Misplaced Pages

This is a legitimate alternative account, clearly labelled on the user page, created to gather diffs during the arbcom review and efterwards. The reporter here, as before, is a sockpuppet of the banned editor Echigo mole, who has been extensively trolling in the last few days on various high profile project pages. Please see Misplaced Pages:Sockpuppet investigations/Echigo mole. Mathsci (talk) 16:18, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

On the evidence page, I think I mentioned that rough diffs were being gathered on alternative accounts. The dots were to prevent Echigo mole (the indefinitely blocked user above) from creating more mischief, since the labelling of the previous alternative account allowed him to find it previously and advertise it. I have sent a detailed account to the arbcom mailing lists and do not wish to discuss this further here. Because so much evidence was submitted in private by the site banned party and her site banned partner, the only way of gathering diffs involving mutliple parties was in this fashion. You found out about this because of the trolling of Echigo mole and, instead of asking questions on my talk page or by email, have taken a confrontational position in which you assume extreme bad faith. You have not on the other hand carried out a checkuser on either of the two sockpuppet accounts (now blocked) of Echigo mole. Please could you do so and leave the discussion of these pages (for rough diffs) to the arbitration committee when they have received my mail? Just to correct Jclemens, evidence is not usually permitted on subpages. Roger Davies copied part of my response during the Requests for amendment to a subpage of the review. These pages for rough diffs were not evidence subpages, but pages for rough diffs. I hope that makes things clearer in your mind. But please could you look at the two accounts Krod Randoon and Jello carotids? Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 18:26, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

The existence of the subpages was mentioned explicitly and openly in this diff The first page is now a subpage of the review pages, which Roger Davies requested me to create. The other four pages were on Alternative-mathsci before Echigo mole started making mischief. Perhaps when you read the talk page of the evidence page, you accidentally missed that comment. I can't remember now exactly how Echigo mole trolled on the first alternative account Alternative-mathsci, but you can look at the deleted pages more easily than me. Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 18:58, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

@FPaS: I wrote an explanation slightly longer than the above to the arbcom mailing lists. At the end of the message which I sent before seeing your posting here, I stated, "Now that the amendment has passed, I would normally request that these pages be deleted." So yes if you can delete these pages (which were still in use during the request for amendment), that would be very kind. Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 19:21, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

@FPaS: presenting a case about proxy-editing involving 5 or more editors is too complicated for me to do off-wiki. I first gathered all the diffs, many of which were redundant, repetitive or of no signifiacnce, and then went through them several times clicking them to see which were particularly relevant. I don't know a way of seeing what's in a diff once I've recorded it off-wiki. In preparing the second set of evidence, I was in the midst of also writing an elaborate set of lectures to be given in early May at a conference in the USA, so was under tight time constraints (essentially no time, although I had to make time). Anyway I was quite open about how I prepared my evidence and arbitrators did not object to my statement that I was collecting rough diffs on an alternative account. Mathsci (talk) 19:40, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

@Jclemens: this editor repeated edits of a confirmed sockpuppet of Echigo mole on WP:AN in a thread devoted to him, started by a completely different user. Elen of the Roads blocked this user before for similar edits without carrying out a checkuser and sympathised with me in private. But surely Jclemens must have looked at the archive page and noticed that Echigo mole has played the same game before with Altmathsci, an alternative account that was used for recording details of his abuse of vodafone accounts? That report was made by Southend sofa (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), eventually indefinitely blocked and also certainly a sockpuppet of Echigo mole (from the comments he made. Jclemens seems now to be in denial about the wikistalking. Multiple editors have removing the trolling edits of Echigo mole on sight at WP:AN. FPaS has blocked several socks on sight per WP:DUCK. The reasonable thing to do in the circumstances would for Jclemens to run a checkuser on the two accounts I have mentioned, both of he sleeper accounts created in 2009. The preliminary edits are the hallmarks of a sockpuppet account (10 edits to article space to render the account autoconfirmed). But I have made a full presentation to the arbcom committee including details of Jclemens' comments on my talk pabout his own involvement. Mathsci (talk) 19:51, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

As far as Altmathsci is concerned, Echigo mole already made the following edits to User:Altmathsci/vodafone as Old Crobuzon (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log): . that MfD nomination was deleted by AGK, who blocked Old Crobuzon as a sockpuppet of Echigo mole. That disruptive conduct is being repeated here by the user who made a series of disruptive edits on WP:AN, which could only have been made by Echigo mole. What doubt is there in cases like this? Mathsci (talk) 20:38, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

