Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 04:16, 22 October 2012

Writ Keeper

Voice your opinion on this candidate (talk page) (113/2/3); Scheduled to end 23:08, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

Nomination

Writ Keeper (talk · contribs) – It is my pleasure to propose Writ Keeper for your consideration as admin. He is relatively new, at least from where I'm sitting, and has impressed me, quickly picking up knowledge of the policies and guidelines and conversing with editors old and new. He does good work in various areas where a tool comes in handy, such as recent changes and new pages patrol, and in associated pages like UAA and occasionally RFPP, areas where I trust his judgment and where he intends to put the tools to use. I looked at his CSD log, which is pretty impressive. He'll be the first to admit that he's no competition for Dr. Blofeld in the field of article writing, but with some gentle nudges (from Uncle G and me) he did produce two DYKs, Sülde Tngri (a Mongolian god) and Adab al-Tabib (a medieval Arab book on medicine and ethics). What I find interesting is that these are nice articles in underdeveloped areas, quite a breath a fresh air, and that he was willing to dive into something he didn't know much about.

Writ Keeper does other stuff--stuff that I barely comprehend, scripts and the like; others can judge, at User:Writ Keeper/Scripts, how good it is. Hey, I think he might be clever enough to delete the main page (he once made me make an edit I never made--I still don't know what happened), and that in itself is reason enough to support him. He tells me he wants to work with edit filters and title blacklists and has suggested a few changes that have been implemented. He's also a really nice guy: I haven't seen him lose his temper or get into conflict, and he does lots of helpful stuff for new editors.

Closing remark: he tells me, and I have no reason not to believe him, that he intends to stay away from ANI. How about that? Drmies (talk) 02:36, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

Conomination from The Blade of the Northern Lights

I have to largely echo what Drmies says above, and perhaps add a bit of my own experience. As someone who patrols CAT:CSD and UAA with some frequency, I’ve seen Writ Keeper’s name on more than a few tags and reports, and I can’t remember having declined one yet. His 1905 deleted edits should quite nicely demonstrate the excellent work he does in speedy deletion and his thorough understanding of the sometimes counterintuitive policies surrounding it. He’s never had a problem calmly giving new users the right guidance and advice even in the face of a less than friendly attitude, one of the most important qualities of both a NPPer and an admin. And god knows we need more technically-oriented admins to do the really hard work to make civilized life possible for the rest of us. I have complete confidence he’ll make a great addition to the admin corps and continue to do an excellent job. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 22:48, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

Candidate, please indicate acceptance of the nomination here: I accept, thanks! Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 23:03, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

Questions for the candidate

Dear candidate, thank you for offering to serve Misplaced Pages as an administrator. Please answer these questions to provide guidance for participants:

1. What administrative work do you intend to take part in?

A: Mostly I'd start at UAA and CSD, also helping out at AIV, if there's a backlog there for some reason. Admin-y stuff that I'm already familiar with. I'd also be keeping an eye on RFPP, although I wouldn't actually be taking action there until I have a little more experience with it. Later down the road, I'd like to work on things like the title blacklist and edit filters, if those bits ever need help, though I definitely need to hone my PCRE skills first. Perhaps SPIs and stuff, I hear they need help every now and again. Really, my plan is to just help out wherever help is needed; I won't be rushing into anything headlong, but if I see an area that's chronically short on admins, I'll shadow it for a while, see how things work, and then start pitching in. As Drmies says, I have no desire to go near ANI, as either a commentator or a disputant; seems like we have enough of both to go around.

2. What are your best contributions to Misplaced Pages, and why?

A: For my best single piece of work, I'm pretty proud of how Adab al-Tabib turned out, though my content creation is an admittedly short list to choose from. Writing doesn't come very naturally to me, but it is the most important part of contributing to Misplaced Pages, and a surprisingly fun challenge. It's funny: I wouldn't have said that content creation was that important for choosing admins before I actually started doing it, but now I see why people say that. Outside of content creation, I'm proud of what I do at 3O and the Teahouse; they're both pretty fun and, although they're still never-ending tasks like maintenance work is, they feel less...sterile than pure maintenance work does.

3. Have you been in any conflicts over editing in the past or have other users caused you stress? How have you dealt with it and how will you deal with it in the future?

A: Nothing that really caused me stress, I'd say. I did get pretty annoyed at the SkepticAnonymous kerfuffle (the very first one) a few months back; wouldn't have remembered about it if I hadn't seen his name somewhere in the last week or two. It can be found at this diff; I'll let y'all be the judge. Context: I had watchlisted his talk page from a comment I left him about speedy deletion vs. prod; later I noticed that he had been blocked, so I popped in to try to give him some advice and things went downhill from there. My general strategy for dealing with Wikistress is usually to pop on some relaxing music, take a break, and come back with fresh eyes. I'm really not too worried about Misplaced Pages things; there's plenty other stuff to be worried about, no sense in worrying about this stuff, too. :)

Optional questions from jc37

In order to help determine whether you meet my criteria (including your knowledge/understanding of policies and processes in relation to the tools and responsibilities that go along with adminship), please answer the following questions.

• 4. How would you personally determine whether you are involved in any particular situation when deciding whether you should block (or unblock) an editor, and when deciding whether you should protect (or unprotect) a page.

• A: Well, the first step for me is to go read WP:INVOLVED. :) I really have no desire to be a drama magnet, so I'm probably going to be interpreting that pretty broadly. Basically, any username or article name that I recognize will me an automatic flag for me to consider myself involved and/or ask another admin's opinion. If I don't really remember where I remeber them from, I'll probably take a look at their talk page history/archives, see if I can find my interaction with them. If it's anything more than nominal, then I'd consider myself involved. By "nominal", I mean anything more than a brief message between us; any significant conversation between the two of us (detailed, handwritten messages, or several back-and-forth messages) would count. Obviously, it would have to be judged on a case-by-case basis, as with everything, but when in doubt, I'd be asking other people for opinions. We're not that short on admins that I couldn't find someone to ask, so no harm in erring on the side of caution.

• 5. Please describe/summarise why and when it would be appropriate for you to apply the policy to ignore all rules to a situation, while also explaining the interdependency between being bold and seeking (and/or following) consensus on Misplaced Pages.

