are likely the article creator's own classifications. This editor created many many 'Hadith...' articles to fit these quotes into. Polargeo (talk) 06:54, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

It is also not clear what the copyright status might be on the particular translation quoted. In fact if the link in the citations is correct (which I am not sure it is for every quote) this all appears to come from a 1995 translation ISBN 9781897940259 so extensive lifting of text is very likely to be a copright issue. Polargeo (talk) 08:43, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Islam-related deletion discussions. —Polargeo (talk) 15:06, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete - this is a quote farm and not an article. Any actual content makes sense at the parent article so there is no need for this one. -- Whpq (talk) 17:16, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. It's quite probable that an article exists for this subject, as DGG correctly notes that it is a key element in the dispute between Shi'a and Sunni traditions. But this isn't that article, and a clean start (at a clearer title) would be best for such an important topic. UltraExactZZ ~ Did 16:23, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. overall keep as the redirect argument didn't make the most sense for having a wide ranging encyclopeadia. NJA (t/c) 11:03, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Mass Effect: Retribution

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Contested PROD using the justification: "Book is by a notable writer of a notable company in a notable 'verse. Lack of a release date does not indicate lack of notability". WP:NBOOK seems to state otherwise, but I am open to the discussion. A possibility could be to redirect to Mass Effect (series) or Drew Karpyshyn until the book has been released and/or notability has been established. Steamroller Assault (talk) 02:14, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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It appears it was just announced today, but the publisher provides a release date of 27 July 2010. So, there is a release date. Bradjamesbrown (talk) 02:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Redirect to Mass Effect (series)#Novels. The subject isn't notable enough for its own article yet, and since its unreleased it shouldn't have one. Redirect, over deletion, would probably be best since the book has been announced. Swarm 07:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep - Plenty of other book and video game articles are allowed to get away with existing even though they aren't released yet. Also, I don't see what the problem with notability is, the Mass Effect franchise is notable, and as a part of that franchise the book should be notable. =/= Ironoclast (Talk) 20:35, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep - Other book series, even sci-fi ones, have had articles created for future books with no problems. Given that the book is only a few months away and its existence has been confirmed by multiple internet articles and previews, bookstores and the publisher, I can't see any reason for deletion at this stage. Bronzey (talk) 01:23, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
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Keep per , , , , and (in German). –MuZemike 05:23, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. The 'keep' arguments have presented some justification based on WP:OTHERSTUFF, and the articles mentioned above seem to all be disseminated from the press release announcing the eventual publication of this book half a year from now. But I have yet to see any specific arguments that justify a current article that follows WP:NBOOK, and am more inclined to see a redirect per User:Stinging Swarm. Steamroller Assault (talk) 05:47, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Cirt (talk) 07:14, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

St. Mary's/Duluth Clinic Health System

AfDs for this article:

Articles for deletion/St. Mary's/Duluth Clinic Health System

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Article, as it currently stands, is a steaming pile of SPAM. Strongly suggest either a complete rewrite, or Delete and start over. WuhWuzDat 16:40, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Speedy Keep this is nowhere near spam with no other content. Rewrite certainly (I see some rewriting has already begun). Polargeo (talk) 19:10, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep. I added some references after the AfD was created, and I think that notability is now shown. – Eastmain (talk) 02:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep I don't think this is spam. Perhaps a different writing approach.Virillion (talk) 03:25, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Cirt (talk) 07:13, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Postliterate society

AfDs for this article:

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I already nominated it once and the decision was keep. While i can agree that this concept may be notable, no significant editing happened since then. The article still doesn't have anything that remotely resembles reliable sources. If it is a significant scientific or cultural concept, it should be either improved or deleted. Otherwise people who don't pay attention to "unreferenced" tags can actually believe what it says now. And maybe it is even true (although i doubt it), but there's no way to verify it. Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 16:06, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. In the first line of the article it dexcirbes the term as hypothetical, and cursory searches of the web and google sholar seem to show it is a notable hypothecy. Yes, it needs referencing, but that can be fixed by editting. Dylanfromthenorth (talk) 16:27, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
I agree that it's possible that the concept is notable and that the article can be fixed by editing, but the same claim was made in the previous AFD and nothing happened since. All of the information in the article is unreferenced and, as far as i'm concerned, wrong. If the concept is important enough, someone will write a properly referenced article soon enough. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 18:14, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
OK, but the correct thing to do with an unreferenced article is to fix it, not delete it. Dylanfromthenorth (talk) 18:42, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
I would gladly fix it, but i don't possess enough knowledge to do it. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 19:10, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

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Rename to Post-literate per Marshall McLuhan, (or a google search for "post literate" mcluhan gutenberg galaxy) seems to show he was an early user, probably coined the phrase. i think the word society is not needed, but the word, if coined by mcluhan, is an important one, and probably deserves a larger article. i would start with this reference. i admit its hard to find reliable sources for its use, but its now ubiquitous. Mercurywoodrose (talk) 03:43, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment Could this AFD be listed or noted at Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Media? i sometimes see afd's included in other discussions. this is really not so much about sf as postmodern media theory. i dont know how to do this, though.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 04:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
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Keep The article needs more content and sources, but just clicking on the automatic "find sources" link above shows that this phrase still gets used in books and news articles. Concerns about technology creating a generation that doesn't read have been an ongoing concern. It used to be television, now it's the internet, and I'm sure that in another ten years, it'll be voice-activated information retrieval. Mandsford (talk) 14:12, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep "failure to be improved" is not a sufficient reason for deletion of a verifiable and notable literary trope. Having said that, this can clearly be improved and certainly should be, but it isn't so bad that deleting what we have here would improve the encyclopedia. Jclemens (talk) 17:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Tone 11:19, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Devachan

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This is a Blavatsky neologism and consequently a content fork of Helena Blavatsky. Misplaced Pages does not benefit from every word made up by Blavatsky having its own article page. Ash (talk) 12:33, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep It's a term used by a large number of published authors, not just Blavatsky as the GBooks hits clearly show. It's also not a content fork and more than heaven is a content fork of Bible. Edward321 (talk) 00:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep per previous poster. __meco (talk) 09:16, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep is a notable term with regular use. jackson5alive (talk) 09:22, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete WP:NOT makes it pretty clear that Misplaced Pages is not a dictionary of neologisms. Simonm223 (talk) 16:46, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

I have added an explanation of this concept from the perspective of anthroposphy also. __meco (talk) 15:21, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Delete Beeblebrox (talk) 00:21, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Jamming Arabs, The

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Non-notable per WP:BAND, unreferenced, no significant coverage online from WP:Reliable sources, WP:Conflict of interest by article's creator. Prod contested by creator. MuffledThud (talk) 11:16, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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As discussed with MuffledThud, here are my reasons why this article should not be deleted:

Criteria for musicians and ensembles Shortcuts: WP:BAND WP:MUSICBIO A musician or ensemble (note that this includes a band, singer, rapper, orchestra, DJ, musical theatre group, etc.) may be notable if it meets at least one of the following criteria:

Has released two or more albums on a major label or one of the more important indie labels (i.e., an independent label with a history of more than a few years and a roster of performers, many of which are notable). Okay, I admit that Alopecia Records wasn't the biggest record label, but they did produce most of England's surf/garage music during their time. The fact that the Jamming Arabs were on this record label therefore would indicate that they were an important group in this genre.

Has become the most prominent representative of a notable style or of the local scene of a city; note that the subject must still meet all ordinary Misplaced Pages standards, including verifiability. This is a tricky one. The Jamming Arabs were certainly the most prominent surf group in NE England, but it might also be true to say that they were one of the only surf groups!