Given the behaviour of Old Crobuzon, the SPI report of Southend sofa and the repeated disruption by Echigo mole during the requests for amendment, I declared the account Aixoisie in exactly the same way as Alternative-mathsci and Altmathsci, i.e. on the alternative account page. Jclemens presumably read the arbcom review page to which I referred above when I placed my comment there. "There are also four subpages elsewhere on an alternative account where diffs were gathered." So Jclemens must have read that statement 2 months ago on 27 March. He raised no objections then, either by email, on my talk page or on the review pages. He did nothing at all. Nor did any other arbitrator. Nor did any arbitrators request to know what the alternative account was. (Roger Davies, because of his background, would notice the deprecating pun in the last created alternative account username, since I happen to be the editor who has most edits on Aix, nothing was being hidden.) However, nobody requested to know the name of the alternative account which was moved to the second account when Echigo mole made similar edits as he had while socking as Old Crobuzon. Certianly if Jclemens or anybody had requested the name of the account by email, I would have supplied it. However, unlike Ferahgo and Occam I did not communicate in private to arbcom mailing lists during the review, except in response to emails from Roger Davies. If Jclemens wishes to invent new rules after the event, I suppose he can, but it doesn't seem to be reasonable or related to the way in which wikipedia functions. Mathsci (talk) 20:55, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

On 29 March Southend sofa (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) made an SPI request here listing the accounts Alternative-mathsci and Altmathsci. That request were turned out by checkusers. Several administrators commented. The files existed at that point also, since Aixoisie was only created on April 1, 3 days after the report was made. (Perhaps I was even unaware of the report.) Jclemens could again have expressed his strong objections there but did not. I don't understand why each time this disruptive editor/wikihounder Echigo mole trolls on wikipedia an increasingly elaborate account has to be given. Jclemens seems to be out of kilter with AGK, Elen of the Roads, Newyorkbrad, Casliber and Shell Kinney at least, as well as a whole series of other checkusers. Presumably he has his personal reasons in seemingly wanting to "write me out of the equation" by capitalising on my long term harrassment by a wikihounder. It is not particularly pleasant, since this editor also has made several attempts to out me on wikipedia, having determined my RL identity. Jclemens seems to show no empathy at all. Mathsci (talk) 21:25, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

• Note also: The subpage User:Alternative-mathsci/subpage still exists. I had forgotten about it: I have requested speedy deletion. The other subpages were User:Alternative-mathsci/subpage1, User:Alternative-mathsci/subpage2, User:Alternative-mathsci/subpage3 and User:Alternative-mathsci/subpage4, all speedy deleted on the 1 April by JohnCD, shortly after my request. Just before that I had amalgamated the numbered subpages into one file and placed that in the user space of Aixoisie. Note that the account that created the problems was Southend sofa (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) who was blocked later as a sockpuppet of Echigo mole by DeltaQuad 2 weeks later, after more evidence came to light. Alternative-mathsci (talk) 21:45, 26 May 2012 (UTC)/Mathsci (talk) 21:48, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

In addition FPaS reverted the fresh report on this page as "rv sock edits", half an hour before blocking the sockpuppet. What has changed since 29 March and Southend sofa's report? Jclemens unwillingness to investigate sockpuppets and his own double standard for FPaS and the reversion and for me and the trolling edits of Jello carotids on the SPI page for Echigo mole that I requested.  Sounds like a duck quacking into a megaphone to me Which new user does Jclemens think made this edit in support of another indefinitely blocked sockpuppet. the same editor creating a false consensus through tag-teaming? It is very hard to describe that kind of edit as anything other than blatant trolling by Echigo mole. Jclemens seems to be suggesting otherwise and it is unclear why. Mathsci (talk) 22:27, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

Note also that during the Muhammad images case, I prepared a list of rough annotated diffs in response to a question from Elonka on the workshop page. At the request of NuclearWarfare, that was moved gradually to the evidence page. The subpage was deleted at my request a little while after a selection of those diffs had been transferred to the evidence page (21 January). Mathsci (talk) 23:38, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

• Jclemens reponses below seem muddled. The reversion was on WP:Sockpuppet investigations/Echigo mole not here. The sockpuppet was the accused and had already been reverted here by FPaS. I was making the report on him; there have been numerous cases where he has answered back interminably (for example as William Hickey and Ansatz). In the actual review a specific question was asked about harrassment by socks. I gave a detailed response that was ignored. No evidence was presented by anybody at all suggesting that my activities on SPI reports concerning Echigo mole were problematic. Now Jclemens now appears to be misrepresenting my current editing and the findings on past editing at WP:Sockpuppet investigations/Echigo mole. Those pages were semiprotected by AGK precisely because of persistent trolling by Echigo mole there. That has not stopped. Mathsci (talk) 23:52, 26 May 2012 (UTC)