• A: I don't think I can really give a concrete answer for this, because IAR by its nature is meant to be flexible and situation-specific. The key idea I try to keep in mind is that it's not what I think is best for Misplaced Pages, it's what Misplaced Pages as a whole (if there is such a thing) thinks is best for Misplaced Pages. It's more of a loose over strict interpretation of the rules (U.S. history analogy is the interpretation of the Constitution), instead of the rules not mattering. It's more useful for adapting the rules for novel situations that their formulation doesn't account for, rather than ignoring them outright. And one way or another, if I invoke bold or IAR, I better be ready to explain my actions, to have evidence on my side, and to be ready for people to disagree with it. Bold actions should (generally) start the conversation, not end it; then a new consensus can arise.

• 6. How do you determine consensus from a discussion? And how may it be determined differently concerning an RfC, an RM, an XfD, or a DRV.

• A: The glib answer is that consensus is wherever the strongest policy-based arguments are. It's not a headcount, though headcounts aren't entirely irrelevant, everything else (mainly strength of arguments) being equal. There usually isn't going to be a perfect agreement by all parties (if only there was!), so it has to be weighed to the best of one's ability. The important thing is the strength of the arguments, especially their grounding in established policy; global policy generally trumps local policy. RfCs, XfDs, RMs, and DRVs are similar in this regard, but they all have a different action if consensus hasn't been reached. Generally, the default result of a no-consensus discussion is to preserve the status quo, though they can also be relisted if there just weren't enough voices to make the consensus clear. For XfDs, the default is not to delete. For DRVs, the default is to remain deleted. For RMs, the default is to leave things where they are, unless it's an uncontroversial move that simply hasn't been discussed much. For RfCs (the most general in scope of the four), the default is to preserve whatever the current state is, unless there are BLP or other overriding concerns. There are also differences in the possible outcomes. RfCs are more open-ended; they can have many different possibilities to choose between. XfDs are generally choosing between delete or keep, but have other potential options, like merge or redirect. DRVs are pretty much just choosing between "endorse deletion" or "overturn". RMs are usually just supporting or opposing the requested move, although people can offer other alternatives.

• 7. User:JohnQ leaves a message on your talk page that User:JohnDoe and User:JaneRoe have been reverting an article back and forth, each to their own preferred version. What steps would you take?

• A: Well, the first step for me is to look at the article history and talk page to see what's going on, and whether people are trying to discuss things or just blindly edit-warring. Next, make sure I'm not involved (as above). Assuming that I see a real edit-war and not reversion of vandalism or BLP problems or the like, if it looks like they're using the talk page, I'll probably post there, asking them to stop editing the article and stay on the talk page to hash it out. Probably drop some talkback notices, to make sure it's not overlooked. If they're not using the talk page, I'll probably post a message to each of their talk pages, asking them to stop editing the article and move to the talk page. From there, hopefully we can work things out. If that doesn't work, then warnings are going to start going out. If that doesn't work (and I should be making sure that there's time for them to react to the messages in between steps), then blocks or page protection might have to follow. The choice between the two would really depend on the situation, I think: I'd have to balance the disruption to others caused by full protection against the fact that blocking prevents the user from participating in discussion. I'd probably ping a more experienced admin and ask their advice if I'm not sure; I'd definitely try to apply common sense here (as with everywhere else), but I don't see anything really helpful on the policy pages.

• 8. Why do you wish to be an administrator?

• A: Because I think I'd be more effective with the tools. I'd imagine it's an overused trope, but "admin-as-a-status" or "admin-as-a-role" doesn't really appeal to me. For one, there are admins I respect, but there are a lot of non-admins I respect as much or more, and there are a few admins (no names!) that I don't particularly respect, so I don't see it as "joining the ranks of the elite" or whatever. It's just a toolbox; one I think I could make good use of.

Additional questions from Amadscientist

My main areas of concern with new administrators are conflict/dispute resolution. Could you please address the follwing questions:

9. In regards to user conduct issues and the use of the block tool, many admin feel inclined to block and some inclined not to block. If an AN/I report was made against a user for civility and/or conduct issues and you regarded these issues as serious enough to deal with, please explain in general terms how you would determine whether or not a block would be justified and why you would consider not blocking as a better choice. (I give no example as to allow the candidate more room to speculate)

• A: Well, that's kinda a weird question, really, because it presupposes part of my response already. Conduct "patrol" is not something I have a desire to do, and so if I think it's serious enough to deal with, it's probably going to be pretty bad to begin with (not to mention that someone else will probably be on top of it). I'd imagine that I'm usually going to be asking for another admin's advice on matters of conduct and civility. One of the (few?) things that has been evident from the recent wiki-discussions on civility is that there are as many views on it as there are editors of Misplaced Pages. At least. Plus, there are culture barriers and even language barriers on occasion. So, I would be extremely reluctant to block for anything that's not really blatant, and even then, I'd still probably want a second opinion before I take action. The thing about blocking is that it can make people righteously indignant (for lack of a better term); it's more like avoiding or delaying the problem than dealing with it directly. Not to say that that's necessarily a bad thing, but it's not always the right move, and it's a move that I would think twice, three times, etc. before taking.

So to summarize: You find the very question weird to begin with because the scenario assumes you see something you would be willing to deal with (which is the point). You see civility issues as "Conduct patrol". If it is that bad you assume others would deal with it and you would still require assistance from another admin on even blatant civility issues. You believe blocking makes people indignant and is avoiding the problem and would think hard before using it.

My (Amadscientist) follow up questions are:

• Arbcom has kicked back civility issues to be dealt with by the community. Do you not see yourself as part of the communtiy as an admin?
• If you cannot place yourself in a situation where you have to make a choice, why should I trust you in the future to actaully make the right choice?(whatever that might be)
• Please elaborate on the "Conduct patrol" comment. Is this to say that you believe admin has no place with civility issues on Misplaced Pages?