Has performed music for a work of media that is notable, e.g. a theme for a network television show, performance in a television show or notable film, inclusion on a notable compilation album, etc. (But if this is the only claim, it is probably more appropriate to have a mention in the main article and redirect to that article.) Again, tricky. One of their songs (unreleased and so not subject to copyright) was used for Hartlepool Tourist Board but it's impossible to reference this as there was no money involved and so no deals exist.

Has been the subject of a half hour or longer broadcast across a national radio or TV network. The Jamming Arabs appeard on Radio Tees for a live session, DJ was Bob Fisher. The band also appeared in the local paper, The Evening Gazette on a two page spread as a local band that actualy had a record deal. Sadly I can find no record of this paper. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tikirussy (talk • contribs) 12:43, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment: if you can find support for Alopecia Records being a significant independent label, we may have something here. The rest doesn't sound promising. Coverage in local media doesn't really count towards notability. Getting used by a local tourist board doesn't count for much either, and is probably unverifiable if what you say is true. The "prominent representative" criterion applies for a notable style or a city's scene, not a style within a city's scene. It would only apply here if they were prominent among surf groups overall (and it doesn't sound like they're as well known as Dick Dale or The Shadows), or among NE England bands of all styles. — Gwalla | Talk 19:07, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

It's maybe down to personal opinion, but Alopecia Records were very important in the surf/garage scene. A quick search on Amazon shows the you can still purchase cds and records from the label. If you look at many of the more popular garage bands they have released material through Alopecia. For example, the following surf bands all appear on wikipedia: The Phantom Surfers, The Apemen, The Trashwomen. In addition, Sir Bald Diddley, the founder of Alopecia Records, can also be found if searched on Misplaced Pages.

One of their songs appeared BBC Film Network:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/filmnetwork/films/p005nb7f

although the film was created by the bass player ;) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tikirussy (talk • contribs) 11:42, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the local tourist board is unverifiable, however, it was played on local television on a semi-regular basis. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tikirussy (talk • contribs) 11:28, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete since it hasn't been established that this group meets WP:BAND. Cordless Larry (talk) 22:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep since I would say that the band meets criteria 5 (depending on whether or not you conside Alopecia! Records to be a note-worthy independant label - which I do). --Tikirussy (talk) 12:32, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- Doesn't that require two or more albums though? As far as I can tell, this band only released one. Cordless Larry (talk) 12:41, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- You know, I read it wrong - I thought it said two on a major label or one album on an indie label. Having said, they did release one cd, one ep and appeared on two compilation cds...still, I apologise for mis-reading the criteria :( --Russell (talk) 12:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Regretful delete: Regretful because Tikirussy's responses here are probably the most gracious by a new contributor whose article faces deletion that I've ever seen on WP. Delete because the band appears too niche to me to meet notability requirements: I do not think Alopecia Records are significant enough a label, since in its own right the label appears to fail notability criteria (Gbooks search; GNews search). The local press coverage, as Gwalla says, is also not enough to meet the criteria, and a single album on an indie label misses that element of the criteria. All the same, thankyou Tikirussy for being a mensch about this, and I hope you'll continue contributing to the project in other areas. Gonzonoir (talk) 14:55, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- I echo those sentiments. Too often, new editors can be difficult to handle in deletion discussions but that certainly isn't true of Tikirussy. Cordless Larry (talk) 15:00, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- Too true. Thanks for being such a good sport about this Russell, and please call on me if I can be of any help with any future articles. MuffledThud (talk) 15:07, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

It's all good. Thanks for the advice along the way, I've certainly learnt a lot in this process (including the word mensch!) and everyone has been more than helpful. I'm obviously sad that the article is deleted but I understand the reasons behind it all. Cheers! --Russell (talk) 15:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment: I'd just like to chime in and also express my appreciation for Russell's pleasant attitude. Having an article you've put some work into wind up on AfD is never a good feeling, and too often AfD debates are plagued by frustration. You've been really great about this whole thing, Russell! — Gwalla | Talk 18:03, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was no consensus. Arbitrarily0 14:21, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Web Cam 3D

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As the film has yet to start shooting, I cannot see how WP:NF or WP:NFF requirements on notability for film have been satisfied. Unless the film was particularly notable for how finances were being raised or the planning stage was oddly notable for some other reason then the article generally falls foul of WP:CRYSTAL. Ash (talk) 10:45, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Provisional Keep The film is not called Web Cam 3D so this incorrect title affects searches. To eliminate the false positives, and to see if this Spanish film might meet notability considerations, I performed a news search for title plus star "Web Cam", "Robert Englund" and found Jurnalul Naţional (Ro), Aullidos (Sp), Moviereporter (Gr)20 minutos (Sp), and Horror Movie (It). In a search for title plus director, "Web Cam", "Antoni Sole", I additionally found Evenimentul Zilei (Ro), Monitorul Expres (Ro), among others... indicative that even disregarding the non-RS English genre reviews, the non-English news sources for a non-US film may be seen to push it toward notability and inclusion consideration per meeting the considerations of WP:CRYSTAL per WP:GNG. I would further suggest that it might be helpful if we might seek input from European Wikipedians who have better access to European sources. Schmidt, 21:28, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

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Comment. According to some of those sources, the name of the movie is Web Cam, and it's a "3D horror movie", whatever that means. No opinion on notability. Note that most of those articles just cite this story in Screen Daily. Pcap ping 02:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NW (Talk) 05:02, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Needle exchange economics

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Contested PROD. Unencyclopedic essay presenting original research. Steamroller Assault (talk) 02:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete: Per nom. South Bay (talk) 02:03, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete as an essay. JIP | Talk 07:36, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

This article is based strictly upon authoritative sources such as the CDC and published research studies that are referenced in the article. The rest is simple math.

If you want to reject it on the grounds that it presents original research, please be specific about what you object to and I will see if any such objections can be resolved through further references

Thank you for mentioning the point about "unpublished synthesis or analysis". I believe that Misplaced Pages takes this position because it does not want articles that are effectively "matters of opinion", such as whether gun ownership increases or decreases safety, but in this case, it really is straight math.

If the CDC days that the average cost of treating an AIDS patient is X and the lack of a needle exchange program results in Y more infections, the resulting cost will be X times Y. This not as a matter of opinion, but as factual as stating that 2 * 3 = 6.

If such arithmetic is forbidden, then I suppose the article must be deleted and I will accept your decision, but I urge you to consider carefully. Without an exchange program, tens of thousands of people will die in conditions of extreme pain, at a cost to the taxpayer of hundreds of millions of dollars per year. By allowing the article, Misplaced Pages can help prevent this.

If you will allow such basic arithmetic, I will be very happy to improve the article, add more references, make it more readable by splitting it into sections and make whatever other changes you believe are appropriate. RicharHMorgan (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 00:58, 15 January 2010 (UTC).

