| Revision as of 09:49, 31 December 2013 editToddy1 (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers48,714 editsm →Requested move: corrected indentation to make it understandable← Previous edit |
Revision as of 16:04, 1 January 2014 edit undoToddy1 (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers48,714 edits →Requested move: '''Oppose''' No reliable sources have been presented to support this changeNext edit → |
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:Hongirads lived along the ] of Mongolian ], it is too far from the Turkic land. Many names of them have Mongol origin. ] (]) 02:28, 31 December 2013 (UTC) |
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:Hongirads lived along the ] of Mongolian ], it is too far from the Turkic land. Many names of them have Mongol origin. ] (]) 02:28, 31 December 2013 (UTC) |
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::You can not quote wikipedia as a reason Szcz. Besides, Mongol etymologies have been invented for many names of Turkic origin in Soviet times in order to divide tribal nations along linguistic lines. Classic divide and conquer strategy. The history of no central Eurasian Steppe tribe can be treated as within the boundaries of any modern nation state precisely because of the migratory nature of their history as you mentioned. Thus the histories of modern Mongolian speaking Kyrgyz and Modern Mongolian speaking Kazakh tribes such as the Kereit (Mongolian Khereid) or Qongirat (Mongolian Hongirat) need to be dealt with under articles about the ethnic groups not fragmented into a myriad of generally un-sourced articlesunder misnomers in order to push this or that political agenda. Even *if* cautiously we wanted to avoid the modern literature as biased towards the "Turkic" agenda as you called it on your other post at ], one still can not escape the facts that the modern authors are not saying anything different from the oldest sources.] (]) 09:25, 31 December 2013 (UTC) |
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::You can not quote wikipedia as a reason Szcz. Besides, Mongol etymologies have been invented for many names of Turkic origin in Soviet times in order to divide tribal nations along linguistic lines. Classic divide and conquer strategy. The history of no central Eurasian Steppe tribe can be treated as within the boundaries of any modern nation state precisely because of the migratory nature of their history as you mentioned. Thus the histories of modern Mongolian speaking Kyrgyz and Modern Mongolian speaking Kazakh tribes such as the Kereit (Mongolian Khereid) or Qongirat (Mongolian Hongirat) need to be dealt with under articles about the ethnic groups not fragmented into a myriad of generally un-sourced articlesunder misnomers in order to push this or that political agenda. Even *if* cautiously we wanted to avoid the modern literature as biased towards the "Turkic" agenda as you called it on your other post at ], one still can not escape the facts that the modern authors are not saying anything different from the oldest sources.] (]) 09:25, 31 December 2013 (UTC) |
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*'''Oppose''' No reliable sources have been presented to support this change. There is also another related moved proposed at ] where the proposer of the change has refused to provide any sources to support that change either.--] (]) 16:04, 1 January 2014 (UTC) |
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=== Kipchak vs Mongol=== |
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=== Kipchak vs Mongol=== |
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Dear Toddy1 you brought a request to my talk page that you wanted to discuss whether this Kazakh ethnic group are Kipchak or Mongol. I recommend you read something about the Kazakh people (Middle Juz) you will see that Kazakhs are Kipchaks not Mongols. ] (]) 18:54, 30 December 2013 (UTC) |
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Dear Toddy1 you brought a request to my talk page that you wanted to discuss whether this Kazakh ethnic group are Kipchak or Mongol. I recommend you read something about the Kazakh people (Middle Juz) you will see that Kazakhs are Kipchaks not Mongols. ] (]) 18:54, 30 December 2013 (UTC) |
This article is about the history of a modern thriving Kypchak ethnic group which constitutes a major portion of Kazakhstan's Middle Juz. It is as wrong to present the nation as a Mongol tribe because this is how it can be interpreted from Mongolian Historical sources as it would be to present the Mongols as a Chinese nation as they can be presented from Chinese historical sources. This article needs to be re-written to reflect the correct language and modern condition of the Hingir and remove all Mongol Bias. Hongirid (talk) 06:56, 18 December 2013 (UTC)
Dear Toddy1 you brought a request to my talk page that you wanted to discuss whether this Kazakh ethnic group are Kipchak or Mongol. I recommend you read something about the Kazakh people (Middle Juz) you will see that Kazakhs are Kipchaks not Mongols. Hongirid (talk) 18:54, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
p.s. Toddy1, Why did you use a different username (User:Sczc) when you edited the article instead of the same one you used on my talk page? Hongirid (talk) 18:57, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
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