Replies, in no particular order:

• It's not that it's something I'd be unwilling to deal with. It's more that you're assuming that I've already decided that it requires action. The problem is that, in the absence of a clear, specific, actively-enforced community standard on the matter, your and my standard of what requires action might be different, so I'm uncomfortable with working on that assumption, since we could be starting from two different points. All I meant by the "conduct patrol" comment was that I, as an admin, wouldn't be looking for conduct disputes to handle; I would just be finding them in passing. I didn't mean anything else by it; certainly wasn't a value judgement on admins who deal with conduct disputes (I specifically avoided the loaded term "civility police", and put patrol in quotes, to try to convey this). Ditto with the "other admins are on it already" comment; all I meant by that is, since I would've probably just happened across it, it has probably been reported already, and the people who watch for such things are probably already on it. It's not that I would ignore the problem and leave it for others to deal with (I wouldn't), it's that others most likely will have dealt with it already by the time I get there.
• It's not that I don't trust myself to make the right choice; it's that, again, in the absence of a clear, enforced standard of what is or isn't incivility, I wouldn't trust any one person to make the call by themselves. There are too many subjective factors in incivility, which include the culture and language barriers I mentioned. Unless it was completely 100% blindingly obvious, I think I would always try asking for a second opinion on a civility issue, because my standards are different than yours, than the two or more people involved in the dispute, than anyone else at Misplaced Pages. The more eyes, the better: a larger sample size might average out to something approximating the social norms, whatever those might be. Your summary of my feelings on blocking are accurate.

I have another follow up on this and will post it tomorrow. Thank you for taking a moment to address my questions!--Amadscientist (talk) 05:49, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

10. Adminship is "No big deal", however once made an admin you will have more user rights than an average editor. With only about a years experiance on Misplaced Pages, could you explain why you feel you are ready to deal with issues with more experianced editors?

• A: Forgive me, but I don't really understand the thrust of this question; I already deal with more experienced editors. It wouldn't really be any different from how it is now: I go in with the knowledge that they probably know what they're doing, that I can be wrong, and that they're another human being somewhere, and treat them accordingly. One of the models of DR that I really like is that of 3O. In 3O, you can ask for a third party's opinion without giving them any sort of power or authority over you. That's like what I'd want for my interactions as an admin. I know that the tools themselves are a big deal (after all, blocking and deleting can have pretty big negative impacts on users new and old if misused), but I don't think that makes me any more authoritative.

I'm pretty big on forgiveness. LOL! But to be honest you pretty much got the jest of what I was asking as I am satisfied with that answer.--Amadscientist (talk) 05:03, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

11. Dispute resolution is an important issue and one admins should have a good grasp of. As an editor in the last year, could you provide any or all examples where you helped to resolve a dispute that was between two or more editors for any reason, including content, conduct or behavior?

• A: As I said, I do work at 3O, so I've gotten some DR experience there. If you'll let me cherry-pick a bit, Talk:Hedge_fund/Archive_1#Systemic_risk is one that got settled pretty amicably (really, the whole thing was pretty amicable all throughout; a pleasant change of pace). Looking at my edit history to the WP:3O main page should yield some links to the disputes I've taken on there. If you'd like more examples, let me know; I'm not averse to doing some digging for them. Perhaps on the talk page or something?

Hmmmmm. While 30 is a part of the DR process, I am more interested in how you actually resolved the issue. Of the example you gave, could you elaborate on how the dispute was resolved?--Amadscientist (talk) 05:11, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Heh, fair enough. But I don't really have a set strategy when I go into DR. As someone once said, "I say what it occurs to me to say when I think I hear people say things." I guess my strategy, such as it is, is to try to distill the dispute down as much as I can. I feel that a lot of disputes in general tend to snowball a bit; people start to go on tangents, which then get picked up and debated, and things spiral out of control once the cumulative wieght of the dispute gets too big to handle. I see my role as trying to refine the dispute back to the essentials, try to broker an agreement on those essentials based on policy and common sense as much as possible, and then suggest overall solutions that match the core agreements. Really, it's just common sense throughout, at least to me.

That wasn't an answer to my actual question, which was: "Of the example you gave, could you elaborate on how the dispute was resolved?" To clarify, how did you resolve the dispute you mentioned from WP:3O?--Amadscientist (talk) 05:49, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Well, I first read the discussion from the two editors while looking at the article for context. If there are two specific versions of the article that the disputants are working with, then I like to have both open while I read, to gain context. I saw that there was a bit of a sidetrack with AWhiteC questioning Bryant about a COI, so I tried to clear that up at the outset. This allowed us to work on the real issues, since Bryant's possible COI wasn't affecting his edits problematically. There was another problem that seemed to be based on Bryant's misreading of a sentence, so we cleared that up next. The meat of the dispute was over the context of a quote; with the discussion now refocused, I allowed the two to go back and forth a bit, and when they appeared to be deadlocked, I stepped in with another variation, which was accepted by both of them.

I thought that was an excellent answer. Thank you. That satisfies my DR concerns.--Amadscientist (talk) 06:15, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Additional question from My76Strat

12. Do you believe you would feel an emotional pain if this RfA drew significant opposition, ultimately being unsuccessful?

A: Good question. Nope! As I said above, I'm really only interested in helping out with the tools. If I don't get them, no big deal; might be a minor efficiency loss for Misplaced Pages, but it's not that bad. I mean, obviously it'll sting a bit if people don't trust me, but I'm not perfect, and the tools can do a lot of damage if misused, so they should require trust. So, it is what it is. I like to think that I've been useful without them so far; no reason I can't continue being useful without them after this. Things will still get done; perhaps not quite as quickly with one more admin, but no big deal.

Thank you for that response; please indulge a follow-on consideration:

12a. I set the above question to allow the possibility that you could have answered with a simple yes or no. Please tell me the summary of your reasoning that moved you to prefer including additional extenuation's?

A:Two reasons: first, because it's been an aspect of this that I've been thinking about for a while, and I kinda wanted to get it down on paper (so to speak). To be honest, if you hadn't asked it, I probably would've said something to this effect in jc37's last question, but I thought it would fit better here. Second, because I don't see it as that straightforward; emotions rarely are. Would I describe my feelings as "emotional pain"? Not really. Would I feel some kind of negative feeling as a result of opposition? Well, yeah. I wouldn't say it reaches to the level of "emotional pain", but I would feel something.

Thank you for this response. FWIW I appreciate that you answered the question just as you did. Frankly if you had chosen to simply answer by saying "no", I'd have been disappointed. So again, thank you. 76Strat  da _Broke da (talk) 18:44, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Additional question from Hahc21

13. This is an inevitalbe situation you may live as an admin: blocking users. One way or the other you may live this in your future admin career. So, please give me a summary of how you interpret blocks from a blocked user perspective, from your personal perspective, and how it may have (from your perspective) permanent consequences on users when performed slightly.