Comment. There may be several peer-reviewed journals in existence where you could submit your paper for scrutiny, but an encyclopedia is simply not the place for it. There could very well be errors, omissions and assumptions in your methodology, but it is the peer-review process, and not Misplaced Pages's place to make that judgement. In addition, your stated intent, "Misplaced Pages can help prevent this" is a definitive use of Misplaced Pages as a soapbox, which is also not what this project is for. I encourage you to read WP:WIS and WP:NOT for more details on what this place is about. Steamroller Assault (talk) 03:23, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
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Delete. The topic appears encyclopedic, but the current contents seems to an original synthesis designed to advance a POV not supported by the sources cited. Pcap ping 09:01, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. Unencylopedic, subject matter is not notable and article is pushing a POV.--Literaturegeek | T@1k? 16:49, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Tone 11:20, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Chalk to win

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Borders on patent nonsense. The unsourced article, such as it is, is about claims allegedly made in "studies" (uncited), by an allegedly existing but non-notable academic who is simultaneously described as "Dr." Lee and as someone without an actual doctorate, and as "renowned" despite being really just a random (alleged) grad student who calls himself "Dr." The article sagely informs us that applying chalk to the cue stick tip is something pool, billiards and snooker players have been doing for ages, but that doing it has been newly discovered to be useful (as if we were doing this before just to entertain ourselves?), yet (get this) that this results in "unwarranted" confidence (right; because simply chalking the cue doesn't make you a good shot, after all). That is, the effect allegedly measured by the alleged studies is bogus. Uh, okay. The "article" smacks of WP:COI, though the seeming single-purpose account who created the article may not be "Dr. Lee" but someone associated with him. PS: It's also a neologism. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(ل)ˀ Contribs. 01:58, 13 January 2010 (UTC) PS: This does not appear to be in any way related to the sports betting phrase "chalked to win", sometimes rendered "chalk' to win". — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(ل)ˀ Contribs. 06:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Speedy delete as hoax / nonsense. To quote the article, "The renowned Dr M. Lee (unconfirmed doctorate) is now undertaking further studies in the art of 'smacking it' . . . . Chalk to win is a method of playing pool and other cue sports, taking the pressure of each shot off of the player and placing it solely on the chalking of the cue." Uh, nice try. Glenfarclas (talk) 09:02, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy delete per above. Blodance (talk) 14:21, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy delete editors only contributions were this article plus adding one reference to it in the article Pool (cue sports) Racepacket (talk) 16:28, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment Number and type of edits by the editor is not one of the speedy deletion criteria. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(ل)ˀ Contribs. 01:47, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. There is no entry for this term/concept in Shamos' Illustrated Encyclopedia of Billiards, nor in Stein & Rubino's Billiard Encyclopedia, nor in Byrne's New Standard Book of Pool and Billiards. A search of the cue chalk board at Billiardsdigest.com (a great resource for those in the know and would capture this if it was a well used neologism) shows not a single reference to the expression and a targeted Google web search (the natural habitat of neologisms) returns zero results.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:23, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was no consensus. kur ykh 00:43, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Greg Wood (actor)

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Non-notable actor for whom the article claims two IMDb profiles. Passes db-a7, but even combined these collections of single TV episodes and the like do not meet the WP:ENT standard of "significant roles in multiple notable films, television shows, stage performances, or other productions," etc. Glenfarclas (talk) 09:08, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep - I disagree with deleating the page because the actor played a significant main role in Brookside from 2002-2003 and was one of the three lead roles in the spin off DVD. Also, although his character in Coronation Street is only classed as a recurring role his is getting more screen time as the storyline he is involved with progresses. Grrrreg 09:16, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment. Storyline over. (See also List_of_minor_Coronation_Street_characters_(2009)#Rick_Neelan.) THF (talk) 01:49, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

- - The storyline isn't over yet Grrrreg 12:51, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment. And whoever maintains List_of_Brookside_Characters didn't find Wood's role in Brookside notable. THF (talk) 01:51, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep per User:Grrrreg and actor meeeting WP:ENT . Since article also notes his pervious name Greg Milburn, we have even a wider search available that gives us more with which to WP:Verfy his work , , , . While meeting the GNG is prefered, guideline allows other means by which to confirm notability. Schmidt, 23:24, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment: I'm not sure what those links are supposed to show—they're all Google searches that don't turn up very many hits. Your GNews archive search is particularly instructive, since all that seems to come up are passing parenthetical mentions; these are as insignificant as a media mention can possibly be. No one's disputing that Greg Milburn or Greg Wood exists or that his roles are verifiable, but neither you nor Grrreg (the article's author) has indicated what part of WP:ENT he might meet. Obviously that'll take more than verifiability. Glenfarclas (talk) 23:34, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Only intended to show that his ENT might be verified through a wider search, as the criteria required to meet ENT if failing GNG. Schmidt, 00:24, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. A handful of minor guest appearances on British TV does not meet WP:ENT. Most notable role was as a loan shark with a few lines in a five-episode arc of a daily soap opera. THF (talk) 01:49, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 07:13, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

IQ Inc

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Advertisement for a non-notable company, created by a promotional account that has since been blocked. sixtynine 06:57, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment. I added some references. - Eastmain (talk) 07:51, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
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Delete, advertisement for a non-notable company, puff piece in the online version of the "Murrysville Star" notwithstanding. Glenfarclas (talk) 09:13, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. I removed the section on the company's Founder, as it appeared to be a verbatim copy of this site, which is the individual's blog. No comment on deletion, since I gutted the article, but I can't find any reliable sources that document the company's notability. UltraExactZZ ~ Did 13:41, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete- per nom. Advertisement and Self-Promotion Tarheel95 (talk) 02:00, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 07:13, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Reply Magazine

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Went through the first 5 pages of google search, it has one dig, but besides that nothing. It looks like a professional site, but its 1rst article is Jan, 2010, so it might need awhile for someone to cover it. Pirate 07:19, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete: I can't find significant coverage for this website. Joe Chill (talk) 02:53, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
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Delete, non-notable brand-new online magazine. Try again later-- Glenfarclas (talk) 09:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Speedy delete A7 Enigma 19:34, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Jeremy Vogt

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This should have been a simple A7 speedy, but throwing it to AfD. This is an utterly non-notable individual, and this BLP two-liner is completely unsourced whatsoever. It reads like a vanity bio that never got finished - Alison 00:29, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

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Comment. Is this Jeremy Vogt the same musician as the drummer for Athenaeum (band) and (apparently briefly) Tonic (band)? This reference lists Jeremy Vogt as the "new drummer" for Tonic, but that name does not appear in the Misplaced Pages article. If all these Vogt are the same people, then he would be notable as a member of two notable bands. I noticed this reference, but perhaps radioindy.com is not a reliable source. - Eastmain (talk) 01:40, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't think they're the same guy somehow (the ages don't seem to match) but that radioindy.com reference is the one contained in the article, only it actually works :) The guy above appears to have a website at http://www.vogtweb.com/ - Alison 01:48, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete per nominator. Alio The Fool 20:31, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

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Delete: per WP:BIO and WP:NOT. South Bay (talk) 01:59, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NJA (t/c) 11:01, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

X-Men (Marvel animated universe)

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As far as I can tell, this article seems to fill a nebulous and unnecessary role in between List of X-Men members and all of the articles on the various characters. Basically, it's just a list of X-Men members, but with slightly longer writeups and somewhat fewer entries. I left a comment on the talk page (basically what's written above) for the author, but he hasn't responded. I simply can't see a reason for this article to exist, and WP:CFORK would counsel deletion. Glenfarclas (talk) 01:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete This is also an overly-detailed and unnecessary bit of info that could go in X-Men animated series or the list that Glen points to above, or within the Misplaced Pages articles about the individual characters themselves. Mandsford (talk) 14:26, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Just to clarify, in my opinion the info doesn't need to "go" anywhere; this is an unenecessary new article, whereas the others are established, and although I haven't pored through everything I can't imagine there's anything here that's not already in the detailed articles on the individual characters (and the list article doesn't need bulking up). Glenfarclas (talk) 09:11, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete - like the dozens of similar articles created by the same editor, this is pretty much a reshuffling of information that is in the characters (and teams) "in other media" articles - which is where they should be. (Emperor (talk) 02:40, 19 January 2010 (UTC))

The result was no consensus. –Juliancolton | 00:21, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

John Harvey (actor)

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This article is a bit of a mess, mixing up British and American actors of the same name. Neither one seems to be particularly notable, though the former does have sheer volume of work in his favour. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:06, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep I started the stub on the actor John Harvey in 2006 because he was a cast member of the film The Man with My Face (1951), which is John Harvey (I) born 27 September 1911, London, England, UK, died 19 July 1982, Oxfordshire, England, and his name was a red link (unwritten article) in that article. It would be a shame if the IMDb started deleting actors they think are not notable enough for mention. I see your point about the mixed details, however, and agree. I wasn't paying close enough attention when I created the stub, which led to erroneous information being added. Perhaps it can be improved. I've removed the info. referring to the American John Harvey and added more facts about the subject at hand. Something along the lines of "Not to be confused with" might be in order. Could be that a move to the title "John Harvey (British actor)" might help. FredR (talk) 10:35, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment. Nice job fixing the article. I'm still not convinced he is notable. I just don't see a major role in a well-known film (minor roles in Tunes of Glory and The Phantom of the Opera look like his best shot). If he is kept however, there's no need for a page move - the American is a much more clear cut no. Clarityfiend (talk) 23:35, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

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Keep I can see no reason why an article about this actor should be removed from Misplaced Pages, which should include all performers, stars, principals, minor performers and crew. Granted, ordinary citizens need no mention in Misplaced Pages articles, but those of stage, screen and television should be given proper coverage, even if they quit show business during the course of their life. This man, John Harvey, was a performer for most of his life. FredR (talk) 10:45, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. It's really hard to ignore a man who's volume of work is as vast as John Harvey. However, I am not convinced that he is notable per WP:ENT. Many of the roles he has performed both on TV and in film have been minor. I see no significant parts in any major films. Based on guidelines I see no basis for the inclusion of this article. Daa89563 (talk) 21:41, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 07:13, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Johan Emmoth

I have only been able to find a couple lists of work he is a producer on, no information about himself whatsoever, notability? Freikorp (talk) 23:17, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 16:36, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

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Weak delete I can't find any independent coverage on him but he has produced a good number of albums and written a fair number of songs. Perhaps a category 'Albums produced by Johan Emmoth'? J04n(talk page) 01:55, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I agree with you, I'd be happy with a category like that. Freikorp (talk) 17:09, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 07:12, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Chris Allan

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

I removed the {{db-person}} tag from this article because A7 does not apply; collaborating with a notable person (Stephen Murphy) in a notable project (Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Adventures) is a credible assertion of notability. However, I have not been able to find sources to substantiate this notability. A Google News Archive search (with the search term: "Chris Allan" Murphy) and a Google News Archive search (with the search term: "Chris Allan" Ninjara) returns no results. This individual appears to fail Misplaced Pages:Notability (biographies), Misplaced Pages:Verifiability, and Misplaced Pages:Biographies of living persons. Cunard (talk) 05:53, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. I was the speedy tagger, and I agree that it was probably a marginal case and declining was fair. But I did research the subject beforehand and could find no remotely significant independent coverage of him, nor under the variant spelling "Chris Allen." If his collaboration made him notable, there should be some independent information to find. Glenfarclas (talk) 09:28, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Timotheus Canens (talk) 01:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete: not notable, still needs to see more reliable sources. South Bay (talk) 01:53, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was Delete The sources provided do not appear to meet the requirement of "significant coverage in third party sources," some of the "keep" arguments are not based on policy. Beeblebrox (talk) 03:27, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Gopiparadhana

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Non-notable religious leader. Ism schism (talk) 05:26, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Religion-related deletion discussions. —Ism schism (talk) 05:29, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 16:36, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Keep for now This article is sourced, a Google search turns up additional possible sources, and many more might be found if searches for sources in another language (Hindi?) were performed. Ism schism, would you mind expanding your rationale for deletion? WP:JNN is considered an argument to avoid. A Stop at Willoughby (talk) 02:41, 5 January 2010 (UTC)
- Sure; the article is a BLP, so it has higher standards than other articles. The references used for this article are non reliable sources. Without reliable sources, this article should be deleted. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 17:10, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. Taking that into consideration, I think the subject of this article meets WP:CREATIVE criteria #3 and #4, as his translations have been subject to significant critical attention, as documented in reliable sources. Keep.—Preceding unsigned comment added by A Stop at Willoughby (talk • contribs) 21:17, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

You stated that the translations, "have been subject to significant critical attention, as documented in reliable sources." Where is the "significant critical attention" and where are the reliable sources. So far, there is a forward to a book the subject translated, and the other is a news article that mentions him in passing. This subject clearly does NOT meet WP:CREATIVE criteria #3 and #4, and as such the article should be deleted. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 21:29, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:43, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep He completed translation of the Bhagavata Purana (Srimad Bhagavatam). This translation has received quite a lot of reviews and is the most popular translation of this Purana. He also translated another major sanskrit text - Brihad-bhagavatamrita . He works as a Sanskrit translator and editor for a leading publisher Bhaktivedanta Book Trust. He received coverage as such in this article . He seems sufficiently notable to me.--Gaura79 (talk) 17:02, 9 January 2010 (UTC)
- Reply There are no reliable sources that attribute notability to this individual. As such, the indivudual is not notable. Please provide reliable sources if you feel that the subject is notable. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 15:10, 10 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Timotheus Canens (talk) 01:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Hinduism-related deletion discussions. -- -SpacemanSpiff 03:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

I added some references from The Miami Herald article. Below I provide an exerpt from a review of Gopiparanadhana and his translation of Sanskrit text Brihad Bhagavatamrita by Joseph T. O’Connell, Ph.D. Professor Emeritus, St. Michael’s College, University of Toronto. It was published as a foreword to the Brihad Bhagavatamrita BBT edition.