A: Well, one of the telling things about blocking is how many new (and some not-so-new) users refer to it as a "ban". They take it personally and see it as they're kicked off of Misplaced Pages forever, which is totally understandable from their end. The trite expression applicable here is "preventative, not punitive"; that is a sensible saying, but we have to remember that not everyone sees it that way. Blocking is a tool: it's a means to an end, not an end in itself, and so we always have to evaluate whether it's the best way of reaching that end. Part of that is recognizing that it can and will drive away good-faith editors. But sometimes it still is the best tool in the box; people don't always listen to their talk page (or know it's there), page protection has the nasty side effect of locking out other, totally innocent editors, and we can't just let editors keep disrupting the article forever. I wish it were otherwise: I sometimes wonder whether some sort of pop-up chat window might have a better effect than the big orange bar, and it would be a bit more human an interaction. If that were implemented and it worked, that could avoid a lot of blocks. But it's not, possibly wouldn't gain consensus with the community (WP:NOTFACEBOOK and all that), so all we can do is what we can with what we have.

Additional question from Glrx

14. Please comment on the notability of Pope John Paul II Elementary School.

A: Ha, I vaguely remember that, now that you mention it. It's probably not notable, though as a school, it obviously doesn't qualify for A7 or anything. Thinking back, I think that's why I wanted to work on it; I stumbled across it probably from recent changes, saw the speedy deletion tag, and thought, "Why not, let's give it a shot." I don't find anything in a quick Google/GNews/Highbeam search, and that squares with my vague memories of not finding any sources that weren't just the school website, so it probably doesn't pass the GNG. That's why I ended up not being able to write anything about it, though I wasn't familiar enough with Misplaced Pages processes at the time to actually nominate it or even tag it or anything. (Keep in mind that I was only two weeks into Misplaced Pages at that point.)

Follow-on question from Kudpung

My questions are always entirely optional and I would not expect anyone to criticise you if you choose not to answer. You conceded that Pope John Paul II Elementary School is probably not notable. It's clear that schools do not qualify for A7, so I'm asking a). how, with an admin's knowledge of policies/guidelines/consensus, you would expect a New Page Patroller to handle such an article, and b). how you would expect a knowledgeable editor to vote on Pope John Paul II Elementary School if it were brought to AfD for being unsourced and failing to meet WP:GNG and WP:ORG? Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 01:39, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

Additional question from Salvio giuliano

15. Do you operate, or have you ever operated, other accounts on Misplaced Pages?

A: Yes, I have two other accounts. User:WK-test is my testing account; I use it to test scripts and the like without having to mess up my main account. User:White King is my "travel" account. ("Writ Keeper" and "White King" are references to the same thing, if anyone's curious; they can also both be abbreviated WK, which is handy). Both alt accounts are indicated on their user page; White King also uses the same signature as Writ Keeper, plus a little extra note. Now that I think of it, though, they're not identified on Writ Keeper's user page; I should go do that. I've operated no other accounts on Misplaced Pages.

Additional question from Tazerdadog

16. If given the mop, will you be open to recall, and if so, under what circumstances?

A: In a word, yes. I hear that a lot of people don't like this question, since it's inherently nonbinding. But, if a group of established (for a reasonable, non-excessive value of "established") users that would be considered uninvolved ask me to resign, citing a specific admin action that I've performed, I would ask a crat to remove my tools. After a while, probably a few days, I'd allow myself to ask for them back; the crat who handles the request (ideally but not necessarily the same one) would then determine whether they've considered me to have resigned "under a cloud", and that decision will be the one that sticks. I'm not going to pretend that that's a binding promise, since apparently it can't be one. But that's what I'd do.

Additional question from Chaser

17. What's the inspiration for your username?

A: I didn't come up with it, it's just the name of a minor character from Homestuck, a webcomic I read. "White King" (as in the chess piece) is another name for the same character, hence the name of my travel account as noted above.

Additional questions from I Jethrobot

18. You have correctly blocked a user for both general edit warring and violating 3RR on a given article, because they continued to revert despite several warnings. The user provides an unblock request saying, "I'm sorry if you thought that I offended other editors and edit warred. I want to keep contributing." How would you handle this unblock request?

A: Trick question! I wouldn't, because I already blocked them; uninvolved admin needed. :) In seriousness though, I'd try to get them to recognize what they did, perhaps by explaining edit-warring and 3RR in a little more depth. My intent isn't for them to put on a hair shirt and come crawling back, it's more that, if they don't understand what they did, they'll (a) continue the disruptive behavior, which is the entire thing blocks are supposed to prevent, and (b) probably be blocked again sooner rather than later. That said, I'm generally in favor of unblocks, on WP:ROPE grounds if nothing else. If they promise they won't edit-war again, and they haven't had a history of breaking such promises, that'd usually be good enough for me.

19. Do experienced editors deserve blocks of a different length or severity than newer editors for the same infraction (e.g. violating 3RR, repeated personal attacks, glamorous Reichstag climbing)? If so, what should be different? If not, why should they be the same?

A: Their block lengths should be the same in my eyes. If we're serious about prevention-not-punishment, blocks should be exactly as long as is needed to prevent disruption, and I don't see any reason why sheer, uncomplicated experience should be a direct factor in that. That doesn't mean that their history doesn't play a role; it obviously does if they've made the same infraction multiple times in the past. Also, it might affect my willingness to unblock early; though my baseline is in favor of blocking, a history showing that the infraction was a one-off thing, then I'd be more inclined to unblock, and if their history shows consistent, similar problems, I'd be more hesitant to unblock.

Additional question from IRWolfie-

20. When you say "global policy generally trumps local policy", can you clarify what you mean? Can you give an example with specific policies?

A:

Additional question from Webclient101

21. Hello Writ Keeper. If the following usernames showed up at UAA, what would you do? Note that they have all been created in the last few days, and nobody has communicated with the users yet, except WikiReviewBot.

• User:Sexygirl398, who has only made constructive edits.
• User:hhhsjsddff, who has not made any edits.
• User:DownwithWebclient101, who has has not made any edits.
• User:Trollolol, who has 1 vandalistic contribution
• User:WikiReviewBot, who has not made any edits.
• User:APPBLOGSTORE, who has promoted his website on his user space.
• User:FuckPaul2, who has vandalized two articles.
• User:AdminsNeedAEffingLife, who has has not made any edits.