Excerpt from review of one of Gopiparadhana's translation. Click at right to show.
The present edition includes translations by Gopiparanadhana Dasa of both the basic poem and its commentary (plus appendices, glossary, etc.). This is an extraordinary labor of love! The Brihad-bhagavatamrita alone contains some 2,500 Sanskrit verses, each requiring painstaking care even when (wisely) being rendered into idiomatic English prose rather than metrical verse. The commentary is considerably longer and, although in Sanskrit prose, is far from easy to convey in readable accurate English. Yet the task has been done and done well, an impressive achievement indeed. When I began to examine the proofs for this book, I was pleased to find that Gopiparanadhana Dasa’s English prose version reads clearly and crisply. Moreover, it conveys the excitement, wonder, and devotion of spiritual discovery that animates Sanatana’s own composition. The more I read, the more fascinated I became with Sanatana’s novel and brilliant retelling of themes emanating from the Srimad Bhagavata (but developed into much that is not found explicitly in that revered text). Depictions of progressively more intense and intimate modes of loving devotion build to a climax in the remarkable portrayal of Krishna at Dvaraka, depressed and anguished in absence from Radha and the gopis and restored to “normal” consciousness only by an artful ruse. The further I read, the less was I conscious that I was reading a translation, so naturally does one unit of the narrative flow into the next. When I did shift to the task of comparing portions of the translation with the Sanskrit, I was pleased to discover that the English prose is indeed very faithful to the Sanskrit original. One might quibble over the choice of certain idiomatic English phrases, but even these convey the basic sense. From the literal meaning of the original, little is left out, and very little is added, in the passage from Sanskrit to English. Inevitably, of course, some resonance is lost in any transition from poetic verse to prose translation. But, fortunately, because the Brihad-bhagavatamrita is mostly narrative and dialogue, it lends itself more readily to prose rendering than would other types of poetic verse. I would like to think that Sanatana Gosvami would welcome his modern prose translator as a kindred spirit and an able expositor of his work. The Dig-darsini, being itself prose, but prose in the peculiar form of Sanskrit textual commentary, presents the translator with a different set of challenges. In size, it is twice the length of the document which it interprets. In form and function, it resembles the complex footnotes of modern scholarship. In orientation, it assumes broadly ranging acquaintance with traditional Vaisnava themes, Sanskrit religious literature, and technical points of devotional aesthetics, theology, and philosophy. Faced with such challenges, many a translator—and, if not he or she, then the publisher—would resort to a paraphrase that drastically cuts down the size and simplifies the scholarship of the commentary and perhaps introduces an ersatz ideological or rhetorical interpretation in place of the more demanding and sophisticated orientation of the author. Not so the present translator and publisher. Both Gopiparanadhana Dasa and the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust are to be commended for respecting Sanatana’s auto-commentary as it is, in all its bulk and sophistication. The Brihad-bhagavatamrita and Dig-darsini together comprise a classic of religious literature whose integrity ought not be compromised. On a narrow scale, it is a classic in that it is the template for the theology and spiritual psychology that have remained authoritative for the Caitanya Vaisnava tradition. And though till now scarcely known beyond that tradition and those who study it, it is—or merits being so recognized—a classic on a global scale as well. Sanatana Gosvami’s chef d’oeuvre is a masterful exploration, grounded in Vaisnava devotional faith, of human spirituality and religious psychology, for the first time being made accessible in its entirety to the English-reading world. As the translator acknowledges, the English version of the Dig-darsini is a paraphrase, not a line-by-line translation. As such, it does not replace a close reading of the Sanskrit original for scholars equipped to do one. But, as the translator points out (and illustrates in the appendices), the paraphrasing is largely a matter of arrangement, not of selective excision or augmentation. From the portions of Volume One that I have compared closely, it is evident that Gopiparanadhana Dasa has managed to retain virtually all of the content of the original commentary, though with considerable rearrangement to facilitate reading. Were it his aim to produce a rigorously literal English rendering, some of his paraphrasing of Sanatana’s formulations might well have to be revisited. But, all things considered, he has done an admirable job of conveying the informational content and spiritual verve of the author—without bowdlerizing or truncating—in an idiom understandable to patient and attentive (though not necessarily expert) readers. I presume that the level attained in Volume One has been maintained through Volumes Two and Three. There is a special significance to this publication over and above its making accessible to readers of English a Sanskrit classic of spiritual literature. This is the first publication by the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust of a major Vaisnava theological text which disciples of the late Swami A. C. Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada have accomplished without his immediate presence. It follows the widely disseminated versions of the Bhagavad-gita in many languages and multi-volume translations of the Srimad Bhagavata Purana and the Caitanya-caritamrita, each of which is accompanied by an elaborate commentary. These prior publications were substantially the work of Prabhupada himself, with certain of his Sanskrit-trained devotees, including Gopiparanadhana Dasa, serving as apprentices. The appearance of the Brihad-bhagavatamrita thus marks a new phase of textual theological scholarship by members of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness. They have, as it were, come into their maturity as responsible for faithful transmission of the Caitanya Vaisnava tradition of prema-bhakti, loving devotion to God Krishna. What better way to assure fidelity to the words and spirit of Caitanya Mahaprabhu and his circle of immediate disciples than to enable devotees and attentive seekers to read, hear, and visualize the foundational texts of those very scholar-devotees who had experienced the charismatic presence of Krishna-Caitanya himself!

Excerpt from review of one of Gopiparadhana's translation. Click at right to show.

The present edition includes translations by Gopiparanadhana Dasa of both the basic poem and its commentary (plus appendices, glossary, etc.). This is an extraordinary labor of love! The Brihad-bhagavatamrita alone contains some 2,500 Sanskrit verses, each requiring painstaking care even when (wisely) being rendered into idiomatic English prose rather than metrical verse. The commentary is considerably longer and, although in Sanskrit prose, is far from easy to convey in readable accurate English. Yet the task has been done and done well, an impressive achievement indeed.
When I began to examine the proofs for this book, I was pleased to find that Gopiparanadhana Dasa’s English prose version reads clearly and crisply. Moreover, it conveys the excitement, wonder, and devotion of spiritual discovery that animates Sanatana’s own composition. The more I read, the more fascinated I became with Sanatana’s novel and brilliant retelling of themes emanating from the Srimad Bhagavata (but developed into much that is not found explicitly in that revered text). Depictions of progressively more intense and intimate modes of loving devotion build to a climax in the remarkable portrayal of Krishna at Dvaraka, depressed and anguished in absence from Radha and the gopis and restored to “normal” consciousness only by an artful ruse.
The further I read, the less was I conscious that I was reading a translation, so naturally does one unit of the narrative flow into the next. When I did shift to the task of comparing portions of the translation with the Sanskrit, I was pleased to discover that the English prose is indeed very faithful to the Sanskrit original. One might quibble over the choice of certain idiomatic English phrases, but even these convey the basic sense. From the literal meaning of the original, little is left out, and very little is added, in the passage from Sanskrit to English. Inevitably, of course, some resonance is lost in any transition from poetic verse to prose translation. But, fortunately, because the Brihad-bhagavatamrita is mostly narrative and dialogue, it lends itself more readily to prose rendering than would other types of poetic verse. I would like to think that Sanatana Gosvami would welcome his modern prose translator as a kindred spirit and an able expositor of his work.
The Dig-darsini, being itself prose, but prose in the peculiar form of Sanskrit textual commentary, presents the translator with a different set of challenges. In size, it is twice the length of the document which it interprets. In form and function, it resembles the complex footnotes of modern scholarship. In orientation, it assumes broadly ranging acquaintance with traditional Vaisnava themes, Sanskrit religious literature, and technical points of devotional aesthetics, theology, and philosophy. Faced with such challenges, many a translator—and, if not he or she, then the publisher—would resort to a paraphrase that drastically cuts down the size and simplifies the scholarship of the commentary and perhaps introduces an ersatz ideological or rhetorical interpretation in place of the more demanding and sophisticated orientation of the author.
Not so the present translator and publisher. Both Gopiparanadhana Dasa and the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust are to be commended for respecting Sanatana’s auto-commentary as it is, in all its bulk and sophistication. The Brihad-bhagavatamrita and Dig-darsini together comprise a classic of religious literature whose integrity ought not be compromised. On a narrow scale, it is a classic in that it is the template for the theology and spiritual psychology that have remained authoritative for the Caitanya Vaisnava tradition. And though till now scarcely known beyond that tradition and those who study it, it is—or merits being so recognized—a classic on a global scale as well. Sanatana Gosvami’s chef d’oeuvre is a masterful exploration, grounded in Vaisnava devotional faith, of human spirituality and religious psychology, for the first time being made accessible in its entirety to the English-reading world.
As the translator acknowledges, the English version of the Dig-darsini is a paraphrase, not a line-by-line translation. As such, it does not replace a close reading of the Sanskrit original for scholars equipped to do one. But, as the translator points out (and illustrates in the appendices), the paraphrasing is largely a matter of arrangement, not of selective excision or augmentation. From the portions of Volume One that I have compared closely, it is evident that Gopiparanadhana Dasa has managed to retain virtually all of the content of the original commentary, though with considerable rearrangement to facilitate reading. Were it his aim to produce a rigorously literal English rendering, some of his paraphrasing of Sanatana’s formulations might well have to be revisited. But, all things considered, he has done an admirable job of conveying the informational content and spiritual verve of the author—without bowdlerizing or truncating—in an idiom understandable to patient and attentive (though not necessarily expert) readers. I presume that the level attained in Volume One has been maintained through Volumes Two and Three.
There is a special significance to this publication over and above its making accessible to readers of English a Sanskrit classic of spiritual literature. This is the first publication by the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust of a major Vaisnava theological text which disciples of the late Swami A. C. Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada have accomplished without his immediate presence. It follows the widely disseminated versions of the Bhagavad-gita in many languages and multi-volume translations of the Srimad Bhagavata Purana and the Caitanya-caritamrita, each of which is accompanied by an elaborate commentary. These prior publications were substantially the work of Prabhupada himself, with certain of his Sanskrit-trained devotees, including Gopiparanadhana Dasa, serving as apprentices. The appearance of the Brihad-bhagavatamrita thus marks a new phase of textual theological scholarship by members of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness. They have, as it were, come into their maturity as responsible for faithful transmission of the Caitanya Vaisnava tradition of prema-bhakti, loving devotion to God Krishna. What better way to assure fidelity to the words and spirit of Caitanya Mahaprabhu and his circle of immediate disciples than to enable devotees and attentive seekers to read, hear, and visualize the foundational texts of those very scholar-devotees who had experienced the charismatic presence of Krishna-Caitanya himself!

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Gaura79 (talk • contribs)

Can someone sign this huge blurb? -- (User) Mb (Talk) 11:40, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

I did so on behalf of Gaura70 (see above). A Stop at Willoughby (talk) 21:17, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete -- Being a translator of works does not justify inclusion. Obviously there will be some reviews of his work, but it is not essential. Essential that he is a translator, and just being a translator is not a sufficient reason for inclusion in Misplaced Pages. I guess you both work for the same company: him and Gaura, thus you are anxious to keep him on. -- (User) Mb (Talk) 11:40, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Comment The sources added do not review of the person at hand. He is only mentioned as part of a larger project. This does not make him notable. Nothing point to him being a notable translator, if that is the claim. As is, the article should be deleted. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 18:49, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
- Well, I presented a reliable source which addresses him directly and in detail.--Gaura79 (talk) 20:13, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
  - The above "reliable source" is a part of the forward to a book this individual translated. That still does not make this individual notable, although the original text may be. Do you have any reviews from notable Sanskrit, Religion, or South Asian Studies journals? Those would work, but none exist. As is, the article is still about a person who translated a notable book - that does not make the translator notable by association. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 21:12, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment While the Brihad Bhagavatamrita may be a notable text; this individual's translation of it is not. This translation is not a notable text in itself, nor is the translator Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 22:51, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete ~~for now~~: WP:ONESOURCE (1 article in Miami Herald) and all other sources are ISKCON (BBT) sites, writing about an author of a BBT book (most publishers do that to sell their books). Though Brihat Bhagavatamrita is notable, but notability of the translation outside ISKCON is questionable. There are several translations of the Gita, not each one is notable as of Prabhupada or Ramakrishan. I am willing to change the vote if notability is proved by more non-ISKCON (non-BBT) references. --Redtigerxyz 02:53, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment Note that the second reference provided by me is not a "BBT reference". It is a scholarly review of Gopiparanadhana's work. The fact that it was published in a BBT book does not make it BBT reference. His Brihad Bhagavatamrita translation is the first and the only full translation of this work into English, and it has received a positive review from a specialist in the field. --Gaura79 (talk) 10:42, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Lets be practical, if scholar X gives a unfavourable review of book A, book A is not going to print X's opinion. Forwards do sell books and can not be regarded as an unbiased review of a book. Also, the first few lines of Miami Herald (that is all I can read in the link, full article not available) seem to suggest the article is about ISKCON in general. Correct me, if I am wrong.--Redtigerxyz 12:48, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

The Miami Herald article is about ISKCON in general, with Gopiparanadhana receiving only some coverage in it. But a scholarly review is a scholarly review, no matter where it was published. The problem here, as you mentioned above, is WP:ONESOURCE. The subject of the article received coverage only in one source, which generally is not enough for a standalone article. I suggest merging the article with Bhaktivedanta Book Trust. Your thoughts?--Gaura79 (talk) 15:17, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Forewords in general are not independent sources and are arranged by the author. (User) Mb (Talk) 13:26, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Merging in Bhaktivedanta Book Trust will be an WP:UNDUE. --Redtigerxyz 16:20, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

What I meant is to include only a limited information on him in relation with the books he translated and edited for the BBT.--Gaura79 (talk) 18:01, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, limited information can be merged into BBT if a section on all BBT authors is written. --Redtigerxyz 02:22, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

Also taking into consideration his position in ISKCON's Governing Body, I think he deserves a standalone article on Wiki.--Gaura79 (talk) 14:05, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep -- the guy is the top shot in GBC Sastric Advisory committee, the group of selected knowledgeble brahminical advisors. From it's inseption so far as I know. Wikid 03:24, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

Reply As this is a BLP, please provide reliable sources. If none are provided, then the article should be deleted. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 00:28, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Minutes of the Governing Body Comission are a reliable primary source, regardless where it is cited. Are you disputing that Gopiparanadhana is a key member of GBC SAC? Or that it does not exist? He is also the author of the Foreword to Surender Unto Me for example, a study material of the Vaishnava Insitute of Higher Education, also used in Bhaktivedanta College and referenced in Vedabase, not nessesarly notable, but interesting to note., the website of Iskcon Ministry of Education calles him: "one of ISKCON's most renowned devotee-scholars, Gopiparanadhana Prabhu" . There is a lot of work for the article to become decent or good, but the subject itself is quite notable. Wikid 00:43, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Reply How is this "Sastric Advisory committee" notable? And, how is being a member of this committee make one notable? Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 01:17, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Reply -- Governing Body Commission is notable, and this person is Notable -- there are more than WP:ONESOURCE as per sources above. Being a guru, besides being an advisor to GBC is also notable. Sources for the article need further improvement. Wikid 13:11, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Reply I agree with Cunard's articulate statement, below, on why this article should be deleted. Do you have any response to the lack of reliable sources? If not, the article should be deleted. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 18:58, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete per the lack of significant coverage in reliable sources. At the moment, the article presents nine references; however none of them are sufficient. I have analyzed and listed the sources in the article as of this revision:

Analysis of the sources in the article
1. This article from the Miami Herald is insufficient because it is not specifically about Gopiparadhana. From what I can see in the blurb, the article appears to be about Elliot Klein, an oceanfront condominium owner. 2. http://catalog.bbt.info/d_show_author.php?id=3&target_language=1 is insufficient because it does not appear to be a reliable source; neither does it appear independent of the subject. 3. http://www.iskconeducation.org/index.php?p=news&id=98 is insufficient because it is not a neutral, third-party source. The article begins with, "We are happy to announce that the fifth Bhagavata Sastri course at Govardhana is going to start in just 75 days from now ..." Furthermore, this article only mentions Gopiparadhana once. 4. http://www.krishna.se/Gopi.html does not appear to be a third-party, reliable source. 5. The subject's translation of Śrī Bṛhad-bhagavatāmrta does not serve to be a sufficient source that establishes notability. 6. This e-book that was translated by the subject does not establish notability. 7. http://www.krishnamedia.org/e-books/Mukunda_Mala_Stotra.pdf – same as #6. 8. Srmiadbhagavata.org is not a third-party source because it lists Gopiparadhana under the heading of "Who We Are / Teachers". 9. http://in.linkedin.com/pub/gopiparanadhana-dasa/10/971/21b – LinkedIn is not a reliable, third-party source because the content is user-generated and thus has not received the editorial fact-checking that reliable sources receive.

Analysis of the sources in the article

1. This article from the Miami Herald is insufficient because it is not specifically about Gopiparadhana. From what I can see in the blurb, the article appears to be about Elliot Klein, an oceanfront condominium owner.
2. http://catalog.bbt.info/d_show_author.php?id=3&target_language=1 is insufficient because it does not appear to be a reliable source; neither does it appear independent of the subject.