A:

General comments

• Links for Writ Keeper: Writ Keeper (talk · contribs · deleted · count · AfD · logs · block log · lu · rfar · spi)
• Edit summary usage for Writ Keeper can be found here.
• Stats on the talk page. Theopolisme 00:00, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

• I don't tend to comment in RfAs any more, but I must say it is mighty impressive that you've edited your CSD log more times than all of your non-deleted mainspace contribs. No doubt some people will find that a problem, but your CSD work sure is fine. "Pepper" @ 00:35, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Please keep discussion constructive and civil. If you are unfamiliar with the nominee, please thoroughly review their contributions before commenting.

Discussion

Support

1. Support happy to be first! AutomaticStrikeout 23:13, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
2. Support this user seems like they won't cause chaos and seems to make themself useful. Thine Antique Pen (talk) 23:15, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
3. Support I've been waiting for this for a while. Ryan Vesey 23:22, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
4. Yep! I've only seen good things from Writ -- as Thine says, "seems like they won't cause chaos". <sarcasm> And that's all that matters, isn't it? </sarcasm> Theopolisme 23:54, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
5. Support Looks good! Michael (talk) 23:59, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
6. Support; sorry I couldn't beat the people trying to beat us noms, got hung up at work a bit longer than I thought. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 00:15, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
7. Support. - Looks good to me! We need all the fresh help we can get! ~ GabeMc 00:38, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
8. Support (edit conflict) Writ is a good all round Wikipedian and an excellent admin candidate.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 00:40, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
9. Support - Actually, when I blocked SA, you handled it very well. You were likely frustrated by your last post, but you weren't rude in the least and focused on still trying to help him. If anything, that proves to me you can stay calm under pressure. You tried to help him multiple times, kept your cool, you explained it well, you said all the things I try to say, the way I try to say them, so I'm glad to support and looking forward to working with you at WP:SPI. Dennis Brown - 2¢ © Join WER 00:57, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
10. Support: The co-nomination by The Blade of The Northern Lights is an immediate indication of trust. Knowing BNL as a Bureaucrat, if an editor that long standing and that well read & respected is convinced he will make a good admin, I have an immediate inclination to trust this editor. I agree with the nominators point, more competent technically focused Admins would be a great assistance to editors like myself working to clear all manner of procedural backlogs. The Illusive Man 02:02, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
11. Per noms. Btw, I don't know complete answers to many of the questions you've been asked so far, and I've been here a while. - Dank (push to talk) 02:26, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

    Dank, I've noticed that trend too. Some of these questions are a bit much. I'm not sure I would pass, but maybe that's the point? Drmies (talk) 19:22, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

12. Support — I don't think I've ever interacted with Writ Keeper directly, but I've definitely seen him around, and I have been given no reason to doubt that he'll do good work with the sysop bit. Kurtis (talk) 03:24, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
13. Support--thought you already were! Go Phightins! 03:27, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

    Actually, so did I.--Amadscientist (talk) 03:37, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

14. Support. CSD work looks good. AfD work looks good. Didn't find any copyright violations or even close paraphrasing in your content contributions. A random survey of your talk page comments shows a calm, composed editor. No reason not to support. Someguy1221 (talk) 03:46, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
15. Support A great editor; will be a great admin. A boat that can float! (watch me float!) 04:36, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
16. Since when hasn't s/he been an admin? Frood! _{What did I break now?} 05:24, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
17. Support The few interactions I've had were positive and I appreciate Writ's work at the teahouse. Should make a fine admin. GaramondLethe 05:55, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
18. Support. I've seen Writ Keeper around, and have been impressed with his/her CSD work, policy knowledge, and temperament. No problems here. — Mr. Stradivarius 06:51, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
19. Support Given the answers to the questions and their history, the candidate shows that they have a good grasp of policy knowledge and how to apply policy to actual work around the project. While the candidate's edit count is reasonably low I feel that they will make a good admin in the long run. Good luck, and I hope you get a new mop in around 7 days. Callanecc (talk • contribs • logs) 07:25, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
20. Looks good, its nice to have fresh blood. NativeForeigner 07:26, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
21. CharlieEchoTango (contact) 07:35, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
22. Support. Good contributions. Answers to questions suggest to me that while they are not the most experienced candidate we've had here, they will refer to guidance and ask questions before using tools in areas in which they are not familiar. More mainspace contributions would be good, but I see no reason to oppose here. --Michig (talk) 07:36, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
23. Support Working here for over 1 year is totally fine for adminship. Good luck--Morning Sunshine (talk) 09:25, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
24. Support No reason not to. I've seen them around and they seem mature and reasonable, and the nominations are good. —Tom Morris (talk) 09:54, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
25. Support No concerns. Torreslfchero (talk) 09:56, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
26. Support per nomination. It Is Me Here 10:30, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
27. Support Rcsprinter (converse) @ 10:48, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
28. Support Thought he'd been around much longer than that. Don't think I've had any direct interaction, but that can be a good sign, considering my areas of operation... Seen him around a lot in many places - never seen a problem. Peridon (talk) 11:01, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
29. Good work at the Teahouse, and has done some DR work - huge plus in my books. I'm sure you'll do fine. Steven Zhang 11:09, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
30. Support - Friendly, helpful, and has a level head. He'll do fine. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:32, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
31. Support - "I say what it occurs to me to say when I think I hear people say things." This candidate sees his role as "trying to refine the dispute back to the essentials, try to broker an agreement on those essentials based on policy and common sense as much as possible, and then suggest overall solutions that match the core agreements. Really, it's just common sense....". A nutshell answer to what is an admin. ```Buster Seven Talk 13:56, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
32. Support Will benefit the project. Legoktm (talk) 14:02, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
33. Support Writ has a good head on his shoulders, makes good decisions and has been nothing short of helpful in projects I have been involved in and in helping me out on my talk page (and I'm an admin!). I think he'd respect the mop for sure! SarahStierch (talk) 15:49, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
34. Support - Acknowledging support of Dennis Brown, Steven Zhang, Sarah Stierch, etc. above. Carrite (talk) 16:13, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
35. Support - He'll be great in deletion work and quite helpful and kind to the newbies. Great choice. Keilana| 16:16, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
36. Support - no concerns and a good pedigree of supporters. GiantSnowman 16:17, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
37. Support nice CSD log in various areas, would be a net benefit imo. Matthew Thompson 17:14, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
38. Support. Hell yes. Ironholds (talk) 17:14, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
39. Support. Not only does he have clue, but I've seen him do great work at the Teahouse, interacting with new editors. That's an excellent skill to have as an admin; with that, I'm happy to support. -- Lord Roem (talk) 18:06, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
40. Support User has clue, Have seen their CSD work and don't recall any serious issues there, good answers to the questions, including the civility block one. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:30, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
41. I am pleased to support this nomination. I am particularly pleased with the answers provided to all of the questions, while being impressed by the answer to my own question; very impressed! 76Strat  da _Broke da (talk) 18:52, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
42. Oh, yeah, I guess I support this editor too. WK, please have the courtesy to not do something drastic again when I'm out camping! Drmies (talk) 19:20, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
43. Support I like the candidate's maturity and readiness to discuss perceived shortcomings; their Teahouse work is a plus. Should do a good job with the tools. Miniapolis (talk) 19:43, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
44. Support. Fully qualified candidate. The opposers' concerns are unpersuasive. Newyorkbrad (talk) 20:33, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