3. http://www.iskconeducation.org/index.php?p=news&id=98 is insufficient because it is not a neutral, third-party source. The article begins with, "We are happy to announce that the fifth Bhagavata Sastri course at Govardhana is going to start in just 75 days from now ..." Furthermore, this article only mentions Gopiparadhana once.
4. http://www.krishna.se/Gopi.html does not appear to be a third-party, reliable source.
5. The subject's translation of Śrī Bṛhad-bhagavatāmrta does not serve to be a sufficient source that establishes notability.
6. This e-book that was translated by the subject does not establish notability.
7. http://www.krishnamedia.org/e-books/Mukunda_Mala_Stotra.pdf – same as #6.
8. Srmiadbhagavata.org is not a third-party source because it lists Gopiparadhana under the heading of "Who We Are / Teachers".
9. http://in.linkedin.com/pub/gopiparanadhana-dasa/10/971/21b – LinkedIn is not a reliable, third-party source because the content is user-generated and thus has not received the editorial fact-checking that reliable sources receive.

Translating books does not make an individual notable. Neither does being an advisor on a committee establish notability. Only significant coverage in reliable sources ensures an individual's notability. I do not see this here.

This article should be deleted for failing Misplaced Pages:Biographies of living persons, Misplaced Pages:Notability (people), and Misplaced Pages:Verifiability. Cunard (talk) 05:59, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Weak keep as a leader of ISKCON, roughly equivalent to a bishop. Bearian (talk) 02:10, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Cirt (talk) 00:04, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Dharma Mittra

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Non-notable religious leader. Ism schism (talk) 05:27, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Religion-related deletion discussions. —Ism schism (talk) 05:28, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 16:36, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:43, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Timotheus Canens (talk) 01:47, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Hinduism-related deletion discussions. -- -SpacemanSpiff 03:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep I'm finding quite a few third-party references to him and his work, as well as many yoga studios across the US that follow his style or whatever. He may not be of huge notability outside the field of yoga, but within that field he appears quite notable. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 01:11, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep Seems to be notable. There'a an article about him here--Gaura79 (talk) 13:07, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Cirt (talk) 10:18, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
Note

Relisted after vandalism by IP . Also, warned the IP. Cheers, Cirt (talk) 10:21, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

keep "Non-notable religious leader" (?), he's a yoga teacher, and notable. Mentioned in "Encyclopaedia of India, Pakistan and Bangladesh, Volume 3" and therefore per def notable. Power.corrupts (talk) 22:59, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. NW (Talk) 05:01, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Banahaw Broadcasting Corporation

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WP:N / Plagarism Nefariousski (talk) 01:40, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete Cite/reference tag added 7 months ago, no work has been done to improve since, station has been defunct for over 20 years, article uses weasel words, article provides little to no encyclopedic value and large portions of article are copypasted from other webpages verbatim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nefariousski (talk • contribs) 01:43, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep. Once notable, always notable. The fact that a station or company no longer operates is not a reason to delete an article. Licenced television stations are always notable. As for the claims of plagiarism, please indicate what has been copied from where. Removing copyvio text is better than deleting an article. - Eastmain (talk • contribs • count) 02:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. – Eastmain (talk) 02:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Philippines-related deletion discussions. – Eastmain (talk) 02:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Speedy Keep. What part of the article is copied and pasted from other web sites? "Defunct for over 20 years" is not a valid deletion reason, or we'd have no articles on DuMont Television Network or Paramount Television Network. Company history was apparently cited by the Supreme Court of the Philippines here, more info can easily be found. Firsfron of Ronchester 03:55, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Merge and redirect to DWWX-TV#History. Mandsford (talk) 14:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, misguided nomination. No evidence of plagiarism/copyvio provided. Notability exists in the fact that it was a licensed TV station. The article could use a serious touchup though. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 00:30, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, still needs resources, but is notable and had a substantial role in Philippine television during Martial Law. Blake Gripling (talk) 03:26, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, although this station is defunct decades ago, it is notable since it took over ABS-CBN, one of the leading networks in the Philippines during the Martial Law era. -WayKurat (talk) 10:43, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep, and Move to DWWX-TV#History and ABS-CBN Broadcasting Corporation#History. - Gabby 18:51, 17 January 2010 (PST).

The result was redirect to Portia. Tone 11:21, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Portia (Shakespeare)

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Delete Portia is already about the Merchant of Venice character, the Julius Caesar sounds very minor, and Portia (disambiguation) is the right place to handle any disambiguation of "Portia". I doubt normal people searching Misplaced Pages randomly put parentheses around search terms. Cybercobra (talk) 01:34, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note to self: RfD Portia (Shakespeare) (disambiguation) --Cybercobra (talk) 10:43, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. The disambig page is quite clear. StAnselm (talk) 08:19, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Redirect to Portia (disambiguation). Polarpanda (talk) 10:36, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Redirect to Portia (disambiguation), this is what I intended to do when removing the prod template. Alternatively, it could redirect to Portia, with a hatnote for the other character. The page was originally an article about both characters, and still contains the history of that article, also there may be links to it from external sites, so the redirect is probably worth keeping. snigbrook (talk) 15:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Disambiguations-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 18:22, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
I wouldn't have thought it necessary, but the page seems to get around 600 hits per month. Therefore, redirect to Portia (disambiguation) seems most prudent. (By the same token, Portia (Shakespeare) (disambiguation) should also redirect there.) Cnilep (talk) 20:37, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Merge and Redirect to Portia (disambiguation). -- Quiddity (talk) 21:25, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Redirect to Portia (disambiguation) as an {{R from incomplete disambiguation}} (and delete Portia (Shakespeare) (disambiguation)). -- JHunterJ (talk) 23:01, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete, and delete Portia (Shakespeare) (disambiguation) as well. I have re-organized Portia (disambiguation) to include both entries in their proper places. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 00:04, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Arbitrarily0 12:04, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

North Cyprus Free Press

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No third party reliable sources found to support this blog being notable. 16x9 (talk) 00:58, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete: I can't find significant coverage for this website. Joe Chill (talk) 02:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete: The only links/sources I can find are in forums, social networking sites, and lists of similar entities. Notability not established. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 23:23, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. NW (Talk) 05:00, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

2009 Toronto blackout

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Per WP:NOTNEWS - this blackout had no notable lasting effect such as the Northeast Blackout of 2003 did. –xeno 00:49, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete - Article previously deleted. Does not meet Misplaced Pages:Notability guidelines.eja2k 00:57, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Just as a point-of-order it was deleted as a prod (and the re-creation could be considered a "contesting of the prod"), so that doesn't really have too much relevance. –xeno 00:59, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment. One might hope that Toronto Hydro and Hydro One took steps to make their networks more reliable as a result of this blackout, but I cannot find documentation of this. One might also hope that people in Toronto learned to take precautions against a possible future blackout, but most people probably didn't. But it did affect a lot of people who worked or lived in the affected area. - Eastmain (talk • contribs • count) 02:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ontario-related deletion discussions. - Eastmain (talk • contribs • count) 02:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete, it's WP:NOTNEWS for Misplaced Pages. The 2003 one was, however summer's over. ConCompS talk review 02:27, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete per nom. —DoRD (talk) 02:44, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete per nom. This was a minor blackout--I live in Toronto and it was a nuisance, but hardly worthy of an article. The 2003 blackout on the other hand was significant and obviously goes beyond WP:NOTNEWS. freshacconci talktalk 03:10, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was keep. Olaf Davis (talk) 21:47, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Pr0metheus burning

AfDs for this article:

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Non-notable band, fails WP:BAND. Previously deleted via AFD but that was quite a while ago so I thought new consensus was called for. Prod removed without comment. TheJazzDalek (talk) 00:46, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. —TheJazzDalek (talk) 00:48, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