    I didn't know I was trying to persuade you Brad. But my concerns seem to have been fully supported by the RFA in my opinion. An editor with just over a single year is simply being welcomed into a groupthink of editors that seem to care very little about how the community treats each other and seem to think this is thunderdome. LOL!--Amadscientist (talk) 22:13, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

    And I think you already had your conclusions drawn before WK answered your question, and you read it the way you wanted to. "Groupthink"--nice buzzword, though I think the list of supporters shows good and variegated company. I don't get your thunderdome reference; I'm probably too old for that. Drmies (talk) 00:51, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

    Two men enter, one man leave! Not sure how that applies to RFA, but there's your pop-culture reference. Beeblebrox (talk) 19:01, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

45. Support Amadscientist raises legitimate concerns, but I think WritKeeper's acknowledgement of the cesspool that is ANI is a good start in a positive direction for admins. I thin Writ will be fine as an admin. Eau(W)oo (talk) 02:27, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
46. Support, as I see no reason not to. The opposes and neutrals are quite unconvincing to me at the moment; the only one of them that gives me any pause whatsoever is Amadscientist's, and even then barely any cause I probably would have had the same general reaction to the question in question. Ks0stm 02:53, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
47. Support, good user, long enough experience, good CSD log. -- Cheers, Riley Huntley 03:23, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
48. Support Well-rounded editor. Spencer 03:25, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
49. Support No concerns at all. – GorillaWarfare (talk) 04:20, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
50. Support I think that this is the proper section. Sven Manguard Wha? 04:38, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
51. Support; looks a good candidate. Andrew Gray (talk) 10:43, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
52. Support - I see no particularly serious problems, and oppose #1 is completely laughable. Reaper Eternal (talk) 11:26, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
53. Sure Unlikely to break the wiki, and neither oppose is convincing. --Philosopher  14:53, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
54. Support Really thoughtful answers to the questions above, including my own (unrelatedly, a humorous edit summary based on statement in #18: *gasp* a singular "they" OPPOSE OPPOSE ABANDON SHIP) I have also watched Writ's participation at The Teahouse, and know that even as an admin, he will continue to be inviting and respectful towards new users who are unfamiliar with policies and guidelines. As a side note, I think the amount of time concerns here are way off-base. Sheer "amount of time" is far less important than how that time is spent, and Writ has had a very industrious first year. That Writ is responsible is apparent, and I trust that the mop will be a good fit with this editor. I, Jethrobot (note: not a bot!) 16:31, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
55. Support No major concerns, if he was to help good luck to him. Ceoil (talk) 17:31, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
56. Support. Lacking in content creation, but otherwise good contributions. Axl ¤ 17:51, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
57. Support Wow, excellent answers to the questions. I don't have any concerns here. ~Adjwilley (talk) 18:36, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
58. Support. I do believe they should work towards greater content creation; with that said, appears to be a good candidate. Kierzek (talk) 00:33, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

    I couldn't agree more. :) (with the "more content creation" bit, that is) Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 01:08, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

59. Stephen 01:23, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
60. Sufficient experience. i usually am less than happy about candidates with little experience in article writing, but his excellent work in advising users shows his understanding of the process. And his patience here with some over-persistent questioning is very commendable. When pressed for full explanations of what I saw as perfectly clear from his first responses, he gave excellent well-thought out further discussions of the problems. DGG ( talk ) 02:34, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
61. Good luck on your admin career. Regards. — ΛΧΣ21™ 02:46, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Likely Oppose He's much of a newbie (1 year, 21 days) and not-so-low edit count (9,858 to date). I know it's risky to oppose, but we have to examine the flaws. Might change my mind because of this, but it's now on paper. TruPepitoMTalk To Me 05:14, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   So what exactly is the basis of your oppose? AutomaticStrikeout 18:15, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I tend to agree. Of course we should examine flaws, but since you haven't actually identified any it is hard to comprehend why you are opposing. I don't think I have ever seen a user with over a year of experience and nearly ten thousand edits referred to as a newbie before. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:33, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Not to badger or anything, but you've only been around since March 2011 and have only about 1500 edits, so I am not sure why you're criticizing someone who's been around for about the same time with almost 10,000 edits a newbie...do you consider yourself a newbie? Go Phightins!

   No flaw in Writ Keeper's editing was identified. TruPepito, if you cannot bring up anything specific, I respectfully suggest you withdraw this oppose since you don't have an actual reason to oppose. Drmies (talk) 19:26, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   The reviewing bureaucrat will throw out votes that have invalid rationales before tallying, so it won't get counted anyway. No need to worry about it. Dennis Brown - 2¢ © Join WER 19:41, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I'm not worried about this RfA but about esthetics. It's sad to see hollow opposes mar the beauty of the result. Drmies (talk) 19:44, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Doesn't make you think that an editor a year old here in Misplaced Pages makes you wonder what he's doing. Like I've said, he's a year and 22 days old. He has about 8000 (no, he isn't over it) live edits and the rest are deleted. Less than half are automated. Plus, he's a deletionist (1/50/3/1 over keep, delete, speedy delete, and redirect votes respectively). He closed an AfD with Speedy Delete. Flaws are flaws, period. Plus, I may go berserk and run for admin if he gets this go signal. TruPepitoMTalk To Me 03:30, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   And for Drmies, my name is not TruPepito, it's Pits. Yet, I'd like to see him answer Q#16 & Q#17. Plus, I'm into doubt on his answer for Q#12 and less for Q#12a for failing to give either a simple yes or no. TruPepitoMTalk To Me 03:39, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   WP:DWIP please. Go Phightins! 03:42, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Fine, fine. Peace out. I'll talk out of this, like WP:DNB for me.TruPepitoMTalk To Me 03:53, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   But well, as the consensus goes for >90%, I'm going to plan to also have a RfA sometime in the future but not too soon. TruPepitoMTalk To Me 10:34, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

2. Oppose at this time. First answer to question I posed was "Off putting" and many might be offended by the term "weird" in the sentence when referring to a direct question to them. Social skills are important for admin and while the editor is not horrible at it, they still lack some tact in responding to direct questions. The entire first question asked by this editor was completely blown off and answered in a manner that gives me pause to support, as the nom has point blanck stated they still require help with major issues and I am not satisfied with the "Conduct patrol" comment. I may change my opinion when my follow up questions are answered but the first reply was enough to understand the nomination appears to be a "status quo" candidate.--Amadscientist (talk) 05:20, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Not arguing against your oppose which I respect but I had a different read. What I did like is that he wanted more than one opinion on "Civility blocks" and he understands they are less than optimal and should be a community decision, not a unilateral one. I prefer hesitation on civility blocks since there is no consensus on them, so we don't accidentally inject WP:BIAS and block due to a misinterpretation. Dennis Brown - 2¢ © Join WER 12:37, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I am neither for, nor against civility blocks. I am for admin realising they are still a part of this community and editors turn to them for help because Arbcom has decided the community must handle it themselves, yet admin are not the "Civilyt patrol/police"...uhm....of course not. They are THE ONLY ONES who have the ability to block in our community. Even if an RFC/U decided that a block was an appropriate action, it still requires the action of an admin. ANI is supposed to be where editors turn for non-vandalsim action. What we get is "You are on your on" many of the times and then on the flip to that we get over zealous admin who block at the drop of a hat.--Amadscientist (talk) 22:10, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Strong Oppose The candidate has 2 errors which prevent me from supporting. First the candidate seems to not understand the notability guidelines, mainly for schools. All schools are notable. I fear the candidate may go happily delete some schools nominated at AFD. Secondly the candidate has temperament issues as highlighted by Amadscientist. Candidate shows attitude from Q9-11. Also shows attitude in answer to Q16. The candidate says "I'm not going to pretend that that's a binding promise, since apparently it can't be one. But that's what I'd do"-when he says "I'm not going to pretend" this indicates he will not be open to recall or make some highly difficult process to be desysopped. Furthermore, "But that's what I'd do" indicates the temperament/attitude I am having trouble with. I also fear with these answers, the candidate will be rude when newbies come to his page asking "why did you delete my page?" etc. Please read the notability guidelines before responding to Kudpungs' followup below Q14. Regards. Capria (talk) 09:36, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   — Capria (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. Legoktm (talk) 10:20, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   !Vote of sock account, now blocked. Kim Dent-Brown 10:54, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Just to be clear, The nom does not have a temperment issues. Using the term "weird" in the first reply was a little disrespectful. I have a thick enough skin to deal with that, but that along with not getting a direct answer to the same question was a little off putting. To me that is simply not the best way to start off. But I am still sure when officially made an admin, Writ will do fine. While my oppose !vote stands, it is simply for reasons not listed or mentioned in the RFA.--Amadscientist (talk) 19:08, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Purely in a spirit of musing: this is kinda my point. I never would've considered the word "weird" in this context to be disrespectful in any way. I'm sorry I used it, now that I know you think so, but that's not at all what I meant. But this is why I can't give a straight answer to general civility questions; some people think that "weird" is disrespectful, and I never would've guessed that. So, if someone and come to me as an admin and said, "This other guy said a comment of mine was weird, they're disrespecting me", my immediate thought would be "No they're not", because I never would've interpreted it that way. But your standard of disrespect is different than mine. So I can't talk about the general case of incivility that should be dealt with, because that general case is insufficiently defined. That's what I was trying to say. Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 22:33, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

3. This fellow spends most of his time in the Teahouse, where he professes to advise to help people to write articles, but he doesn't seem to have experience writing any article himself. Diesel-50 (talk) 20:39, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
4. Oppose I've looked through Adab al-Tabib and it seems too weak. For example, some works state that the author may have been Jewish - see A History of Medicine - but this is not mentioned. As the religion of the author seems to be controversial and the article currently gives weight to a writer who pushes the Moslem faith of the author, this seems too sloppy or tendentious. As this is supposed to be the candidate's best work, it seems insufficient to grant the candidate power to adjudicate in disputes between other editors. Warden (talk) 21:45, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   I did not know that admins had the power to "adjudicate in disputes" more then a regular editor. Could you please clarify to what you are referring? meshach (talk) 22:06, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   First of all, administrators have extra tools at their disposal, which gives them an advantage over ordinary users. Second, administrators are entrusted with the tools because they are considered trusted users, consequently others will look up to them, trusting them so set an example how to act properly. That's why I would like to see proof of article writing in an administrator candidate. Can the candidate exercise editorial judgement when confronted with a pile of sources that disagree, can he act neutrally and broker compromises in contentious areas? We have no proof that this one can. Diesel-50 (talk) 01:21, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

   I disagree with the premise that one must have a near-perfect article in order to be able to fairly assess consensus in other content areas. I, Jethrobot (note: not a bot!) 22:16, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

5. Oppose- Too many edits in places like Teahouse and talk page, not enough contributions to articles. However, I am impressed by your CSD log. Keep it up! Bzweebl (talk • contribs) 22:29, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
6. Oppose - Weak candidate. Leontopodium alpinum (talk) 00:10, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

   Could you provide diffs or a particular reason you feel this way? This would probably help Writ Keeper better understand a shortcoming if you think one exists. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 04:13, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

7. Oppose - I suppose people focus on things like deleting articles and such, but if an admin is supposed to spend some amount of time getting involved with disputes, and that admin has almost no experience in editing issues especially with controversial articles, it's hard for me to see how useful they'll be as real admins. I see that few seem to care about the need for broad background experienced admins, but I just want to make that point, as this is my first vote on admins. SkepticalRaptor (talk) 03:49, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

You probably should note that in Q1, Writ expressed that the places he would intend to perform admin work would not be in area closely related to content disputes (e.g. CSD, UAA, and AIV). I, Jethrobot (note: not a bot!) 04:15, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Neutral