~~Delete - This band doesn't meet any of the criteria for inclusion.~~ —DoRD (talk) 02:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
- With the information in the updated article, the band may indeed meet the guidelines. —DoRD (talk) 14:12, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
~~Delete~~ Neutral, hard to believe it's been over four years since the last AfD and they still only have 165 unique GHits. I really can't find anything in a reliable source that could indicate notability at all. Good luck to 'em, maybe in 2014. Glenfarclas (talk) 04:27, 13 January 2010 (UTC) EDITED TO SAY: feeling roughly neutral now per ArmadniGeneral's discussion. I can't get too excited about a writeup in the local free alt-weekly; it's the nature of alternative papers to write about underground bands performing at local dive bars. We're talking about the type of paper that has ads for strippers and bongs in the back. However, I'll take the word of others who know more that the labels this band has released on are at least somewhat prominent for this type of music. This band seems to be somewhere around the extreme low end of notability, even in this genre. Glenfarclas (talk) 10:15, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment: They have a tendency to be named as "Prometheus Burning" rather than "Pr0metheus Burning". Try Googling for that, and you will find 120,000+ hits. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 07:27, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
  - Tried that before the nomination. Didn't find anything usable for the article, just things like twitter, last.fm, myspace, etc. See WP:GHITS. TheJazzDalek (talk) 10:29, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
~~Delete.~~ Keep. Sadly, I can't find any independent coverage by any reliable sources. Criterion 5 of WP:BAND would be the most plausible argument to keep, but I don't believe Hive Records can realistically be considered a 'more important indie label' and even if it were the absence of outside coverage or other claim to notability would prevent me from !voting keep. J04n(talk page) 12:50, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Changing to keep per the sources added to the article by ArmadniGeneral, particularly , , and . J04n(talk page) 08:02, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep per WP:BAND IF "In addition to playing much of the east coast and midwest, the group has also played several shows in Canada over the years" can be proven true. Bearian (talk) 04:41, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- In addition to being verifiable, it has to have received non-trivial coverage in a reliable source, per WP:BAND. Also note that the criterion specifies concert tour, not just "several shows". TheJazzDalek (talk) 09:59, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
  - Can someone define what "reliable independant sources" you're looking for to cite - when discussing tour history? How is a complete list of tours and shows played on the bands official site considered inadequate? --Syphir (talk) 23:19, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
    - A list of tour dates is trivial coverage. Non-trivial coverage in a reliable sources would be something like an article about the tour in a magazine or newspaper (or better-known website). Additionally, the band's website is a primary source and, as such, is unreliable. TheJazzDalek (talk) 00:30, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
- Comment: I have located a source confirming at least one performance in Canada and added it to the article, along with many other citations. I have also located several promotional posters from Canadian venues advertising Pr0metheus Burning's appearance, however I suppose these can't count as reliable sources. Nonetheless we have confirmation that, as of November 2007 they had performed at least one Canadian event. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 07:04, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
  - The issue really isn't "did they play in Canada?" but "has any tour received non-trivial coverage in a reliable source?".
Keep: First of all, anyone noting that this article has been deleted previously should note, as the nominator has noted, that the band has undergone developments since that time. Let us keep in mind that WP:N and its related subpages are guidelines, and are "best treated with common sense." Thus I see freedom to move around within them. Getting to the point, the band has released three albums on established, though independent, labels. In addition the article claims that they are working on a fourth (though it is uncited, I am AGF in lieu of third-party confirmation until it is available). I have spent some time tracking down sources for the article, and IMO have been successful. I have even located one article from the Pittsburgh City Paper dedicated entirely to Pr0metheus Burning, although it is somewhat dated. We must keep in mind the relatively-underground status of industrial/electronic music in the United States, thus the difficulty of locating an array of references from familiar sources. Just because something isn't popular doesn't mean it's not notable within the scope of its own genre. That said, I believe the article and the topic meet WP:BAND, criteria 1 and 5. Under criterion 1, the band has had an entire article written about them in the Pittsburgh City Paper, definitely a reliable source and certainly not trivial coverage. Further, the band's albums have been the topic of (at the very least) two reviews by Igloo Magazine and ReGen Magazine, which are popular and notable within the genre. Under criterion 5, the band has released two albums with Hive Records, and one with Crunch Pod, although they might be less notable. Hive Records may not be well known in pop culture, but it is notable to those appreciative of industrial, electronic, or otherwise "underground" music. (Additionally, with the release of Electronic Saviors it may meet criterion 10 as well, although we shall have to wait and see.) If this article is kept I would like to do a rearrangement/reworking of it. –ArmadniGeneral (talk • contribs) 07:04, 15 January 2010 (UTC)
- Criterion 1 states multiple non-trivial published works—1 non-trivial article is a great start but falls far short. Criterion 5 states two or more albums on a major label or one of the more important indie labels—Hive is neither a major label nor is it an important indie. Industrial/electronic music is well-established and there are dozens of bands in that genre that are notable enough for inclusion on Misplaced Pages that have no trouble passing WP:MUSIC. If a band is so far underground that they can't pass WP:MUSIC, then they're too far underground for Misplaced Pages. TheJazzDalek (talk) 10:29, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep: I feel ArmadniGeneral has done an outstanding job hunting down references, and I feel they should be adequate enough to keep the article alive. I don't understand how they fall short of being popular enough for Misplaced Pages. There are many artists of many other genres, even more underground than Industrial - who have been considered popular enough. How does Prometheus Burning differ? They have received considerable popularity within the Industrial scene. They have toured extensively, and have been associated with pretty big names on tours and compilations in very recent years. The references show that. They aren't too underground for Misplaced Pages - they're not a garage band playing shows in peoples' basements. Industrial itself simply isn't the most popular genre in the world. Just because you've never heard of them doesn't or they may never receive pop radio airplay doesn't mean they're not relevant to the genre at this moment. Also, Hive Records is considered a very important record label within the Industrial community - just about anyone who's involved in Industrial music knows what Hive Records is as far as I'm aware. It's very relevant and noteworthy. --Syphir (talk) 06:27, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NW (Talk) 05:00, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Keep it looks like it meets WP:BAND, no need to relist even. JBsupreme (talk) 10:04, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
Keep. This article now satisfies WP:BAND well enough for me. Kudos to User:ArmadniGeneral for his work in locating and incorporating the above sources. Gongshow 18:13, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 00:08, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

Indigo Cheminformatics Toolkit

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Reference review:

Home page- Reliable source, not independent of the subject
Sourceforge- Reliable source, trivial
Three Google Newsgroups- Not reliable sources
Depth-First- Blog, not reliable source
So much to do, so little time- Blog, not reliable source
Google Code- Reliable source, trivial
Charlie’s path to dEAth- Blog, not reliable source
Noel O'Blog- Blog, not reliable source
Three presentations- Reliable sources, trivial

I can't find significant coverage for this software. Joe Chill (talk) 00:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Software-related deletion discussions. -- Joe Chill (talk) 00:36, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

delete (looks like an advert) Tedickey (talk) 01:14, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Delete. It's not as spammy as a lot of these software articles, so I'm willing to believe it's not an out-and-out advertisement, but this software is certainly run-of-the-mill non-notable. Like Joe, I can't find any significant coverage (and basically no insignificant coverage either, for that matter). Glenfarclas (talk) 04:30, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Comment I'm not sure what Joe means by trivial, but the presentations are WP:PRIMARY sources. Pcap ping 02:34, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
- I meant trivial as in not significant coverage. I think that no presentations show notability for software. I didn't think of saying primary because I have only skimmed through that page. Joe Chill (talk) 02:39, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
Delete. This is pretty new software and insofar it doesn't meet our standards for inclusion. The only secondary coverage I was able to find were more blogs. Pcap ping 02:48, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NW (Talk) 05:00, 20 January 2010 (UTC)