1. I don't want to oppose, but I can't support you in good faith. Not that I think you'd misuse the tools for any particular reason or anything, but a dichotomy of your contributions show me something: your total number of edits are, roughly, 9,900. Of those edits, the article namespace is the third most edited namespace behind the user and user talk namespaces. Non-essential areas of Misplaced Pages where you have the most edits are: User:Writ Keeper/CSD log (1,300 edits), Misplaced Pages: Teahouse/Questions (325), Misplaced Pages talk:Teahouse/Host lounge (100), Misplaced Pages talk:Teahouse (100), your own talk page (250) and User talk:Drmies (100). I think my point is these are your most frequented pages, and I think if you cut them out, a fourth of your edits no longer being there is significant, to me at least. I think if you expand your horizons beyond these few pages, you'd make a fine administrator. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 08:26, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Seeing as his CSD log is auto-generated by Twinkle and is mainly used for the benefit of the log-keeper to assess their own CSD tagging and improve based on it, I don't see anything wrong with continuing to update it. (No opinion on the other pages though.) Legoktm (talk) 08:51, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I agree, it's something more editors should do with deletions they tag, but I think when it takes up a significant portion of their contributions (along with the other pages combined), is when it makes me reluctant. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 08:55, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I don't know if it makes a difference, but the namespace breakdown doesn't include the 1900 deleted contribs, which, due to CSD work, are mostly edits in article namespace. I guesstimated a few weeks ago that about 27% of my contribs are in the article namespace when taking that into account. Regardless, though, it's a fair criticism, and the one thing that really gave me pause when I was thinking about running. Thanks! Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 09:40, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Absolutely, and it's nothing anything you've done, since I think you've one a good job from what I've seen. By the end, I may switch to support based on more !votes. Keep up the good job. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 09:43, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   If contributing to Misplaced Pages:Teahouse—a project specifically to help retain newbies better!—isn't considered a huge positive for a candidate, I'm not sure what can be. Seriously. —Tom Morris (talk) 11:56, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I don't think that's what Moe is saying, he's making a comparison to the amount of edits to those pages compared to the amount in the mainspace, saying that the candidate needs to balance xe's efforts/edits. (Please correct me if I'm wrong Moe) Legoktm (talk) 12:17, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   You're right, you could become an administrator by making lots of main namespace contributions and not editing the Teahouse project, not the other way around. I'm not saying it was a negative that he edits there, it isn't, but I stayed neutral since there was such a large fraction of his contributions to these few pages. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 13:24, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Strongly agree with Tom Morris...if helping new editors out and retaining them so this project won't fall apart in a few years when all of our current editors get fed up with the system isn't a top priority and thus is considered "insignificant", I would like an example of something you think is significant. Go Phightins! 14:37, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I can't quantify or guesstimate, but I think WK spends very little time on my talk page discussing the weather or the Cowboys. Go through and you'll see that he has helped out more than one person who came by my talk page to ask me something--those helpful comments are one of the reasons I think he'll make a good admin, and I'm always happy to see his responses to others' questions. Back in the good old days, Bbb used to help out a lot, but since he started running his own store he's become something of a stranger... Drmies (talk) 19:52, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   I actually have no doubt that Writ will make a fine admin, I just don't agree with many of the first answer I recieved. That is not saying they are wrong, just that I see admin in a different manner than I think even admin see themselves.--Amadscientist (talk) 22:29, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Go Phightins!: I am talking about significance in relation to being an administrator, not in relation to any other activity on Misplaced Pages. Is Teahouse significant? Sure, I suppose it could be. However, editors who spend all their time there are not contributing in a way that an administrator needs tools. Significant pages are administrator noticeboards, non-admin closures of XFD's or RFC's on talk pages (or at least participation in these discussions), and other pages where administrators would have to spend their time when they get the tools. The Teahouse doesn't need administrator tools, sorry. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 23:24, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Gonna have to respectfully disagree with you there...when new users have questions, they could be in relation to deleted articles they've created, abuse from other editors, reports of vandalism they don't know what to do with, etc. Not saying that the Teahouse should require admin tools, but having someone who operates there who does might be a helpful thing. Go Phightins! 23:34, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   There's no doubt there could be use for administrator tools (almost any area of Misplaced Pages could benefit from someone with administrator tools being there). My neutral vote is based on my confidence in him needing administrator tools, outside of anything else. While he may be valuable in the area of CSD, he has significantly less experience in other areas where administrators need the tools. When he's thrown out to the wolves as an administrator to do tasks like protections, blocks and closing heated disputes, his work at Teahouse isn't much of relevance there. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 23:43, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   Well, I respect your opinion and I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. Go Phightins! 23:45, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

   That's fine. It's not like I'm trying to poison the well or persuade !voters otherwise, it's just my personal set of standards at RFA that they are active in these areas. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 23:58, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

2. Neutral – You seem like a good editor, but I can't support someone who has only been registered for a year. TRLIJC19 (talk • contribs) 02:00, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Pure curiosity, what time length do you think would be sufficient? Legoktm (talk) 04:44, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   For me, I'm maybe thinking of 3-5 years with a consistent edit count. TruPepitoMTalk To Me 05:26, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   I find that to be a bit unreasonable. I wrote a quick script with the API and found out that: Out of 1133 current admins (325 had errors due to re-naming, the old log, etc.) at the time of promotion, only 239 had been around for 3 years, and 68 for 5 years (updated below). While the standards for adminship have definitely gone up over time, I don't think they've gone up that much. Legoktm (talk) 07:09, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   That (the no. of admins that have been around for 3 years and 5 years) accounts for 37.99% of the population, not including the errors. And you didn't mention the admin that have been around for 4 years. I'd like to know also for the other years (0-2, 5+). TruPepitoMTalk To Me 10:25, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Well, I tend to agree with Legoktm that your standard seems a bit excessive; I know this isn't statistically significant, but when I passed my RfA, I had been editing Misplaced Pages for less than a year and a half — and, by the way, less than a year later I was also made a functionary... Salvio 11:59, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   I would like to see about 2.5–3 years of editing, though I would consider supporting someone who has a very consistent edit count over 18–24 months. TRLIJC19 (talk • contribs) 13:28, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

   Here's some more complete data: Out of 1133 current admins (-325 errors), 286 were +sysop in <1 year, 364 were <2, 111 were <3, 60 were <4, and 68 were 4+. An important disclaimer is that I took into account the time the admin was last +sysop'd, which means if they were removed for inactivity and then given the right back, it would count the time they got it back as when they were +sysop'd. If anyone else wants this data sorted in a different way I can do so. (probably). Legoktm (talk) 14:35, 21 October 2012 (UTC)